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Pirkey
01-18-2011, 12:42 PM
What do analysts do? Are they like a second coach?

thefro526
01-18-2011, 12:50 PM
What do analysts do? Are they like a second coach?

My understanding is that they are the 4th "Coach" for the alliance.

I'm planning on training our Human Player to be an Analyst with the specific task of managing tubes during the match. She is going to keep track of what tubes are in play, what tubes are scored and what tubes are remaining in the Feeder Stations. With this information we should minimize the chance of ourselves or a partner grabbing the wrong tube to complete logos and things of that nature.

GaryVoshol
01-18-2011, 02:09 PM
They must stay within the ALLIANCE STATION.
They may not touch GAME PIECES.
They may not touch the controls except for emergencies (e.g. to keep them from falling to the floor.

Other than that, their function is not described in the rules. It will be up to teams and alliances to decide what the ANALYST will do.

Bob Steele
01-18-2011, 06:48 PM
In reviewing the human interactions in the game there is no mention of not allowing signaling from one end to the other of the field.

Interactions between the field and OFF the field is specifically not allowed.

T 26 states that devices used solely for the purpose of planning or tracking strategy of game play are allowed inside the ALLIANCE STATION if they meet ALL of specified conditions//

ie NO outside communication (outside ARENA)
No electronic communication
AND

Do not in any way affect the outcome of a match, other than by allowing TEAM members to plan or track strategy for the purposes of communication of that strategy to other ALLIANCE members...

This would seem to indicate that you could hold up a SIGN (for instance a CIRCLE,TRIANGLE,SQUARE) that would inform your Alliance partner on the other end that you want them to put said piece into play...from either side.

This could be something that the Analyst could do.... signaling to the other end what piece to put out the slot.

It would seem that this would be legal under 5.5.7 T-26

These would be used to communicate strategy to other ALLIANCE members...

Any ideas on this? It looks legal to me...

arizonafoxx
01-18-2011, 07:03 PM
In reviewing the human interactions in the game there is no mention of not allowing signaling from one end to the other of the field.

Interactions between the field and OFF the field is specifically not allowed.

T 26 states that devices used solely for the purpose of planning or tracking strategy of game play are allowed inside the ALLIANCE STATION if they meet ALL of specified conditions//

ie NO outside communication (outside ARENA)
No electronic communication
AND

Do not in any way affect the outcome of a match, other than by allowing TEAM members to plan or track strategy for the purposes of communication of that strategy to other ALLIANCE members...

This would seem to indicate that you could hold up a SIGN (for instance a CIRCLE,TRIANGLE,SQUARE) that would inform your Alliance partner on the other end that you want them to put said piece into play...from either side.

This could be something that the Analyst could do.... signaling to the other end what piece to put out the slot.

It would seem that this would be legal under 5.5.7 T-26

These would be used to communicate strategy to other ALLIANCE members...

Any ideas on this? It looks legal to me...


I think I am going to have my team make some laminated signaling cards or maybe shapes on the end of poles. I would assume that coaches would also be able to hold up these cards/poles. Maybe we should make three sets so our entire alliance would have the ability to signal the feeder in the same way.

Would it be legal to hold the cards/poles out to the side of the alliance wall? Or only above and against the wall.

alectronic
01-18-2011, 07:05 PM
You are correct under the current rules. It seems to indicate that "holding up a sign" is considered strategy since it satisfies T26.
I thought there was a rule about bringing things to the field, but it seems that T26 is the only related rule.

Zuelu562
01-18-2011, 07:42 PM
Regardless, i'm going over handsignals with my alliance if I'm human player this year, both directional and piece related, definitely need to get to work on those. May go with signs if i can.

SirTasty
01-19-2011, 12:55 AM
Another idea is to use the analyst as the "coach's coach," keeping track of the global game status and giving each team directions on strategy: prioritize this logo piece, make sure you block this robot, etc.

I've never been on the floor, but it seems to me that it could be a useful function. Can anyone give me some feedback on this?

davidthefat
01-19-2011, 12:59 AM
Another idea is to use the analyst as the "coach's coach," keeping track of the global game status and giving each team directions on strategy: prioritize this logo piece, make sure you block this robot, etc.

I've never been on the floor, but it seems to me that it could be a useful function. Can anyone give me some feedback on this?

What I was thinking: there is a coach that is in the box looking at the game from the bird's eye view and tells the coach down on the field what plays they are running, how the line is lined up and ect. They analyze the other team and tells the coach to adjust to that front.

Roger
01-19-2011, 06:43 AM
A team would actually have two types of Human Players available for play: A person that is able to provide tubes to robots via the Feeding Slot or tossed over the wall (the latter being a much practiced specialty); or an Analyst that can provide strategy (again, a practiced specialty). This may be the same person, but not necessarily.

The Analyst is the only person on the Alliance whose only job is to watch the whole field and jump from driver to driver, and coordinate between them. What usually ends up is three teams doing their own thing.

Yet, when you think of it, the four Human Players are in total control of the field. If they all keep supplying Triangles (for example, because they were on the top of the pile), not much high scoring can be done. They are also the best ones to see what needs to be fed.

Carol
01-19-2011, 07:22 AM
I think I am going to have my team make some laminated signaling cards or maybe shapes on the end of poles. I would assume that coaches would also be able to hold up these cards/poles. Maybe we should make three sets so our entire alliance would have the ability to signal the feeder in the same way.

Would it be legal to hold the cards/poles out to the side of the alliance wall? Or only above and against the wall.

Sounds like a good question for the Q&A

dag0620
01-19-2011, 07:24 AM
So clearly each team needs to come prepared with a way of signalling.

Indicator lights on the robot? Just use some different colored bubble lights (or other lights etc). for each type of tube.

Easier for the message to understand, and less of a chance of there being issues of having messages blocked.

SirTasty
01-19-2011, 05:30 PM
What I was thinking: there is a coach that is in the box looking at the game from the bird's eye view and tells the coach down on the field what plays they are running, how the line is lined up and ect. They analyze the other team and tells the coach to adjust to that front.

Can't communicate with people in the stands.

davidthefat
01-19-2011, 06:28 PM
Can't communicate with people in the stands.

I was making a football reference.

ebarker
01-19-2011, 06:41 PM
Rule <T26> prohibits technology that allows the drive team to communicate with anyone outside of the arena in a way that can affect the outcome of the match.

You could try telepathy, morse code eye blinking, etc.....

In other words - you are prohibited from getting help from the stands like the way football is done.

thefro526
01-19-2011, 07:00 PM
For those of you considering having Analysts hold up cards to signal the feeders during matches, just remember that they'll need to be large enough so that the Feeder can see them and interpret without thought - meaning that they'll be clearly visible to the other alliance as well - which may or may not be an issue.

Not to mention that the Driver's station is packed as it is, and they'll need to do a bit of wiggling to get a direct line of sight.

Theoretically, you'll want the most discrete, yet clearly visible method of signaling as possible, ideally signalling directly to the Human Player in a simple and precise fashion.

Kims Robot
02-21-2011, 11:05 AM
Now that teams are close to done, and several have attended scrimmages... how ARE you planning on using your analyst?

Do any of you RELY on the analyst for signaling of tubes?

Do any of you RELY on the analyst for overall match communication?

for overall match strategy?

for...?

Madison
02-21-2011, 11:22 AM
We'll likely want our human player in the feeder station as much as possible, as we see that process of human player loading being a significant variable affecting how long it takes to acquire and score tubes.

As coach, I will be communicating with the analyst as necessary -- depending somewhat on their ability to effectively communicate on behalf of our partners. Ultimately, however, we'll be making the decision about which tubes human players should load into our robot and signal them directly as we approach the loading station using colored LED light strips.