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Tetraman
05-04-2011, 02:10 PM
Post all of your ideas for game elements, game-play concepts and/or complete game challenges that you would like to see in the 2012 or future FIRST robotics games. Maybe someone from FIRST GDC will see it, maybe not.

Please keep this thread to what you want to see, not rumors or theories as to what you believe the game will be. For 2012 game rumors and theories, check out this thread instead: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94932


I'll start off with this concept I've had for a while and was suggested in the thread I linked to.

http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Score.png

Image from http://www.exploratorium.edu/books/bernoulli/

Peter Matteson
05-04-2011, 02:51 PM
As I've been saying for a few years I want a bulk item that will give us a new challange. Something small like racket balls, tennis balls, softballs which will drastically change handeling mechanisms from what we do now.

I would even go for sand, or marbles.

Jared Russell
05-04-2011, 02:53 PM
Footballs. Frisbees. Both are game pieces we haven't had to deal with before in FRC.

Colin P
05-04-2011, 03:50 PM
Ending the Apocalypse?

Im just hoping for something big like the track balls.

Christopher149
05-04-2011, 05:38 PM
I would love to see a game with an autonomous period similar to logomotion ... in that there is a scoring piece/action solely for autonomous that is relatively easy to perform (ie tracking lines). This was the first year in possibly forever that my team scored in autonomous (partly due to the specific benefit from ubertubes).

Koko Ed
05-04-2011, 05:46 PM
Those bean bag chairs they used in the volunteer lounge in St. Louis would make great game pieces.

bduddy
05-04-2011, 06:00 PM
4 teams per alliance. One robot has to remain off the field at all times, in some kind of "pit area" or the like, but each of the 4 robots has to be on the field for at least a certain amount of time.

Tetraman
05-04-2011, 06:08 PM
Those bean bag chairs they used in the volunteer lounge in St. Louis would make great game pieces.

Until they break. If one of those bean bags breaks, we'd have to vacuum the floor because of all those cushion beans. Good idea though. Maybe if there was a much tougher 'skin' for the bean bags.

Koko Ed
05-04-2011, 06:20 PM
Until they break. If one of those bean bags breaks, we'd have to vacuum the floor because of all those cushion beans. Good idea though. Maybe if there was a much tougher 'skin' for the bean bags.

Maybe the beans could be part of the floor surface.

EricH
05-04-2011, 06:46 PM
Here's mine (I already put it in the 2012 rumor thread):

6 robots on the field. 4 mobile goals, similar in design to the 2004 ones (or 2001). Two goals start on each side of center; each alliance starts touching its own driver station.

The center of the field has "terrain"--a shallow ramp on a pivot to act as a teeter-totter. Over the ramp is a large-ish arch of steel pipe. Let's call it 10' high at the top. The ramp is divided into a red zone and a blue zone (may also be split in 2-4 segments, each marked for one alliance or the other); the arch is marked into point zones.

On the sides of the fields there are minibot tracks, 2 per alliance (1 track per side of the field). The tracks on each side meet at midfield.

At dead center on both sides, there is a stand holding two bonus balls. When removed during autonomous, the balls trigger an avalanche of lower-score balls onto the field.

Also on the field are three trackball-sized "doubler" balls. They start on the balanced ramp. (Field resetters, please keep your rotten tomatoes in hand for now. I'm not done yet.)

There is a line on each side of the field at the quarter-field mark.

The Game
In autonomous period, robots deploy their minibots onto their alliance's tracks. The minibots race to trigger the balls, or block their opponents from doing the same. Robots may also attempt to trigger the flood. Robots may not deploy their minibots past the line at 1/4 field.

Teleop begins. Robots attempt to fill the mobile goals and get them into their own half of the field, in the area between the ramp and the 1/4-field line. Robots and humans collaborate to fill their goals--but robots may only release the balls from below the 4' mark, and the goals are 5' high. Robots may also feed the humans. Doublers may be placed on top of the goals. At the 1-minute mark, any balls that haven't already dropped come flooding in.

For the end game, robots attempt to balance the bridge with goals in their zone, or hang on the arch. This will require teamwork between alliances, and/or a game of chicken (who's letting go first?).

Scoring
Each ball in an owned goal (between 1/2 and 1/4 field, or on the ramp in your zone) is worth 5 points; having the goal owned is 10 points. The ball score is doubled by a doubler ball on top of the goal; having the goal on a balanced ramp doubles any score for both the goal and the balls, doubler included.

Each robot on the arch and not touching the ground will receive points based on the lowest-value contacted scoring zone; the maximum-point zone is not the one at the top of the arch, but the ones right next to it. Robots on the ramps score 10 points.

Penalties: Penalties are 5 points apiece; pinning is 3 penalties; intentional tipping is a red card, disablement, and 2 penalties. Descoring is 10 penalties and a yellow card for the first offense; the second draws a red card and 10 penalties.

Tetraman
05-04-2011, 07:46 PM
Frisbees.

I have no idea what I created, but I had some free time so I made this up. I didn't have any real rules involved but here is a frisbee field. On the side you can see I have a place for Human players.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField1.jpg

Other Images of the Field:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField2.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField3.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField4.jpg

Robby Unruh
05-06-2011, 06:37 PM
I have no idea what I created, but I had some free time so I made this up. I didn't have any real rules involved but here is a frisbee field. On the side you can see I have a place for Human players.

- snip -

Other Images of the Field:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField2.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField3.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/FrisbeeField4.jpg

Could you elaborate on this field a little more? It looks really nice. Do you score by throwing Frisbees in to the little troths on the ends of the field?

Tetraman
05-11-2011, 07:22 PM
Could you elaborate on this field a little more? It looks really nice. Do you score by throwing Frisbees in to the little troths on the ends of the field?

Yep. The object is to shoot the frisbees into your high goal. However you can only score when you are within your alliance zone on the field. You may run around and pick up frisbees in the center of the field, or COURT, however only two robots per alliance are allowed in the COURT at a time.

The Frisbees themselves have a green dot on their front and back so robots can find them in the field and pick them up with specialized mechanisms.

End of the game might have something relating to the number of frisbees you are holding at a certain height, like Double Trouble.

Points would be something like, 4 for a frisbee scored in the goal and 1 point for a frisbee on the floor in your half-circle on the court. If it's outside the line, it won't count. And 12 or 16 points for some big end game bonus.

IKE
05-11-2011, 07:50 PM
I would really love to hang from a arch one of these years.

BJC
05-11-2011, 08:52 PM
I would love to see pool noodles cut into 1ft segments.
Other cool objects.. I got my hands on one of the 148 prank playhouse balls. They are suprisingly hard to crush and very light. They would make a cool game object.

I would really love to hang from a arch one of these years.

Quoting myself from the 2012 Game thread:

"I have an idea for a awesome endgame:

Giant arch made of 1.75" steel tubing (used for the towers of '10 and the minibot towers '11).

This giant arch spans the width of the playing field in the middle of the field reaching at least 12 ft high. robots get points for hanging off of the arch and not touching the ground. However, more points are awarded for being higher on the arch. One could go about it like the minibots this year with point values for being the highest to lowest or just have markings on the arch with "zones" which have certain hanging values.

Either way, it would be an amazing endgame to watch. Robots battling for the center position... 2004 but better?

Eh, thats all I've got for now, Bryan"

The more I think about this endgame, the more amazing I think it would be.

Alex Cormier
05-12-2011, 06:37 PM
BEST (http://gadgetbox.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/05/12/6624781-the-worlds-most-useless-machine-version-20) game piece ever. And teams can build them!

notmattlythgoe
05-19-2011, 10:43 AM
What about a game that has two different game pieces that you have to put together. Maybe PVC pipes with magnets on the end that you have to slide into a hole and attach it to a piece that has another magnet that is in the hole. Then pull it back out and place it somewhere else, maybe on a steel scoring plate. Each PVC pipe is a point, but if it has the second piece on it it is worth 3 points.

Kusha
05-23-2011, 10:36 PM
http://www.appstoreapps.com/images/apps/arcadebowling-thumbnail.png

'nuff said. '10 spin off. Sorta.

Robert Cawthon
06-09-2011, 02:56 PM
How about one of you brainiacs out there design a game based on Lacrosse? Nerf balls as game pieces with passing and scoring? Maybe 5 on 5 with smaller bots? I would be interested in what you all come up with. :cool:

Tetraman
06-20-2011, 11:06 PM
How about one of you brainiacs out there design a game based on Lacrosse? Nerf balls as game pieces with passing and scoring? Maybe 5 on 5 with smaller bots? I would be interested in what you all come up with. :cool:

Ok.

FIRST-LAX

The game is played on a 27'x54' field. Two alliances with five robotics teams each face off in each match. Each robot must start the game within a 2'x2'x3' starting position. Once the game begins, robots may extend outward to any length and size, but at no time may a robot or its mechanisms rise higher than 3'.

Here is a view of the game field:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Field1-1.jpg

Two GOALS sit within the playing field, and are marked red and blue by their bumpers. Red alliance will attempt to score in the Red bumper GOAL and Blue alliance in the Blue bumper GOAL.

In the corners of the field are ALLIANCE ZONES, two for each alliance. Only Red Alliance robots are allowed to move within the Red ALLIANCE ZONES, and only Blue alliance robots are allowed to move within the Blue ALLIANCE ZONES.

When ready to play the match, alliances may set their robot anywhere on their ALLIANCE ZONE side of the field, but can not have their robot move past the white line splitting the field in half, or the center circle. At least one robot of each alliance must be standing over the back white line of their half of the field.

Pictures:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Field2-1.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Field6.jpg

Five yellow POWER BALLS are set in the field on their specific spots. When Autonomous mode begins, teams will attempt to grab and score the POWER BALLS into their GOAL.

The match begins with a 15 second autonomous mode. After the autonomous mode, teams are awarded points and the two minute tele-operated mode begins.

Every 15 seconds pf the 2 minute match, four white NORMAL BALLS enter the field by the Field Crew - one in each ALLIANCE ZONE.

Picture:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Field7.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f242/ErwinTheSketcher/Field8.jpg

In the last few seconds, alliance robots may run their robots into the Alliance Zones for bonus points. Each robot touching only the colored carpet and/or white line and not the green field carpet, will earn the alliance bonus points.

After the match, teams are awarded points for their goals they made.


-> 3 points for each scored POWER BALL in autonomous mode.
-> Bonus 3 points for scoring more POWER BALLS than the opponent in Autonomous mode. If both teams tie, neither get the bonus.

-> 2 points for each scored NORMAL BALL.
-> 2 points for each scored POWER BALL in Tele-operated mode.
-> Bonus 2 points for having one or two robots in the alliance zone at the end of the match, 6 points for having three or four robots, and 12 points for having all five robots.


Enjoy. Discuss.

Andrew Lawrence
06-20-2011, 11:46 PM
I'm not sure if this would count as a "Game-play idea", but I had an idea earlier about a possible rule during build season.

We as FIRSTers are supposed to work together and help each other, yet I've seen a lot of secrecy in my years. Now while I understand when you have that one awesome original idea that will win you Einstein that you don't want to share, that doesn't mean that outside of competition days and during build season you stick to yourselves and stay away from other teams as if they're enemies. Look at Chief Delphi here. A lot of people start openly discussing their ideas and giving out ideas and helping other teams the minute after the kick-off video is shown. Now luckily for me, there are some teams in California who are open and helpful to other teams, and even let them use their facilities. Aside from them, there is little to no collaboration between teams during build season.

So, long piece of text aside, my idea is that during build season, there could be a rule that dictates that each team collaborates with another team every 2 weeks of the 6 week build season. I think that this will not only bring great teams and great minds together, but also make us better people.

Just one of my many thoughts.

Robert Cawthon
06-21-2011, 02:11 PM
So, long piece of text aside, my idea is that during build season, there could be a rule that dictates that each team collaborates with another team every 2 weeks of the 6 week build season. I think that this will not only bring great teams and great minds together, but also make us better people.

Granted that it would help teams, there are some that it would be impractable. I am thinking of, among others, Team 935 in Newton, KS or 3284 in Camdenton, MO. There are no nearby teams for hands on collaboration, although online collaboration would be a possiblity. Just a point, keep in mind all of the teams in FIRST when thinking of an idea. What would seem like a wonderful idea for one team or an area might not work for the rest. Another point is something that would seem to be great for a regional may not work at all for the Michigan district competitions. Just a thought. I did like your idea, though. I might try to do something like that with our team and a couple of locals this year.

Jared Russell
06-21-2011, 05:17 PM
Inspired by this: http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1066127&postcount=165

Sadly, I do not possess the game-design style of Tetraman, so text will have to do...

Presenting...

FIRSTAMARI DAMACY

THE BASICS:
* 3 vs. 3
* Robot starting dimensions of 28x38x60, expansion allowed
* 100% bumper coverage required (for this game, you actually need it)
* The goal is to accumulate as much TRASH onto your robot as possible and then return to a WEIGH STATION in order to have the highest total alliance weight at the end of the round. TRASH can be accumulated by picking up, sticking on to, or otherwise acquiring TRASH game pieces that have been littered on the floor by human players. At the end of the round, additional bonus points are given to the team which has forced the TRASH RAMP at the middle of the field to tip towards their alliance's player station.

THE ARENA:

---------------------------
|R | | | B|
| | | | |
Red| | TTT | B|Blue
|R | TTT | |
| | | | |
|R | | | B|
---------------------------

R = red weigh station
B = blue weigh station
T = trash ramp

* 54' x 27' field
* Flat field
* In the middle of the field is a teeter-totter called a TRASH RAMP. There is a 3'x3'x3' open-topped cube on each side of the trash ramp (so you can put trash into your teams' cube and cause the ramp to fall your way).
* Robots must start on a WEIGH STATION, a 40"x40" pressure-sensitive pad that weighs whatever is on it. There are three red and three blue WEIGH STATIONS in front of the corresponding alliance player stations.
* There is a solid middle line and two other lines 1/4 and 3/4 of the way across the field, respectively.
* On the field scoring display are six numbers: the current weights on each one of the six pressure pads.

GAME PIECES:
* TRASH. The field is littered with all manner of small objects. Think balls, cubes, cones, smoked Tetrix motors, whatever. For the purposes of this thought experiment, the exact nature of the TRASH doesn't really matter. Just assume there is a lot of it. Ideally, there are ~80 pieces of trash, each weighing around .5-1.0 lbs.
* Each HUMAN PLAYER (3 per alliance) begins with an armful of TRASH. In addition, there is an equivalent amount of TRASH scattered randomly around the middle two quadrants of the field by field staff.

MATCH PLAY:
* The match begins with a 10 second HUMAN PLAYER LITTERING period. Human players from each alliance grab trash from their player stations and place it on their OPPONENTS' side in the quarter furthest from the center (e.g. the 1st or 4th quadrant). All trash must be placed on the field, and none of it can touch a robot.
* Next comes a 10 second AUTONOMOUS PERIOD. Robots use on-board sensors to acquire TRASH and return to their WEIGH STATIONS for bonus points.
* Lastly is a 2:00 TELEOPERATED PERIOD. Teams drive their robots around the field, collecting, sucking up, picking up, or otherwise "acquiring" TRASH in order to get as heavy as possible. But it isn't that simple! Teams ALSO get bonus points by forcing the ramp at the center of the field to fall their way at the end. This forces teams to quickly think - am I better off loading my bot up with trash, or should I focus on placing trash onto the ramp?
* In the last 10 seconds, no opposing robot may enter the quadrant containing the opposite alliance's WEIGH STATIONS.

SCORING:
* The current weights of each WEIGH STATION are constantly displayed on the arena screen.
* At the beginning of the round, each WEIGH STATION automatically computes the starting weight of each robot.
* At the end of the round, each WEIGH STATION displays the ENDING weight DIFFERENTIAL on each WEIGH STATION. For example, if a robot started at 119 lbs and at the end of the match, there are 128 lbs on the scale, the DIFFERENTIAL is 9 lbs.
* Teams earn one point for every pound of their total DIFFERENTIAL (sum of 3 weights at the end - sum of 3 weights at beginning). Minimum DIFFERENTIAL for each WEIGH STATION is 0, but only one robot may touch each WEIGH STATION at the end (e.g. you can't all three get on one pad). Each WEIGH STATION only gets points if the original robot that started there returns there (this prevents a 120 lb robot and a 40 lb robot from trading places for crazy points).
* If, at the end of the round, the TRASH RAMP (which starts at a somewhat unstable equilibrium at the beginning of the round) is touching the ground on one alliance's side of the field, then that alliance has TIPPED THE SCALES. By doing this, that alliance gets to add the TWICE the weight all of the TRASH on BOTH sides of the TRASH RAMP onto its total score.

In summary:
Score* = Final Weight - Start Weight - Penalties + BONUS
BONUS (if ramp is on your side) = 2*(Red weight + Blue weight)

* Keeping in mind minimum DIFFERENTIAL of each WEIGH STATION is 0

PENALTIES/DETAILS:
* Biggest no-no: No robot may be touching any part of the TRASH RAMP (including TRASH possessed by a given robot) at the end of the match. Penalty: The other alliance gets to TIP THE SCALES. If both alliances do this, nobody TIPS THE SCALES.
* No TRASH can be removed from the TRASH RAMP once placed there.
* Violating the line during the last 10 seconds (there is a warning claxon at 15 seconds): DQ
* More than one robot ending touching the same WEIGH STATION = that WEIGH STATION is disabled
* A robot touching a WEIGH STATION other than the one it started on during the end game = WEIGH STATION disabled
* Standard 5 second/5 feet pinning rules.

EricH
06-21-2011, 07:20 PM
So, long piece of text aside, my idea is that during build season, there could be a rule that dictates that each team collaborates with another team every 2 weeks of the 6 week build season. I think that this will not only bring great teams and great minds together, but also make us better people.

Just one of my many thoughts.
It's a very difficult to enforce rule. Those eventually work their way out of the rulebook (anybody remember the FIX-IT windows?). I don't think it'll catch on.

Are we supposed to help each other and work together? Yes. That's the Gracious part of Gracious Professionalism. BUT! The Professional part could easily be seen as including not revealing company secrets to rival companies, and collaborating could be seen as doing just that. Or, it might not be. Be that as it may, collaboration is always an option, and FIRST made that clear years ago. If, however, it is forced by anything other than extremely good game design by FIRST, I don't think it will be a good thing in the long run.

mickey d's 71
07-24-2011, 02:49 PM
i am going with end of the world theme mayan architecture game would be you and alliance build mayan pyramid in middle of field to make it interesting only one pyramid can be made between the two alliances and each block will be either blue or red and whoever has the top tier of the pyramid in there color gets an extra bonus
another would be a pyramid is in the center of the field and u have to climb it and bring down scoring bins kinda and take it to your side fill it up and empty it on opposing alliance side for points

Andrew Lawrence
07-24-2011, 03:03 PM
Something I've always thought would be an interesting game rule is switching robots. Like, there would be a rule saying that you must drive one of your alliance team's robots instead of your own.

Though matches would be harder, it would be fun to watch!

EricH
07-24-2011, 04:01 PM
another would be a pyramid is in the center of the field and u have to climb it and bring down scoring bins kinda and take it to your side fill it up and empty it on opposing alliance side for points
2003: Stack Attack.

OK, so the bins didn't have to be filled... they had to be stacked. And the easiest way to take a stack down was to hit it with a robot.

Frenchie461
07-24-2011, 04:29 PM
Something I've always thought would be an interesting game rule is switching robots. Like, there would be a rule saying that you must drive one of your alliance team's robots instead of your own.

Though matches would be harder, it would be fun to watch!

That would be Awesome