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Unread 03-20-2010, 10:59 PM
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3" ball violation--Why????

Okay, first off, I think that the GDC has a daunting task every year. They thoroughly think out 99.99% of the issues facing each game. I always try to understand the reasons behind the they rules make. This time I'm stumped. If a ball goes under the robot by more than 3" it's a violation. Why? You're already limited to one ball at a time. What is the reasoning behind it? Rookie teams have it hardest. They usually don't have the experience nor the exposure to methods and practices that experienced teams have. For the most part (based on 3 weeks of regionals), rookie teams are by far, the least successful in adequately kicking the ball.
Allowing the ball to pass under the bot at will (one at a time) would make ball control, hense kicking, infinitely easier. Remember, the crowd wants to see high scores. It appears at most regionals that the penalties were more common than the goals in a vast number of matches--with most of those penalties resulting from balls passing under the bot. Update 16 attempted to address this but I think, fell short.

Please help me see the GDC's viewpoint. I KNOW I'm missing the obvious.
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Unread 03-20-2010, 11:11 PM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

I am pretty sure that the original intent of the rule was to stop teams from sticking multiple balls under the robot, and thereby possessing them, and taking them out of play from other robots. Atleast, thats what I always thought the intent was...
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Unread 03-20-2010, 11:16 PM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

Itís basically engineering a robot to hold a ball outside of its diameter, which makes it so much harder to manipulate. Which is the entire challenge that was one of the biggest challenges my team faced which was how to manipulate the ball without going in 3" if you took that rule out the task becomes like every other year a hand or some sort of cup into the robot would hold the ball and it would make it so easy to manipulate and shoot the ball even though itís easier for the rookies itís much easier for veteran teams. Whereas this competition is support to challenge the mind and force teams to think outside of the box, Thus the game is not only challenging for rookies who will not only learn much more valuable information for next year but it levels the game with veteran teams who also struggle with this rule.
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Unread 03-21-2010, 12:21 AM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

Why, in soccer, aren't you allowed to carry the ball with your hands?

(Um... okay... because then it would be... er... football...?)

But I digress... the rule is the rule because it is the rule. Kind of circular logic, I'll admit... but keep in mind that the game consists of putting a ball through a hole in a wall so that we can pick the ball up and put it back out on the floor so we can put it through the hole again. Those rules are the rules because... er... well... those are the rules.

I suspect the GDC actually put a bit of thought into the 3" rule, as it seems that a very few teams have developed absolutely outstanding grippers, proving that it can be done, several have developed grippers of varying degrees of functionality, proving that it's not easy, and some have gone without.

A 4" incursion would have made it a no brainer to build a gripper. A 2" incursion would have probably made anything but a vacuum a waste of time. A 3" incursion isn't quite enough that a gripper was the obvious solution, but also enough that a vacuum wasn't the only solution.

But keep in mind that it isn't supposed to be easy, and just as soccer wouldn't be soccer if you could touch the ball with your hands, and basketball wouldn't be basketball if your could touch the ball with your feet, Breakaway wouldn't be Breakaway if you could suck the ball in to the robot.

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Unread 03-21-2010, 09:39 AM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

Quote:
I suspect the GDC actually put a bit of thought into the 3" rule
And I would also submit they put a lot of thought into several other measurements.....84" hanging bar and 90" vertical limit...angle, height and width of bump (they know how a 28" X 38" platform performs).....bumper height.....height and width of tunnel and platform....that little annoying thing on the wall side of the goal that stops so many herds up the wall!

All good stuff!
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Unread 03-21-2010, 09:57 AM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

It's a design constraint. It would be much, much easier for any team to secure a ball if it could go more than three inches inside the robot. Building within "random" constraints is key to engineering.
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Unread 03-21-2010, 10:12 AM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

I think it is a rule the GDC "was inspried by" from robo-cup. Here is a team that is extrememly good at ball handling:
http://www.techunited.nl/index.php?p=11

The 3" rule and the must to keep it on the ground makes it very challenging.
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Unread 03-21-2010, 10:27 AM
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Re: 3" ball violation--Why????

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