OCCRA
Go to Post My students like to win, so I'll stick to enabling that. - sdcantrell56 [more]
Home
Go Back   Chief Delphi > FIRST > General Forum
CD-Events   CD-Media   CD-Spy   FRC-Spy  
portal register members calendar search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read FAQ rules

 
Reply
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #16   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-08-2010, 11:21 PM
HannahF's Avatar
HannahF HannahF is offline
from Vice Pres to College Mentor
FRC #0433 (The Firebirds)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Cheltenham, Pa
Posts: 73
HannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant futureHannahF has a brilliant future
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidthefat View Post
I think the major thing I lack is the ability to teach and patience. I sometimes even freak out (not literally) just a major facepalm moment when guys use too many if statements to do something. Yes, I need to mature on that part if I want to be a leader



edit: Would you find it rude if a Junior ran against you for a leadership position if you were a Senior? I am not sure if this guy is going to run again, but he was the programming leader this year, but I pretty ended up being "the" programmer...
I really just wanted to address a couple of the points you made and offer my $.02:

In regards to your worries about seniority issues, In my opinion before you nominated yourself for a leadership position I think you should have a long a good talk with the person who held the job this year. Even if you feel you did most of the coding on your own this year, talk to him because there may be more to the position then you realize. He may explain to you why he is more qualified for the job or he might surprise you by telling you he wants you to run. I however do not think it is a good Idea to run without talking it out with him. He will most likely respect you more if you tell him your plans to run ahead of time. In my own personal experience, the leader should be the most qualified person for a job, and a good true leader recognizes when they are no longer the most qualified and steps down allowing someone better to rise up to take their job.

Also would you be willing to make a compromise? You mentioned that you want to take on leadership positions but it would appear that you are not comfortable teaching yet. Take it from someone who has been both the director (captain) of programming and the Vice President of a team, teaching is one of the most important and most fulfilling parts of being a leader on a team and patience is not something you can try to get by without especially in a position like programming where it often takes time for a new person to understand. Your code "hogging" most likely directly stems from your lack of patience and this is not cool in a programming leader. Perhaps you need to take another year to become more comfortable and confident in your abilities and your relationships on the team before you consider leading. You could consider "shadowing" the programming leader from this year, next year learning what it's like to hold the position, and practicing your teaching skills before people begin looking up to you, then next year when he graduates you will be ready to confidently take his place.

Again these are just suggestions, I am not trying to say that you would not be a good leader next year (because I have never met you before, and therefore honestly don't know), I am only trying to convey that there is a lot to think about before you become a leader. As I said before I was the director of programming for my team this year and sometimes that jobs means more than just writing code. I was in charge of showing new members Labview, making sure vi's were written on time(delegation is key), planning out autonomous, writing autonomous(sometimes its ok to have a piece of code thats mostly yours), setting up the classmate's wireless for drive practices, fixing signal problems, dealing with complaints from builders and the drivers(once again patience is key), building projects, and making the majority of code changes at competitions. But I loved every minute of it because at that point I had been programming for almost two years and I really enjoy teaching people about programming. Next year however, I will be passing my title to an underclassman because I want her to have the opportunity to be a leader; I have watched her grow to love programming this year as much as I do, and because as a Senior and the Vice President of the team, I know that I unfortunately will not be able to devote all the time that is necessary to be the director of programming next year. This does not mean I won't program as much as I can next year, because I love programming and so i guess my parting thought is;

if you truly love writing code don't allow a title to affect how much time you spend programming

So you know just some things to consider

~Hannah
__________________
If at first you don't succeed, ask a girl for help.~ FIREBIRDS 433

2012 MAR CHA District Chairman's Award
2011 Philadelphia Regional Chairman's Award
2011 Washington DC Regional Website Award and KPC&B Entrepreneurship Award
Proud Mentor of FLL teams the CamdeNerdz and Robodogs
2010 Pittsburgh Regional Chairman's Award & KPC&B Entrepreneurship Award
2010 Philadephia Regional Engineering Inspiration Award
2009 Philadelphia Regional Chairman's Award
2009 Connecticut Regional Engineering Inspiration Award
2008 Philadelphia Regional Engineering Inspiration Award
Reply With Quote
  #17   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-08-2010, 11:34 PM
woody's Avatar
woody woody is offline
Too much metal for one hand! \m/
FRC #0033 (Killer Bees)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 90
woody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to beholdwoody is a splendid one to behold
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

I'd like to recommend that anyone interested in leadership on an FRC team (or in general) read Launching a Leadership Revolution by Orrin Woodward and Chris Brady. It is one of the best discussions of leadership that I have read, including prerequisites to leadership, 5 "levels" of leadership, and illustrative stories concluding each section. This is a must read for mentors, and any student who is interested in taking on a leadership position on his/her team could benefit greatly from it.
On a similar note, Tribal Leadership by Logan, King, and Fischer-Wright is a great book focused on creating a culture of excellence within organizations. The principles they discuss are immediately applicable to FRC teams. Maybe Isaac would like to go into a little more detail on this one : )

Sorry to refrain from offering a 30 second opinion on the subject; hopefully anyone hungry enough to actually read one or both of these books will find them as beneficial as I have.
__________________
"The greatest of all mistakes is to do nothing because you can only do a little; do what you can." - Sir Sidney Smith
Reply With Quote
  #18   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-09-2010, 12:02 AM
Tristan Lall's Avatar
Tristan Lall Tristan Lall is offline
Registered User
FRC #0188 (Woburn Robotics)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Rookie Year: 1999
Location: Toronto, ON
Posts: 2,424
Tristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond reputeTristan Lall has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Here's a very good lieder.
Reply With Quote
  #19   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-09-2010, 12:53 AM
Chris is me's Avatar
Chris is me Chris is me is offline
Work harder, do better.
AKA: Pinecone
FRC #2791 (Shaker Robotics) (EWCP)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Troy, NY
Posts: 6,522
Chris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond reputeChris is me has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via AIM to Chris is me
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

I'm sorry, I made this post and forgot to submit it for several hours, so I'm sorry if this has been said by others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidthefat View Post
What would you say are the traits of a good or great leader?

Quote:
I first think that the person should be a demagogue, they should be able to unite and convince people that they can reach the goal. Secondly, they should be able to plan out and execute the plan for success. Thirdly, I believe the leader should be good at their position. Honestly if you can't even program, why do you even bother being the programming leader? That is different for team leaders, I believe that they should be able to coordinate and have a great personality while having wisdom. The leader should know when to take the risk or be more conservative. They should have the ability to synchronize the team's process and put more emphasis on the lacking divisions. Lastly I believe the leader needs to be very respectful and never cocky, but always confident about the team.
A lot of those qualities are good to have, but not really necessary for leadership.

Personally I think a subteam leader in the context of FRC needs to have a basic knowledge of his subsystem, but not necessarily the most knowledge. More important than the amount of knowledge is knowledge of their amount of knowledge. A leader needs to know their limits. I would take that over confidence or technical ability any day of the week.

Motivation and organizational skills are a must as well. Confidence in your sub team, not necessarily. I would take a pragmatic leader over a confident, unless that gets in the way of motivation. The leader shouldn't be a downer and expect nothing out of their subteam, and they should definitely push and challenge them, but "confident" and "overconfident" are more similar than you think. It's far too easy to be overconfident.

Quote:
Now being said that, do I really qualify to be in a leadership position? This year, even though this was my first year, ended up hogging the computer and the code. I wrote at least 90% of the years code, the other 10% being the team leader's code for autonomous. I do feel that I did not put 100% of my effort onto the coding this year, my mentor had to clean up the code during competition because it was spaghetti code. I usually do not do that with my coding, that showed that I did not care for robotics as much as I should. I am very OCD about people touching my code, so I am not sure if it is wise for me to run for the programming leader, me being only a 2nd year and my OCD, I would probably end up hogging the code again.
Please don't call it "your OCD", it's insulting to people with actual mental disorders. Sorry, pet peeve of mine.

I wouldn't say being your first year on the team would be a problem. I hate when people give people stuff for no other reason other than "seniority". I would say hogging the programming computer and being upset when other people do anything to "your" code would make you a very bad leader. You can't lead a team if you just want to do it all yourself. That level of micromanagment is the opposite of a leadership quality.

I'm being blunt, but I figure you'd appreciate honest advice rather than softened advice for the sake of being super nice. I don't think you'd be a good programming leader... right now. Hogging the code is generally a sign of arrogance, that you think you're the only person who can do the code right. Your "OCD" about it being changed and the following from the next paragraph

Quote:
step back and let the others work on it first and just fix up the code after wards?
is also indicative of this subconscious attitude. Note the implication that because someone else is working on it, it'll turn out wrong and need fixing up.

Quote:
Now if I do run for it and win the position, what kind of advice do you have for me regarding the leadership position. I got things done, when people asked for me to do something, I got it done. But should I take charge again and end up programming the whole robot my self or should I just step back and let the others work on it first and just fix up the code after wards? Now I feel like the second option, I am very OCD about coding, if they don't put the spaces or indent correctly I freak out and fix it. Thats a personal flaw. Also to me, it seems lazy or bossy to have the other programmers code the robot.
Task delegation isn't laziness. It will probably take more effort and work than coding a robot would have, especially because you could delegate some of it to yourself.

As for advice, I would suggest you remember your goals and work based on them. You're not working on a programming team with the goal of producing functional and effective code for an FRC robot. That is a goal, but not the ultimate goal. The ultimate goal is to inspire people to pursue science and technology, and depending on your team, teaching, engaging, and learning should be a part of that. When given the choice between getting the code done an hour earlier, or engaging more of your programmers, the choice is obvious.

I wouldn't define "taking charge" as "hogging the computer and coding the whole robot". That's the opposite of leadership. Taking charge would be coordinating your programming team to get the entire project done.

---


Quote:
Now here is where the problem starts, I am terrible at teaching. If you program, it is more about how you think, not the syntax. I code in C++ and Java, we used Java this year, which I personally do not like. Also I told my mentors straight up, I will use C++ next year. Now that I think about it, if I want to be a leader, I probably have to make sacrifices myself, Java is easier to learn than C++. I have 2 more years for robotics, which is not a lot, that means someone else has to step up after me. I think it is better in the long run to have the programmers suffer a little bit learning C++. I am already putting in the extra mile with my mentors, you know about my little autonomous robot project (check my sig). I think the major thing I lack is the ability to teach and patience. I sometimes even freak out (not literally) just a major facepalm moment when guys use too many if statements to do something. Yes, I need to mature on that part if I want to be a leader
I think you're starting to catch on a bit. You've seen a shortcoming of yours, that you're bad at teaching, and you're considering the compromises you need to make to effectively do your job as a leader rather than as a coder. I think the important distinction to make is that you see leadership as the person who does the most work, when that's not exactly true. "Going the extra mile" as a leader isn't taking a big project and doing it yourself; "taking charge" isn't doing 100% of the robot's code. You'll need to separate being a leader from doing the work.
__________________
Proud 2791 Mentor (2010-201?):
2014 FLR Motorola Quality / Semifinalists (with 341, 4930)
2013 WPI Regional #1 Seed / Delphi Excellence in Engineering / Finalists (with 20, 3182), BAE Motorola Quality
2012 BAE Imagery / Finalists (with 1519, 885), CT Xerox Creativity / Semifinalists (with 2168, 118)

Proud 1714 Alumnus (2009) - 2009 Minnesota 10,000 Lakes Regional Champions (with 2826, 2470)
2791 Build Season Photo Gallery - Look here for mechanism photos
My Robotics Blog (Updated April 11 2014)
Reply With Quote
  #20   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-09-2010, 07:57 AM
IKE's Avatar
IKE IKE is offline
FF Pure Mi
AKA: Isaac Rife
no team (N/A)
Team Role: Mechanical
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Rookie Year: 2003
Location: Michigan
Posts: 1,763
IKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond reputeIKE has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Quote:
Originally Posted by woody View Post
On a similar note, Tribal Leadership by Logan, King, and Fischer-Wright is a great book focused on creating a culture of excellence within organizations. The principles they discuss are immediately applicable to FRC teams. Maybe Isaac would like to go into a little more detail on this one : )
Tribal Leadership is one of the best Leadership books I have read as far as applicability to FRC and FIRST in general. I purchased several copies and have had our other mentors read it, and passed it on to people within the CD community I have a lot of respect for (there is much more to come). You can actually download the audio-book version for free by signing up through Zappos.com
http://www.zappos.com/tribal.zhtml
It in MP3 format.
Why is an online shoe distributorship offering free downloads of a leadership book? Oddly enough for many of the same reasons 341 won Chairman's this year. SERIOUSLY! the audio-book is missing the chapter on Strategy which in my opinion is one of the best views of general strategy I have ever seen.
David, many of the things you are asking about would be much clearer after reading (or listening to) this book.
************************************************** *******
There are a ton of different ways to lead, and what works for some may not work for others. Some leaders are quite vocal and charismatic. Others are quiet and more of the lead by example. What is important is to understand the different styles and find a style that works best for you, and the people you are leading. I don't think it is leadership to lead a group that you are the only one contributing. That is really just doing, not leading.

If you think of a team as a whole bunch of parts, a poor leader will have a mess. A decent leader will assemble and use this team in a manner that the sum of the parts seperate is actually more than them as a whole. This is underachieving, but nearly inevitable due to overlap of skill sets, timing, and budget constraints. A good leader's output will equal the sum of those independent parts. That means everyone is fully utilized to the sum of their abilities. A great leader is able to produce an output greater than the sum. That is because a great leader is able to get people to work beyond their ability and instead reach their potential.

SMEs (Subject Matter Experts) typically have trouble extending beyond good as they know things can be done better if they do it themselves. This takes them away from leading and developing others and often blocks the efforts of others (hey you guys sit back and watch a pro). A manager I really respect once told me, "The toughest part of being promoted to management was watching others get better at my area of technical expertise than me. Eventually, them getting better became the most rewarding part of my job."
Reply With Quote
  #21   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-09-2010, 09:40 AM
rsisk's Avatar
rsisk rsisk is offline
The GURU Channel
AKA: Richard Sisk
FRC #2493 (Robokong)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Riverside, CA
Posts: 2,453
rsisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond reputersisk has a reputation beyond repute
Send a message via MSN to rsisk
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

I see another way to divide types of leaders; strategic and tactical.

Strategic leaders are the visionaries of the team. They think in terms of years, direction, philosophy. The immediate impact of their decisions is not always visible, but in the long run, you sure are glad they guided the team in a certain direction. They are the Generals, the CEOs, the head coach.

Tactical leaders are the guys in the trenches getting the job done. They lead teams of doers to accomplish a goal. They are the ones planning out the build season, the days objectives, the competition. They buy into the vision of the strategic leaders and make it happen. They are the Captains and the Chief Master Sergeants, the senior managers, the team leaders.

Regardless of the type of leader, they all need to earn respect of those they lead. They don't need to be loved, but they do need respect in order to lead. They need to be confident in their decisions. They need to listen to many sources of input, process that information, then make the best decision they can, sometimes working on incomplete information. They need to be honest.

One of the cool things I have found mentoring an FRC team is to watch the development of students on the team as some of them grow into leadership roles. The change that occurs between freshman and senior is amazing especially when combined with the influence of a program like FIRST.
__________________



Reply With Quote
  #22   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-09-2010, 09:08 PM
Phoenix Spud's Avatar
Phoenix Spud Phoenix Spud is offline
Ask not what your team can do 4u...
AKA: The American living in Australia
FRC #3132 (Thunder Down Under), FRC #2342 (Team Phoenix)
Team Role: College Student
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Rookie Year: 2004
Location: Sydney, Australia
Posts: 644
Phoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant futurePhoenix Spud has a brilliant future
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Personally, I think age has nothing to do with being a leader. I have seen 10 year olds ready to lead, and 20 year olds who aren't. It has more to do with your maturity and experience than your age.

Just because someone is a senior does not automatically make them the best person for the job. At times, the right person could be a freshmen who has extensive experience. A good leader will step down so the right people are in the leadership positions, regardless of age.

My $.02
__________________
Sarah Heimlich
Strategy Mentor | FIRST Step Host

FIRST TEAM 3132
Thunder Down Under
Sydney, Australia
Reply With Quote
  #23   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-10-2010, 03:19 AM
Zack247's Avatar
Zack247 Zack247 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Zack Medow
FRC #0247 (Da Bears)
Team Role: Alumni
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Berkley High School
Posts: 24
Zack247 is a name known to allZack247 is a name known to allZack247 is a name known to allZack247 is a name known to allZack247 is a name known to allZack247 is a name known to all
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

As The West Wing taught me, a good leader must believe that he/she was was put on earth by God to do their job, and to never show it.
Reply With Quote
  #24   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-10-2010, 08:14 AM
OZ_341's Avatar Unsung FIRST Hero
OZ_341 OZ_341 is offline
Registered User
#0341 (Wissahickon)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Rookie Year: 2000
Location: Ambler, PA
Posts: 1,441
OZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond reputeOZ_341 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

I would like to suggest that any young people interested in leadership, should read one of the many books by or about John Wooden. (storied college basketball coach) I am not a big basketball fan, but I am a big John Wooden fan. Simple and to the point. Check it out!

Another favorite is the "7 habits of Highly Successful People". There is a lot of insight into leadership in that book as well.

Both of these suggested readings make the point that you should "cooperate" with those you are leading. Something I really believe in.
__________________
2010 Championship Chairman's Award
2014 NEWTON Division Finalists (thanks 971, 1983, & 3147)
2014 Mid-Atlantic Champions (thanks 2590 & 11)
2014 Hatboro District Champions (thanks 2590 & 272)
2014 Lenape District Team Spirit Award
2014 Finger Lakes and MAR CMP KPCB Award
Overall Record 60 W - 37 L
Reply With Quote
  #25   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-10-2010, 09:38 PM
Cheerleader1073's Avatar
Cheerleader1073 Cheerleader1073 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Genevieve
FRC #0233 (The Pink Team)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Rookie Year: 2007
Location: Home in NH, College in FL!
Posts: 92
Cheerleader1073 is a jewel in the roughCheerleader1073 is a jewel in the roughCheerleader1073 is a jewel in the rough
Send a message via Skype™ to Cheerleader1073
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Since many have already made excellent and relevant comments, I won't bore with an entire page's worth of what's already been said! However I would like to say just this that I actually heard in a movie: sometimes you have to have served in order to lead. Going off on this, a great leader should be elected because of their experience by those who have experience as well. Our team holds interviews for lead positions (we have to Co-CEOs each year as well as VPs for each subgroup) which are held by the previous year's Co-CEOs for the new Co-CEOs, then the new Co-CEOs (after they are selected) replace the old ones for the new VP interviews, as well as a consistent panel of the same 5-7 mentors for all interviews. This has worked for our team from the beginning, so just thought I'd throw that in there!

Thanks!

-Gen
__________________
Genevieve Beaulieu
1073, 1058, 1519... always in my <3!



Heard about FIRST Friday 2012?
www.worldfirstfriday.wordpress.com
http://www.facebook.com/worldfirstfriday

@lifebycountry on Twitter

FRC Student: 2007-2011
FLL/JFLL Mentor: 2008-2011
Volunteer (Mixed): 2007-Present
FRC Mentor: 2011-Present

Reply With Quote
  #26   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-11-2010, 04:28 PM
JamesCH95's Avatar
JamesCH95 JamesCH95 is offline
Hardcore Dork
AKA: JCH
FRC #0095 (LRT-UVR Grasshoppers #95)
Team Role: Engineer
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Rookie Year: 2001
Location: Enfield, NH
Posts: 1,443
JamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond reputeJamesCH95 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

We had a freshman do all of the programming this year. He did it, but was pretty well fried at the end.

The last thing you should do is "hog the code" because if two or three programmers can be effectively coordinated it will spread out the workload and keep fresh eyes looking at the code. Your "OCD" about neat programming could actually be a strength in this regard: if every programmer who works on the code works in the same general format of tabs and spacing etc they will more easily be able to read and comprehend each others code and therefore be a more effective team. Heck, even if you go through after every revision and neaten up the code to a uniform format you would probably be helping things.

If you could handle coordinating 2 other programmers, collectively developing a programming format that works for all of you, and be willing to compromise on programming styles I think you could do okay. Also remember that a good leader is humble, flexible, and usually has a non-abrasive personality.
__________________
Theory is a nice place, I'd like to go there one day, I hear everything works there.

Maturity is knowing you were an idiot, common sense is trying to not be an idiot, wisdom is knowing that you will still be an idiot.
Reply With Quote
  #27   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-11-2010, 06:15 PM
Rion Atkinson's Avatar
Rion Atkinson Rion Atkinson is offline
The CAD Guy
no team
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Rookie Year: 2009
Location: Oklahoma City
Posts: 393
Rion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond reputeRion Atkinson has a reputation beyond repute
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Quote:
Originally Posted by davidthefat View Post
edit: Would you find it rude if a Junior ran against you for a leadership position if you were a Senior? I am not sure if this guy is going to run again, but he was the programming leader this year, but I pretty ended up being "the" programmer...
I know this question has been answered. But I'm going to answer it from experience. I was a junior this year and it was only my second year on the team. In fact, on my first year I was the electrical sub-team captain. This year I decided to run for team-captain against a senior who has been on the team sense it's beginning 3 years ago. His last year is next year and he thought for sure his last two years he would be able to be team-captain. I actually happened to win the voting and was team captain this year. I know for a fact that he never respected me the entire year. He was hurt by the fact that it was only my second year on the team and he felt him being older, and more experienced that it was his right to be captain.

You asked what they would fill, it's possible that is what they will fill. Or they accept you won it for the right reasons, and take it in stride.

------------------------------

Now I would like to do something here.

This thread seems to have been started to tell what a good leader is. But it also seems like it is only talking about what a good programming leader is. I would like to submit the following questions.

What is a great leader?

How do you become a great leader? Is it a gift, or something that can be learned?

I ask these because this being my first year as the team leader I was still learning how to lead well. I was able enough to get all the students(save one) to like me and follow me as their leader. The problem was most of the mentors. The engineering mentors (including our Boeing mentor) along with the head mentor, did not like me. They all said I was too strong willed and never listened to them. (Which was followed by the words "You aren't allowed on this team next year", looks like the senior will have his chance after all. ) I wont deny that, but that was mainly when they said stuff like "Riveting is a lot stronger than welding", "It's impossible to weld aluminum" and "80/20 is a lot lighter that extruded aluminum." On the last one they failed to account for the weight of the brackets and only went by pounds per foot.

Anyway, my biggest point is this. How does a high school student become a great leader? Is this even possible? Should their be restrictions on who can lead and who can't? I would love to hear everyone's opinions on this.

Requesting your $0.02
-Rion
__________________
‎‎"I know not with what weapons World War III will be fought, but World War IV will be fought with sticks and stones. -Albert Einstein
Start Something

Email - rionatkinson@gmail.com
Skype - Rion.Atkinson

Last edited by Rion Atkinson : 06-11-2010 at 06:33 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #28   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-11-2010, 07:14 PM
BrianT103's Avatar
BrianT103 BrianT103 is offline
Registered User
AKA: Brian Taylor a.ka. BT
FRC #0103 (Cybersonics)
Team Role: Mentor
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Rookie Year: 2006
Location: Kintnersville, PA
Posts: 57
BrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud ofBrianT103 has much to be proud of
Send a message via AIM to BrianT103
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

A good leader must first be an excellent follower.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #29   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-13-2010, 09:09 PM
ExTexan's Avatar
ExTexan ExTexan is offline
Parent and Volunteer
AKA: Richard Singletary
FRC #0548
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Rookie Year: 2008
Location: Northville, MI
Posts: 128
ExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant futureExTexan has a brilliant future
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

Quote:
What is a great leader?

How do you become a great leader? Is it a gift, or something that can be learned?
Great questions....and if every aspect of a good leader could be defined, or learned, then there would be many more great leaders. Some parts are instinctive, some can be learned and no two great leaders have exactly the same qualities.

That being said there are a few traits that are very common and if you imagine what you look for in a leader, as a follower, then here are a few:

Listening: I want to follow someone who listens to me.
Empathy: I want to follow someone who understands my viewpoint.
Dependability, Integrity, etc.: I want to follow someone who is dependable and I trust and respect.
Communication: A very big one and the above three traits are part of it. In your example, as a follower, if I believe riveting is stronger than welding and tell you so then I want you to listen, understand why I think so and then communicate to me why you think it may not be true in such a fashion that I trust your response.
Be Fair: Not equal, but fair
Enjoy Every Minute: When my "leader" is not upbeat, I am not upbeat.

And probably the most difficult one for many leaders is to let your sub-leaders do things you don't agree with. Question, inspect, advise but let your leaders lead. Real leaders know when not to turn wrenches or write code. A leaders job is to motivate, have a plan, a strategy and keep the group headed in a direction that everyone knows.

Some of these come natural, some are learned and there are many more. But the biggest thing you can do as a leader (and one that very few leaders do) is to GET FEEDBACK. I mean true, honest, good and bad, feedback. It has to be anonymous from most people to be truly honest and you must devise your own methods but if you get that information, and act on it properly, you will learn why you aren't a good leader and become one if you have the ability. So many "leaders" are ineffective, or not as effective as they could be, and have no idea why.
__________________
What we think, or what we know, or what we believe is, in the end, of little consequence. The only consequence is what we do.

2010 REFEREE: Kettering, Ann Arbor, Wayne State, Troy, MI Championship, Atlanta-Newton field, IGVC TARDEC, MARC and upcoming KETTERING Kickoff.
Reply With Quote
  #30   Spotlight this post!  
Unread 06-13-2010, 11:12 PM
548swimmer's Avatar
548swimmer 548swimmer is offline
CAD Leader
AKA: Alec Wagner
FRC #0548 (Robostangs)
Team Role: CAD
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Rookie Year: 2005
Location: Michigan
Posts: 304
548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of548swimmer has much to be proud of
Re: What Makes A Good Leader?

I feel that one of the most important skills for a leader to have is the ability to keep everyone working well together. This year we ran in to issues with simple things like sensor mounts. No one told the CAD team that the sensor in question (a gyro I think) was even going to be used until late in the season so no mount was designed. A good leader would make sure everyone knew that sensor needed to be mounted far enough ahead of time so that it could be designed in.

From a mechanical standpoint, I want a leader who will keep things moving. The time to prototype is in the offseason (if you can call it that), not during week 3. The leader needs to decide when to make a call, and then make a call at that time.

In general, a great leader must be humble. Let's say for example that your average mechanical guy was your new build leader. Now, instead of worrying about whether to use a panhead or cap screw he has to coordinate electrical, CAD, programming, and fabrication. A great leader woud, in this instance, admit that he can't program or wire an electrical board and appoint a "cabinet" if you will. While he doesn't necessarily need to be "hands-on" with everything, he should have a general idea about what's going on.
__________________
My religion is physics, it can explain everything.

WINNER -- 2011 Waterford District
District Chairman's -- 2011 Waterford District
Finalist -- 2011 Ann Arbor District
State Chairman's -- 2011 Michigan State Championship
Quarter-finalist -- 2011 Galileo
2011 Championship -- Highest Ranking Score
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What makes for a good and spectator-friendly game? Chris Hibner General Forum 12 04-22-2009 12:33 PM
What makes a good teaser photo? Tom Bottiglieri General Forum 8 01-27-2005 05:03 AM
what makes a good robot MikeL303 General Forum 19 04-20-2003 12:09 AM
What makes you such a good scouter Raul@13 Scouting 6 03-04-2003 08:22 PM
What makes the Good, So good? Chris General Forum 16 07-18-2002 10:09 AM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:33 AM.

The Chief Delphi Forums are sponsored by Innovation First International, Inc.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © Chief Delphi