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Unread 01-01-2005, 11:45 PM
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suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

At this point, it seems that there are about 75 people who have maxed out their reputation dots. When one compares the list of those 75 people with their join dates, only about 10 of them have joined since the reputation system started. This brings up the question as to what the purpose of the reputation system is.

If the reputation system is designed to reward older members, it is doing exactly what it was designed for. There is an inherent bias against new members that will only get worse as the years go on and people build up more reputation and more reputation altering power. I wouldn't doubt in 2 or 3 more years that JVN (assuming he keeps posting) will have a reputation exceeding 100,000 and would be able to give 1000 reputation points to other people.

I think that it's time to reduce the existing reputation (and probably do it once a year).

One way to do that would be to divide everyone's reputation by a constant, say 5 or 10. I kind of like the idea of indexing this constant to the amount of reputation of the highest member (for example divide everyone this year by a constant that would leave JVN with 1000 reputation points). This would preserve the existing reputation strata, while allowing new members to move up more easily. If this were done each year, someone who amassed a lot of reputation but stopped posting would within a few years see themself with the same reputation as a new poster.

Another idea would be to set an amount of reputation, and set everyone above that level to that level once a year. Somewhere between 500 and 1000 seems good to me. This would allow the highly regarded poster who stops posting to maintain a certain amount of reputation while still allowing newer members the ability to get recognized.

What do people think?
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:03 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

I take the reputation system about as seriously as I do a "What team will win the championship?" thread on the first week of the build season. It's all a popularity contest and I can't see it intended for anything else.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:12 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Quote:
Originally Posted by Koko Ed
I take the reputation system about as seriously as I do a "What team will win the championship?" thread on the first week of the build season. It's all a popularity contest and I can't see it intended for anything else.
Many FIRSTers who have been on ChiefDelphi would probably agree with you here, but the people with the most reputation are often highly respected within both the CD and FIRST community as a whole. The only problem is that new CDers may be intimidated by the reputation of the most reputable users and hold false notions like "User X must be 10 times better than User Y because X has 10 green dots while Y has one."
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:13 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

I'll agree that that's pretty much all it is in its current form. It seems to me that for it to be truly useful, it needs to be some sort of reputation/posts system, or possibly only reputation gained in the last 2-3-4 months counts. Or if you're really fancy, rep points decay exponentially with time. I too have noticed the large swings that high rep members can create. I was admonished for a post by dave lavery once, but just given neutral reps. When he later gave me positive reps for another post, I can understand why he wouldn't throw around negative reps lightly. So yeah, some sort of weighting system would probably help keep the rep system somewhat relevant.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:14 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

This seems to be more trouble than it's worth.


For instance, if everyones rep was divided by a constant those that currently have low points (one or two green dots) would wind up with negative points and a gray or red dot that they didn't deserve. To customize this, so that the formula changes depending on rep points (which would be almost like going from user to user) would be impractical if not impossible.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:25 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Jay H 237: Dividing a person with low reputation's reputation points would give them a smaller number or a positive fraction, but never a negative number. Even users with negative reputation would have this divided and thus become closer to 0.

In general, I think that this isn't necessary---users like JVN and Dave Lavery and such are comparable, on a smaller scale, of course, to presidents of the United States. While they will someday not be active in FIRST and on ChiefDelphi, what they've contributed will always be remembered, and thus should always be recognized. Lincoln doesn't do a whole lot for the USA right now, but that doesn't mean we're about to take him off of our currency and forget that he abolished slavery. Furthermore, users of that magnitude know how to properly and intelligently distribute their reputation points. Perhaps a cap on the amount of reputation-altering power a user can have would be in order? Certainly the reputation should still be shown---the user earned it!
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:26 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverStar
Many FIRSTers who have been on ChiefDelphi would probably agree with you here, but the people with the most reputation are often highly respected within both the CD and FIRST community as a whole. The only problem is that new CDers may be intimidated by the reputation of the most reputable users and hold false notions like "User X must be 10 times better than User Y because X has 10 green dots while Y has one."
You know how I got my big rep score?
When I was running the Fantasy FIRST draft before the championships and everybody was drunk with excitment over the whole idea and kept showiering me with oodles of reputation just because I put two and two together and came up with a game anyone else could have easily came up with.
There is little to take seriously about the whole thing nor should there be.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:37 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

I sure do miss the old days when you knew who knew their stuff on CD just by reading posts. I speak my mind, and don't worry about reputation. I think it is more important to stand up for your beliefs and say what you think than to be intimitated by someone who has more "green dots" than you do. They are, after all, just dots.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:37 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

I have to kind of agree with Ed here, and at the same time, I also think the rep system could just be left alone. While it does seem a bit of a popularity contest, looking at the people with the highest rep, they also have the most experience relevant to helping people on CD FIRST and presenting useful postings. You know that people with high reps can generally give you the advice you need, while people newer to CD are more in the "unknown" category. If new people are in fact intimidated by the rep system, then perhaps we need to explain it better off of the main section. I dont know that I even know many of the details of it (for instance, is there a max limit?). So maybe its time we explain it better before we try changing it.

I will be honest, I found it fairly useful, coming into CD just this year myself, and not knowing who to be able to ask for help. I've been heavily involved in FIRST since 96, but I had never really been on CD before, so it was fairly useful to figure out who had "good reps" in the community, while at the same time noting that it can at times be similar to winning prom king/queen.

Just my thoughts
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Unread 01-02-2005, 12:45 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kims Robot
I dont know that I even know many of the details of it (for instance, is there a max limit?). So maybe its time we explain it better before we try changing it.
For the record, this thread explains how the reputation system works, along with the reputation-altering power system.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 01:00 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

I feel it is somewhat a good idea to do something with the reputation system. A member of a rookie team contacted me for some help regarding their robot design because saw I had a high reputation and thought I'd be a good resource. I was to a certain extent, but then I directed him to a better suited person for his question. So all in all, I think the reputation system does count. Some people do look at the reputation system and judge a person. And if Brandon feels that there are people with high reputation who do not deserve to be, then maybe we can do something about it. And I agree to Koko Ed too, some of my reputation points are just useless. They've come from the most stupid things ever. And I personally feel that some members with high reputation just do not deserve to be there, they're there just because of friends or just talking sweet and not meaning anything.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 01:02 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

(Full disclosure: I have eleven dots.)

I see the rep system as a non-issue. If folks want to rep someone for something silly, that is their call under the system.

If there is one thing I would love to see change about the rep system, it would be to create some sort of half-strength option, for when I don't feel like giving someone a full-on red dot. There are several times that I've wanted to give someone a negative rep, but decided against it because I'd be screwing them up far beyond what it was worth. And sometimes neutral just doesn't say it.

...but like I said, I'm fine with it right now.

<edit>Somewhere in the FAQs (too tired to look it up right now) there's a mention that if you feel a rep is unwarranted, PM Brandon. He can take those things out.</edit>
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Unread 01-02-2005, 01:02 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

How about normalizing the reputation points by dividing the number by the quantity of postings made by the person.
This normalized number may reflect more of a quality rep # instead of a quantity rep #.

Some of the sub-forums should not be part of the reputation system; like chit-chat and games.
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Last edited by Rich Wong : 01-02-2005 at 05:38 PM. Reason: added comments.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 01:04 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bharat Nain
I feel it is somewhat a good idea to do something with the reputation system. A member of a rookie team contacted me for some help regarding their robot design because saw I had a high reputation and thought I'd be a good resource. I was to a certain extent, but then I directed him to a better suited person for his question. So all in all, I think the reputation system does count. Some people do look at the reputation system and judge a person. And if Brandon feels that there are people with high reputation who do not deserve to be, then maybe we can do something about it. And I agree to Koko Ed too, some of my reputation points are just useless. They've come from the most stupid things ever. And I personally feel that some members with high reputation just do not deserve to be there, they're there just because of friends or just talking sweet and not meaning anything.
Nothing wrong with being liked neither.
I just think people read too much into the rep. It's like looking good. What you see is what you get.
You want more? Search thier previous posts and see what makes them tick. The proof is in the pudding and you'll find out if they're the real deal or full of it pretty quick.
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Unread 01-02-2005, 01:04 AM
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Re: suggestion to reduce existing reputation for upcoming season

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnasmific
I sure do miss the old days when you knew who knew their stuff on CD just by reading posts. I speak my mind, and don't worry about reputation. I think it is more important to stand up for your beliefs and say what you think than to be intimitated by someone who has more "green dots" than you do. They are, after all, just dots.
Although I've used CD for the last year, I know I haven't explored all of its features. I'd seen reputation mentioned once or twice, but until this thread I didn't really know anything about it. I've simply made my decisions by reading the posts. It doesn't take long to figure out who the CD community respects, who uses sound reasoning and logical arguments, and who posts regularly while saying nothing.
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