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Unread 04-06-2005, 12:53 AM
Ken Delaney 357 Ken Delaney 357 is offline
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Are the VEX kits worth buying?

This goes out to the 50 teams that have the kits already. Are they worth buying? I liked the EDUbot/Robovation kits when they came out but did not feel they were worth the cost. I really think that these VEX kits could make robotics more accessible to schools and youth organizations, if VEX can deliver on their promise. So you have had them for about two weeks now, what have been your experiences? Unfortunately I will not be at Championship with my team(Go Royal Assault!) to see the Vex Challenge first-hand.I am thinking of buying a kit of my own when they're available. I am really interested in your feedback.
Thanks
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Last edited by Ken Delaney 357 : 04-06-2005 at 01:01 AM.
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Unread 04-06-2005, 08:04 AM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

I'm not on a Vex team, but I did get a couple of minutes of quality time with one at Palmetto.

Knowing that they're $300 (and the Robovation kit that rookies get goes for $595 on IFI's website, or just the controller itself is $250 without a radio), I'd say they're worth the money. The materials look pretty much like Robovation materials, but the controller and radio look and feel a bit more finished than the Robovation's setup. (The radio felt good in my hands--but then again, I have big hands. I can't use anything but the XBox Duke controller. So you might want to watch out if you've got really small students.) Programming remains a mystery, although I did notice that they're using non-standard ports on the back of the controller itself, which makes me think there's some proprietary something-or-other going on within. (Little do they know that we have folks like Kevin Watson in our camp. Fwahaahaa. )

If I had the money right now, I would buy one. (But that's another story.)
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Last edited by Billfred : 04-06-2005 at 08:08 AM.
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Unread 04-06-2005, 12:44 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

My FLL team worked with a Robovation kit this summer, as the basis for a robotic "Avatar" project. Since we have received Vex kits to prepare for the FIRST Vex Challenge in Atlanta, we have compared them in detail, and just about every area is improved, some substantially.

The microcontroller is similar in capability, with 16 I/O ports and interrupt ports still present. Thesolenoid outputs have been removed, but the connection of up to two R/C receivers is allowed, each through a single cable (the Robovation controller uses up to eight cables for one receiver). The battery pack connector now accepts standard 7.2v NiCad battery packs without an adapter.

The R/C transmitter and receiver is included, a modified Futaba 6-channel digital system that seems very suitable to its purpose (and will drive 8 motors/servos, in a configuration where you slave two motors to each differential drivetrain). There is also a mode to use two transmitters with one receiver to control the chassis and manipulator(s) separately.

The "Erector-like" mild steel building components and the same, with a couple of new ones added. Delrin bearing have some new configurations, and axles are still square. 3 sizes of gears have been added, but the sprockets and chains have been removed (I understand they will be added back into the system in the Fall). The three motors are similar, with a better finish and a clutch added. A servo is also included (120 degree), in the same form factor as the motors. The wheels are MUCH better - no more soft foam that cannot bear weight without deforming. The hardware is still hex-driver oriented.

The programming system is absent, but should be available in the Fall. I understand it will be C based, with a Visual layer (on the idea of Mindstorms) available for simplified coding. Only limit switches and bumper switches made the beta kit, but as many as six new sensors should be available in the Fall.


All in all, my team loves them, and at half the price of the Robovation kit, with a very capable R/C system included, with many design upgrades, I feel that the Vex Robotic Development Systems are a great buy, and I look forward to our town group, the Sharon Youth Robotics Association (http://syraweb.home.comcast.net/), sponsoring a number of Vex teams in addition to FLL teams in the Fall.

I have seen the Vex kits already in several Radio Shack stores, at least here in Massachusetts, so you should be able to get a look soon. Also, we have posted a Vex-oriented website at http://eaglevex.home.comcast.net/, with lots of pictures, to chronicle our reponse to the FIRST Vex Challenge this Spring.
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Unread 04-06-2005, 03:52 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Here's an article with some pictures. Looks kind of like an erector set.
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Unread 04-06-2005, 04:32 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Ive been playing with our kits, and they are a lot of fun, and Id say they are worth the money. But if you want a better deal, wait about a year or so for the fully programabble versions (at least thats when I THINK they are supposed to come out). Expect a lot of other cool goodies in May also.
The only problems I have with the kits are that there is only 1 PWM extention, so you cant space the motors out very much, and thats theres only 3 motors (and 1 servo). It even tells you how to build a 4-wheel drive, but doesnt give you enough motors =P. But you will be able to buy individual motors, so that solves that problem.
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Unread 04-07-2005, 12:35 AM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Hello Ken: I think the VEX Kit is worth the money. I am an adult mentor for our newly formed robotics team and we are participating in the VEX pilot program. I cannot compare it to any other kits as this is our first year in a robotics program. I wish some of our students were here to tell you about the Vex kit. They really have been getting alot out of it. Everything in the kit seems to be of good quality especially the electronics. The metal pieces are easy to work with as far as cutting and bending if needed. A good selection of fasteners and spacers is included as well as a couple of different types of limit switches. There are no belts, chains, or pulleys though and I think that would be a nice addition in future kits. It would be nice to see some timing gears and belts of various sizes and my bet is that there will be in future kits. They did a very good job with this kit. We are a small budget private school and probably would not have been able to start a robotics program without a kit of this kind. I highly recommend VEX! Our team will be competing in Atlanta and our students are very excited about going. The VEX kit has really ignited the enthusiasm of our students and our robotics program.
Thanks,
Greg
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Unread 04-07-2005, 02:25 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

I'd say so. Be prepared to buy the battery kit for $50 at your local Radio Shack. Also, it seems both kits I know of ended up with the same freq crystals, so he and I are considering getting the 4 crystal set so we can run at the same time.

Several of the parts seem a little on the expensive side, so I have started to look into home-brew parts. I have NO idea if that will be legal on a FRV team, but I don't really care. Mine will be used for private use, and team prototypes. (Example - the base squarebot uses almost all the shaft collars and bearing plates.) Dr. Joe's list of McMaster Carr parts is a good start.

I hope that the championship webcast will show some Vex stuff too, or at least I hope to see some pictures. My buddy and I are building triple play robots, with bamboo Tetras. I just wish they would get the programming device out soon.

It's good to know the local radio shack people.
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Unread 04-07-2005, 03:05 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Not2B
I'd say so. Be prepared to buy the battery kit for $50 at your local Radio Shack. Also, it seems both kits I know of ended up with the same freq crystals, so he and I are considering getting the 4 crystal set so we can run at the same time.
Standard Hobbyist RC batteries work just fine. In my opinion, you can get much better batteries (3000mA-h NiMH) and a charger from Tower Hobby for about the same cost as the Radio Shack kit.

I know that the rule book recommends using NiCd batteries because they can supply more current with lower voltage drop than NiMH, but again, in my opinion, even with 8 motors it is not that easy to draw that much current from these motors. They are internally protected for overheating which means if you use the motor at anything close the their stall current for any period of time, the breakers are going to turn the motors off momentarily. HERE is a link to the IFI website where they have a table of what currents were allowed on the Isaac system (fore runner to VEX).

Also, the rule book does not apply generally, only to the Atlanta Tourney.

For what it is worth.

Joe J.


P.S. In answer to the question, "Are the VEX kits worth buying?" I have to say, "Yes, undoubtedly." There are flaws. Improvements can always be made, but it is a very solid concept. One that I am sure will introduce robotics to 1000's of folks who otherwise would not have the opportunity. Well done, Innovation First, Radio Shack, & FIRST. JJ
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Last edited by Joe Johnson : 04-07-2005 at 03:49 PM.
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Unread 04-07-2005, 03:32 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

The vex kits are available online now, http://www.radioshack.com/category.a...0%5F000&Page=1
And I'm considering going out to get one. It looks very cool
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Unread 04-07-2005, 04:06 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Johnson
Standard Hobbyist RC batteries work just fine. In my opinion, you can get much better batteries (3000mA-h NiMH) and a charger from Tower Hobby for about the same cost as the Radio Shack kit.
DOH! That's a great idea! Tower Hobbies is a GREAT place. I'll have to remind the other VEXers in my area. (Grumble grumble... I've only used them for gas powered products, forgot about the battery powered side of the hobby.)
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Unread 04-07-2005, 11:12 PM
Ken Delaney 357 Ken Delaney 357 is offline
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

WooHoo!! I am definitely buying one ASAP. It sound like everyone is having a great time with them. I would like to wait for the fall to get the improved kit that Lil' Lavery spoke of, but I need to get one now so I can show it to my school administrators to get things off the ground for possibly starting a VEX team in the fall. Thanks everybody for the feedback.

Quote:
Originally Posted by devicenull
The vex kits are available online now, http://www.radioshack.com/category.a...0%5F000&Page=1
And I'm considering going out to get one. It looks very cool
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Unread 04-08-2005, 08:28 AM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Hi,
Our team just bought a VEX starter kit and some accessories from Radioshack this week. I took the stuff home and worked with my 9 year-old. We followed the Inventor Book (comes with kit) to build the basic drive unit or SquareBot. My son had no problems building it.

Connecting the controller and plugging into the correct port was difficult for him only because he was unfamilar with these FIRST programming and electrical concepts.

It was a lot of fun. Of course, we had to build an arm to pick up 'tetras' so it would be interesting. The default code in the controller was sufficient and can allow for a lot of ideas without needing any programming.

Here's what you need from Radioshack to get started.
1. Starter Kit $300
2. Battery kit $50.

You can do lots of stuff for $350.

Now, lots of add-on kits come from Radioshack. In order to do lots of problem solving exercising such as hanging, picking up balls, stacking, scooping,etc. these add on kits are helpful if you have the money.
1. Extra hardware $80
2. Chain drive kits ?
3. Motor (1) kit $20
4. Servo (1) kit $20
5. Gear kit $13
6. Tire kit ?
7. Cutting tool ? (need to do lots of cutting of metal for various designs)

Call it about $180 since I don't know the price of three items above. This now comes to $530.

The robot does have an autonomous mode. This requires a jumper and the user cannot control the robot with the transmitter (I think!). To have fun doing this, one could use various sensor kits.
1. Programming kit ?
2. Line sensor kit. ?
3. Ultrasonic range finder ?
4. Encoders ?

Don't know these prices. Bet its around $120 or more. Please let me know the exact values.

Now for a price of $650 plus tax you and your teams can do really complex normal and autonomous things.

Radioshack only listed four items yesterday...although they stock everything in their system. (Do a search for VEX brand to see what's available).

Oh yeah, if you have an EduRobot kit, you can borrow and use most of the hardware for this VEX robot (brackets, screws, nuts, etc.)

We'll demo our VEX robot next Monday when are team meets to make preparations for the nationals (we won't be doing VEX competitions.

I definitely like the stuff. Hope to find low cost substitutes for the add-ons in the future.

Regards,
ChuckB
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Unread 04-10-2005, 05:30 AM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Delaney 357
This goes out to the 50 teams that have the kits already. Are they worth buying?
FVT-42 The Hitchhikers

As part of the RoboEducators (http://www.roboeducators.org/), we are planning to run five Robotics Boot Camps for teachers using the Vex this summer. There will be five of these camps across the US. I will be running mine at my Contra Costa College, where I teach. We will expect these ten teachers to build teams and then compete in a local competition. These teams would naturally also fit in with whatever plans FIRST has for Vex.

Oh, I forgot to answer. Yup, I sure think they are worth buying. My team has gone though dozens of prototypes by this point. It is a wonderful vehicle for exploration and creativity.
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Unread 04-11-2005, 09:50 AM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

White Wolf,
I haven't gotten a clear answer on programming the VEX controller. What language is the VEX controller programmed in? Can you select a different language (i.e. Visual, C, PBASIC, or other)?

Thanks,
Chuck
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Unread 04-11-2005, 12:13 PM
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Re: Are the VEX kits worth buying?

The kits at the stores already (yes I have seen personally 2 stores in CT that carry them already) is version .5

(Side note - It was pretty funny seeing the looks we got looking at the kit, not one time, but on 2 separate visits to the same store in one day while wearing FIRST logo plastered shirts and hats, and the second time with a friend riding a Segway in the store with us.)

What is V1.0 gonna bring? Maybe I shall wait till that one comes out till I get one... May take me that long to save up enough to get one anyways, even with the relatively cheap $299.00 price tag for the starter kit..

I want a pair of Vex safety glasses first though, but they do look like child's sizes..
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