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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:02 PM
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Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

I don’t like saying this, and I’m not quite sure how, but I think someone has to say it now, before the build season gets here.

Over the past 6 months or so, Chief Delphi has become increasingly negative in tone. This is disturbing on a number of levels. First, I haven’t seen a real reason to go this route. Second, this is the off-season, when normal levels are slow, cheerful, mainly in Chit-Chat, and sometimes thoughtful as members reflect. This last year, CD has been busy. VERY busy, compared to normal, with a series of discussions on the new control system, new structures, pilots and their results, and similar items.

There isn’t really a good reason to go the negative route. I mean, there is the news coming out of FRC HQ, but that’s a mixed bag for teams—and can help some teams. Yet, almost every time somebody puts up the news of a new post from Bill’s Blog, it’s only a matter of hours before somebody else complains about X aspect of the post, which is prophesied to be doom for another party. (All right, so I exaggerate a bit.) I’m guilty of this too, though to an aspect of a post of Dave’s that I probably misinterpreted. Remember, we’ve had major competition changes before, and we survived. We even thrived. So what’s different about this one? It can’t just be the change; there must be a reason people are just plain not liking this one. I’m not sure what it is, other than maybe secrecy, and this one's kind of open compared to some.

As I said earlier, CD has been surprisingly busy for the time of year. Lots of people are on and posting, and that’s good. But the last several years, around this time, people were speculating on the next game, developing prototypes that would never work (until they posted them and got some constructive criticism), and having fun in the Chit-Chat forum. This year, people are making their opinions, nice or not, known about the changes that FRC HQ (in the person of Bill) is letting us know about. Some are keeping it positive or even humorous (there was a bit of satire in one of the threads on the new control system). But many are complaining, and some are making unfounded comments that are then being refuted, sometimes nastily.

What’s going on here? When did this change begin? What’s the cure for this?

I’m not going to say that CD should shut down or be a “FIRST is great” forum. Those are the worst two options of many. But what I am going to say is that we all need a break. Go outside and have fun. Get away from the internet for a day or three. Go watch a sports game in person--preferably one that you don't have to go to because of X relative being in it. Have a snowball fight, if you have snow already. Come back refreshed, ready for another year, and then make your break a little earlier next year.

(Oh, and Brandon… If you have anything that needs CD to be down for a couple hours to implement, might I request that that implementation happen soon?)
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:11 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

well said, i do agree that it seems "it" has hit the fan on here, and theres alot more anger and negativity lately for some reason
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:20 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

I will take a whack at answering your question. People in general do not like change. Why is this change any bigger than in the past? Because people are having change all around them. The main thoughts going through their heads are "Will I get a raise/bonus this Christmas?", "Can I survive if I get laid off?", "After 'Jen' got laid off, I'm not sure if my job is secure,", "I heard the Smiths from down the road had to sell a car/move to a poorer neighborhood/draw from Timmy's college fund,". This economic crisis has people's world crashing down. Without going into what caused it or how it should/shouldn't be fixed, I can tell you people look for something that they do not expect to change. Some people found this in FIRST. People need somewhere to look that is their comfort zone. We may not be able to be their comfort zone but we need to see that the world is not pleasing the people as much as it was back when previous changes were made.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:25 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

The Old Chief Delphi is with IFI. (I kid, really, I don't know enough of about the programming, electrical, engineering stuff of the control board to take a stance...)

Seriously, I think the problem is that people just don't like change. I don't think you can entirely blame someone or criticize someone for being negative about change when its human nature to do so. Could we all deal with change better? Of course. Should we expect everyone to go along with the change without saying anything? Of course not.

Edit: as Rich later elludes to, its more the situation (change) than the individuals.

Last edited by XaulZan11 : 10-05-2009 at 06:35 PM.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:25 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

I've noticed this for quite some time, and because of it (and a few other things) I don't visit or attend ChiefDelphi as much or interact with the community.

This may from what I've been brought up on, moderating communities run by a very young entrepreneur, but when I see this the first thing I think of is the administration and the rules (no offense). Whilst a administration cannot manage everything, it certainly make a community nicer. Yeah, people can still disagree, but it doesn't have to be as fumming as it is now. ChiefDelphi is a large forum (or I see it as one), but all that takes is a reliable leader with several moderators.

I don't really want to start a argument or anything, but like I see a lot of things that could be different, and I don't really see ChiefDelphi as a place of 100% gracious professionalism which is especially important when it is linked as the most popular FIRST forum. What image does this place onto FIRST when its community/members aren't exactly gracious?

*hides before something blows up in the internets*

-Tanner
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:29 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

This is a public place and we are a subset of a larger culture that right now is in the midst of global recession and dealing with a lot of mistrust of leadership on a grand scale - governments, large business, financial institutions, etc.

The world at large right now is grumpy, thus Chief Delphi at large right now is grumpy. The same can be said of my workplace, and many places I go right now. Individuals in all of those places still find a way to rise above it, but it's a smaller percentage in times like these.

Don't try to make more of it than it is.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 06:44 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

I agree with Mr. Kressly on this.

I mean, Chief Delphi has grown, and the people who use it during the regular season find it to be such an excellent resource, that they often come back to get the latest analysis of FIRST gossip during the off-season. When someone says something like the bagging system is good (just as an example) I'm sure someone has a reason as to why it's not good, and then he/she wants to post his/her opinion on the topic.

When you have *so many* people together in one place, you can't expect everyone to be all jolly and happy. You can't moderate how people think or how they feel, so moderating what people...*put* wouldn't be in anyone's best interests. Granted that posts that are rude or offensive are out of bounds, but other than that, I see no reason why someone should not be allowed to post his/her qualms about something.

Change might be the largest factor here, but there's no pleasing everyone. As a community of intellectuals, or some-what intellectuals, we have to accept that in whatever we strive to do, there will be some pessimism, there will be some optimism, but as long as we don't forget why we are in FIRST, we'll all come together in the end.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 07:30 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

And every day bring us closer to Dec 21, 2012. I'll bet that is having an effect...

Blake
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Unread 10-05-2009, 08:26 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Maybe more and more people have stopped giving the "powers-that-be" the benefit of the doubt and are now treating news with a more critical eye than before?

Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
Fool me multiple times over multiple years?
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Unread 10-05-2009, 08:30 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by XaulZan11 View Post
The Old Chief Delphi is with IFI.
In all seriousness, I think that some of the changes that occurred previously (eg: switching to a new radio when IFI was around a number of years ago) weren't publicized before the season, but instead were publicized after kickoff. So previously, there weren't as many targets to shoot at this time of year. I'm not saying that's totally it, but it might be one of the contributing factors.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 08:59 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JVN View Post
Maybe more and more people have stopped giving the "powers-that-be" the benefit of the doubt and are now treating news with a more critical eye than before?

Fool me once, shame on you.
Fool me twice, shame on me.
Fool me multiple times over multiple years?
I'd have to agree and say that's pretty accurate. I'd go as far as saying that recent posts have not been in bad taste though. Most of what has been written is productive or at least provokes thought and criticism. Even if it is criticism that's a little harsh, everyone needs to remember that posts on here need to be taken with a grain of salt. Same goes for those posting reactions to other posts and comments. I've read it someone before on here that "you people take this game too seriously" but I think a better way of saying to just relax and think out thoughts would be to take everything with a grain of salt.

Anywho, I still say JVN's post is pretty accurate as to why CD's been a little more confrontational recently. But its not that big a deal IMHO, it all just depends on how you let it get to you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanner View Post
What image does this place onto FIRST when its community/members aren't exactly gracious?

-Tanner
This is a public forum, anticipate a confrontational attitude when arguing about topics. GP and anything like that don't need to be dragged across every plane you cross. For this I'll quote someone I look up to on this matter:

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Unread 10-05-2009, 09:34 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gblake View Post
And every day bring us closer to Dec 21, 2012.
I thought it was 12/12/12. Ah, no matter.


My opinion is that there is more offseason activity on CD because there are more people on CD. FIRST has grown a bit in the past 5 years, CD mirrors that.

Couple that with the increase from FIRST in communication, at an earlier time, than in the past (e.g., control system '09, driver station '10). This is a good thing, by the way.

More posts + more time to complain about things = more negative posts than in the past. A predisposition to complain because of the economy helps too.

This is speculation, of course, I did absolutely no research to come to these conclusions. Maybe someone else wants to follow up on that.
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Unread 10-05-2009, 09:41 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Rotolo View Post

...

This is speculation, of course, I did absolutely no research to come to these conclusions. Maybe someone else wants to follow up on that.

sounds like government work... jk jk
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Unread 10-05-2009, 09:48 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gblake View Post
And every day bring us closer to Dec 21, 2012. I'll bet that is having an effect...

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I thought we only had to worry about that if we were Mayan?
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Unread 10-05-2009, 09:54 PM
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Re: Whatever Happened to the Old Chief Delphi?

What happens when you have people who come from many diverse experiences and opinions and who are passionate about the same area of interest, goal, opportunity, or challenge?

What helps with communication and deepens understanding, awareness, insight, and knowledge? What doesn't?

I think Gracious Professionalism can cross every plane easily, helping to bring respect to the discussions and even the ability to agree to disagree without being detrimental to the opportunities that arise in this forum.
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