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Unread 01-09-2011, 04:50 PM
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LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and when?

We are a second-year team. Our Classmate PC is from the 2010 season. We are a little confused about how to update our Classmate PC and our various programming workstations from FRC 2010 to FRC 2011. We are wondering if anyone has any insight on this. Here is the cast of characters:

There is the USB flash drive in the 2011 Kit of Parts for re-imaging the Classmate computer.

On the Kit of Parts page, there is a "Classmate_Update.bat" file stored in a ZIP file accessible from the "Classmate Update" link on that page.

On the National Instruments web site, there is a 2011 LabVIEW Update that is a "mandatory update for the LabVIEW portion of the FIRST Robotics Competition Softwaare 2011. You MUST install this update in order to compete in the FIRST Robotics Competition." This page says, "This software update is meant to be installed ONLY after installing LabVIEW FRC from the DVD that comes with the 2011 Controls Kit or on the Classmate computer that comes with the kit." This statement would seem to imply that LabVIEW (or the LabVIEW runtime environment) is installed on the (re-imaged) 2011 FRC Classmate computer, and that this update must be run on the Classmate.

Also on the NI web site, there is a 2011 Utilities Update that has the same language above, about being required in order to compete in FRC in 2011. In addition, the page says that since this update "contains the update to the cRIO Imaging Utility, teams using Java and C/C++ will also need to install it."

The NI web site also has a 2011 Driver Station Update. Once again, the page says this update is required in FRC 2011. The page has specific instructions for how to install the update on the Classmate PC.

On each of the above three pages on the NI web site, it says that the three updates must be installed in the order shown above.

There is an old page on the NI web site, 2010 Driver Station Update. This is the driver station update page for LAST year (2010).

The Kit of Parts page also has a link, How to Set Up Your 2011 Driver Station. This document says to re-image the Classmate using the Flash drive, run the Classmate_Update.bat file (to activate Windows 7), and then "Update the Classmate Software." But for the latter step, it provides a link to the old 2010 Driver Station Update, rather than the new 2011 Driver Station Update (!). Confusing!

So, here are our questions about how to upgrade our Classmate PC from FRC 2010 to FRC 2011:

1. In the "Update the Classmate Software" step above, shouldn't we run the new 2011 Driver Station Update rather than the old 2010 Driver Station Update?

2. There is another thread here on Chief Delphi that points out that the LabVIEW runtime environment in indeed installed on the Classmate PC. (Which makes sense, because the default Dashboard software that ran on the Classmate PC -- at least in 2010 -- was written in LabVIEW.) So, since the Classmate PC contains the LabVIEW runtime environment, should we also run the 2011 LabVIEW Update and 2011 Utilities Update on the Classmate PC? If so, as explained on each of the above NI pages, we should install those two updates before installing the 2011 Driver Station Update.

For our programming workstation PCs, we are programming in Wind River C++ (not LabVIEW). As such, per the instructions on the National Instruments LabVIEW installation DVD in the Kit of Parts, we followed the instructions to "Install only the FRC Tools" from that disc. When we do this, a LOT of National Instruments software still gets installed on the workstation. So, we are still wondering:

3. On our programming workstation PCs, should we install the 2011 LabVIEW Update?

4. Similarly, on our programming PCs, should we install the 2011 Utilities Update? It would seem we should, because (among other things) this includes the updated cRIO Imaging Utility, which we usually run from one of our programming PCs.

Sorry for the long post. I wanted to try and explain everything clearly. If anyone has some help for us, that would be great. Thanks for your help!
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Unread 01-09-2011, 05:59 PM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

To my understanding, the three things you named off MUST be installed onto the classmate. This includes the 2011 Driver station update, not the 2010 update. Also, if you are using windriver, you do not need to download the "LabVIEW update" but you do need to install the "C/C++ update" found here http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprogr....aspx?id=18758

The order is 'classmate update.bat' then 'utilities update' then 'driver station 2011' then C/C++ update unless you are programming with a separate computer, in which case that is the computer you download the C/C++ update to. Hope this made sense.
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Unread 01-09-2011, 09:52 PM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

The OP is almost funny in describing the confusion.

Seriously folks it is this document here, page two

http://usfirst.org/uploadedFiles/Rob...er_Station.pdf

This document lives on the www.usfirst.org/frc/kitofparts webpage as "How to setup your driver station"

It would be useful to have a note that says "aka, how to reimage your classmate".
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Unread 01-10-2011, 01:01 AM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

It's unfortunate that FIRST did not provide the documentation for beta teams to review. Let me see if I can answer your questions based on my own experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Forgaard View Post
So, here are our questions about how to upgrade our Classmate PC from FRC 2010 to FRC 2011:

1. In the "Update the Classmate Software" step above, shouldn't we run the new 2011 Driver Station Update rather than the old 2010 Driver Station Update?
Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Forgaard View Post
2. There is another thread here on Chief Delphi that points out that the LabVIEW runtime environment in indeed installed on the Classmate PC. (Which makes sense, because the default Dashboard software that ran on the Classmate PC -- at least in 2010 -- was written in LabVIEW.) So, since the Classmate PC contains the LabVIEW runtime environment, should we also run the 2011 LabVIEW Update and 2011 Utilities Update on the Classmate PC? If so, as explained on each of the above NI pages, we should install those two updates before installing the 2011 Driver Station Update.
The Classmate had to be imaged and distributed before the final software was done, thus even though the classmate has all the required software components, they all need to be updated.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Forgaard View Post
For our programming workstation PCs, we are programming in Wind River C++ (not LabVIEW). As such, per the instructions on the National Instruments LabVIEW installation DVD in the Kit of Parts, we followed the instructions to "Install only the FRC Tools" from that disc. When we do this, a LOT of National Instruments software still gets installed on the workstation. So, we are still wondering:

3. On our programming workstation PCs, should we install the 2011 LabVIEW Update?
The goal of separating the FRC utilities was so that teams that did not use LabVIEW did not have to install the LabVIEW update. However, this was done partway through the beta period so I doubt it got tested on a clean system. Personally, I would install all 3 updates on the classmate, but only the minimum on the programming PCs, but that depends on adventuresome you are.

4. Similarly, on our programming PCs, should we install the 2011 Utilities Update? It would seem we should, because (among other things) this includes the updated cRIO Imaging Utility, which we usually run from one of our programming PCs.[/quote]

Yes

Quote:
Originally Posted by Randy Forgaard View Post
Sorry for the long post. I wanted to try and explain everything clearly. If anyone has some help for us, that would be great. Thanks for your help!
I hope you'll apply to be a beta tester next year, as detail oriented people are very much needed.
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Unread 03-02-2011, 07:45 PM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

A new (optional) driver station update is available that will ease proper configuration of the driver station laptop's IP configuration (making you more likely to successfully connect to the field). You can find it here: http://joule.ni.com/nidu/cds/view/p/id/2263/lang/en

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Unread 03-03-2011, 04:21 PM
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Question Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

Quote:
Originally Posted by jhersh View Post
A new (optional) driver station update is available that will ease proper configuration of the driver station laptop's IP configuration (making you more likely to successfully connect to the field).
Joe - can you define what that means, i.e. what was changed? We had problems at a Week 0 event and were completely unable to connect to the field throughout the event despite the best efforts of the FIRST FTAs there. However, we have since received a replacement cRIO from National Instruments which appears to be able to connect to the DLink without issue.

Trying to decide if we should consider updating or not...
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Unread 03-04-2011, 12:36 AM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaSpoldi View Post
Joe - can you define what that means, i.e. what was changed? We had problems at a Week 0 event and were completely unable to connect to the field throughout the event despite the best efforts of the FIRST FTAs there. However, we have since received a replacement cRIO from National Instruments which appears to be able to connect to the DLink without issue.

Trying to decide if we should consider updating or not...
When in doubt, upgrade! The only change was to have the DS replace an IP address in windows instead of adding it. Having multiple IP addresses will make the field unable to talk to the DS.

Joe
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Unread 03-04-2011, 10:08 AM
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Re: LabVIEW Update, Utilities Update, Driver Station Update...which to install and wh

Here's another fun scenario we ran into during testing this past week.

We plugged our netbook into a network this week that had another computer at the same IP address (both static). Windows 7 assigned a new IP address in the 169.XXXXXX range. Going in and changing that back to the correct static address in the tcp/ip properties did nothing. An ipconfig /release /renew did nothing as well. Only changing it to dynamic ip address assignment, then back to static, then adding the correct address would fix it. Windows 7 seems to be a bit dyslexic in this situation.

Of course, we couldn't figure it out solely from the driver station window - the driver station couldn't set the IP properly either once this occured but was also not setting any error message.

Is there a way to modify the driver station IP assignment code so that it checks that it's successfully been changed? Having it appear to change but not actually change caused us a good 30 minutes of headaches until we logged into the developer account and did an ipconfig to check.
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