View Full Version : 2012 MSC
mjustice66
08-04-2012, 14:48
So who's excited for MSC this year. I know I am especially after witnessing Troy.
Squeakypig
08-04-2012, 15:29
The things that are going to happen at this tournament...definitely worth taking a break from college for :D .
I really hope there are multiple teams with flawless coop records here to make it really interesting. I know that's what Troy was!
ChristopherSD
08-04-2012, 23:22
It'll be a Coopertition competition more than anything else. :cool:
nikeairmancurry
09-04-2012, 00:04
It'll be a Coopertition competition more than anything else. :cool:
Atleast the first two days...
It'll be a Coopertition competition more than anything else. :cool:
I think it is more like an "Avoid not being able to balance on Coopertition bridge" during qualifying rounds. When most teams can balance on coopertition bridge, it will not be a deciding factor towards the seeding. It will be back to WLT.
I think it is more like an "Avoid not being able to balance on Coopertition bridge" during qualifying rounds. When most teams can balance on coopertition bridge, it will not be a deciding factor towards the seeding. It will be back to WLT.
Unless you are on on the field when it goes bad. Then you instantly drop relative to the rest of the field.
ChristopherSD
09-04-2012, 14:51
When most teams can balance on coopertition bridge, it will not be a deciding factor towards the seeding. It will be back to WLT.
I hope you're correct when it comes to win/loss records. Can't say I'm a fan of seeing undefeated teams in 10th place.
AdamHeard
09-04-2012, 14:54
With co-op happening more, and it swinging back closer to WLT I see some interesting things happening.
I see it shifting more towards the lesser scorers on the alliance doing co-op, in an effort to win the match, possibly resulting in less reliable co-op robots and a failure to do so, hurting everyone on the field.
Chris Hibner
09-04-2012, 15:06
With co-op happening more, and it swinging back closer to WLT I see some interesting things happening.
I see it shifting more towards the lesser scorers on the alliance doing co-op, in an effort to win the match, possibly resulting in less reliable co-op robots and a failure to do so, hurting everyone on the field.
I was thinking of this same thing. There will definitely be a lot of hard thinking about who should handle the bridge.
As far as undefeated teams being ranked 10th, I don't inherently have a problem with it. Going undefeated and being ranked 10th tells me there is a strategy issue (qualification strategy, that is). I'm sure there are plenty of teams that would have fewer losses if they valued winning above the co-op bridge.
A wild card at MSC should be alliance bridge capability. I expect to see a *lot* of "6 bridge" matches...
A wild card at MSC should be alliance bridge capability. I expect to see a *lot* of "6 bridge" matches...
I refer to these affectionately as Triple Doubles and i wish that was an actual term in the manual even if it gave no bonus
DjScribbles
09-04-2012, 16:32
Our team is officially excited! It's going to be a long 1.5 (and counting) days of work...
Clinton Bolinger
09-04-2012, 16:38
With co-op happening more, and it swinging back closer to WLT I see some interesting things happening.
I see it shifting more towards the lesser scorers on the alliance doing co-op, in an effort to win the match, possibly resulting in less reliable co-op robots and a failure to do so, hurting everyone on the field.
Personally, I see the better scoring machines doing the coop.
I can't see a team like HOT leaving it up to another team to balance the coop bridge, when it is so important to ranking. Also I do not see a team like HOT agreeing to balance with a less capable shooting machine while 469 cleans up in the last 30 seconds.
I do think that the average time to balance on the coop bridge to be more around the 30 second mark rather then the 45+ at previous district events.
-Clinton-
Grim Tuesday
09-04-2012, 19:16
The politics surrounding the bridge at MSC shall be very interesting.
Squeakypig
09-04-2012, 20:17
The coop bridge at MSC will be very similar to Troy I believe.
"My stats say that you are the best balancer on your alliance...we want you to balance with us."
Lightning Robotics is excited to be a part of this awesome event!
Few of our students made this promo video for our pit display: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbxK3oM1LT0
Wayne TenBrink
09-04-2012, 23:15
The NC Gears are just happy that our check finally cleared at FIRST HQ and now we actually show up on the roster of teams!
Every team at MSC should be capable of tipping the bridge and balancing. I foresee a lot of triple doubles, with basket scoring once again determining matches. Hybrid will be huge. Be flexible on your setup, movements, and timing to avoid clashing with your partners. I expect defense will be a much bigger factor than it was at district events, where the non-scorers were often also non-bridge crossers and therefore unable to play defense. Creatively driven, wide defense bots that have good hybrid and don't collect fouls will valuable picks for elims.
Its going to be fun to watch and an honor to participate.
ChristopherSD
09-04-2012, 23:23
I expect defense will be a much bigger factor than it was at district events
Completely agree. Teams that prefer shooting two feet from the hoop are at high risk.
Watch the robot on the Coopertition bridge play defense on 548. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FMpSvDZ_4Q#t=1m12s)
Grim Tuesday
09-04-2012, 23:28
Completely agree. Teams that prefer shooting two feet from the hoop are at high risk.
Watch the robot on the Coopertition bridge play defense on 548. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FMpSvDZ_4Q#t=1m12s)
Not to derail, but what were all those penalties for?
pathew100
09-04-2012, 23:36
Not to derail, but what were all those penalties for?
Probably for transitory contact with the key. If the two blue robots were touching each other and one was touching the key, both are considered to be protected.
pathew100
09-04-2012, 23:41
Completely agree. Teams that prefer shooting two feet from the hoop are at high risk.
Watch the robot on the Coopertition bridge play defense on 548. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FMpSvDZ_4Q#t=1m12s)
Which is why we (FRC 862) chose to build our fender bot with a "sideways" shooter. So we can use the drivetrain to push back and get into position. Worked pretty well at Livonia when there was some tough defense played on us in elims. See the video from post #16 (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1156045&postcount=16) for some highlights.
Should be a great competition. Can't wait!
Jack Jones
09-04-2012, 23:49
Probably for transitory contact with the key. If the two blue robots were touching each other and one was touching the key, both are considered to be protected.
I don't believe there's any such thing as transitory contact. It appeared to be [G27]s on 548. Deliberate or damaging contact inside the frame perimeter.
Bjenks548
10-04-2012, 13:08
Completely agree. Teams that prefer shooting two feet from the hoop are at high risk.
Watch the robot on the Coopertition bridge play defense on 548. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8FMpSvDZ_4Q#t=1m12s)
Don't worry about us, we've made massive shooting changes if there's a defender anywhere close. Also I am extremely excited for MSC, I don't see one team on the list that isn't scary in some aspect!
Paul Copioli
10-04-2012, 13:58
I don't believe there's any such thing as transitory contact. It appeared to be [G27]s on 548. Deliberate or damaging contact inside the frame perimeter.
Yes Jack is right. The offensive robot got the penalties (three technicals) for damaging contact inside the bumper perimeter. It was one of the most ridiculous calls I have seen at a FIRST event. And yes, we let the head referee know how we felt at the time. Since the outcome would not have changed due to the penalties, we decided to not bring out the rule book. I will definitely have some questions for the ref crew at MSC during the driver's meeting.
So, is there any video footage of the good West Michigan teams in action? I haven't seen good West Michigan robot action since the videos of 1918 and 85 in week 1. Granted I haven't looked very hard. But I'd love some to watch some videos of 85, 107, 141, 1918, 2054, 2474, 2767, 3234, 3357, 4003, and all the other West Michigan teams!
Joe Ross
11-04-2012, 12:10
Similar to what I did in previous years (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=735425&postcount=165), I ran through 200 simulated qualification match schedules (with 12 matches per team, using the FIRST match generator). I used each team's highest adjusted opr at any event for their contribution to a match, based on Ed Law's data. I calculated the results for each of the 200 simulated qualification schedules, and then looked at some statistics from the aggregate results.
Since the standings are much more complicated this year, I did not try to calculate the standings. This is only the contribution of w-l-t to the qualification score (eg 2 points for a win, 1 point for a tie, no points for a loss).
Everyone should attend Karthik's presentation (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=105540) where he covers "Why 'OPR' is a flawed indicator in Rebound Rumble".
OPR Average Median Mode Min Max StDev
67 39.33 21.75 22 22 16 24 1.86
469 36.28 21.01 21.5 22 16 24 2.09
2474 34.73 20.71 21 22 16 24 2.02
548 33.12 19.74 20 20 12 24 2.39
3322 28.87 17.895 18 18 10 24 2.81
27 28.44 17.875 18 18 11 24 2.79
217 28.12 17.55 18 18 10 24 2.58
1023 27.54 17.555 18 18 10 24 2.76
1918 25.76 16.58 16.5 18 8 22 2.85
1718 25.64 16.515 16 18 10 23 2.55
3539 25.54 16.6 17 18 8 24 2.85
862 23.70 15.47 16 16 6 22 2.88
51 23.52 15.36 16 16 6 22 3.05
2337 22.40 14.565 14 14 6 21 2.85
2137 21.70 14.39 14 14 6 22 3.05
1684 20.96 13.95 14 14 6 24 3.01
2054 20.89 14.06 14 14 7 23 3.07
33 20.42 13.125 13 14 6 20 2.84
573 19.77 13.78 14 14 6 22 3.02
70 19.57 13.25 14 14 5 20 2.90
302 19.25 13.025 13 12 6 20 3.05
3234 19.14 13 13 14 6 20 2.99
123 18.45 12.095 12 12 2 20 3.01
858 18.41 12 12 12 3 20 3.08
2767 17.90 12.215 12 14 6 22 3.01
226 17.77 11.825 12 12 4 19 3.15
107 17.62 12.135 12 12 5 20 2.97
308 17.52 12.405 12 12 4 20 2.99
2834 17.24 11.755 12 12 4 22 2.95
314 17.09 11.495 12 12 4 18 2.87
2959 16.98 11.495 12 12 2 20 3.04
2000 16.36 10.74 10.5 12 4 20 3.01
245 16.08 10.98 11 10 4 17 2.86
85 15.88 11.35 12 12 2 20 3.12
3618 15.33 10.635 10 10 2 18 3.18
3546 15.13 10.545 10 12 4 18 2.98
247 15.09 10.415 10 10 4 18 2.97
830 15.06 10.355 10 12 2 20 3.16
240 15.00 10.305 10 10 4 18 2.87
3568 14.65 10.47 10 10 4 18 3.06
904 14.58 10.45 10 10 2 18 2.85
2851 14.37 9.92 10 10 2 18 2.88
3098 13.81 10.16 10 10 2 18 3.06
1025 13.78 9.855 10 10 4 20 2.83
3572 13.45 9.715 10 10 2 18 3.00
2591 12.94 9.365 10 10 0 18 2.93
201 12.85 9.13 10 10 1 18 3.29
4294 12.03 9.01 9 10 2 16 2.92
66 11.62 8.94 9 10 0 17 2.87
1504 11.56 9.115 9 8 2 18 2.73
494 11.16 8.455 8 8 2 14 2.62
503 11.11 8.3 8 8 0 15 2.67
3601 10.46 7.815 8 8 0 16 2.82
4003 10.14 7.365 7 6 0 16 2.78
141 9.09 7.72 8 8 2 14 2.99
3538 7.99 6.945 7 8 0 16 2.95
3537 7.91 6.91 6 6 0 14 2.71
3617 6.76 6.125 6 6 0 15 2.95
1711 6.52 6.06 6 6 0 15 2.59
3656 6.49 5.81 6 6 0 14 2.71
3509 2.37 3.865 4 2 0 12 2.41
MagiChau
11-04-2012, 15:20
So, is there any video footage of the good West Michigan teams in action? I haven't seen good West Michigan robot action since the videos of 1918 and 85 in week 1. Granted I haven't looked very hard. But I'd love some to watch some videos of 85, 107, 141, 1918, 2054, 2474, 2767, 3234, 3357, 4003, and all the other West Michigan teams!
Our mentor with the shiny SLR camera has HQ footage of West Michigan. It focuses on BOB though so you don't see as much of the other robots.
3546 has some footage of their alliance in the finals match 2 and 3.
Team 3546 channel containing Final Match 2 & 3
http://www.youtube.com/user/GHteam3546
Team 85 Playlist of West Michigan Videos
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL879C356D73A6CAA2&feature=plcp
washedout
11-04-2012, 16:17
Field appears to be set.
Variations from Ed's list of 64 qualifiers:
No 3357
No 703
Add 2586
Add 904
Carolyn_Grace
11-04-2012, 17:36
Just a heads up to everyone attending MSC!
There will be a Non-Engineering Mentors Organization (NEMO) Gathering after Opening Ceremonies on Saturday!
This gathering is for any mentors who handle any of the Non-Engineering tasks that are needed to manage FIRST teams.
This can be anything that does not have to do with robot design and build: like Awards submissions, business plans, sponsorship and fundraising, chaperoning, planning trips, organizing food and calendars...etc.
We will network and share information to help improve our teams as well as FiM and FIRST overall.
If your team is attending MSC, please send a representative to this meeting. It will be a great way to find out about non-Engineering resources from each other.
My goal is to have everyone leave with at least 3 new contacts/friends!
(I will not be passing out fliers to advertise this :eek: , so please spread the news by word of mouth!)
If your team is attending MSC, please send a representative to this meeting.
What if our team is not attending MSC but we will be there as spectators? Can we still attend? Just out of curiosity.
Travis Hoffman
11-04-2012, 17:51
I was thinking of this same thing. There will definitely be a lot of hard thinking about who should handle the bridge.
The two best scorers.
I can't see a team like HOT leaving it up to another team to balance the coop bridge, when it is so important to ranking. Also I do not see a team like HOT agreeing to balance with a less capable shooting machine while 469 cleans up in the last 30 seconds.
Yup.
Carolyn_Grace
11-04-2012, 17:56
What if our team is not attending MSC but we will be there as spectators? Can we still attend? Just out of curiosity.
Absolutely!
I encourage any mentor to attend this that is interested (or parent that deals with any non-engineering tasks!)
I'd also like to extend the invitation to those out-of-staters who will be joining us.
It's going to be extremely informal. More of a meet and greet with a bit of structured conversation.
I've heard a lot of rumors that the eliminations of the event will be shown on Public Television. Anyone know where I should look to find specifics regarding the broadcasting?
Thanks!
The two best scorers.
Why? There are plenty of robots that can balance just as well as the top scorers at MSC. Why not let them balance?
That's like saying, "We want to balance with YOU, not your perfectly capable alliance partners, because since we are going to be unable to score in the last 30 seconds we want nobody on your alliance scoring either."
Alliances will have to weigh the benefits and disadvantages of choosing to co-op with their top scorer.
Travis Hoffman
11-04-2012, 19:50
Why? There are plenty of robots that can balance just as well as the top scorers at MSC. Why not let them balance?
That's like saying, "We want to balance with YOU, not your perfectly capable alliance partners, because since we are going to be unable to score in the last 30 seconds we want nobody on your alliance scoring either."
Alliances will have to weigh the benefits and disadvantages of choosing to co-op with their top scorer.
Benefits:
Ensure both sides get an equal and fair opportunity to win the match on hybrid/teleop points through the first 1:45 or so of the match.
Ensure the 2 best teams go to the bridge to get the critical 2 CP.
Disadvantages:
????
I'd hate to be a higher seed putting the acquisition of 2 CP in the hands of others, no matter how capable you think they may be at balancing up to that point. If lower seeded bots are "perfectly capable" of balancing, they are also perfectly capable of going to the alliance bridge to be a part of the ubiquitous "triple doubles" you expect to see at the competition.
Littleboy
11-04-2012, 20:03
I predict at least 2 double triples.
Benefits:
Ensure both sides get an equal and fair opportunity to win the match on hybrid/teleop points through the first 1:45 or so of the match.
Ensure the 2 best teams go to the bridge to get the critical 2 CP.
Disadvantages:
????
I'd hate to be a higher seed putting the acquisition of 2 CP in the hands of others, no matter how capable you think they may be at balancing up to that point. If lower seeded bots are "perfectly capable" of balancing, they are also perfectly capable of going to the alliance bridge to be a part of the ubiquitous "triple doubles" you expect to see at the competition.
Yes, if you don't go for the coop bridge, you are putting the acquisition of 2 CP in the hands of others. But if you do go for the coop bridge and the outcome of the match has not been decided yet, you are putting the acquisition of 2 QP (winning) in the hands of others. And if you win you don't share those QP with your opponents.
Travis Hoffman
11-04-2012, 20:32
Yes, if you don't go for the coop bridge, you are putting the acquisition of 2 CP in the hands of others. But if you do go for the coop bridge and the outcome of the match has not been decided yet, you are putting the acquisition of 2 QP (winning) in the hands of others. And if you win you don't share those QP with your opponents.
And if you lose, you risk getting zilch out of the match. Quite tough coming back after taking that kind of hit.
And if you lose, you risk getting zilch out of the match. Quite tough coming back after taking that kind of hit.
That is true. I guess you just have to believe in yourself. Believe you have the power to sway the match! :D Call me crazy, but I think a very good scorer can probably categorize matches into 3 different categories: Easy matches where you can get the 4 points (from win and coop) all by yourself, hard matches where the maximum QP you can get is 2 (from coop), and, my favorite, matches that require TEAMWORK with lesser scorers on your alliance to achieve 4 points (from win and coop). In the first two cases, you should go for the coop bridge. In the last case you should do whatever it takes to win and hope that your partner coops successfully.
Of course, the statistics are mostly against me. 3161 ranked first at GTRW because they cooped in every match. 4161 seeded first at San Diego by just focusing on the coop bridge in qualifications. 67 tries to coop every match in order to maximize their QP and seeded first in all three events they attended.
As a counterexample, my team (3322) seeded first with 20 Coopertition points at Livonia, balancing 7 times out of 7 attempts. Some of those balances were on the alliance bridge. We were conscious enough about our standing to coop in our last match, barely pulling it off with 4390 in the last couple seconds. But a lot of the time we trusted our alliance mates to balance the Coopertition bridge, and it ended up working out for us.
By the way, what I say on this board has nothing to do with what 3322 will do at MSC. We might end up attempting a coop balance in every match; who knows? And we would love to coop with 67 in a match in order to show them how good we are at balancing! :p
MagiChau
12-04-2012, 10:04
schedule is out http://www2.usfirst.org/2012comp/events/GL/ScheduleQual.html
schedule is out http://www2.usfirst.org/2012comp/events/GL/ScheduleQual.html
Match 19 is perhaps the scariest thing ever. And Match 45 will be intense as well!
There are quite a few OMG matches! In a field of 64, how 469 gets to play with 67 once and against 67 twice. Scheduling gods are ROTFLTAO... :-)
Match 112 is pretty stacked, too.
Joe Ross
12-04-2012, 12:09
I ran through the actual qualification match schedules (as posted on the FIRST website). I used each team's highest adjusted opr at any event for their contribution to a match, based on Ed Law's data. I calculated the results for each of the matches.
Since the standings are much more complicated this year, I did not try to calculate the standings. This is only the contribution of w-l-t to the qualification score (eg 2 points for a win, 1 point for a tie, no points for a loss).
Everyone should attend Karthik's presentation where he covers "Why 'OPR' is a flawed indicator in Rebound Rumble".
Matches:
Match Red 1 Red 2 Red 3 Blue 1 Blue 2 Blue 3 RScore BScore
1 123 2246 3572 4003 2054 217 41 59
2 1023 1684 2834 85 3234 3322 66 64
3 67 858 1718 3617 3538 3098 83 29
4 1025 1918 2591 3620 862 1711 53 41
5 2851 66 3601 3509 2586 201 36 28
6 503 3546 314 3656 245 2337 43 44
7 226 830 51 904 2767 247 57 48
8 573 4294 1504 3618 240 548 44 63
9 3539 141 2000 2137 2959 27 51 67
10 2474 302 3537 33 469 3568 62 71
11 308 70 123 494 107 2851 56 43
12 3656 904 3546 3617 1918 217 36 61
13 3098 240 1023 3620 2586 3601 57 33
14 3234 3509 2137 201 226 3572 43 44
15 830 2054 2959 1684 33 3537 53 49
16 1711 308 2337 2246 862 141 47 43
17 314 51 107 3539 4294 2591 59 51
18 245 2834 27 858 1504 3538 61 38
19 2000 548 3322 67 70 469 78 95
20 302 1718 247 85 494 503 60 38
21 1025 66 3568 4003 2767 573 41 48
22 2474 226 2959 3618 2337 3098 70 51
23 1711 33 2851 217 3601 3539 41 64
24 240 2591 904 1023 3234 123 43 65
25 1918 308 3322 503 27 51 73 63
26 469 3572 573 2767 245 1718 69 60
27 1504 247 3656 70 2137 3537 33 50
28 201 107 3620 548 2834 2474 41 85
29 67 1025 2246 1684 3509 3568 63 38
30 2586 4003 3538 302 830 862 31 58
31 3546 85 3617 141 494 4294 38 32
32 3618 66 858 314 2000 2054 45 54
33 107 1918 2474 3537 2851 1718 79 48
34 548 3539 3572 1023 226 503 72 57
35 3568 2959 3538 1711 2137 201 40 42
36 3234 308 67 3601 3546 573 76 45
37 314 2591 3098 302 1684 2246 44 50
38 217 904 2337 858 70 4003 65 48
39 862 4294 2054 2834 141 3322 57 55
40 85 3620 240 2767 3656 469 41 60
41 830 3509 1504 494 123 2000 29 45
42 66 33 27 1025 3617 51 60 45
43 247 3618 70 2586 245 2591 50 42
44 4294 904 3537 862 3572 2474 35 72
45 201 3539 469 217 67 3546 75 82
46 85 2137 3601 2054 858 123 48 57
47 1718 2246 314 226 3620 1504 53 40
48 503 2959 4003 2586 27 3234 38 60
49 1918 141 1023 66 245 247 63 43
50 2000 3618 573 1684 494 3538 51 40
51 3098 2834 308 3568 1711 830 49 37
52 3656 240 51 2851 302 1025 45 47
53 3322 3617 33 548 3509 2337 56 57
54 2767 3601 3234 107 2246 27 47 56
55 2591 247 2000 3539 904 4003 44 51
56 3537 1023 217 314 226 573 64 55
57 1684 503 858 141 3568 3620 50 34
58 3098 245 2054 201 494 548 51 57
59 2851 862 2767 2959 3618 67 56 71
60 70 3322 3546 240 1711 2474 64 57
61 2137 2834 302 66 1918 3509 58 40
62 308 3572 3538 85 3656 33 39 42
63 469 2586 51 1504 107 3617 73 37
64 830 123 4294 1718 2337 1025 45 62
65 862 503 3601 494 217 2474 45 74
66 240 245 4003 2834 3509 2246 41 29
67 1711 3234 548 3656 302 2000 59 41
68 70 904 2586 3620 27 2054 48 59
69 1918 2959 314 3617 469 308 60 61
70 1504 2591 3572 3539 67 66 38 77
71 1684 2137 1718 2337 3546 2767 69 55
72 141 123 201 51 3537 3618 40 47
73 3538 33 107 3098 573 247 46 49
74 2851 858 85 3322 1025 830 48 58
75 226 3568 302 4294 1023 70 52 60
76 3546 3509 2054 314 862 1504 38 53
77 3539 3537 3617 3618 4003 3601 41 35
78 240 1718 217 308 2959 1684 69 56
79 1918 201 573 830 858 3572 59 46
80 226 494 2337 107 3656 66 51 36
81 3620 3322 2767 3538 141 247 57 32
82 2591 51 548 85 27 3568 70 59
83 2246 33 1023 2000 2851 2137 58 52
84 2586 503 67 2834 469 123 63 71
85 904 2474 3234 245 1711 1025 69 37
86 3098 217 2959 4294 66 3322 59 53
87 302 1504 2337 3601 308 201 53 41
88 1684 27 830 862 1023 107 64 70
89 2054 247 3572 2851 240 3568 49 44
90 2834 3618 494 469 1025 2137 43 72
91 3539 85 3509 3098 1918 70 44 60
92 1718 548 3538 314 141 904 67 41
93 2586 33 858 226 2591 3546 51 46
94 4003 2246 3656 573 2474 51 26 79
95 2000 1711 2767 123 3617 503 41 36
96 3620 3537 67 4294 245 3234 57 47
97 3618 3568 3322 904 1718 3601 59 51
98 314 2137 66 830 240 107 51 48
99 85 141 217 2586 1504 2474 53 60
100 2834 51 2000 3546 3572 3098 57 42
101 308 1025 548 3509 3537 2591 65 23
102 123 302 3620 2959 3539 573 47 63
103 4294 201 3538 70 2246 503 33 41
104 2767 67 494 4003 1918 33 68 56
105 27 247 2337 469 2054 3234 65 76
106 2851 245 226 1711 3617 1684 48 35
107 862 858 2959 1023 3656 548 59 67
108 314 1025 70 3601 141 3572 51 32
109 85 3537 2246 66 503 904 34 38
110 3620 3546 830 302 3618 27 40 62
111 494 3617 573 2591 3322 2137 38 64
112 1711 1023 51 67 2054 2337 59 82
113 858 2474 4294 308 3509 247 65 35
114 3098 469 1504 4003 3234 2851 62 43
115 1684 201 2767 2586 3539 3656 52 45
116 2000 226 217 240 2834 1918 62 58
117 862 245 33 3568 123 1718 60 59
118 107 3509 1025 3538 2054 1023 34 57
119 573 503 2137 904 2851 3098 53 43
120 3656 2474 141 67 2591 830 50 67
121 201 4003 27 1711 85 314 51 40
122 3546 66 1684 548 247 123 48 66
123 494 1718 3539 858 240 2246 63 43
124 245 3572 107 2959 302 3322 47 65
125 3617 2767 70 3537 2834 862 45 49
126 3618 3620 3234 217 33 51 44 72
127 3568 2337 2586 1918 2000 1504 50 54
128 469 3601 3538 308 226 4294 54 48
W-L-T:
Team Wins Losses Ties
469 11 1 0
67 11 1 0
217 11 1 0
548 11 1 0
1023 10 2 0
2054 10 2 0
70 9 3 0
2474 9 3 0
2137 9 3 0
27 8 4 0
2337 8 4 0
1918 8 4 0
1718 8 4 0
51 8 4 0
2834 8 4 0
573 8 4 0
302 8 4 0
1025 8 4 0
3322 7 5 0
2959 7 5 0
33 7 5 0
3539 7 5 0
862 7 5 0
2000 7 5 0
308 7 5 0
3618 7 5 0
226 6 6 0
2767 6 6 0
3234 6 6 0
123 6 6 0
314 6 6 0
201 6 6 0
3098 6 6 0
3537 6 6 0
494 6 6 0
2246 6 6 0
1684 5 7 0
830 5 7 0
245 5 7 0
3572 5 7 0
858 5 7 0
247 5 7 0
66 5 7 0
1504 5 7 0
4003 5 7 0
107 4 8 0
240 4 8 0
503 4 8 0
2591 4 8 0
2586 4 8 0
904 4 8 0
1711 4 8 0
3656 4 8 0
3617 4 8 0
3546 3 9 0
4294 3 9 0
2851 3 9 0
3601 3 9 0
3620 3 9 0
3538 3 9 0
3568 2 10 0
85 2 10 0
141 1 11 0
3509 1 11 0
Highest Alliance Scores:
match 19 Blue 95
match 28 Blue 85
match 3 Red 83
match 45 Blue 82
match 112 Blue 82
Highest Combined Scores:
match 19 173
match 45 157
match 112 141
match 105 141
match 25 136
Highest Scoring Close Matches:
Match 69 Red 60 Blue 61
Match 117 Red 60 Blue 59
Match 53 Red 56 Blue 57
Match 2 Red 66 Blue 64
Match 39 Red 57 Blue 55
Match 116 Red 62 Blue 58
Match 88 Red 64 Blue 70
Match 45 Red 75 Blue 82
Alpha Beta
12-04-2012, 13:02
Is there a webcast for MSC? Not finding it on NASA or MadStream.
Code red robotics has a page up for the cast here (http://coderedrobotics.com/webcast/Michigan-FIRST-Robotics-State-Championship/), though it appears down now.
Grim Tuesday
12-04-2012, 14:46
It appears to be up now...But with no sound and an obnoxious ticker banner across the top. I hope that gets fixed for tomorrow.
Grim Tuesday
12-04-2012, 16:34
As predicted, 19 was an excellent match. 86-62, all bridges balanced.
nikeairmancurry
12-04-2012, 17:12
I predict at least 2 double triples.
3 as of match 19
I've heard a lot of rumors that the eliminations of the event will be shown on Public Television. Anyone know where I should look to find specifics regarding the broadcasting?
Thanks!
It is happening..but won't be broadcasted until May.
3 as of match 19
No it hasnt.
nikeairmancurry
12-04-2012, 17:36
No it hasnt.
Read it wrong... 3 triple doubles...
Fed's with zero points after three matches is insane!
Fed's with zero points after three matches is insane!
Actually they have 112 :-p
Yes, I know you mean QP.
Tom Bottiglieri
13-04-2012, 11:51
All webcasts should be like this (double pane, one for the production feed and one of a full field camera). Kudos to Code Red Robotics.
Walter Deitzler
13-04-2012, 15:55
Is there a youtube playlist for these matches, or any kind of video archive?
nikeairmancurry
13-04-2012, 17:12
Is there a youtube playlist for these matches, or any kind of video archive?
Yes... FIRSTinMichgian
Chris Hibner
13-04-2012, 22:09
It's been an amazing competition so far. It's pretty tough to put up 61 and 72 points in consecutive qualifying matches and lose them both, but that's the way it is at a championship event. Tomorrow is going to be intense.
Alliance selections:
1 469 67 830
2 2054 548 245
3 3098 33 2137
4 573 1918 70
5 4294 2474 3234
6 2337 1023 1684
7 51 217 2851
8 862 1718 3322
no refusals by anyone involved
Grim Tuesday
14-04-2012, 14:03
So close to a double triple! And they made it a couple matches later!
It is indeed a rare year when you don't see the Thunder Chickens in St. Louis.
Jack Jones
14-04-2012, 15:22
Sf 1-2 Field Fault - all six robots dropped com at same time
MrRiedemanJACC
14-04-2012, 16:09
I've been following it off and on all day in between house hold chores :D
That is pretty crazy there Chris to score that many and still lose a match.
On the Code Red Robotics live stream there was just a mention of waiting on the replay camera for the ABC special. Does anyone know of that? When and where will it be broadcast?
Grim Tuesday
14-04-2012, 16:45
So why wasn't [G25] applied to 67 when there was a blue robot touching them while balancing?
RufflesRidge
14-04-2012, 16:46
So why wasn't [G25] applied to 67 when there was a blue robot touching them while balancing?
Presumably because the robot falling onto them is covered by [G44]
Grim Tuesday
14-04-2012, 16:47
Presumably because the robot falling onto them is covered by [G44]
That's an interesting usage of it. Has some very interesting connotations in the future if that holds true through championships.
So why wasn't [G25] applied to 67 when there was a blue robot touching them while balancing?I wouldn't really say it affected the balancing... if anything, it helped the blue alliance because otherwise the falling robot is probably on its side.
smistthegreat
14-04-2012, 16:59
I agree with the way it was called, but I can see an argument for calling G35 on 67 because their presence prevented 548 from driving off the end of the bridge, preventing a double balance. That's sketchy at best, and I think the refs did the right thing. Another interesting observation is that after 67 died, 469 (I believe accidentally) pushed them closer to the blue bridge. If anyone wants to rewatch it it's uploaded here (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDLzSMPyYsc&feature=plcp&context=C40067fbVDvjVQa1PpcFP6_SlwfHBdBp_lM3NEePFA 2JIOqGaUC3o%3D).
Tristan Lall
14-04-2012, 17:01
So why wasn't [G25] applied to 67 when there was a blue robot touching them while balancing?
Because 67 never touched the bridge directly. (At best, you could say 67 interfered with the bridge because the other robot fell on it, but then [G44] would apply and negate the foul.)
As for [G28], I don't know the circumstances of what happened with 67. If they E-stopped in that position (understanding the implications), there might be an argument to be made that the resulting contact was purposeful (and it was obviously consequential). On the other hand, sitting immobile isn't a very good indicator of purpose. I'd say the call on the field was a good one: one foul.
I wouldn't really say it affected the balancing... if anything, it helped the blue alliance because otherwise the falling robot is probably on its side.
I disagree...
Well if the robot was on it side, the blue alliance would have won.
There were no bridge points in the final match (F 1-2). This was because the robot 67 was contacting (preventing from tipping) was still in contact with the bridge. Had the robot not been in contact with the bridge, the blue alliance would have received 20 bridge points.
The final score was Red (469, 67, 830) 60 - Blue (2054, 548, 245) 49.
With blue getting those 20 BP, the final score would have been Red 60 - Blue 69.
Congratulations to 469, 67, and 830 for winning the MSC; which is no small feat!
I disagree...
Well if the robot was on it side, the blue alliance would have won.
There were no bridge points in the final match (F 1-2). This was because the robot 67 was contacting (preventing from tipping) was still in contact with the bridge. Had the robot not been in contact with the bridge, the blue alliance would have received 20 bridge points.
The final score was Red (469, 67, 830) 60 - Blue (2054, 548, 245) 49.
With blue getting those 20 BP, the final score would have been Red 60 - Blue 69.
And Blue should have (and would have) lost had it gone to a rubber match...67 was not moving nearly the entire match.
And Blue should have (and would have) lost had it gone to a rubber match...67 was not moving nearly the entire match.
And what if 67 had died for the last half of that rubber match and blue won? I think it still should have gone to a 3rd match
Gray Adams
14-04-2012, 17:38
And what if 67 had died for the last half of that rubber match and blue won? I think it still should have gone to a 3rd match
A bad call at the end of a match doesn't warrant a new match, it warrants a review of the call, and adjustment of the score as necessary.
And Blue should have (and would have) lost had it gone to a rubber match...67 was not moving nearly the entire match.
I was not saying it would have changed the tournament outcome.
Losing comms, or whatever the issue was, happens. That was not the first time 67 had sat still for a good portion of the match during eliminations.
I am glad that Red won! I am very inspired by 469 and 67 machines. I can't wait to get an in person look at the robots in St. Louis!
A bad call at the end of a match doesn't warrant a new match, it warrants a review of the call, and adjustment of the score as necessary.
And if the call had been changed blue would have won. Which, to me, would seem logical to warrant another match.
RufflesRidge
14-04-2012, 17:49
And if the call had been changed blue would have won. Which, to me, would seem logical to warrant another match.
I disagree. At most, you can call a Tech Foul per [G28] which would still have given Red the win. I can't possibly see how a non-moving robot in the position 67 was in would not be [G44] protected from any potential [G25] call.
Gray Adams
14-04-2012, 17:53
I disagree. At most, you can call a Tech Foul per [G28] which would still have given Red the win. I can't possibly see how a non-moving robot in the position 67 was in would not be [G44] protected from any potential [G25] call.
Why would it be G44 protected? No opponent put 67 where they were.
RufflesRidge
14-04-2012, 17:58
Why would it be G44 protected? No opponent put 67 where they were.
Because they weren't touching the bridge, hence no possible way to incur [G25] by themselves, if they were to be moved into contact with the bridge it would have had to have been by the opposing alliance.
[G25] Robots may not contact or otherwise interfere with the opposing Alliance Bridge.
Note: I am suggesting that the appropriate call for hitting the overhanging edge of a robot on the bridge, per the rules as written, is a Tech foul [G28] even if that contact unbalances a balanced bridge or otherwise interferes with balancing. The "If the act...." section of G25 is written as part of the "Violation" section which means that it is used to stipulate the penalty for violating the rule which requires a violation of the rule itself to begin with (touching the bridge).
Gray Adams
14-04-2012, 18:11
Because they weren't touching the bridge, hence no possible way to incur [G25] by themselves, if they were to be moved into contact with the bridge it would have had to have been by the opposing alliance.
Note: I am suggesting that the appropriate call for hitting the overhanging edge of a robot on the bridge, per the rules as written, is a Tech foul [G28] even if that contact unbalances a balanced bridge or otherwise interferes with balancing. The "If the act...." section of G25 is written as part of the "Violation" section which means that it is used to stipulate the penalty for violating the rule which requires a violation of the rule itself to begin with (touching the bridge).
G25 doesn't say you must contact the bridge for the violation to be incurred. It implies that there are ways to interfere with balancing that don't involve contacting the bridge. The balance attempt was clearly interfered with by 67, by definition of interfere. Though that doesn't mean it changed the outcome, its certainly enough to make a case for G25.
Tristan Lall
14-04-2012, 18:42
G25 doesn't say you must contact the bridge for the violation to be incurred. It implies that there are ways to interfere with balancing that don't involve contacting the bridge. The balance attempt was clearly interfered with by 67, by definition of interfere. Though that doesn't mean it changed the outcome, its certainly enough to make a case for G25.
It's true that [G25] doesn't require actual contact for interference.1 However, if the interference was directly caused by an opponent's action (even if there were other direct causes), [G44] is triggered and [G25] is waived. It doesn't matter that 548 didn't intend to fall on 67; only that they did, that the bridge was interfered with, and that 548 was a direct cause of the interference.
1 Thought experiment: a robot has an earthquake machine and directs it at the floor to unseat the opponents' bridge. [G25] would seem to be appropriate.
Gray Adams
14-04-2012, 18:49
It's true that [G25] doesn't require actual contact for interference.1 However, if the interference was directly caused by an opponent's action (even if there were other direct causes), [G44] is triggered and [G25] is waived. It doesn't matter that 548 didn't intend to fall on 67; only that they did, that the bridge was interfered with, and that 548 was a direct cause of the interference.
1 Thought experiment: a robot has an earthquake machine and directs it at the floor to unseat the opponents' bridge. [G25] would seem to be appropriate.
Well now you're in G45 territory for using G44 to waive G25.
Bjenks548
14-04-2012, 20:31
Wanted to thank 2054 and 245 for being great alliance partners and getting us all the way to the finals.
Congrats to 67, 469, and 830. Very scary alliance and a well deserved victory!
Hope to see all of you at St. Louis and hope to meet again behind the same glass in eliminations there!
What a great, high stakes competiton! Always great to see HOT win (and to give them a run for their money in quarters 1 match 2). I have a lot to say about the many great teams at the event. but unfortunately I have other things on my mind.
I lost a blue and gray checkered (kind of) hoodie that contains my car keys at the competition. It was on the table in our pit after our last quarterfinals match, and then disappeared. I looked everywhere I had been including the stands and the pit, and my team searched through all our stuff and couldn't find it. We talked to pit admin and to the event coordinator and they weren't able to help me.
Nobody moved it, so barring someone walking into our pit and just taking it, we think what most likely happened is it got bumped into the pit behind us belonging to Team Excel, 2474. They packed up very quickly and were gone the next time anyone from our team was in the pit. 2474, it would really help me if you could check to see if you have my hoodie and keys.
I know what I have to do now that my keys are gone; I am just wondering if anyone has seen the hoodie or has any idea where I could find it. What do they do with the lost and found items after the competition?
EricLeifermann
14-04-2012, 21:01
Who won Chairmans, EI and RAS?
I am pretty sure all lost and found gets sent to FIRST Headquarters. I am not 100% though.
Hope you find your hoodie and keys!
Who won Chairmans, EI and RAS?
Chairmans: 27, 33, 503
EI: 1718
RAS: I dont remember.
StephenK
14-04-2012, 21:15
4130 Blue Devils won RAS
Tom Line
14-04-2012, 21:19
4130 Blue Devils won RAS
That was particularly sweet for us - they are a rookie team we started this year and build in our build space. We're in the process of helping them with funding for the trip to St. Louis, and possibly getting them a ride down there.
Go Blue Devils!
That was particularly sweet for us - they are a rookie team we started this year and build in our build space. We're in the process of helping them with funding for the trip to St. Louis, and possibly getting them a ride down there.
Go Blue Devils!Build them a Crate! Fast! :ahh: That's what Team 1511 did for our Regional's Rookie All Star team. Actually we made it in advance and presented it to the winner after they won.
AsianPersuasion
14-04-2012, 23:06
Great match, congrats to the winnings alliance! The wave from the stands :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjep3WMjm3Y&list=HL1334458830&feature=mh_lolz
That was particularly sweet for us - they are a rookie team we started this year and build in our build space. We're in the process of helping them with funding for the trip to St. Louis, and possibly getting them a ride down there.
Go Blue Devils!
How many of them are there? We may have room on our bus.
AsianPersuasion
15-04-2012, 04:32
The wave :) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjep3WMjm3Y
Adam Freeman
15-04-2012, 10:21
OK...what an interesting way to win the Michigan State Championship. Obviously "dead" in the blue protected area, possibly in the way of a double or triple balance is not the way we would have wanted to finish out an incredible FiM Season.
I'd like to thank all the people that made this event possible...all the volunteers, refs, judges, FTAs, teams, etc...just another awesome run event all around.
- To 469, thank you for allowing us to play with you guys one more time this season. Both your team and your ro bot are incredible. For anyone that hasn't noticed, 469 has the best robot in Michigan and probably all of FIRST. Just an incredible performance all weekend long. Thanks for carrying the load for the alliance and our failing robot. I don't think we have seen the full power an alliance of 469+67 could have, yet this season. I will keep my fingers crossed that we will get one more chance to show it in St. Louis. On a different note, it has been incredible how close our teams have gotten over this season. At Waterford we were feeling each other out. At Troy we were working together. At MSC we were messing around and joking with each other. We have gone from fellow localteams and rivals...to teammates...to friends, its amazing.
- To 830, thanks for being great alliance partners. Awesome defense and smart play. You guys were willing to do whatever we asked you to do and did it very well. We could not have won without you guys.
- Congratulations to 548, 2054, and 245. This was not how we wanted to win on a debatable call. You guys were awesome competitors and great sports about the entire situation.
- To 548, you guys are awesome. Winners at Northville with us, Finalists at Troy and MSC against us. Constant improvement all season long. We know how much you guys have worked this year, especially seeing you in the shop after what must have been 2-3 all nighters this season. You are a budding powerhouse Michigan team.
- Congrats to 27, 33, and 503 on your MSC Chairman's awards and 1718 on the Engineering Inspiration Award. Also, congrats to Debbie May, from 1023, on her WFFA.
- Congrats to all the teams that qualified for the Championship in St. Louis. But, I am extremely sad that our good friends the Thunderchickens did not qualify... such a great team, it will just be really weird when they aren't there.
- Thanks to all the great people that come from a long way to see this event live (Andy Baker, Meridith and John Novak, Koko Ed...). Also, it was cool to have Dean witness the awesomeness of MSC...and have Bill Miller sitting courtside watching the Eliminations.
Now on to the last match. I am still not 100% sure what the issue was. I would assume there are some small metal chips inside the cRIO or the Digital side car....or what I was told we found was that the radio was bumped from Bridge to Auto. Either way, we would lose communication from the Drivers station to the robot. I believe the FTAs could see it drop communications, but robot appeared to be live (all light on cRIO/Radio) when we checked it out on the field. We dropped for about 11sec in the middle of the match, regained control for about 15sec, then dropped again chasing a ball over in the blue protected area. We were not going over there to interfere with any blue balancing. 469 did come over and bump us, in hopes of us coming back alive, but there was no intention to move us closer to the blue bridge. The hope was that their bump was what helped us come alive the first time, so maybe it would work again. It wasn't planned or even strategic (more of reactionary by the driver), since it would have been better for them to just go and double or single balance for the win.
I can't say definitively one way or the other if the right call was made by the refs....since the overlap of rules in this years game confuse the heck out of me. I am happy with the call they made...but mostly because we benefitted most from it. Although I would have loved to play strong all the way through the entire match and ended on another awesome double triple balance for the win, just so we could have put on a better show for the TV special (and be heading into St. Louis with as much confidence as possible).
Hopefully we can help bring another Championship trophy back to Michigan, where they belong, again!
-Adam
...
On the Code Red Robotics live stream there was just a mention of waiting on the replay camera for the ABC special. Does anyone know of that? When and where will it be broadcast?
The special is supposed to broadcast on a Detroit PBS station, but will simultaneously go live online (so I am told). Look for this later in May.
************************************************** *
I would like to start with a congratulations to Debbie of team 1023 on her WFFA. 1023 has an exemplary program on and off the field, and I know she has had a huge impact on her students.
Congratulations to the event winners 469, 67, and 830. I was impressed with the versatillity you guys showed through the tournament. Congratulations to the Finalists 2054, 548, and 245. The film crew loved 548's arm and was rooting for you guys. Also, everyone wants to know what kind of Zip-ties 2054 has ;) .
Congratulations to 503 and 27 on well deserved Chairman's awards. I am continuously in awe of all that you guys do, and humbled to be in your company. To 1718, I don't know that there is a more appropriate EI winner. I know that I am inpired byt the work you guys do year in and out please keep it going.
3098, thank you for picking us, an 2137, thank you for playing with us. It was a fun run. I am sorry we were not more robust.
A huge thank you to the volunteers that make the event run so smoothly. I saw a lot of great mentors in volunteers shirts playing double duty during the weekend. Thank you to all of the inspectors for ensuring everyone made it out on the field in fair fashion.
I feel I need to make a special callout. They say actions speak louder than words, but I think some words are needed in this case. There was a team at MSC that didn't have a Chairman's booth, wasn't bragging about their efforts, but in my opinion embodied the true spirit of being a role model team. This team was exemplary on the field while donating the large percentage of their mentors to run the event from technical field assistance to former students leading in inspection and mentor roles of other teams (these people are Dean's List quality before there was a Dean's List award). They have mentors taking pictures for all to enjoy. They had mentors assisting the film crew to ensure that the others will see what a great "sport of the mind" we participate in. Marjie, thank you for running such a great event. Gail, thank you for for your leadership in all that you do. Las Guerillas, thank you for the impact your organization has had on how FIRST is done in Michigan.
862 had an amazing time at the Michigan State Championship, and were incredibly honored to be an alliance captain at this amazing event!
A huge thank you to our alliance partners 1718 The Fighting Pi, and 3322 Eagle Imperium you both were amazing partners! To be able to hold that number 1 alliance to only a 7 point lead is an incredible accomplishment. When that score is 97-90 its even more impressive! Getting that triple balance was one of the greatest experiences of the weekend!
Good luck to both of you in St. Louis!
Does anyone know where the list is of the teams that qualified for St. Louis? I was curious so I was looking for it, but I couldn't find it anywhere.
Does anyone know where the list is of the teams that qualified for St. Louis? I was curious so I was looking for it, but I couldn't find it anywhere.
It's in the updated results and rankings spreadsheet on the FiM website:
http://firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2012/frc_2012_season.html
Richard Wallace
15-04-2012, 12:30
Does anyone know where the list is of the teams that qualified for St. Louis? I was curious so I was looking for it, but I couldn't find it anywhere.Look on the FiM website this evening. Under FRC Events - 2012 Season. There should be an updated spreadsheet for Results and Rankings.
Does anyone know where the list is of the teams that qualified for St. Louis? I was curious so I was looking for it, but I couldn't find it anywhere.
Here are the results:
http://www.firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2012/2012_Results.xls
Grim Tuesday
15-04-2012, 12:49
Here are the results:
http://www.firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2012/2012_Results.xls
A tear is shed for 217.
Carolyn_Grace
15-04-2012, 12:57
Longest post I've ever written for CD.
As a first time Volunteer Coordinator I want to start out by thanking all of our wonderful volunteers that we had this weekend. Every time that I saw a volunteer, they were working hard with smiles on their faces. This was an amazing event, but it was only that way because of the effort from our volunteers.
I want to especially shout out to a few volunteers who almost never get publicly recognized:
Cheryl and the other wonderful people managing our four safety glasses station:
I worked that job at Waterford for a bit, and I know how boring it can be to sit there all day, but every time I saw you and asked “How’s it going?” you smiled and said, “Great!” You did an efficient and great job making sure our tables were manned all the time, and I want you to know how extremely grateful I am that you donated your time this weekend to help us out there. In my opinion, that is the most under-appreciated but important volunteer roles in FIRST. On Saturday we had hundreds of visitors who had never seen a FIRST event before, but you helped them feel welcome in the pit areas, and that is how we can really spread the message of FIRST. Thank you!
My ladies that worked the volunteer table:
This is another job that takes you away from the field and your team all weekend long, but you ladies always had a smile for me when I went up to our room to get something or grab a coffee. I definitely could not have done my job without you helping to check people in and help volunteers find where they needed to be. You were an enormous help to me personally, and I know that the other volunteers were always grateful to see your smiling faces as they came in the room for meals. Dana, you rocked at helping out wherever I needed you this weekend! I appreciate you taking care of things for me on Wednesday! It was nice to know that I didn’t have to worry about anything that day so I didn’t have to miss class.
The gentlemen at the practice field, especially Andrew!
I was so nervous to have five ramps set up there with 64 teams wanting to use them, but I never once had to worry about it! You were amazing! Andrew, I can’t even imagine how exhausted you had to be Thursday. You stayed there all day long and helped queue the endless line of teams and make sure everyone was safely using the ramps. We didn’t have any problems at the practice field. The teams were patient with each other, and our practice field attendants were the best!
Queuers!
Cindy, we always can count on you! Thank you for taking the lead here! Koko Ed and Kevin, it was awesome to have some out-of-staters working with us! I hope that you enjoyed the FiM spirit and will come back again next year! Every time I was around the field, it was wonderful to see your smiling faces. Ed, I love your stories. I’m still laughing about them now!
Our gentle, sweet and hilarious Pit Admin!
A special thank you to the Sweet family. Jane and Russ, you run a flawless pit table, and we are a million times thankful that you could join us this weekend. I didn’t get a chance to give you a hug before you left for the day on Saturday, but next time I see you, you better believe that I’ll have a big one for you! Dan, you too! Between running our replacement parts, giving me crap about anything you could think of :) and helping with crowd control, every time I saw you, I knew that we were in capable hands. Thanks, buddy!
And lastly, a few key people:
Pat, our Scorekeeper:
You are a constant steady rock in the midst of the controlled chaos that is a FIRST event. Nothing phases you as you efficiently take care of things behind the scorer's table. We are lucky to have you on board. Alex, you make me laugh every time that I talk with you. Thanks for helping out with Pat and being on call during elims even though we needed your space at the table. Your positive attitude is inspiring and contagious. Thanks, kid.
Tricia and Alex: thanks for taking care of our judges! They seemed so happy every time that I saw them! You two are awesome. Tricia, thank you for the kind words and vote of confidence on Friday. I know Pam has always appreciated your help over the years, and now I fully understand why: you are amazing.
Jason, our Field Supervisor:
Oh Jay, I don’t even know where to start.
Probably should just go with this: ~~~
Thank you for the constant laughs all weekend and for being our “Jack of all Trades!” Our field crew was great, and it was because of your leadership that we were able to keep things moving along smoothly. The friendship that we’ve created over the past year is awesome, and I always look forward to seeing you at FIRST events. Thanks for the constant jokes over the headset! People probably think that I’m crazy, because I’d be in a room talking with volunteers and would just bust out laughing at something that you said through the mic/headset.
Refs and Inspectors:
As always, we have the classiest crew up here! Thank you for taking care of our teams. Your job is not easy, because it revolves around telling people when they’ve done something wrong.
Zebras: you guys looked great this weekend. I hope that you had fun, and I’m glad that we had every single one of your on board! Alan, thanks for taking the lead here!
Inspectors: one of my favorite moments of the weekend was looking over and seeing a bunch of you sitting on that camera-stand with the sign that said, “Robot Inspector Storage Area.” A few of you took care of other jobs for me over the weekend when you weren’t inspecting: thank you SO much for this! I know that Marjie missed inspecting, but was happy to leave her job in capable Cheri’s hands! Ike, you did an awesome job as lead inspector. Thank you for all of your help with the production crew as well. I hope you realize how respected and appreciated you are in the FiM and FIRST community.
Rob and Eric: It is always a pleasure working with you. You looked sharp in your new FTA shirts! Eric, your endless energy and positivity is contagious. Rob, you are always cool under pressure. These are two guys that I know I can rely on no matter what. As FTAs, they truly live the FIRST Spirit. They care about every single team and robot that is at their events and on their field, and their main goal is to make sure that all of the teams, students, and volunteers have a positive experience.
Tom, Bob and Teams 830 - the Rat Pack and 469 - the Las Guerillas:
What an exhausting weekend, and yet you stayed until 10:30 to help with fields takedown, clean up and other last second jobs to finish off the weekend. We are unbelievably lucky to have such a dedicated crew that takes care of our fields, once again always with a smile on your faces.
Lastly, but not at all least: Marjie Jenkins, our event coordinator.
You did an absolutely amazing job. The event was brilliant! You handled everything flawlessly. Thank you for all of your hard work planning this. I’m having a hard time coming up with words to tell you how impressed I am with how you took care of *everything* this weekend. Thank you for the opportunity to be your Volunteer Coordinator. It was, hands down, the best FIRST experience that I’ve had. You are a wonderful person, and I’m honored to have worked with you this weekend.
What.An.Epic.Weekend.
Thank you!
Chris Hibner
15-04-2012, 13:05
The gentlemen at the practice field, especially Andrew! [/B] I was so nervous to have five ramps set up there with 64 teams wanting to use them, but I never once had to worry about it! You were amazing! Andrew, I can’t even imagine how exhausted you had to be Thursday. You stayed there all day long and helped queue the endless line of teams and make sure everyone was safely using the ramps. We didn’t have any problems at the practice field. The teams were patient with each other, and our practice field attendants were the best!
I really want to give special thanks to the practice field crew. This was BY FAR the best run practice field that I've ever seen. This should be a model for how all events are run. Thank you very much. It couldn't have been better.
I really want to give special thanks to the practice field crew. This was BY FAR the best run practice field that I've ever seen. This should be a model for how all events are run. Thank you very much. It couldn't have been better.
I'll second that... lots of energy and intense teams at the practice field, it went very well for the several times we used the field. Very well run.
Congratulations to all teams that made it to MSC this weekend. The competition was as better than everyone expected ( and expectations were high) The event was well run and everyone should be proud of the success.
1918 had a great time this weekend and it was nice to be able to watch matches rather than work on our robot like we have done in the past. Looking forward to seeing every one in St. Louis and good luck to all.
Jim Zondag
15-04-2012, 16:04
MSC was a great event as always. Thanks to everyone who made this possible. Event staff was great, teams were great, the competition was awesome.
Congrats to 469, 67 and 830 for the big win.
- 2nd time State Champs for 469 - Amazing season record with a total of 365 State Ranking points at the end. This is as close to a perfect season as we have seen here since we started this system in 2009. Only 3 match losses over 3 Districts and the Championship......, 69/72 Amazing.
- 3rd time State Champs for 67....incredible!
- Great Third partner in team 830.
Thanks to 3098 for picking us. We played great together. Sometimes technology lets us down, but despite this, it was a good run.
Great Defense by 2137, plus a couple of awesome triples!
This was our team's 3rd time winning State level Chairman's Award. Hard to believe considering the great stuff I saw presented by all 10 DCA teams.
Looking forward to St Louis.
Michigan will have many contenders as always.
A question about the MSC Rookie All Star. I have noticed that Team 4130 won the MSC Rookie All Star. Congrats! But I noticed that their robot did not seem to compete. Were teams invited to MSC without their robots? Which teams? District RAS? District Chairman's? District EI?
StephenK
15-04-2012, 16:20
A question about the MSC Rookie All Star. I have noticed that Team 4130 won the MSC Rookie All Star. Congrats! But I noticed that their robot did not seem to compete. Were teams invited to MSC without their robots? Which teams? District RAS? District Chairman's? District EI?
From what I understand district chairman's and EI winners are invited along with their robot, while district RAS only qualifies to present for RAS at states (as in no robot).
Richard Wallace
15-04-2012, 16:34
From what I understand district chairman's and EI winners are invited along with their robot, while district RAS only qualifies to present for RAS at states (as in no robot).Check the FiM Rules Supplement (http://http://www.firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2012/2012_Rules_Supplement.pdf). Only the District CA winners are automatically qualified for MSC. All other spots are determined by point rank. I think the same system is used in MAR.
Check the FiM Rules Supplement (http://http://www.firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2012/2012_Rules_Supplement.pdf). Only the District CA winners are automatically qualified for MSC. All other spots are determined by point rank. I think the same system is used in MAR.
Richard: I'm having a hard time reading between the lines...
Chairman's Award, Engineering Inspiration Award, Rookie All-Star Award and the Website Award at the State Championship
Only the District Winners of Chairman’s Award, Engineering Inspiration Award, Rookie All-Star Award and Website Award will be eligible to compete for the award at the State Championship.
State Championship: Qualifying and Registering to Compete
Sixty four (64) teams will qualify for the State Championship:
- The District Chairman’s Award Winner from each district event will automatically qualify for a spot.
-The balance of the 64 State Championship spots will be filled by the top teams in ranked order based on their total points following the close of the district event season.
I don't see the rule that says that if you win RAS or EI that your robot isn't eligible unless you are in the top 64 ranking. Is that unspoken?
Richard Wallace
15-04-2012, 17:08
The key words are "to compete".
District EI and RAS winners come to MSC for interviews with the judges, but do not automatically qualify for one of the 64 spots to compete (i.e., with robots), as the district CA winners do.
Squeakypig
15-04-2012, 17:44
MSC was amazing, better than ever before!
I would like to thank team 51 and our big brothers team 217 for picking us as the 3rd bot on their alliance.
This was the best season our team has ever had and it is unfortunate that we will not be able to attend the world championship this year. We have still yet to attend the world champs, but I have a feeling next year is gonna be our year (judging by the progress over the past 4 years).
I would like to give even more thanks to team 217. You have been our inspiration ever since we came to be in 2009. This year you practiced with us a lot and helped us in our jaguar/victor fiasco. Can't wait to do it all again next year! (Might need to find a new place to practice though...not sure they will let us have a tank of water in our place :P)
Chris Hibner
15-04-2012, 19:04
MSC was amazing, better than ever before!
I would like to thank team 51 and our big brothers team 217 for picking us as the 3rd bot on their alliance.
A big thanks to Crevolution and the Thunderchickens for being great alliance partners. I'm just sorry that we couldn't knock off the number 2 seed to get you guys some more points to get you to the championships.
The Thunderchickes are always a great team to work with, and it's always nice to see our friends on that team.
It was a big pleasure working with Crevolution - the first time for us. I see greatness in the making on that team. I could tell from working with them that they were excited with their progress this year and it appears that the success is contagious (as it should be).
It was a great event. Thanks to all that helped put it on.
Meredith Novak
15-04-2012, 20:49
Making the trek to Michigan to attend the MSC was one of my better crazy ideas. What a great time John and I had! I recommend all mentors attend an FRC event without a team, don't even volunteer, just observe and enjoy. And MSC would be a really ideal spectator event for anyone. It was so much fun to spend time talking with the kids about their robots and CA displays, watching matches and alliance selections without that "feeling" in your gut. It gives a perspective that you just do not get when you are competing, volunteering or mentoring teams at an event.
Special thanks to our friends who let us poke around, take pictures and ask all kinds of questions about their amazing creations: Adam, Walt, Dave and all the HOT team 67; Jim, Ike and the Bees 33; Mike, Ken, Chris and purple 51; Dan, Don (so glad you crossed the pond to be there) and the 469 Guerrillas; Paul, Mike and the 217 chickens; Kyle, Dennis and Rush 27; Richard and those not-so-average Joes 3620; Bob and Holland 107...and our new friends on 548, 2767, 4294, and many more.
The event was amazing - I have an extensive list of ideas for things to work toward in Arkansas and I think John has a couple of napkin drawings to keep him occupied the next couple of weeks. It makes us realize how much Team 16 misses playing with so many of these teams, but you all have a great thing going there. Congratulations to you all and thank you for your hospitality.
I would like to start with a congratulations to Debbie of team 1023 on her WFFA. 1023 has an exemplary program on and off the field, and I know she has had a huge impact on her students.
I feel I need to make a special callout. They say actions speak louder than words, but I think some words are needed in this case. There was a team at MSC that didn't have a Chairman's booth, wasn't bragging about their efforts, but in my opinion embodied the true spirit of being a role model team. This team was exemplary on the field while donating the large percentage of their mentors to run the event from technical field assistance to former students leading in inspection and mentor roles of other teams (these people are Dean's List quality before there was a Dean's List award). They have mentors taking pictures for all to enjoy. They had mentors assisting the film crew to ensure that the others will see what a great "sport of the mind" we participate in. Marjie, thank you for running such a great event. Gail, thank you for for your leadership in all that you do. Las Guerillas, thank you for the impact your organization has had on how FIRST is done in Michigan.
Thank you so much!
And.. I totally agree with what you said about 469! They are always there, doing so much! Great robot, great team!
Thanks to the Enginerds for picking us! It was fun playing with you and the Chimeras!!
It was so nice to see so many friends at MSC. There are so many amazing teams here! The network of friendship just continues to grow. Thank you to all of the teams that helped Nick and I reshape our team 4 years ago when we took over the team. We leaned heavily on the RUSH toolkit, interactions with so many strong Michigan coaches and mentors, and the friendliness of all. I am so grateful to be involved with all of you in this life-changing experience! Thank you all for sharing and caring!
Thanks again to all of the volunteers, to Marji for coordinating the awesome event, to Gail and Pam for all they do for us, to all of our awesome MC's, to Dave for being such a great spokesperson for all of us, and to everyone for making it such a great event!
Wayne TenBrink
15-04-2012, 23:28
Once again, it was an honor and a privilege to compete at MSC. Thanks to all the volunteers who made it possible. We should never forget how good we have it here, and never miss an opportunity to show our appreciation for those who make it possible.
Congratulations to everyone who made it there, and those who get to go on to CMP. Especially 27, 33, and 503 for CA, 1718 for EI, 4130 for RAS, and the winning alliance of 469, 67, and 830. Special congratulations to Debbie May for winning Woodie Flowers award. We will be well represented in St. Louis.
Thanks to 573 for selecting us and, along with 70 & 308, digging deep to take the quarters and put up a respectable fight against the #1 alliance in the semi's.
Now for one more round of "improvements" and it's on to St. Louis!
Edit: A very special thanks to Team 2771 for providing the webcasts all season. You make it possible for our friends, families, classmates, and co-workers be part of FRC. It was good to see your team in the stands at MSC!
Thank you so much!
.....
Thanks to the Enginerds for picking us! It was fun playing with you and the Chimeras!!
.....
1684 Chimeras also enjoyed the eliminations alliance, and we're very honored and appreciative to be chosen on the alliance. We had a great time playing with 1023 Bedford Express and the alliance captains 2337 Enginerds.
The event was great, our team was very happy to be part of it. Looking forward to next year.
Thanks again 1023 and 2337!
BX has about 20 seats left on our charter bus this year. If anyone is interested in sharing the bus, or if some of you that didn't qualify want to go (chaperones must accompany students) :) please let me know! We are leaving at 6 am Wednesday and returning around 8:30 pm on Sunday. We are located way down by Toledo. It is about a 40 minute drive from AA and about a 50 min. drive from Detroit.
zack0617
16-04-2012, 22:04
BX has about 20 seats left on our charter bus this year. If anyone is interested in sharing the bus, or if some of you that didn't qualify want to go (chaperones must accompany students) :) please let me know! We are leaving at 6 am Wednesday and returning around 8:30 pm on Sunday. We are located way down by Toledo. It is about a 40 minute drive from AA and about a 50 min. drive from Detroit.
Any room on that bus for a couple of ThunderChickens if we dont qualify and if no teams actually competing need that space?
Any room on that bus for a couple of ThunderChickens if we dont qualify and if no teams actually competing need that space? Would love to have some chickens join us! If you want to opt in our complete package, try to let me know asap. email me at bxcoach1023@gmail.com for info or details. :)
zack0617
16-04-2012, 22:12
Would love to have some chickens join us! If you want to opt in our complete package, try to let me know asap. email me at bxcoach1023@gmail.com for info or details. :)
Ill tell you when i know for sure if we are getting to compete or not, which im almost positive will be tomorrow?
Ill tell you when i know for sure if we are getting to compete or not, which im almost positive will be tomorrow?
Ok.. Sounds good. I am still hoping you all will be competing!!! The number of teams in Michigan has sure grown over the past 4 years, seems we should be getting more slots! :)
BX has about 20 seats left on our charter bus this year. If anyone is interested in sharing the bus, or if some of you that didn't qualify want to go (chaperones must accompany students) :) please let me know! We are leaving at 6 am Wednesday and returning around 8:30 pm on Sunday. We are located way down by Toledo. It is about a 40 minute drive from AA and about a 50 min. drive from Detroit.
I'll just throw this out there: 1023 is a FANTASTIC team to travel with! I rode with them down to STL last year, and I can't think of a more welcoming, spirited, and generally fun group of people. If you're in the metro Detroit/AA area and are looking to go, I strongly suggest taking up Mrs. May's offer :)
zack0617
17-04-2012, 21:34
Ok.. Sounds good. I am still hoping you all will be competing!!! The number of teams in Michigan has sure grown over the past 4 years, seems we should be getting more slots! :)
Thank you for the offer, but when i asked the students who had said they might be attending worlds, most already had plans and didnt want to drive 2 hours to Toledo and miss 3 days of school, but again i thank you for the offer, good luck and have fun at Worlds!
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