World Rankings

[Joe Ross]

I used the First in Michigan point system to calculate rankings for each of the 75 regionals and combine them into a world ranking. See the attached spreadsheet.

Here's the scoring system, from the FiM Rules Supplement (http://www.firstinmichigan.org/FRC_2013/2013_Rules_Supplement.pdf)
POINT CATEGORY POINTS POINTS
Win-Loss Record in Qualifying Rounds
Win 2
Tie 1
Final Alliance Captains After Picking
#1 Alliance Captain 16
#2 Alliance Captain 15
#3 Alliance Captain down to #8 Alliance Captain 14 down to 9
Draft Order by Acceptance
#1 Draft Pick (Accepted) 16
#2 Draft Pick (Accepted) 15
#3Draft Pick down to #16 Draft Pick 14 down to 1
Elimination Round Performance
Winning Alliance Teams:
Alliance Captain and First Pick 30
Second Pick 24
Finalist Alliance Teams:
Alliance Captain and First Pick 20
Second Pick 16
Semi Finalist Alliance Teams:
Alliance Captain and First Pick 10
Second Pick 8
Awards
Industrial Design 5
Quality 5
Excellence in Engineering 5
Innovation in Control 5
Creativity 5
Entrepreneurship 5
Team Spirit 2
Gracious Professionalism 2
Imagery 2
Highest Rookie Seed 2
Industrial Safety 2
Judges Award 2
Rookie Inspiration 2


Like FiM, I only counted a team's first two events. However, since a majority of teams only play one event, I did not want to overly punish a team for only playing one event, and multiplied their point values by 2 (which assumes they would have done just as well at a second event). Additionally, in Michigan, everyone plays 12 matches per event. However, at other regionals, teams play as few as 8 matches. Since teams earn points for Wins and Ties, I normalized every event wins and ties points based on the actual number of matches played, based on 12 matches and rounded.

I have also included the results prior to normalization for comparison.

Congratulations to team 1986 for having the highest score in both the normalized and unnormalized results. For teams that only attended a single regional, team 955 had the best normalized result and team 4265 had the best unnormalized result.

All tiebreakers were implemented, however, there was still 1 tie, team 1571 and 3527 had the same points, Elim Score, Best Elims Draft Score, Best Draft, QP, Wins, and 3 highest scores.

Let me know if you find any errors. The alliance selection data was taken from the 2013 Alliance Selection (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114555) thread, and there may be errors or typos.

[stingray27]

How did you determine what teams where alliance captains and 1st picks, etc.?

[Ivan Malik]

Thread (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114555&highlight=alliance+selection+results)that has been going on all season

[nikeairmancurry]

How did you determine what teams where alliance captains and 1st picks, etc.?

The Alliance selection thread would be most helpful there...

[stingray27]

Yeah ok. Thanks. I had known about that thread and was wondering if there was actually any "official" data out there regarding alliance selection and how the draft had played out at each tournament. I have been wondering about it for a while to see if I would be able to parse it from somewhere for my app....

[Basel A]

Yeah ok. Thanks. I had known about that thread and was wondering if there was actually any "official" data out there regarding alliance selection and how the draft had played out at each tournament. I have been wondering about it for a while to see if I would be able to parse it from somewhere for my app....

Joe has been going through the Alliance Selections thread over the past week or two, correcting and adding results from various regionals. As for parsing, alliance member with the highest rank is automatically the captain, but telling the 1st pick from the 2nd pick can't be done using the online data provided by first. Well, except that any pick with a rank higher than the lowest captain had to have been the alliance's first pick.

[Joe Ross]

Yeah ok. Thanks. I had known about that thread and was wondering if there was actually any "official" data out there regarding alliance selection and how the draft had played out at each tournament. I have been wondering about it for a while to see if I would be able to parse it from somewhere for my app....

FIRST has the data, but doesn't publish it. Ed Law does a good job guessing the ambiguous cases using OPR in his scouting spreadsheet, but that's not that great when you get to the 6th, 7th, and 8th seeds with the serpentine. As others said, I used the alliance selection thread, and supplemented with other sources when needed.

[stingray27]

Ok. Well, thanks to all those who helped put this information online for those to use, and thanks Joe for compiling this information.

Is there anyway we can get FIRST to supply this information or put it somewhere online? I know it would be of great use for FIRST in Michigan, private applications and just to use in general. Possibly add it to the elimination schedule page on the FIRST information or FMS feed, or possibly organize the stations certain seeds are for their first matches, then randomize them after that. Anything would be nice....

[Joe Ross]

Is there anyway we can get FIRST to supply this information or put it somewhere online? I know it would be of great use for FIRST in Michigan,

FiM gets the data directly from the FTA. See http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1165482&postcount=3

[kjohnson]

Team 103 is ranked 103 with 103 points...

[Hallry]

Are week 7 events (specifically MAR and FiM Championships) included in this?

[Joe Ross]

Team 103 is ranked 103 with 103 points...

That is the only occurrence of all three matching. Team 11 is ranked 11. No other team has the same number of points as their team number.

[Joe Ross]

Are week 7 events included in this?

The Chesapeake regional is included. The Michigan and MAR championships are not. Since each team at the championships were already involved in 2 events, it wouldn't have impacted the rankings.

[Bob Steele]

I am assuming that no points were given for Engineering Inspiration or Chairman's Awards? I don't see them on the charts...just the other awards like spirit and safety, etc
i guess this is an artifact of using the FiM system. They don't give ranking points for these awards because they qualify directly for the State Championship... Normally teams that win one of these bigger awards don't receive any of the other awards that ARE given points under the FiM rules..

[Jim Zondag]

Is there anyway we can get FIRST to supply this information or put it somewhere online? I know it would be of great use for FIRST in Michigan, private applications and just to use in general. Possibly add it to the elimination schedule page on the FIRST information or FMS feed, or possibly organize the stations certain seeds are for their first matches, then randomize them after that. Anything would be nice....

I have asked FIRST to make this Draft Order data available on several occasions over the past 4 years. Nothing. Not sure if the requests ever got past Bill. We very much want this in Michigan since our District Rankings depend on the draft order. We could automate all the FiM standings, but we are missing this one slice of data from each event. The way it is now, We must manually enter this data each week.

I requested this again about 2 weeks ago. Frank Merrick immediately replied and requested a followup discussion after the CMP.
I think we will finally get this issue resolved for 2014.

[Joe Ross]

I posted the alliance selection order that I used in the alliance selection thread.

[Rangel(kf7fdb)]

Wow rank 61. That's a couple hundred ranks better than we thought it was going to be. :yikes:

[Snowbird]

Woot!

Looking through the spreadsheet, are you taking the highest scores in qualifying only? Because we did have higher scores after alliance selection.

-Mentor, 4265, speaking on behalf of the team

[Navid Shafa]

i guess this is an artifact of using the FiM system.

Correct:

Q18: “Why are there no ranking points associated with the Chairman’s Award, Engineering Inspiration Award, and Rookie All Star Award?”
A18: This decision for this was made by FIRST NH, not FiM. FIRST considers these 3 awards to be “Culture Changing Awards” and wishes them to remain apart from the rest of the competition awards.
FiM disagrees with this position, and we feel that the decision not to award points for these items actually degrades the prestige of these awards relative to the others by making them worth nothing in our system.


Taken from Jim Zondag's FAQ's:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/papers/2804?

[Dreams2Reality]

Woot!

Looking through the spreadsheet, are you taking the highest scores in qualifying only? Because we did have higher scores after alliance selection.

-Mentor, 4265, speaking on behalf of the team

Not to speak for Joe, but the FiM scoring includes the highest scores only from the qualifiers because they are used in case of ties. Similarly, additional QS, AS CP, and TP are accumulated only from the qualifiers.

[Travis Hoffman]

It'll be interesting to see once divisions are released how many of the Top 400 in this ranking method are actually attending the Championship.

[Hallry]

It'll be interesting to see once divisions are released how many of the Top 400 in this ranking method are actually attending the Championship.

You can see the almost-completed 2013 Championship Team List (without divisions) here: https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2013&event=cmp. There are 386 teams signed up so far.

[Ed Law]

FIRST has the data, but doesn't publish it. Ed Law does a good job guessing the ambiguous cases using OPR in his scouting spreadsheet, but that's not that great when you get to the 6th, 7th, and 8th seeds with the serpentine. As others said, I used the alliance selection thread, and supplemented with other sources when needed.

I need to make a correction here. As Joe pointed out in my post http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1165482&postcount=3 from last year, I do not use the alliance selection results from CD. To me even one error is too many. However it is not true that I guess the alliance selection based on OPR. I cannot image anybody would do that. The spreadsheet make the determination automatically when it is clear. For example if team A as alliance captain 2 pick team B who is alliance captain 8, then we know for sure that team B is #2 pick and the team they pick later in 2nd round is #15 pick. If team A as alliance captain 2 pick team C in first round and team D in second round and team C is not an alliance captain, there is no way to tell which team in an alliance was picked first or second, the program will list the higher ranked one as # 2 or 15 pick, and the lower ranked team as # 15 or 2 pick.

Jim Zondag has been asking FIRST to provide this information for the last few years. It looks like FIRST is finally listening.

Joe, thank you for doing this. Now any region who wants to do what if a certain group of teams is in a district and see the ranking, they can easily do it with your spreadsheet by selecting those teams only.

[Jonathan Ryan]

Team 145 was the 4th overall selection at FLR. Selected by team 48, the 4th seeded Alliance captain. 1126 was the 13th pick, the third pick of the 4th seeded Alliance.

[Nemo]

It'll be interesting to see once divisions are released how many of the Top 400 in this ranking method are actually attending the Championship.

As of a half hour ago, the number is 223 out of 400.

14633

[CrazyMohawk]

I was shocked to see a NW team at number 2 :eek: but very happy as well. Go 955.

Also good to see we're 39th.:)

[Boe]

wow awesome we managed to sneak into the top 100 :D:D and thats without our planned 7 disk for champs

[Joe Ross]

I corrected a few errors (There were 2 judges awards at Isreal, and messed up the North Star elimination finish). I also added a column for the award points.

[Chris Fultz]

i am not finding 67

[Hallry]

i am not finding 67

Rank 129.

[Citrus Dad]

Note: I was reviewing the 2834 database and think I found that the Championship OPRs are in error. The sums of the individual components often do not add up to the Total. (3824's in Curie is off by 32.) A quick scan of the regionals finds in some cases no deviations whatsoever and <2 pts maximum in others. I suggest going back and recomputing the OPRs.

[Ether]

Note: I was reviewing the 2834 database and think I found that the Championship OPRs are in error. The sums of the individual components often do not add up to the Total. (3824's in Curie is off by 32.) A quick scan of the regionals finds in some cases no deviations whatsoever and <2 pts maximum in others. I suggest going back and recomputing the OPRs.

redirect here:

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1276030#post1276030

[Joe Ross]

I've updated the rankings based on the 2014 District Standard Points Ranking (http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default/files/uploadedFiles/Robotics_Programs/FRC/Resources/FRC_District_Standard_Points_Ranking_System.pdf)

The additional award points propel 955 from 2nd to 1st in the normalized rankings. The 2nd year bonus and Engineering Inspiration points propelled 3990 from 20th to 2nd. 4451 was the highest ranked rookie, moving from 75th to 26th.

See attached.

[MARS_James]

I've updated the rankings based on the 2014 District Standard Points Ranking (http://www.usfirst.org/sites/default/files/uploadedFiles/Robotics_Programs/FRC/Resources/FRC_District_Standard_Points_Ranking_System.pdf)

The additional award points propel 955 from 2nd to 1st in the normalized rankings. The 2nd year bonus and Engineering Inspiration points propelled 3990 from 20th to 2nd. 4451 was the highest ranked rookie, moving from 75th to 26th.

See attached.

Interesting to see the changes in rankings from the old structure to the new (My old team dropped more than 100 places) probably mostly because of awards that got no points previously receiving them and the youth bonuses, FIRST's new rules will definitely cause some teams to make District/Regional Championship who wouldn't have in the past.