FIRST Choice Items

[cgmv123]

Now that FIRST Choice items are available for 'window-shopping', what stands out to you?

Just quickly scanning, it looks like the 'bigger' items, like Talons and Classmates have appropriately large point values.

[joelg236]

So far, I can only fill in about 300 credits of things we need. Looks like 3D printers are being pushed heavily. cRIO seems like a bad buy.

Also, it appears the website was just updated in the past few minutes, removing some items (extension cord is no longer there?).

[coalhot]

I don't think the cRio is a bad buy, depending on how your team utilized spare parts/components/setups.

The 55 credits for a lot of stuff is bugging me. It seems like it was implemented especially so I can't do something like get a pair of Talons and a battery. That seems like a legit FIRST Choice order, right?

[thefro526]

The 55 credits for a lot of stuff is bugging me. It seems like it was implemented especially so I can't do something like get a pair of Talons and a battery. That seems like a legit FIRST Choice order, right?

Phil, I'm inclined to think that the credits may have been allotted to do just that. It seems to me that it's fairly obvious that there are fewer useful items currently in FC than 'less useful' items. Looking through some of the theoretical order configurations it becomes pretty obvious that most teams should be able to get at least one or two things that are 'really useful' from FC, but very, very few are going to make out like bandits. In the grand scheme of things, we may all end up being better off if everyone gets 'something' from FC, rather than the extreme cases last year where some teams got everything while others got nothing.

[Caleb Sykes]

The 55 credits for a lot of stuff is bugging me. It seems like it was implemented especially so I can't do something like get a pair of Talons and a battery. That seems like a legit FIRST Choice order, right?

It would be if more Talons and batteries were available. As it is, there are only 250 teams that can get 2 Talons, and only 500 that can get a battery. Since there are 3000+ teams, these items need to be highly priced even with the quantity limits to allow everyone a shot at these high-importance items.

[runneals]

It has a decent selection for teams who are going to use Pneumatic systems, but I agree that there isn't much else besides batteries, connectors, C-RIOs, and $100 3-D Printing vouchers.

[chmorroni]

I don't know if this is true, but the Talon page says there won't be any included in the KOP, whereas multiple other things CIMs, Classmates, Batteries, and cRIOs say that they are included. Am I missing something, or is there something else going on?

[cgmv123]

I don't know if this is true, but the Talon page says there won't be any included in the KOP, whereas multiple other things CIMs, Classmates, Batteries, and cRIOs say that they are included. Am I missing something, or is there something else going on?

Talons were not in the KOP last year, so it's not surprising. I'd expect IFI to throw in a few Jaguars and/or a voucher like last year.

[Mark McLeod]

Some of those items (Classmate, cRIO) will get included in Rookie Kits (green+black totes), but not in the veteran kits (black tote).

[ehfeinberg]

Could someone please link the new FIRST Choice website? I can't seem to find it on the FRC blog...

[Mark McLeod]

Go to the AndyMark website: http://www.andymark.com/
Click on the prominent FIRST Choice logo: https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/
Click on Preview: https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/newproducts

[ehfeinberg]

Go to the AndyMark website: http://www.andymark.com/
Click on the prominent FIRST Choice logo: https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/
Click on Preview: https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/newproducts

<Facepalm/>

To my defense, that big FIRST Choice logo wasn't there a little while a go for me. I saw the FTC button and a deal of the day button, no FIRST Choice.

[Mark McLeod]

The more mundane path is to go to the AndyMark site and on the left menu under FIRST you will find FIRST Choice and other FIRST specific item links.

[Tom Line]

So far, I can only fill in about 300 credits of things we need. Looks like 3D printers are being pushed heavily. cRIO seems like a bad buy.

Also, it appears the website was just updated in the past few minutes, removing some items (extension cord is no longer there?).

I'm not sure why you think the cRIO is a bad buy.

For a lot of teams who use LabVIEW, there's is going to be very little change between the new 2015 system and the current system. So while the wiring may be a little different, the cRIO will still be an excellent developement platform.

In addition, they're quite handy for running old robots. At 100 credits, they are fairly cost effective.

I've started going through and doing some evaluation based on dollars and points, and it looks like all the highly sought items are right around $1 = 1 point. Cims, Talons, and Batteries all fall under this catagory. So it looks like FIRST did exactly what they should have when they valued these.

[joelg236]

I've started going through and doing some evaluation based on dollars and points, and it looks like all the highly sought items are right around $1 = 1 point. Cims, Talons, and Batteries all fall under this catagory. So it looks like FIRST did exactly what they should have when they valued these.

For me it seems slightly lopsided. Maybe my prices aren't on-point, but there is certainly some differences between items. Obviously, there are different subsidies for different parts.


I'm not sure why you think the cRIO is a bad buy.

For a lot of teams who use LabVIEW, there's is going to be very little change between the new 2015 system and the current system. So while the wiring may be a little different, the cRIO will still be an excellent developement platform.

In addition, they're quite handy for running old robots. At 100 credits, they are fairly cost effective.


Probably not a terrible option, but any team with more than one cRIO already hasn't got much of a reason, considering it'll be obsolete in a year. (and likely won't get much use) I guess testing is possible reason, but why not wait a year and get discounted ones from other teams or surplus on Andymark?

[BBray_T1296]

why not wait a year and get discounted ones from other teams or surplus on Andymark?

How else will we slip on regolith (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunacy_%28FIRST%29), kick soccerballs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakaway_%28FIRST%29), hang tubes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logomotion), shoot baskets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rebound_Rumble), launch frisbees (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultimate_Ascent), and have a 2014 robot at the same time (in the next 2 months)?

[Tom Line]

For me it seems slightly lopsided. Maybe my prices aren't on-point, but there is certainly some differences between items. Obviously, there are different subsidies for different parts.

Most of your prices are very close to the ones I have on my spreadsheet.

I noticed the higher bang-for-the-buck on the pneumatic components as well. I will venture a guess that those may be priced that way because a lot of teams don't use them every year. That makes them intrisically worth less than a Talon, a Battery, or a pre-made battery lead.

Even with the item limits, I see that a lot of components that will be sold out fairly quickly.

That said, I went through and made a buy-list and I don't have any trouble filling all my points and then some with components that I know will be useful in the next year or two. That makes me happy :D

[sanddrag]

Has it been mentioned if new items will be stocked after kickoff, for the second distribution of (450) points? Will the stock of any of the currently posted items be replenished for the second round, of they go out of stock on the first round?

[Redo91]

In the past years, once the items were gone from FC that was it. I have not seen anything saying that it will be different this year for this year

[cgmv123]

Once an item is gone, it's gone.

[Bald & Bearded]

Couple of interesting things.

I was really surprised at the number of 3D printing vouchers. Those seem like a reasonable deal if you want to explore 3D printing and not take a chance on the lottery. And most of these places offering the vouchers will have much higher end commercial grade printers.

I concur with the comments about the Talons and batteries.

While the CRIO will be obsolete next year if you need one for this year that is a good deal (assuming you have the modules).

The toggle switches and buttons seem overpriced to me.

Motors and Pneumatics seem like the best deals.

[rsisk]

I noticed the pneumatic valves are on 24V. Anyone know if the new control system next year will support 24V pneumatic valves?

[otherguy]

I noticed the pneumatic valves are on 24V. Anyone know if the new control system next year will support 24V pneumatic valves?

If i remember corerctly, 12/24v is selectable via jumper on the pneumatics module.

It's also listed as being supported in the picture linked in this post:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1267723&postcount=20

[Bruceb]

anybody else notice the old van door motors???

[MichaelBick]

I noticed the pneumatic valves are on 24V. Anyone know if the new control system next year will support 24V pneumatic valves?

The 2014 control system will stay the same as the 2013 control system. It only changes for 2015.

[aldaeron]

I read the FC rules (http://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/t/FIRSTChoiceRules)

What I did not see were details on the Max Qty Per Team restriction that some items have (Talons, Battery, etc). Does that Max Qty Per Team apply to FIRST Choice as a whole or each of the two sessions (i.e. can I get one battery in the first round and another in the second round)?

My guess is the Max applies to the whole FIRST choice for the season.

Thanks!

-matto-

[joelg236]

I read the FC rules (http://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/t/FIRSTChoiceRules)

What I did not see were details on the Max Qty Per Team restriction that some items have (Talons, Battery, etc). Does that Max Qty Per Team apply to FIRST Choice as a whole or each of the two sessions (i.e. can I get one battery in the first round and another in the second round)?

My guess is the Max applies to the whole FIRST choice for the season.

Thanks!

-matto-

Looks like it applies to both rounds together. They don't have enough talons and batteries to support twice as much.

[JohnSchneider]

Isnt there typically a placeholder for "20XX Game Piece"?
I dont see one for "2014 game piece"

[Nuttyman54]

Isnt there typically a placeholder for "20XX Game Piece"?
I dont see one for "2014 game piece"


Clearly, there is no game piece. See theories in other threads about it being a virtual game this year.

[Mark McLeod]

Isnt there typically a placeholder for "20XX Game Piece"?
I dont see one for "2014 game piece"
There were not any placeholders last year before kickoff.

[cgmv123]

There won't be any Talons and batteries left at the end of the first day, let alone by the time everyone gets their additional kickoff credits.

[DELurker]

The thing that stood out the most to me was the FC14-004 IR Transmitter (http://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-004). It looks a lot like the one from 2008(?) but with a new part number. It says it won't be in the kits, but that could be a misdirection.

Why would they have it there if we didn't need it this year? It's not like we could use it if it's not required for the game...

[Siri]

The thing that stood out the most to me was the FC14-004 IR Transmitter (http://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-004). It looks a lot like the one from 2008(?) but with a new part number. It says it won't be in the kits, but that could be a misdirection.

Why would they have it there if we didn't need it this year? It's not like we could use it if it's not required for the game...I'm presuming it's for the same reason they had it up there last year even though it wasn't in the game. Now what that reason actually is, I have no clue. Presumably they have them and they don't know what else to do with them.

[PayneTrain]

The thing that stood out the most to me was the FC14-004 IR Transmitter (http://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-004). It looks a lot like the one from 2008(?) but with a new part number. It says it won't be in the kits, but that could be a misdirection.

Why would they have it there if we didn't need it this year? It's not like we could use it if it's not required for the game...

It's a great device for teams who lost their old remotes to shop TVs, clearly.

[DampRobot]

Does anyone know if you can use 24V and 12V solenoids on the same system, or the 24V solenoids in FIRST choice with the FRC electronics at all?

Also, is it possible to replace the 1/8" port in the black tanks with a 1/4" port to more easily interface with the robot's standard pneumatics system?

[Gregor]

Also, is it possible to replace the 1/8" port in the black tanks with a 1/4" port to more easily interface with the robot's standard pneumatics system?

You can buy 1/4 to 1/8" NPT adaptors. I believe they were included in the kit for a few years. Veteren teams should have some.


They look like this: http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41yW7TxsenL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

[DampRobot]

You can buy 1/4 to 1/8" NPT adaptors. I believe they were included in the kit for a few years. Veteren teams should have some.


They look like this: http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41yW7TxsenL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

Ahh, so these are threaded NPT connectors rather than push to connect?

[Gregor]

Ahh, so these are threaded NPT connectors rather than push to connect?

Yep. Male 1/8" NPT and female 1/4" NPT.

[Dr Theta]

Does anyone know if you can use 24V and 12V solenoids on the same system, or the 24V solenoids in FIRST choice with the FRC electronics at all?

Also, is it possible to replace the 1/8" port in the black tanks with a 1/4" port to more easily interface with the robot's standard pneumatics system?

Anither good option for this http://www.andymark.com/product-p/am-2011.htm

[yarden.saa]

The best item in FIRST Choice, only 5 fc points that worth 65$

https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-026

[joelg236]

The best item in FIRST Choice, only 5 fc points that worth 65$

https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-026

Wait. A cable tie worth $65???

[Joe Ross]

Does anyone know if you can use 24V and 12V solenoids on the same system, or the 24V solenoids in FIRST choice with the FRC electronics at all?

FIRST provides wiring instructions for 24v solenoids. If you want to use both 24v and 12v, you must use 2 solenoid modules in the cRIO or put the 24v solenoids on a solenoid module and run the 12v solenoids from spikes.

[yarden.saa]

Wait. A cable tie worth $65???
48" cable tie (1.21 meter)

[Chris is me]

Wait. A cable tie worth $65???

You get fifty of them.

[Jared]

The best item in FIRST Choice, only 5 fc points that worth 65$

https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-026

I think the extension cord for 0 credits is a better dealhttps://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-110

[sanddrag]

I think the extension cord for 0 credits is a better dealhttps://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/en/fc14-110Note that it's for a generator, not a standard outlet.

[MechEng83]

I haven't see anything like this posted yet, so here is a list of the FIRST Choice items along with commercial prices I was able to find for the items.

The list isn't complete for a few reasons: Some items I couldn't find a price for, anywhere. Other items I could only find prices off ebay, which can be wildly variable, so I did not include those. I selected prices from "typical" FRC vendors if possible (others may have varying opinions on which vendors qualify as typical). Preference for listing was given to the part manufacturer's site, if price was listed. If multiple vendors had it listed at different prices, I tended toward the cheaper option.

If you have information on missing items, or a large price difference, I certainly would appreciate hearing about that. No consideration was given to shipping costs.

As always, decisions should be made with your team in mind. No one "best choice" list will exist.

Spreadsheet here (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aksm_xDjD_14dEw1LUZtMmNoR19sNVN6eG9EX0ZES kE&usp=sharing)

[mrnoble]

I don't want to mess up our teams' chances with this item, but I thought it would be worth pointing out that the slewing rings run around $200+.

http://www.globalindustrial.com/p/motors/bearings/slewing-ring-bearings/100mm-dia-slewing-ring-bearing-6070-lbs-max-axial-static?infoParam.campaignId=T9A&gclid=CLD4l5SEq7sCFclaMgodzEkAvg

[Jim Wilks]

I'm not sure why you think the cRIO is a bad buy.

For a lot of teams who use LabVIEW, there's is going to be very little change between the new 2015 system and the current system. So while the wiring may be a little different, the cRIO will still be an excellent developement platform.

In addition, they're quite handy for running old robots. At 100 credits, they are fairly cost effective.

What good is a CRIO with no modules in it? Buying the modules from NI individually is no bargain.

[Tom Line]

What good is a CRIO with no modules in it? Buying the modules from NI individually is no bargain.

Using the FIRST discount makes them reasonable. We also tend to have spare modules sitting around not being used.

For us, it's definitely a good deal because we'll get to keep all our old robots running and still have one to play with off a robot.

[sanddrag]

Anyone know if there is a difference between the two classmates?

Also, will the web site allow for adding different items to the cart through different browser tabs? Can anyone who did the beta test chime in on that?

[Steven Donow]

Anyone know if there is a difference between the two classmates?

Also, will the web site allow for adding different items to the cart through different browser tabs? Can anyone who did the beta test chime in on that?

Per the document on the beta test (http://files.andymark.com/BetaTestingResults.pdf):

1. Don’t open multiple windows or tabs. It can get confusing and depending on browser settings
the timers may be different on each window/tab, and if one runs to zero you will lose the items
in your cart.

[OWilliamson]

I haven't see anything like this posted yet, so here is a list of the FIRST Choice items along with commercial prices I was able to find for the items.

The list isn't complete for a few reasons: Some items I couldn't find a price for, anywhere. Other items I could only find prices off ebay, which can be wildly variable, so I did not include those. I selected prices from "typical" FRC vendors if possible (others may have varying opinions on which vendors qualify as typical). Preference for listing was given to the part manufacturer's site, if price was listed. If multiple vendors had it listed at different prices, I tended toward the cheaper option.

If you have information on missing items, or a large price difference, I certainly would appreciate hearing about that. No consideration was given to shipping costs.

As always, decisions should be made with your team in mind. No one "best choice" list will exist.

Spreadsheet here (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Aksm_xDjD_14dEw1LUZtMmNoR19sNVN6eG9EX0ZES kE&usp=sharing)

Thank you so much for posting your spreadsheet. I was just about to make one for our team, but you saved us a bunch of time by posting yours! :D

[DonRotolo]

With 7 minutes to go, I am surprised to find that I am actually nervous. Possibly not as bad as the guy managing the servers, but nevertheless...

Need to score a bunch of triple taps for all our Generators.:p

Edit: T - 4 minutes and the server has stopped responding... :-(
...and T+ 1 minute, server not responding. sigh.

[Micah Chetrit]

The site is already really laggy (over a minute to load a page) with over 5 minutes before it starts

[Nirvash]

Need to score a bunch of triple taps for all our Generators.:p

I see I have some competition! I'm going to have to get those in the cart fast! Before they all run out!

Edit: Also, did the site just get really slow for anyone else?

[Whippet]

The site is already really laggy (over a minute to load a page) with over 5 minutes before it starts

I'm honestly worried now that the load time will exceed the time on the shopping cart timer...

[peronis]

server seems down to me....anyone else?

[kaliken]

dang it... tried to log in 10 minutes early... still waiting!

[rees2001]

I can't even get the site to load

[MrRiedemanJACC]

Glad to hear it's not my internet connection that is lagging....


But I think everyone knows this will be a pretty slow process to get the items we want...

[ttldomination]

server seems down to me....anyone else?

Yeah, not sure if they're down or just on their knees. Either way, this doesn't bode well for 12:01.

- Sunny G.

[MechEng83]

I hope the lag is temporary, otherwise, a lot of people are going to time out on their carts...

[Bob Steele]

Interesting... can't seem to log in
Just get a loading page...
worked Thursday... must be a lot of traffic
Hope its not another one of those days

[aldaeron]

The site is already really laggy (over a minute to load a page) with over 5 minutes before it starts

The silly thing is that there are less than 5000 people logging in. I wish this would be outsourced to a retailer that can handle millions of simultaneous transactions (like Amazon).

[Whippet]

server seems down to me....anyone else?

The server appears to be down.

[Nirvash]

It's going to be one of those days, especially for the webadmins.

[tr6scott]

blastoff... blank screen...

[ttldomination]

The server appears to be down.

http://isitup.org/www.firstchoicebyandymark.com

- Sunny G.

[Ryan Dognaux]

Has anyone successfully loaded the site & seen their updated credit amount? It does seem like the server is down.

[HeyLookABurrito]

Yea I have been logged on for about 30 min now and the site is not loading at all for me anymore so watch for the site to come back online

[sanddrag]

still responds to ping, but no page loads

[mklinker]

Bummer.....

[joelg236]

Lag for me too. Actually, I reloaded a page at 9:57 and still have nothing...

Darn.

[AdamHeard]

The silly thing is that there are less than 5000 people logging in. I wish this would be outsourced to a retailer that can handle millions of simultaneous transactions (like Amazon).

Less even, still shy of 3000 teams.

[ice.berg]

http://isitup.org/www.firstchoicebyandymark.com

- Sunny G.

.......this is never good

[Whippet]

Has anyone successfully loaded the site & seen their updated credit amount? It does seem like the server is down.

Nope. I think that we crashed the server from the traffic.

[Christopher149]

Got logged in, but then the server went down. Still down.

[scottandme]

Was working when I logged in around 11:40, nothing responding now...

[MrRiedemanJACC]

I was logged on earlier (about an hour ago) got to all the items we are wanting, opened them in new tabs so that once logged on all I had to do was add to cart for each one. Still have those tabs, but no luck in refreshing a single one or getting to the order page.

[Kevin Selavko]

For me, pages stopped loading 5 minute BEFORE 12:01

[HeyLookABurrito]

Dam this is almost as bad as the obama care site...

[peronis]

For me, pages stopped loading 5 minute BEFORE 12:01

same here

[ttldomination]

Dam this is almost as bad as the obama care site...

I was just about to post this.

#toosoon

- Sunny G.

[Bochek]

same here

me too

[JohnFogarty]

I can ping the https://www.firstchoicebyandymark.com/ IP address though... :(

[aldaeron]

Less even, still shy of 3000 teams.

Do they still off CSC 109 with Staley teaching it at SLO? This would be a better project than the Chess program from days of old.

[Jim Wilks]

Can't log in...

[waialua359]

:mad:
Have to leave. Oh well, I guess we get the scraps again.

[Travis Hoffman]

I was logged on earlier (about an hour ago) got to all the items we are wanting, opened them in new tabs so that once logged on all I had to do was add to cart for each one. Still have those tabs, but no luck in refreshing a single one or getting to the order page.

I believe the beta test results page suggested that people not have multiple tabs open for best performance, but I can't really get to the site to verify that right now. :)

[MooreteP]

I was logged on earlier (about an hour ago) got to all the items we are wanting, opened them in new tabs so that once logged on all I had to do was add to cart for each one. Still have those tabs, but no luck in refreshing a single one or getting to the order page.

Maybe AndyMark could hire Brandon to handle the traffic that should be relatively commensurate to the complaining that will commence on this thread.

[Qasim]

Northern Ontario FIRST team member here.... Been down for me ever since 11:50

[joelg236]

I did a whois and got the ip: 173.236.24.187

I can ping the ip, but not the domain (firstchoicebyandymark.com). Ugh.

[MrRiedemanJACC]

How soon before everyone that is trying FIRST Choice, then goes to Chief Delphi to find the status of FIRST Choice, then crashes their servers? :)

[jspatz1]

I was logged on earlier (about an hour ago) got to all the items we are wanting, opened them in new tabs so that once logged on all I had to do was add to cart for each one. Still have those tabs, but no luck in refreshing a single one or getting to the order page.

AndyMark's FIRST Choice "tips" warns against operating in more than one window. Confuses the session timer. You could be timed out and not know it because the timer is not synced in a different window.

Logged in and working fine prior to 11:50, then froze.

[JohnFogarty]

I wonder if the WA service provider AndyMark uses provides DDOS protection or not....or maybe our service requests are exceeding their allotted bandwidth.
Because the server they use is still up...or appears to be.

[tr6scott]

No page loades but something is out there....


Pinging www.firstchoicebyandymark.com [173.236.24.187] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=14ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=119

Ping statistics for 173.236.24.187:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 14ms, Maximum = 15ms, Average = 14ms

C:\BAT-UTIL>ping www.firstchoicebyandymark.com

Pinging www.firstchoicebyandymark.com [173.236.24.187] with 32 bytes of data:
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=15ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=14ms TTL=119
Reply from 173.236.24.187: bytes=32 time=14ms TTL=119

Ping statistics for 173.236.24.187:
Packets: Sent = 4, Received = 4, Lost = 0 (0% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
Minimum = 14ms, Maximum = 15ms, Average = 14ms

C:\BAT-UTIL>

[sanddrag]

tracert is timing out at Bright House Networks, which is an Indianapolis ISP. I clicked Login about 13 minutes ago, and it did load that page about 60 seconds ago.

[HeyLookABurrito]

Has anyone been able to get in and purchase anything yet?

[JohnFogarty]

I'm on a sprit telecom fiber connection and it's not showing as timing out, but I can't get the website to load either.

[rees2001]

Has anyone been able to get in and purchase anything yet?

get in? I have not got the page to load. couldn't get past AM main page and I tried to log in 15 minutes before 12.

[Mr. Van]

Should this go on much longer, I hope that they restart the whole thing at a later date and/or time.

Actually, a much better system would be a lottery. You have a few days to put in for the items you want, and by a random selection, you either get them or you don't. Then have a 2nd round and a third.

In fact this is the way that Regional Registration should work. Enough of this "fastest fingers/connection" stuff.

- Mr. Van
Coach, Robodox

[JohnFogarty]

Is anyone trying to load a plain text version of the site?

[nixiebunny]

I have the same problem buying Burning Man tickets.

I wish that small orgs like Andymark would rent temporary server time from some huge server farm such as AWS for these DDoS-type first-come-first-served events. It would make customers happier.

[Nirvash]

I'm really surprised the page loads are going this long without throwing an error out.



Edit: Just after I said that
Unable to load the webpage because the server sent no data.
Error code: ERR_EMPTY_RESPONSE

[DonRotolo]

Ah, foo. Hate when this happens. :rolleyes:

[joelg236]

Is anyone trying to load a plain text version of the site?

I've tried curl and wget-ing the site. Nothing yet.

[Wayne C.]

this is the best they can do?

once again disappointed...

[Mr. Rip]

Next year's FIRST Choice Beta Test will need more participants, like 2500.

Mr. Rip
Texas Torque

[ham90mack]

Is anyone trying to load a plain text version of the site?

That shouldn't make any difference. It seems the server is hung up on generating the page in the first place, not hung up on serving images.

[dlavery]

From the FRC Twitter feed (FRCteams)

Friends @andymarkinc are working with their webhost to determine and fix the issue. We'll update as we know more.

#FIRSTChoice is experiencing technical difficulties where no one has been able to access the site. We'll update as we know more.



..

[sanddrag]

this is the best they can do?

once again disappointed...Hey, at least I'm not in the middle of teaching class dealing with this.

[coachgallina]

Looks like I am not going to be able to get the 5 flux capicitors that my team needs:) ... I just ate a pound of xmas cookies in frustration waiting to log in.....

[rees2001]

I think it is time to put a fork in it. It's cooked.

I agree that the process need to be restarted at a later date with a BETTER plan. I was hoping to be done and out by now.

Put a note up on the main page and let everyone know it will start over later... in the week...working.

Can't add more rep to sanddrag

[aldaeron]

this is the best they can do?

once again disappointed...

I agree.

For an organization that has a purpose of Inspiring and Recognizing Technology, we should have a better way to get 3000 ish teams to be able to order a few parts each.

[Wayne C.]

Hey, at least I'm not in the middle of teaching class dealing with this.

yeah, great use for a saturday afternoon

[Mr. Van]

Hey, at least I'm not in the middle of teaching class dealing with this.

Right with you, Dave!

(Of course, there are other things I'd rather be doing on a Saturday...)

- Mr. Van

[MrTechCenter]

It finally just stopped loading for me and told me that the webpage is not available.

[Tungrus]

If only peeps stop pinging and other DDoS attacks ... May be the competition... OMG once again we go through this pain, may be it's all worth!

[Mr. Rip]

I got to one of the products I want to order.

Mr. Rip

[Andy Brockway]

FIRST has opened up the rest of the Virtual KOP.
http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/kit-of-parts

Gives us something else to look at!

[joelg236]

The page just timed out after waiting >20 minutes... I hope they re-do this. I have to go very soon. :(

[jspatz1]

Preview page finally loaded, approx. 25 minutes after clicking the link, so the server is functioning. I have no credits showing.

[Jim Wilks]

yeah, great use for a saturday afternoon

I'm sure I'm not alone in putting off other activities in order to be here to do this....

Frustrated again.

[JohnFogarty]

My other team's computer using Google Chrome has managed to connect to the server, but can't load the page still.

[HFCHS-NASA]

Wow I gave up a Saturday of not skiing to sit at school and try to order parts. How long to wait??????:mad:

[Whippet]

FIRST has opened up the rest of the Virtual KOP.
http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/kit-of-parts

Gives us something else to look at!

33" Drive Base kit length. Looks like we're keeping the smaller dimensions this year.

[MechEng83]

I hope it gets up and running soon. I missed going to the state FLL tournament to support one of our feeder teams for this.

[joelg236]

Just got the home page to load the title of the page, still no content.

[Mr. Rip]

I quit. I have some FLL teams to go watch. Very frustrating.

Mr. Rip
Texas Torque

[geomapguy]

yay! smaller dimensions

[MooreteP]

Hey, at least I'm not in the middle of teaching class dealing with this.

I second that emotion.

We're at the beginning of a cool winter storm here in the Northeast. I got my shopping at real storefronts done this morning.

Starting to cook up a Gumbo for dinner this evening to have the energy to shovel the pretty white stuff later tonight.

All is right with the world.

(Except for this $#%*^%$ FIRST Choice that I made too many years ago.)

[HeyLookABurrito]

33" Drive Base kit length. Looks like we're keeping the smaller dimensions this year.

where did you get this information from?

[ttldomination]

FIRST has opened up the rest of the Virtual KOP.
http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/kit-of-parts

I'm curious about the IFI voucher. More specifically, what do we get, what exactly is free, etc.

- Sunny G.

[MrRiedemanJACC]

Where are you seeing the virtual kit of parts? I don't see it on the page you mentioned....

[HeyLookABurrito]

straight off of the andymark site

"Thank you for your patience as FIRST Choice is experiencing technical difficulties."

[Whippet]

where did you get this information from?

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/kit-of-parts

[Phil Lutgen]

AndyMark just posted that they are having "Technical Difficulties".

[JohnFogarty]

My friend with a gigabit connection said the site doesn't load for him either.

[benbox1]

Well, I am on the AXIS camera page and somehow the Qty available is now 797 as 3 are on hold.

[MrRiedemanJACC]

I'm curious about the IFI voucher. More specifically, what do we get, what exactly is free, etc.

- Sunny G.

http://www.vexrobotics.com/vexpro/pdv-group.html

[Tom Ore]

It just sent me back to the login page...

[DonRotolo]

somebody is getting in, since some of the 'oh hold' quantities are nonzero

[aldaeron]

It just sent me back to the login page...

One item page did load for me and it showed "6 on hold". Dead now of course ...

[Whippet]

Well, I am on the AXIS camera page and somehow the Qty available is now 797 as 3 are on hold.

The Talon page has been loading for about twenty-seven minutes here in Texas. Still no luck getting it to work.

[Abrakadabra]

Hey - maybe it's a GAME HINT!:

"All robots will sit motionless on the field between the Autonomous and Teleoperated periods until one alliance can take it no longer and presses the big, red "RESUME" button in their alliance station, thus resuming play but costing their alliance 30 points."

<snark> Should have outsourced FIRST Choice to VexPro, right Andrew Lawrence? </snark>

[jspatz1]

somebody is getting in, since some of the 'oh hold' quantities are nonzero

You're getting pages to load? Can I come to you house? :D

[Bob Steele]

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/kit-of-parts

Interesting that there are frisbees in the "Everyone's" KOP from last year's game.
They must be trying to get rid of them..

OoPS that link was for the 2013 kit of parts... sorry I am an idiot.... they have not released the list of this year's KOP yet

[rees2001]

You're getting pages to load? Can I come to you house? :D

It will probably take you less time to get to NJ than to wait for this thing to work.

[Jim Wilks]

I'm packing this in as a lost cause.

[DonRotolo]

You're getting pages to load? Can I come to you house? :D
Well, singular at least.

Nothing more is loading though, not sure if I am even logged in anymore.

sigh.

[benbox1]

You're getting pages to load? Can I come to you house? :D

I happened to get one page to load about 10 minutes ago, but you probably don't want to come to my house unless you want to deal with kids continously screaming at you, "Has it loaded yet, Daddy?!"

[Phil Lutgen]

At this point, they should just cancel this and figure out a better way to do it. I hope FIRST is following this and makes the call soon. I feel like I am waiting to be caller 1000 on a radio station.

[seg9585]

I managed to get to 4 different parts pages, but still loading when trying to add them to cart. The cRio modules and cordless screwdriver kit each have about 1/2 dozen holds.

[Nate Laverdure]

Any troubleshooting advice for a non-working team password on the IFI site?

[Andy Brockway]

Well at least I was able to order my Vex Pro PDV stuff already. I ordered as a guest. TIMS has your voucher code.

[joelg236]

Well, singular at least.

Nothing more is loading though, not sure if I am even logged in anymore.

sigh.

Same thing here, and no, I'm not logged in anymore...

[Ken Streeter]

Ironically, I figured I'd go check out the product donation vouchers from various suppliers while waiting for the FIRST Choice site.

I got my cart all full of the items from the IFI PDV at the vexpro site, and then clicked "Place Order."

The response was a new dialog window: "There was an error processing your order. Please contact us or try again later."

I guess the vexpro site is having similar issues today, too!

[Breakaway3937]

At this point, they should just cancel this and figure out a better way to do it. I hope FIRST is following this and makes the call soon. I feel like I am waiting to be caller 1000 on a radio station.

I think at this point it would be in the best interest of all teams.

[saulwold]

How is this even remotely fair if some people are logged in and already seen 4 product pages and I have not even loaded the login page yet!

I know who said life is fair!

Sau!

[FrankJ]

Realize the cart timers will time out before you can actually buy them. They were around 2 min on Beta.

[DonRotolo]

Yep, a page loaded for me and I am not logged in anymore.

sigh.

Oddly enough, the qualtity on hold is now zero, was not before. Hmm...

[DarrinMunter]

On the bright side, I'm at work for another 5 hours, so I'll keep trying. (downside is I'm acually suppost to be working) :yikes:

[ttakashima]

Well.... At least I finished my ordering with the IFI Voucher and Inventables Voucher...

[MechEng83]

Realize the cart timers will time out before you can actually buy them. They were around 2 min on Beta.

Back when the Beta results page was available, it said they upped the timer to 10 minutes. Still wouldn't be good enough with the issues they're having.

[Mr. Van]

Um... the "Superbowl of Smarts..."

Maybe we're in the "Pentathlon of Patience"?

- Mr. Van

[jspatz1]

Well, singular at least.

Nothing more is loading though, not sure if I am even logged in anymore.

sigh.

OK I'll stay here.

For everyone's info....I was no longer logged in after a 30-minute page refresh on the preview page. Looks like the logout timer is working, and is shorter than the current refresh time.

[seg9585]

How is this even remotely fair if some people are logged in and already seen 4 product pages and I have not even loaded the login page yet!

I know who said life is fair!

Sau!

I've actually tried connecting via home wifi and LTE, so double the attempts? Don't worry I haven't been able to order squat.

[Tungrus]

"Due to unusually large number of requests your request is routed a queue. Your call is very important to us, please stay on line, your request will be served ASAP. If you refresh the browser or start a new session, you will lose your turn"

Probably this is what I would have heard...if I was on talking browser!

[DonRotolo]

"Due to unusually large number of requests your request is routed a queue. Your call is very important to us, please stay on line, your request will be served ASAP. If you refresh the browser or start a new session, you will lose your turn"

Probably this is what I would have heard...if I was on talking browser!
Yours talks? Mine is just whimpering...

[seg9585]

This is what happens when AndyMark selects LabView as their programming language of choice

[Phil Lutgen]

Just before it logged you out for timing out.

[MrTechCenter]

This is what happens when AndyMark selects LabView as their programming language of choice

What does this have to do with anything?

[FrankJ]

Why do I feel like Pavlov's dog?

[DonRotolo]

This is what happens when AndyMark selects LabView as their programming language of choice
Hey, hey! Don't diss the 'view!

[Tom Ore]

The page just changed to "The service is unavailable". Can't get login screen back.

[JohnFogarty]

I'm getting this on the firstchoicebyandymark.com page now.
The service is unavailable.

[MooreteP]

Have we set the record for comment frequency yet?

[Phil Lutgen]

This is what happens when AndyMark selects LabView as their programming language of choice

Actually, they borrowed some 386 processors from the government as they just updated to 486 architecture

[DonRotolo]

Likely a reboot. That's what i'd do.

[Wayne C.]

Its 12:30 HERE IN NJ I have been on the Andymark homepage since 11:52 and have been repeatedly tried to get into the First Choice page. It is now 12: 30

You tell me how this is either beneficial or fair to my team? We registered and paid for a kit like everyone else. Our team needs a new netbook -the only thing on the list vital to our operations. So either I sit here for god knows how long constantly trying to access this $@#$@#$@#$@# site or I cough up the cash to buy one because I am sure the big ticket items of the kit will disappear like a flash as they did last year.

So my suggestion for future "virtual kit of parts"
1. no more limited number items- if there aren't enough parts for all the teams to get one then don't offer them
2. avoid this stupid race to be first stuff. It never works- never has

I really appreciate how Andymark has made this resource available to the teams. Letting teams develop kits for their needs is the way to go. But this annual race is awful. With all the great minds in FIRST there needs to be someone with a better idea.

Its 12:43 now . Im quitting Definitely not happy. :cool:

[seg9585]

Very information, Andymark!

http://eric.segonline.net/2013/misc/unavailable.jpg

[Whippet]

The page just changed to "The service is unavailable". Can't get login screen back.

Same. I assume that FIRST Choice ordering has been postponed until later.

[Phil Lutgen]

just got a "The service is unavailable." on my screens

[JohnFogarty]

Depending on what kind of server they use only god knows how long a reboot would take.

[Tungrus]

I had enough... I am driving in Michigan now will have fun driving slowly on about 3" snow on the roads!

[MooreteP]

I calculate 120 posts in 45 minutes.
That's 160 posts per hour!

Lets shoot for 200!

Too much time on my hands.

Gonna go wrap presents or try the ACA Health care website.:)

[Bob Steele]

Santa called... someone just got moved to the naughty list...

[droswell]

Doesn't look like a reboot of the server, still responds to pings. Probably restarting apache or whatever web server they are using.

[HeyLookABurrito]

So who else has the jeopardy sound track running in the background?? :))

[Nirvash]

Can I drive my order to Andymark offices? It may be faster!

[seg9585]

Our team needs a new netbook -the only thing on the list vital to our operations.

If it's just the Classmate you're looking for, I'm sure that wont be a problem. Most veteran teams have moved on and never looked back from the dark days of the Classmate.

[FrankJ]

It seems nobody is able to order so this is not really unfair. Frustrating though. It does seem there would be a better way though.

[JohnFogarty]

My firefox browser seems to be partially loading the Login page.

[valkyrie2240]

FRCTeams twitter says: "Still working to determine the issue. We will have more information on #FIRSTChoice at 1:00 PM Eastern."

[Phil Lutgen]

Good luck everyone. Regardless of this (and last year having things removed from my cart as I was paying for them), I hope you all have a great and successful season with the kids. I missed a parade with our students and the robot for this fiasco. Cannot ever get that back, but I hope FIRST makes it right.

[MrRiedemanJACC]

@FRCTeams - Still working to determine the issue. We will have more information on #FIRSTChoice at 1:00 pm Eastern

[Clem1640]

Just a bit disappointing...

[Phil Lutgen]

So who else has the jeopardy sound track running in the background?? :))

Now it is in my head, THANKS!

[IceStorm]

Doesn't look like a reboot of the server, still responds to pings. Probably restarting apache or whatever web server they are using.

Pings could be coming from a hardware firewall or something else that sits between us and the main webserver. Not uncommon to see that where they only pass the web ports through to the server.

[MrTechCenter]

The FRC Twitter posts suggests that it'll be postponed.

[DonRotolo]

So who else has the jeopardy sound track running in the background?? :))Great. Now I can't get that out of my head. :mad:

It seems nobody is able to order so this is not really unfair. Frustrating though. It does seem there would be a better way though.Yes, it is frustrating. So are other things. Perhaps next year, it can become a lottery system (somewhat like the printers), where you place your order in the first 3 or 4 days sometime, and a decent algorithm hands out the parts best they can.

Wayne, I disagree that if they don't have enough then don't offer them. But I very much agree that this is senseless. It is not a people fault so much as a process issue - and I can solve those....

[MechEng83]

The FRC Twitter posts suggests that it'll be postponed.

I'm not sure how you conclude that from the posts of them working on the issue.

[Tom Ore]

Just got the login screen back - now stuck there

[Phil Lutgen]

I had enough... I am driving in Michigan now will have fun driving slowly on about 3" snow on the roads!

Yup. It has been cold in san diego here too! It got down to the 40s last night. We almost had ice in our garden fountains.

[Mr. Van]

Perhaps next year, it can become a lottery system (somewhat like the printers), where you place your order in the first 3 or 4 days sometime, and a decent algorithm hands out the parts best they can.
Just as I suggested. This is the way we should also do registration for regionals. It's can't be that difficult...

- Mr. Van

[MrTechCenter]

I'm not sure how you conclude that from the posts of them working on the issue.

I doubt that "more information at 1:00 Eastern" means that it will be up at 1:00, but rather they'll let everyone know when they expect it to be back up, which can be later today, or even another day entirely.

[Whippet]

Just got the login screen back - now stuck there

Same. I sincerely hope that this gets postponed with a better server.

[mrnoble]

I agree with the earlier posts that it is better to waste my Saturday (morning, in Denver) than ruin a day of teaching, which was essentially the risk I took last year. I feel philosophical rather than angry. I did get the Inventables stuff ordered, at least.

[DonRotolo]

Got a new login page just now. Entered the password and will see what happens. But at this rate, 10 minutes will not be enough. Ah well.

[sanddrag]

How much is the Inventables PDV worth?

[MooreteP]

After Einstein 2012, you'd think the bandwidth issue would have been addressed.
I'm not stating that I believe that is the problem, but......

[MechEng83]

I doubt that "more information at 1:00 Eastern" means that it will be up at 1:00, but rather they'll let everyone know when they expect it to be back up, which can be later today, or even another day entirely.

I guess I view postponed as "there will be a set time xxxx" rather than "as soon as we get it working" semantics, I suppose.

[geomapguy]

How much is the Inventables PDV worth?

$25 from Inventables
$25 from Digikey
$450 from AndyMark

EDIT: And BaneBots website says the PDV isn't ready yet. Most likely $30

[Tungrus]

2 motor controllers victor or jag, 1 vex 2 wire motor and driver plus something, all worth about $220 or so. But their coupon code is not working yet

[MooreteP]

Red alliance ready, Blue alliance ready.
3 - 2 - 1....

153 posts in 1 hour.

2.55 ppm.

Is this a record?

[Christopher149]

It's 1PM eastern. Where's the update?

[Qasim]

It's 1PM eastern. Where's the update?

BRING THE PITCH FORKS

[MrTechCenter]

2 motor controllers victor or jag, 1 vex 2 wire motor and driver plus something, all worth about $220 or so. But their coupon code is not working yet

The code worked for me but as soon as I hit "Place Order" it gave me an error message.

[team222badbrad]

It's 1PM eastern. Where's the update?

I think Twitter just crashed...



JK :p

[Ryan Dognaux]

After Einstein 2012, you'd think the bandwidth issue would have been addressed.

How is that even remotely related to what's happening with FIRST choice right now?

[Travis Hoffman]

Just spent the $450 AM PDV (thanks AndyMark!) for those who opted out of the kit chassis at the fully-functional andymark.com. Got the Talons I was looking for.

Quite happy there.

[Whippet]

My VEX coupon code was working, but VEX couldn't accept my VISA gift card as payment, and now I'm stuck with the dreaded "Coupon code "[redacted]" is not valid." Has anyone else had this problem?

[jspatz1]

The code worked for me but as soon as I hit "Place Order" it gave me an error message.

Which is what he meant by the coupon code not working. I got the same result.

[coachgallina]

I give up...You guys could have it!

[aldaeron]

My VEX coupon code was working, but VEX couldn't accept my VISA gift car as payment, and now I'm stuck with the dreaded "Coupon code "[redacted]" is not valid." Has anyone else had this problem?

Yes

[MrTechCenter]

The site loaded the log-in page all of a sudden, but I put in the login info and now we wait again...

[droswell]

Just spent the $450 AM PDV on Talons at the fully-functional andymark.com.

Quite happy there.

How'd you do that?

[jspatz1]

Just spent the $450 AM PDV on Talons at the fully-functional andymark.com.

Quite happy there.

How do you use this PDV code? Your normal AM account or is there a special team account to use this PDV?

[Tom Ore]

Just got the preview page - now trying to get to my item page

[valkyrie2240]

FRCTeams twitter says: "We are postponing the opening of #FIRSTChoice. We will post when it will open by 2:00 PM Eastern."

[MrTechCenter]

From the FRC Teams Twitter: We are postponing the opening of #FIRSTChoice. We will post when it will open by 2:00 PM Eastern.

[peronis]

vex checkout not working, first choice not working.... need to go somewhere soon.....FIRST said details coming at 1pm est and its 1:07....

edit:nvm they said something

[MechEng83]

@FRCTeams: "We are postponing the opening of #FIRSTChoice. We will post when it will open by 2:00 PM Eastern."

[Whippet]

Just got the preview page - now trying to get to my item page

Still stuck at the login screen.

[RoboTigers1796]

OPEN BY 2PM? what the heck does that mean. I have to keep refreshing until then? -__-

EDIT: Nevermind

[Bob Steele]

We apologise again for the fault in the
subtitles. Those responsible for sacking
the people who have just been sacked,
have been sacked.

[Whippet]

from @frcteams on twitter:
We are postponing the opening of #FIRSTChoice. We will post when it will open by 2:00 PM Eastern.
Hopefully it will work better next time.

[MrTechCenter]

BY 2PM? what the heck does that mean. I have to keep refreshing until then? -__-

They're announcing when it'll be up at 2PM, meaning you can take an hour long break.

[Nirvash]

'We are announcing that we will be announcing the time of the opening"

[ttldomination]

OPEN BY 2PM? what the heck does that mean. I have to keep refreshing until then? -__-
They should just state we will reopen it at 2PM..

No, I think they mean that by 2 PM, they will announce when the FC released has been postponed to.

- Sunny G.

[RoboTigers1796]

They're announcing when it'll be up at 2PM, meaning you can take an hour long break.

sorry, too worked up to even read a tweet properly

[mrnoble]

How much is the Inventables PDV worth?

$25

[MooreteP]

How is that even remotely related to what's happening with FIRST choice right now?

I meant it to be ironic.

Heavy traffic = more lost packets.
Too many of us trying to access the website.
Communication pipeline size may be an issue.
Host capacity a problem.

Someone trying to access the website with their Samsung Galaxy. :)

Bricks on the playing field.

[Mr. Van]

From what I gather, they will tell us when it will be open at 2:00 PM Eastern. NOT that it will be open at that time. Is that right? Do I have 50 minutes to go do something useful?

- Mr. Van

[ham90mack]

From what I gather, they will tell us when it will be open at 2:00 PM Eastern. NOT that it will be open at that time. Is that right? Do I have 50 minutes to go do something useful?

- Mr. Van

Correct.

[Bob Steele]

Any idea how it will be announced? Many of us don't use Twitter...
Will they announce it on the AM site?
an email would be appropriate...

R

[holygrail]

We apologise again for the fault in the
subtitles. Those responsible for sacking
the people who have just been sacked,
have been sacked.

Love this!

Frustrating Morning.

[peronis]

edit: didn't read twitter correctly

[ttldomination]

Any idea how it will be announced? Many of us don't use Twitter...
Will they announce it on the AM site?
an email would be appropriate...

R

This bugged me quite a bit. I noticed that updates were being pushed into twitter, so I had to resurrect my three-year dead account. #bahumbug.

- Sunny G.