Human Players

[AshrayGuppy]

Can human players score if next to a scoring zone? couldn't find it in the rules..

[GaryVoshol]

3.1.4
Points are awarded once per CYCLE for BALLS SCORED by ROBOTS in the GOALS, BALLS SCORED by ROBOTS over the TRUSS, and for each ROBOT CATCH.

[AshrayGuppy]

What is the primary function of human players?

[GaryVoshol]

It looks like their only function is to inbound balls
-- from the pedestal in the alliance zone
-- from the HP zone when the ball goes out of bounds without being scored

[Gabrielle3164]

Can someone help me understand how you get the balls from the pedestal to the Human Player Area? G38 and G39 leave me confused because you cannot pass the ball between the areas, nor can you walk between the areas.

G38 HUMAN PLAYERS may not pass the BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER in another HUMAN PLAYER AREA (passing the BALL within an ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA is permitted). Violation: FOUL

G39 During the MATCH, TEAMS must remain in contact with the area of the FIELD (ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA) in which they started the MATCH. Exceptions will be granted for inadvertent, momentary, and inconsequential infractions and in cases concerning safety. Violation: FOUL

[Karibou]

It looks like their only function is to inbound balls
-- from the pedestal in the alliance zone
-- from the HP zone when the ball goes out of bounds without being scored

That's what I'm seeing as well. There's no way to get the balls to the human player areas directly from the pedestal (and G36 prevents those human players from introducing the balls from the pedestal because they would be introducing it on the wrong end of the field), so their only purpose in the human player areas is inbounding balls that go out of play.

[Qcom]

Is it possible for a human player to be a part of an assist cycle? I can't seem to find anything preventing such an occurance in the rules.

[EricH]

Is it possible for a human player to be a part of an assist cycle? I can't seem to find anything preventing such an occurance in the rules.

Except that the ball would have to leave the field to do that. Intentional removal of a ball from the field would be a violation of G11.

[Bryan Herbst]

Except that the ball would have to leave the field to do that. Intentional removal of a ball from the field would be a violation of G11.

From the blue box in G11:

Passing a BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER is within gameplay and not considered a violation of G11.

[EricH]

From the blue box in G11:

Guess I should read the blue boxes, too.

[GGMarieT]

What is the main function of the human players, where does the ball end up after being thrown through the goal, and how does the ball return to the human player after being scored so the human player can return the ball into play?

[Karibou]

What is the main function of the human players, where does the ball end up after being thrown through the hoop, and how does the ball return to the human player after being scored so the human player can return the ball into play?

The balls that are returned to play after being scored must come from the pedestal. Human players may take a ball off of a lit pedestal and put it into play (also see G36). That's their main function. The human players not in the driver station inbound balls that go out of play, and can apparently be passed balls from the robots on the field.

I don't have a rule that says it, but I think it was in the broadcast that the field crew returns the balls from being scored to the pedestal. With a minimum of two balls per alliance out of play at all times after auton, having a good cycle there to ensure that there is always a ball on the pedestal should be easy.

[EricH]

What is the main function of the human players, where does the ball end up after being thrown through the hoop, and how does the ball return to the human player after being scored so the human player can return the ball into play?

Hoop? What hoop? There's a hoop on the field? Please use the proper terminology. (In this case, I believe that would be "goal".)


Please, please, please read the Manual. Pay special attention to any references to "cycle" and "pedestal".


For those that can't take the time to use Ctrl-F on the Manual (I won't express my opinion on them), the human players inbound the ball. After a ball goes through the goal, it is retrieved by field personnel (from Kickoff broadcast) and placed on the Pedestal if that is open. The ball is picked up from there by the human players and inbounded (multiple rules).

[Joseph Smith]

What's the point of the Human Players and the human player stations by the scoring end of the field? What are they there to do? I don't quite understand what they are there for.

[Coin3]

What's the point of the Human Players and the human player stations by the scoring end of the field? What are they there to do? I don't quite understand what they are there for.

One use that may be a possibility is that if for some reason two robots on the same alliance can't pass to each other efficiently, then the first robot can pass to the human player who would then pass the ball to the second robot. It seems unlikely but in Qualifying matches it may be the only way to keep up a competitive scoring rate depending on who you are paired up with.

[themccannman]

Am I interpreting this correctly?

G39 states that human players that begin the match in the human players zone may not leave that zone during the match.

2 human players must stay in the designated 2 human player zones the entire match which means that the third human player must be the one to retrieve the ball from the pedestal and pass it to a human player in a human player zone, who then passes it into the field correct?

e.g.
Ball leaves field

field personnel place ball on pedestal

the one human player not in human player zone retrieves the ball

that human player then gives the ball to another human player in the human player zone

human player in the human player zone then inbounds the ball

Is that correct?

EDIT: My bad, I didn't realize the human player zones at the alliance stations were connected to the zone the pedestal was in. Ignore the above ^

[Connerd]

Am I interpreting this correctly?

2 human players must stay in the designated 2 human player zones the entire match which means that the third human player must be the one to retrieve the ball from the pedestal and pass it to a human player in a human player zone, who then passes it into the field correct?

Nope, as according to 3.2.7 Human Actions, Rule G38:

HUMAN PLAYERS may not pass the BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER in another HUMAN PLAYER AREA (passing the BALL within an ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA is permitted).
Violation: FOUL

[FIMAlumni]

Anyone think a Human Player can bounce the ball off their own carpet and over the truss to a scoring robot, leaving 2 defensive robots and a fast 20 point cycle with only 1 robot?

[PVCpirate]

I think what people may be missing is the area behind the driver stations marked with white tape extends around the corner of the arena. So, one human player takes a ball off the pedestal, walks to one corner of the field, and inbounds the ball while staying within the legal area. The other two human players stand on the edges of the field, closer to the middle.

[ENeyman]

What is the point of the two alliance-colored rectangles dubbed the "Human Player Area"? It is my understanding that you cannot transport the balls from the pedestal to those areas without going outside of the permitted human player zones. Can someone clarify the purpose of those four rectangular areas?

[GaryVoshol]

Anyone think a Human Player can bounce the ball off their own carpet and over the truss to a scoring robot, leaving 2 defensive robots and a fast 20 point cycle with only 1 robot?

Nope - if you read the rules, you'll see that a ROBOT must score the TRUSS points.

[GaryVoshol]

NOTE: I moved some HP items into this thread.

[TheDrillKeeper]

What is the point of the two alliance-colored rectangles dubbed the "Human Player Area"? It is my understanding that you cannot transport the balls from the pedestal to those areas without going outside of the permitted human player zones. Can someone clarify the purpose of those four rectangular areas?

The game video mentioned using those players to help keep balls in the field.

[GaryVoshol]

I don't have a rule that says it, but I think it was in the broadcast that the field crew returns the balls from being scored to the pedestal. With a minimum of two balls per alliance out of play at all times after auton, having a good cycle there to ensure that there is always a ball on the pedestal should be easy.
OK, Kara, get your crew prepared! (I hope your "should be easy" proves to be true.)

See you in Escanaba.

[Joon Park]

I'm pretty sure the human players in those colored boxes are only to be used in conjunction with the rule that robots are able to throw balls to them. Because you're not required to put any human players there, I'm guessing we won't see much use of these spots, unless I'm missing something.

[Koko Ed]

What is the primary function of human players?

Basically they are in a game maintenance like they were in 2010.

[themccannman]

I'm pretty sure the human players in those colored boxes are only to be used in conjunction with the rule that robots are able to throw balls to them. Because you're not required to put any human players there, I'm guessing we won't see much use of these spots, unless I'm missing something.

This is correct, I found this very confusing at first too. The two human player zones on the opposite side of the field from their respective alliance zones are only used for bringing balls back into play after they either leave play (per G11), or are passed to them by a robot (per the G11 rule exception).

[godkane]

I have a similar question. Can a human throw the ball off your robot, which would then go over the truss or into a goal?

[brandon.cottrell]

There are 2 types of human players this year, 1 who puts a ball in play on the driver's side of the field, and 2 on opposite sides of the field who just are able to put the ball pack in place if it goes out.

[bentjeans]

Anyone think a Human Player can bounce the ball off their own carpet and over the truss to a scoring robot, leaving 2 defensive robots and a fast 20 point cycle with only 1 robot?

I don't see any rule that precludes it, but I think you'd be hard pressed to physically bounce the ball high enough to clear the truss and yet stay on the field for a bot to receive.

section 3.1.4
...A BALL is considered SCORED over the TRUSS if a ROBOT causes a BALL to...

So why would the human bother to try and bounce the ball over the truss? There's no truss point for doing so.

[alectronic]

I have a similar question. Can a human throw the ball off your robot, which would then go over the truss or into a goal?

Nope, that would mean the ROBOT would not be causing the BALL to pass, the human would.

A BALL is considered SCORED over the TRUSS if a ROBOT causes a BALL to pass though the infinitely tall plane that is bounded by the top of the TRUSS and the TRUSS POLES toward the ALLIANCE’S GOALS

[PAR_WIG1350]

I have a similar question. Can a human throw the ball off your robot, which would then go over the truss or into a goal?

This might be worth asking in Q&A.

[ninjosh97]

According to the blue box in G11, the ROBOT can pass the ball to the human player.
This could be useful...

1. If a robot doesn't have a ground pickup, and you want to "assist" it.

2. If the ball handling robot is pinned, it could pass to the human player who could chuck it to another robot.

I don't think there are any regulations as to how far the human player can throw... so might also be an effective way of getting the ball across the field fast.

[kenjifujita17]

According to the blue box in G11, the ROBOT can pass the ball to the human player.
This could be useful...

1. If a robot doesn't have a ground pickup, and you want to "assist" it.

2. If the ball handling robot is pinned, it could pass to the human player who could chuck it to another robot.

I don't think there are any regulations as to how far the human player can throw... so might also be an effective way of getting the ball across the field fast.

G36
A BALL inbounded after retrieval from the PEDESTAL must first contact a ROBOT or the carpet on its DRIVERS’ end of the FIELD before crossing beyond the TRUSS.

Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL

I didn't see any other throwing limitations

[kenjifujita17]

Can someone help me understand how you get the balls from the pedestal to the Human Player Area? G38 and G39 leave me confused because you cannot pass the ball between the areas, nor can you walk between the areas.

G38 HUMAN PLAYERS may not pass the BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER in another HUMAN PLAYER AREA (passing the BALL within an ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA is permitted). Violation: FOUL

G39 During the MATCH, TEAMS must remain in contact with the area of the FIELD (ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA) in which they started the MATCH. Exceptions will be granted for inadvertent, momentary, and inconsequential infractions and in cases concerning safety. Violation: FOUL

Only one human player may inbound balls from the pedestal by staying within the taped boundaries of their alliance zone. The other two human players only throw the balls that went out of bounds back in if the ball had not been scored.

[Karibou]

Only one human player may inbound balls from the pedestal by staying within the taped boundaries of their alliance zone. The other two human players only throw the balls that went out of bounds back in if the ball had not been scored.
(Emphasis mine)

Is there a rule that actually specifies the distribution of human players on the field? As far as I can tell, it only says where they may stand, not where they must stand. You could have two players in the alliance station and one in one of the human player zones (maybe not advisable, but possible).

...unless I missed something, which is entirely possible.

[Hallry]

As far as I can tell, it only says where they may stand, not where they must stand. You could have two players in the alliance station and one in one of the human player zones (maybe not advisable, but possible).

It sounds to me like the human players may stand in either of their zones or the alliance station. But of course, whichever zone they choose to stand it, they must remain for the entirety of the match. Otherwise, what would be the point of the parenthesis of G38:

G38 HUMAN PLAYERS may not pass the BALL to a HUMAN PLAYER in another HUMAN PLAYER AREA (passing the BALL within an ALLIANCE STATION or HUMAN PLAYER AREA is permitted). Violation: FOUL

(Emphasis mine)