Aerial Assist Strategy

[thegem811]

Hey Chief Delphi,
Our team is wondering what other teams' strategies are for Aerial Assist. The game this year requires a lot of cooperation, and knowing strategies that can be compatible with others can help teams be more successful in their competitions.

[Justin Shelley]

Three Robots Per Alliance

1) Inbounds from human player and passes to robot 2. Also can play defense if needed.

2) Retrieves from #1 and tosses over truss. Can also high score if needed.

3 Catches ball from #2 and scores into high goal with a large "sweet spot"

In Autonomus

#3 scores 2 balls in auto, their ball and #1 ball
#1 scores 1 ball

Must have great drivetrain!

[Jibri Wright]

One my team was looking at was just to outscore the other alliance in autonomous then just send two robots two defend the other team while one robot just takes the ball and shoot into high goal making cycles solo. I think this strategy could easily win a lot of qualification matches, maybe not elims. We probably won't even attempt this strategy though cause it kinda takes the "assist" out of aerial assist.

[cadandcookies]

Flexibility and control.

We planned our robot's roles with different partners and prioritized based on that. Key was being able to make quick assists and play around our alliance partners' robots-- being able to receive easily from human player, being able to transfer the ball quickly and in a controlled manner.

Overall strategy: Win.

[RyanCahoon]

one robot just takes the ball and shoot into high goal making cycles solo. I think this strategy could easily win a lot of qualification matches

It may win a lot of matches, but may not seed you as high as you like, since the second ranking criterion is cumulative assist points.

[Jibri Wright]

It may win a lot of matches, but may not seed you as high as you like, since the second ranking criterion is cumulative assist points.

There is that, but we considered that less of an issue since you'll win almost all of your matches. Definitely enough to get you in the top ten. Then again your team may go to 'harder' regionals than we do so it may not be that viable an option for every regional. Even so, with experience from the regionals we go to, being 8-2 is enough to get you in the top 6.

[Canon reeves]

We are going to try to focus on defense and feeding quickly, this way we do rely on our partners quite heavily, but all that matters is that you are viable in eliminations to be picked as a partner. We figured since there are 49 teams at our regional, and 36 go to eliminations, we could do better if we just focused on our one thing or two things and did them well.

[Alan Anderson]

...36 go to eliminations...

How do you come up with that number?

[JohnFogarty]

People are thinking that alliances are always 4 teams.

[mott]

People are thinking that alliances are always 4 teams.

8 x 4 = 36??

[Steven Donow]

8 x 4 = 36??

Alliances are only 4 teams at Championship.

[bscharles]

8 x 4 = 36??

Regional competitions are still setup with the 3-team alliances in eliminations. It's only at championships that elimination alliances will have 4 teams.

[Walter Deitzler]

8 x 4 = 36??

I think that what he is trying to say here is that 8x4 is not 36, but 32.

[mott]

I think that what he is trying to say here is that 8x4 is not 36, but 32.

Correct!

So, Alan's question still stands... How do you come up with 36 teams going to elims???

[Xavbro]

I'm thinking of making a playbook like for basketball or football with set plays for the different types of alliance set ups. I'm a visual learner so having drawing of what each robot should do during the match I feel would make it easier for each team to know and see before the match. The ideal strategy to me is what Justin said at first but with a slight change:


1) Inbounds from human player and passes to robot 2. Also can play defense if needed.

2) Retrieves from #1 and tosses over truss. Can also high score if needed. Set screen/pick/block for robot 3.

3) Catches ball from #2 and scores into high goal with a large "sweet spot"


I also would have robot 1 toss it over the truss and have robot 2 or 3 catch it. I feel having robots in your scoring zone helps minimize defense on your primary scorer as one can block/screen/pick the defense to give space for the scorer to score.

Of course if the scorer can score with little to no problem with the defense on them, then yes, having a 2nd robot playing defense is definitely a better option.

[rsegrest]

...Even so, with experience from the regionals we go to, being 8-2 is enough to get you in the top 6.

Wow...not at ours. 8-2 may get you in the top 15...top 6? For ours that's more like 9-1 minimum...

[pntbll1313]

Wow...not at ours. 8-2 may get you in the top 15...top 6? For ours that's more like 9-1 minimum...

8-2 is a very good record and should get you in the top 8 at just about any regional. I challenge you to find one where it didn't get you in the top 12 or so (still a likely captain)...

For example at Lone Star where you compete 8-2 would have ranked you 5th last year.
reference: http://www.thebluealliance.com/event/2013txho rankings

[XaulZan11]

8-2 is a very good record and should get you in the top 8 at just about any regional. I challenge you to find one where it didn't get you in the top 12 or so (still a likely captain)...

For example at Lone Star where you compete 8-2 would have ranked you 5th last year.
reference: http://www.thebluealliance.com/event/2013txho rankings

Indeed. Here are the records of the 6th seeds at Lone Start since 2007.
2013: 7-2-1
2012: 7-3
2011: 8-2
2010: Win/Loss not recorded
2009: 6-1
2008: 6-3-1
2007: 7-2

[Caleb Sykes]

Wow...not at ours. 8-2 may get you in the top 15...top 6? For ours that's more like 9-1 minimum...

Here are the seeding results from the Lone Star Regional last year:


rank team QS AP CP TP Record DQ Played
1 118 18.00 228.00 110.00 397.00 9-1-0 0 10
2 1477 18.00 178.00 160.00 237.00 9-1-0 0 10
3 57 18.00 134.00 200.00 246.00 9-1-0 0 10
4 148 16.00 168.00 140.00 323.00 8-2-0 0 10
5 624 16.00 158.00 160.00 269.00 8-2-0 0 10
6 4587 15.00 90.00 230.00 102.00 7-2-1 0 10
7 3741 14.00 196.00 60.00 177.00 7-3-0 0 10
8 4328 14.00 162.00 100.00 233.00 7-3-0 0 10
9 231 14.00 152.00 140.00 292.00 7-3-0 0 10
10 704 14.00 142.00 140.00 197.00 7-3-0 0 10
11 3961 14.00 102.00 110.00 180.00 7-3-0 0 10
12 441 14.00 94.00 80.00 169.00 7-3-0 0 10
13 2582 14.00 86.00 340.00 99.00 7-3-0 0 10
14 2438 14.00 74.00 140.00 153.00 7-3-0 0 10
15 2587 12.00 206.00 90.00 375.00 6-4-0 0 10

Lone Star certainly had some ridiculously good teams attending, but even 624 and 148 only went 8-2. Were you referring to a different regional? TBA says your team only attended this one. Or perhaps were you referring to 2012, which does not correlate to this year because the coopertition bridge played some havoc with the seeding.

EDIT: avoiding double post

[chrisfl]

Our strategy is to be amazing. I've already said too much:yikes:

[rsegrest]

I humbly stand corrected. :o

When you play with the big dogs sometimes you forget that they lose a match (or two) more than you realize. :)

[TheMadCADer]

I also would have robot 1 toss it over the truss and have robot 2 or 3 catch it. I feel having robots in your scoring zone helps minimize defense on your primary scorer as one can block/screen/pick the defense to give space for the scorer to score.

I've been thinking about this a bit, and I think it will probably be best to have as many ball exchanges on the "starting" side of the Truss as possible. My reasoning is that a team playing defense will use the most obvious strategy possible to prevent scoring rather than the most optimal, and that is messing with the thing putting the ball in the goal. They will then sit on your "scoring" side of the Truss and interfere with you once the ball enters the zone. This would make a ball hand-off more problematic in that area of the field.

I'd have my last robot in the cycle enter the Red/Blue scoring zone only to shoot (with escort if needed), and then quickly withdraw, only hanging around if they need to play defense.

[Xavbro]

I've been thinking about this a bit, and I think it will probably be best to have as many ball exchanges on the "starting" side of the Truss as possible. My reasoning is that a team playing defense will use the most obvious strategy possible to prevent scoring rather than the most optimal, and that is messing with the thing putting the ball in the goal. They will then sit on your "scoring" side of the Truss and interfere with you once the ball enters the zone. This would make a ball hand-off more problematic in that area of the field.

I'd have my last robot in the cycle enter the Red/Blue scoring zone only to shoot (with escort if needed), and then quickly withdraw, only hanging around if they need to play defense.

Good point. I can definitely see that happening in a match. Minimizing time in the scoring zone is a valid strategy. My approach was that the scorer could slow down the other alliance while waiting to receive the ball.

Overall I think the strategy for the game will develop more after regionals have been played (as usual). I do enjoy watching week 1 events and seeing teams develop strategies as the even progresses.

[Justin Shelley]

I feel that defense will be better played by keeping the ball from getting to the shooter because a good shooter with a sweet spot will be hard to defend, but keeping the ball from ever getting there would be much easier!

[Citrus Dad]

Are teams building robots to catch truss shots? Are they building robots that can accurately range to another robot to catch the ball?

[Canon reeves]

Are teams building robots to catch truss shots? Are they building robots that can accurately range to another robot to catch the ball?

We are trying, we plan on lining up on the x axis then just driving back and forth to catch it because we are extending. So sorry about my confusion earlier! I have no idea how I came up with that, I had thought there were 4 in an alliance:o

[JesseK]

For the first time (against my better judgement at first), we have built a robot that does everything. The higher priorities are 100% effective & reliable, and the lower are >75% effective. The game will be too dynamic to have any single strategy.

General multi-assist formations:
"Flying V with a Moon Walk"
"Multi-bot Choo Choo"
"Stack / Cut / Strike"
"Honestly, why can't you just roll it to me?"

There are even little things to help improve specific opportunities like
"shoot from the outer part of the field inward so it knocks an opponent's balls off of their podium & potentially delays the start of their next cycle, or at least makes the HP play our game of dodgeball" (unverified since we don't have an actual field setup to practice with)
or
"Get into a pushing match with the intent of pushing a robot towards its high goal"
or
"Block the in-bounder, not the ball"