BETA 2015?

[Tottanka]

Hi,
I remember last year, this was the time for application for beta testing, and i dont recall anything about it this year.

Does anyone know if the applications are open yet? or when will they be?

Thanks

[Ben Wolsieffer]

This is the link to the beta testing application: https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/JLTYSGS

This is from the flyer that was handed out at the Championship.

[Alpha Beta]

Will this be the week the Beta test teams will be announced? Comments on the FRC blog (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/blog-2015-Control-System-KOP-Survey) indicate we should know by the end of June, with testing to start in July. Anxious for everyone to get started and report back their findings. Good luck to everyone hoping to be on the list.

[Joe Ross]

Will this be the week the Beta test teams will be announced? Comments on the FRC blog (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/blog-2015-Control-System-KOP-Survey) indicate we should know by the end of June, with testing to start in July.

Per the NI FRC community today, the list will be released early next week. https://decibel.ni.com/content/docs/DOC-30419#comment-35876

[Alpha Beta]

Got an e-mail today informing us that we were not selected for the Beta test group.

Should see the list of who did make the cut soon.

[Tottanka]

Got an e-mail today informing us that we were not selected for the Beta test group.

Should see the list of who did make the cut soon.

same here.

[Michael Blake]

We're in for C++... 4 years in a row.

NEW roboRIO hardware should be in our shop sometime in August... expect authorized/allowed CD postings from James Killian.

--Michael Blake

[Jacob Bendicksen]

1540's in for Java - we're excited and ready!

[tyler34]

I didn't receive an e-mail at all...

[Ben Wolsieffer]

We didn't make it either.

[Alan Anderson]

The TechnoKats are selected as a 2015 beta team! I'm almost overwhelmed by the enthusiastic response I got from the students when I told them.

The email does not specify a language. Our application emphasized our experience with LabVIEW, so I'm expecting that's what we will be using.

[JohnFogarty]

4901 got in for Java I believe. The email didn't specify language. Exciting times are soon to be had.

[RyanShoff]

Didn't get in.

[Akash Rastogi]

Looks like 11 will be Beta Testing.

https://www.facebook.com/MORTteam11/posts/812091278809316

Saw 1114 post as well.

[Boe]

Looks like 11 will be Beta Testing.

https://www.facebook.com/MORTteam11/posts/812091278809316

Saw 1114 post as well.

148 also posted that they were selected.

[theawesome1730]

We're in too. A little surprised, but still very eager to test some new kit!

[ykarkason]

3316 D-Bug from Israel will also be participating in the Beta test!

[waialua359]

359 also selected for Beta Testing.

[GuyM142]

Is there an official list posted somewhere?

[tr6scott]

TORC was selected too!
No language was given, but we said we could do C++ and Labview.
I also stated that we are not what you would call strong in either programming language, but we could give vital feedback on documentation and implementation from a rookie, tier 2 caliber team perspective.

We also had a good response from the team on the news!

[Wendy Holladay]

in

[Chris Fultz]

Cyber Blue is in.

[tim-tim]

836 is in as well.

[coalhot]

Blog post! (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/2015-FRC-Control-System-Beta-Test-Teams)

[MrRoboSteve]

3081 wasn't selected, but that's not surprising given the competition this year.

Congrats to the two MN teams selected -- 2177 Robettes and 3130 E.R.R.O.R. I'm sure they'll do a great job of testing and training the other MN teams on the updated control system.

[nathannfm]

Blog post! (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/2015-FRC-Control-System-Beta-Test-Teams)

Rather surprising that there was only 1 MAR team selected and that they are on the very northern edge of the region.

[Bob Steele]

Skunk Works was honored to be selected for Beta testing along with our friends 488, 1540 and 1425 from the PNW. We hope to help usher in a new controller to the Region and FRC. Anxious to get started...

[Boe]

Congrats to everyone who was selected. Happy to see our shop partners 3130 get chosen as one of the teams.

[Alpha Beta]

The email does not specify a language. Our application emphasized our experience with LabVIEW, so I'm expecting that's what we will be using.

TORC was selected too!
No language was given, but we said we could do C++ and Labview.

Blog post! (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/2015-FRC-Control-System-Beta-Test-Teams)

For those of you wondering what language you are responsible for. The blog post links to a map that has that information. You can filter by language too if you just want to see those teams.

Edit: Map appears to by U.S. teams only.

[Jon Stratis]

2177 is happy to continue working with the control system, moving from Alpha to Beta.

This summer we're working with our friends on 1816 on a joint project, implementing a swerve drive robot with the new control system (and, incidentally, trying to make it into a software library that can be used by other teams as well!). I guess you could say we can't just sit around and wait until the official Beta tasks are set out for us :)

[nstephenh]

Team 900 (The Zebracorns) from Durham, North Carolina, is part of the beta, and we are looking forward to experimenting with the new system and sharing our results.

[cgmv123]

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1391883

[sergioCorral842]

842 is honored to have been chosen to be beta testers. It also looks like we are the only team from Arizona.

[E Dawg]

159 is looking forward to testing with C++.

[MattInAHat]

3620 is eager to jump in with Java.

[Libby K]

Rather surprising that there was only 1 MAR team selected and that they are on the very northern edge of the region.

This is definitely a little confusing. MORT is absolutely a role model team in the region, and I know they'll do an excellent job of sharing their findings, but MAR isn't exactly tiny, and it'll be tough for them to get their experiences out to the teams in southern NJ/Eastern PA/Delaware without some serious travel and $ pitched in. For comparison-- If I counted right, there are 7 Michigan teams & 5 New England teams.

Hopefully MAR-the-corporation puts in some effort/resources to help get information to all the region's teams, so that the burden doesn't entirely fall on Team 11. Also crossing my fingers that fall off-seasons will allow MORT to come and share their experience at the events as 25 did during their time as a beta tester way-back-when.

I know it'd be tough for us to get up there to MORT's school pre-kickoff for the required seminar-event, and we're not even that far away as compared to other teams. Definitely seeing the need for online and at-event sharing with only one region team testing.

[techtiger1]

I really never understood how FIRST determines who the BETA test teams are. Not saying they make bad choices, just saying the process is a little fuzzy. ::rtm::

[MoistRobot]

Team 832 OSCAR eagerly anticipates being able to share their Labview beta experience with other Georgia teams!

[Dancin103]

This is definitely a little confusing. MORT is absolutely a role model team in the region, and I know they'll do an excellent job of sharing their findings, but MAR isn't exactly tiny, and it'll be tough for them to get their experiences out to the teams in southern NJ/Eastern PA/Delaware without some serious travel and $ pitched in. For comparison-- If I counted right, there are 7 Michigan teams & 5 New England teams.

Hopefully MAR-the-corporation puts in some effort/resources to help get information to all the region's teams, so that the burden doesn't entirely fall on Team 11. Also crossing my fingers that fall off-seasons will allow MORT to come and share their experience at the events as 25 did during their time as a beta tester way-back-when.

I know it'd be tough for us to get up there to MORT's school pre-kickoff for the required seminar-event, and we're not even that far away as compared to other teams. Definitely seeing the need for online and at-event sharing with only one region team testing.

I definitely agree here, very strange that there was only 1 MAR team selected as there are many very competent teams in our region of doing this, I would have expected at least 3 (1 for each state). That being said I know when we did the beta test a few years back we demonstrated it at all the off season competitions we went to in the fall, I'm hoping they will be able to do the same. MORT is a great team and will do this very well, just wish there were more testing in our area.

[Jimmy Nichols]

I third this. Out here in the Midwest only 1 Ohio team was chosen and 3 Indiana teams.

[cgmv123]

I really never understood how FIRST determines who the BETA test teams are. Not saying they make bad choices, just saying the process is a little fuzzy. ::rtm::

They want a selection of teams that is representative of all of FIRST. Some "elite" teams, some "average" teams and some "lower-level" teams.

[Dancin103]

They want a selection of teams that is representative of all of FIRST. Some "elite" teams, some "average" teams and some "lower-level" teams.

But even if you make this argument, there is still all those different calibers of teams in each of those different regions.

[Link07]

I definitely agree here, very strange that there was only 1 MAR team selected as there are many very competent teams in our region of doing this, I would have expected at least 3 (1 for each state). That being said I know when we did the beta test a few years back we demonstrated it at all the off season competitions we went to in the fall, I'm hoping they will be able to do the same.

I also voice these concerns. In my mind there are a lot of other teams that probably would have made more sense. Interested to see how this plays out

[Jon Stratis]

I really never understood how FIRST determines who the BETA test teams are. Not saying they make bad choices, just saying the process is a little fuzzy. ::rtm::

From what I understand, FIRST looks at a number of criteria.

First, they only consider teams that apply for it. As the blog said, "more than" 200 teams applied, which to me says less than 250... and FIRST selected 90 teams. That's a pretty large percentage - probably somewhere around 40% of applicants.

Next, they look at languages. With 90 teams selected, they probably have 30 for each language (at least in the past they've balanced the number for each language, and that's what they did for Alpha Testing).

Next, they look at geography. Based on the teams selected, they want to try to go for a wide geographical distribution, and they want to hit the areas that are geographically dense with teams. It may not be possible, as you may not have any teams apply from a given state or region.

Taking all of that into consideration, they might select two teams from the same city (like St. Paul) who do different languages (like 2177 and 3130), in a densely populated region (like the 180+ teams in Minnesota). At the same time, another team in that same area might be rejected because they use the same language as a team that was accepted.

All of that is pretty much guaranteed - the Beta Test program wouldn't accomplish their goals without considering those items.

The rest is speculation. There's a lot of data that FIRST can consider, but I don't know if they do or not. If a team has been a Beta/Alpha tester in the past, it could affect the results either way (you may want them involved again if they did a good job, or you may want to give another team the opportunity this year. For example, I believe, but haven't verified, that all of the Alpha teams have become Beta teams, and I know that my team has been a Beta or Alpha team every year for the past 4-5 years or so). FIRST may look for recommendations from the RD's for an area, on the assumption that the RD's would have an idea of which teams in an area would do better, with both the testing and outreach portions. FIRST may look at past regional results - consistent on-field performance could be an indication as to a team's technical success, while awards could be an indication of a team's ability to successfully communicate or interact with the FIRST community. It's not a perfect metric, to be sure, but we can all picture teams from our regionals who always seem to have technical issues with their robots, or who don't interact with other teams very well. Again, that's all speculation, but any of it could play a part.

[Akash Rastogi]

I also voice these concerns. In my mind there are a lot of other teams that probably would have made more sense. Interested to see how this plays out

I don't speak on behalf of 11 or 193, but as an alum who has seen how hard David Bodmer and his crew work to attend other events and create resources for other teams, I am sure the students and mentors will work even harder to ensure the proper information is presented to all teams within MAR to the best of their ability, especially with the added stress of being the only team Beta Testing in the area.

Admittedly, I was surprised only 1 MAR team was selected as well. But I was also surprised to see both 340 and 1511 selected, as they are both from Rochester. Guess it depends which language each team is doing.

[thatprogrammer]

4592 was selected! C++ baby!

[MattInAHat]

...some "average" teams...
Hehehe.


Also just worth noting since it keeps coming up.
The 7 teams in Michigan are all relatively close together--within an hour of each other near Detroit; Save for the outlier of team 3620 in the Southwestern side. I'll be interested in seeing how teams in the upper peninsula adapt to the change, or if any of the teams from under the bridge can make it up to some offseason events up there.

[aryker]

Team 868 is in for beta testing.

[waialua359]

Part of the considerations for our team were at least based on a couple of things.
368 pointed out that our Control Systems person is a CSA.
The other was input given on behalf of our team and others in Hawaii from our Regional Director, when he was asked by FIRST.

[Karthik]

They want a selection of teams that is representative of all of FIRST. Some "elite" teams, some "average" teams and some "lower-level" teams.

Do you have a source for this? I don't recall this criteria being listed in any documents over the years.

[Joe Ross]

I definitely agree here, very strange that there was only 1 MAR team selected as there are many very competent teams in our region of doing this, I would have expected at least 3 (1 for each state).

How many MAR teams applied? Last year's beta test only had barely more applicants then number of teams accepted, and 11 was the only MAR team. Maybe that means MAR teams aren't interested in beta testing?

[Libby K]

How many MAR teams applied? Last year's beta test only had barely more applicants then number of teams accepted, and 11 was the only MAR team. Maybe that means MAR teams aren't interested in beta testing?

I can't speak for other MAR teams but 1923 did apply. So there were at least two.

[Link07]

How many MAR teams applied? Last year's beta test only had barely more applicants then number of teams accepted, and 11 was the only MAR team. Maybe that means MAR teams aren't interested in beta testing?

IIRC, Team 2600 and Team 4454 were also beta testers last year

[Pratik Kunapuli]

How many MAR teams applied? Last year's beta test only had barely more applicants then number of teams accepted, and 11 was the only MAR team. Maybe that means MAR teams aren't interested in beta testing?

341 applied and was not selected.

[NWChen]

Have the languages been removed from the map? I recall them being there this morning.

[Ben Martin]

How many MAR teams applied? Last year's beta test only had barely more applicants then number of teams accepted, and 11 was the only MAR team. Maybe that means MAR teams aren't interested in beta testing?

We did not apply. Not a great year for this for us, with 35% of our students graduating, including our expert in this area.

[MattInAHat]

Have the languages been removed from the map? I recall them being there this morning.

Yup, they were there earlier but aren't now.
I also can't find Cheezy Poofs on the map.

[Tom Bottiglieri]

254 and 971 have been accepted as a joint application.

[Anupam Goli]

I really never understood how FIRST determines who the BETA test teams are. Not saying they make bad choices, just saying the process is a little fuzzy. ::rtm::

It seems like many of the teams chosen have strong track records, indicated by chairman's awards, EI, Rookie inspiration, and/or Rookie all star awards. If I was FIRST, I'd choose teams with strong track records, but at the same time, saying "We’re grateful for your interest and commitment to FIRST, and we hope that you don’t infer this to be a reflection on your team’s strength." may not be entirely truthful. However, being rejected this time around for the beta test motivates me to do better this upcoming year on the field and off the field. Congrats to all of the teams selected to participate in the beta test, and good luck!

[cgmv123]

Do you have a source for this? I don't recall this criteria being listed in any documents over the years.

This was stated at the info panel for the new control system at Championship.

[coalhot]

IIRC, Team 2600 and Team 4454 were also beta testers last year

As far as I know, we applied and didn't get it this year.

Congrats to all the teams that got in!

[Ernst]

Team 1732 is excited to get to help test the new control system. Time to start putting together a Beta Test Blog and some resource pages.

It's a shame that we won't have the new system in time to bring it to some midsummer events like IRI and R2OC.

Is there any way to check what language teams plan to use? I'm pretty sure that the map used to have that information and showed us as LabView and 5148- NB Blitz, our closest Beta Test neighbors, as C++.

[Joe Ross]

Is there any way to check what language teams plan to use? I'm pretty sure that the map used to have that information and showed us as LabView and 5148- NB Blitz, our closest Beta Test neighbors, as C++.

It still shows the language for me. If you look at the list view, it's more convient. https://www.google.com/fusiontables/DataSource?docid=1HL0g3UtkeI4FhsP41izV_TIJ0-t_Fwazy_ROOsMo#rows:id=1

[Jon Stratis]

I think the languages were removed when they changed it to include all Beta teams, not just US ones. The original link was (based on this thread (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=129950)from this morning):
https://www.google.com/fusiontables/DataSource?docid=1HL0g3UtkeI4FhsP41izV_TIJ0-t_Fwazy_ROOsMo#map:id=3

The current link (as of the time of this post) in the blog is:
https://www.google.com/fusiontables/DataSource?docid=1fwolBEkwgn5Mn-kxomQWrt23qAb4FxSNoJN-0xvT#map:id=3

[Michael Hill]

Small request, can we put all data from beta teams in 1 thread and update the first post with links to beta team findings? Please?

[Lil' Lavery]

I know we're still spoiled compared to many parts of the FRC world, but no beta team around Philadelphia really kinda sucks.

[E Dawg]

Does anyone know if we will receive the 2015 IDE's with the control system? Or will we have to use the ones from last season?

[Jon Stratis]

I would assume you'll be using the new IDE's... we did for Alpha testing, and they have all the instructions ready on Screen Step Live for it. I can't see them going backwards for beta testing.

[PayneTrain]

I know we're still spoiled compared to many parts of the FRC world, but no beta team around Philadelphia really kinda sucks.

What I find to be really silly in the case of the MAR area is that there are around half a dozen offseasons you could demo the control system at in an informal but constructive enviornment, but they have put the burden of doing that on 1 team. I guess education about the new system through the beta either a) isn't as important as I percieved initially, b) they seriously are entrusting MORT to cover a 120+ team area all by themselves (not a dig at 11), or c) beta education just is important but fitting into whatever requirments FIRST specified for testing narrowly beat it out, and MAR is supposed to deal with it.

Meanwhile in Virginia we have 3 teams in the state selected for the program and only two unique offseason events and (I believe) only one group of open workshops so I guess I don't know what's happening but I imagine I'm not alone in that regard.

[Kevin Selavko]

3260, SHARP, as well as our next door neighbors 3504, Girls of Steel, will both be beta testing in Java, although it appears that our team is not on the map. Both of our alliance partners from Pittsburgh, the RoboBees and Westytek, also have gotten the chance to be beta testers.

[tim-tim]

Barring some unforeseen circumstance, we will have the Beta Test bit at Duel on the Delaware. Last year we traveled to 4 states and DC to showcase the new control system during our alpha testing phase.

That's at least one event in MAR that MORT won't have to worry about.

[Joe Ross]

3260, SHARP, as well as our next door neighbors 3504, Girls of Steel, will both be beta testing in Java, although it appears that our team is not on the map.

It's because both are listed as Pittsburgh. Both are there, but 3504 is hiding 3260. The same thing occurs in Rochester, NYC, Seattle, and San Jose.

[AllenGregoryIV]

We applied and didn't get selected but 118 and 1477 did and we see them pretty regularly so not a big deal for us.

Hopefully we will see a lot of useful code published before kickoff. The more we have to work with the better.

[magnets]

Is there a collection of websites/teams that will be updating with information, code, pictures, or video of the new system?

Also, are there any alpha teams that have information out there? I've tried going down the list, but haven't found any yet.

[MattInAHat]

Is there a collection of websites/teams that will be updating with information, code, pictures, or video of the new system?

Also, are there any alpha teams that have information out there? I've tried going down the list, but haven't found any yet.

Look here: http://www.fightingpi.org/Resources/Controls/Alpha/Alpha.shtml
The Fighting Pi were in the Alpha and they presented at CMP and MSC. They have a number of resources available on their website.

[mman1506]

Is there a collection of websites/teams that will be updating with information, code, pictures, or video of the new system?

Also, are there any alpha teams that have information out there? I've tried going down the list, but haven't found any yet.

Fighting pi (http://www.fightingpi.org/Resources/Controls/Alpha/Alpha.shtml)and Robo bees (https://www.flickr.com/photos/robobees836/sets/72157637269209674/) have some

[Mr. B.]

After reading through this thread last night and seeing some posts about 11 & the issues with there being only 1 MAR team selected for the 2015 Beta Testing program, I wanted to take a moment this morning to share my thoughts with the MAR - FRC Community.

1. Thank you to FRC 836 - The Robobees for offering to help us cover the Duel on the Delaware event later this year. Your support and offering to assist us is greatly appreciated!

2. As things appear now with us being the only MAR team selected for this Beta Testing program with FIRST, FRC 11 will do it's best to share, present and assist teams with understanding the new control system. Our team has and always will have an open door policy when it comes to helping support our friends in MAR/FIRST and this situation is no different.

3. I have been in contact with our Beta Testing development team since the announcement was made and are currently developing our plan as to how we can effectively share this knowledge to the MAR community over the coming months. At this time I can say for sure that we will be attending the November 1st Ramp Riot Event hosted by FRC 341 - Miss Daisy and will look to see about providing a presentation at that event with their permission.

4. As I work with our team in the coming weeks to develop a plan as to how and when we can share this information, I will be sure to communicate our intentions with the MAR Board so they can share the information out to the teams in a timely and effective manner and teams can plan their schedules around attending one of our sessions. Stay tuned!

If there are any direct questions any of you have of myself or FRC 11 - MORT, please don't hesitate to email me at dbodmer@mort11.org. Your support of our efforts is and will be greatly appreciated.

Mr. B.