led strips

[dradel]

wanted to get a quick poll from you guys.
we have led lightstrips we used on last years robot, we cut them into the lengths we wanted. now i know they are no longer cots, but they serve no purpose other than editing light. with that said is it against the rules, or not in the spirt of first to reuse them this year? there are multiple trains of thought on this.

[weaversam8]

You are correct, the LED strips count as a FABRICATED ITEM because they were modified. The 2015 Game Manual States:

FABRICATED ITEMS from ROBOTS entered in previous FIRST competitions may not be used on ROBOTS in the 2015 FRC (other than those allowed per R12-C).

R12-C states an exception:

FABRICATED items consisting of one COTS electrical device (e.g. a motor or motor controller), connectors, and any materials used to secure and insulate those connectors.

The LED strips were COTS when purchased, and they are an electrical item, although I am unsure if this exception covers them. You may wish to take this to Q&A.

[dradel]

What if the vendor andymark in this case is no longer carrying the item (led light strip )

[Redo91]

The best place for an answer to this question would be the Q&A (https://frc-qa.usfirst.org/Questions.php).

[Nebster]

I know this is technically not following the rules exactly, but I would feel free to use them. Inspectors aren't going to care whether or not the LED strips got cut down last season or not, they're just light and serve no purpose other than that. If FIRST actually does enforce this rule down to the single little LED strips, then that would just be costing teams a lot of money that doesn't need to be spent.

[Christopher149]

I know this is technically not following the rules exactly, but I would feel free to use them. Inspectors aren't going to care whether or not the LED strips got cut down last season or not, they're just light and serve no purpose other than that. If FIRST actually does enforce this rule down to the single little LED strips, then that would just be costing teams a lot of money that doesn't need to be spent.

To expand on that: we're an old team and subsequently have a lot of old parts. If I take a piece of 80/20 that has a couple holes in it and has been cut to some length (no longer COTS), but then make another cut and drill some more holes, is it okay or not? Our team has taken the position that this is okay, because it is material that was COTS at one point, but none of the previous fabrication was beneficial to this year. And if FIRST wants to promote recycling, this kind of reuse feels in the spirit of the rules.

[magnets]

I know this is technically not following the rules exactly, but I would feel free to use them. Inspectors aren't going to care whether or not the LED strips got cut down last season or not, they're just light and serve no purpose other than that. If FIRST actually does enforce this rule down to the single little LED strips, then that would just be costing teams a lot of money that doesn't need to be spent.

To expand on that: we're an old team and subsequently have a lot of old parts. If I take a piece of 80/20 that has a couple holes in it and has been cut to some length (no longer COTS), but then make another cut and drill some more holes, is it okay or not? Our team has taken the position that this is okay, because it is material that was COTS at one point, but none of the previous fabrication was beneficial to this year. And if FIRST wants to promote recycling, this kind of reuse feels in the spirit of the rules.

In my opinion, knowingly violating the rules is far from okay. If a team is unfamiliar with the manual and violates the rules by accident, that's okay. If a team is familiar with a rule, knows they are breaking it, but thinks that it's okay because the inspector probably won't find out, then I have a real problem with this. When you lie and sign your name on the inspection sheet saying that you don't know any rules to which your robot does not comply, you are cheating. If you do plan on cheating, why would you ever post about it on the internet, where robot inspectors will read this?

I take such a strong opinion on issues like these because it's a really bad thing if rules aren't "rules". If you don't really have to follow the rules, or you justify your conscious decision to violate rules because of how you interpret the "spirit of the rules", then how far should we go? Is it okay to add 1 pound to a 119.9 lbs robot, if that 1 pound is only decorations? How will teams know which rules are okay to violate?

FIRST is a COMPETITION. We all have the same rules, and even if we think they are a little bit silly or wasteful, we MUST follow them. Trust me, if you think GDC rules are bad, you haven't seen some of the engineering requirements documents that are used in the real world.