big sponsors hate good teams

[mipo0707]

why is that so many successful teams dont get the big or even enough sponsorships?
like just why? they r successful just help them a bit and in return they will advertise ur company,
u will feel good that u helped a team and so many kids on that team

[magnets]

This isn't true. Talk to 254. They're incredibly successful, and sponsors love them. I talked to some of their members in St. Louis, and the sponsor program they have is amazing.

[bobjones227]

Don't be so hasty with your conclusions. There are plenty of successful teams that have many sponsors that are also large.

[evanperryg]

This isn't true in the slightest. Actually, the most successful teams often have a lot of sponsors, including some very big ones.

[z_beeblebrox]

I'd say that it's hard for any FRC team to get big sponsorships, not just good teams.

[jvriezen]

why is that so many successful teams dont get the big or even enough sponsorships?
like just why? they r successful just help them a bit and in return they will advertise ur company,
u will feel good that u helped a team and so many kids on that team

I believe it is 'true'. There are indeed 'many' successful teams that don't get a high level of sponsorship. But as prior responses say, there are ALSO many successful teams that DO get a high level of sponsorship.

There are also teams that have a high level of sponsorship, yet are not 'successful' (by various metrics of success.)

A successful team first needs good people (quality/skilled mentors/students) to be successful-- they can often be successful with lower sponsorship because of factors other than $ and sponsor resources.

I suspect a team having trouble getting sponsorship is due to either a lack of local willing sponsors and/or a lack of effort (or the wrong type of effort) by the team to recruit and retain sponsors.

[artK]

why is that so many successful teams dont get the big or even enough sponsorships?
like just why? they r successful just help them a bit and in return they will advertise ur company,
u will feel good that u helped a team and so many kids on that team

You seem to make a number of assumptions about a successful team. I recommend you take a read of this (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1269632&postcount=1) post about what successful teams do, especially stereotypes #1 and #2, which goes into monetary and machining resources of some successful teams.

[jvriezen]

You seem to make a number of assumptions about a successful team. I recommend you take a read of this (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1269632&postcount=1) post about what successful teams do, especially stereotypes #1 and #2, which goes into monetary and machining resources of some successful teams.

I think the OP is concerned that some teams he or she is familiar with have found success and are disappointed that attempts to recruit additional or 'big' sponsors have not met with success.

If anything, the presumption was that many successful teams are not able to become 'rich' despite being successful. The referenced post is about teams thinking that all successful teams must be 'rich' (and other stuff.) That's a different issue.

[Michael Hill]

In my experience, big sponsors will sponsor a successful team over an unsuccessful one. Marketing departments tend to like their brand to be associated with winning. Sad, but true. If you're a team that performs well at competition, but still no big sponsors, I would suggest doing more outside of just your robot (outreach events). If companies see you're out in the community and supporting the community and doing good things, it's very easy to justify a sponsorship. Perhaps you also need to learn how to talk to potential sponsors. Unfortunately, that's a big personality thing. Find the kids most enthusiastic about robots and your team and have them approach the company. Only very rarely do mentors on our team approach a company. Most of our sponsorship comes from kids pounding the pavement and basically doing cold calls. We publish an annual sponsor book and place those in the businesses that sponsor us (as well as in the chamber of commerce). Some other team told us about this fund raising idea (sorry I forget who it was), but it has had very good results. We have best results when kids bring a robot with them.

In fact, we only have a few "big" sponsors. We get a lot from local places giving smaller amounts. In a way, I like to think it's more stable (though more difficult). If one of our big sponsors pulls out, we're not dead in the water money-wise.

[bkahl]

This thread is cute.

[Sperkowsky]

Getting sponsors is all about impression. We are a tiny team who finished last place in the sbpli regional. Yet we got northop grumman and cable vision to sponsor us.

Sponsors don't care much about the quality of the team.

[Gregor]

This thread is cute.

195 is the perfect example of a good team with more sponsors than I can count.

[jman4747]

Some teams have large sponsors some teams don't. Others have a long sponsor list some don't. If you have enough money you will do okay. What enough is varies a lot though.

I think mentors matter more in the long run so long as you:

1. Can register ($5,000)

2. Can buy robot parts ($2,000 - $5,000)

3. Have basic shop tools (???) Tool donations = victory

4. Matirial/Product/Tool Donations = Victory

[Billfred]

Getting sponsors is all about impression. We are a tiny team who finished last place in the sbpli regional. Yet we got northop grumman and cable vision to sponsor us.

Sponsors don't care much about the quality of the team.Yes and no. I can't speak for all sponsors, but Bosch does care about the quality of the team though not as much the performance of the robot. If we were cussing and carrying on and being stupid at events, I would not expect to stay a Bosch team. If we were seeded dead last but doing the right things and presenting ourselves well? Fair shot.

[Jared Russell]

With each passing year I realize more and more that getting sponsors has almost nothing to do with on-field success, and everything to do with your tenacity in going out and getting sponsors.

[Monochron]

why is that so many successful teams dont get the big or even enough sponsorships?
like just why? they r successful just help them a bit and in return they will advertise ur company,
u will feel good that u helped a team and so many kids on that team

I hate to be an old man, but shouldn't we promote good grammar in FIRST? It's hard to be successful in anything you do (engineering, business, acquiring sponsors) if you can't manage to put down a coherent sentence using real English words. Communication is too critical a skill to just ignore.

[Chris Fultz]

As a team sponsor, we are more concerned with the behavior, attitude and commitment to FIRST ideals than specific performance in the competition. Some of our teams perform well, some struggle, some are in the middle. We support them all in every way we can.

[Seth Mallory]

Yes and no. I can't speak for all sponsors, but Bosch does care about the quality of the team though not as much the performance of the robot. If we were cussing and carrying on and being stupid at events, I would not expect to stay a Bosch team. If we were seeded dead last but doing the right things and presenting ourselves well? Fair shot.

I will say that Bosch is great sponsor. The mentors that come from Bosch fit our goals and desires for the students.

[GeeTwo]

We definitely had better success getting sponsors in the weeks following our first regional victory than we'd ever had before. I'm confident that this is at least as much due to the effort and attitude and message put forward as to the sponsors' desire to be associated with a winner.

[Carolyn_Grace]

Finding more team sponsorship can seem like a daunting task. It can be less so with a dedicated group of students who educate themselves on how to improve their efforts.

Use the FIRST Fundraising Toolkit for Success (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/first-fundraising-toolkit), created by Renee Becker, to help your efforts.

In my experience, gaining more sponsorship is more about the effort and communication put in, rather than the success or status of the team.

Improve your communication regarding your goals, objectives, needs, and grammar. It may seem a silly thing to nitpick about on ChiefDelphi, but practicing your communication skills on this forum may help your communication skills with potential sponsors.

Put more effort into training, organizing, and following through of your team goals.

And thank your current sponsors.
Always take time to thank them.
In person.
With a small gift that they can display.

[Libby K]

Yes and no. I can't speak for all sponsors, but Bosch does care about the quality of the team though not as much the performance of the robot. If we were cussing and carrying on and being stupid at events, I would not expect to stay a Bosch team. If we were seeded dead last but doing the right things and presenting ourselves well? Fair shot.

As a team sponsor, we are more concerned with the behavior, attitude and commitment to FIRST ideals than specific performance in the competition. Some of our teams perform well, some struggle, some are in the middle. We support them all in every way we can.

This is so much of what I came here to say.

From a different perspective, this year I was responsible for launching a FIRST sponsorship program at my company (United Therapeutics). It was pretty interesting to hear different perspectives on what we should consider for criteria - but overall we came to a good mix between the picture of the team as a whole, level of need, and location (priority given to teams local to our offices).

We started with a brand-new roster of 25 FRC teams running a full range of ages - 386 all the way up to 5511. In terms of what we were looking for, performance on the field is probably dead-last when it comes to deciding how we renew their grants for 2015-16.

Is it really cool that we had several regional winners, tons of awards, and even two Championship division winners (paired together, I might add!) on #TeamUnither this season? Absolutely. But if any one of those teams stopped being an appropriate representation of FIRST's ideals - you can bet we'd drop them.

To others' points - communication is key. How you get your message across will greatly impact how that potential future sponsor sees you - and once you have them, keeping in touch to let them know how you're doing is something they won't forget.

[Michael Sperber]

Libby hit the nail right on the head... Sponsors define "successful" in different ways.

It was pretty interesting to hear different perspectives on what we should consider for criteria - but overall we came to a good mix between the picture of the team as a whole, level of need, and location (priority given to teams local to our offices).
...
In terms of what we were looking for, performance on the field is probably dead-last when it comes to deciding how we renew their grants for 2015-16.
...
But if any one of those teams stopped being an appropriate representation of FIRST's ideals - you can bet we'd drop them.

Successful could be quantitative: the number of wins, the number of trophies, the number of students on the team.

Or it could be quantitative in a different manner: the number of students pursuing college degrees in STEM fields, the number of students who win FIRST scholarships, the number of students on the honor roll who were on academic probation.

Or it could be qualitative: the impact the FIRST program has on the students, the impact FIRST has on the mentors.


When answering the OP's question:
why is that so many successful teams dont get the big or even enough sponsorships?
I think the first question that should be answered is: "what is successful?"

[IronicDeadBird]

Did somebody take my citation needed sign on a stick I normally use for protests?

[WynS]

I think that sponsors like "quality" teams and I agree that quality can be defined different ways. We try to inspire others as a team and make an impact on students lives. We also make a point of keeping our sponsors informed about how we are doing that. I really think they appreciate that - they also really like photos. As a result, we have some very loyal sponsors - monetary and otherwise. Some of our sponsors have approached us because I believe they see us as a quality team. We do have a few large sponsors but we also have many smaller sponsors. When people ask how we get sponsors, I tell them that we are always promoting FIRST and our team to try and recruit new sponsors. You never know where a sponsorship will come from. Some of our sponsors have come from casual conversations about robotics. We take nothing for granted because there is no guarantee that any of our sponsors will return for the next season.

When sending out sponsor updates, we try and emphasize how much our students are learning and doing because I think that is really what sponsors are interested in. We have not always been a winning team but we have always tried to be a quality team.

[MikeBrock]

This thread makes so much sense!!! Great work OP!

[Greg McKaskle]

Along with a few other engineers, I review FRC grant requests for NI funding. I also lead a team of engineers in doing the recruiting tasks at a major Texas university. The qualities that we value in FRC teams are amazingly similar to those we value in employees. This shouldn't be too surprising since we are essentially selecting a representative, one that you will make an investment in and hoping for some amount of accomplishment.

For an employee, no matter how good the grades or the list of accomplishments, they must be able to communicate and convince you that they can be a strong member of a team. This includes verbal, written, and body language and attitude. They don't have to be an actor or produce prose like Shakespeare, but negative impressions and miscommunication can be very costly in day-to-day operations. And of course the communication will largely be about technical topics -- descriptions of buggy mechanisms, observations that help to discover faults, descriptions of the plan that will make it is robust/fast/shiny. They also need to be able to describe the goals they initially set as well as their updates to those goals. You are looking at the whole package, and nobody is perfect, but your task as an interviewer/reviewer is to find ways to compare the expected contribution of each candidate and score or rank them.

For FRC teams, this hardly changes except that you aren't dealing with a specific individual, but an organization -- a team. The team's pit, signage, theme/message/attitude, the goals they set for themselves as an organization, and their accomplishments are all considered. Some of this comes from he written grant request, and some from previous encounters at events. Scoring lots of points or playing good D honestly isn't much of a factor for NI. Awards and positive impact on the students and community far outweigh a technically sophisticated robot or well-coached drivers.

It is also useful to think about a sponsorship request as a competition. Hundreds of teams are likely applying for the same thing as you, and you want your team merits to win your team the grant. This is similar to college applications and it happens within companies too -- for project funding, advancement, and winning contracts.

NI grants try to strike a balance between financial need, accomplishments, and locality. We do not want to see good teams fold. We want to see a good balance of mentor/student involvement. Local team sponsorship has the benefit of combining funds and direct engineer mentoring and it is highly visible and easier to measure results.

Finally, we have to weigh impact of the funds we give to a particular FRC team against the impact it would have on FLL or GirlStart, United Way or other charities. And at the end of the day, these funds could alternately be used to purchase faster computers, construct buildings, pay salaries of employees and interns; so we do have to justify how we are spending company money and why a particular FRC team's budget is more important than the other choices.

So, I'd encourage you to reconsider your initial conclusion. I suspect that this is based on a specific incident, and I doubt that the company motives are what you suggest. If your team was the one to lose funding and doesn't understand why, it is perfectly reasonable for the team to write a professional letter asking for more information, areas for improvement, etc. Be sure this is an official team letter and not a barrage of disorganized questions from different students or subteams. You may also consider sending a letter to companies who are still sponsoring, to tell them how your team did this season, how the money or time investment helped students and team, etc. Let them know how much this means to you and say thank you. This material helps a proponent of FIRST within the company to justify continuing and possibly enhancing the sponsorship.

Greg McKaskle

[Foster]

I always hate to be late to a thread but my grammar response and presentation of sponsors was covered by Libby. +1

I do want to comment on Greg's post. As a sponsor (STEMRobotics) I get a ton of requests each year. Like Greg/NI we try to spend the money where it will do the most good (AKA biggest bang for the buck). So we have a tendency to fund starter teams in areas that are under served by competition robotics.

[jman4747]

The most common thing I get from current and potential sponsors is "do you need help?" and "do you need/will you get good use out of it?". Proving that you need any given amount of money is harder for most smaller teams than parts, materials, and tools.

[waialua359]

What's not emphasized enough is what you do once you receive funding. That in itself requires a lot, especially if you plan on reapplying for the same sponsorship, generally speaking.

[Iaquinto.Joe]

Looking at OP's post history they're either a troll or a child. CD is too easy to get a ruse out of some times.

[jman4747]

Looking at OP's post history they're either a troll or a child. CD is too easy to get a ruse out of some times.

I think so too but the replies can yield useful information. Just use the opportunity to have a meaningful discussion and spread some useful information. This thread has probably been more useful than the championship split ones.

[JaneYoung]

I think so too but the replies can yield useful information. Just use the opportunity to have a meaningful discussion and spread some useful information. This thread has probably been more useful than the championship split ones.

I was thinking this exact same thing. The definition of success has been cast in a different light in this thread. One that can be seen very clearly and from different perspectives. Different viewpoints and perspectives can serve a great purpose; they can widen the scope.

This is a good discussion, especially for young teams who are learning the ropes.

Jane

[MikLast]

Looking at OP's post history they're either a troll or a child. CD is too easy to get a ruse out of some times.

May be so, but i am going to save this thread for later use, has some really good stuff for getting sponsorship's.