New Chairman's Deadline - Week 4

[Gary Dillard]

OK I just noticed this - I did a search and didn't find any discussion of it:

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/calendar/awards-chairmans-award-application-deadline-2016

The Chairman's Award application opened on Thursday, November 12, 2015 at 12:00 PM, Noon (Eastern Time) and closes on Thursday, February 4, 2016 at 3:00 PM (Eastern Time).

Chairman's award submission is due less than 4 weeks after kickoff and 2 and a half weeks prior to stop build this year? Last year it was 2 days after stop build.

[wilsonmw04]

Why the change and why so late in the year? I know the season hasn't started yet, but my team had a timeline for the submission process. We know have to rework the whole system. Might I suggest announcing these changes a bit sooner?

PS: was this in a blast that I missed or is this the first folks are hearing about it?

[waialua359]

Why the change and why so late in the year? I know the season hasn't started yet, but my team had a timeline for the submission process. We know have to rework the whole system. Might I suggest announcing these changes a bit sooner?

PS: was this in a blast that I missed or is this the first folks are hearing about it?
For those of us in the HOF through our monthly meetings, this is the 1st time I have seen/heard of it as well and it wasnt discussed.

[MissDaisyGirl]

That's really early. I haven't heard of this until now either. Perhaps we can ask.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Why the change and why so late in the year? I know the season hasn't started yet, but my team had a timeline for the submission process. We know have to rework the whole system. Might I suggest announcing these changes a bit sooner?

PS: was this in a blast that I missed or is this the first folks are hearing about it?

Palmetto being Week 0.5 this year puts strain on the judges. Submissions need to be done in time for them to get to the judges in time to get them read.

[Basel A]

Palmetto being Week 0.5 this year puts strain on the judges. Submissions need to be done in time for them to get to the judges in time to get them read.

That's a great reason to make the submission deadline one week earlier than before. That doesn't seem to be the situation.

[Andrew Schreiber]

That's a great reason to make the submission deadline one week earlier than before. That doesn't seem to be the situation.

You mean the deadline for something that teams can be working on right now?

Sorry, I don't see an issue with this.

[Basel A]

You mean the deadline for something that teams can be working on right now?

Sorry, I don't see an issue with this.

We're working on it right now. Probably a lot of teams are. Some teams will decide to solely focus on outreach in the Fall (because it can take more people than a subteam), and working on the award from the start of build season. Other teams might not be working now because they have absolutely no idea the deadline is a different date this year.

[Jacob Bendicksen]

I sent an email to Frank Answers Fridays about the date change -- it surprised me when I saw it yesterday. It's definitely a change from the old due date around Bag Day, so I'm curious what the reasoning is.

[Sperkowsky]

You mean the deadline for something that teams can be working on right now?

Sorry, I don't see an issue with this.
Your not the person who runs chairman's then are you? As someone who does manage the submission of the award on my team I can tell you this is a big deal. We get a lot of footage during build season because that's when most people show up and when the most action is going on. With chairman's ending after build season I had time to edit everything and get everything together when we were no longer busy. Now I'm going to have to either get the whole thing done before build season or during which means it won't be as professional and will put a strain on the whole team.

[EricH]

Your not the person who runs chairman's then are you? As someone who does manage the submission of the award on my team I can tell you this is a big deal. We get a lot of footage during build season because that's when most people show up and when the most action is going on. With chairman's ending after build season I had time to edit everything and get everything together when we were no longer busy. Now I'm going to have to either get the whole thing done before build season or during which means it won't be as professional and will put a strain on the whole team.

Are you sure that you cannot be accomplishing the mission of the Chairman's Award before build?*

Here's the thing: The page OPENS 11/12. There is nothing saying that you can't be starting everything on 11/12 as far as the written portions--or as far as video.


*(This is a loaded question. Just so you're aware.)

[Sperkowsky]

Are you sure that you cannot be accomplishing the mission of the Chairman's Award before build?*

Here's the thing: The page OPENS 11/12. There is nothing saying that you can't be starting everything on 11/12 as far as the written portions--or as far as video.


*(This is a loaded question. Just so you're aware.)
Well right now we are building an off-season bot for a competition in November while getting ready to also run out first competition live stream. We are also training 25 new freshman with only 5 dedicated senior members while doing sponsor relations for the first time. After mid November we will have a month free so that's when we are going to have to do it. I preferred the extra time but it's obviously not impossible to finish the it earlier. What ticked me off about the quoted response was saying it wasn't a big deal acting as if the award gets done in a day which as you and me knows it definitely does not.

[Pjohn1959]

For those of us in the HOF through our monthly meetings, this is the 1st time I have seen/heard of it as well and it wasnt discussed.

Wow....

[Gary Dillard]

You mean the deadline for something that teams can be working on right now?

Sorry, I don't see an issue with this.

Andrew, I'll be sure to explain that to both of the rookie teams we're mentoring, who will likely be getting NASA grants and required to make a submission by the deadline. I'm sure the team that hasn't even started meeting yet will fully understand that they should have already been working on an award submission for a team that doesn't exist in a competition that they know pretty much nothing about. I'm sure it will make their submission much easier since they won't have to include most of what they experience in FIRST.

[EricH]

Well right now we are building an off-season bot for a competition in November while getting ready to also run out first competition live stream. We are also training 25 new freshman with only 5 dedicated senior members while doing sponsor relations for the first time. After mid November we will have a month free so that's when we are going to have to do it. I preferred the extra time but it's obviously not impossible to finish the it earlier. What ticked me off about the quoted response was saying it wasn't a big deal acting as if the award gets done in a day which as you and me knows it definitely does not.

You're building an offseason robot. You're training freshmen. You're doing sponsor relations. If you're not out there with a video camera at various points in all of those, you should be. Start getting your video now. (Trust me. There's a team who got some of their video footage either a year before or a day before--I want to say a YEAR before--their submission.) You can edit later, and do any reshoots/updates later. (Actually, just as a thought, that could really work in your favor--the updates part, that is.)


Also, Andrew does know how long the RCA takes. He's been on a team of that caliber. I wouldn't assume that someone doesn't because they seem to blow it off.



That being said, that is two weeks less time than for the 2014/2015 season, which opened at the same time and closed right after build, and with no announcement. Not sure why.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Your not the person who runs chairman's then are you? As someone who does manage the submission of the award on my team I can tell you this is a big deal. We get a lot of footage during build season because that's when most people show up and when the most action is going on. With chairman's ending after build season I had time to edit everything and get everything together when we were no longer busy. Now I'm going to have to either get the whole thing done before build season or during which means it won't be as professional and will put a strain on the whole team.

FRC 125 has won chairmans at an event the last two years. Prior to that I was a mentor on 79, who won one in 2013. I'm also an alumni of 27. Furthermore I'm responsible for finding judges to read these essays for the northeastern district. I know both sides of this award. I know exactly how much effort it is and how much teams put into it. I also know the amount of stress it puts on judges to have to choose just one team. And I know how many hours of work those judges put in before the event reading essays.

It sucks to have the deadline this early. There are reasons for it and things you can do to mitigate it.

Gary, for your rookie teams maybe help them build a skeleton essay now. Heck they can even use it as a roadmap and plan their season and offseason activities. Could be a good exercise (especially working with experienced teams and mentors to do it)

[Joe Ross]

Andrew, I'll be sure to explain that to both of the rookie teams we're mentoring, who will likely be getting NASA grants and required to make a submission by the deadline.


In the past, the requirements have been to make a chairmans like submission to NASA. Remember that rookies can't submit chairmans. Has something changed?

[sdangelo]

Remember that rookies can't submit chairmans. Has something changed?
I think rookies can submit Chairman's, they just aren't judged for it. I seem to remember seeing a checkbox in the Chairman's submission last year that said something along the lines of "Please check this box if you are only submitting to fulfill a NASA grant requirement."

[PayneTrain]

As someone with hands in too many hats on the team, I like the change. As long as FIRST communicates the change adequately, it's a good move. I almost wish the award submission was due before kickoff; we use that as a team controlled deadline for the submission. The earlier you shift the submission period for the essay, judges get more time to look at the written submission and teams of all sizes can break up the written/video/presentation trifecta to a greater degree.

[wilsonmw04]

The earlier you shift the submission period for the essay, judges get more time to look at the written submission

If this happens they can have it due in July!

[BrendanB]

I think its a good change seeing I've always disliked having the submission date so close to stop build day because it means less members from the team are available to help with the submission because they are working hard to finish the robot or in the midst of other deadlines.

Yes its less time, but there is still plenty of time between now and February 4th.

We get a lot of footage during build season because that's when most people show up and when the most action is going on.

The video doesn't get submitted with the essay so you now have more time to work on it since your efforts after February 4th won't be on the written portions. You can also get to work earlier on your presentation which is arguably the most important part of a Chairmans submission.

For most teams this change means actually starting the essay before build season starts. Every year I've been on a team we've said, "We are going to have the essay written before build season starts" but the result is still the same with the efforts beginning with the build season.

[alex.lew]

Palmetto being Week 0.5 this year puts strain on the judges. Submissions need to be done in time for them to get to the judges in time to get them read.

Agree. This has to be the reason for the change - giving judges more review time. Teams have been able to submit CA at multiple regionals for 2 years now, and at larger events there are 20+ submissions. I'm sure the judges' feedback justifies the deadline change.

That being said, I really wish this had been announced with the definitions update, rather than just appearing on the season calendar.

[PayneTrain]

If this happens they can have it due in July!

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