Championship Waitlist [Archive]

Taylor

11-02-2016, 10:34

Teams may join the Championship Saitlist to fill any remaining FIRST Championship slots not consumed by qualifying Regional or District teams. Teams who sign up for the Waitlist will be randomly selected at various points throughout the season in an effort to give teams as much time to make travel plans as possible while ensuring we do not exceed FIRST Championship capacity.

I'm not sure whether "season" is specific to competition season, or the period of time from kickoff til CMP.

Have any waitlist teams received word as to their CMP status yet?

Jacob Paikoff

11-02-2016, 11:29

I would guess no since only 30 teams are registered as of today.

Most likely season refers to competition season, which means they should be starting to send out notices soon.

SenorZ

11-02-2016, 12:04

Last year it seamed that they sent out invitations to waitlist teams AFTER they had a rough estimate of how many earned spots would be taken.

Once you're team has completed all of its registered competitions, and has NOT earned a spot at champs, then they send you the invite.

I think we got our invite during the week following our second regional

Anthony Galea

11-02-2016, 13:12

Once you're team has completed all of its registered competitions, and has NOT earned a spot at champs, then they send you the invite.

This is not true. Last season, we got our invite before our second of three events, and I also know that many MSC qualifying teams got notified before MSC, which created an extra spot in the district.

SenorZ

11-02-2016, 15:02

This is not true. Last season, we got our invite before our second of three events, and I also know that many MSC qualifying teams got notified before MSC, which created an extra spot in the district.

Hmmm. There is a very distinct possibility I am remembering things wrong. It's happened before. But for us, we did receive our invite within one week of our Week 5 event.

tindleroot

11-02-2016, 15:11

Hmmm. There is a very distinct possibility I am remembering things wrong. It's happened before. But for us, we did receive our invite within one week of our Week 5 event.

We also received our invitation (somehow; we had gone to worlds the previous year) before the district championship last year (as had another Indiana team), so at the end of the district champs another team knew that they were advancing to worlds due to the spot we received.

Lil' Lavery

21-03-2016, 13:37

Anthony Galea

21-03-2016, 13:40

Lil' Lavery

21-03-2016, 13:48

Where is this list coming from?

https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2016&event=cmp

tindleroot

21-03-2016, 15:33

It seems like teams are beginning to get on via the wait list.

175 teams are currently registered. Only 144 spots have been generated by regionals so far. Some of those will be HoF/Legacy/2015 Champs spots.

None of the listed teams are there from waitlist.

144 spots have been generated by regionals.
There are 7 legacy teams.
From my count there are 17 active Hall of Fame teams. 1 of them (191) is legacy.
There are 4 Winners from last year's champs.
There are 4 EI winners from last year's champs.
So 144+7+16+4+4=175

Lil' Lavery

21-03-2016, 15:53

None of the listed teams are there from waitlist.

144 spots have been generated by regionals.
There are 7 legacy teams.
From my count there are 17 active Hall of Fame teams. 1 of them (191) is legacy.
There are 4 Winners from last year's champs.
There are 4 EI winners from last year's champs.
So 144+7+16+4+4=175

Fair enough. But this does mean that every single week 1/2 team accepted and paid their invitation to the Championship, which would be truly unprecedented.

MechEng83

22-03-2016, 14:24

The earliest waitlist invite I can confirm from last year was after week 4 events had concluded.

Zach101

28-03-2016, 14:26

Is there a form that we have to fill out, where will it be sent to, and where can I find more general information?

SenorZ

28-03-2016, 14:44

Is there a form that we have to fill out, where will it be sent to, and where can I find more general information?

Your main contact in TIMS will get an email saying something to the effect of, "Congratulations, you've been invited to take a wait list spot..."

Your main contact had to register for the wait list in TIMS. And you'll have about the same time frame to accept/pay as a team that earns a spot via regional competition. (If memory serves)

Edit... our wait list invite from last year, on April 7:
Greetings 2015 Championship Wait List Team:

We are very pleased to be able to offer your team a spot in the 2015 Championship event!

To Accept this Invitation:
· Your team has been moved from Wait List status to Registered status in the Team Information Management System (TIMS)
You will need to notify us of your acceptance and secure your Championship Registration by contacting Finance and making payment within 48 hours*
Email or Fax a Purchase Order to ar@usfirst.org or 603-206-2079
Email or Fax a Letter of Commitment to ar@usfirst.org or 603-206-2079
Log into your TIMS account to pay with a credit card
If you have any questions or need assistance with payment, please contact Finance at 800-871-8326, ext. 563, or email ar@usfirst.org and a Finance representative will be happy to assist you.
· If you have other Championship related question(s), please contact Team Support at 800-871-8326, “0”, or email frcteams@usfirst.org and a team support staff member will be happy to assist you.

*Please note, we understand the requested turn-around time on this invitation is short and may be a cause of concern. Given the proximity to the event, it is necessary we have wait list teams secure their spots as quickly as possible, or release them so we may extend the offer to other teams on the list. We want to assure you, however, that Finance will do everything possible to work with you in securing your spot should you choose to attend. We thank you in advance for your understanding.

To Decline this Invitation
· Your team has been moved from Wait List status to Registered status in TIMS. Important: This does not commit you to attending the Championship; this status change was done to expedite the overall Wait List process.
· Kindly reply to this email within 48 hours of receipt with your written Decline and your team will be Unregistered as well as removed from future Wait List consideration
· If you have any questions, please contact Team Support at 800-871-8326, “0”, or email frcteams@usfirst.org and a team support staff member will be happy to assist you

Thank you in advance – we hope you are able to join us in St. Louis!

Go Teams!

Sincerely,

FRC Team Support

Hallry

01-04-2016, 23:27

It does appear that a few teams are now registered for World Champs via the waitlist (http://frc-events.firstinspires.org/2016/CMP).

Justin Montois

01-04-2016, 23:51

48 is registered and they have not qualified at their events so waitlist teams must be getting in.

Hallry

02-04-2016, 00:10

48 is registered and they have not qualified at their events so waitlist teams must be getting in.

There are a few others as well. For example, 3637 from MAR is already shown as registered for STL, as is 2767 from Michigan.

logank013

02-04-2016, 09:46

When is the full list of waitlist teams usually posted? Thhe INDCMPS is Week 7 this year. I'd like to know any IN teams qualified via the waitlist before then. Will it be known before then?

Last year, two IN teams were known during the week 6 event so I assume yes?

Bonus: Does anyone have a link to a list of teams that qualified via the waitlist? I'm curious if FIRST keeps that specific list on their website. Thanks.

Edit: Also, if anyone does find a list of waitlist teams that have qualified via the waitlist in the later weeks, please post it on this thread too. Thanks.

Kevin Leonard

02-04-2016, 11:34

2791 hasn't been to Champs since 2009, and they have the best robot they've ever built. If 2791 doesn't get in off the waitlist to the last real championship, I don't know what criteria even exists for this.

RufflesRidge

02-04-2016, 11:56

I don't know what criteria even exists for this.

No criteria? It's a weighted randomization:
Teams may join the Championship Waitlist to fill any remaining
FIRST Championship slots not consumed by qualifying Regional or District teams. Teams who sign up for the Waitlist will be randomly selected at various points throughout the season in an effort to give teams as much
time to make travel plans as possible while ensuring we do not exceed FIRST Championship capacity.

...

Teams will receive a number of “entries” to get selected from the Waitlist equal to 2016 minus the last year they attended Championship (or their rookie year, or when they most recently returned as an active team, whichever year is the most recent). As examples, a team that attended
in 2015 will get one entry in the waitlist drawing, a team that last attended in 2014 will get two, and a team that has never attended but has been continuously active since 2006 will get ten.

forbes

02-04-2016, 12:15

Kevin Leonard

02-04-2016, 12:16

No criteria? It's a weighted randomization:

Well thats just it- what you quoted. How is it that 48 is already off the waitlist when they've been to champs almost every year, including last year (no offense to 48, you guys are cool), when 2791 hasn't been since 2009 and isn't. It just seems odd.

Sperkowsky

02-04-2016, 12:19

Well thats just it- what you quoted. How is it that 48 is already off the waitlist when they've been to champs almost every year, including last year (no offense to 48, you guys are cool), when 2791 hasn't been since 2009 and isn't. It just seems odd.
Agreed we have not ever made championships and have been a team since 2009. I wish it was a little less random but oh well.

logank013

02-04-2016, 12:23

This is the full list of teams that have been invited via wait list as far as I can tell:
as of 4/2

48
188
279
296
333
538
1389
1739
1987
2471
2647
2767
3055
3637
3961
4405
4792
5034
5243
5775 declined

How can you tell? And why don't they draw all wait list teams in 1 big drawing on 1 day?

forbes

02-04-2016, 12:26

How can you tell? And why don't they draw all wait list teams in 1 big drawing on 1 day?

They invite teams as early as possible to give them time to make plans, but they still don't know exactly how many wait list spots there are to give out.

My list is from some interpretation of the data from my website that is tracking the championship registration list: frc.divisions.co/history (http://frc.divisions.co/history)

RufflesRidge

02-04-2016, 12:33

Well thats just it- what you quoted. How is it that 48 is already off the waitlist when they've been to champs almost every year, including last year (no offense to 48, you guys are cool), when 2791 hasn't been since 2009 and isn't. It just seems odd.

Because it's random. If you have 14 teams that went last year on the waitlist, the odds that 1 of them will be picked are twice as high as the odds that a particular team with 7 chances gets picked.

seg9585

04-04-2016, 14:04

If a team was invited via waitlist but declined last year, do the number of entries they get in the weighting still depend on their last Championship appearance or is it based on the last invite?

For instance, my team (4276) last attended in 2013 but we were invited and declined in 2015. Do we get 3 entries or 1?

Mark McLeod

04-04-2016, 14:16

I'd imagine 3.
The data is much easier to handle just going by past official Championship team lists than having to remember somehow who turned down what and when.

Travis Hoffman

04-04-2016, 14:55

48 is registered and they have not qualified at their events so waitlist teams must be getting in.

Technically, we qualified at our event, as we received the email one hour after arrival in Queen City. :)

We actually should have qualified twice, but whatevz. We're in.

Travis Hoffman

04-04-2016, 15:20

Well thats just it- what you quoted. How is it that 48 is already off the waitlist when they've been to champs almost every year, including last year (no offense to 48, you guys are cool), when 2791 hasn't been since 2009 and isn't. It just seems odd.

Maybe low-numbered teams are as lucky with lottery randomization as they aren't with schedule randomization. ;) ;) ;) ;)

SenorZ

04-04-2016, 15:40

Do we get 3 entries or 1?

Its got to be 3. They shouldn't ding you for not being able to afford the event.

Also, I looked up our last invitation. It was sent one whole week AFTER our last event. So we had very little time to plan too.

Mastonevich

05-04-2016, 09:35

1987 actually did qualify at Hub City by winning EI. I assume that will open up another spot on the waitlist for a different team in the end.

For those that did apply to the wait list, you will need to have your plan together as they don't give much time to give them an answer.

Travis Hoffman

05-04-2016, 09:42

For those that did apply to the wait list, you will need to have your plan together as they don't give much time to give them an answer.

This is very true. We received the invite on Thursday morning. We had to accept or decline within 24 hours of email receipt. We had to secure payment by the following Monday. If you hope to receive a spot, be ready to act immediately should your golden ticket arrive in your Inbox.

forbes

05-04-2016, 21:12

Here's the list as of 4/5:

48
188
279
296
322 declined
333
538
1389
1510
1739
1987 qualified after waitlist invite
2471 declined
2647
2767
3055 declined
3637
3961
4180
4405
4792
5034
5243
5775 declined

dirtbikerxz

05-04-2016, 22:30

Here's the list as of 4/5:

...
322 declined
...
2471 declined
...
3055 declined
...
5775 declined

Just out of curiosity, why would anyone be declined?

ATannahill

05-04-2016, 22:33

Just out of curiosity, why would anyone be declined?
I am guessing that the team was offered a slot but they declined, probably because they did not have the money to attend.

dirtbikerxz

05-04-2016, 22:34

I am guessing that the team was offered a slot but they declined, probably because they did not have the money to attend.

Ohhh declined means that the TEAM declined... okay. I thought that frc declined the team.

Sh1ine

07-04-2016, 09:54

Have anymore teams been moved off the wait list and into champs since last week?

forbes

07-04-2016, 12:03

Have anymore teams been moved off the wait list and into champs since last week?

The last wait list change was made on 4/3. The list above is still current- a total of 18 teams are currently registered for the championship from the wait list.

orangemoore

07-04-2016, 12:06

The last wait list change was made on 4/3. The list above is still current- a total of 18 teams are currently registered for the championship from the wait list.

Do we know how many spots are left to be handed out?

SenorZ

07-04-2016, 12:40

Do we know how many spots are left to be handed out?

This "old school" version of the site has the tally at 321 teams so far.

https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2016&event=cmp

forbes

07-04-2016, 12:42

Do we know how many spots are left to be handed out?

Based on my (possibly inaccurate) count, at least 25 wait list spots still need to be handed out. As many as ~40 could be given out, especially if they go over the 600 team target like last year.

MechEng83

07-04-2016, 12:44

Do we know how many spots are left to be handed out?

With 321 spots currently taken, and 6 regionals this weekend (36 spots) and 218 district spots allocated, that leaves 25 spots left to fill with the waitlist, assuming 600 teams.

This doesn't account for any spots taken by a district team at a regional.

SenorZ

07-04-2016, 12:47

Hmmm. Looks like we might be saving that $5000 for other projects.

seg9585

07-04-2016, 13:03

With 321 spots currently taken, and 6 regionals this weekend (36 spots) and 218 district spots allocated, that leaves 25 spots left to fill with the waitlist, assuming 600 teams.

This doesn't account for any spots taken by a district team at a regional.

Can you explain the "218 district spots allocated"? I am not familiar with how district events allocate championship spots.

MechEng83

07-04-2016, 13:07

Can you explain the "218 district spots allocated"? I am not familiar with how district events allocate championship spots.

https://firstfrc.blob.core.windows.net/frc2016manuals/AdminManual/FRC-2016-admin-manual-07.pdf
The table in Section 7.4.4

Owen Busler

07-04-2016, 13:08

Can you explain the "218 district spots allocated"? I am not familiar with how district events allocate championship spots.

From the admin manual:

7.4.4 FIRST Championship Teams from Districts

"Districts will receive the percentage of available slots at the FIRST championship, rounded up to the nearest whole slot, equal to the percentage of teams they have in their District compared to all of FIRST Robotics Competition in the current season. In calculating available slots at the FIRST Championship, pre-qualified teams will be excluded. "

7.4.3 District Championship

"Team capacity at District Championships for the 2016 season will be as follows:
Chesapeake District Championship...................................... 58
Indiana State Championship...................................... ........... 32
Michigan State Championship...................................... .......102
Mid-Atlantic Robotics District Championship ........................ 55
North Carolina FIRST Robotics State Championship............. 32
New England District Championship..................................... 64
Pacific Northwest District Championship .............................. 64
Peachtree District State Championship................................. 45"

seg9585

07-04-2016, 13:28

Okay, so effectively ~half of the teams competing in District Championships will earn a spot to Champs?

Makes me wonder what the true "path of least resistance" of qualifying for Champs actually is.

AdamHeard

07-04-2016, 13:40

logank013

07-04-2016, 13:47

From the admin manual:

7.4.4 FIRST Championship Teams from Districts

"Districts will receive the percentage of available slots at the FIRST championship, rounded up to the nearest whole slot, equal to the percentage of teams they have in their District compared to all of FIRST Robotics Competition in the current season. In calculating available slots at the FIRST Championship, pre-qualified teams will be excluded. "

7.4.3 District Championship

"Team capacity at District Championships for the 2016 season will be as follows:
Chesapeake District Championship...................................... 25/58....43.1%
Indiana State Championship...................................... ........... 9/32....28.1%
Michigan State Championship...................................... ....... 76/102....74.5%
Mid-Atlantic Robotics District Championship ........................ 22/55....40.0%
North Carolina FIRST Robotics State Championship............. 10/32....31.2%
New England District Championship..................................... 34/64....53.1%
Pacific Northwest District Championship .............................. 30/64....46.9%
Peachtree District State Championship................................. 12/45....26.7%"

Total: .................................................. ...........................218/452....48.2%

Key: ..............................(Teams going to Worlds)/(Teams at DCMP)....%%%%

Modified the quote to have total allocated to worlds vs. total at DCMP with percentages.

MechEng83

07-04-2016, 14:36

Okay, so effectively ~half of the teams competing in District Championships will earn a spot to Champs?

Makes me wonder what the true "path of least resistance" of qualifying for Champs actually is.

Please don't forget that the teams competing in a district championship have already passed the filter of qualifying in their district to compete in the championship and gain a chance at qualifying for the world championship.

For example: Michigan has 411 teams. 102 compete at the DCMP. 76 qualify for CMP. 76/411 = 18.5%
Indiana has 49 teams. 32 compete at DCMP. 9 qualify for CMP. 9/49 = 18.4%

That's still a better percentage than you see at a typical regional, but it's not a "nearly half" situation.

Lil' Lavery

07-04-2016, 14:36

Okay, so effectively ~half of the teams competing in District Championships will earn a spot to Champs?

Makes me wonder what the true "path of least resistance" of qualifying for Champs actually is.

218 out of 600 is much closer to 1/3 of spots than 1/2 of spots.

The quantity of teams each district sends to the Championship is based on their proportion of the total teams in FRC. A more populous district sends more teams.

In terms of the "path of least resistance," it really depends on what your team is. If you're a high performing team, districts affords you a much greater chance to qualify via points. If you're a middle of the pack team, you may have better odds in a regional format, and hoping to be on the right alliance at the right time and take home a regional win (or wildcard).

seg9585

07-04-2016, 15:52

218 out of 600 is much closer to 1/3 of spots than 1/2 of spots.

I didn't say half the teams attending champs were from Districts, just that half the District Champs teams were attending worlds. Very different.

Looking at Michigan for a second:

411 teams in total, 76 qualify for CMP (18.5%)

vs

Non-rookie team attending 2 regionals:
1st regional, 5 spots out of 65 make it to champs (7.7% chance to make Champs)
2nd regional, 5 spots out of 48 earn champs spots (reduced total number of teams attending the regional because they already earned spots, effectively factoring in wildcards): (10.4% chance to make Champs)

0.923 * .896 = .827 chance of not making Champs = 17.3% chance of making Champs from Regionals from a purely statistical standpoint.

So to *nearly* match the odds of making Champs at Regionals, one must always plan to attend 2 regionals.
2 regionals = $9000, vs 2 district events + district championship = $8000

$432 per 1% chance of making it to Champs via Districts
$520 per 1% chance of making it to Champs via Regionals

MechEng83

07-04-2016, 16:05

orangemoore

07-04-2016, 19:09

Looks like 2 teams were removed from CMP list.

Both appear to be waitlist teams

2647
4792

So that brings the # of wait list spot up to 27

Lil' Lavery

07-04-2016, 19:13

I didn't say half the teams attending champs were from Districts, just that half the District Champs teams were attending worlds. Very different.

Looking at Michigan for a second:

411 teams in total, 76 qualify for CMP (18.5%)

vs

Non-rookie team attending 2 regionals:
1st regional, 5 spots out of 65 make it to champs (7.7% chance to make Champs)
2nd regional, 5 spots out of 48 earn champs spots (reduced total number of teams attending the regional because they already earned spots, effectively factoring in wildcards): (10.4% chance to make Champs)

0.923 * .896 = .827 chance of not making Champs = 17.3% chance of making Champs from Regionals from a purely statistical standpoint.

So to *nearly* match the odds of making Champs at Regionals, one must always plan to attend 2 regionals.
2 regionals = $9000, vs 2 district events + district championship = $8000

$432 per 1% chance of making it to Champs via Districts
$520 per 1% chance of making it to Champs via Regionals

First off, the cost of 2 district events and a district championship is $9000 in registration fees.

Secondly, where are you getting that 65 team number? 65 teams would be a very large regional event, and probably shouldn't be used as a general proxy for regional qualification. Using the data from this page (http://173.255.246.196/2016/), the average size of a regional event is only 51.5 teams.

Further still, you remove the rookies from the regional pool, while you don't remove the rookies from the district pool. While rookie qualification is proportionally smaller in the larger districts, it can significantly impact the odds in places like Indiana, Georgia, and North Carolina (where total team quantity is comparable to regional size). There's also the ranking point bonuses assigned to rookie (10 point) and sophomore (5 point) teams in the district system.

So, let's re-run the numbers.

210 non-rookie exclusive CMP spots are generated for the 1151 (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1W929hKsmvbodzsoDy7E4ol0ox3ejh97bjS9IFWds2as/edit?pref=2&pli=1#gid=982499818) district teams. That's an 18.24% advancement odds for $9000 worth of registration fees, or $493.22/% point.

A one-regional team competes for 5 non-rookie exclusive CMP spots out of 51.5 regional attendees. That's a 9.71% advancement odds for $5000 worth of registration fees, or $514.93/% point.

Not factoring in wild cards (which improve regional teams' odds), a two-play team has an 18.48% advancement odds for $9000 worth of registration fees, or $487.09/% point.

kyle_hamblett

07-04-2016, 20:03

As per the Admin Manual:
Teams who sign up for the Waitlist will be randomly selected at various
points throughout the season in an effort to give teams as much time to make travel plans as possible while
ensuring we do not exceed FIRST Championship capacity.

Is there generally a date that they would no longer invite waitlisted teams? I would assume it's based on the rest of the teams that actually qualify and if there are any spots left over/when they either accept or decline the invitation.

forbes

07-04-2016, 20:10

As per the Admin Manual:

Is there generally a date that they would no longer invite waitlisted teams? I would assume it's based on the rest of the teams that actually qualify and if there are any spots left over/when they either accept or decline the invitation.

From what I remember from last year, they were still inviting teams about a week before championship. At that point, the decline rate increases significantly and it becomes difficult to find any teams willing to make last minute plans.

As a definite stop, I'm pretty sure once divisions are released no further teams can be invited.

Jay O'Donnell

08-04-2016, 01:12

As per the Admin Manual:

Is there generally a date that they would no longer invite waitlisted teams? I would assume it's based on the rest of the teams that actually qualify and if there are any spots left over/when they either accept or decline the invitation.

1058 was pulled off last year a few days before New England Champs. And there's definitely teams that get invited after that. I'm pretty sure I've heard of teams getting invited a few days before world champs.

SenorZ

08-04-2016, 12:05

Team 4276 just received an invitation this morning. One week after our second event.

We'll be accepting.

forbes

08-04-2016, 19:15

8 teams were invited today bringing the total number of wait list teams to 24:

181
238
548
670
2405
3482
4276
5404

Travis Hoffman

08-04-2016, 20:39

8 teams were invited today bringing the total number of wait list teams to 24:

181
238
548
670
2405
3482
4276
5404

548, 3482....48 is a lucky number. Also, Happy 48 Day (4/8).

forbes

10-04-2016, 18:02

4 additions and 2 declines brings the current total to 26:

48
157
181
188
238 declined
279
296
322 declined
333
538
548
670
1389
1510
1732
1739
1987 qualified after waitlist invite
2344
2405
2471 declined
2647 declined
2767
3055 declined
3482 declined
3637
3961
4180
4276
4290
4405
4792 declined
5034
5243
5404
5775 declined

BethMo

10-04-2016, 18:32

Incorrect. Our registration is $5000 just like every one else. The DCMP is $4000, just like a 2nd play regional.

It depends on the district. In the Pacific Northwest district this year, grants from generous sponsors covered all of the district championship registration fees, so there was no additional cost to the teams themselves.

Moretti

10-04-2016, 21:15

4290 has accepted their waitlist position. See you all at championships!

forbes

11-04-2016, 13:42

Qualifying teams from the 3 district championships and the 6 regionals this past weekend have been added to the registration list.

Only 28 of the estimated 36 regional spots were taken
There were 2 district teams that were already qualified (via regional, etc) of the 65 available district spots
One wait list team declined (team 157)

According to my count, with up to 153 district spots still up for grabs, the current open capacity at the championship is 28 teams.

s5511

11-04-2016, 20:54

What is the likelihood that a team who has participated in last years championship becomes eligible through the waitlist?? Is it above 20%?

Peyton Yeung

11-04-2016, 21:17

So far no IN team has made it off the waitlist. Hopefully that changes by this weekend.

tindleroot

11-04-2016, 21:25

So far no IN team has made it off the waitlist. Hopefully that changes by this weekend.

Agreed. Sending 1-2 more teams would give some really deserving teams a shot at making the big show.

ATannahill

11-04-2016, 21:41

What is the likelihood that a team who has participated in last years championship becomes eligible through the waitlist?? Is it above 20%?
The likelihood is 1/number of lottery tickets. We don't know how many teams signed up for the lottery or the distribution of them back to the last time they attended the championship (or their rookie year or the latest year of refounding) so we cannot determine the denominator. If I had to guess, I would say there is less than a 20% chance.

dodar

11-04-2016, 21:45

The likelihood is 1/number of lottery tickets. We don't know how many teams signed up for the lottery or the distribution of them back to the last time they attended the championship (or their rookie year or the latest year of refounding) so we cannot determine the denominator. If I had to guess, I would say there is less than a 20% chance.

And it would also change per team too.

orangemoore

11-04-2016, 21:48

And it would also change per team too.

The question was about a team that went to champs last year.

(We have 6/total # of tickets still hoping to get in!)

ATannahill

11-04-2016, 21:53

The question was about a team that went to champs last year.

(We have 7/total # of tickets still hoping to get in!)
I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you have 6/tickets. You get 2016-2010(rookie year) tickets. Best of luck.

orangemoore

11-04-2016, 21:55

I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you have 6/tickets. You get 2016-2010(rookie year) tickets. Best of luck.

Whoops.

No disappointment though.

Sperkowsky

11-04-2016, 22:16

We have 7 and are still hoping :/ so the odds of a person with 1 getting it are definitely lower them 20%

Sent from my LG-H810 using Tapatalk

jkelleyrtp

11-04-2016, 23:00

We got RAS at our regional last year and are on this year's wait list. Would we have 5/6 tickets? What are the chances?

ATannahill

11-04-2016, 23:23

We got RAS at our regional last year and are on this year's wait list. Would we have 5/6 tickets? What are the chances?
You would have one ticket. You get 2016-2015(last year you attended the championship). We still cannot tell you the chances because we do not know how many teams are on the wait list and how many tickets each of them receive.

logank013

14-04-2016, 07:27

MechEng83

14-04-2016, 08:21

Current Amount of teams qualified to worlds (on the Worlds list here (https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2016&event=cmp)): 420
Teams Left to send:
-Peachtree: 12
-Michigan: 76
-MAR: 22
-NE: 34
-IN: 12
Total: 576

Total at worlds: 608
Spots left for waitlist: 608-576 = 32

So based on my calculations, we should have 32 more spots (at least) to raffle off to the waitlist. I'm asking if anyone knows why FIRST hasn't raffled off these 32 spots yet. Thank you.

Edit: As I thought about this, is this so less teams that will qualify get waitlisted? For instance, 1024 is ahead by a lot in IN. Odds are, they just need to show up and rank well in qualifications and they secure a spot for themselves in the "next-in" teams. Is this to prevent good teams like 1024 getting the waitlist spot? So is that why they are waiting until after week 7 events to do the rest of the waitlist teams? Thanks again.

Several of your numbers aren't quite correct.

I believe the target is 600 teams. There were 608 last year due to a number of circumstances. I don't know an official number, so FIRST could potentially do whatever they want.

Indiana has 9 spots, not 12.

The 420 number includes teams from districts that have already qualified, for example, 868 is already registered, but they're taking one of the 9 Indiana spots, so there is actually another waitlist spot opened up for that.

The calculation becomes much harder to know how many teams, and I'm pretty sure there hasn't been an official decree of "xxx number of teams, exactly" to allow for some wiggle room.

I doubt FIRST is not releasing waitlist spots to see if a "good team" qualifies on their own. They have provisions in districts to give the waitlist spot for an in-district qualifying team to the next-in-line team. I know this because we got 135's waitlist spot last year. There isn't a reason to wait to hand those out.

logank013

14-04-2016, 11:06

Several of your numbers aren't quite correct.

I believe the target is 600 teams. There were 608 last year due to a number of circumstances. I don't know an official number, so FIRST could potentially do whatever they want.

Indiana has 9 spots, not 12.

The 420 number includes teams from districts that have already qualified, for example, 868 is already registered, but they're taking one of the 9 Indiana spots, so there is actually another waitlist spot opened up for that.

The calculation becomes much harder to know how many teams, and I'm pretty sure there hasn't been an official decree of "xxx number of teams, exactly" to allow for some wiggle room.

I doubt FIRST is not releasing waitlist spots to see if a "good team" qualifies on their own. They have provisions in districts to give the waitlist spot for an in-district qualifying team to the next-in-line team. I know this because we got 135's waitlist spot last year. There isn't a reason to wait to hand those out.

Oops. Sorry. I'm not sure why I put down IN having 12 spots. I've been fretting about the fact we only have 9 spots for the past few weeks. Haha. But still, there are 27 spots to give away at least right? So why aren't those being given away yet?

Hallry

14-04-2016, 11:17

Indiana has 9 spots, not 12.

Also, MAR only has 19 spots left to give out this weekend, not 22 (11, 1676, and 2590 have already qualified).

Anthony Galea

14-04-2016, 11:19

Also, MAR only has 19 spots left to give out this weekend, not 22 (11, 1676, and 2590 have already qualified).

And FiM has two less spots from 910 and 245 qualifying at WEGLR and Queen City, respectively.

forbes

14-04-2016, 11:32

Does anyone know how 5830 (Chesapeake district) or 4534 (North Carolina district) qualified? I don't think it's wait list (especially since 5830 is a rookie), but I don't see any other reason.

PayneTrain

14-04-2016, 11:41

Does anyone know how 5830 (Chesapeake district) or 4534 (North Carolina district) qualified? I don't think it's wait list (especially since 5830 is a rookie), but I don't see any other reason.

5830 was the RAS at CHCMP.

forbes

14-04-2016, 11:41

Teams Left to send:
-Peachtree: 12
-Michigan: 76
-MAR: 22
-NE: 34
-IN: 9
Total: 573

Total at worlds: 600
Spots left for waitlist: 600-573 = 27

Also, MAR only has 19 spots left to give out this weekend, not 22 (11, 1676, and 2590 have already qualified).

And FiM has two less spots from 910 and 245 qualifying at WEGLR and Queen City, respectively.

Accounting for the other districts as well, here is an updated total:
-Peachtree: 11 of 12
-Michigan: 74 of 76
-MAR: 19 of 22
-NE: 33 of 34
-IN: 8 of 9
Total left to send: 145
Total spots taken: 565
Total spots remaining: 35

forbes

14-04-2016, 11:45

5830 was the RAS at CHCMP.

Thanks, and 4534 won Engineering Inspiration at nccmp.

Sperkowsky

14-04-2016, 11:59

I wonder why first is waiting to distribute the last 30 or so spots. The longer the wait the harder it is for teams.

SenorZ

14-04-2016, 12:09

I wonder why first is waiting to distribute the last 30 or so spots. The longer the wait the harder it is for teams.

They may have already notified teams they have a wait list spot. But they the team gets a day to decide and decline. If all thirty spots get offered and declined over and over, the registered team list stays the same while the date keeps rollin' on.

logank013

14-04-2016, 12:47

Accounting for the other districts as well, here is an updated total:
-Peachtree: 11 of 12
-Michigan: 74 of 76
-MAR: 19 of 22
-NE: 33 of 34
-IN: 8 of 9
Total left to send: 145
Total spots taken: 565
Total spots remaining: 35

Thanks so much! I totally forgot about the district teams that already qualified via regionals. All in all, they still have pretty big amount of wait list spots to give out.

ATannahill

14-04-2016, 13:13

And FiM has two less spots from 910 and 245 qualifying at WEGLR and Queen City, respectively.

You forgot 141 won EI in South Florida.

forbes

14-04-2016, 13:18

You forgot 141 won EI in South Florida.

I counted 141 but missed 910 because they aren't listed as qualified on this list (http://frc-districtrankings.firstinspires.org/2016/FIM) for some reason.

forbes

15-04-2016, 12:53

24 teams pulled from the wait list today:

145
178
303
334
354
423
433
839
894
1123
1159
1973
2733
2823
3049
3501
3600
4085
4206
4335
4646
5166
5261
5410

Jrizo

15-04-2016, 13:22

4335 has accepted

433firebirds

15-04-2016, 18:27

Team 433, The Firebirds has just been accepted off of the waitlist! We cannot wait to see everyone in Saint Louis!

Kevin Leonard

16-04-2016, 04:22

24 teams pulled from the wait list today:

145
178
303
334
354
423
433
839
894
1123
1159
1973
2733
2823
3049
3501
3600
4085
4206
4335
4646
5166
5261
5410

It's good to see 145 on that list! They always build a decent machine with a ton of potential, and I'm glad they have the opportunity to go to champs!

I'm still pulling for 2791 to get one of the spots, though. Their robot is phenomenal.

lkg9999

17-04-2016, 14:31

24 teams pulled from the wait list today:

145
178
303
334
354
423
433
839
894
1123
1159
1973
2733
2823
3049
3501
3600
4085
4206
4335
4646
5166
5261
5410

Very happy to also see team 839 Rosie Robotics on the list as well!

youngpilot

17-04-2016, 21:33

PayneTrain

17-04-2016, 21:47

Any idea with how many spots could be left (if any) this close to Championship? (Along with 24 teams being pulled a couple days ago.) I'm really not sure when they stop pulling people from waitlist... (I'm new to waitlist this year).

It's going to be a very busy Monday and Tuesday at headquarters. They need to add all of the teams that accepted their bids from the weekend, then evaluate the slots they have left, then they will probably offer the waitlist spots in "waves". They'll notify teams, add whoever accepted their bids and remove the people that turned it down, then keep going from there.

I don't know how many slots will be actually pulled off the waitlist proper at this point and will instead go down the ladder from district systems.

orangemoore

17-04-2016, 21:57

The Registration Lists currently sits at 583 I would assume it is safe to say that they added all district teams that officially qualified this weekend when a bunch were added this morning (this might be wrong).

It looks like there are 17 spots open excluding any declines from the teams added on Friday.

And there could be even more. Last year champs had a total 608 team going because they wanted to ensure that they had fulfilled the number they promised. We won't know if they go over again until they do.

At a minimum it would appear there are at least 17 spots left.

The hope is still alive. (Even for us!)

Mark McLeod

18-04-2016, 09:15

593 this morning, although acceptances must still be being finalized.

TAlholm

18-04-2016, 09:30

Team 1991 just received our invitation, and we plan on accepting. See you all there!

forbes

18-04-2016, 09:41

Wait list teams added this morning:
237
810
904
1515
1991
2240
2496
2791
2839
3840
3926
4156
4192
5002

Previous wait list teams that declined:
178
2555
3501
5261

Hallry

18-04-2016, 09:46

I'm still pulling for 2791 to get one of the spots, though. Their robot is phenomenal.

Wait list teams added this morning:
2791

Ayyyy :D

Chris is me

18-04-2016, 09:57

2791

Best news of the entire year! Wooooooooo

Jonathan Ryan

18-04-2016, 10:42

It's good to see 145 on that list! They always build a decent machine with a ton of potential, and I'm glad they have the opportunity to go to champs!

I'm still pulling for 2791 to get one of the spots, though. Their robot is phenomenal.
Thanks for the shoutout Kevin, unfortunately, we cannot afford to attend. We thought we had a bot that could compete this year, but financially can't make it happen. Hoping to be able to attend next year as it will be Team 145's 20th anniversary. See you in October at the Rumble!

dmsinucity

18-04-2016, 13:43

I know that team 3397 applied for the wait list, but I do not see them listed. Can anyone help me find out what happened?

orangemoore

18-04-2016, 13:45

I know that team 3397 applied for the wait list, but I do not see them listed. Can anyone help me find out what happened?

This is the list created for Champs. You would only appear on it if you are invited from the wait list. For some reason the list of teams on the wait list has not been made public.

SenorZ

18-04-2016, 13:46

I know that team 3397 applied for the wait list, but I do not see them listed. Can anyone help me find out what happened?

Semi random lottery. If you didn't get an invitation (yet) you just didn't get your number pulled from the hat.

dmsinucity

18-04-2016, 13:50

Oh well, we were hopeful. Good luck to all the teams competing we will be down there cheering everyone on.

Ryan Dognaux

18-04-2016, 13:53

Oh well, we were hopeful. Good luck to all the teams competing we will be down there cheering everyone on.

Don't give up hope yet - there are still a few spots to be filled. Being local gives us a slight advantage in that we can more easily accept a last minute offer.

forbes

18-04-2016, 14:20

Added (invited from wait list):
1073
2228
2393
3930
4466
5261

Removed (declined their wait list invitation):
810
2496
2791
2839
4192

mdrouillard

18-04-2016, 14:23

(Team 772) We are still hoping as well. But with the deadline to release our hotel block fast approaching I hope we get a lottery win in time to keep the hotels....

Chris is me

18-04-2016, 14:28

Removed:
2791

As of right now, 2791's team page (frclinks.com/t/2791) still shows them as registered. I don't think they have committed to a decision either way yet, but that could have changed in the last hour or two. Is there another page with more up to date waitlist information?

tim-tim

18-04-2016, 14:30

Here you go Chris

My list is from some interpretation of the data from my website that is tracking the championship registration list: frc.divisions.co/history (http://frc.divisions.co/history)

forbes

18-04-2016, 14:30

As of right now, 2791's team page (frclinks.com/t/2791) still shows them as registered. I don't think they have committed to a decision either way yet, but that could have changed in the last hour or two. Is there another page with more up to date waitlist information?

I'm looking at this page (http://frc.divisions.co/history) which pulls data from this official site (https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2016&event=cmp&skip_teams=0).

nahstobor

18-04-2016, 14:32

2733 has accepted. We are looking forward to attending our first championship event in team history!

Chris is me

18-04-2016, 14:32

I'm looking at this page (http://frc.divisions.co/history) which pulls data from this official site (https://my.usfirst.org/myarea/index.lasso?page=teamlist&event_type=FRC&sort_teams=number&year=2016&event=cmp&skip_teams=0).

Well crap. I guess it wasn't in the cards for Shaker then... Too bad.

Brian Maher

18-04-2016, 14:33

Removed:
2791

It is my regret to report that Shaker is currently not planning on attending CMP.

SenorZ

18-04-2016, 17:53

Sitting at 597 registered teams.

forbes

18-04-2016, 23:35

Some late night changes:
Invited- 353, 2964, 4694
Declined- 894

Not a wait list team, but 368 was also removed from the registration list

TheBoulderite

18-04-2016, 23:57

Some late night changes: Not a wait list team, but 368 was also removed from the registration list

Kika Mana is withdrawing? It'll be a shame to not see them there this year. Their robot is fantastic.

araniaraniratul

19-04-2016, 00:04

2733 has accepted. We are looking forward to attending our first championship event in team history!

For how consistently solid y'all are, that's really shocking!

orangemoore

19-04-2016, 12:50

Large # of changes Recently. Some are likely district teams. (Like 193)

Added
3256
1539
1769
88
2493
1989
3135
5686
5712
4060
193
Removed
237
354
5261
4156
2240
3840
334
5002
2228

Under my current knowledge my team 3135 will be accepting.

With this update we are sitting at 600 teams.

forbes

19-04-2016, 13:04

Large # of changes Recently. Some are likely district teams. (Like 193)

From what I can tell, only 88, 193, and 5686 were invited due to district declines, the rest are from the wait list.

Also notable: it appears 5261 was invited (and declined) twice from the wait list.

forbes

19-04-2016, 20:36

District teams are still being adjusted, but here are just the wait list changes:

Invited- 894 (again..?), 5472, 5499
Declined- 4466

This brings the total number of currently registered teams to 599.

Lil' Lavery

19-04-2016, 23:58

Brian Maher

20-04-2016, 09:13

FYI, the FIRST district rankings page indicates if a team is "qualified" or not (as well as those that declined their invitations). This can be used to determine if a district team made it off the waitlist or is being awarded a points spot.

http://frc-districtrankings.usfirst.org/2016/MAR

Yes, but the two highest unqualified teams (5624 and 1989) are currently registered, as of yesterday, suggesting that list is outdated.

Lil' Lavery

20-04-2016, 11:49

Yes, but the two highest unqualified teams (5624 and 1989) are currently registered, as of yesterday, suggesting that list is outdated.

Or that both of those teams got off the waitlist.

Ryan Dognaux

20-04-2016, 12:01

Another batch of invites, this time some local teams included like 1329, 4931 and 4329. 4329 is accepting and will see everyone next week!

orangemoore

20-04-2016, 12:04

More updates to the Champs List

Added
371
1038
1329
4329
4931
Removed
353
1539
2493
2964

I'm glad to see 4329 on this list

Hallry

20-04-2016, 12:12

Yes, but the two highest unqualified teams (5624 and 1989) are currently registered, as of yesterday, suggesting that list is outdated.
Or that both of those teams got off the waitlist.

What are the odds of that?

orangemoore

20-04-2016, 13:23

Added 5167

We are up to 601.

PayneTrain

20-04-2016, 14:08

Another batch of invites, this time some local teams included like 1329, 4931 and 4329. 4329 is accepting and will see everyone next week!

Tight deadline .. Hope y'all can figure out travel!

Ryan Dognaux

20-04-2016, 14:31

Tight deadline .. Hope y'all can figure out travel!

Step 1: Load kids into vehicles
Step 2: Drive 30 minutes to venue

:]

Hakiobo

20-04-2016, 14:38

Step 1: Load kids into vehicles
Step 2: Drive 30 minutes to venue

:]
Benefits of being a local team I see. Glad to see both 4329, and 4931 have a chance to go to champs. You guys were great at St. Louis regional!

Sent from my 0PAJ5 using Tapatalk

RyanShoff

20-04-2016, 18:37

The random number generator seems stuck on local STL teams. I wonder what the defining radius is.

forbes

20-04-2016, 18:40

The random number generator seems stuck on local STL teams. I wonder what the defining radius is.

function getRandomCity() {
// Chosen by throwing a fair dart at a map
return "St. Louis";
}

orangemoore

20-04-2016, 18:55

More Updates and we are down to 598.

Added
2978
3147
Removed
1038
1329
1989
3256

I expect more changes to happen still

Joe Johnson

20-04-2016, 19:25

5167 Marysville, MI just added
Possibly to back fill for 3548 that was removed yesterday?

4694 Amarillo, TX just removed
No have why.

Joe Johnson

21-04-2016, 11:07

11am on TH 4/21
Removed:

371 Staten Island, NY
1515 Beverly Hills, CA

Added:

834 Center Valley, PA
3172 Salina, KS
4694 Amarillo, TX
5002 Collierville, TN

Ben Martin

21-04-2016, 11:20

11am on TH 4/21
Added:

834 Center Valley, PA

I'm very glad to see 834 qualified. It was very unfortunate that teams didn't value low goaling/ball manipulation skills enough in MAR during playoffs, as they averaged over 6 low goals/match for their last 6 matches.

ScoutMom700

21-04-2016, 12:46

Why do they keep putting some of the same teams on the list that were already removed? I have seen at least 3 that have been pulled twice. Wish they would just pull our number, we are ready to go.

PayneTrain

21-04-2016, 12:53

Why do they keep putting some of the same teams on the list that were already removed? I have seen at least 3 that have been pulled twice. Wish they would just pull our number, we are ready to go.

Whatever they are using to select teams probably does not remove all drawings of the team.

ScoutMom700

21-04-2016, 13:17

Thought that might be it. Seems that after a team declines that all there "tickets" should be removed. It would be annoying to have to keep declining every day because your number keeps coming up.

dmsinucity

21-04-2016, 15:43

Why would a team be dropped off the list?:mad:

orangemoore

21-04-2016, 15:47

Why would a team be dropped off the list?:mad:

Only if they declined( to my knowledge). Or if FIRST made a mistake.

Jack S.

21-04-2016, 16:04

I feel like FIRST is cutting it a little close with their plan to release divisions AND schedules tomorrow. Perhaps it's just me but I think a lot of these "add, wait 24 hours, drop, repeat" slowdowns could be avoided if FIRST were to send out a refresher email to all the waitlist teams perhaps over last weekend saying "hey, we know you're signed up for the waitlist, but please reply if your team would actually be able to attend at this late hour" and adjust the list accordingly.

All this adding and dropping from the list is agonizing. I know my team doesn't really have the best chances of making the list, but hey, what else am I going to do with the week off from school due to the entire city flooding?

Doug G

21-04-2016, 16:20

IIRC... they have released divisions in the past and still made minor adds/dels to the team lists without changing who is already in each division.

Hallry

21-04-2016, 16:51

IIRC... they have released divisions in the past and still made minor adds/dels to the team lists without changing who is already in each division.

Correct. This happened last year I believe.

Joe Johnson

21-04-2016, 16:53

ATannahill

21-04-2016, 16:54

Kristian Calhoun

21-04-2016, 16:58

IIRC... they have released divisions in the past and still made minor adds/dels to the team lists without changing who is already in each division.

Correct. This happened last year I believe.

Correct, but the preliminary match schedules have never before been published on the same day divisions are released. Last year divisions were announced on Wednesday, but the match schedules came out on Friday, which allowed two days for changes to be made to the divisions before generating schedules.

generaldgibson

21-04-2016, 16:58

Where does one view the teams that are currently registered for Championship?

ATannahill

21-04-2016, 17:02

Where does one view the teams that are currently registered for Championship?
frclinks.com/e/cmp

Joe Johnson

21-04-2016, 17:31

I have not seen an official answer but all signs I have seen point to 75 teams per division.

I don't remember but I think that FIRST had shown 600 slots basically until they published the list and it had 76 teams per division (one team from Carson got lost on the way to St. Louis or some such -- so there were only 607 actual teams competing). Perhaps that is the way they plan on rolling this year as well. Hard to figure FIRST out at times...

Ryan Dognaux

21-04-2016, 19:23

Why would a team be dropped off the list?:mad:

You guys were just added an hour ago FYI - http://frc.divisions.co/history

Joe Johnson

21-04-2016, 19:41

REMOVED

3172 Salina, KS
4694 Amarillo, TX
5002 Collierville, TN

ADDED

1466 Knoxville, TN
3397 University City, MO

I_AM_Clayton

21-04-2016, 19:46

You guys were just added an hour ago FYI - http://frc.divisions.co/history

After having the best season in our teams history, we surprisingly and unfortunately did not win an event or any awards so we were hungry for a spot! We are very excited to compete next week!

Ryan Dognaux

21-04-2016, 20:12

After having the best season in our teams history, we surprisingly and unfortunately did not win an event or any awards so we were hungry for a spot! We are very excited to compete next week!

Congratulations! You guys have a solid robot this year, happy that you'll get to play again officially one more time.

generaldgibson

21-04-2016, 20:58

Congratulations! You guys have a solid robot this year, happy that you'll get to play again officially one more time.

Thanks a lot, as Clayton said, we're very excited to be able to use our most successful robot again. I think that we were one of the last teams on the waitlist to be invited, if not the last, so we're pretty excited lol

Kevin Sevcik

21-04-2016, 20:59

Does anyone know if FIRST plans to have 76 teams per division as they did last year or if they plan to have just 75 (i.e. these 600 teams (http://frclinks.com/e/cmp) are the teams with possible drops/adds as they or is FIRST sitting on 8 more golden tickets they haven't yet put on the list just yet)?

Overclocked is still hoping against hope to get an invite and it feels less unseemly to hope for a newly opened slot than to hope one of the teams on the list has to drop out...

Dr. Joe J.I ran numbers in this or another thread. A bird told me the target cycle time was 7.5 minutes. Assuming 75 teams, that's 10 matches per team and 22 minutes of buffer time in the schedule. One more team adds 2 more matches and knocks the buffer down to 7 minutes. Given how things have run everywhere this year, I think they'd aim for 75 teams and the extra buffer time.

orangemoore

21-04-2016, 21:14

I ran numbers in this or another thread. A bird told me the target cycle time was 7.5 minutes. Assuming 75 teams, that's 10 matches per team and 22 minutes of buffer time in the schedule. One more team adds 2 more matches and knocks the buffer down to 7 minutes. Given how things have run everywhere this year, I think they'd aim for 75 teams and the extra buffer time.

It seems that FIRST is trying to have exactly 600 teams this year. And they are very close to doing so.

Last year we ended up with 607 teams. If they were going to end up with more they would have* given the spots out by now.
*It only seems to make sense. Every time they remove teams they add another to fill the spot created.

Jen Lawrie

22-04-2016, 05:44

ADDED

1466 Knoxville, TN
3397 University City, MO

1466 will be declining our waitlist invite. We were at Champs last year and, while it would be great to go again, we're going to focus that time and funding elsewhere. I hope this opens another slot to a team still waiting.

rich2202

22-04-2016, 07:29

I ran numbers in this or another thread. A bird told me the target cycle time was 7.5 minutes. Assuming 75 teams, that's 10 matches per team and 22 minutes of buffer time in the schedule. One more team adds 2 more matches and knocks the buffer down to 7 minutes. Given how things have run everywhere this year, I think they'd aim for 75 teams and the extra buffer time.

With 75 teams and 10 matches each, that is 750 robot matches.
750 robot matches with 6 teams per match is 125 game matches

Qualifications is from 8:30-5:00 on Thursday, and 8:00 to 6:30 on Friday, That is 8.5 hours on Thursday, and 10.5 hours on Friday for a total of 19 hours.

However, there are 2 hour lunch breaks on each day, so the total for matches is 15 hours, or 900 minutes.

125 game matches at 7 minutes per match is 875 minutes, leaving 25 minutes for the 10 Audience Defense Selection (2.5 minutes per selection).

guniv

22-04-2016, 07:45

1466 will be declining our waitlist invite. We were at Champs last year and, while it would be great to go again, we're going to focus that time and funding elsewhere. I hope this opens another slot to a team still waiting.

It was exciting to see another Knoxville team on the list, but I hope you guys have a good off-season. Was very impressed by your robot this year.

3966 still crossing our fingers to get an invite. Almost unbagged the robot yesterday because we have an event on Monday, but we found other things to do instead. We've never been and would love to go.

Joe Johnson

22-04-2016, 10:08

REMOVED

1466 Knoxville, TN

ADDED

272 Lansdale, PA
1209 Tulsa, OK

dmsinucity

22-04-2016, 10:54

Thanks a lot, as Clayton said, we're very excited to be able to use our most successful robot again. I think that we were one of the last teams on the waitlist to be invited, if not the last, so we're pretty excited lol

Yes, this by far has been the most successful robot built by the team. It is very exciting to just compete on this level and no matter the outcome all teams are winners.

forbes

22-04-2016, 10:56

REMOVED

1466 Knoxville, TN

ADDED

272 Lansdale, PA
1209 Tulsa, OK

My sources say 1209 has accepted.

Joe Johnson

22-04-2016, 16:03

REMOVED:

894 Flint, MI

bbombei

22-04-2016, 16:38

So where's the wait list for teams that want to go to champs I can't find it ?

Brian Maher

22-04-2016, 16:45

So where's the wait list for teams that want to go to champs I can't find it ?

I don't think the waitlist is publicly visible, but you can see the teams registered for Champs at frclinks.com/e/cmp/2016.

orangemoore

22-04-2016, 16:45

So where's the wait list for teams that want to go to champs I can't find it ?

That list is not public.

rich2202

22-04-2016, 17:15

2 teams added yesterday, and 2 teams added today.

One team added yesterday declined, and one team reportedly accepted.

The two unknown teams are 3397, and 272. 3397 is local so, presumably they would accept.

272 was added today, and is unknown. The roster is at 599 teams.

So, 1 more team is invited to make 600? And, if 272 declines, then another team after that?

orangemoore

22-04-2016, 17:17

Kristian Calhoun

22-04-2016, 17:53

Kevin Sevcik

22-04-2016, 18:04

generaldgibson

22-04-2016, 18:06

The two unknown teams are 3397, and 272. 3397 is local so, presumably they would accept.

Correct, we have accepted the invitation. How many teams does it add up to now?

orangemoore

22-04-2016, 18:09

Correct, we have accepted the invitation. How many teams does it add up to now?

We still are at 599.

http://frc.divisions.co/

Joe Johnson

22-04-2016, 19:15

894 dropped out earlier so since there hasn't been another invite, the roster is still at 599 and 1 opening if 272 accepts.

I swear at this point HQ should add 3 teams and whoever confirms first gets it. It'll hurt the 2 that are too slow, but the time it takes for a team to confirm is pushing the process out too long. Either that or they cut it at 599 and that's it. It's not like anyone but a local team is going to pull off a Champs trip all on Monday.

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.

Kevin Sevcik

22-04-2016, 19:50

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.I would hope the announcement about 2Champz will clarify some things like this whenever they get around to making it. I was assuming there would be an announcement or town hall about it at Champs, but I don't see one on the schedule. If there's a surprise town hall, I'd be willing to be an advocate on this for teams that feel slighted or in the dark about the current selection process, as would others on here, I'm sure. I'd need a crash course in district advancement and why your team thinks they should've gotten an invite, however, since I've been in Regional-ville for my whole career.

cgmv123

22-04-2016, 20:12

We still are at 599.

http://frc.divisions.co/

FIRST's site shows 600 (http://frc-events.firstinspires.org/2016/CMP) and all divisions have 75 teams.

orangemoore

22-04-2016, 20:16

FIRST's site shows 600 (http://frc-events.firstinspires.org/2016/CMP) and all divisions have 75 teams.

The secret team appears to be 5326

rich2202

22-04-2016, 20:21

The secret team appears to be 5326

Another local team.

rich2202

22-04-2016, 20:28

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year. ...

You would think by Monday after the last weekend of competition, FIRST could publish a list of the order of the teams to be invited.

Teams could then figure out their likelihood of clearing the waitlist, and watch the acceptances/declines. Teams could even pre-decline.

Sperkowsky

22-04-2016, 23:13

Call me crazy but the admin manual mentions nothing about First being allowed to specially invite local teams off the waitlist. I understand the idea but then there should be something in writing.

I wish the waitlist process was just entirely more open and know. It's this weird hidden thing throughout manual and everything about it seems vague.

But all in all its better then nothing. My team may not have gotten invited this year but we will either make it next year or have 8 entries and hope for the best.

Joe Johnson

22-04-2016, 23:18

Another local team.

Added.

5326 St. Louis, MO

It is unclear why but they have not been added to this list (http://frclinks.com/e/cmp) which has been the most "live" list FIRST was publishing (and is now showing division assignments so someone has updated that data but just not the last team they added).

5326 is listed on this list (http://frc-events.firstinspires.org/2016/CMP) which had been updating episodically (once day or so),

The freshness date disclaimer says "Participant list last modified Apr 22, 2016 14:55 event time."

For what it is worth, that freshness date seems to correspond to when they removed 894 from the live list and were only showing 599 teams (and still are only showing that number actually).

Strange.

Dr. Joe J.

forbes

22-04-2016, 23:22

Added.

5326 St. Louis, MO

It is unclear why but they have not been added to this list (http://frclinks.com/e/cmp) which has been the most "live" list FIRST was publishing (and is now showing division assignments so someone has updated that data but just not the last team they added).

5326 is listed on this list (http://frc-events.firstinspires.org/2016/CMP) which had been updating episodically (once day or so),

The freshness date disclaimer says "Participant list last modified Apr 22, 2016 14:55 event time."

For what it is worth, that freshness date seems to correspond to when they removed 894 from the live list and were only showing 599 teams (and still are only showing that number actually).

Strange.

Dr. Joe J.

This disparity has been concerning me as well. Either FIRST should publish consistent data within a reasonable time frame or they should take any sites they don't want to update offline.

Joe Johnson

22-04-2016, 23:42

This disparity has been concerning me as well. Either FIRST should publish consistent data within a reasonable time frame or they should take any sites they don't want to update offline.

If you want to REALLY get your undies in a bunch try comparing these official "FRC District Ranking System (http://frc-districtrankings.firstinspires.org/)" lists which purport to show who is "qualified" or "D.I." (Declined Invitation) or "---" (Did Not Qualify / Not Yet Qualified) to that actual CMP List. There are dependencies at every level for every district.

It is this crazy quilt system that FIRST presents to the world and declines to explain.

When there are discrepancies that seem to point to errors or disparate treatment of teams between districts, FIRST doesn't respond to repeated inquiries by e-mail. And when questioned by phone hides behind an algorithm and explains by saying they don't have to explain.

Not FIRST's brightest hour.

Dr. Joe J.

forbes

26-04-2016, 16:03

It looks like 1625 replaced 5931 in Carson.

Can anyone confirm?

nikeairmancurry

26-04-2016, 20:28

Accounting for the other districts as well, here is an updated total:
-Peachtree: 11 of 12
-Michigan: 74 of 76
-MAR: 19 of 22
-NE: 33 of 34
-IN: 8 of 9
Total left to send: 145
Total spots taken: 565
Total spots remaining: 35

Michigan ended up with 86 spots after it was all said and done.

Joe Johnson

26-04-2016, 22:45

I know it only affects a small number of teams but FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

I don't speak for 246, but I can speak for my own experience as a mentor on a team that was on the bubble. FIRST has been completely opaque. We've gotten basically no explanation of the process or how things would work or when we would know something or not.

Part of our team is convinced that a mistake was made and that we should have been invited based on our rank at the end of the NEF-DCMP. We brought it up with NEF folks only to be told it is out of their hands. We have brought it up with FIRST. No answer. Not a yes, not a no, nothing. When we finally called to get to a live body they didn't seem interested in hearing the argument yet alone explaining why we were mistaken. All they could say was that it is done by an algorithm and they don't explain their algorithms to teams. Repeated request for more info resulted in no response whatever.

Earlier in the week, when some seniors where getting worked up about a potential mistake being made, I assured my team that they'd be treated fairly. I can't say that now. Maybe they were treated fairly. Maybe they were cheated out of an invite to St. Louis. Who can say? It is done by Algorithm and FIRST doesn't explain its Algorithms to teams.

I believe that FIRST owes the community more transparency (any transparency would an improvement). One quote I heard from another mentor, "FIRST is a black box about their CMP list. They make their decisions and explain nothing."

I'll close as I started: FIRST should be ashamed of how they have run the Championship Invite List this year.

Dr. Joe J.

For what it is worth, someone NE FIRST finally sent me a table with some data that has convinced me that we were treated fairly, there was not a mistake in the invitation list at least as far as our team is concerned. So... that's good.

Still doesn't clear up the issues of transparency and timely responses but at least I did get something to reassure the team that a mistake didn't keep them from St. Louis.

FWIW.

Dr. Joe J.