2016 Einstein

[JABot67]

Einstein is upon us!

Newton Champs: 7.) 217 3476 4678 188
Galileo Champs: 1.) 195 987 1197 1065
Archimedes Champs: 1.) 1501 1986 5050 4828
Curie Champs: 8.) 694 3339 379 1511
Carver Champs: 2.) 330 2481 120 1086
Tesla Champs: 1.) 2056 1690 3015 1405
Carson Champs: 4.) 2122 2052 3538 41
Hopper Champs: 1.) 148 1678 364 2990

Newton vs. Hopper
vs.
Curie vs. Carver

vs.

Galileo vs. Carson
vs.
Archimedes vs. Tesla

EDIT: Bolded teams have previous championships. Underlined teams have previously gone to Einstein.

[Dezion]

8th alliance Curie and 7th alliance Newton. This will be interesting to see how they perform against 1st (and potentially 2nd) seeded teams.

[Dave Campbell]

Carver champs should have 120, not 910....

[mrnoble]

Go Taters

[trumpthero786]

MAR's Einstein representation streak lives on through 41 the RoboWarriors! Good luck to them and every other team. This is going to be a really good final set of matches.

[JABot67]

Team Breakdown:

New York: 694 1511 3015 1405
California: 330 1197 1678 3476
Michigan: 217 3538 5050
Ontario: 188 2056 4678
Israel: 1690 3339
Ohio: 120 379
Connecticut (and NEFIRST): 195
Florida: 1065
Idaho: 2122
Illinois: 2481
Indiana: 1501
Minnesota: 2052
Mississippi: 364
Missouri: 1986
Nevada: 987
New Jersey (and MAR): 41
North Carolina: 4828
Oregon (and PNW): 2990
Texas: 148
Virginia: 1086

Bolded teams have previous championships. Underlined teams have previously gone to Einstein. Bolded states/provinces/countries are sending their first teams to Einstein.

I am not sure about this, but it seems that 1986 is the first team from Missouri to make it to Einstein!

[pmangels17]

For those that are at CMP, does anyone have an actual approximate starting time for Einstein matches? I'm getting my timezones all confused.

[Starke]

For those that are at CMP, does anyone have an actual approximate starting time for Einstein matches? I'm getting my timezones all confused.

3:30 PM EST

http://www.firstchampionship.org/championship-schedule

[MrTechCenter]

For those that are at CMP, does anyone have an actual approximate starting time for Einstein matches? I'm getting my timezones all confused.

This might help, saw it on Reddit:

http://itsalmo.st/#einsteinfield2016

[pmangels17]

This might help, saw it on Reddit:

http://itsalmo.st/#einsteinfield2016

That countdown is wonderful but oh so torturous.

[The other Gabe]

congrats to 2990 on being the second PNW team to win their field, and the first team from oregon!

if y'all play a match, you'll also be the first PNW team on the Einstein carpet

[microbuns]

My predictions - this could really go any way though, I'm in no way confident.

QF Newton 217 3476 4678 188
SF Galileo 195 987 1197 1065
QF Archimedes 1501 1986 5050 4828
QF Curie 694 3339 379 1511
SF Carver 330 2481 120 1086
W Tesla 2056 1690 3015 1405
QF Carson 2122 2052 3538 41
F Hopper 148 1678 364 2990

[Carl C]

Districts represented on Einstein this year:

Chesapeake: 1086
Indiana: 1501
Mid Atlantic: 41
Michigan: 217, 3538, 5050
New England: 195
North Carolina: 4828
Pacific Northwest: 2990


Every district is represented except Georgia.

[TheStatisticMan]

congrats to 2990 on being the second PNW team to win their field, and the first team from oregon!

if y'all play a match, you'll also be the first PNW team on the Einstein carpet

Just curious, which PNW team was the first to win their field?

[indieFan]

Bolded teams have previous championships. Underlined teams have previously gone to Einstein. Bolded states/provinces/countries are sending their first teams to Einstein.


Does the fact that teams have a full student turnover every 4 years play into how anyone views these same teams? For example, 330 won their championship back in 2005. Clearly, this is not the same 330 team that is going to Einstein today.

[Kevin Leonard]

Einstein is upon us!

Newton Champs: 7.) 217 3476 4678 188
Galileo Champs: 1.) 195 987 1197 1065
Archimedes Champs: 1.) 1501 1986 5050 4828
Curie Champs: 8.) 694 3339 379 1511
Carver Champs: 2.) 330 2481 120 1086
Tesla Champs: 1.) 2056 1690 3015 1405
Carson Champs: 4.) 2122 2052 3538 41
Hopper Champs: 1.) 148 1678 364 2990

Newton vs. Hopper
vs.
Curie vs. Carver

vs.

Galileo vs. Carson
vs.
Archimedes vs. Tesla

EDIT: Bolded teams have previous championships. Underlined teams have previously gone to Einstein.

Hopper over Newton in 3
Carver over Curie in 2
Galileo over Carson in 2
Tesla over Archimedes in 2

Hopper over Carver in 3
Tesla over Galileo in 3

Hopper over Tesla in 3

1678 and 148 get their second World Championships each, with 1678 becoming only the third (and last) team to win back-to-back Championships. 364 and 2990 get their first World Championships.

[Kevin Leonard]

Team Breakdown:

New York: 694 1511 3015 1405
California: 330 1197 1678 3476
Michigan: 217 3538 5050
Ontario: 188 2056 4678
Israel: 1690 3339
Ohio: 120 379
Connecticut (and NEFIRST): 195
Florida: 1065
Idaho: 2122
Illinois: 2481
Indiana: 1501
Minnesota: 2052
Mississippi: 364
Missouri: 1986
Nevada: 987
New Jersey (and MAR): 41
North Carolina: 4828
Oregon (and PNW): 2990
Texas: 148
Virginia: 1086

Bolded teams have previous championships. Underlined teams have previously gone to Einstein. Bolded states/provinces/countries are sending their first teams to Einstein.

I am not sure about this, but it seems that 1986 is the first team from Missouri to make it to Einstein!

Before 2016, NY had been to Einstein twice, with 1507 in 2009 and 20 in 2015. Now we have 4 teams on Einstein. New York really stepped up our play this year!

[Basel A]

Einstein Predictions

Newton Champs: 7.) 217 3476 4678 188 F
Galileo Champs: 1.) 195 987 1197 1065 W
Archimedes Champs: 1.) 1501 1986 5050 4828 QF
Curie Champs: 8.) 694 3339 379 1511 QF
Carver Champs: 2.) 330 2481 120 1086 SF
Tesla Champs: 1.) 2056 1690 3015 1405 SF
Carson Champs: 4.) 2122 2052 3538 41 QF
Hopper Champs: 1.) 148 1678 364 2990 QF

[JABot67]

INSIGHTS

217 and 148 are each going for their third championship, though this time they'll be on opposite sides of the glass in quarterfinals.

330, 987, and 1678 are all going for their second championship.

1678 has been on Einstein 4 years in a row.

148, 330, 987, 2056, 3339, and 3476 have been on Einstein 2 years in a row.

987 has been on Einstein a total of 5 times.

This year, some fantastic teams made Einstein for the first time. 1986 has been a Missouri powerhouse for a long time, and 2122 has been excelling for years. 1501 and 2052 have also been great, and they finally get a chance on the big stage.

This is a big year for the state of New York, sending four teams to Einstein. It's also a great year for Israel - they sent two of their regional champions to Einstein - and for Idaho, Mississippi, Missouri, and Oregon.

[Thad House]

Just curious, which PNW team was the first to win their field?

492 won last year but never played on Einstein.

Also Curie was a perfect reverse bracket. 5-8 won quarters, 7 and 8 won semis, and 8 won. Has that ever happened before?

[Mark Sheridan]

Does the fact that teams have a full student turnover every 4 years play into how anyone views these same teams? For example, 330 won their championship back in 2005. Clearly, this is not the same 330 team that is going to Einstein today.

330's drive coach was the driver in 2005. Also 330 allows middle school students so their turn over rate is more like 8 years. I think they have only had 2 drivers since 2005.

[The other Gabe]

Just curious, which PNW team was the first to win their field?

492 was the 4th robot on 2056's alliance last year, winning their field

[Max Boord]

Einstein Predictions
Galileo Champs: 1.) 195 987 1197 1065 W

I hope:]

[Carl C]

Last chance for almost certainly wrong predictions?

Win probabilities:
QF - Newton vs Hopper (Newton 0.599)
QF - Galileo vs Carson (Galileo 0.691)
QF - Curie vs Carver (Carver 0.886)
QF - Archimedes vs. Tesla (Tesla 0.566)
SF - Newton vs Galileo (Newton 0.609)
SF - Carver vs Tesla (50/50, Tesla?)
F - Newton vs Tesla (Newton 0.709)

Let's see what happens!

[CalTran]

I hope this no live scoring thing isn't a regular occurrence for the afternoon.

[roboboy941]

I hope this no live scoring thing isn't a regular occurrence for the afternoon.

Along with no auton/teleop ending sounds.

Edit: There we go :D

[bam-bam]

Who won WFA? I heard Eric from 316.

[blazingbronco18]

Webcast? Don't see it on TBA

[indieFan]

Webcast? Don't see it on TBA

http://www.firstchampionship.org/watch-championship-live

[hyperhawk]

First match on Mass of Hopper v Newton would have gone very differently if there had been sounds and score displays.

Edit: oh thank goodness

[CalTran]

First match on Mass of Hopper v Newton would have gone very differently if there had been sounds and score displays.

Edit: oh thank goodness

They're replaying it, for those wondering about the edit.

[Kpchem]

Who won WFA? I heard Eric from 316.

The Woodie Flowers Award went to Eric Stokely from FRC Team 360.

[RonAyyyyyyyy]

You can do it Kelly!

[The other Gabe]

congrats to 2990 on being the second PNW team to win their field, and the first team from oregon!

if y'all play a match, you'll also be the first PNW team on the Einstein carpet

and it's official! 2990 is the first PNW team to have a robot touch Einstein! great job with that feeding strategy

[MARS_James]

So far I am liking the interviews on Einstein better this year so far

[Reed501]

What's with the lack of defense? These matches are so boring to watch.

[CalTran]

What's with the lack of defense? These matches are so boring to watch.

I mean, if you don't know too much about the other Alliance, triple offense isn't a bad plan. Now that they've seen the other 7 Alliances, they can start formulating a better plan for defense.
Additionally, many of these teams have largely undefendable shots or shoot from protected locations, so conventional courtyard defense would be fairly ineffective. An argument could be made for neutral zone delay tactics, but I'm not sure how effective it would be.

[Tartan47]

So far I am liking the interviews on Einstein better this year so far

That's Awesome

[Carl C]

That's Awesome

I wonder what their strategy was to improve them.

On a more serious note, I have been loving the Einstein presentation so far. Having all of the teams walk onto the floor with their standards was brilliant and despite the field issues, they have done a good job filling time thus far.

[Ravage457]

492 won last year but never played on Einstein.

Also Curie was a perfect reverse bracket. 5-8 won quarters, 7 and 8 won semis, and 8 won. Has that ever happened before?



987 was the #8 seed in 2007 when they won the World Championships, if I remember they called the Maroon alliance since that whole alliance had the same color

[jojoguy10]

and it's official! 2990 is the first PNW team to have a robot touch Einstein! great job with that feeding strategy

We were so excited! We'll see how we do!

[The other Gabe]

What's with the lack of defense? These matches are so boring to watch.

2990 was playing a sort of defense the whole game - by feeding their alliance balls, they simultaneously starved their opposition of game pieces. conventional courtyard defense would have done nothing for them when all three opposing robots could just shoot over them

[frcguy]

Even with 2990 dead, Hopper still wins. Crazy!

[MikLast]

5th QF was amazing. What happened to 2990 though? Seemed like they lost comms.

Also congrats 2990, its great to see a PNW team on Einstein!

[jojoguy10]

5th QF was amazing. What happened to 2990 though? Seemed like they lost comms.

Also congrats 2990, its great to see a PNW team on Einstein!

It sounded like the RoboRIO got reset. Apparently, the claim was that one of the low bar flaps hit our RoboRIO's reset button??? Not sure. I'm in Oregon hearing the noise :-)

[wendymom]

So far I am liking the interviews on Einstein better this year so far

The sideline reporter is Jonell Gregor. She was on Krunch in high school and now mentors 5816, is an Ambassador at the South Florida Regional and is on the Orlando Regional planning committee. She graduated from UCF with a mechanical engineering degree and now works for Disney. She also is the sideline reporter for Roboshow. We are super proud of her. She's AWESOME!

[bam-bam]

Holy cow! 330 with the match for ages!

[MikLast]

Semi 3 is one to watch, that was intense!

[frcguy]

Oh man. 330 just righted themselves twice, the second time in the last few seconds of the match to get on the bater. Unbelievable!

[Road Rash]

Holy cow! 330 with the match for ages!
That was epic! :D

[cgmv123]

Holy cow! 330 with the match for ages!

Not once but twice!

[Yipyapper]

330 actually just pulled off the play of the season to trump 254's play earlier. Down on its side, moves to get on its back, cranes itself up and then does it AGAIN and wins an EINSTEIN SEMI-FINAL MATCH by 5 which, if they hadn't clutched twice, would've been a loss.

Unreal. I've never seen something this unreal in FRC before.

[Collin4564]

That semifinals match number three was absolutely insane! Team 330 clearly worked hard and deserved that win.

[kaliken]

They did the same thing in LA when they got bowled over by 5012 in the finals. We love how amazing their drive team is!!! They are an amazing team. Glad we got to play with them..

Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk

[frcguy]

Woah, 1678 just slipped off the batter in the last 5 seconds! That match was crazy!

[indieFan]

They did the same thing in LA when they got bowled over by 5012 in the finals. We love how amazing their drive team is!!!

Do you know if they design into their machine how to right themselves if tipped?

[MikLast]

RIP the PNW dream. Congrats to Carver, was intense and great to watch.

[Yipyapper]

So close right to the end. Pretty heartbreaking to see the one red robot not hang at the top and slide off (I don't think it mattered with the score difference), but at the same time 330's crazy play in the second match is justified since they won it. If 330 doesn't win in the finals, that play will be the highlight of the year. If they do win, it'll be the one of the best plays in FRC history.

[Kevin Sevcik]

So close right to the end. Pretty heartbreaking to see the one red robot not hang at the top and slide off (I don't think it mattered with the score difference), but at the same time 330's crazy play in the second match is justified since they won it. If 330 doesn't win in the finals, that play will be the highlight of the year. If they do win, it'll be the one of the best plays in FRC history.actually the match would have been a tie with 1678' challenge and score

[XaulZan11]

actually the match would have been a tie with 1678' challenge and score

But they would have lost the tie-breaker. If they scaled, they would have won both match 2 and match 3.

[frcguy]

Here we go, winner of the third finals match takes all! This is going to be a good one.

[mrnoble]

Yes, will.i.am said that.

[JohnFogarty]

That Will.i.am interview though. LOL

[connor.worley]

Yes, will.i.am said that.

Is he wrong tho?

[mrnoble]

Thank you Disney for helping FIRST make a great game. Debate the merits of other years, but this is one of the best.

[SoccerTaco]

Anyone get the feeling will.i.am is excited about FIRST??

[SoMe_DuDe904]

http://oddshot.tv/shot/frcgamesense-20160430231114184

[JohnFogarty]

I'm ready for the tiebreaker thread :^)

[MARS_James]

Tied Match Einstein Winner Decided By Foul lol

[bam-bam]

Congrats to 330, 2481, 120, and 1086. One of the greatest Einstein finals ever played (2010, 2013, 2014, and the list goes on...).

[MikLast]

http://oddshot.tv/shot/frcgamesense-20160430231114184

i thought this was limited to just CS:GO. I hate Oddshot so much, never works with chrome.

[pmangels17]

Einstein matches never fail to disappoint, and this year is no different. Congratulations to the teams who left it all on the field! Great job 330, 2481, 120, and 1086, and to everyone who worked hard this year to field some dope robots!

[apache8080]

Congratulations to 330, 120, 2481, and 1086 but a Championship match tie break should not be decided on a penalty point.

[jojoguy10]

CONGRATS to everyone on all of the divisions! This was one of the most exciting FRC games in history for me! Hope to see you all again at CHAMPS next year (whichever one we're at #2champs)

[samthesnake]

Congratulations to 330, 120, 2481, and 1086 but a Championship match tie break should not be decided on a penalty point.

I agree 100%. I want to know what the blue foul was. Any ideas?

[Galum]

I agree 100%. I want to know what the blue foul was. Any ideas?

From what I gathered - pinning, didn't back-up 6 feet

[SoMe_DuDe904]

I agree 100%. I want to know what the blue foul was. Any ideas?

Likely pinning by the defensive robot but I would have to rewatch to see for sure.

[MikLast]

was pinning, upper right side of the field. Cant remember the time though.

[MrNick]

Best match on Einstein has to be semi 3. 330's amazing performance to pull out the win was spectacular to watch and it made it fun to then watch their alliance win it all. Congrats!

[drewsapple]

I think the foul was because the blue alliance rolled a boulder out of their human player station, over the ramparts, and into the enemy courtyard.

[gary325]

I think the foul was because the blue alliance rolled a boulder out of their human player station, over the ramparts, and into the enemy courtyard.

That is not a foul. That is a technique many teams perfected throughout the season. If it went through the low bar, that is another story.

The pinning by 1405 appeared to be in error. They did not prevent the other robot from moving. They were just in their line of sight to the goals. She would start the count almost immediately when 1405 hit the driver station wall.

The foul may have been an inadvertent hit of a robot when it was still over the outer works.

[Basel A]

Best Einstein finals I've ever seen, except for one thing: I wish we could've had a fourth match!

[purduephotog]

I couldn't watch via twitch... Reading the score it was 220 to 225……, 5 point penalty in favor of red which made it tied. Since it was tied then the penalty made by blue triggered the win for red?

[Kingland093]

Congrats to 987 on the Chairman's award win!

[Christopher149]

Did anyone catch the Make It Loud Award winner?

[Karibou]

Did anyone catch the Make It Loud Award winner?

Disney

[rpappa]

As someone who was rooting for 3015 and 2056's alliance (3015 because I'm close with them and 2056 because who didn't want to see them win champs after losing their first regional) it was crushing to see the match be won despite the score saying there was a tie.

In almost any other competition, a tie would be decided by extra play time. FIRST is becoming, for sure, a spectator sport. I know many people came to watch my team's events, with only a shallow knowledge of how the game works, because it is easy to understand on a general level. The team with the most points was considered the winner of the match. The teams that did the best overall, had the advantage going into eliminations. If the number eight seed scored higher than the number one seed, it was considered an upset, and was quite exciting.

So, in interest of FIRST being more appetizing to the general public, I feel like the situation should be addressed. Anyone not familiar with the rules would be honestly confused as to why there was the word "winner" under the red alliance despite each alliance earning 225 points, a confusion which I saw first hand as I was watching from home with a small group. The idea of a champion is already muddled enough, with a fourth team that may or may not contribute to an alliance winning, and with championship splitting into two events next year. Now, when you are calling four teams the "best in the world" based off one line located in 100+ pages of game manual, this definition becomes even more confusing.

The score says we have two evenly matched teams. It would be satisfying to know that one is truly better than the other based off more than just a technicality.

[Eugene Fang]

Please please please remove the tiebreaker rule for finals at all events, or at least finals on Einstein in 2017. I get the rule was instituted to save time during playoffs (5+ matches due to ties is never fun), but ending the world championship on a would-be-tie (especially for outside spectators) doesn't make sense.

I don't mean to take anything away from the winning alliance this year. It's just doesn't make sense from a spectator point of view, especially when sharing videos of what is supposed to be the pinnacle match of FRC to outsiders.

[bam-bam]

Really, the tiebreaker was put in place after 2010's tendency to result in ties. Ties are rather rare, and do warrant a replay in eliminations.

[The other Gabe]

I don't think ties merit a re-play. if the rules have been the same all season with the ties, why should it change at Einstein?

[bam-bam]

I don't think ties merit a re-play. if the rules have been the same all season with the ties, why should it change at Einstein?

If you were referring to me, I meant the 2017 season, not this year.

[tindleroot]

Some Einstein statistics for anyone who may be interested:

Now that I've updated my Einstein team database/spreadsheet, there have been some interesting developments in it this year. I've kept this spreadsheet for the past few years to have a record of every team that's played on Einstein since the beginning of divisions in 2001, and I also have a ranking metric to determine the "Einstein influence" of different teams.

The main teams I look at are teams with multiple Einstein appearances. Three more teams were added to this list today - 2481, 195, and 3339.

Similarly, I look for teams with Einstein streaks. FIVE teams (with a streak higher than 1) were added today - 2056, 148, 330, 3476, and 3339. 1678 has officially taken the unique second place position on this list with 4 consecutive appearances (pulling ahead of 175 and 67). 987 also has now pulled off a second 2-appearance streak (only 469, 217, and 67 have had two streaks before).

987 jumped up significantly in my influence ranking, as a semifinalist and with the Chairman's win. They are now tied in influence with 1114 for fourth. 217 jumped up to tie with 469 for sixth. 330 went up to 11th with their second championship win. 1678 is in 12th now and 148 is in 15th. 2056 is in 18th. 2481, 195, 3476, and 3339 are in 29th, 35th, 36th, and 38th respectfully (only multiple Einstein appearances are in this list).

It's crazy how many Einstein repeats there were this year, despite some of the classic big-name Einstein teams not being there. Maybe there are just getting to be a lot of good teams getting to Einstein multiple times (with twice as many spots, it's relatively easier to make it).

Final remark: every alliance on Einstein had at least one Einstein veteran on it except for the Archimedes and Carson alliances.

[Paul Copioli]

I think your data may be off regarding 2 appearance streaks.

217 had a 2 appearance streak in 2005-2006 and in 2008-2009.

[tindleroot]

I think your data may be off regarding 2 appearance streaks.

217 had a 2 appearance streak in 2005-2006 and in 2008-2009.

Oops, no idea how I forgot the ThunderChickens in that. Thanks for the help, Paul!

[Hallry]

1676's full-field footage of the 2016 Einstein Finals can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPUJJPXRAlET2fWoEdiFuMKI-pN-1gaSn. The rest of our Newton and Einstein footage has been a bit delayed due to hotel wifi, but should be up by tonight. Enjoy!

The Einstein Semifinals and World Championship Chairman's Presentation footage have now been added to the playlist.

[Caleb Sykes]

Really, the tiebreaker was put in place after 2010's tendency to result in ties. Ties are rather rare, and do warrant a replay in eliminations.

If we ever get a game with as low of scoring as 2010 again, I would be in favor of tiebreakers to save time. For games with much higher scores, and much higher score variances, like this year, 2015, 2013, or 2012, I don't like the tiebreakers.

At the very least, the winner should be given one additional tiebreaker point so that it is clear to the audience who won.

[AquaMorph]

I rewatched the final match several times watching all the referees. Not once was a flag waved to call a penalty. Likewise, I did not see a penalty either. It looks like fair play from each alliance. I'm sure there was something I missed but I have not come across anything that says what the penalty was for. Does anyone know what foul was called?

[Richard Wallace]

I rewatched the final match several times watching all the referees. Not once was a flag waved to call a penalty. Likewise, I did not see a penalty either. It looks like fair play from each alliance. I'm sure there was something I missed but I have not come across anything that says what the penalty was for. Does anyone know what foul was called?

Looks like the courtyard ref entered a blue penalty at 1:12 in that video. The ref had been watching 1405 for while. It appears to me that 1405 did not back away 6 ft and then wait 3 seconds before attempting to pin again. So the foul was probably G22 pinning.

[AquaMorph]

Looks like the courtyard ref entered a blue penalty at 1:12 in that video. The ref had been watching 1405 for while. It appears to me that 1405 did not back away 6 ft and then wait 3 seconds before attempting to pin again. So the foul was probably G22 pinning.

Yeah that appears to be correct. Thanks for clearly that up.

[LeelandS]

Looks like the courtyard ref entered a blue penalty at 1:12 in that video. The ref had been watching 1405 for while. It appears to me that 1405 did not back away 6 ft and then wait 3 seconds before attempting to pin again. So the foul was probably G22 pinning.

I was actually wondering about that. Naturally I don't want to start a thing, and I wasn't close enough to get a really good look, but it looked to me like our robot backed up the requisite amount. I find this evidenced by the fact that the ref seemed to halt her count and keep her hand up instead of finishing her count.

It looks to me that when we returned, 120 was clearly able to move, as they moved forward and then preceeded to turn and move out of the courtyard. Without interference from our robot, as we went to move to another robot.

I've never been trained as a referee, is there some kind of "intent to pin" that referees are supposed to look for? It looks even though we did return to pin 120, we never completed her process as they were clearly able to begin moving. Any thoughts from someone with more referee knowledge than I?

I'm extremely happy with this season, and our run at world's. I'm more so asking because if our driver was not entirely at fault, I don't want him to think he is. And I want to be able to tell him what to do better next year.

[JohnFogarty]

Looks like the courtyard ref entered a blue penalty at 1:12 in that video. The ref had been watching 1405 for while. It appears to me that 1405 did not back away 6 ft and then wait 3 seconds before attempting to pin again. So the foul was probably G22 pinning.

That's the strangest pinning call I've ever seen. The drivetrain of the "pinning" robot was perpendicular to the pinned robot for the majority of the count. That was not pinning. Pinning needs to be defined better so that calls like that don't happen. 120 could have turned and drove out of the corner whenever they wanted to find a different shooting position.

[jtrv]

That's the strangest pinning call I've ever seen. The drivetrain of the "pinning" robot was perpendicular to the pinned robot for the majority of the count. That was not pinning. Pinning needs to be defined better so that calls like that don't happen. 120 could have turned and drove out of the corner whenever they wanted to find a different shooting position.

From my experience, pinning this year has been called for the simplest of things. Defense is incredibly potent this year, but with so many refs seemingly trigger-happy to call pinning fouls (and also the possibility of undeserved red cards due to flips), we didn't get to see very much of it.

[jjkoletar]

I was actually wondering about that. Naturally I don't want to start a thing, and I wasn't close enough to get a really good look, but it looked to me like our robot backed up the requisite amount. I find this evidenced by the fact that the ref seemed to halt her count and keep her hand up instead of finishing her count.

It looks to me that when we returned, 120 was clearly able to move, as they moved forward and then preceeded to turn and move out of the courtyard. Without interference from our robot, as we went to move to another robot.

I've never been trained as a referee, is there some kind of "intent to pin" that referees are supposed to look for? It looks even though we did return to pin 120, we never completed her process as they were clearly able to begin moving. Any thoughts from someone with more referee knowledge than I?

I'm extremely happy with this season, and our run at world's. I'm more so asking because if our driver was not entirely at fault, I don't want him to think he is. And I want to be able to tell him what to do better next year.

Text of the rule:

ROBOTS may not pin an opponent’s ROBOT for more than five (5) seconds. A ROBOT will be considered pinned until the ROBOTS have separated by at least six (6) feet. The pinning ROBOT(s) must then wait for at least three (3) seconds before attempting to pin the same ROBOT again. Pinning is transitory through other objects. If the pinned ROBOT chases the pinning ROBOT upon retreat, the pinning ROBOT will not be penalized, and the pin will be considered complete.


Blue bot drives in front of red bot. Though it's perpendicular, they're against a wall, so the referee starts her pin count. She counts off 4 seconds.
As she's about to give her fifth "chop", the blue bot gets six feet of separation for a brief period. This is why you see her halt her count.
At this point, now that you're six feet away, the red bot is no longer considered pinned. The thing is, you must wait three seconds before pinning that same robot again. Since you only had six feet of separation for about a second, and then go and kind of reenter the six feet around the robot you were pinning, she considers the robot to be pinned again, meaning you have now tried to pin that same robot again with 3 seconds of the pin being over, meaning you get a foul.


I know it's not a very strong call and that it decided literally the winners of FIRST Stronghold, but the thing is, if referees second-guess themselves because it's a really close match, then their calls could get less fair because they're worried that it could be a deciding factor. The only advice I can give is to, when you're ending a pin, literally go to the other side of the courtyard, or start T-Boning a second robot immediately after you backed away.

[pmcoburn]

My thought for future tie-breakers is that ties should be replayed ONLY during elimination rounds ONLY in the event that a robot could be eliminated as a result.

Scenario #1: Alliance R plays Alliance B in 1st game of an elimination round. Tie is resolved by tiebreakers.

Scenario #2: Alliance R wins 1st match of elimination round, 2nd game results in tie. Since this is a possible elimination game, it is replayed.

Scenario #3: Alliances split 1st and 2nd games, 3rd results in a tie. Replay.

This would NOT apply to qualifications, since no robots are eliminated during quals.

[mikeh2338]

1676's full-field footage of the 2016 Einstein Finals can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPUJJPXRAlET2fWoEdiFuMKI-pN-1gaSn. The rest of our Newton and Einstein footage has been a bit delayed due to hotel wifi, but should be up by tonight. Enjoy!

The Einstein Semifinals and World Championship Chairman's Presentation footage have now been added to the playlist.

Thank you for posting the match videos. Your seats were much better than mine and it is great to go back for another look at the amazing matches played on Einstein in 2016. Are any match videos available from the official FIRST stream? While the full field/overhead vids are a blessing, seeing the real-time score would really add to the drama of the matches.

Mike Harrison
Team 2338 [Mentor]

[Road Rash]

Are any match videos available from the official FIRST stream? While the full field/overhead vids are a blessing, seeing the real-time score would really add to the drama of the matches.

Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjDSCT96K2w

[Hallry]

All of 1676's full-field footage of Einstein is now uploaded and can be found here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPUJJPXRAlET2fWoEdiFuMKI-pN-1gaSn. We have also posted our videos of the Opening Ceremonies and Closing Awards Ceremony in that playlist as well. Enjoy!

You can also find all of our Newton Subdivision footage here https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLPUJJPXRAlER7kJVE9S9R14DZnbqgem-I.

[TheBoulderite]

If Einsteins this year proved anything, it's that Israeli teams are getting really good. Last year, 3339 was the first Israeli team to make it to Einsteins, and were eliminated in the quarters. This year, both 3339 and 1690 made it, with 3211 appearing in the division finals. It's really cool to see, sort of like when Canadian teams started getting good enough to make Einsteins. I'm going to make the bold prediction now that a team from Israel will win it all sometime in the next five years.

[XaulZan11]

I haven't seen this brought up, but does anyone know why Semifinal match 1.2 (the match where 330 tipped twice) was "under review"? Perhaps this is too much of a conspiracy theory, but is there a chance they were going to issue a red card (which would have been very much in line based on how tipping was getting called) but decided not to once they saw 330's alliance win?

[Kevin Leonard]

If Einsteins this year proved anything, it's that Israeli teams are getting really good. Last year, 3339 was the first Israeli team to make it to Einsteins, and were eliminated in the quarters. This year, both 3339 and 1690 made it, with 3211 appearing in the division finals. It's really cool to see, sort of like when Canadian teams started getting good enough to make Einsteins. I'm going to make the bold prediction now that a team from Israel will win it all sometime in the next five years.

Having worked with 3339, and having seen 1690 play, I don't even think that's a bold prediction. Israel is really good, guys, and just wait until they realize how effective districts are in a few years.

[jspatz1]

Is there video available of the full Einstein playoff including the breaks and commentary?