Official Inter-District Interest

[notmattlythgoe]

This is something that I've brought up in multiple threads and I was wondering what the interest from teams would be.

If some form of official inter-district play (earn points in other districts) was available, would you be interested?

[Chris is me]

I honestly can't understand the argument against this. It's no different than qualifying at an out of state regional. Various protections could be implemented to prevent out of region teams from taking too many spots from local competitors, and the only teams that would have the means to exploit this system for a substantial competitive advantage are the teams who had no trouble qualifying in the first place.

[notmattlythgoe]

I honestly can't understand the argument against this. It's no different than qualifying at an out of state regional. Various protections could be implemented to prevent out of region teams from taking too many spots from local competitors, and the only teams that would have the means to exploit this system for a substantial competitive advantage are the teams who had no trouble qualifying in the first place.

I think most of the worry is making sure districts are able to fill their own events before their teams start using their plays somewhere else. It will basically add an extra level of effort on the planning side.

I know CHS is looking to add an additional event this year to accommodate growth. How nice would it be to be able to save the money and allows some of the teams to play in NC and help fill out their events instead?

[Ty Tremblay]

Why do you need to earn points outside of your district? The purpose of district points is to provide a method of measuring a team's "skill" relative to other teams in the district. Going outside of the district and earning points there detracts from that.

[Rick]

Why do you need to earn points outside of your district? The purpose of district points is to provide a method of measuring a team's "skill" relative to other teams in the district. Going outside of the district and earning points there detracts from that.

+1

[notmattlythgoe]

Why do you need to earn points outside of your district? The purpose of district points is to provide a method of measuring a team's "skill" relative to other teams in the district. Going outside of the district and earning points there detracts from that.

A couple of reasons come to mind.
- One of the complaints people have about districts is that they see the same teams over and over again. Opening the borders would allow different teams to enter the district.
- Some teams on the borders of districts are closer to events in another district than their own. This would allow those teams to decrease their travel costs by opening their options up more.

[FrankJ]

I thought the point of districts was to lower costs and give more plays for your bucks. Anyway. I am not sure how judged awards that have a district winner would be handled. Without that teams that are competitive for those awards would have little incentive to go out of district for point events. A third event would be fun, but given the total cost a close regional is still a better value. Currently for PCH there are 4 regional in the same travel radius as the closest out of district district.

Since our team is still run by full time students 3 in district events (2 district + states) and hopefully 1/2 champs is about as much as we can manage. (Please take this as a good natured poke at the pro teams out there and not a serious complaint) :]

[Ty Tremblay]

A couple of reasons come to mind.
- One of the complaints people have about districts is that they see the same teams over and over again. Opening the borders would allow different teams to enter the district.
- Some teams on the borders of districts are closer to events in another district than their own. This would allow those teams to decrease their travel costs by opening their options up more.

- I can see that as not being ideal, but seeing local teams more often is part of districts. I think the benefits of lowered competition costs outweigh this.

- This would reduce travel costs, but what about registration costs?

[Rick]

A couple of reasons come to mind.
- One of the complaints people have about districts is that they see the same teams over and over again. Opening the borders would allow different teams to enter the district.
- Some teams on the borders of districts are closer to events in another district than their own. This would allow those teams to decrease their travel costs by opening their options up more.

Seeing the same teams 'over and over again' is not a valid complaint for earning points out of district. FIRST is not restricting you to personally go visit other teams.

I would be 100% behind a process to allow border teams to join an adjacent district for a few years while teams/events build up in their area. Teams would earn points in the adjacent district then compete in the adjacent DCMP, they would earn zero points in their original home district. This would be a temporary and voluntary fix for that issue.

[notmattlythgoe]

- I can see that as not being ideal, but seeing local teams more often is part of districts. I think the benefits of lowered competition costs outweigh this.

- This would reduce travel costs, but what about registration costs?

- I agree that seeing more of your local teams more often has its benefits, and I don't imagine that half of your local events would be filled with out of district teams. But having the choice to once in a while hit up another district would be nice.

- Obviously some decisions would need made on who gets the $1k for the team, would it be split? Would the owning district keep it all? I imagine this could be decided between districts that opt to participate, maybe CHS would send $500 per team for the first 5 teams that opt to participate in a NC event.

[notmattlythgoe]

Seeing the same teams 'over and over again' is not a valid complaint for earning points out of district. FIRST is not restricting you to personally go visit other teams.

I would be 100% behind a process to allow border teams to join an adjacent district for a few years while teams/events build up in their area. Teams would earn points in the adjacent district then compete in the adjacent DCMP, they would earn zero points in their original home district. This would be a temporary and voluntary fix for that issue.

Who are you to decide what is a valid complaint? If it is something that bothers teams that are a part of a district why is it not valid?

FYI it is not something that personally bothers me. However, having to see me multiple times a year I can understand why teams want to go elsewhere...

[Rick]

Who are you to decide what is a valid complaint? If it is something that bothers teams that are a part of a district why is it not valid?

There are already opportunities to compete out of district or at a regional to see other teams. So the complaint is not valid when it comes to earning district points out of your home district. I completely understand it is easier for teams to justify competing out of district if they can earn points while doing it, but is it reasonable to change the entire district system in FIRST to accommodate a handful of teams that don't like seeing their neighbor teams 'over and over'?

[notmattlythgoe]

There are already opportunities to compete out of district or at a regional to see other teams. So the complaint is not valid when it comes to earning district points out of your home district. I completely understand it is easier for teams to justify competing out of district if they can earn points while doing it, but is it reasonable to change the entire district system in FIRST to accommodate a handful of teams that don't like seeing their neighbor teams 'over and over'?

Why does the entire system need to change? Why can't it be organized by certain districts between themselves? Why do teams need to be blocked from doing this?

Why could this not be piloted by CHS, MAR, and NC?

[EricDrost]

There are already opportunities to compete out of district or at a regional to see other teams.

Part of the problem is that very few events have open slots by the time district teams are given "open season" to travel. Between the school district needing a certain amount of time as notice, mobilizing a large team, and wait lists not going through, it wasn't possible for us to travel outside of FMA in 2016.

I see both pros and cons to letting points count across district lines, but I'd love to see some changes to registration so that we can see teams in other regions without jumping through dozens of hurdles. Being able to sign up for a NE or CHS event first and have it count for points would make it significantly easier for us to do that, but I recognize that "official inter-district play" isn't the only solution to that problem.

[Hitchhiker 42]

In my opinion, I say no.

My first reason is that qualifying to go to Champs from your district intrinsically means you did better than the other teams in your area. That's the way it should be. Introducing points from other districts could be detrimental to this. For example, if a team that wouldn't otherwise make it (but close) from FIM goes to play in Peachtree, it is clear that they will qualify. However, this means that the best in FIM are not being represented. That's a problem.

[kjohnson]

I would be 100% behind a process to allow border teams to join an adjacent district for a few years while teams/events build up in their area. Teams would earn points in the adjacent district then compete in the adjacent DCMP, they would earn zero points in their original home district. This would be a temporary and voluntary fix for that issue.

I'm not sure that completely removing teams from their home district is a viable solution to keep districts balanced. For inter-district play to work teams should still have to attend one points event in their home district and compete at their home DCMP.

We are 10 miles from the southern border of CHS, making NC district events lucrative to us financially. Last season NC was struggling to fill some of their events while CHS is looking at possibly needing to add an additional event for 2017. Inter-district play would benefit both districts.

[TD78]

I'm not sure that completely removing teams from their home district is a viable solution to keep districts balanced. For inter-district play to work teams should still have to attend one points event in their home district and compete at their home DCMP.

We are 10 miles from the southern border of CHS, making NC district events lucrative to us financially. Last season NC was struggling to fill some of their events while CHS is looking at possibly needing to add an additional event for 2017. Inter-district play would benefit both districts.

What Rick is getting at is that for teams like yourselves, because you live so close to an adjacent district (NC), you would actually leave the CHS district and become a permanent part of the NC district for some amount of time (2, 3, 4 years...whatever). You may live inside the borders of CHS, but you would be a part of NC, competing in its district events and its district championship. It's been brought up before...conference play, or something similar to that.

[Zebra_Fact_Man]

Here is my very selfish reason why I voted no:

My team intends to register for a non-FiM district early in the season next year (Wks 1-3) to get some inexpensive practice in for our two districts that count (Wks 3-6). If Inter-District Play becomes counted, we lose that option (unless we can opt out of counting that event's points). Regionals are a lot more money, a lot less matches, more days I have to take off work, and a lot smaller chance of making the playoff. A District Event offers us much more practice potential.

[GeeTwo]

I checked "Yes, but probably wouldn't use it", simply because LA/MS is so far from going to districts that it won't matter for us for a while.

Why do I like the idea of inter-district play?


Inspiration. Travel inspires those who travel as they see new places. People (teams) who travel inspire those they meet. Ain't that what it's all about?
Geographic reality. No matter how you slice districts, there are going to be teams located on the boundary, who will find it far more convenient to compete in several of the events in the "nearby" district than many of those in their home district. Some may find a way to "get a P.O. Box in the other district" and make it work, but some really are on the fence and could benefit from both. There are certain to be teams which will be more sustainable splitting their competition among two adjacent districts.