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View Full Version : YES! Suction cups and vacuum pumps are IN this year! BIG TIME!

KenWittlief
27-01-2004, 17:45
Hot off the FIRST Q&A website:
Q: <R54> The word vacuum is NOT in the 2004 manual. I don’t know if generating a vacuum falls under pneumatics. Is a commercial off the shelf device that creates a vacuum OK if we power/drive it with a motor supplied in the KOP?

A: Yes,a commercial off the shelf device that creates a vacuum is OK if you power/drive it with a motor supplied in the KOP.



this means you can buy commerical vacuum pumps and drive them with a drill motor, chilupa, or one of the others, and use a suction cup that is powered all the time, without having to play games with pneumatic cylinders and one way valves

Sweet!
ngreen
27-01-2004, 18:53
Yeah my team has already done this. I would tell design but I not able to disclose info. My lips are sealed. :rolleyes: Good luck though. But is good to see first allow their use this year. It might be a better solution than other ways of making suction i.e. the cyclinders and an easier solution to some of the games challenges, like even sticking to the platform as a defensive move.
Porterhouse04
27-01-2004, 19:01
As a rookie i must ask, can we just buy a vacuum pump and use it as is? I assume we must have to use the supplied motors in the kit for any application we choose. If we do have to use the drill or chip motors to power a vacuum pump, is it a straight forward motor swap? Any information anyone can give me would be greatly appreciated, i know very little about vacuum pumps.

thanks,
Sam
ngreen
27-01-2004, 19:10
Like you said you will have to use a motor from the kit. It can be a straight switch if you find a part that matches up perfectly with the motors from the kit...very hard and I'm sure you would be breaking several murphy's law if it did work out. The best hope and what you will probably have to do is find a vaccum pump that will work and re-engineer your kit motor to work with it.

BTW, you can use any motor in the kit, not just drill and chips. Cims or fisher-price w/o gears might work just as well or better. You will need high rpm to create an efficient vaccum.
Al Skierkiewicz
28-01-2004, 07:18
Well this is a big change!
I want to warn teams that intend to do this that motors designed for vacuums (blower type vacuum) are designed differently. If you use one of the kit motors, you may have to "leak" a little of the vacuum to prevent the motor from burning up due to the strange load produced by the blower with the inlet blocked.
KenWittlief
28-01-2004, 07:29
Our ME is the one who is looking for commerical vacuum pumps, but I got the impression he was talking about a piston device, like the compressor, that can be powered with one of the KOP motors.

When I find out what hes planning on using, I will let the rest of you know.
ngreen
28-01-2004, 11:38
Well this is a big change!
I want to warn teams that intend to do this that motors designed for vacuums (blower type vacuum) are designed differently. If you use one of the kit motors, you may have to "leak" a little of the vacuum to prevent the motor from burning up due to the strange load produced by the blower with the inlet blocked.

Al, this isn't a problem. Open up an impeller type vacuum and you'll see what I mean. Our vacuum only takes 1-2 amps when the vacuum is working. Oddly it was pulling 5 amps when there was no vacuum. Leaking air would only cause more of a load on the motor in this type of vacuum.
Al Skierkiewicz
28-01-2004, 12:54
Al, this isn't a problem. Open up an impeller type vacuum and you'll see what I mean. Our vacuum only takes 1-2 amps when the vacuum is working. Oddly it was pulling 5 amps when there was no vacuum. Leaking air would only cause more of a load on the motor in this type of vacuum.
Nelson,
As you say, full open does produce high current but the motors also essentially run no-load when the intake is closed down. This does produce a lot of heat in the motor from increased friction at the brushes and bearings, lack of effeciency on the fan and lot's of brush arcing. Just wanted to let teams know that there are risks...
CharlieWilken
30-01-2004, 23:23
Could someone suggest where one could find a vaccum punp and how are they rated?