View Full Version : The Regional Wars
Andy Grady
22-04-2004, 14:32
Atlanta was very cool for me because for the first time in 3 years, I was able to meet and have some excelent discussions with some of my midwestern counterparts. During these discussions, I came to one big conclusion....what happened to the northeast this year? Sure we had a couple of teams make a good run at it, but the finals were a Michigan and Indiana dominated set of matches! Over the years I think that there has been a definate split in FIRST reguarding the game style and teams in the region...i separate them into 4 major groups.
Northeast: Primarly a defensive region. Great past national champions such as Gael Force, Tigerbolt, Raider Robotix, and Rage and Aces High among others. A very competitive region where everyone is out for blood at the regionals and offseason competitions.
Midwest: Has quickly become the powerhouse region. Primarily an offensive oriented region, with champions like Beatty and Hammond (4 times over), the Technokats, Wildstang, Sunny Delight (now extinct), and Juggernauts among others. From the outside, seems to be quite a tight knit group...very competitive on the inside.
South: A good mix of offensive and defensive robots. Teams like Baxter Bomb Squad, Heatwave, Cortez High School, Space Coast, and other oldies make for an excelent competitiveness.
West: Another strong offensive division with a few very solid defensive teams. Home of the Cheesy Poofs, Kingman, GRT, among others. Region thus far has been pretty much dominated by the Poofs and Kingman, but other teams are starting to show some good strength.
You can almost see the rivalry forming between the regions. I know that in the northeast, very often we talk of knocking the midwest off the pedistil (sp?.) that they have been sitting on as of late...makes for some very exciting matches and great trash talking ;)
Now, the question I pose to everyone is this...
What do you think of an event that would bring teams together from each of these regions to decide who is the "King" of regions. Very similar to the Ryder Cup in golf? I think it would be very cool if you could manage to get all those teams in one place for something like that. ;)
Ben Lauer
22-04-2004, 14:38
I think it would be awesome.
I would like to see a regional regional, but how would you decide which teams could compete.
-Maybe the teams from each region would vote on 5-10 bots to go and play for them. Kind of like an election.
Chris Hibner
22-04-2004, 14:45
The Grady Cup??? Sounds like goooooood watchin'!
I didn't realize the Northeast trash talked about the midwest so much. I'm going to have to step up my game. How's about this: "You guys don't win anymore because you're all too tired from the shuffle board games at the retirement home. It's about time you dinosaur teams pulled your 350 HP / 25 MPH-going, left-turn-signal-stuck-on Cadillacs off the road!" Okay, okay. I'm just kidding - but I had to get a jab in somewhere.
Back to the topic... It does sound like a lot of fun. The only problem is that it would be tough to get all of the teams to travel for another event.
Matt Leese
22-04-2004, 15:14
If you are including Rochester in the northeast, there were two Rochester teams in the finals (i.e. they were Division Champions). That means, at worst, 1/6 of the teams were from the Northeast. While that's not exactly proportional, I'm not sure it's quite as bad as you seem to be making out.
Matt
Dave Campbell
22-04-2004, 15:28
Off Topic -
...Sunny Delight (now extinct), ...
Define extinct? Team 144 (P&G - WHHS, 1994-1998) moved to P&G - Northwest HS, 1999 - 2002 then migrated to P&G - Lakota East HS, the team # stayed at NW and has since been dropped. Team 1038 LEHS got the same mentor crew that existed as Sunny D :) Check out the history, you'll see evidence that they still exist. Team 144 - NWHS 2001 National Finalists, 2002 National Semi-finalists, Team 1038 - 2004 National Semi-finalists. Of course those last three years needed great alliance partners too!
Back on topic - I think it, "The Grady Cup," should rotate year to year...IRI, Beantown Blitz, BBS Brawl, California Robot Games, etc. and could have the regional "best of the best" sponsored to compete. It would have to have some careful selection criteria to take the luck of strong vs. weak FRC pairings out.
Ken Leung
22-04-2004, 15:33
What do you think of an event that would bring teams together from each of these regions to decide who is the "King" of regions. Very similar to the Ryder Cup in golf? I think it would be very cool if you could manage to get all those teams in one place for something like that. ;)
It would be very cool if we have the "Grady Cup" event. Each team get to qualify for the Grady Cup at the regionals they went to. Imagine only the best teams get to attend, and the best of the best play together to determine the king of the event. That's going to be totally wild!
There are a tons of west coast teams who would love such an event. You mentioned the cheesy poofs, kingman, and GRT, but there are few other teams who are not exactly famous to the rest of the country, and always have a powerful machine each year, like Beachbot 330, Thunderbot 980, Team 968, and team 852. And they are going to take the champion trophy sooner or later!
The "Grady Cup" has the potential to turn into something very exciting. Sure the logistics of it are rather complicated, but let's forget about that for now.
One region that wasn't mentioned was my little part of the world, Canada. Teams like 188, 1114 and 1241 would definitely be able to give some of the "big boys" a run for their money. Despite the fact that their money is worth more than ours... =)
It'd be neat if each region had to choose one three team alliance. Wow, that choice would be extremely difficult in the midwest.
Jeremy Roberts
22-04-2004, 16:00
This sounds like a fun idea and could turn out to be very exciting. After some brief thought I came up with a rough draft method of accomplishing this.
How many teams
Each Regional would be given one entry (entry could be one robot or one alliance) to the "Grady Cup" for every 30 teams in attendance. This would guarantee every regional at least 1 representative and mega regionals (like the Canadian one) would not be under-represented.
Choosing the teams
The representing team(s) from each regional should be chosen by their peers with guidlines saying that whomever is chosen must have made it at least to the quarter-finals.
Where
If this event were to take place I agree with Dave Campbell that it should rotate every year to a new location. The offseason events would be a good option since the competition structure is already in place.
There would be many details to work out (e.g. Can team afford to make another comp. trip?). Maybe Andy already has a plan in the works :) . Just my thoughts...
Michael Leicht
22-04-2004, 16:05
i pick the Northeast because of the bond with the other teams out there like 237, and 222, i can't forget 25.
OneAngryDaisy
22-04-2004, 16:16
i pick the Northeast there are alot of great teams out here like 237, 222, and of crouse team 303 panther robotics.
tune down the ego there, buddy..
the only issue I see with this is- money. Wherever it is held, there will be teams that can't make it. Probably half of them, actually, as it would cost over a thousand to drive, sleep, and spend a day somewhere far away from home. Anyone have a way to get past this issue?
Jessica Boucher
22-04-2004, 17:26
Hmm. Interesting. The question is, would discounts be enough to help, and if so, where would they want to be? (IE: Hotel's not so much the issue as is transportation costs, or vice versa). After that, it's just a matter of making the cost part of what you normally would fundraise.
shawny963
22-04-2004, 17:37
For simplicity, why not invite the winning alliance from each regional. Then the competition could be more of a finals atmosphere with no quals. I mean, i realize that there are duplicate winners and teams that wont make it. But if a team from an alliance will be missing, the other two could choose a replacement from their regional? Obviously this wont represent all the great bots, or even the best bots of each regional. But it is the best representation of what it takes to win a given regional. And if these alliances face off, the winners would best represent the strongest regional. What do you all think?
tune down the ego there, buddy..
the only issue I see with this is- money. Wherever it is held, there will be teams that can't make it. Probably half of them, actually, as it would cost over a thousand to drive, sleep, and spend a day somewhere far away from home. Anyone have a way to get past this issue?
As far as housing goes, rather than hotels why dont we actually make it "housing" as they do for like the Little League World Series and such where there are sponsor families that house a few kids and take care of them (i.e. travel around town, maybe evenb food, and a roof over their head obviously). If it is ever to be held at B@B I know my house would be open for a drive team (sorry 4 is the max I could get my parents to agree to.... yes I already checked with them :yikes: arn't you so proud of me! )
David Bridge
22-04-2004, 17:47
For simplicity, why not invite the winning alliance from each regional. Then the competition could be more of a finals atmosphere with no quals. I mean, i realize that there are duplicate winners and teams that wont make it. But if a team from an alliance will be missing, the other two could choose a replacement from their regional? Obviously this wont represent all the great bots, or even the best bots of each regional. But it is the best representation of what it takes to win a given regional. And if these alliances face off, the winners would best represent the strongest regional. What do you all think?
I do like the idea of finding the strongest regional, however since the game changed so much from week to week and teams kept improving their robots Im not sure that asking regional winning alliances to stick together would be fair. Just for example, 177s alliance won the philly regional, but since then one team that stands out in my mind that improved A LOT was MOE... for that reason we picked them to be on our galileo alliance. Perhaps letting the winning alliance captains from each regional pick two other teams in their region would be a better way since the alliance captain is often the deciding factor on winning the regional. Then each regional is represented AND it is a better representation of the region also (because some teams may have travelled the country to go to certain regionals). That method would also reduce the factor of deciding who gets to go and who doesn't
D.J. Fluck
22-04-2004, 17:58
Obviously this wont represent all the great bots, or even the best bots of each regional. But it is the best representation of what it takes to win a given regional.
Another thing, last year Wildstang really didn't become what everyone now remembers until late Friday of the Championships....same thing with 469 this year....they didnt make the elim at GLR, they were quarterfinalists at Midwest and then they were finalists in atlanta....
shawny963
22-04-2004, 18:01
I See what you are getting at, but I was trying to provide an accurate representation of a winning alliance at a regional. The captain of a regional doesnt just get to pick the two best teams, they must make intellegent decisions from a field of remaining robots. I guess I think that some regionals may have a few incredibly strong teams(type a), and others a well rounded field of good teams(type b). The question isnt what regional has the most insanely powerful teams, rather which is most difficult to win. By comparing winning alliances, you can gauge the difficulty of winning different regionals, fielded with different types of teams. I guess I would like to see if it is more difficult to win type a or b. Not which regional has the 3 best teams attending.
suneel112
22-04-2004, 18:07
I know its not cool to be egocentric, but here goes:
The Midwest IS WHERE ITS AT!!! LITERALLY In terms of robotics, the Midwest won at least two years in a row, one year with the winning alliance being made up ENTIRELY of Midwest teams
2003 (Houston, Texas): 469 (Las Guerrillas; Bloomfield Hills, MI), 111 (Wildstang; Schaumburg, IL) and 65 (The Huskie Brigade; Pontiac, MI)
2004 (Atlanta, Georgia): 71 (Team Hammond (aka Beatty); Hammond, IN) , 494 (The Martians; Goodrich, MI), 435 (The Robodogs; Raleigh, NC) 2 of 3 were from the midwest.
2005 (Atlanta, Georgia): 461 (Westside Boiler Invasion; West Lafayette, IN), ???, ???
(the last one was just an egocentric prediction)
Anyways, now that I responded with all my egotism, I think its time to get that out and just say that there are great, strong regionals everywhere! :D
(as long as everywhere means Evanston, IL; Ypsilanti, MI; or Cleveland, OH) ;)
Atlanta was very cool for me because for the first time in 3 years, I was able to meet and have some excelent discussions with some of my midwestern counterparts. During these discussions, I came to one big conclusion....what happened to the northeast this year? Sure we had a couple of teams make a good run at it, but the finals were a Michigan and Indiana dominated set of matches! Over the years I think that there has been a definate split in FIRST reguarding the game style and teams in the region...i separate them into 4 major groups.
Northeast: Primarly a defensive region. Great past national champions such as Gael Force, Tigerbolt, Raider Robotix, and Rage and Aces High among others. A very competitive region where everyone is out for blood at the regionals and offseason competitions.
Midwest: Has quickly become the powerhouse region. Primarily an offensive oriented region, with champions like Beatty and Hammond (4 times over), the Technokats, Wildstang, Sunny Delight (now extinct), and Juggernauts among others. From the outside, seems to be quite a tight knit group...very competitive on the inside.
South: A good mix of offensive and defensive robots. Teams like Baxter Bomb Squad, Heatwave, Cortez High School, Space Coast, and other oldies make for an excelent competitiveness.
West: Another strong offensive division with a few very solid defensive teams. Home of the Cheesy Poofs, Kingman, GRT, among others. Region thus far has been pretty much dominated by the Poofs and Kingman, but other teams are starting to show some good strength.
You can almost see the rivalry forming between the regions. I know that in the northeast, very often we talk of knocking the midwest off the pedistil (sp?.) that they have been sitting on as of late...makes for some very exciting matches and great trash talking ;)
Now, the question I pose to everyone is this...
What do you think of an event that would bring teams together from each of these regions to decide who is the "King" of regions. Very similar to the Ryder Cup in golf? I think it would be very cool if you could manage to get all those teams in one place for something like that. ;)
I never looked at it like that but now that I think of it you're right... hmmm... That would be cool to have some sort of competition and for the northeast to take it all back!!! :D
Northeast: Primarly a defensive region. Great past national champions such as Gael Force, Tigerbolt, Raider Robotix, and Rage and Aces High among others. A very competitive region where everyone is out for blood at the regionals and offseason competitions.
out for blood? That's putting it a bit mildly, if you ask me.
Bill Moore
22-04-2004, 22:17
Just for example, 177s alliance won the philly regional, but since then one team that stands out in my mind that improved A LOT was MOE... for that reason we picked them to be on our galileo alliance.
The reason MOE had so much improvement from Trenton to Philly to Atlanta is because our Competition and Autonomous Team literally spent every day working on controlling the robot better. The number of hours spent by those two teams was tremendous, and it showed by how well the robot improved through each of the competitions we attended. Even now, the Autonomous Team is still tweaking code for our off-season activities. Look out for us at PARC!
I know its not cool to be egocentric, but here goes:
The Midwest IS WHERE ITS AT!!! LITERALLY In terms of robotics, the Midwest won at least two years in a row, one year with the winning alliance being made up ENTIRELY of Midwest teams
2003 (Houston, Texas): 469 (Las Guerrillas; Bloomfield Hills, MI), 111 (Wildstang; Schaumburg, IL) and 65 (The Huskie Brigade; Pontiac, MI)
2004 (Atlanta, Georgia): 71 (Team Hammond (aka Beatty); Hammond, IN) , 494 (The Martians; Goodrich, MI), 435 (The Robodogs; Raleigh, NC) 2 of 3 were from the midwest.
2005 (Atlanta, Georgia): 461 (Westside Boiler Invasion; West Lafayette, IN), ???, ???
(the last one was just an egocentric prediction)
Anyways, now that I responded with all my egotism, I think its time to get that out and just say that there are great, strong regionals everywhere! :D
(as long as everywhere means Evanston, IL; Ypsilanti, MI; or Cleveland, OH) ;)
I think you mean 88, 126, and 173 in 2005 for Atlanta...
The south definately has a reputation as being one of the most brutal and defensive regionals out there. Teams like 233 and 79 are just two that i can think off the top of my head that are pretty descriptive of what a good southern robot is like.
Of course I know this idea won't happen but anyway... I think the best way to pick the regional teams would be to nominate a captain for each region and let them pick a lineup. Sure deserving teams get left out but selecting teams solely on regional wins or finalist appearances is quite flawed. Not only is there an extremely large amount of luck involved but due to the nature of picking alliances it’s unlikely that all the best teams are represented in the finals. Even if the #1 seed is the best team and picks the second best team at the competition their third partner will at best be the 17th best team. Keep in mind I think any team that makes it to the elimination rounds is deserving, my point is that often the best teams get spread out amongst the alliances. So I say just pick one of the big names, or a group of them if you prefer, from each region and let them fill out the rosters.
So, I would have the regional captain select 10 teams to represent that region and, just for fun, 2 alternates. The format would consist of a best of five matches between two regions with the winner moving on. Each team plays at most one match per round. Lineups are declared at the beginning of each round with all five of the two-team pairings and the match # they will play in.
Although I think you should just give the Midwest the trophy now. :)
111 & 494 – Worked at nationals.
93 & 67 – 93 catches ALL the balls, 67 caps it and hangs.
33 & 111 – 33 fills the goal, 111 caps and hangs.
45 & 47 – Lots of small balls, 45 caps while 47 hangs.
461 & 469 – With both goals full of balls and doubled why hang?
Also please keep in mind this is a quick list during my break from circuits. I definitely forgot some teams and, with only 10 spots, didn’t get to put in all the great ones I did remember. I would expect anyone given the job of filling out this team for real would have quite the hard time.
As far as getting all those teams in one place, well, that would pretty much be impossible but to save on hotel costs everyone can stay at my house! I do think a location could be found within driving distance for a Midwest vs. NE showdown but those Cali teams are so far away...
btw... what about the Canadians, or the Brazilians for that matter.
-dtk
Berserker
23-04-2004, 09:12
I know its not cool to be egocentric, but here goes:
The Midwest IS WHERE ITS AT!!! LITERALLY In terms of robotics, the Midwest won at least two years in a row, one year with the winning alliance being made up ENTIRELY of Midwest teams
but this year the northeast had a lot of really good robots....
365, 222, 25, 175, 303, 11, 237, 88, 56, and many others
Chris Hibner
23-04-2004, 09:33
I know its not cool to be egocentric, but here goes:
The Midwest IS WHERE ITS AT!!! LITERALLY In terms of robotics, the Midwest won at least two years in a row, one year with the winning alliance being made up ENTIRELY of Midwest teams
2003 (Houston, Texas): 469 (Las Guerrillas; Bloomfield Hills, MI), 111 (Wildstang; Schaumburg, IL) and 65 (The Huskie Brigade; Pontiac, MI)
2004 (Atlanta, Georgia): 71 (Team Hammond (aka Beatty); Hammond, IN) , 494 (The Martians; Goodrich, MI), 435 (The Robodogs; Raleigh, NC) 2 of 3 were from the midwest.
2005 (Atlanta, Georgia): 461 (Westside Boiler Invasion; West Lafayette, IN), ???, ???
(the last one was just an egocentric prediction)
Anyways, now that I responded with all my egotism, I think its time to get that out and just say that there are great, strong regionals everywhere! :D
(as long as everywhere means Evanston, IL; Ypsilanti, MI; or Cleveland, OH) ;)
I want to continue suneel's post (I'm going to stick with the midwest / northeast rivalry here, so I'm going to leave out the teams from the other regions) ...
2003 finalists: 494 (midwest), 25 (northeast)
2002 Champions: 71, 66 (midwest), and 173 (northest).
2002 Finalist: 308 (midwest), 311 (northeast)
2001 Champions: 71 (midwest), 365 (northeast)
2001 Finalists: 111, 33, 349, 144 (midwest)
2000 Champions: 25 (northeast)
2000 Finalists: 111 (midwest), 126 (northeast)
(sorry, my memory is pretty fuzzy from 2000 and 1999)
1999 Champions 176 (northeast), 1 (midwest)
1999 Finalists: 111, 45 (midwest)
1998 Champion: 45 (midwest)
1998 Finalist: 121 (northeast)
1997 Champion: 71 (midwest)
1997 Finalist: 47 (midwest)
(Note: 1997 team numbers are the CURRENT numbers for those teams).
So, since 1997 (since I've been involved in FIRST), the number of championship and finalist participants have been (according to my fuzzy memory):
Midwest: 22
Northeast: 8
Granted, I think I may have missed a couple in 1999 and 2000, but it appears the midwest has the edge. Hey Andy, thanks for getting the ball rolling on the trash-talking thing. :D
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 09:43
Granted, I think I may have missed a couple in 1999 and 2000, but it appears the midwest has the edge. Hey Andy, thanks for getting the ball rolling on the trash-talking thing. :D
You see Chris...we in the Northeast don't dwell on the past. To us, its all about next year (i.e. Boston Red Sox Fans). By the way, you missed Chaos in 2000, Gael Force in 1995, Tigerbolt in 1996, and Gael Force in 1992. Thank you, come again!
The northeast will return next year, full force...be afraid, be very afraid!
-Andy Grady
Granted, I think I may have missed a couple in 1999 and 2000, but it appears the midwest has the edge. Hey Andy, thanks for getting the ball rolling on the trash-talking thing. :D
To fill in some of the blanks...
The 2000 National Finalists were Teams 126, 131 and 102, all from the Northeast
The 1999 National Champions included Team 48, from the Midwest.
Chris Hibner
23-04-2004, 09:52
You see Chris...we in the Northeast don't dwell on the past. To us, its all about next year (i.e. Boston Red Sox Fans). By the way, you missed Chaos in 2000, Gael Force in 1995, Tigerbolt in 1996, and Gael Force in 1992. Thank you, come again!
The northeast will return next year, full force...be afraid, be very afraid!
-Andy Grady
I guess my memory wasn't too bad (only missing Chaos in 2000). I guess I'll bump that record to 22-9. I only listed the years in which I was at the competition - I joined in 1997. So sorry about missing the "ancient history" part.
You should try and make it to the IRI this year to see how the midwest teams do it up. Oh right! You were at nationals, so by watching the finals you already saw how the midwest teams do it. (This is getting fun!)
Okay, Andy - I'm going to stop now (I promise). You should know that I respect the northeast as much as anyone. You guys are great. Seriously though, you should come to the IRI. It's a great time.
The northeast will return next year, full force...be afraid, be very afraid!
-Andy Grady
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 10:23
I guess my memory wasn't too bad (only missing Chaos in 2000). I guess I'll bump that record to 22-9. I only listed the years in which I was at the competition - I joined in 1997. So sorry about missing the "ancient history" part.
Ohhhhhh how convenient that you didn't start FIRST until after the age when the Northeast dominated all of FIRST! We are planning on making our move soon enough, dont you worry! :D
Who knows...maybe at a certain possible undisclosed special event in 2005, we might be able to find out who really is the best region once and for all. ;)
By the way, you can keep talking trash all ya want...I think its fun, and it adds to the rivalry...just as long as it stays fun and there are no personal attacks or anything like that.
-Andy Grady
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 10:26
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
Well, I dunno if the Gael Force and R2 will be in the same event at any point this summer, but I will say this...
I may very well be a "free agent" at a certain event comming up in June. My strategy and/or coaching abilities may be available to any team who might be daring enough to make me the correct offer for my services ;)
Ken Leung
23-04-2004, 10:46
2000 Champions: 25 (northeast)
2000 Finalists: 111 (midwest), 126 (northeast)
(sorry, my memory is pretty fuzzy from 2000 and 1999)
Granted, I think I may have missed a couple in 1999 and 2000, but it appears the midwest has the edge. Hey Andy, thanks for getting the ball rolling on the trash-talking thing. :D
And how convenient that you "forgot" about the other 2 year 2000 champions, Team 255 and 232, both from California. I keep telling people, we are due to have a west coast champion sooner or later, you guys just watch out. Soon as the divisions work out the way they should ;-).
Andy Baker
23-04-2004, 10:47
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
Bring it on! I would bet that a mixture of numerous Indiana teams could whoop your butt. :)
Andy B.
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 10:50
Bring it on! I would bet that a mixture of numerous Indiana teams could whoop your butt. :)
Andy B.
Ahhh but you are forgetting Mr. Baker....collectively, John and I know more about you and your robots, than you know about you and your robots! I seem to remember last time 45 crossed the path of a team I was on...they ended up missing a tread after the match ;)
(And the rivalry heats up!)
-Andy Grady
Bring it on! I would bet that a mixture of numerous Indiana teams could whoop your butt. :)
Andy B.
Ohh no, I'm soooooooo scared!
Cmon Baker, pick your alliance. Don't limit yourself... pick from anywhere in the Midwest...
Better yet, make it a mentors grudge match. Grady drives his robot, Joel drives our robot. I'll coach.
Are you ready for a full season of pent up "Joel-can't-drive-aggresion"? The man is an artist with a joystick... Are you ready for that?
I don't think so.
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 11:05
Are you ready for a full season of pent up "Joel-can't-drive-aggresion"? The man is an artist with a joystick... Are you ready for that?
I don't think so.
And if you think Joel will be agressive after not driving for one year, imagine how crazy im gonna go not having driven for 6 years!!! One thing is for sure...you older midwest engineers have NO chance of outdriving Joel and I, two people who were once masters of the FIRST joysticks!
Just bring it!
-Andy Grady
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
John,
I'm always up for a challenge. Bring your robot up to Wonderland and we can try this out.
Tom Bottiglieri
23-04-2004, 11:18
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
Or, how about you guys come down to CT for a little bit of 716 and 195 :) :)
I'm sure that would be a fun match up
John,
I'm always up for a challenge. Bring your robot up to Wonderland and we can try this out.
Silly Canadian,
How about YOU come to US! ;)
(Actually, I'm not gonna be anywhere near my robot this summer... Whatever off-seasons 229 ends up at, isn't my decision at all, it's all up to the kids... maybe they WILL come to Canadia. *shrug*)
John
Silly Canadian,
How about YOU come to US! ;)
(Actually, I'm not gonna be anywhere near my robot this summer... Whatever off-seasons 229 ends up at, isn't my decision at all, it's all up to the kids... maybe they WILL come to Canadia. *shrug*)
John
I think I've spent more time in the States over the past month and a half than I have in Canada. Canadian teams are always travelling down south. This summer I invite all the American teams who've never come up north, (or haven't since 2002, hint hint 229) for the Wonderland challenge. You might just like up here.
Why wouldn't you guys come, you wouldn't be scared of some little Canadian robots, would ya?
Trash talking across borders. Yee-haw.
This summer I invite all the American teams who've never come up north, (or haven't since 2002, hint hint 229) for the Wonderland challenge. You might just like up here.
Why wouldn't you guys come, you wouldn't be scared of some little Canadian robots, would ya?
Trash talking across borders. Yee-haw.We had too much trouble with spending money.
The HS kids get in the mentality of: "It's not REAL money, it's Canadian money... it looks like it came out of a Monopoly game!"
Plus there is the whole drinking age thing, just leads to trouble. ;)
We already won you a gold, what more do you want from us?? ;)
We had too much trouble with spending money.
The HS kids get in the mentality of: "It's not REAL money, it's Canadian money... it looks like it came out of a Monopoly game!"
Plus there is the whole drinking age thing, just leads to trouble. ;)
We already won you a gold, what more do you want from us?? ;)
I don't know about you, but I always end up with all the money at the end of my monopoly games. :cool:
Are you sure you'll be able to compete at an event without us? I mean, when something goes wrong with your robot, who's going to fix it? ;)
I think I've spent more time in the States over the past month and a half than I have in Canada. Canadian teams are always travelling down south. This summer I invite all the American teams who've never come up north, (or haven't since 2002, hint hint 229) for the Wonderland challenge. You might just like up here.
Why wouldn't you guys come, you wouldn't be scared of some little Canadian robots, would ya?
Trash talking across borders. Yee-haw.
Funny you say NORTH Karthik considering that the Toronto area is actually south of Potsdam. May we will venture back over the border someday to win one with you guys on your home turf. (or beat you, either way it doesn’t matter much to us :) )
We will see what we can do about getting over there, sometimes border crossing is a little tight "We have this robot, and all these electronics...oh, and a bunch of batteries to power it with, please let us cross" usually doesn't go over to well.
Eric
Andy Baker
23-04-2004, 11:54
Ohh no, I'm soooooooo scared! Cmon Baker, pick your alliance. Don't limit yourself... pick from anywhere in the Midwest...
Better yet, make it a mentors grudge match. Grady drives his robot, Joel drives our robot. I'll coach. Are you ready for a full season of pent up "Joel-can't-drive-aggresion"? The man is an artist with a joystick... Are you ready for that?
I don't think so.
And if you think Joel will be agressive after not driving for one year, imagine how crazy im gonna go not having driven for 6 years!!! One thing is for sure...you older midwest engineers have NO chance of outdriving Joel and I, two people who were once masters of the FIRST joysticks! Just bring it!
-Andy Grady
My heavens, look at the trash talking from these two has-been-drivers. It's pretty sad, really. Sad to see these two guys cling to their former glory, much like an old, washed up jock who likes to tell tall tales. Worse yet, that uppity V-Neun is dragging a fine young man, Joel Johnson, into this helplessness.
The only way that this "match-up" could ever happen is if 126 and 229 would bring their robots to Indiana for the July 9-10th IRI. Many good midwest teams will be there, and you could even pick our partner for us.
As for driving, I am terrible. The last time I drove, I put a hole in our alliance station wall (2001) after going airborne off the ramp. Needless to say, I will let our students drive. They are much better at it than I and I don't have any has-been dreams that I need to prove. :)
So, I'm up for the challenge... bring it on. But, you gotta bring it to Indy.
Andy B.
What JVN got out of that post:
Blah Blah Blah Blah, Whine Whine Whine Whine, Blah Blah Blah Blah, Whine Whine Whine Whine
Blah Blah Blah, come to my home turf, blah blah, I'm scared to face you anywhere else. Whine Whine Whine, Blah Blah Blah
I suck at Driving, Whine Whine, Excuses, Excuses, Blah Blah.
Andy B.
I'll see if I can make it happen. ;)
John
It is easy to trash talk when you know you won't show up. Here in Canada we have a better deal for you than you have for us. Our food is cheaper, our hotels are cheaper and our dollar is worth less. What do you have to lose except your dignity? We Canadians are great hosts but we won't give you a match. I think that with Karthiks approval, Team 188 and Team 1114 will challenge ANY 2 American teams that dare cross our borders. Let us see if you dare. Canadian teams have always come to the US teams, now it's your turn to step up. :p
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 12:19
My heavens, look at the trash talking from these two has-been-drivers. It's pretty sad, really. Sad to see these two guys cling to their former glory, much like an old, washed up jock who likes to tell tall tales. Worse yet, that uppity V-Neun is dragging a fine young man, Joel Johnson, into this helplessness.
Andy B.
Problem is, I wouldn't be holding onto my former glory if you midwesterners would stop ducking me! ;)
As for IRI...well, it all depends on my situation, but maybe if I am able to make it, I can adopt a team for a weekend and show you how it is really done :D
We will see what we can do about getting over there, sometimes border crossing is a little tight "We have this robot, and all these electronics...oh, and a bunch of batteries to power it with, please let us cross" usually doesn't go over to well.
Eric,
Getting across the border with a robot really isn't that hard. As long as you let them know it's for exhibition purposes only, there usually isn't much trouble. We drove our second robot to three events in America this year, and had no problems.
It is easy to trash talk when you know you won't show up. Here in Canada we have a better deal for you than you have for us. Our food is cheaper, our hotels are cheaper and our dollar is worth less. What do you have to lose except your dignity? We Canadians are great hosts but we won't give you a match. I think that with Karthiks approval, Team 188 and Team 1114 will challenge ANY 2 American teams that dare cross our borders. Let us see if you dare. Canadian teams have always come to the US teams, now it's your turn to step up. :p
I'll second Steve's comment. Team 188 and 1114 are issuing an open challenge to anyone who wants to try us. The power of 188 and the grace 1114. I'd like to see anyone match that. Oh yeah, if we need a small ball team, we've always got 1241. =)
As for driving, I am terrible. The last time I drove, I put a hole in our alliance station wall (2001) after going airborne off the ramp. Needless to say, I will let our students drive. They are much better at it than I and I don't have any has-been dreams that I need to prove. :)
Andy,
I'm glad I'm not the only one who's broken a wall. This year I knocked out a plywood board or two when I tried strafing around the field. Don't worry, my true talents are in my shooting ability. I'll take all challengers in a shoot out. This kid is baller and a shot caller.
So Clarkson is a possibility... Who else is in? Mr. Baker, I'm looking in your direction. You know you want to come.
Canada's Wonderland, June 5-6. Be there.
karthik--- you don't konw how bad I want to go to Winter Wonderland... I think that it is possible for TJ to be there... I have been practically begging Mrs. Calef and I think she likes the idea... Especially since it is cheaper than some competitions... The problem for us would be the bus situation... hmmm I don't know... I'm praying TJ can go up there and take over Canada!!! hahahaha :P
Chris Fultz
23-04-2004, 12:55
Off seasons.
229 + 126 vs ANYBODY.
You up for it?
It's freakin' unbeatable man. ;)
JV
Instead of Kickin your a** with full-up Indiana teams (pick two, any two),
we probably have several Lego teams that would make it a more fair fight.
Think you can you handle the 6th graders, JVN?
Ben Lauer
23-04-2004, 13:05
Yeah, I agree with Chris. I have a hard time thinking of a team in Indiana that is bad. My team didn't go to Nationals, (I mean the Championship for you Canadians) but I think that us and any other Indiana team could take you!
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 13:07
Instead of Kickin your a** with full-up Indiana teams (pick two, any two),
we probably have several Lego teams that would make it a more fair fight.
Think you can you handle the 6th graders, JVN?
Hey, some of those little Lego bots are tough! Especially considering that 100% of them have an autonomous mode! ;)
Instead of Kickin your a** with full-up Indiana teams (pick two, any two),
we probably have several Lego teams that would make it a more fair fight.
Think you can you handle the 6th graders, JVN?
Probably not Chris.
I'm certainly more scared of your 6th graders than of your "pros".
Those kids still know how to play.
Chris Fultz
23-04-2004, 13:19
Sorry I can't reply just now, I am busy crossing some names off of my
"FIRST paricipants to try and recruit to Rolls-Royce" list.
David Kelly
23-04-2004, 13:23
Sorry I can't reply just now, I am busy crossing some names off of my
"FIRST paricipants to try and recruit to Rolls-Royce" list.
OUCH!! you going to take that from old man fultz, jvn??? :ahh:
OUCH!! you going to take that from old man fultz, jvn??? :ahh:
Uhhh....
Yep. I most certainly am.
Checkmate.
He wins.
All hail Cyber Blue, and Indiana.
Wooo.
John
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 13:52
Uhhh....
Yep. I most certainly am.
Checkmate.
He wins.
All hail Cyber Blue, and Indiana.
Wooo.
John
JVN wusses out, leaves Grady high and dry to fend for the northeast region by himself...way to go buddy!
JVN wusses out, leaves Grady high and dry to fend for the northeast region by himself...way to go buddy!
hahaha I'll always be here... hehehe
JVN wusses out, leaves Grady high and dry to fend for the northeast region by himself...way to go buddy!Hey man...
Fultz got me with a low blow.
Besides... I'll defend our honor just fine next year at nationals. ;)
John
(Now I just need to get us qualified)
(Now I just need to get us qualified)
Oh boy.... Qualifying... I hope we can do that too next year... hmmmm...
Travis Hoffman
23-04-2004, 14:18
I think I've spent more time in the States over the past month and a half than I have in Canada. Canadian teams are always travelling down south. This summer I invite all the American teams who've never come up north, (or haven't since 2002, hint hint 229) for the Wonderland challenge. You might just like up here.
So three year veterans of the Canadian-American Wars aren't invited? Does that mean Team 48 can stay home and sleep? Or better yet, ignore you guys entirely and just go to IRI? :p
So three year veterans of the Canadian-American Wars aren't invited? Does that mean Team 48 can stay home and sleep? Or better yet, ignore you guys entirely and just go to IRI? :p
Trav,
Don't even start. I've been practically begging you guys to come up to Wonderland. For the past three years you guys have been our favourite guests.
Since you've been to three Canadian Regionals, could we bestow you guys with honorary Canadian status? I'd challenge anyone to take on the old alliance of 1114 and 48. (Provided neither of us slips a tread, or damages a strafing module...)
Mike Soukup
23-04-2004, 15:52
I've stayed out of the mix for far too long, so here I go...
Ohhhhhh how convenient that you didn't start FIRST until after the age when the Northeast dominated all of FIRST! We are planning on making our move soon enough, dont you worry! :D
Oh, you must be talking about the days when all the teams in FIRST were from the Northeast (*) because that's the only time they dominated. Who's living in the past now Grady? Lets talk about the present. The Midwest has passed you years ago and we're still waiting for the long promised come-back.
* Disclaimer - of course there were some non-Northeast teams back then, but not many
Andy Grady
23-04-2004, 16:02
I've stayed out of the mix for far too long, so here I go...
Oh, you must be talking about the days when all the teams in FIRST were from the Northeast (*) because that's the only time they dominated. Who's living in the past now Grady? Lets talk about the present. The Midwest has passed you years ago and we're still waiting for the long promised come-back.
* Disclaimer - of course there were some non-Northeast teams back then, but not many
We are just waiting for you guys to catch up and start playing our game before we totally blow you out of the water. Everyone knows that defense wins championships, and we invented defense in the northeast! Don't get me wrong, you guys are definately starting to catch on (i.e. Martians). But it took you long enough...
Definitions:
Defense (Northeast Version) - When a robot uses full force to bash, ram, or block a team from scoring points, resulting in victory.
Defense (Midwest Version) - Tip over, accidentally get in the way of opponent.
Its ok Mike...I mean look at football teams like the Colts...great offense, alot of fun to watch. Eventually though, they were overun by the stronger, more experienced, defensive masterminds, the New England Patriots. Another case where the Northeast dominates. ;)
-Andy Grady
Chris Hibner
23-04-2004, 16:12
Its ok Mike...I mean look at football teams like the Colts...great offense, alot of fun to watch. Eventually though, they were overun by the stronger, more experienced, defensive masterminds, the New England Patriots. Another case where the Northeast dominates. ;)
Of course, the reason the Patriots won is because they have a great quarterback from the University of MICHIGAN!
Of course, the reason the Patriots won is because they have a great quarterback from the University of MICHIGAN!
Who was smart enough to move to the NORTHEAST so he could play with talented players on a great NORTHEAST team and actually win something.
We are just waiting for you guys to catch up and start playing our game before we totally blow you out of the water. Everyone knows that defense wins championships, and we invented defense in the northeast! Don't get me wrong, you guys are definately starting to catch on (i.e. Martians). But it took you long enough...
Definitions:
Defense (Northeast Version) - When a robot uses full force to bash, ram, or block a team from scoring points, resulting in victory.
Defense (Midwest Version) - Tip over, accidentally get in the way of opponent.
Its ok Mike...I mean look at football teams like the Colts...great offense, alot of fun to watch. Eventually though, they were overun by the stronger, more experienced, defensive masterminds, the New England Patriots. Another case where the Northeast dominates. ;)
-Andy Grady
great point Andy... sure the midwest will catch on eventually but then the Northeast of coarse will think of something even better... That's just how it goes...
Love to have Team 48 come to Canadas Wonderland Invitational BUT you are from the US so you must find your own alliance partners. Team 48 almost has Canadian citizenship but not quite. Maybe you could help out 639 and they could be your partner. I know they beat you bad last meeting but I'm sure that you can become friends. Even 188 and 1114 can get over a few minor differences in the name of US/Canada competition. :p
Somehow I don't think we will be travelling to IRI or Wonderland this year (it's a little far). However, if any midwest alliance or canadian alliance or northeast alliance will come out west, team 60 and 254 will take you on. Don't get confused, our robots look kind of similar. Since we can do everything, that's ok that we do not have complementary alliance partners (unlike all of your regions, where you need alliance partners who do something different from you).
Actually, if you're scared of Kingman, come to the Cal Games. We will beat you with our practice robot and our competition robot.
If you want to know what happens when the Midwest challenges us on our home turf, look at Chief Delphi's performance at SVR.
If you want to know how the Northeast compares to the West, look at 190 at SVR in 2003 (not sure about the year...might have been 2002).
If you want to know how the South compares to the West, look at 945 at Sacramento (they were the best of the three regions).
Canadian teams have not come to either Sacramento or Silicon Valley yet.
btw...there are many more excellent Western robots
Somehow I don't think we will be travelling to IRI or Wonderland this year (it's a little far). However, if any midwest alliance or canadian alliance or northeast alliance will come out west, team 60 and 254 will take you on. Don't get confused, our robots look kind of similar. Since we can do everything, that's ok that we do not have complementary alliance partners (unlike all of your regions, where you need alliance partners who do something different from you).
Actually, if you're scared of Kingman, come to the Cal Games. We will beat you with our practice robot and our competition robot.
If you want to know what happens when the Midwest challenges us on our home turf, look at Chief Delphi's performance at SVR.
If you want to know how the Northeast compares to the West, look at 190 at SVR in 2003 (not sure about the year...might have been 2002).
If you want to know how the Soth compares to the West, look at 945 at Sacramento (they were the best of the three regions).
Canadian teams have not come to either Sacramento or Silicon Valley yet.
btw...there are many more excellent Western robots
hmmm too bad... I'm positive 88 and 190 could go over there and show you how its done... hehe they go up and hang and we clean house on the floor... our HP (me or Andy Carson) will put forth our 95% shooting and then 88 will go and give the stationary goal a slam dunk... hehehe... then why not after that go hang? hehehe easy... :D
Chris Fultz
23-04-2004, 23:07
When we went to Arizona (west) and competed - we were #1 seed.
When we went to Chicago against the mid-west power houses, we were #9.
How can you argue with facts - obviously the midwest is the tougher region!
ps - to anyone just joining - this is a fun forum - please no negative reps for anybody!
ps - to anyone just joining - this is a fun forum - please no negative reps for anybody!
Its all about the bragging rights!!! hahaha :D
D.J. Fluck
23-04-2004, 23:14
Definitions:
Defense (Northeast Version) - When a robot uses full force to bash, ram, or block a team from scoring points, resulting in victory.
Defense (Midwest Version) - Tip over, accidentally get in the way of opponent.
Your Northeast version sounds like the 04 National Champions, The Martians (from Michigan) way to play defense... :p
Oh Grady, how have you forgotten 99 so quickly? Gotta love that 45 machine...the definition of defense ;)
Chris Fultz
23-04-2004, 23:48
Somehow I don't think we will be travelling to IRI ... this year (it's a little far).
Maybe you could put together an 'All Star' team of a few students from several teams in CA. Small cost for each team, but a California contingent at the IRI.
Could be a great time! We might even be able to get you a robot!
Ken Leung
24-04-2004, 01:11
Maybe you could put together an 'All Star' team of a few students from several teams in CA. Small cost for each team, but a California contingent at the IRI.
Could be a great time! We might even be able to get you a robot!
Hey, I might even be able to coach that team! And I never officially coached before. We can even use the ball drive of the Technokat from 2 years ago!
I will coach the CA alliance and score our own matches. Perfect strategy to get #1 seed. Are you scared now?
You might hear me comment in the background after our matches:
"I just don't know how our team keep capping that goal with 48 balls in it! That's unpossible!"
When we went to Arizona (west) and competed - we were #1 seed.
When we went to Chicago against the mid-west power houses, we were #9.
How can you argue with facts - obviously the midwest is the tougher region!
Or maybe you had some bad luck in Chicago? Or maybe you broke down?
Kingman seeded #1 in Archimedes (I forget their regional seeding).
Okay... I can't help it.
How'd you guys seed in Newton?
;)
Actually I have no clue...but John, i think you were standing right next to me and Paul Copioli when we got picked in the first round despite our lousy qualifying luck.
(note: we did have bad luck at Nats for our robot: 118 hit our power switch in auton, our solenoid block got smashed in auton another match, we caught our hook on the human player station, etc)
Chris Fultz
24-04-2004, 09:25
Or maybe you had some bad luck in Chicago? Or maybe you broke down?
Flawless every match - had to be the level of competition - no other explanation.
And we had the best human player in the world.
100%.
Never missed a shot.
Going to the NBA as soon as he has his diploma.
I think he is Reggie Millers' replacement.
Matt - BYW / I was serious about that 'All-Star' team from CA. PM me if you are interested.
After reading the post by Matt D it seems that when push comes to shove that the Cheesypoofs are more Poof than anything. It must be the laid back life dude.
J Flex 188
24-04-2004, 10:52
oh matt d doesnt need to worry about that at all. Thanks to our international robotics exchange program, Team 188 will actually be putting some action behind all this turkey talk and will be heading down to SoCal in 2005 after hosting Team 22 this year. And uh, yeah, how about that laid back life? maybe you'll just take our drubbing of you easily hmm? =D
Somehow I don't think we will be travelling to IRI or Wonderland this year (it's a little far). However, if any midwest alliance or canadian alliance or northeast alliance will come out west, team 60 and 254 will take you on. Don't get confused, our robots look kind of similar. Since we can do everything, that's ok that we do not have complementary alliance partners (unlike all of your regions, where you need alliance partners who do something different from you).
Actually, if you're scared of Kingman, come to the Cal Games. We will beat you with our practice robot and our competition robot.
If you want to know what happens when the Midwest challenges us on our home turf, look at Chief Delphi's performance at SVR.
If you want to know how the Northeast compares to the West, look at 190 at SVR in 2003 (not sure about the year...might have been 2002).
If you want to know how the South compares to the West, look at 945 at Sacramento (they were the best of the three regions).
Canadian teams have not come to either Sacramento or Silicon Valley yet.
btw...there are many more excellent Western robots
i think that there's no stopping the midwest.
494 and 71: 'nuff said
not to mention 469
Actually I have no clue...but John, i think you were standing right next to me and Paul Copioli when we got picked in the first round despite our lousy qualifying luck.
(note: we did have bad luck at Nats for our robot: 118 hit our power switch in auton, our solenoid block got smashed in auton another match, we caught our hook on the human player station, etc)
Matt,
I'm just kidding.
You guys are awesome. I'm just being a Northeast jerk, in the spirit of the thread. ;)
John
If you want to know what happens when the Midwest challenges us on our home turf, look at Chief Delphi's performance at SVR.
If you want to know how the Northeast compares to the West, look at 190 at SVR in 2003 (not sure about the year...might have been 2002).
If you want to know how the South compares to the West, look at 945 at Sacramento (they were the best of the three regions).
Canadian teams have not come to either Sacramento or Silicon Valley yet.
btw...there are many more excellent Western robots
Matt D,
I love your robot, but while we're on the topic of teams competing across country, let's take a little stroll down memory lane.
The year is 2002. The game is Zone Zeal. The site, is the Buckeye Regional. The result, the Poofs lose in the semifinals. If my memory serves me correctly, you guys have won 9 of the 11 regional events you've ever been to. Could it just be a coincidence that you happen to lose the only one you've been to outside of California? Hmmm. Or maybe you'll do what I like to do, and blame it Clarkson... ;)
Just stirring the pot...
ok...we lost when we went to Cleveland. The Midwest it better than us. what can I say?
hopefully we will go down to a different regional than just sacramento and svr so we will get to play against some of your awesome teams.
(please note that everythingi say in this thread, meaning my joking bragging, is just for fun and not serious. please do not think that I really think we would necessarily win etc. I just think it would be fun to play with or against some teams from other locations. I think the achievements of the Midwest are incredible and i look up to many of those teams. Remember, this thread is all in fun)
Matt D,
The year is 2002. The game is Zone Zeal. The site, is the Buckeye Regional. The result, the Poofs lose in the semifinals. If my memory serves me correctly, you guys have won 9 of the 11 regional events you've ever been to. Could it just be a coincidence that you happen to lose the only one you've been to outside of California? Hmmm.
The year is 2000. The site, Lonestar regional. The result, we are the champions. That seems to me to be another regional victory outside of CA.
Joe Ross
24-04-2004, 14:00
When we went to Arizona (west) and competed - we were #1 seed.[/I]
What round of the finals did you lose in again? How'd you do the year before at AZ?
Andy Grady
24-04-2004, 16:27
Oh Grady, how have you forgotten 99 so quickly? Gotta love that 45 machine...the definition of defense ;)
DJ,
I haven't forgotten 1999. Like I said earlier, I have a good memory of 1999 at Rumble at the Rock when my team (Team 42 at the time) sent the Technokittens into the deep realm of defeat...after we ripped the tread off their drive system, and ripped them right off the puck...promptly replacing them ON the puck for the victory ;)
To be quite honest though, I do have alot of respect for the Technokats ability to play defense all these years...I will always consider them a northeast team trapped in the offsensive land of Indiana ;)
Eric Bareiss
24-04-2004, 17:31
When we went to Arizona (west) and competed - we were #1 seed.
When we went to Chicago against the mid-west power houses, we were #9.
How can you argue with facts - obviously the midwest is the tougher region!
Team 64 seeded 14th in seattle 2002 and 1st in LA that must mean Seattle is better than California. But wait, 22 seeded 1st in Seattle the same year and 28th in LA. Interesting.
Matt I think you are handling yourself better than I would. The Cheesy Poofs lost in Buckeye because they were in the middle of changing their design. They got it right in San Jose, seeded 1st and won the very next week.
I think I'll stop because I have a tendancy to offend people. PM me or hit me up on my AIM @ FluffyBlink if you want get into it.
Chris Fultz
24-04-2004, 18:51
What round of the finals did you lose in again?
I forget.
How'd you do the year before at AZ?
I forget that, too. But I think we had jet lag. That 2 hour time difference is a killer on us Indiana farm kids. we normally don't travel outside of the county.
PS - Don't try to add new facts to confuse my selectively chosen facts.
Levin571
24-04-2004, 19:21
how about restarting the Rumble at the Rock off season tournement and introducing the "Grady Cup" there?
the original FIRST off season tournement spot i think should hold a best of the best tournement
Andy Grady
24-04-2004, 20:30
how about restarting the Rumble at the Rock off season tournement and introducing the "Grady Cup" there?
the original FIRST off season tournement spot i think should hold a best of the best tournement
Funny you should say that... ;)
Lets just say, I am working on a suprise for the 2005 offseason...keep your eyes peeled in the coming weeks.
Did you know, the summer of 2005 would be 10 years since Rumble at the Rock was first created? Kinda makes you think...doesn't it? :yikes:
-Andy Grady
Mike Soukup
26-04-2004, 16:23
Defense (Northeast Version) - When a robot uses full force to bash, ram, or block a team from scoring points, resulting in victory.
Defense (Midwest Version) - Tip over, accidentally get in the way of opponent.
I can't let you openly mock us like that. It's on!
Here's another set of definitions for you to chew on:
Offense (Midwest Version) - When a robot uses cleverly, beautifully, and specifically, designed assemblies to score lots of points for their alliance, resulting in victory.
Offense (Northeast Version) - Repeatedly bash, ram, or block the opponent in the hopes that they get confused and score for your alliance.
Its ok Mike...I mean look at football teams like the Colts...great offense, alot of fun to watch. Eventually though, they were overun by the stronger, more experienced, defensive masterminds, the New England Patriots. Another case where the Northeast dominates. ;)
If you're talking football, I've got one for you. Superbowl XX - Bears vs Patriots. Best defensive team ever vs well...I don't know if the Pats were good at anything that year. Result: 46-10 victory for the Midwest; Northeast goes home and cries. I suppose you'll blame it on the ugly uniforms. Before you mock me for going back almost 20 years for my example, just remember that I'm clinging to my childhood memories of the Bears being a great team.
Who's going to respond first, JVN or Grady? This sure is fun :D
We are just waiting for you guys to catch up and start playing our game before we totally blow you out of the water. Everyone knows that defense wins championships, and we invented defense in the northeast! Don't get me wrong, you guys are definately starting to catch on (i.e. Martians). But it took you long enough...
Definitions:
Defense (Northeast Version) - When a robot uses full force to bash, ram, or block a team from scoring points, resulting in victory.
Defense (Midwest Version) - Tip over, accidentally get in the way of opponent.
Its ok Mike...I mean look at football teams like the Colts...great offense, alot of fun to watch. Eventually though, they were overun by the stronger, more experienced, defensive masterminds, the New England Patriots. Another case where the Northeast dominates. ;)
-Andy Grady
Andy,
Be careful what you wish for. I have often been tempted to make a killer defensive robot to fit the name "wildstang". When I get fed up with complex mechanisms, we may do that.
The problem is that it is no fun to sit in the pits and have every other team mad at you because you completely took away their ability to compete. And then they would all complain that it is a battlebot not a FIRST robot. You see, it is more fun to design and drive a robot that can perform several delicate functions, rather than just go after other robots to stop them. A "box on wheels" as my good friend Mike Bastoni use to call them, can do that. Lots of creativity there huh?
Andy Grady
26-04-2004, 22:26
Offense (Midwest Version) - When a robot uses cleverly, beautifully, and specifically, designed assemblies to score lots of points for their alliance, resulting in victory.
Offense (Northeast Version) - Repeatedly bash, ram, or block the opponent in the hopes that they get confused and score for your alliance.
I wish I had a reply for that...but frankly thats too funny! Job well done! To bad your logic is a little off...I think when you guys were tie dying those Wildstang shirts, some of it may have seeped a little too far into the cranium ;)
You see, the best offense IS a defense. Lets go back to 1995 for a minute and review a defensive masterpiece which was called "The Big Bopper". In the finals, against Raychem and Woodside High School, the Gael Force robot would drive up the side of the ramp, barrel into Woodside or any other robot sitting on top of the hill, then when they were down and out..score juuuust enough to get by. This ultimately resulted in more exciting matches! In the northeast, we like to keep things close and exciting....no 300 point blowouts like you guys in the midwest try to accomplish each year, putting the collective audience to sleep. With FIRST, its all about style! In the northeast, we are alllll style.
As for Raul...didn't you guys build one of those defensive robots last year? Wildstang the wedge? See, defense does win championships my friend...I dont deny that you midwesterners are catching on...it just took ya a while ;) Of course you need to understand...when Team Hammond won its 4th championship this year, they woke up the sleeping giant that is the Northeast. Next year when things get a little rough on you midwesterners...make sure you give your thanks to the Beatty's for giving us something to shoot for :D
-Andy Grady
P.S. For those just tuning in, just a reminder that this is a fun thread...my comments and the comments of others are not meant to put down or belittle any team in a serious manner...in other words...don't take anything I have to say seriously ;)
D.J. Fluck
26-04-2004, 22:49
You see, the best offense IS a defense. Lets go back to 1995 for a minute and review a defensive masterpiece which was called "The Big Bopper". In the finals, against Raychem and Woodside High School, the Gael Force robot would drive up the side of the ramp, barrel into Woodside or any other robot sitting on top of the hill, then when they were down and out..score juuuust enough to get by. This ultimately resulted in more exciting matches!
Grady man, come back to the present...quit living in the past, buddy :p
-----------------------------
You proved my point already with what you have below:
In the northeast, we like to keep things close and exciting....no 300 point blowouts like you guys in the midwest try to accomplish each year, putting the collective audience to sleep. With FIRST, its all about style! In the northeast, we are alllll style
See, you let them blow you guys out, then you go run them over at the end...but they still win....of course we like running up the score for when your "box on wheels" comes and flips us, we can just sit there cheer and celebrate while you desperately try to come back and fall short in the end..I guess thats how the Northeast likes it, close, but no cigar. ;)
As for Raul...didn't you guys build one of those defensive robots last year? Wildstang the wedge? See, defense does win championships my friend...I dont deny that you midwesterners are catching on...it just took ya a while ;) Of course you need to understand...when Team Hammond won its 4th championship this year, they woke up the sleeping giant that is the Northeast. Next year when things get a little rough on you midwesterners...make sure you give your thanks to the Beatty's for giving us something to shoot for :D
Haven't you been saying that since like oh Hammond's first championship back in 97 ;)
Collin Fultz
26-04-2004, 22:53
Uhhh....
Yep. I most certainly am.
Checkmate.
He wins.
All hail Cyber Blue, and Indiana.
Wooo.
John
Don't take him too seriously John...after all...if he had that much pull at Rolls...david kelly wouldn't have a job :)
Andy Grady
26-04-2004, 22:56
Haven't you been saying that since like oh Hammond's first championship back in 97 ;)
Yeah...but this time we REALLY REALLY mean it! Plus, after 4 National Championships, ya gotta figure the midwest is ready to revolt against its own.
-Andy Grady
Ben Lauer
27-04-2004, 13:13
Revolt..no sir, we are just trying to find a way to make sure no non-Indiana team has a chance. Just wait, eventually the championship will be in Indianapolis so all the teams can drive home every night instead of staying at a hotel.
D.J. Fluck
27-04-2004, 16:44
Revolt..no sir, we are just trying to find a way to make sure no non-Indiana team has a chance. Just wait, eventually the championship will be in Indianapolis so all the teams can drive home every night instead of staying at a hotel.
Ben, I think we'll let Michigan play with us too, they outnumber us by a lot...thats for sure :p
Edit: Maybe Illinois too, if they're nice :p
Andy Grady
27-04-2004, 16:48
Joke time!
Q: What do you get when you cross the Tacoma Narrows Bridge and a Ford Pinto?
A: A midwestern FIRST robot!
HAHAHAHAHA...oh man, i crack myself up. ;)
Waiting for tomatoes to be thrown,
Andy Grady
HAHAHAHAHA...oh man, i crack myself up. ;)
If I laughed, does that make me a tremendous engineering nerd?
I think, yes it does. ;)
Elyse Holguin
27-04-2004, 21:02
Yeah...but this time we REALLY REALLY mean it! Plus, after 4 National Championships, ya gotta figure the midwest is ready to revolt against its own.
-Andy Grady
Don't look only at us, I recall a Technokat Championship win in there. (Not to mention the Illinois and Michigan wins as well.) We're just trying to keep things in a nice centralized location. I kind of like Indiana as the ringleader.
Elyse Holguin
27-04-2004, 21:04
If I laughed, does that make me a tremendous engineering nerd?
I think, yes it does. ;)
You didn't need to laugh to make yourself a tremendous engineering nerd. You were already. :D
Ben Lauer
27-04-2004, 21:50
Ok, I love Michigan, and Illinois is ok, but they have to be nice.
But really, We don't have mountains to climb or fun roads to drive on. The most elevation change we have is the bridges over interstates!!!! Maybe thats why our robots are better, nothing else to do!!!!
Andy Grady
27-04-2004, 22:16
Don't look only at us, I recall a Technokat Championship win in there. (Not to mention the Illinois and Michigan wins as well.) We're just trying to keep things in a nice centralized location. I kind of like Indiana as the ringleader.
Sorry Elyse...4 championships = biiiiig target on your back!!!
Look at it this way though, in all due seriousness...that is one huge sign of respect for such a strong team. Be proud of your roots...they are special.
-Andy Grady
P.S. I did think of one good thing that came out of Indiana...Larry Bird...greatest basketball player of all time.
Ryan Dognaux
28-04-2004, 00:19
What round of the finals did you lose in again? How'd you do the year before at AZ?
- Lost in the Semi's
- 6th seed at AZ previous year, I believe, but drafted by the 1st.
Does anyone hear that? I think it's the sound of Midwest teams pwning ;)
Joe Ross
28-04-2004, 00:50
- Lost in the Semi's
- 6th seed at AZ previous year, I believe, but drafted by the 1st.
Does anyone hear that? I think it's the sound of Midwest teams pwning ;)
actually, 7th, but I won't fault you for that. I will fault you for omitting that you lost in the quarterfinals. In fact, both midwestern teams lost in the quarters.
Lets summarize this. #1 seed and lost in the semis this year. Last year #7 seed, chosen 1st, lost in quarterfinals. Didn't win any technical awards either year. Do you know what I call a team that does well in the seeding rounds, but loses early in the finals (and doesn't have any technical awards)? LUCKY.
Meanwhile, team 980 seeded 4th and 2nd, and got to the semifinals each time. 330 seeded lower, but was finalist and won.
So, you did well, but certainly didn't "pwn" anyone.
Ryan Dognaux
28-04-2004, 08:47
actually, 7th, but I won't fault you for that. I will fault you for omitting that you lost in the quarterfinals. In fact, both midwestern teams lost in the quarters.
Lets summarize this. #1 seed and lost in the semis this year. Last year #7 seed, chosen 1st, lost in quarterfinals. Didn't win any technical awards either year. Do you know what I call a team that does well in the seeding rounds, but loses early in the finals (and doesn't have any technical awards)? LUCKY.
Meanwhile, team 980 seeded 4th and 2nd, and got to the semifinals each time. 330 seeded lower, but was finalist and won.
So, you did well, but certainly didn't "pwn" anyone.
Pardon my memory, for it does not serve me well.
The Semifinals loss came this year at Arizona, the quarter finals loss came last year at Arizona.
You know what I call every one of your alliance partners breaking (including ourselves) at some point during the final rounds? UNLUCKY
While we didn't win any technical awards, don't the 2 Chairmans Awards from AZ and Midwest count as something? :]
and doesn't have any technical awards
I hope you don't mean ever, because in 01' we took the Delphi's Driving Tomorrow's Technology Award with our innovative back-pack arm.
I still hear that sound of Midwest teams dominating :)
Jessica Boucher
28-04-2004, 09:27
I hope you don't mean ever, because in 01' we took the Delphi's Driving Tomorrow's Technology Award with our innovative back-pack arm.
Bah..... an '01 tech award doesn't mean much anymore. It's great that you won it, but who knows if it was because of people on your team that have since graduated/left......only by stringing technical awards from year after year or every other year shows a consistent lack of "being lucky".
Plus, we're not playing the 01 game, now are we? (thank goodness!!) ;)
Matt Leese
28-04-2004, 11:06
Perhaps you should take a look at the Cleveland Regional (which is in the midwest) from this past year. I seem to remember that two of the three winning teams were from the east (340 and 1286; both of Rochester, NY). So it's a bit interesting when two eastern teams head west and win...
Matt
Mike Soukup
28-04-2004, 11:21
Waiting for tomatoes to be thrown
As much as I'd like to oblige, I can't bring myself to do it. Your joke was one of the funniest things I've read here in quite while; I laughed out loud. Mostly because it's true. In the Widwest (if you define the Midwest as Schaumburg, IL) we throw so many functions on a robot that in order to make the weight we build 'em so they bend a bit. Now that you mention it, our big arm did sway much like the Tacoma Narrows Bridge. Were we the inspiration for your joke?
I wish I had an equally funny come-back, but I don't right now. Hopefully I'll get some inspiration later.
In the light of some recent posts, I'd like to remind everyone of an earlier quote from Andy. Try to keep it fun & not personal. We're just trying to make jokes here, not have serious debates about why a team won/lost a competition.
By the way, you can keep talking trash all ya want...I think its fun, and it adds to the rivalry...just as long as it stays fun and there are no personal attacks or anything like that.
D.J. Fluck
28-04-2004, 11:43
The Northeastern Teams are like the Boston Red Sox, always pretty talented, but choke when it's crunch time :D
The Midwest domination factor started around 1997, which was also the year of the first Midwest Regional...hrm, maybe FIRST's creation of a regional not on the east coast is what started your curse ;)
By the way, you can keep talking trash all ya want...I think its fun, and it adds to the rivalry...just as long as it stays fun and there are no personal attacks or anything like that.
Andy Grady
28-04-2004, 11:50
The Northeastern Teams are like the Boston Red Sox, always pretty talented, but choke when it's crunch time :D
The Midwest domination factor started around 1997, which was also the year of the first Midwest Regional...hrm, maybe FIRST's creation of a regional not on the east coast is what started your curse ;)
OUCH! That was low man...bringing up my beloved Red Sox like that. However, as we say here in New England...there is no curse...next year will be the year!
-Andy Grady
p.s. Hey, couldn't you say the same thing about the Cubbies? I hear Steve Bartman is looking to join up with the Technokitties! ;)
D.J. Fluck
28-04-2004, 11:52
p.s. Hey, couldn't you say the same thing about the Cubbies? I hear Steve Bartman is looking to join up with the Technokitties! ;)
There is an unofficial restraining order on Mr. Bartman. If he comes within 3 states of any midwestern state, he will be shot ;)
In my opinion, the Michigan region and the west have more advanced animations and better looking. THe majority of the aniamtions in the North East are decent, but the midwest and west just dominate this area of robotics....
Alan Anderson
28-04-2004, 12:10
But really, We don't have mountains to climb or fun roads to drive on. The most elevation change we have is the bridges over interstates!!!!
I think the Tyrannical Mechanicals (1272) would have something relevant to say about that, Ben. Look a bit further south than Marion County. Only two thirds of Indiana was ironed flat by the glaciers; the wrinkles all got pushed down to the bottom end.
Indiana farmland might be flatter than a FIRST field, but there's more than corn in Indiana.
Could that be because all they have to do in the Midwest is to sleep and watch paint dry. While sleeping I guess that annimators have more "Inspiration " time than the rest of us. :p
Just so I know, Where does the line between East, Midwest and West lie?
Jessica Boucher
28-04-2004, 12:20
Just so I know, Where does the line between East, Midwest and West lie?
I personally use the Appalacians and the Rockies as my dividers.
Of course, I haven't traveled further west than the Appalacians, so my sense of the country is skewed....but I'll be honest, noone will give the same answer as to where the regions lie...because we're all skewed ;)
Chris Fultz
28-04-2004, 12:28
Could that be because all they have to do in the Midwest is to sleep and watch paint dry.
We also watch the grass grow on really sunny days.
Just so I know, Where does the line between East, Midwest and West lie?
Indiana and Michigan are the mid-west, sort of like the center of the country, the epicenter of commerce, technology and all things great in this country.
PS - We would have called ourselves the "mideast", but that name was already taken.
Good news for me is that I must be in the East. Otherwise I would have looked pretty bad slamming myself. Therefore I stand on my statements. Let the chaos continue (I think I stole that from somewhere, Jon?). :cool:
Fireworks 234
28-04-2004, 15:34
Indiana and Michigan are the mid-west, sort of like the center of the country, the epicenter of commerce, technology and all things great in this country.
Although I'm not going to argue with that, you can't forget our buddies in Illinois and Ohio.:yikes:
Elyse Holguin
28-04-2004, 20:03
Ok, I love Michigan, and Illinois is ok, but they have to be nice.
But really, We don't have mountains to climb or fun roads to drive on. The most elevation change we have is the bridges over interstates!!!! Maybe thats why our robots are better, nothing else to do!!!!
Bloomington does have some nasty hills. NOT fun driving around there with ice at all. Brown County (which doesn't have a FIRST team (yet) also has some of the best hills in the world for running, XC camp is there in the summer.
My views are a little skewed compared to most of you. I consider the midwest west of the Mississippi and ends at Mountain Time( a little before the Rockies). Everything to the east of Mississippi is the East or Mid-east for those of you who don't want to associate with the East. And to the west of the Rockies is the West. When you are in the middle of the country. Yes, Kansas is the center. It is hard for me to describe Michigan and Indiana as the MidWEST. They are to the east. It makes no sense.
Bloomington does have some nasty hills. NOT fun driving around there with ice at all.
I'm crying for you, believe me. :rolleyes:
Behold: The regions of the United States!! (http://www.usembassy.de/usa/travel-regions.htm)
Great explanations of each region too! It says of the northeast-
In their business dealings, New Englanders gained a reputation for hard work, shrewdness, thrift, and ingenuity.
Take that midwest :D
For those with any second thoughts as to what the regions are :p
And no one can complain about a hill without seeing the devils backbone here in Bethlehem CT... steep grade + dangerous curve == fun in the winter :ahh:
Jessica Boucher
28-04-2004, 21:13
And no one can complain about a hill without seeing the devils backbone here in Bethlehem CT... steep grade + dangerous curve == fun in the winter :ahh:
Yay for obscure CT references only the Litchfield County Alliance (38, 237 & 716) will get!!! :D
Chris Fultz
28-04-2004, 21:15
Although I'm not going to argue with that, you can't forget our buddies in Illinois and Ohio.:yikes:
removed for no apparently good reason -
Elyse Holguin
28-04-2004, 21:29
I'm crying for you, believe me. :rolleyes:
hey, I'm just someone who's used to driving around from Hammond to Chicago, Kokomo , or Indianapolis. :p Excuse me if I don't enjoy driving through the Appalachians on a daily basis... or whatever you weird Northeasterners have. :D
Okay, guys...
Everyone is coming and saying nice things about their teams and region, but now this thread really need an impartial observer. Let me tell you what we see from the Southern Hemisphere, taking a much better view of the big picture. :cool:
Over our 5 years of competition, we've been to the West, East and Midwest. This year, attending the Midwest regional, we realized the obvious: The Midwest teams are the most competitive ones and their robots really are the best.
But Midwest teams, don't be too proud of yourselves. The Brazilian teams are growing in number and in a couple of years the Midwest will totally lose their spot at the top of the rank. :D
PS - Non-Midwest teams: sorry... but we just had to make up for the warm reception we got at the Midwest Regional... Just goes to prove how great those teams are! :p
Originally Posted by Andy Grady
By the way, you can keep talking trash all ya want...I think its fun, and it adds to the rivalry...just as long as it stays fun and there are no personal attacks or anything like that.
Chris Fultz
28-04-2004, 21:57
Okay, guys...
This year, attending the Midwest regional, we realized the obvious: The Midwest teams are the most competitive ones and their robots really are the best.
:p
383 is my new favorite team in the entire FIRST world.
Andy Grady
28-04-2004, 21:58
Behold: The regions of the United States!! (http://www.usembassy.de/usa/travel-regions.htm)
Actually that map is fairly accurate in my eyes....
Here is how I consider the regional divisions in FIRST.
According to that map, New England and the Mid Atlantic would be the Northeast. The midwest is exactly as it looks, The south would be a mix of the southwest and the south, and the west would be exactly as shown. When you mix those 4 regions and add the 5th region (international teams), that would make my divisional separation.
Collin Fultz
28-04-2004, 21:59
Okay, guys...
Everyone is coming and saying nice things about their teams and region, but now this thread really need an impartial observer. Let me tell you what we see from the Southern Hemisphere, taking a much better view of the big picture. :cool:
Over our 5 years of competition, we've been to the West, East and Midwest. This year, attending the Midwest regional, we realized the obvious: The Midwest teams are the most competitive ones and their robots really are the best.
But Midwest teams, don't be too proud of yourselves. The Brazilian teams are growing in number and in a couple of years the Midwest will totally lose their spot at the top of the rank. :D
PS - Non-Midwest teams: sorry... but we just had to make up for the warm reception we got at the Midwest Regional... Just goes to prove how great those teams are! :p
there you have it...Midwest-only the best
Northeast-not in the least
The MidWest is the best
The south?
Shut your mouth!
Midwest is the best
They're better than the rest!
West? Oh you jest (sorry really bad rhyme :) )
Midwest is the best :cool:
Elyse Holguin
28-04-2004, 22:17
there you have it...Midwest-only the best
Northeast-not in the least
The MidWest is the best
The south?
Shut your mouth!
Midwest is the best
They're better than the rest!
West? Oh you jest (sorry really bad rhyme :) )
Midwest is the best :cool:
collin... we're trying to look GOOD here... :rolleyes: :p :D
there you have it...Midwest-only the best
Northeast-not in the least
The MidWest is the best
The south?
Shut your mouth!
Midwest is the best
They're better than the rest!
West? Oh you jest (sorry really bad rhyme :) )
Midwest is the best :cool:
Hah! Northeast is just taking a vacation. Letting our neighbors accross the mountains taste some victory before we decide to make our comeback! You poor midwesterners are playing right into our hands... (cue evil laughter)
Matt_Kaplan1902
28-04-2004, 22:59
I have to agree and say that the Mid-West is the best. But you all are underestimating the South. Just look at some of the amazing teams down here:
233
343
79
312
108 (so I'm a little biased)
180
342
... and the list goes on
I predict that next years Championship alliance will include a Florida team.
Ben Lauer
28-04-2004, 23:16
Bloomington does have some nasty hills. NOT fun driving around there with ice at all. Brown County (which doesn't have a FIRST team (yet) also has some of the best hills in the world for running, XC camp is there in the summer.
True True, i went to a camp there: the toilet was a hole in the ground, you think they are ready for a robotics team?!?!
but for real, those hills are killer when you are on a bike...it's called the hilly hundred, two days, 50 miles a day (if you are a cycler you should check it out)
J/K
ben
Clell Chatman
30-04-2004, 23:36
Well, I have to say that team 16 Baxter Bomb Squad is not part of the South but part of the Midwest. With that adjustment you must calculate in the wins team 16 took. I do believe one those two wins this year was in a Northeastern regional.
Oh Ya, The Chesapeake Regional
Here in Mountain Home, AR we even make the medical plastics that keep you Northeastern people alive.
RoteAugen
02-05-2004, 01:01
Back when our team did well at the nats (long time ago lol) our seniors would all sing "the immigrant song" by Led Zeppelin. Why? well, listen to the lyrics! the Northeasterners are used to mimicking the Vikings!
Levin571
04-05-2004, 07:06
The Northeast teams bash the other Northeast teams out of competitions, then the midwest teams come along and get you while your weak from the last kill.
But the Northeast shall one day rise again!!!
DE-FENCE... DE-FENCE
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