Who is using the kitbot? [Archive]

M. Hicken

12-01-2005, 16:47

Our mentors are stuck on the idea of using the kitbot, entirely, for the compteition. Now i know that the kb is really easy to make, but who is using it for their final design, it seems like a real frame would be easier, lighter, and easier for each team to configure.

dez250

12-01-2005, 16:52

Please Search before posting, it answers some previously answered questions and is very easy to do...

With that being said check out the following thread

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32499

Roland

12-01-2005, 16:53

We're probably going to use the gearbox because we don't really have much to use to fabricate more parts for that. We'll probably end up doing four or six wheel drive though. I think we might use the kit chassis with some modifications.

Billfred

12-01-2005, 16:54

Having gotten a feel for the kitbot, I'm pretty sure that the kitbot is a real frame. And it's much lighter than 1293's robot last year. (Boy, we built that thing like a brick--and loved it!)

Yes, 1293 is using the kitbot as the base. We do have plans to change the wheels on the robot--Dean's 2WD version was just a bit too squirrelly for us.

(there I go again with the squirrelly thing :D )

M. Hicken

12-01-2005, 17:01

sorry guys, i wasnt paying attention, i just wanted to quickly find the consensus of the other teams

JVN

12-01-2005, 17:18

Something that hasn't really been talked about much...

One of my favorite features of the kitbot is the "Stackable" nature of the transmissions. That is, you can combine both transmissions to form a "double reduction" gearbox.

All involved in the design agreed that in the interest of providing a versatile kit item that all teams can use, we should make the transmissions useable in other applications.

These transmissions can be used to provide a high efficiency, robust gearbox with high reduction to drive an arm or other mechanism.

Joel Glidden

12-01-2005, 18:49

I don't have time to search for the thread this should go in, but I just have to say it...

Best. Kit. Ever!

/Take that, English teachers. :cool:

Winged Wonder

12-01-2005, 18:57

the kit bot is great... but if you wanna be unique and creative.. the sky (and the budget) is the limit! oh and rules too... can't forget the rules....

Ssbfalcon

12-01-2005, 20:23

Ah yes, the rules... Hmm... (*Scratches off kinetic orb cannon...*)

We're using the kit for the base, with some modifications, maybe. Depends on the arm...

I'm glad our nightmare of limited mobility died.

Chriszuma

12-01-2005, 21:31

We're just going to use the kitbot to test our autonomous and things of that sort. Speaking as one of the team's coders, this makes it a LOT easier to do our jobs.

squeeks548

12-01-2005, 22:16

I think that this is a great kit bot. Our team is not going to use the kit bot because some think that it is too flimsey. Me and a few others built the whole thing in a couple hours after the kickoff, the whole thing we even drove it around with the new controls. It seems like it could be easily modified especially if you just wanted to put wider wheels in it.

galewind

12-01-2005, 22:27

Adam Richards

12-01-2005, 22:33

honestly, how strong do you think the kit chassis material is? We're considering using it due to apparent strength and the fact that it's free. It seems fairly high quality, so I'm actually considering it. We spent over $700 on extruded aluminum last year and felt that we kind of got ripped off, so we're trying to be a bit more careful when it comes to materials selection.
Kit chassis material isn't very durable. Some of the bars may, and probably will bend/warp during a match. I mean, I'm not trying to say that this stuff isn't very strong, but if your regional is having your bot rammed into constantly, you may run into some problems with the kit chassis.

Here's the best way of testing durability:

Secure your new chassis to something strong that won't move (just the chassis, no wheels, no cpu, nothing but the metal). Take your bot from last year. Ram your bot at full speed head on, at an angle, and sideswiping the secured frame. If it survives (with minor damage), it's worth using. If it doesn't, well, you need a better chassis material.

Cory

12-01-2005, 22:48

Guys, really, how many times does John have to come in these threads and say "Hey guys you're all wrong, I personally ran this thing into walls at high speed and it came out fine"

Cuz you know what? If he thought it was good enough for FIRST to use and gave it the ok, then it's good enough for us.

Psychomikers

12-01-2005, 23:05

We really haven't decided yet ourselves. Alot of us think we should use the kitbot. But then questions(like at tonights meeting) have come up of "being the same" problems and someone asked about the durability of it. And mainly we just talked about advantages and disadvantages of it, haven't quite gotten anywhere with it. I guess mainly we're trying to determine if we can do better or not. One of our worries is will it hold up long enough. Eh, the joys of planning :eek: oh well

Ellery

12-01-2005, 23:24

Our team is using as much of it as possible... Mainly due to ease of construction, cost, and ease of maintenance. Unless your team has alot of resources to make a really light, robust, frame via Tig welding this is a step up from standard extrusions but yes you'll give a little in some durability since it isn't as beefy as standard extrusions.

Anyways most stuff we've built in the past is overkill in design.

With the changing tides of a smaller team and less $ and resources since we are sponsoring 3 teams this year on a 2 team budget and sponsoring the Finger Lakes Regional we'll take the more efficient path.

Believe me these kits have evolved so much, at least from all 14 years of this program you wouldn't believe how much freedom we have now compared to 10 years ago. I remembered we couldn't spend more than $425 outside the Kit at one time.

Happy Bot Building y'all. And I hope to chat with all the teams who are coming to the Finger Lakes Regional.

Ellery

Rick

12-01-2005, 23:35

We will be using the "kit bot" with some mods. First of all wheel chair wheels are soooooo 2002. We will slamming our bot to a 1/4 off the ground and using some Colson Specials. Check out the episodes of American Robot starting January 19 for the real scoop.

Anchi

13-01-2005, 08:53

we are using the gearbox only, we are making ours out of 1" aluminum and welding it. as to the guy who used extruded Al, why? why not just weld Al to make a frame?

we are making ours modular so we need the flexibility of our own chassis.

JulieB

13-01-2005, 08:56

were not it look like it will snap in half any sec.

[527]phil

13-01-2005, 09:43

I personally don't like the kitbot because FIRST has turned the kit of parts into an over sized erector set, i especially don't like the fact that it's pre-drilled, i would rather use the frame to make a small robot that we can mount a chair on and ride it around the competition :D

Twstdkittie

13-01-2005, 10:06

phil']I personally don't like the kitbot because FIRST has turned the kit of parts into an over sized erector set, i especially don't like the fact that it's pre-drilled, i would rather use the frame to make a small robot that we can mount a chair on and ride it around the competition :D

Weeeeee!!!! I wanna ride around on a robot!!!

Chriszuma

13-01-2005, 15:38

what is American Robot? is that some new show on discovery channel or something? if so, i think the American * theme is getting kinda old.

Aignam

13-01-2005, 15:50

what is American Robot? is that some new show on discovery channel or something? if so, i think the American * theme is getting kinda old. It's a series of short movies that Team 121 will be realeasing throughout build season, documenting their team's efforts.

Paul Copioli

13-01-2005, 20:12

For those of you that think the kit chassis is too weak, read this post!

When John and his boss at IFI showed me initial pictures of the frame; I said, "that geometry looks weak." They didn't argue with me and they just sent me a kit to put together. I designed and built a prototype gearbox to mate with the frame (machined from solid ... lots of fun!). I loaded it up with a total of 130 lbs. and drove the heck out of it. I bashed it into everything. I hit walls at full speed, the center structure from last year at full speed. I even built a ramp to jump it over. I was trying to give it as much shock loading as I could. I drove it in the 4 wheel drive configuration (I think you should use it in the 4 WD configuration). The frame never bent, it never buckled. It held up to everything I could throw at it.

FIRST still thought it looked too weak, so I sent it to them to try to break. Nothing, nada, no failure at all. They could not break it, bend it, dent it. The frame is made from 1/8" 5052-H32 half hard aluminum. It is tough stuff. Those of you that say it is too weak, just do not know what you are talking about.

-Paul

JVN

13-01-2005, 23:33

It held up to everything I could throw at it.
-Paul
There is a cute video of Paul's young son crashing it into a wall... ;)
Destructive testing at the hands of a child...

n0cturnalxb

14-01-2005, 03:25

There is a cute video of Paul's young son crashing it into a wall... ;)
Destructive testing at the hands of a child...
Ohh.. upload and post, we (or, at least, I!) want to see!

--------

I think 1159's going to be using the entire kit, unless there's a major change in design or something. We'll see in one or two weeks for sure ;)

Alaina

14-01-2005, 12:54

Team 814 is in the middle of some financial issues, so we're using all that we can out of the kit. I very much appreciate the awesome kit we got this year.

I personally don't like the wheels too much. They seem a little bit too slippery. But I think we can make them work.

MikeDubreuil

14-01-2005, 13:28

We're actually working on two robots. One specially designed for the game and another make out of the kit bot. The kit bot robot will be a practice robot for software and student driving. It will also be almost entirely high school built.

We found the kit bot to be of very high quality. The frame is solid as a rock and seems like it could be used to make a Battle-bot. The drive train seems very nice, we especially like how easy the assembly was.

Even for a 8 year veteran team we had serious debates about whether to use the materials in the kit bot. The kit bot really levels the playing field between rookies and veterans.

Is FIRST making it too easy?
I would say the answer is yes they are making it easier than years past. But I would also say that does that matter? If students are still inspired to pursue more advanced designs and eventually a career in the technology sector we still have met our ultimate goal.

ngreen

14-01-2005, 15:14

I think more than making it easy, it makes it hard for veteran teams. This drive and chassis can compete with what many of the veteran teams have been using and allows the rookies to focus more attention to more difficult task such as tetra manipulation.

Looking at my team personally, we are a third year team that has done well the last two using a student tig welded frame and a chain drive with the drill motors. We don't have resources or experience on drives more than that right now and this year you can put together a comparable frame in several hours what has taken us around a week the last two years.

So I don't think FIRST has made it too easy. There will be several veteran teams use this drive because it is just as good as what they've been using. But meanwhile rookie teams will be able to spend less time getting their robot to move. I think in the end this move will make more of the veteran teams to make a greater focus in more advance drive systems, better manipulator design, and programming in order to gain back that advantage lost. I really hope this brings the end to the rookie one drive wheel robots!

supersy77

16-01-2005, 21:30

I dont know about you guys but the kitbot is bangin. It handles nice and has plenty of power, and is light. The only thing is it needs 4wd, and phnumatic tires in back. Other than that the only trouble ive had is the transmissions have been grindin a little but i greased them and they are getting better.

Winged Wonder

16-01-2005, 23:24

Modeish

17-01-2005, 17:51

We built the Kitbot but i hate it. Its great for the rookies and for the software team but, i dont like the idea of everyone having a similar robot. We are using the gearboxes for our final bot, but definitely building the frame of item.

-Modeish