pic: Team 116 Modular Control System

[dlavery]

[cdm-description=photo]20148[/cdm-description]

[jgannon]

WHOA. Just, WHOA. :ahh:

That is without a doubt the niftiest electrical "board" I've seen... awesome job, Dave and team.

[Rich Kressly]

Darn NASA people and their ideas :D
Actually, my bet is a 116 student came up with it.
Dave, this is great stuff. I've been collecting ideas for a new (2006) rookie team at my school. This puppy is going on the list. My only question is, Can your robot place tetras and deliver Krispy Kremes to team mentors in autonomous mode?

[Darwin695]

I would love to know how that works out... especially with the heat issue...

Does look like you got that covered, what a neat way to make sure aluminum filings dont get in the victors!

[dtengineering]

When I see stuff like that, sometimes I say, "That's BRILLIANT, why didn't I think of that?"

But I never like the answer.

I guess we'll just have to think of a brilliant design like that for next year. Thank you for sharing the idea... it really is a good one.

[Michael Corsetto]

Looks great! We tried one of those this year, but unfortunately it was built and designed by a couple of freshmen. Needless to say, it wasn't the most beautiful thing I've seen. It didn't even fit into our frame. We were going to call it the Brain Box. (I think it's pretty catchy:D ) Good luck and I hope to see ya guys at nats.

[Kris Verdeyen]

We suspected some Junkin brother spycraft when we saw that guy. Lucien hasn't talked yet, but a few more turns of the thumbscrews oughta do it.

I'll have to post pics of our monstrosity of a controls box when I remember my camera. It unfolds similarly, but we got the bright idea of putting an accumulator, 4 solenoids, and a mess o' hoses in there too. It ain't pretty.

Do you have a mirror or something to be able to see the RC lights? Our resident inspector complained and complained about not being able to see ours until we slid the brain forward an inch.

Edit - Pics:
Top:
http://photos4.flickr.com/4891541_328c68fba7.jpg
Connector Plate:
http://photos3.flickr.com/4891476_5d83144774.jpg
Box:
http://photos4.flickr.com/4891442_f1526f4bb6.jpg

We've allotted an hour on Thursday for our inspection. :)

[Matthew_H]

That is one nice box. We tried folding some items in last year to protect the main rc board but the inspectors made us turn the board to the outside so they could see the lights by just looking down at the robot. Have you run into this same problem before?

[Josh Hambright]

Very impressive dave,
I myself had attempted something like this several years ago and failed miserably and have considered it several times since then, you however have suceeded!

Kudos to you sir!

One question as brought up in the above post, how easy is it to see the lights on the RC and Victors?

Jtosh

[DarkJedi613]

Wow! Awesome idea. Good way to keep bits of metal out...though if it does get in it'll get in everything. :ahh:

How much does it weigh though? and how does it mount to the robot?

[imjustmatthew]

This is similar to what we (Team 638) have done the last two years, though done better than we did.

Two years ago I built and designed theitegrated control box that won Leadership in Control at the VCU regional. Last year we were able to move to shelves so the control box itself could come apart into seperate pieces.

Our goal for this year has been to actually drop in the control box, much like a stick of RAM in a computer and are nearing that goal. By dropping in we can eliminate the nasty plug-in blocks that are still present in your design,

I'll see if I can post a pic in the next couple of days, or give us a visit at the VCU regional, it should be great.

[The Cyborg]

:eek:
That...is...beautiful!!!!

What type of wire connectors are those on the outside of the box? Those look awesome! It will solve a ton of problems on our robot....

One question though, how are you able to see the lights on the victors and the RC while the box is in your robot?

Whoever built that... You are my new hero! :]

[Shu Song]

this box brings me to tears... I love it so much.

I wanted to make a box similar to this one this year. But had to settle for just a flat panel instead because of space issues.

Great work!!!

[Mr. Lim]

Hardcore!

I like it... A LOT!

For some reason it reminds me of Bonsai Kittens.

-SlimBoJones...

[phillutz]

I think people missed the point raise earlier.
Can you see the blinking lights?
You may not pass inspection unless the inspector can see them....

It is an awesome design though.

[i_am_Doug]

Dane are electrical persons gotta see this.

its neat double kudos! :)

[elknise]

True, don't they need to be visible at all times? We were thinking about doing a tetra shaped box for our electronics but we realized that we would have a space issue and it would be hard to see and access the robot controller.

[ttedrow]

Also covered in this thread:

http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?p=337370#post337370

<R57> The Robot Controller must be positioned within the robot so that its indicator lights may be seen during inspection and during operation in a match. This will greatly facilitate analysis in case of problems.


As an Inspector, the LEDs on the RC must be visible without opening/removing anything during the match. This is due to the time sensitive nature of the competition. The IFI rep checks each robot before each match.

[Tristan Lall]

For some reason it reminds me of Bonsai Kittens.http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/insertGray.jpg (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html)http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/squishGray.jpg (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html)
I still think the bonsai kitten (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html) is a better non-functional decoration.

[Conor Ryan]

exquisite, just beautiful. beats all the others I've seen by far, I wonder if anyone can beat it.

[Erin Rapacki]

http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/insertGray.jpg (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html)http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/squishGray.jpg (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html)
I still think the bonsai kitten (http://www.shorty.com/bonsaikitten/index.html) is a better non-functional decoration.

I know it's not real... but the concept is still disgusting!

I hope that cool fold-up electronics box passes inspection. It'll be funny if Dave didn't know the rules well enough to prevent such a re-design :rolleyes: Well, as I've said before, if it hasn't been done yet there's probably a reason why.

[Alaina]

That is simply the most ingenious thing I've ever seen. Good job....Great job!

[dlavery]

Yes, the LEDs on the RC, Victors and Spikes are visible through the clear cover and sides of the box when it is folded up. So it will pass inspection (or they better give us a REALLY good reason why it shouldn't! :) ).

And Kris, no, Lucien's brother had nothing to do with this. Two students on our team built up the basic prototype for the design in my shop over the summer, and tested it in the fall on our demo robot. We then turned them loose on the version for the competition robot in January, and this is what resulted!

Our whole approach this year has been to make the robot as modular as possible, and built for quick access to the subsystems. As noted in the caption, the entire control system pops right out with two cabinet latches after disconnedting the cables. The drive assemblies come off with just two bolts and two wire disconnects. The complete pneumatics system comes off in under two minutes with four bolts, and disconnecting the air hoses. The superstructure comes off with six bolts and two wire disconnects. We can build up from a bare frame and the modules sitting on the floor to a complete robot in under 20 minutes, and tear the entire thing back apart in less than 15. Of course, we are REALLY hoping that we don't have to do that too many times!

-dave

[TLonghorns0593]

We did a box "board" last year and we are doing one this year. We called our box last year the Brain. Judges didn't like it to much said they like to see all of the electronics. But we like it so we go with it.

[Spaztik Duck]

Two students on our team built up the basic prototype for the design in my shop over the summer, and tested it the fall on our demo robot.
-dave

That's not entirely true Dave, we built a lot of it at Kyle's :) .

Oh, and wouldn't it be "tested it this fall" not "tested it the fall"? :D

[dlavery]

That's not entirely true Dave, we built a lot of it at Kyle's :).

But only with a lot of expert guidance and help. Like "hey what does this wire do... <ffzznapp!> dang! Was it supposed to go all sparkly and smokey like that?" :)

[Lil' Lavery]

And dont forget the ridicule the rest of us gave you guys every time you messed up over the summer! :yikes:
"What!?! You builit it backwards 3 times!?! KYLE!!!!!"

Anyway, good job Kyle and Audrey(and Ted for the 2005 one).

[pakrat]

It's hot. I like that it folds up all the way. OUrs just wenyt into a compartment on our robot last year.

[Fixen]

This is so darn awesome. Can we use that design next year? XD

[tkwetzel]

This is so darn awesome. Can we use that design next year? XD

I don't mean to take words out of other people's mouths....or wait....maybe I do? I think Dave has been known to say something along the lines of "Take from the best and design the rest". Meaning, use what you see other teams doing (including this control box) and add it to your own deigns. Dave has pushed for sharing of designs a lot, much like Andy Baker has, because it betters the competition and raises the level of other teams in FIRST.

[stealth13777]

I have to aks where you got the connectors coming out of that box. We have been looking for connectors like that for two years now with no luck.

[richardp]

The connectors are Anderson Power Poles (http://www.andersonpower.com/products/pp/sp.html) . Getting the crimps for them on the larger wire (10 AWG) was a bit tricky but still not difficult. Now I notice they have different sizes. :rolleyes: For the PWM wires going to the RC we used Moex Connectors (http://www.molex.com/customer.html?supplierPN=std062r,157ftm:157mtm,std 062p) , the crimper for those I think was a little pricey but they worked great for those.

[mechanicalbrain]

the origional pic placed on this site is old its been hear forever. we too are doing one of these ive been planning out the connections. one thing to help all you people. we long ago realsider your power board and control board are the exact same sive down to the mounting holes. we did ours back to back. also can you have the main power switch inside a box like that?

[richardp]

The 120 AMP breaker sits on top of a piece of polycarb that was bent (http://www.invisiblerobot.com/robotics/robot_c40/index/p1040361.html) ( if you look carefully you can see the platform that it is mounted on). It is mountaed to the top of that, also there is a small hole just big enough for the breaker cut in the top piece. When it is closed up the switch is just above the polycarb and the hole is big enough for someone to push the reset back in. This allows the breaker itself to be inside but

[mechanicalbrain]

okay but that doesn't answer my question. ill assume the answer is no.

[dlavery]

the origional pic placed on this site is old its been hear forever. we too are doing one of these ive been planning out the connections. one thing to help all you people. we long ago realsider your power board and control board are the exact same sive down to the mounting holes. we did ours back to back. also can you have the main power switch inside a box like that?
okay but that doesn't answer my question. ill assume the answer is no.

What, exactly, is your question? (note: spelling, punctuation and good grammar are your friends - use them and enjoy the benefits of legible, understandable prose; your original message is unclear, and it is difficult to determine which part is "question" and which part is "run-on sentence"). If you were asking if having the main breaker completely enclosed within a control box is permissible, then for the 2005 competition the answer would have been "no" (see Rule <R48> and Rule <R58>). If you were asking if the particular method of mounting the main breaker within the Team 116 control box is legal, then for the 2005 competition the answer would be "yes." As Richie noted, in this implementation the main breaker is mounted on a short stand and protrudes through a hole in the top of the box, so it is not completely enclosed. This permits ready access to the breaker switch for inspection and testing, and brings it in compliance with all 2005 rules*. Based on the empirical evidence (e.g. successfully passing through inspections during the 2005 FRC competition season), the FRC inspectors and judges alike have determined that this was permitted and within the rules.

-dave

*note: all comments pertain to the 2005 FRC rules. Any or all of these rules may be different in future, and such solutions may or may not be allowed.

[mechanicalbrain]

also can you have the main power switch inside a box like that?
I know its not exactly clear but I was referring to mounting it without a hole in the top of the box but I found the answer.

[BlackShadowFox]

So How much does this board weigh? what is inside the mysterious box? and what is the size?

I like the idea and would like to design something that could also be pulled out in a flash.

[Lil' Lavery]

So How much does this board weigh? what is inside the mysterious box? and what is the size?

I like the idea and would like to design something that could also be pulled out in a flash.

Each box has weighed about 15 lb.s during the three competition season 116 used them. Each box has contained the appropriate electrical components to control that year's robot, so they varied in weight somewhat from year-to-year depending on the amount of victors/spikes/etc required.
The same can be said for the size. The box pictured in this thread was the largest of the three, and I'd link pictures of the 2007 version, but the team 116 website seems to be down. They're typically around 18" long, and <12" wide and <12" tall.
Inside the boxes are the RC, Victors, Spike relays, break panels, main breaker, gyro, accelerometer, and power distribution blocks. There's also a fan to cool the entire system.

[BlackShadowFox]

I know the obvious things, its the amount of each components that i would like to know.

[Chief Pride]

incredible design... looks cool too :)

[Lil' Lavery]

I know the obvious things, its the amount of each components that i would like to know.

That varied by year. Pictured in this thread is the 2005 version, which included 7 victors, 3 spike relays, 3 mollusk connector (for pwms), and the essentials (RC, Main breaker, breaker panel), as well as a large muffin fan for cooling.
Since the 116 website down, there are no pictures I can find of the final version, so I have some pictures of an earlier version (wires not cleaned up etc.). The 2007 version had 6 victors, 6 spikes, power distribution block, RC, main breaker, breaker panel, LCD panel (not pictured), DB25 connection (for pwms, not pictured), back-up battery, and a large muffin fan.
Unfinished 2007 pictures:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v178/Mystlyfe/116%20stuffage/P2140494.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v178/Mystlyfe/116%20stuffage/P2140484.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v178/Mystlyfe/116%20stuffage/P2140483.jpg

[BlackShadowFox]

Thanks For the information and images