View Full Version : Ramp or No Ramp
Cyber Punk 234
19-01-2006, 14:01
Hey I was just seeing if teams thought how hard and if it is important to get up on the ramp at the end of the match. If so can you?
-John
Arefin Bari
19-01-2006, 14:22
Team 1345 made a prototype chassis which has been posted on the forum few days ago. That chassis goes up the ramp very easily. So yes, it is worth it and you can do it fairly easily. Also, I was in team 179's shop the other day and their 2k5 robot rides up the ramp very easily. The clearance for swampy 2k5 was 2 1/2". Keep in mind the ramp was made out of plywood.
... question is how much difference is it going to make with the diamond plate and the top of the platform?
Team 1345 made a prototype chassis which has been posted on the forum few days ago. That chassis goes up the ramp very easily. So yes, it is worth it and you can do it fairly easily. Also, I was in team 179's shop the other day and their 2k5 robot rides up the ramp very easily. The clearance for swampy 2k5 was 2 1/2". Keep in mind the ramp was made out of plywood.
... question is how much difference is it going to make with the diamond plate and the top of the platform?
Lots. The grip is just not there. I was surprised when we tried it the first time and noticed the slip factor. When you build, you will see.
Lil' Lavery
19-01-2006, 14:45
Most qualification matches will be decided by the ramp. You can quote me on that one.
Stu Bloom
19-01-2006, 14:57
I think we will see a lot of robots tipping over, either fighting to get on the platform, or just with a high CG that doesn't accomodate that 30º ramp.
Ian Curtis
19-01-2006, 15:15
The Ramp will be important. I'd rather have a dump truck robot with a high powered drive train, and the ability to make it up the ramp, than one with omni wheels that can shoot 3 pointers and not make it up the ramp.
663.keith
19-01-2006, 16:48
I believe that it will be important to get up the ramp, but also, teams can help each other up. I remember in the animation the blue shovel bot pushed the other two up the ramp to get all three 'bots on. I think if a team had a good bot to go up the ramp he could easily push an omniwheel bot up :cool:
dude__hi
19-01-2006, 16:54
Our robot will be able to make it up the ramp even with the omni wheels in the front. Our back tires will have enough grip to push up the ramp and we've incorporated brakes to the wheels to make sure we don't slide back down at the end of the match.
Ian Curtis
19-01-2006, 17:18
I believe that it will be important to get up the ramp, but also, teams can help each other up. I remember in the animation the blue shovel bot pushed the other two up the ramp to get all three 'bots on. I think if a team had a good bot to go up the ramp he could easily push an omniwheel bot up :cool:
In my opinion, bad idea. We broke several of the little rollers off our omni wheels last year, and that was just going over pipe. I'd think that the omni wheels would break when getting pushed up that ramp. Also, if a robot is not built to make it up such inclines, you could damage their frame. If you want to make friends, ask before pushing robots up the ramp. You don't want to damage a robot. There are six weeks of sweat, tears, and hopefully purely metaphorical blood into that robot.
varcsscotty
19-01-2006, 17:19
brakes are a good idea. I was thinking about that.
We will aslo be able to make the ramp.
Rick TYler
19-01-2006, 17:23
brakes are a good idea. I was thinking about that.
Brakes? We ain't got no brakes! We don't got to use no stinkin' brakes! What is the back wall of the platform for, anyway?
We are wondering what the other teams are thinking about as far as getting on the ramp at the end of the round.
Is it worth it?
Is your team designing your drive train around getting up on the ramp?
We are wondering what the other teams are thinking about as far as getting on the ramp at the end of the round.
Is it worth it?
Is your team designing your drive train around getting up on the ramp?
Getting to the top is worth an awfully lot of points not to.
Justin_302
19-01-2006, 18:21
Being on the ramp will give your alliance more points at the end of the match. I dont think it will be necessary for a team to win, but it can change the score at the end of the match.
Cyber Punk 234
19-01-2006, 18:24
Lol I made this same topic today. Anyway yea I think its going to be a big thing to get on the ramp and Im questionable on the dimond plate still, Team 234 will get it done.
Good luck to all the teams.
Brakes? We ain't got no brakes! We don't got to use no stinkin' brakes! What is the back wall of the platform for, anyway?
right...brakes, I have to say it's a good idea, thanks for it. and btw, I agree high CG bots will lose at the ramp, but I think the ramp will play a big part just not as big as lil'lavery made it out to be. ;)
greencactus3
19-01-2006, 18:58
depending on your design it may be easier to have drop down caster so someone else can push you up that ramp. im positive a couple teams will be able to accomplish that
I've merged two threads about the same subject (and with the same title!) to make the world a better place.
Eric Scheuing
19-01-2006, 19:15
It seems like it wouldn't be too difficult if you have a good drivetrain.
Ian Curtis
19-01-2006, 22:12
right...brakes, I have to say it's a good idea, thanks for it. and btw, I agree high CG bots will lose at the ramp, but I think the ramp will play a big part just not as big as lil'lavery made it out to be. ;)
The ramp make a big difference in the qualifiers becuase team's won't be scoring as much and it'll make a big difference in the eliminations because scores will be so similar.
And on the subject of brakes... Is it legal for robot's to become temporarily airborne? It is a very freaky experience watching an AM transmission in fast speed making it's way towards your alliance station, with a jump between you and it.
Mike Norton
19-01-2006, 22:23
getting on the ramp? We plan on putting other robots on on ramp then getting up.
You do not need your teammates on the ramp, you could put the other team on your ramp :)
yes a 25 pts swing could help. just think the other team can't get 25 pts when they are on your ramp :ahh:
Lil' Lavery
19-01-2006, 22:30
right...brakes, I have to say it's a good idea, thanks for it. and btw, I agree high CG bots will lose at the ramp, but I think the ramp will play a big part just not as big as lil'lavery made it out to be. ;)
Recalls the 2003 and 2004 game discussions... ;)
Brandon Holley
20-01-2006, 00:19
getting on the ramp? We plan on putting other robots on on ramp then getting up.
You do not need your teammates on the ramp, you could put the other team on your ramp :)
yes a 25 pts swing could help. just think the other team can't get 25 pts when they are on your ramp :ahh:
I also believe that the opposing alliances robots count for your score as well, so you very well could be causing a 30 pt+ swing for your team!
I still believe if your team cannot keep up with a couple of good shooters, that by the end of the match, 25 pts (assuming ALL three can get up) may not make up the difference. Close matches will come down to ramp...not necessarily getting up it, but keeping others off it, or even as stated above, pushing your opponents up on yours.
Wayne Doenges
20-01-2006, 03:09
One thing to consider about pushing fellow robots up the ramp. If two robots are close to their max. height they will be pushing with the top part of there bot and not the bottom bumpers when going up the 30 degree ramp.
Pushing may not be an option for tall robots, traction or no.
Also, with a little speed, the 7" wheelchair wheels will climb the ramp.
ChuckDickerson
20-01-2006, 12:58
Also, with a little speed, the 7" wheelchair wheels will climb the ramp.
I am going under the assumption that most of the robots WILL be capable of climbing the ramp. Whether they do or not will depend on the particular game. With just the stuff that comes in the KoP, a piece of plywood and some wire every team should be able to build a basic kitbot that can climb the ramp. Therefore, even if your team has no budget, no machine shop, no materials, and you can't handle balls, pick them up off the field, or shoot them you should be able to build a bot that can at least score 5 points for your alliance. As far as I am concerned if you can't climb on the ramp you are throwing away free points.
robochick1319
19-02-2006, 17:27
We're definitely going for the ramp this year. But from the robots I've seen so far, the ramp will be something of a struggle. (a big one) :ahh:
Wayne Doenges
19-02-2006, 23:29
Last Saturday we did a couple of ramp climbs at our full weight.
We have real diamond plate on our ramp. Not just bare plywood.
Our robot had no problem churning up the ramp at low speed. No tip over. We even did a angled assent. Our bot just corrected itself and went up the ramp.
The ramp will be interesting, we can make it fairly easily. But found a slight flaw(in our design...now fixed) with part of the frame hitting a bump in the diamond plate at full speed and causing a fast stop, definitely made the driver station jump a few inches. Also i agree with previous that the 5pts at the end quite well may determine more than a few matches.
... question is how much difference is it going to make with the diamond plate and the top of the platform?
Based upon my experiences hanging out in the practice area in 2004 (FIRST Frenzy, with the stairs leading up to the middle), a lot. A saw no end of robots that could reliably climb wood stairs, but failed miserably on the diamond plate.
Diamond plate is fairly slick if your traction doesn't grip the diamonds.
Our robot cannot do the ramp. We built the robot without caring about the ramp, and tested to see if we could. Our chains hang too low and hit the corners of the ramp as we go up, plus our robot is too tall and falls over on the incline (at least at a stand still).
We believe the ramp will be unimportant to us though. If there are not 2 robots already on your platform, it is worth 5 points. Two balls shot in the center at the end is worth more than this. If there are 2 already on yours, you need to now make up 15 points, but this can be done by shooting in 5 balls, OR by shooting in a few balls and pushing one of your opponents at the end so they cannot get on the ramp. Taking away 5 or 15 points from your opponents is the same as scoring it for you, plus you get whatever you shoot in beforehand.
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