Teaching 3ds max

[BuddyB309]

I taught myself 3ds max. So I dont know how to teach it to someone else. Since I'm a senior and will be leaving the team come the fall I want to pass my knowledge down to some lower classmates. I tried that once already but it don't know how to teach, got excited that someone wanted to learn, came on too hard, and scared the would be animators away.

Any tips on how to go over the basics? I know once you get past that point it becomes easier for them. What should I teach them first? I know I cant just say "here read the tutorials" cause that turned a lot of people off when I tried that way. How do I get them exited about learning 3ds max?

[fimmel]

i took 3ds at school and we started out learning the basic shapes and how the basic modifiers work (twist, bend for example)then we learned how to use splines and there modifiers (extrude) after that we learned how to mix them and then how to loft. after that we started the animation. just think that took a whole year lol

[Morgan Gillespie]

What our team tried to do is do weekly lessons using the 3ds bible and courseware tutorials. It worked but honestly the only people that really know 3ds are the ones that took it home and taught themselves.

[RoboJedi75]

I would suggest a basic tutorial showing them around the interface (an organized point and click type of explaination). I.E. boxes, spheres, shapes, light, material, and render. Explain how you learned it in words for them. That will really teach a lot with a little. I know it worked for me.

I'm currently working on a 'tutorial' for my team and I hope to later upload it to the web for all animators to use. I'm trying to show how to make an animation from start to finish.

[Capt.ArD]

I started by teaching the basic functions: create shapes/splines/geometry, scale, translate, rotate. I taught them latheing with splines. Then, i went into vertex manipulation (this is how you turn the object into editable poly, this is how you move the verteces, etc.). then i exlpained how meshsmooth works, as well as bend, shell, etc. o yeah, and soft selection, very useful.

This took about 3 hours, or 2 1.5-hour meetings. I then spent one meeting doing a demo, where the underclassmen gave me an object and i would make a simple model really fast. this helped them see application of the things i taught them.

finally, 2-3 meetings before we begin animating, i gave an assignment of a simple item to make (pencil, cup, etc.) This helped them get a feel for the software, and to exchange tips and for me to offer individual help on things. I also taught texturing to them in groups of 2 0r 3 at this point.

it can really be done many ways. i would just say try to do it how teachers teach in class, show an idea, use simple language, and give them time to play with it and try it out.

[BuddyB309]

Okay, I got some classes set up at the school but our Tech department (AKA tech Nazis) our only letting use one computer with 3ds max on it no matter how much I plead with them.

Any suggestion of what to do teaching a class of five with one computer?

[Morgan Gillespie]

Five chairs? Just keep it interesting, let people go on and test what you are teaching them. Make sure the 4 not testing do not fool around so they actually learn instead of just one person learning. Other than getting another computer there isn't much you can do.

[[527]phil]

A reseller of the autodesk software had a few children enrolled in our school district and he came in to help out. Out of a room of 15 kids (including me) only I took the initiative to actually make an animation for the competition. After watching what he did on the projector screen for about an hour i went back to work on the robot. when i went home i began working on the animation. After i finished everything i knew how to do i handed it over to my teammate ken, who did the lighting and everything. unfortunately it didn't come out how i wanted it, but oh well. But the problem is at this point I am the only one who knows how to make an animation. And even worse there isn't much enthusiasm from the younger members. I think the best way to teach the program is by showing objects that can be recreated in 3ds max using basic geometry. Our animation was based upon Lego's because they are simple and made of basic shapes. I also recreated some of the robots from the kickoff video. showing the beginners how to make something with the basic cubes, spheres, and cylinders will entertain them for a little while. And when their done they'll want to learn how to do more. Maybe you could take a part of the robot, or a tool, and recreate it as a group. Access to the software is also a problem for my team, most of the time the computers with the software are locked up, In order for the padawans to learn you have to have access. I bought the 3ds max bible and have been going through it this summer, I highly recommend it to teach others.

[Alexa Stott]

Five chairs? Just keep it interesting, let people go on and test what you are teaching them. Make sure the 4 not testing do not fool around so they actually learn instead of just one person learning. Other than getting another computer there isn't much you can do.

While I've never learned animation, I might be able to give you some input from when I learned programming in a group just about that size. It is possible for the other 4 not actually working to really learn something. Sometimes, the person teaching us would just shove the only computer we had in front of someone and tell them to program something with it. The rest of us would watch what they were doing, and give some suggestions if we saw something was wrong, or listened to the instructor's corrections of the person's errors.

This is also a great way to teach collaboration. Everyone can give some input into the task. They all can learn whether they're at the computer or not. The important thing is, like Morgan said, to make sure the other 4 are not fooling around while other people are trying to learn.

[BuddyB309]

thanks for all of your input. I taught my first 3ds max class yesterday. I arrived at the school only to find that it was locked and I couldn't get into the only room with 3ds max. So the newbies and I headed over to the bot shop and I taught the first lesson of 3ds max with a white board and a dry erase marker. I don't think anything was learned that day, other than that I spell really bad and I cant draw on a white board. At least I tried to make it fun.

[BuddyB309]

ow my head.... I have a new found respect for teachers. Teaching this program has to be the hardest thing ever. I use a projector and the kids follow along on their computers. I feel like I'm going extremely slow and explaining everything but every two mins I hear "I'm lost!". argh.. You really don't know how much you know about something, until you try to teach it to another individual.

[addictedMax]

thanks for all of your input. I taught my first 3ds max class yesterday. I arrived at the school only to find that it was locked and I couldn't get into the only room with 3ds max. So the newbies and I headed over to the bot shop and I taught the first lesson of 3ds max with a white board and a dry erase marker. I don't think anything was learned that day, other than that I spell really bad and I cant draw on a white board. At least I tried to make it fun.
left handed?

[Mazin]

Since just about everybody on my team has come from a solid-modelling background since our schools teach Inventor starting from middle school, I would assume that the idea of "a-bunch-of-triangles" can be a bit confusing for people used to the ease of creating NURBS models from scratch.

We bridge the gap by having some people who don't know Max to make some stuff in Inventor quickly, then popping it in Max. After it's in Max, I taught them some basic selecting, moving, etc. Modeling is tricky, and we were dealing with easily solid-modelled stuff.

[BuddyB309]

One thing I found that is if the students have 3ds max on their computers at home you will eventually tell which ones are messing with the program and which ones aren't. During a class if I get through my lesson for that day and I have extra time I always find a random object in the room and say "here is a _________, now make it on 3ds max." Of course you make it along with them but you will defiantly see who's been practicing.

The Idea of modeling objects on 3ds is quite easy to teach. I found that everyone caught on and they were able to make a soft drink cup the second day. The very first thing I have them make is a teapot. ;)

Materials are a different story. I never realized how complex materials are since I taught 3ds max to myself. If your going to teach materials and how they work plan two lessons of two hours each. Then make sure to give them some homework. I found that if you call them up on the phone and give tell them you want this done, they are more motivated then if you assign it at the end of the class. (I guess its more personal, I dont know I just tried it one day and got results)

Rendering is hard to teach cause its really boring, I got through my lesson an hour early because that was just about rendering.

Also when teaching its always good to have files set up before hand that everyone can use and they can all follow along.

But most important, be patient and make it fun.

[Testament-Doom]

I totally agree with all of your opinions. I myself really was new to the beginning my first 2 years but was really slow and didn't really submit anything. Though I know 3DSmax so much now, all aspects of it. I do understand the importance of teachers and how hard their job is. Your ideas really do help you know. I am making a lesson plan for myself cause I fear I might just lose myself XD

The only thing that gets me is that in my school, I really don't think ANYONE is motivated to do 3dsmax stuff. I mean, I feel I am the only one, and the only other people that use it are people on our robotics team ,and they really don't use it much cause I'm the dedicated person to it. It's all about motivating people though. I just want to get people interested into this, you know.

I also feel a bit stupid not putting in a "create a simple object using the things you have learned thus far" thing but I can always put it into my "free" days where they explore 3dsmax the whole after school time :P. So, I just want your opinion on this. Do you like teaching 3dsmax to students or not? The pros and cons about it? I want to be prepared for it when school comes. :)

[BuddyB309]

So, I just want your opinion on this. Do you like teaching 3dsmax to students or not? The pros and cons about it? I want to be prepared for it when school comes. :)

Dude, I was in the exact same position you are in now. Not a lot of people are motivated to learn 3ds max because of its complexity. Also people who use and are dedicated to doing 3ds max are most likely not mechanical minded people. I myself stare blankly at my car's engine wondering what all the little parts do. I also did not touch any part of the robot in the build season. So, people who normally join robotics, join because they are mechanical minded people and want to work on the robot. These people will not dedicate themselves to 3ds max. (no offense to anybody out there)
I found that people who are interested in video editing or special effects in video, will pick up animation. You need people who are artist minded or are in robotics not for the robot. (which is not common) You need to take control and be recruiter. If you are not a people friendly type of guy make posters telling people they can create video games using this software. (Gamers will love the idea.)

Going along with your question though. Yes I like teaching 3ds max, I learn a lot more teaching it then I do sitting at home with my computer. I like to see the light bulbs turn on and to see the moment when some finally gets it. Its also very stressful, I want to scream at my students and tell them that they should learn faster. I don't because if you cut someone down or have any negative attitude toward it, your students will pick up on that. Never, NEVER, Talk negatively about the subject or any of your potential animators. If one of your students doesn't is lost and doesn't know what to do, don't reach over and grab his mouse and do it for him. Point at the screen and have him go where you go or give him hints. (positively)

Also have patience. Do not get aggravated at anybody or your students will pick up on that also.

Give your students the program to take home and work with. The 2 hours spent in the classroom is never enough time to learn it. They mainly have to learn the program themselves and you are there if they have any questions or to teach them a new technique. Also recognize what is experience and what is a new technique, It will make the lessons move on quicker.

Finding an animator who is truly dedicated to the program and falls in love with it is few and far in between. But I realize that If i don't teach someone my skills, the animation team dies. Also realize that the animation team will have bad years as well as a couple good years. You make the difference in when those bad years and those good years become the present.

I hope this information helps you. Ask if you have any other questions.

[Dan Zollman]

These people will not dedicate themselves to 3ds max.

Well, I would dedicate myself to 3ds max, as well as Inventor, build team, Chairman's award work, PR/marketing, everything else...but there's never enough time!

Groups of students in our club will be learning Inventor and animation this year (i.e. not the same groups of students), most of whom will start without any knowledge of the software. We plan to have a few workshops led by experienced club members throughout the beginning of the year to teach them the software, and they'll probably also go through tutorials on their own. Because of various activities and meeting schedule, we won't be able to have a regular class for each program.

I know you might only be able to answer this question for 3ds max, but if these students would be learning from both the experienced members and from tutorials on their own, would you say that it's better for certain areas to be covered by the tutorials and others by the workshops?
Or that they should start with tutorials and get more advanced in the workshops?
Or should the workshops cover the same areas as the tutorials but reinforce them?

I'm basically asking this because I'm trying to determine what approaches should be taken and how to use the meetings effectively.

[BuddyB309]

I know you might only be able to answer this question for 3ds max, but if these students would be learning from both the experienced members and from tutorials on their own, would you say that it's better for certain areas to be covered by the tutorials and others by the workshops?
Or that they should start with tutorials and get more advanced in the workshops?
Or should the workshops cover the same areas as the tutorials but reinforce them?

I'm basically asking this because I'm trying to determine what approaches should be taken and how to use the meetings effectively.

What I found that works is I give them tutorials that I found on the internet (A Big folder stuffed with printouts of 3ds max tutorials). They take it home and work on it themselves. (Make sure to get it back) Then I come up with lesson plans for the class and go through step-by-step process. When I was first starting out and learning 3ds max on my own, the tutorials in the user reference was very confusing, and gave me too many modeling techniques too early. I would walk away in frustration and a huge headache. You know what it takes to put together an animation and you know what to use and what you don’t use in the program when making an entry. Teach them all that they need to know to put together an animation. The few that go home and mess with the program will find out the other aspects of the program and will come back to you with questions. Always start the class by seeing if anybody had any question from the previous lesson.

As for advanced workshops, I really don’t know how if the advanced workshop is necessary. The more advanced you get with the program the more shorter and specific the lessons become and the more times your student will smack their forehead and say "Oh why didn't I think of that! Now let me get back to my computer and try it." The Autodesk booth at nationals is an advance workshop. I was doing plenty of forehead smacking myself there.

Perhaps the advance workshop would be all of you working on the safety video. Then your students will now know the procedure of making an AVA entry (Like story board, character sketches, and other side things). If you teach the potential animators the basics over the summer like I did, then when the safety video comes around, you all can dive in and clarify any specific problems.

More on to your questions though Basics should defiantly be covered by a workshop. Starting out with a new concept of thinking is way to difficult to learn by any means of a book. Set up a projector that shows what you have on your screen, and have the kids follow along on their computers. After you cover every aspect of the basics (Modeling, materials, character rigging, animation, lighting, and rendering) Tutorials from books and the Internet can take over from there. Just remember you need at least one class or meeting to teach one basic from the list. So you will need at least six meetings before you are done with the basics. After that you're animators can learn about particle effects and reactors on their own or you can set up more classes. (If make the right atmosphere during the lesson it ends up being really fun) Feel free to give them tutorials and other challenges to take home and learn when you are in the middle of the basics.

This is my opinion in how the lessons should be set up for teaching 3ds max. You might find a way that is more effective for your students. If you do please post on this thread and tell me your ideas.

I hope I gave you the answer you were looking for. Just Keep in mind this teaching business takes quite a lot of planning.

[coreyk]

Hello,

After reading this thread - the conflict with team members not being motivated/interested seemed to appear with every post. Therefore, let me share some insight on this matter and one way that it can be resolved.

Each season brings new individuals to the team. In all cases these students are unique, bringing different traits and interests. Most times, it extremely difficult to place the newcomers in one area of responsibility. Although difficult, it is important to assign members to an area that they are interested in - otherwise the work will not get accomplished. Take a survey at the beginning of the year and question the new members on what they would like to do. Show them your animation, robot, website, newsletter, business plan, etc. and see who is attracted to which area. Also require the new members to go through an "Interview" with the advisor's and student officers - asking questions like "What is your strongest area in school? In what occupation do you see yourself? What is your learning style? Do you prefer Writing over Mathematics?" This will provide further clarity and narrow down which area the student will do the best in.

To get students motivated show them award-winning animations that other teams created from the previous year. Let them know what they are working toward. At the beginning of school to the start of build season engage in training sessions – maybe 1-2 days a week. Teach a concept, and then have members work on tutorials involving that skill. Keep track of who is doing what in how much time. Right now you may begin listing the top tutorials that you think are worth teaching and draft “lesson plans” on how you will be teaching them. Start easy, and then gradually increase the difficulty. Remember: it may be advantageous to place more members then you actually need in animation because a few you will find are not interested. These students may be transferred to other team areas. For the most part, freshman may have no idea what they wish to do in the future as far as a career, so let them multi-task. Although, during the short weeks, when creating the animation, – keep the animators to the animating, do not spread anyone too thin. For example, the animation build time is about five weeks from when the prompt is released. The time before that, in-between training, you may have an animator helping with web design or writing for the newsletter, etc.

By taking some time to discover the interests of team members, you will find individuals that have great potential and may be highly successful in creating the animation. Make a survey and conduct an interview -- see where the interests lay.

I hope this helps – e-mail me with any questions:

cybersonics@palisadessd.org