Game Hint #1

[Ice Berg]

http://usfirst.org/uploadedImages/clue1.jpg

Another Fish?!

This was on:

http://usfirst.org/community/frc/content.aspx?id=11310

[lenny8]

YES!!!!!! you know what this means......


WATER GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ice Berg]

Take a look at the image from an angle to your screen. There is a silhouette and some illegible text in the background.

[Nuttyman54]

while it's red, that it's notably not a herring...

[Muktar Ali]

Finally a game hint :))

I can see the writing when tilting my screen but its hard to make out:confused:

[CraigHickman]

Ladies and Gentlemen, here we go. Start your insanity!

[Andrew Schreiber]

And now there is no chance of ANY of us doing anything but discussing this for the next 300 responses.

How long until someone posts a copy with the text saturated and darkened in ps? I bet 2 hrs.

[Beth Sweet]

Seth, how did you find this link, I can't seem to get to it unless I follow your link... is it under the manual?

[synth3tk]

Look deeper, kids. The letters are written backwards...

[Greg Needel]

And now there is no chance of ANY of us doing anything but discussing this for the next 300 responses.

How long until someone posts a copy with the text saturated and darkened in ps? I bet 2 hrs.

I am working on it now, I started by looking at the meta data for the photo. I don't think the text will tell us anything except a clue to what book this was scanned out of.


Anyone know what kind of fish this is?

[ttldomination]

I'm calling the bluff. No water game.

Crosses fingers.

CRAP< THE LETTERS ARE BACKWARDS. :D. My friend knows how to read backwards. hehehehe. [muahahhaha]

Can anyone make out the shape in the background? It looks like a hat or a flying saucer...?

@Beth Sweet: If you go to usfirst.org , then go under already invovled, FRC, it's right there.

[SuperJake]

Anyone know what kind of fish this is?

It looks to be a Lampris Guttatus, commonly called an Opah.

http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=1072

Here is a Wikipedia link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opah

[Ice Berg]

usfirst.org > already involved > FRC > the Game Hint link on that page

[IndySam]

It's a fish


/thread

[Beth Sweet]

Ah yes, there it is, totally missed it. Thanks!

[waialua359]

My first thought wasn't a water game.
More like a fat fish who just "ATE."
Maybe like 2006 and "EAT" (collect) balls (fish pellets) until we are full.
Then, fire away!

[Muktar Ali]

The image and writing in the background could be of the next page of the book. As it was scanned, a faint image can appear in the background

[IndySam]

It looks to be a Lampris Guttatus, commonly called an Opah.

http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=1072

LOL we crashed this website.

[IndySam]

The Opah is a deep-bodied, compressed fish. It is deep blue on the back grading to a lighter blue or silver on the belly. The body is covered with white spots and the fins are a vibrant red.

Opahs grow to over 1.5 m in length and can weigh over 70 kg.

They eat other fishes and squids.

The species has a worldwide oceanic distribution. It is a mid-water species which lives at depths between 100 m and 400 m. In Australia it is known from off northern New South Wales, around the south of the country including Tasmania, to south-western Western Australia.

The 87 cm long specimen in the image is registered in the Australian Museum Fish Collection (AMS I.24492-001). It was collected on a tuna long line off Ulladulla, New South Wales in March 1984. The upper lobe of its caudal (tail) fin is missing.

The species has also been called Spotted Moonfish and Opal Fish.

[Elgin Clock]

OPAH!!!!!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opah

http://www.state.hi.us/dbedt/seafood/opah.html

[synth3tk]

The image and writing in the background could be of the next page of the book. As it was scanned, a faint image can appear in the background
Those are some pretty thin pages, but I believe you're right. I don't think the phrases/words will mean anything significant. But then again, who knows if this clue does either.... :rolleyes:

[SuperJake]

OPAH!!!!!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opah

http://www.state.hi.us/dbedt/seafood/opah.html

I think this is interesting from the Hawaii website (emphasis mine):

Opah are not found in schools, and thus are not caught in any quantity. However, individual fish are regularly hooked by longline boats fishing over seamounts. Landings follow no set pattern in any particular area, but the presence of opah at the depths of longline fishing gear may be related to vertical migrations from the deep up the slopes of seamounts in search of food. Opah are taken on longline gear year-round, but landings seem to peak in April-August.

also...

In Hawaii, the opah has historically been an incidental catch of longline gear. Only recently has this species become commercially important. The opah was viewed as a good luck fish by old-time longline fishermen, who would give it away as a gesture of goodwill rather than sell it.

Possibly a single robot will have to climb down (or is placed inside) a deep area - its task is to give scoring objects to other robots. The other robots cannot reach scoring objects without the help of this robot.

[lenny8]

i think the letter mean that the cam this year is going to have to recognize faint letters.....


Behind a Fish :D

[martin417]

Here it is. Looks like bleed through from the back of the page it was copied from.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_H788PT0M1EI/SThB0A5_dOI/AAAAAAAABC0/5VUxtARmvZc/fish.jpg

if you can't see the image, try this:

http://picasaweb.google.com/mwilson417/First#5276039325316773090

[koreabell]

I tried to clear it with photoshop but i think it got worse kinda

http://koreabell.mireene.com/clue1.png

[Wetzel]

6 fins for one fish.
6v0 alliances! :yikes:

Wetzel

[synth3tk]

A few words I've roughly found:

"deeply"
"forked"
"body"

And a picture of a shark in the background. I vote page bleed.

[ChuckDickerson]

It was Lampris luna (now Lampris guttatus) common name Opah or Moonfish. It is an open ocean fish not commonly seen near shore or in shallow water. It is believed to move fast and manouver nimbly. It is a midwater deep sea fish. It is unusual because it has pectorial fins that point straight up, and are believed to be the main force in locamotion rather than the tail. It is the only member of its family and can be quite large up to 500 lbs. The mouth is highly protractile.

Plenty of food for thought...

[martin417]

I could read "body" and "deeply forked" the shape bleeding through appears to be another fish. I would bet that it was scanned from a fish book. Duh...

[James1902]

An opah has four types of flesh, each a different color

Four different alliances all different colors?:ahh:

The opah was viewed as a good luck fish by old-time longline fishermen, who would give it away as a gesture of goodwill rather than sell it.

Or a game involving "Sharing or giving away" pieces to other robots

indicates that opah—like tuna—maintain themselves at constantly high speeds

Speed may be important as well




Hooray for useless game hints and speculation!!!!

[Greg Needel]

color modified, some of the words are readable. I could probably change the levels a bit more to get it better. Also I flipped it horizontally because the text would be backwards on the other side of the page.


http://www.robogreg.com/clue1a.jpg

[synth3tk]

What filter levels did you use?

[Cyberphil]

CONNECT THE DOTS!! Dots 1-3000 create a rough image of Dean Kamen.

[Michael Hill]

It's a shop. I can tell from the pixels and the...metadata.

Also, checking out the file deeper, there seems to be some interesting embedded XML data. I don't know if this is common with Photoshop on OSX, but here it is anyway.

<!DOCTYPE plist PUBLIC "-//Apple//DTD PLIST 1.0//EN" "http://www.apple.com/DTDs/PropertyList-1.0.dtd">
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[lenny8]

in the back ground you can see man ray lurking in the shadows


http://home.comcast.net/~matchgame/3x5pictures/dirtybubblesnap1.jpg

[The_M01e]

Its Inner tubes(fish->water) fitting into small/thin places(fish->size)!

[ttldomination]

I doubt the actual hint is the fish. I think it may have more to do with the page in the background. If they really wanted to make the Opah the clue, then they would have simply copy and pasted a picture. :D.

Just something interesting though " An opah has four types of flesh, each a different color"

[The_M01e]

i found something.

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

You can get some of the words out of it in the correct order.

[synth3tk]

The_M01e just found a website containing the exact background text:
http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

[Richard Wallace]

The fish is shaped like a football. Footballs, or rugby balls, will be used as game pieces.

[The_M01e]

Me again, I think morphology is what we're looking for on the website. I think thats the big hint.

[SamC]

The_M01e just found a website containing the exact background text:
http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

..and the FIRST/CD community has successfully crashed another site today...

[Clinton Bolinger]

I doubt they scanned it... found this image here:

http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/images/fish/moonfish1.jpg

http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/fishorderonline.htm

Google Images: "Moon Fish"

Enjoy!

-Oris-

[ttldomination]

This has got to be the fastest growing thread yet. But, I think the rugby/football idea might be it....

[Joe G.]

I'm going to call that this is conclusive proof that this year there will NOT be a water game. Dave would never be that obvious...

[Kyle Love]

Fish typically roam the sea in schools, right? How about we go back to the old school 4v0 type of game, where all the robots on the field are out there to make a giant score and not play any defense?

[JaneYoung]

Fish typically roam the sea in schools, right? How about we go back to the old school 4v0 type of game, where all the robots on the field are out there to make a giant score and not play any defense?

This fish is a loner. No schools.

[Michael Hill]

Well, you can tell they've photoshopped it somehow from metadata in the FIRST picture that isn't prevalent in the original. Now the real goal is to see if there are a difference if one opens them. Try some different filters and overlay styles (linear burn, etc.).

[synth3tk]

This fish is a loner. No schools.
QFT. But, that doesn't mean it can't represent no alliances. Last few years, the game has been alliance-based.

alliances -> fish schools

[Ryan Caldwell]

Morphology sounds like a fun FIRST like word

[Michael Hill]

Either that or they're calling us all big fish...I mean...they are using a small fish to bait us.

[eitang]

round fish = round arena

[Elgin Clock]

I doubt they scanned it... found this image here:

http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/images/fish/moonfish1.jpg

http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/fishorderonline.htm

Google Images: "Moon Fish"

Enjoy!

-Oris-

Exact same image, with the same exact dimensions & filesize!
Awesome find!!
We can rule out that someone at FIRST scanned it in.

Well, you can tell they've photoshopped it somehow from metadata in the FIRST picture that isn't prevalent in the original. Now the real goal is to see if there are a difference if one opens them. Try some different filters and overlay styles (linear burn, etc.).

Wouldn't that make the file size vary from the original if FIRST modified it???
(See above statement)


Bring on the next Clue!

[The_M01e]

Based on the http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

I believe the hint is the heading "Morphology" And thanks to wikipedia, here are some definitions:
# Morphology (linguistics), the study of the structure and content of word forms
# Morphology (biology), the study of the form or shape of an organism or part thereof
# Morphology (astronomy), the shape of astronomical objects such as nebulae, galaxies, or other extended objects
# Morphology (folkloristics), the structure of narratives such as folk tales
# Geomorphology, the study of landforms
# Mathematical morphology, a theoretical model based on lattice theory, used for digital image processing
# River morphology, the field of science dealing with changes of river planform
# Morphological analysis, a general method for non-quantified modelling

[Andrew Schreiber]

..and the FIRST/CD community has successfully crashed another site today...

Wow, you know we are getting big when we can effectively Slashdot a site (explanation:slashdot effect is when a site is linked in a popular place and the massive in flow of traffic knocks the site off line, happens a lot with Digg.com stuff too)

On a related note, I am still thinking this is just a sick, sick joke by Mr Lavery to make us all crazy.

But, I will bite, someone earlier mentioned that the Opah engage in "vertical migrations from the deep up the slopes of seamounts in search of food. Opah are taken on longline gear year-round, but landings seem to peak in April-August." Based upon this information, we will have to climb something, be it ramp or step or even bars, to retrieve the game pieces. Based on the fact that the migrations appear to peak during months that we are not competing there will most likely be a smattering of game pieces on the ground as well but the upper ones will be worth more points.

There you go GDC, I hope you are enjoying this feeding frenzy.

[JesseK]

Game hints are really just a conspiracy for the GDC 'alpha test' last-minute ideas that are 'guessed at' by the community. :rolleyes:

Here's my take ambiguous guess that HAS to be right because it covers almost every possibility:
Fish are slippery. That means either the ground or the game piece will be hard to grasp/navigate/contend with unless you have a non-standard robot setup.

[Engineer]

Since this is a deep water fish where very little light will reach, maybe our robots will have to operating in an environment with little or no visible light.

[IndySam]

Wow, you know we are getting big when we can effectively Slashdot a site (explanation:slashdot effect is when a site is linked in a popular place and the massive in flow of traffic knocks the site off line, happens a lot with Digg.com stuff too)

On a related note, I am still thinking this is just a sick, sick joke by Mr Lavery to make us all crazy.

But, I will bite, someone earlier mentioned that the Opah engage in "vertical migrations from the deep up the slopes of seamounts in search of food. Opah are taken on longline gear year-round, but landings seem to peak in April-August." Based upon this information, we will have to climb something, be it ramp or step or even bars, to retrieve the game pieces. Based on the fact that the migrations appear to peak during months that we are not competing there will most likely be a smattering of game pieces on the ground as well but the upper ones will be worth more points.

There you go GDC, I hope you are enjoying this feeding frenzy.

Great name for a game.

[Joe G.]

A friend of mine suggested that it may have to do with how fish swim, moving side to side. Maybe articulated drivetrains will be advantageous...

[Michael Hill]

They are most certainly NOT the same size.

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~hill13/same.PNG

[James1902]

They are most certainly NOT the same size.

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~hill13/same.PNG


well that's a bit odd

[Rich Kressly]

while it's red, that it's notably not a herring...

No kidding. I'm soooooo disappointed ;)

[synth3tk]

well that's a bit odd
Yes, it is. The size was almost doubled for the clue. Did anyone find any other meta data yet?

[samir13k]

you have got to be kidding me!!! a fish!!!
there is no way that its a water game... they
would have to be plastic/rubber game pieces that
we have to transfer around. different kinds of fish
make different amounts of points...
Thats where the vision systems kick in...
Since the RC has real time processing,
the fish are going to be moving when the bot has
to pick Them up!
THIS IS REDICULOUS!!! Fishing!!! UGH!

lol...there is my 2 cents/pennies

-Samir

[JaneYoung]

But, that doesn't mean it can't represent no alliances. Last few years, the game has been alliance-based.



Right. I was thinking about the word, seamount (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seamount), and how these fish are caught.

I also like that its other names are moonfish and opal fish. There are lots of things to think about with this hint. It's fun.

[erstech]

I see Feeding Frenzy being the name.
the little or no light wouldn't make for a very exciting game for spectators, but something we need to think about is what the new control system can do that the last one couldn't.
I like the climbing or up/down idea to retrieve the game pieces, possible we will have to use the new camera to retrieve those game pieces from "the depths" (or the heights) where the drivers have no line of sight.

[IndySam]

Yes, it is. The size was almost doubled for the clue. Did anyone find any other meta data yet?

Just saved with a different level of JPEG compression. Same file.

[Elgin Clock]

They are most certainly NOT the same size.

http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~hill13/same.PNG

I retract the exact filesize comment, but dimensionally (560 x 504 pixels) they are still the same.

[Andrew Schreiber]

well that's a bit odd

Actually its not that odd, it does prove that it was modified somewhere along the line, not necessarily by FIRST. Nor does it mean there is additional information, a different compression format would change the size drastically like that. Also, are they the same format? Images are a tricky thing to compare.

EDIT:Sorry, IndySam beat me to it.

[rutzman]

The opah has four different types of flesh of different colors and the control system shipped with a camera so couldn't the game involve multi-colored game pieces that the camera has to identify to be sorted and placed in different areas?

Of course, it could be a fake clue...

[synth3tk]

Just saved with a different level of JPEG compression. Same file.
True. But remember, this is a FIRST Game Hint. Nothing's too wild an idea. ;)

[Knippschild]

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/3362/firstdecryptyl0.jpg

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/1319/firstdecrypt2dv1.jpg

[Michael Hill]

If you look at my previous post, there is XML data in the 2nd one that isn't in the 1st one. Could just be EXIF data though.

[The_M01e]

Again: http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

I propose that the text in the background is the paragraph that is under the heading "Morphology"

I think "morphology" is the key word here.

[Chief Samwize]

It seems as though the picture was scanned out of a book, that explains the picture of another fish facing the opposite direction and the backwards text, they are on the next page.

As for the clue I would venture to say that it has something to do with the name of the fish possibly. Maybe the moon part of moonfish has some significants? Moon comes out in the dark, and with the cameras in the new control system maybe there is a portion of the game (scoring area) that the drivers will not be able to see and have to use the camera?

Just some ideas.

-Sam

[Bomberofdoom]

Has anyone tested the Axis camera and it's quality?

'Cause we might be struck this year by FISH EYE LENS.

http://www.new-zealand-photo.co.nz/store/lenses/fish-eye-fisheye-lens.jpg
Eh?





.


I still vote for water game. Everyone said 2009 will be water. Why shouldn't it?:rolleyes:

[IndySam]

Original file was opened up on a graphics computer at FIRST in Photoshop and then just re-saved at PS default compression of 8. Specifically in PS CS3 on a Mac.

That's why it is different.

[synth3tk]

Original file was opened up on a graphics computer at FIRST in Photoshop and then just re-saved at PS default compression of 8. Specifically in PS CS3 on a Mac.

That's why it is different.
Thanks for the clarifications. That rules out any super-secret embedded data...

[MrForbes]

moonfish....

the playing field will have a surface similar to that of the moon....

[fimmel]

Well, you can tell they've photoshopped it somehow from metadata in the FIRST picture that isn't prevalent in the original. Now the real goal is to see if there are a difference if one opens them. Try some different filters and overlay styles (linear burn, etc.).

the odd thing is that the FIRST picture was created: dec 3 08 19:56

the one on the website was created: dec 4 08 at 16:29

how was FIRST's created before?

[vivek16]

HAH!

75 replies in an hour, I love FIRST.

maybe we will have to make sushi?

-Vivek

[JaneYoung]

Again: http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Lancetfish

I propose that the text in the background is the paragraph that is under the heading "Morphology"

I think "morphology" is the key word here.

M01e, what are you thinking about? Can you expand a little on why you think morphology is a key word?

Everyone is thinking about different things and exploring different things. Later when things settle down, folks will go back over the thread and re-read it. Plus, this thread is going to grow and grow and grow for a few hours, perhaps, days. I paid attention to what you wrote the first time and looked up morphology. It's interesting.

[IndySam]

the odd thing is that the FIRST picture was created: dec 3 08 19:56

the one on the website was created: dec 4 08 at 16:29

how was FIRST's created before?
check the time on your computer.

[Elgin Clock]

the odd thing is that the FIRST picture was created: dec 3 08 19:56

the one on the website was created: dec 4 08 at 16:29

how was FIRST's created before?

The one on the FIRST site was uploaded to the site @ 7:56pm last night - No shock.

You downloaded the one off the other website to your computer today about 15 minutes ago - again no shock.

[Lakedaimon]

Real Opah Fishin'!

[The_M01e]

Morphology I think leads to the word morph or change. That our robots are going to change to fit into places of something like that. I have a feeling that our robots will have to change in order to do something. Though I like what some of the others have came out with. I'm looking up a video where they showed the camera's video.

[Ryan Caldwell]

would be cool if we had to dress and cook the fish too

[Elgin Clock]

Btw, since this same image was found on a site with the title moonfish1.jpg, (moonfish.jpg without the "1" from the same site shown below in my signature btw - lol) maybe it has some kind of relevance to the moon's configuration this past Monday?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegasrob/3076451492/

Anyone else see that Monday night?
I thought it was odd enough to notice, & it was kinda cool.
But what could it mean in the clue world of FIRST?

[temujin]

The fish is an opah. Opah is close to Oprah. My guess is that Ms. Winfrey kicks off the game!:D

[The_M01e]

Opah = Moonfish

same fish.

[swaknight]

Morphology?, could that mean that some part of the field might change throughout the match, like between modes or something.

[Tom Bottiglieri]

I think I've found some extra information on the game. It seems we can submit questions about the new game here. (http://tinyurl.com/sqcmx)

Good luck!

[IndySam]

They did not search the web to find a scan with details about a lancetfish viewable in reverse from the back page of the scan to point us to word "morphology."

[synth3tk]

The fish is an opah. Opah is close to Oprah. My guess is that Ms. Winfrey kicks off the game!:D
Sad day for FIRST, although the publicity wouldn't be too bad...

[Andrew Schreiber]

Morphology I think leads to the word morph or change. That our robots are going to change to fit into places of something like that. I have a feeling that our robots will have to change in order to do something. Though I like what some of the others have came out with. I'm looking up a video where they showed the camera's video.

Btw, since this same image was found on a site with the title moonfish1.jpg, (moonfish.jpg without the "1" from the same site shown below in my signature btw - lol) maybe it has some kind of relevance to the moon's configuration this past Monday?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/vegasrob/3076451492/

Anyone else see that Monday night?
I thought it was odd enough to notice, & it was kinda cool.
But what could it mean in the clue world of FIRST?


Coupling these two thoughts together (and after looking up morphology myself, remember, English is a good thing to know!) I could see game pieces/fields that radically change over time. OR perhaps we should recall the April fool's prank at West Michigan in 2006, the light changing colors.

Or perhaps Morphology only refers to the change in competition structure for FIRST.

[synth3tk]

They did not search the web to find a scan with details about a lancetfish viewable in reverse from the back page of the scan to point us to word "morphology."
Closed-mindedness? Everyone knows anything is possible with FIRST and the GDC....

[synth3tk]

Elgin just killed Flickr.
Any link posted here within the next few hours will kill the site for sure. :ahh:

[Elgin Clock]

Elgin just killed Flickr.

Still works for me. lol I don't know why all you people are complaining about websites crashing, they all work for me when I click these links in here. :D

But if they do crash.. let me just say, "My bad!" lol :rolleyes:

[JaneYoung]

This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morphology) was the morphology I looked up. All these different areas...wow.

Also, Elgin, I did see the moon and planets that evening. It was an incredible night for a walk. Thanks for the link. Beautiful.

Edit: Sorry Indy, I just read your post. I just like the word. You do have a point. :)

[billbo911]

It looks to be a Lampris Guttatus, commonly called an Opah.


Here is a Wikipedia link:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opah

From Wikipedia.... "....Though rarely caught, opah are prized trophies ..."

OK, here is my EARLY $.02.

One or two of the Game Elements are going to have a very large bonus value related to them. But they will be very difficult to attain.

[RyanN]

moonfish....

the playing field will have a surface similar to that of the moon....

No, we will not be playing on a surface similar to the moon, but Dave has setup a shuttle service to the moon for all the teams to go play on the ACTUAL MOON!.

Thanks Dave, I'm excited about visiting the moon. I've never been before!

[billbo911]

Still works for me. lol I don't know why all you people are complaining about websites crashing, they all work for me when I click these links in here. :D

But if they do crash.. let me just say, "My bad!" lol :rolleyes:

Oooops, my bad. It's the IT dept. at my work filtering some web sites.

Rock On!!!

[dtengineering]

moonfish....

the playing field will have a surface similar to that of the moon....

Given NASA's interest in lunar exploration, the "rough" terrain on the FTC playing field this year, I think this might be one of the better ideas to date...

Jason

[Greg Needel]

There are many methods of hiding information in photographs. I was able to scan the image at the highest sensitivity for all the major types of encryption (jsteg, jphide, outguess, and invisible) The system of hiding information within photos was able to detect a hidden message. Now the methodology I used just exposes the type of hidden message and not the message itself. The message unfortunatly for us appears to be hidden in the JPHIDE which utilizes a password based encryption so without the password it will be impossible to figure out the message. Although we do know that there is something there.


****disclaimer: the way the analysis tools that I have scan the data it looks for missing voids in repeating color sections of the photo (complex photos with lots of colors are best for hiding). When I tested with normal sensitivity I didn't see any result, but on cranking up the sensitivity I found proof of an encryption. With all things like this it is possible to get a false positive, but since this is all for fun anyway we can just assume it is there.



so what do we think the password is? I might try to make a dictionary and brute force it later after I am done with the bench top test of the new control system.

[EricH]

From Wikipedia.... "....Though rarely caught, opah are prized trophies ..."

OK, here is my EARLY $.02.

One or two of the Game Elements are going to have a very large bonus value related to them. But they will be very difficult to attain.
If so, best check the game design threads.

Something tells me that this is not going to be a full water game, though a water-like substance may be involved. I also think that the gamepiece will not be a real fish.

Greg, the last thing we need is muddier (or darker) water.


Or is the GDC just teasing us? I choose the last one.

[MrForbes]

password = red_herring

[Nica F.]

just analyzing what other people have said, just an unload of thoughts; (the beginning of many ;) )

It is an open ocean fish not commonly seen near shore or in shallow water.
This makes me think of how in the "Aim High" game there had to be a backbot that could only stay in one portion of the field during the game. It may be possible that there could again be several parts to the match, or a certain period in time where bots can only stay in a certain area.

...is believed to move fast and manouver nimbly. .....The mouth is highly protractile.

Speed could be essential, or at least quick moving, seeing that a synonym for nimble is agile, my guess is that there will some sort of signal that robotics will need to respond to quickly, could be connected to the autonomous or hybrid mode, or if it's as complicated as it could be it could be additional signals throughout the game.

As for the whole "moonfish" nickname there's so much that could be connected in reference of the moon part of the name I'm not going to get into detail about that. not today. lol

If only this game hint came out after I had finals... haha :rolleyes:

[AndyB]

First could come up with a better clue for the word morphology than a picture of a fish...

You not going to solve this clue, or any other clue by finding hidden text at extreme contrast levels or breaking down color channels.

There's a reason for this fish. The best thing I could recommend would be to start finding meaningful anagrams of Lampris guttatus.

[synth3tk]

There's a reason for this fish. The best thing I could recommend would be to start finding meaningful anagrams of Lampris guttatus.
That's funny.....

[Bob Steele]

Perhaps the MOON fish is a vague reference to Mike Singletary and his locker room antics. Robots with pants???

:0)

[AngelicSlayer]

FIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIS H~!!!!!!

YEAH.
WIN.
WHOO.

[Greg Needel]

Did anyone think this could be in relation to the band PHISH getting back together for the first time since 2004?

That could mean we could be doing a FIRST frenzy style game with elements from the past few years all combined. I hope that is it, as I would love a multidimensional game.


http://www.misconstruedthoughts.com/newblog/archives/phish.jpeg

[ironbears]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

[Vikesrock]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

It most certainly is a waste of time, but it would take a lot more than one post by stop this train now.

[Madison]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

Kinda, but it didn't help.

[EricH]

Kinda, but it didn't help.Yep. Back around 2006, Dave's ramblings gave a lot of hints-- but that didn't help. Same with the official hint-- and only one portion was really solved correctly. You wouldn't remember who got it right, now, would you?:p


This hint will be painfully obvious in hindsight. They all are.

[synth3tk]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?
I believe once, but so close to the Kick-Off that it didn't matter anyway.

Besides, this is FIRST. We thrive on following seemingly-nonexistent leads. :D This is fun for us. And as stated earlier, nothing will stop us from speculating. Is this a waste of time? Yeah. Do I have anything better to do than look too deep into a picture to find a hint? No, not really. :p

It's all in good fun.

[Joe G.]

There's a reason for this fish. The best thing I could recommend would be to start finding meaningful anagrams of Lampris guttatus.

"Gap Stairs Tumult." They did warn against designing before the season...

[Akash Rastogi]

I believe that a change in field is in order. And NO, not water. Something slippery perhaps or on the other hand, something squishy and gummy. Scales indicate scaling objects larger than we are used to. That's all I'm saying for this "hint." Ha.

[JaneYoung]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

I think there will be other hints that come along as well. Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

The GDC seems to let us run the line out as far as we can go, exasperating ourselves and everyone else. Then they throw out another hint and we start again. Chumming, right Libby? :D

If you stay within the framework of 'entertaining', the lure isn't as attractive, easing the tug of the hook as it sets.

[commodoredl]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

07 someone was able to take the picture and figure out that the game piece was an inner tube. I don't remember if that proved it or if everyone continued guessing, the thread was way too long in the end to bother reading all the way through.
In most cases even if you did figure out the hint you wouldn't have any proof that you were correct so it wouldn't make a difference. :P

[IndySam]

well this seems like a waste of time, has anyone actually ever gotten a clue right before and gave them an advantage?

waste of time? Blasphemy!


BTW this is a appears to be a male of the species

[EricH]

BTW this is a appears to be a male of the speciesPut it in the box... http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41123&highlight=mailboxes

[Ryan_Todd]

Interesting goodies start halfway down the following Webster's page on Lampris Guttatus:
http://www.websters-dictionary-online.org/definition/Lampris+Guttatus

A few highlights:

Pig Latin = amprislay uttatusgay.

Words within the letters "a-a-g-i-l-m-p-r-s-s-t-t-t-u-u"
-3 letters: gutturalisms.
-4 letters: gutturalism, pragmatists.
-5 letters: marsupials, mutualists, pragmatist, sugarplums.

Hexadecimal = 4C 61 6D 70 72 69 73 47 75 74 74 61 74 75 73

Binary = 01001100 01100001 01101101 01110000 01110010 01101001 01110011 00100000 01000111 01110101 01110100 01110100 01100001 01110100 01110101 01110011

HTML = &#76 &#97 &#109 &#112 &#114 &#105 &#115 &#32 &#71 &#117 &#116 &#116 &#97 &#116 &#117 &#115

ISO 10646 = 004C 0061 006D 0070 0072 0069 0073 0047 0075 0074 0074 0061 0074 0075 0073



Additionally, an online anagram finder @ wordsmith.org found exactly 66667 possible anagrams!
Link for first 1000 only:
http://wordsmith.org/anagram/anagram.cgi?anagram=Lampris+Cuttatus&t=1000
Link for all: (Beware, it takes a long time to load)
http://wordsmith.org/anagram/anagram.cgi?anagram=Lampris+Guttatus&language=english&t=0&d=&include=&exclude=&n=&m=&source=adv&a=n&l=n&q=n&k=1

[Rick TYler]

I don't have the stamina right now to read the whole thread, so just a question -- did someone also suggest that the name "moonfish" and rounded shape of the fish might suggest a disk-shaped game component? Robot Ultimate Frisbee, anyone?

[Anna B.]

going with the whole morphology thing, if it is applicable in so many areas, maybe there will be multiple areas for the robots to do different things?

[JaneYoung]

I don't have the stamina right now to read the whole thread, so just a question -- did someone also suggest that the name "moonfish" and rounded shape of the fish might suggest a disk-shaped game component? Robot Ultimate Frisbee, anyone?

Flying fish?

1902, want to jump on in here?

Flying fish... geez.

Edit: hey, they do flap their way through the water...

[cdennisxlx2]

Words within the letters "a-a-g-i-l-m-p-r-s-s-t-t-t-u-u"
-3 letters: gutturalisms.
-4 letters: gutturalism, pragmatists.
-5 letters: marsupials, mutualists, pragmatist, sugarplums.


3, 4, 5 ... anyone?

how about a triangle? or to be more specific a right triangle.

just thought i would throw that into the mix

[Nin_estarSaerah]

I'm sitting here drinking eggnog, listening to Christmas carols, watching a roaring fire, mulling over game hints. The holidays are here!

Well, its too obvious that it would be a game hint, unless they want us to think its too obvious, we're being toyed with.

Acording to Wikipedia's in pop culture "On one episode of the Food Network show Iron Chef America, opah was chosen as the secret ingredient. A clip from this battle provided a memorable moment when Iron Chef Mario Batali jokingly danced with a whole opah en route to his station in the beginning of the program.

Currently being used as the first game hint of the 2009 FIRST Robotics Competition."

Maybe our robots have to cook.

Lampris guttatus . Lampris, greek for brilliant or clear, guttatus, latin for spotted or speckled. a contradiction?

Another anagram is Alarmist Gust Put. its a golf windmill.

well, thats my two cents for now.

p.s. yes, its a waste of time, but i'd rather waste time on this than on anything else.

[pentau]

Two things to add that may/may not be helpful.

This anagram generator is backed by a dictionary, so it might be easier to sort through the possibilities:
http://www.mbhs.edu/~bconnell/cgi-bin/anagram.cgi?cpw=4&phrase=Lamprisguttatus


It seems that they searched for moonfish instead of Opah. Is there any deeper meaning? :p
http://images.google.com/images?q=moonfish

[Ryan Dognaux]

Everyone is reading way too much into this. The game piece is clearly a bunch of Opahs this year. Problem solved, case closed. Start designing your fish handling robots now.

[smstarkiller]

hey fish are really slimy and hard to grip maby the game peice is 2.

[R.C.]

hey fish are really slimy and hard to grip maby the game peice is 2.

Or maybe the field is slippery, ha.

[Nin_estarSaerah]

I think that the ideas of a lunar landscape are most likely

perhaps its a game where we have to "fish" for mechanical fish. like this:

http://www.comparestoreprices.co.uk/images/pr/pressman-toy-international-ltd-lets-go-fishing.jpg

[b3t4_2836]

http://www.fishbase.org/Summary/SpeciesSummary.php?id=1072

Did anyone else notice the word "TUBE" in the order section? Maybe carrying tubes again, or going through them like tunnels.

Also with the scanned idea. since one fish is in one direction and the shadow is in the other maybe a reversal go direction?


I liked the moon idea with the uneven playing field. Or a round playing field.

[Tom Line]

Two things to add that may/may not be helpful.

This anagram generator is backed by a dictionary, so it might be easier to sort through the possibilities:


It seems that they searched for moonfish instead of Opah. Is there any deeper meaning? :p

I rarely venture wild guesses, but you may have a point there.

The fact that this is the exact photo that comes up with a moonfish google search is interesting.

So Dave, perhaps playing off the water game and the red herring, included "fish" in the hint for fun. He included moon because this game has a circular illuminated object over the field that will be detected by the new camera.

Have they ever included a camera in the KOP when it was not needed? That camera isn't free - I would wager they wouldn't provide it unless it was going to be used.

[Nawaid Ladak]

Of course, it could be a fake clue...

/This

[Dryice101]

OPAH a model for optimal design of multipurpose small hydropower plants. It is a new Engineering Software.:) :) :) So stop your gibberish and look it up!
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6V1P-4GWBDSB-1&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&view=c&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=3cb8cab2a87623fdf896d5f5a3b3b64f

[Ryan_Todd]

An opah is large, round, and flat. Discs, anyone?

[GaryVoshol]

Moonfish = ohms info

Robot Resistance!

[Nin_estarSaerah]

Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary

Opah: A large oceanic fish (Lampris quttatus), inhabiting the Atlantic Ocean. It is remarkable for its brilliant colors, which are red, green, and blue, with tints of purple and gold, covered with round silvery spots. Called also king of the herrings.

so, moon, fish, new software, anagrams....

or just the king of red herrings.

[smstarkiller]

on wikipedia they said that the fish highest point lattuded was 34 degrees. around that latitude is Rosewell georgia which is right next to atlanta. theidore roosevelts mother was born in that city. are we gunna use teddy bears?:ahh:
also the genus name for the opah fish comes from the latin for brilliant/ clear. any ideas?

[jerry w]

anagrams for lampris guttatus

airmass glut putt
august limp start
gas multistartup
grampa slits tutu
guilt ramp status
guitar must splat
spatial gum trust
pastrami gut lust

:D :D :D

[synth3tk]

Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary

Opah: A large oceanic fish (Lampris quttatus), inhabiting the Atlantic Ocean. It is remarkable for its brilliant colors, which are red, green, and blue, with tints of purple and gold, covered with round silvery spots. Called also king of the herrings.

so, moon, fish, new software, anagrams....

or just the king of red herrings.
Nice find is very nice. So basically, this could mean that this is just one king-of-a-herring.

[CraigHickman]

on wikipedia they said that the fish highest point lattuded was 34 degrees. around that latitude is Rosewell georgia which is right next to atlanta. theidore roosevelts mother was born in that city. are we gunna use teddy bears?:ahh:
also the genus name for the opah fish comes from the latin for brilliant/ clear. any ideas?

Or we could have to climb a 34 degree ramp... O.o

[smstarkiller]

Nice find is very nice. So basically, this could mean that this is just one king-of-a-herring.

oh no not again

[b3t4_2836]

anagrams for lampris guttatus

airmass glut putt
august limp start
gas multistartup
grampa slits tutu
guilt ramp status
guitar must splat
spatial gum trust
pastrami gut lust

:D :D :D
i'm going with "pastrami gut lust"

but it does have ramp in the list too...

[Boydean]

As stated here - http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/fishorderonline.htm

Lampris guttatus weights between 30-50kgs. 50kgs -> 110lbs, NEW WEIGHT LIMIT?? :yikes:

[Nate Smith]

Acording to Wikipedia's in pop culture ...."Currently being used as the first game hint of the 2009 FIRST Robotics Competition."


Unless it was somebody here(traceroute isn't being that cooperative...), has anyone considered where the wikipedia change came from? (IP: 208.65.90.13)

[Ice Berg]

I'm betting that the game will be called:


Shoot for the Moon

[RyanN]

color modified, some of the words are readable. I could probably change the levels a bit more to get it better. Also I flipped it horizontally because the text would be backwards on the other side of the page.


http://www.robogreg.com/clue1a.jpg

Okay... I zoomed out to try to clear some words out. Here's what I think I can make up:

body, covered, deeply forked, dorsal fin, bellied

I Googled all of those together, but couldn't find any exact matches. Of course a lot about fish (dorsal fin).

[Schnabel]

You know, I think that we are just over analyzing this hint. If I remember correctly, once we find out the game, we have to reanalyze the hint again in order to find out what it meant, which usually ends up being a random fact of the game. (i.e. the GPS coordinates last year)

[smstarkiller]

You know, I think that we are just over analyzing this hint. If I remember correctly, once we find out the game, we have to reanalyze the hint again in order to find out what it meant, which usually ends up being a random fact of the game. (i.e. the GPS coordinates last year)

ya we probly are. What were the GPS coordinates for last year anyway?

[384 huband44]

In the background of the picture in the text i saw the word body and someone earlier said something about opah dealing with the number 4
This might mean that there needs to be a body with four somethings attached to it and these four "components" to pick something up

[Eugene Fang]

ya we probly are. What were the GPS coordinates for last year anyway?

It pointed to a tortoise and hare statue - a race.

[RyanN]

Unless it was somebody here(traceroute isn't being that cooperative...), has anyone considered where the wikipedia change came from? (IP: 208.65.90.13)

I believe it was someone here. I went to http://www.ip-adress.com/ip_tracer/ and searched up 208.65.90.13, and it says:

IP address [?]: 208.65.90.13 [Whois]
IP address country: United States
IP address state: Georgia
IP address city: Marietta
IP address latitude: 33.953201
IP address longitude: -84.517700
ISP of this IP [?]: Atlantic Nexus
Organization: LLC
Host of this IP: [?]: npo-services.org [Whois]
Local Time of this IP country: 2008-12-04 21:16

[smstarkiller]

It pointed to a tortoise and hare statue - a race.

wow they put to much time into these clues

[vivek16]

Moonfish

Round game piece, it may move on it's own (wriggle like a fish), and there will be light involved.

-Vivek

[Eugene Fang]

wow they put to much time into these clues

Actually, i think we do. lol.

[smstarkiller]

the 34 degrees seems to be a consistant thing.

[Nin_estarSaerah]

yes, and the 2007 game hint was a picture directly from the game.

[synth3tk]

You know, I think that we are just over analyzing this hint. If I remember correctly, once we find out the game, we have to reanalyze the hint again in order to find out what it meant, which usually ends up being a random fact of the game. (i.e. the GPS coordinates last year)
Think of it this way: The more we analyze it now, the closer we could be to actually knowing what it meant later. As in, we may have guessed it and won't know until after Kick-Off...

As stated here - http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/fishorderonline.htm

Lampris guttatus weights between 30-50kgs. 50kgs -> 110lbs, NEW WEIGHT LIMIT?? :yikes:
Good lawd, I hope not.....

[Kiwi]

The sites, and for that matter also the fish, are Australian. Perhaps there's a connection to "down under"... maybe the number of spots (like the dots on the fish) on the bottom of a game piece will tell us how many points it can score.


Maybe the deep water fish means we aren't allowed to touch the floor.

[lingomaniac88]

Not being allowed to touch the floor? I don't think the GDC would be that cruel...

[Nin_estarSaerah]

"It is currently being used as the first game hint for the 2009 FIRST Robotics Competition season"

this was added to the Opah page on wikipedia at 2:07, while this thread was started at 3:13. when was the hint posted


not that this is at all relevant, I'm sure.

and i could be making a mistake on the times, as well.

[Joe G.]

I think that the many, small dots on the fish could represent many, small gamepieces. I think that one main advantage of the new control system, without the game being fully reliant on it, would be the camera's ability to give driver feedback on picking up very small objects.

I think that the "deep fork," and the tight crevices on the fish's fins may represent tight spaces that need to be manuvered through, possibly in a way that a normal chassis cannot handle.

The latitude thing seems a bit to obscure, even for the GDC.

[sdcantrell56]

Here it is. Looks like bleed through from the back of the page it was copied from.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_H788PT0M1EI/SThB0A5_dOI/AAAAAAAABC0/5VUxtARmvZc/fish.jpg

if you can't see the image, try this:

http://picasaweb.google.com/mwilson417/First#5276039325316773090

How did you manage this? You are quite sneaky. Good thing you're on our side. HAHA

[smstarkiller]

if only we could find the book this came form.....

[Boydean]

if only we could find the book this came form.....

Ill give it about two to three days before someone finds it.

[smstarkiller]

Ill give it about two to three days before someone finds it.

ya maby the whole clue is just pointing in the dircection of the book and the fish has nothing to do with it.

[Justin Montois]

Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary

Opah: A large oceanic fish (Lampris quttatus), inhabiting the Atlantic Ocean. It is remarkable for its brilliant colors, which are red, green, and blue, with tints of purple and gold, covered with round silvery spots. Called also king of the herrings.

or just the king of red herrings.

Agreed. King of the Red Herrings.

[KarenH]

Moonfish

Round game piece, it may move on it's own (wriggle like a fish), and there will be light involved.

-Vivek
A Roomba! (http://store.irobot.com/home/index.jsp)

[MachineMan]

Here is something that I noticed:

The fish is pointing toward the left.
The left signifies the Democratic Party.
So when we get to the competition, all the good robots' mechanisms will be taken off and evenly distributed among all the robots without mechanisms.

Only joking...I love these threads.
:D

[smstarkiller]

Here is something that I noticed:

The fish is pointing toward the left.
The left signifies the Democratic Party.
So when we get to the competition, all the good robots' mechanisms will be taken off and evenly distributed among all the robots without mechanisms.

Only joking...I love these threads.
:D

hahaha socialism joke.

[Nin_estarSaerah]

Here is something that I noticed:

The fish is pointing toward the left.
The left signifies the Democratic Party.
So when we get to the competition, all the good robots' mechanisms will be taken off and evenly distributed among all the robots without mechanisms.

Only joking...I love these threads.
:D

funny, but almost not funny.

[longrange]

The sites, and for that matter also the fish, are Australian. Perhaps there's a connection to "down under"... maybe the number of spots (like the dots on the fish) on the bottom of a game piece will tell us how many points it can score.


Maybe the deep water fish means we aren't allowed to touch the floor.

The fish are not specific to Australia. We catch them here in Los Angeles AT 34 deg. N. Lat.

This years kit of parts has a camera and the user station has the ability to attach a display for real time video. I think the game will require a gripper arm with camera to SCALE a wall and pick up 1 of FOUR COLOR Discs. Andy Mark is also now making larger wheels which would help cross a surface like the MOON(fish).

[Jonathan Norris]

You all (well most of you) have a new control system to play with... Go learn the in's and out's of it... trust me learning the control system will help you a lot more come January 3rd then this 'hint' will. The control system is more fun and just as frustrating a use of your time... patience... we will all know the game soon enough.... breath ....

[lenny8]

i got it the field will smell like fish. yes, everyone smell it. Smell it!

[sayso_411]

I like the ideas that we have to morph or adapt the robot to ride the field...i mean moonfish=lunar like crater surface...and if the image does refer to lunar position, during this week it was supposed to align with venus and jupiter-again planet and space; GDC is ruining my sleep-but well worth it
Also, i think our robot needs to be agile like the fish to maneuver the field!
FTC for now ;)

Edit: OPAH: Hydropower?-things relating to a water game need to stop

[Karibou]

I have the feeling that analyzing the anagrams of Lampris Guttatus is probably going way overboard. Last year, they gave us a set of words that made an anagram, not a picture. This fish has a multitude of names, and we wouldn't know which one to use in an effort to figure it out.

I love the idea of a playing field like the moon...the only problem I can see with it is that it would be impossible for teams to practice in their own workspaces, unless FIRST decided to provide us with a replica of the playing field in our kits...:ahh:

Did anyone else notice this on Wikipedia?
Opah are deeply keeled, compressed and discoid fish with conspicuous coloration: the body is a steely blue grading to rosy on the belly, with white spots covering the flanks.
Red. Blue. White. FIRST colors. The camera recognizes triangles, squares, and circles, at least. Can it recognize colors as well? (all I know about the capabilities of the camera is what I can see from the pictures that our programmers have put up from the benchtesting...).

[KAPcom]

So, i've been working on the hint for the past couple hours, and here's what i've got:

-i did a simple substitution decode with the scientific name of the fish, and got 12, 1, 13, 16, 18, 9, 19 – 7, 21, 20, 20, 1, 20, 21, 19.

-Tried googling these, didn't get anything. So, i added the two sets together, and got 88, 129.

-Googled this, and came accross this doc:
http://www.dss.cahwnet.gov/lettersnotices/entres/getinfo/acl88/88-129.pdf

-Finally, took the accronym of the main subject of the doc. and got this:
S.A.W.S.

I'm thinking the game this year will be some sort of construction game, where the pieces are intertwinable, and we have to put them together. This goes with the morphology therory as the field will be changing drasticly throughout the match. I haven't come up with a reason for the text in the background, but oh wells.

Maybe this will create some branches in your brain.

[DMetalKong]

Don't forget Dave's mighty morphin' signatures.

"To the five, you keep me alive"
"To the six, you give me my fix"
"To the three, thank you from me"

[synth3tk]

OMG, if I view your signature one more time, Karibou, I'm going to go mad!!! :p

I keep winning until I see your posts.

[lemon1324]

Sometimes a fish is just a fish.

Or possibly the game pieces are fish.

Or this is the King of Red Herrings

[JaneYoung]

Ok, speaking of going mad..
Has anyone noticed and/or pointed out the lines in the belly that look like a right angle/maybe a square? Like pencil lines?

*sigh*

I can see it on the original hint and I also see it in this (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=779436@postcount=71) post.

[IndySam]

You all (well most of you) have a new control system to play with... Go learn the in's and out's of it... trust me learning the control system will help you a lot more come January 3rd then this 'hint' will. The control system is more fun and just as frustrating a use of your time... patience... we will all know the game soon enough.... breath ....

Don't rain on our parade :D

[Zyck_titan]

Perhaps it simply has to do with the fish itself? Gameplay might involve Fishing, casting a line, reeling something in etc.

[MrForbes]

I love the idea of a playing field like the moon...the only problem I can see with it is that it would be impossible for teams to practice in their own workspaces,

I knew this old Ranger 7 film would come in handy for something....

[EricH]

The sites, and for that matter also the fish, are Australian. Perhaps there's a connection to "down under"... maybe the number of spots (like the dots on the fish) on the bottom of a game piece will tell us how many points it can score.


Maybe the deep water fish means we aren't allowed to touch the floor.I believe that at one point, Dave claimed to have grown up down under. That's the connection.

I noticed that Aidan was around earlier. I'm just wondering how hard the GDC is laughing their heads off right about now...

...they'll be laughing even harder by the end of the week.

[colin340]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLE2So5NIY0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLE2So5NIY0)

^^my reply
you tube cut me of i was was about to say slippery-er

[Fireworks 234]

I totally agree with the thoughts that the watermark is not a part of the hint. I feel that the only part of the hint here is its name and/or the fish itself.

[Joe G.]

Maybe "Red Herring" is the hint. Maybe we will have to fake out our opponents to succeed in the game.

[Illegalsocks]

I think the bit about "vertical migrations from the deep up the slopes of seamounts" and the four different colors of flesh are most significant. I'm predicting a game where the 'bots have to climb steep slopes that are subject to change (morphology) and have to give something to fellow alliance members (fishermen giving it away).

[JB987]

i'm going with "pastrami gut lust"

but it does have ramp in the list too...

Just for fun...a quick rearrangement of the anagrams reveals:

august(majestic as in big) ramps tilts (not grammatical)...been there before and much of the past does repeat over the years... and august ramp stilts...then again, if you are real creative, and read between the letters one can read, "its enough to drive one crazy"...

[ChuckDickerson]

The GDC obviously did a Google images search for "moonfish" and took the first image that showed up. This must have been on purpose. The question is why?

A quick Google search for "moon fish" turns up this: http://www.moonfishocean.com/ right away. Apparently "moon, fish, ocean" is the new zen version of "rock, paper, scissors". :ahh:

From the website:

"Zen Masters use the game as a test of a disciple’s reflexes and non-attachment to outcomes. The Master holds a pebble in his palm. The pebble remains hidden when the Master plays “Moon” or “Fish.” It is revealed only when the Master plays “Ocean.” If the disciple can snatch the pebble quickly enough, he automatically wins the round."

Sounds like we will be somehow playing "rock, paper, scissors" with robots and trying to steal something from the opposing alliance. Still 3v3. One "master" robot holds/guards a special game piece while the other 2 "disciple robots" try to steal the game piece from the opposing alliance for major bonus points. Maybe like 2006 with offensive and defensive periods of 2v3 or something.

[Raul]

I say just rub some lemon on the picture of the fish and see what pops out.

[daltore]

I agree that the text is unimportant. One set of words I can make out is "deeply forked caudal" which merely refers to a feature of the fish, and is most likely a description on the next page that the scanner accidentally caught. Looking at data on the fish, it looks like it's not good at all at dealing with changes in its environment, and is very sensitive. This could be another global warming/impact lesson. Either that or we do, in fact, get to build 6 foot, 500 lb. robots.

And there's no way to clean up the text anymore than has already been done. Anyone tried running it through some steganography programs? It's unlikely it contains any hidden data as it's only 90 kilobytes, but it might be worth a try. The low quality and graininess lends itself to an opportunity for a seamless steganograph. My tests show it's a possible candidate for the jphide protocol with a 2.0 sensitivity scan. I'm attempting to confirm, but someone else with more advanced tools may be more successful.

[Cooley744]

lol good old game hints. as far as im concerned, it's going to be a rock paper scissors type deal. something more like the 2007 game then the 2008. something so simple like tic tac toe became the the massive intertube rack. they are going to take a really simple concept and make it into a massive game! im so excited!

[comphappy]

We are going fishing...

[Cooley744]

the card game go fish, but in robot form.

[Dowjonesbotics]

Game involving triangles...look at the fins. Its pointless to sit here unless you have hours of time to analyze these "hints"

Haha, wish I had time. Good luck everyone!:)

[Eugene Fang]

the card game go fish, but in robot form.

Well, since the robots can communicate with each other via wifi, i guess there will be 6 stationary robots on the field, and they can play go fish wirelessly!

how exciting!

[BornaE]

Daves signuture

"I know what you're thinking, punk," hissed Wordy Harry to his new editor, "you're thinking, 'Did he use six superfluous adjectives or only five?' - and to tell the truth, I forgot myself in all this excitement; but being as this is English, the most powerful language in the world, whose subtle nuances will blow your head clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel loquacious?' - well do you, punk?"
- Stuart Vasepuru, 2006 Bulwer-Lytton Fiction Contest

To the four: awaiting a few more.


My OTHER CAR (http://marsrovers.nasa.gov/home/index.html) is still on Mars!!!

[billbo911]

This is just my version of a FIRST opah, aka Moonfish.

http://billbo911.smugmug.com/photos/430598041_FbMiX-L.jpg

Sorry, I was getting a little bored. :yikes:

[artdutra04]

Everybody's doin' the fish! Yeah, yeah, yeah! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZWLup3yB7s&fmt=18)
(In case you are wondering, the song in the above video is Trendy by Reel Big Fish).

http://www.brandsoftheworld.com/brands/0015/6728/brand.gif (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reel_Big_Fish)

[Dan Petrovic]

YES!!!!!! you know what this means......


WATER GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I almost bashed my head into my desk when I saw the fish knowing that someone would bring up that ridiculous water game joke.

[ChuckDickerson]

For what it is worth the original image seems to be copyrighted by the Commonwealth Scientific and Industial Research Organisation (CSIRO) of Australia. Go to this page: http://www.marine.csiro.au/caabsearch/caab_search.caab_report?spcode=37268001 and click the little “image info” link under our new favorite photo at the top of the page. It should take you to this page: http://www.marine.csiro.au/caabsearch/caab_search.image_details?ref=37268001a-t.jpg with the copyright info.

The photo is available for purchase in high resolution here: http://www.frdc.com.au/shop/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=37268001-DLD.tif&Store_Code=photo if say you wanted to publish it in a book as an illustration.

The photo FIRST is using as Clue #1 seems to come from a simple Google Images search for “moonfish” which in turn originated here (as previously noted in this thread): http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/images/fish/moonfish1.jpg which is linked to from this parent webpage: http://www.australianseafoodexports.com/fishorderonline.htm

The image used on www.australianseafoodexports.com has the reverse text in the background as does the FIRST Clue #1 image. The GDC did not covertly plant any hidden messages in the reverse text. They have better things to do with their time. More likely the Australian seafood export company scanned a photo of a “moonfish” they had handy in some book and the text on the backside of the page (probably about some entirely different and non-related fish) came through on the scan. My bet is this is the book: http://www.publish.csiro.au/?nid=18&pid=2181 but it may be this one also: http://www.publish.csiro.au/?nid=18&pid=3551. I don’t have a copy of either book myself but may can find one at the office when I get back next week. If anyone lives near a university with a marine research program they might want to check the university library and see what they can find.

Given that last year the clue was in fact a latitude and longitude coordinate it might also be worth considering the CAAB Taxon Code for Lampris guttatus is 37 268001 which could easily be construed as a latitude in North America. If a Clue # 2 comes along it might be a reference to a longitude. I doubt that the GDC would give us a lat/lon 2 years in a row but you never know.

[lenny8]

I totally agree with the thoughts that the watermark is not a part of the hint. I feel that the only part of the hint here is its name and/or the fish itself.


thats what they want you to think.:p

[Betty_Krocker]

No, I think that we will have to do a game that involves a net of some sort to catch things

OR

We are going to have to have one or two robots go after a high value target, while the others lend support or something along those lines

as far as the GPS theory... If the problem DOES have to do with fishing or marine, they might refer to LORAN-C TD coordinates since more fisherman and navigators use it over GPS due to accuracy...

[pat-tron116]

the water mark is the dicstionary defonition for RED HARRING:ahh:

[Betty_Krocker]

the clue could have to do with the fact that fish have scales, and the robots could have to scale something...

[Elgin Clock]

It (2008 game clue) pointed to a tortoise and hare statue - a race.
wow they put to much time into these clues
Actually, i think we do. lol.

The actual thing the coordinate clue pointed to last year was the start/finish line of the Boston Marathon, & not the Tortoise & The Hare. Technically both related to the game (sort of), but the start/finish line was the focus of the clue.

Everybody's doin' the fish! Yeah, yeah, yeah! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EZWLup3yB7s&fmt=18)
(In case you are wondering, the song in the above video is Trendy by Reel Big Fish).


Good thing they are coming around at the end of January to CT... I'll have to ask them if they know something!!! :rolleyes: :p

[Michael Hill]

Don't you guys see it? it's totally easy *Goes into National Treasure mode*

What we have in the picture is a moonfish. The moonfish is on a stamp in Madeira.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/Flag_of_Madeira.svg

Now, they've just shown us the basic outline of the field. It's obviously a 4-team game with everyone starting at one end of the cross trying to score something in the middle or grab a game piece from the middle.

[johnr]

Someone said earlier that it might be to hard for teams to do a practice field like the moon. Do you remember last years center wall base plates? Teams where getting stuck on them. Now take 2' x 2' half inch plywood sheets and put them under your carpet in random locations. Watch the bots bounce along.

[JesseK]

Given that last year the clue was in fact a latitude and longitude coordinate it might also be worth considering the CAAB Taxon Code for Lampris guttatus is 37 268001 which could easily be construed as a latitude in North America. If a Clue # 2 comes along it might be a reference to a longitude. I doubt that the GDC would give us a lat/lon 2 years in a row but you never know.

Last year we got a lat/long/bearing as a clue. We knew it was a lat/long, and even had it down to the right place in Boston. Yet still, no one figured out that the hint meant the tortoise and hare statues in that reside in Copley Square at the given bearing when standing at the main statue in the Square. The obvious is so hard to see sometimes...

[Josh Goodman]

I think it will be quite obvious that FIRST will want to show off their new controls system this year. So how can what we've come up with so far tie into the cRIO? I have no idea. I'm assuming we will be using a camera system this year, but I think that the 28X16 (or whatever it is) carpeted field has worked for many years so well, that they will stick with it, at least for the inaugural year of the cRIO.

[JaneYoung]

This has been a beautiful hint. Just beautiful.

Has there ever been a hint given with built-in Gracious Professionalism as part of its traditions/history?

In Hawaii, the opah has historically been an incidental catch of longline gear. Only recently has this species become commercially important. The opah was viewed as a good luck fish by old-time longline fishermen, who would give it away as a gesture of goodwill rather than sell it.

The reference that was made to the Zen game equivalent of Rock, Paper, Scissors by DeepWater is another beauty, even if it doesn't amount to anything. It is a neat link to look at and think about.

Now the stamp in Madeira find that Michael just showed us. It's just all so cool.

Great hint, GDC and FIRST!

I think there were some great guesses at the hints in the past 3 years that I can remember. Some nailed the hints, some circled them and got 'this close'. That's what makes it fun when the game is revealed. But, the GP aspect of this one blows me out of the water. And, speaking of water - we are playing a water game, if you think about it - guessing the meaning of this fish.

[SuperJake]

Sounds like we will be somehow playing "rock, paper, scissors" with robots and trying to steal something from the opposing alliance. Still 3v3. One "master" robot holds/guards a special game piece while the other 2 "disciple robots" try to steal the game piece from the opposing alliance for major bonus points. Maybe like 2006 with offensive and defensive periods of 2v3 or something.

I LOVE IT. It gives the teams that like to make super defensive robots something to defend, the robots that make super pushing robots something to push on (the defenders) and the super delicate finesse robots something to reach for. The Elimination rounds for this type of game play would be FANTASTIC.

There could also be some poor pairings during the qualification rounds, but we see that now anyway.

~Jake

[Daboss314159]

this kind of fish does not travel in a group, but it is a loner, mabey there wont be teams this year

[Illegalsocks]

Now, they've just shown us the basic outline of the field. It's obviously a 4-team game with everyone starting at one end of the cross trying to score something in the middle or grab a game piece from the middle.

Also, refering to thw Wiki article about Madeira, I found this:
"Madeira Island is the largest island of the group with an area of 741 km², a length of 30 geographical miles (57 km), a breadth of 13 miles (22 km) at its widest point, and a coastline of 80 to 90 miles. Its longer axis lies east and west, along which lies a mountain chain with a mean altitude of 4,000 feet (1,220 m), considered the backbone of the island from which many deep ravines radiate outward to the coast. Its most famous sea cliff, the Cabo Girão, is the world's second highest. The highest point on the island is Pico Ruivo, at 1,862 meters (6,107 ft)."

I'm sticking with the sloping playing field theory.

[DMetalKong]

More wikipedia fun!

Concerning Dave's signatures...

The six:

Les Six is a name, inspired by The Five, given in 1923 by critic Henri Collet in an article titled ‘Les cinq Russes, les six Français et M. Satie’ (Comoedia, 16 January 1920) to a group of six composers working in Montparnasse whose music is often seen as a reaction against Wagnerism and Impressionism.


The five:

The Five, also known as The Mighty Handful (Russian: Могучая кучка, Moguchaya kuchka), refers to a circle of composers who met in Saint Petersburg, Russia, in the years 1856-1870.


The four:

The Glasgow School was a circle of influential modern artists and designers who began to coalesce in Glasgow, Scotland in the 1870s, and flourished from the 1890s to sometime around 1910. Groups part of this were The Four (also known as the Spook School), the Glasgow Girls and the Glasgow Boys.


Now, can anyone else relate 'the three' to arts and music?
And how does this fit in with fish?
I really have no idea...

[ezygmont708]

I just received the 1st FIRST Game Hint...
What do you think this means?

http://www.usfirst.org/community/frc/content.aspx?id=11310 (http://www.usfirst.org/community/frc/content.aspx?id=11310)

[AndyB]

Anagrams for Lampris Guttatus of the top of my head:

I Must Lag Startup
A Gut Ramp Tilts Us


Can't wait to see the gut ramp...

[billbo911]

Anagrams for Lampris Guttatus of the top of my head:

I Must Lag Startup
A Gut Ramp Tilts Us


Can't wait to see the gut ramp...

Maybe a tilting ramp, like a teeter totter, in the gut, the middle, of the field?



Now on a different note. This Moonfish looks like a round, flat disk to me. Wouldn't it be cool to play Frisbee with robots??!!

[IndySam]

Now on a different note. This Moonfish looks like a round, flat disk to me. Wouldn't it be cool to play Frisbee with robots??!!

How about a foam flying disks?
(http://www.target.com/Tuff-Coat-Foam-Flying-Disc-6-pk/dp/B000BR11PA)

[Mr_I]

Look deeper, kids. The letters are written backwards...

Which likely means it came from a book, and that's the text on the reverse page. (In other words, likely not a part of the clue.) :(

[Elgin Clock]

Maybe a tilting ramp, like a teeter totter, in the gut, the middle, of the field?

2001 Deja vu??
http://www.team537.com/history.php?year=2001

[billbo911]

2001 Deja vu??
http://www.team537.com/history.php?year=2001

Yep. That is what I was thinking.
Note. Look at my Rookie Year. I wasn't around then, but the challenge of that Teeter-Totter has always intrigued me ever since I read about it.

[billbo911]

How about a foam flying disks?
(http://www.target.com/Tuff-Coat-Foam-Flying-Disc-6-pk/dp/B000BR11PA)

Yep! That'll work!:cool:

[Zak698]

after a lil time in gimp, the test is backwards and there is another image of a shrak behind the fish, thus i believe that this is a scanned imaged from a book

[gabrielse]

What about a moon-shaped hovering disk as a game piece?

http://www.estesrockets.com/rockets.php?pid=008304

[nofar#1943]

what about somthing like fishing rod?
when we soppuse to catch somthing with hoocks

[Alan Anderson]

after a lil time in gimp, the test is backwards and there is another image of a shrak behind the fish, thus i believe that this is a scanned imaged from a book

You might have gotten that information faster if you had spent the time reading the thread instead of playing with the Gimp. :) I have the impression that what's on the other page is a channel catfish rather than a shark, but I don't think it's relevant.

(And I might have understood you faster if you typed more slowly and paid closer attention to spelling, but I'll attribute the test/text and shrak/shark to your being excited about the hint.)

[JaneYoung]

(And I might have understood you faster if you typed more slowly and paid closer attention to spelling, but I'll attribute the test/text and shrak/shark to your being excited about the hint.)

Ah heck, I was thinking the shrak was a distant cousin to the shrek. I can't imagine having to reel in a shrek um, shrak.

Nevermind.

[jerry w]

Anagrams for Lampris Guttatus of the top of my head:

I Must Lag Startup
A Gut Ramp Tilts Us


Can't wait to see the gut ramp...

no not "gut"
the word is "tug"

A Ramp Tilt Tugs Us

[Tonya Scott 476]

What if it is a simple as moon + fish.

Moonbuggy--collecting rocks/transporting things around (look at FLL robots transporting items for survival of people on mars)

Fish---fish have a lateral line which is a series of nervous sensors which pick up vibration in the water for protection or finding food. So robots "sense" things like lights, etc.

[Tonya Scott 476]

in regards to fish anatomy and morphology---they do have swim bladders. the playing pieces could be some type of "balloon"

[ChuckDickerson]

Last year we got a lat/long/bearing as a clue. We knew it was a lat/long, and even had it down to the right place in Boston. Yet still, no one figured out that the hint meant the tortoise and hare statues in that reside in Copley Square at the given bearing when standing at the main statue in the Square. The obvious is so hard to see sometimes...

Really? (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=662452&postcount=17) Are you sure? (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=662843&postcount=266)

[rickG977]

The fish is the Opah alson known as the Spotted Moonfish. Since water and electricity don't get along I suspect something dealing with the moon.:yikes:

[jakflyer]

the fish wasnt scanned out off a book. i found the same picture here: http://www.wildoceanseafoods.com/Hawaiian_Moonfish_Opah_s/66.htm&usg=__GgjgDF8Ovuytdsy6sQjuEb8f0t0=
its the same picture except it looks like first sharpened theirs and made it pixelly

[Andrew Schreiber]

the fish wasnt scanned out off a book. i found the same picture here: http://www.wildoceanseafoods.com/Hawaiian_Moonfish_Opah_s/66.htm&usg=__GgjgDF8Ovuytdsy6sQjuEb8f0t0=
its the same picture except it looks like first sharpened theirs and made it pixelly

I'm sorry to be a jerk but please read the thread instead of reposting information. I understand your excitement but this thread is growing quickly enough as is.

And I don't mean to pick on you, just grabbed one of the responses I saw that fit the criteria, this comment applies to everyone in every thread, Please read the thread before posting.

[synth3tk]

You can also search the thread, using the tools at the top.

During the initial rush, most of this info has been posted at least three times already.

[Tetraman]

1) Game hints usually revolve around a "game piece" or a "game objective".
2) Game hits usually are obscure, yet their representation to the game piece or objective is very much apparent once the entire game is revealed and more consideration can be input.
3) A Series of game hints never seem to reach a similar conclusion, but seperate parts of the whole FIRST game.
4) Game Hints are never solved until after the revealing of the game.
5) Game hints are what many will call "The Return to Chief Delphi", when many of the robotics fans return from their summer slumber, log back onto the site and prepare for the next season.


Thats all this hint is telling me at the moment.

[Wayne C.]

OKay- so I searched out Opah and found a Honolulu fish market

so what if the game has us running around the field picking up rubber fish and tossing them into a basket of some sort. Every so often you come across a Red Herring worth bonus points. If you can catch the biggest fish- the Opah. You get the super bonus. Since the Opah has little dots in a pattern you need to have the camera recognize the pattern...

Or else we all just get slimy?


Whats with all the fish each year and this GDC!!!!

of course the color pattern of this poorly known ocean fish may just appeal to the hint people?

[cmwilson13]

It could be a hint referring to some type of aquatic life off the cost of Australia, not necessarily the fish itself. Australia is the only place to have box jellyfish, and box jellyfish are the only jelly fish with the ability to see and move toward their food. Since we are getting cameras this year, the competition could have something to do with finding and locating something using the camera.

or

Opah is a Greek word meaning celebration or challenge. Greeks invented the Olympics which is both a celebration and challenges. Based on the fact that the first Lego league has a series of events (like a decathlon) that you can choose from, and because of time issues, I feel that the competition could be a heptathlon. That and this fish looks like a discus.

[Bertman]

If you play the hint backwards it says "paul is dead"

or not

[ZInventor]

isn't there some greek thing called opah... don't know how greek thing is spelled...

math teacher brought this to my attention...

thinks it means cheers, or salut, or something...


-Z

[Wylie99998]

well as the pic is scanned, presumibly out of a book, perhaps it has something to do with camera recognition? likely shapes -> disks

[rsegrest]

Don't know if anyone has any avid fishermen around but one of our mentors has mentioned that this is a form of "ribbon fish"...any thoughts?...

[AustinDpOwers89]

while many are dismissing the text and shark in the background, the moonfish being a loner and not traveling in schools could indicate a no team free for all, or the shark in the background could indicate some sort of predator prey situation, or it could indicate a 6v0 situation as fish are friends not food. ;)