Windows 7

[McGurky]

Well with the Windows 7 Beta hopefully coming with the new year, is anyone looking forward to it? What do you hope come with the new download?

[Maxpower57]

Well with the Windows 7 Beta hopefully coming with the new year, is anyone looking forward to it? What do you hope come with the new download?

not really. its a minor upgrade at best.
i'd rather stick with vista and not shell out the extra 200$ for a fancy new skin.

[Nate Smith]

I've had the chance to work a little with the PDC build of Windows 7 (build 6801), and even at that point, I have to say that it is quite a bit more than a minor upgrade. There have been overhauls to major parts of the code, both on the surface and under the hood. It's been a while, so I don't remember all the details, but I know that dual booting between Vista and Win7, I saw quite a few major differences. I was surprised that my old HP Laserjet 1100 did not have a driver out of the box, but it just appears that they tried to cut down on what was directly included, and made them available through download instead. I'm definitely going to try and get in on the beta once they start it, and will get a refresher at that point...

[JohnBoucher]

As one of many that elected to skip Vista, I will be trying it.

[Maxpower57]

As one of many that elected to skip Vista, I will be trying it.

I still don't understand what people's problems with vista are. it really got the short end of the stick. there's nothing broken about the operating system as people seem to think, and i have seen few people get any actual problems with it.
it sure did a whole lot better than leopard did, but no one called them out on that.

i don't get it. :confused:

[McGurky]

i haven't had a single problem with vista aside from not being able to use a wireless router that was made in the pre-vista days :(

[JohnBoucher]

I still don't understand what people's problems with vista are. it really got the short end of the stick. there's nothing broken about the operating system as people seem to think, and i have seen few people get any actual problems with it.
it sure did a whole lot better than leopard did, but no one called them out on that.

i don't get it. :confused:

IMHO When released it did not work with a lot of applications. I believe that Microsoft should of done more to address third party applications prior to release.

[Daniel_LaFleur]

IMHO When released it did not work with a lot of applications. I believe that Microsoft should of done more to address third party applications prior to release.

Not just applications, but also drivers for hardware needed to be rewritten and were not available at the time of Vistas launch.

[Nate Smith]

I still don't understand what people's problems with vista are. it really got the short end of the stick. there's nothing broken about the operating system as people seem to think, and i have seen few people get any actual problems with it.
it sure did a whole lot better than leopard did, but no one called them out on that.

i don't get it. :confused:

Prior to Service Pack 1, there were many problems with compatibility with different programs, as well as a lack of driver support for what would be considered lower-end hardware. With Vista, the default security model had changed greatly, and for too long, Windows application developers had gotten used to the old style of Windows security (read: none), and so with Vista, Windows was now preventing those applications from doing things that they had been able to do in the past.

As far as drivers are concerned, a lot of the problems were actually caused by manufacturers of "budget" hardware, such as your no-name webcams and winmodems, to name just a few. Without proper Vista drivers, this hardware would simply not work, and for the majority of computer users, they don't understand the whole driver model, and are stuck at "device X worked in XP, why doesn't it work in Vista?" Many didn't see this as the fault of the device manufacturer, but rather that of Microsoft...after all, everything "just worked" on their $399 "starter" Dell or eMachines computer before they added Vista on.

[Nate Smith]

Not just applications, but also drivers for hardware needed to be rewritten and were not available at the time of Vistas launch.
Or in some cases, still not available...
One example that I personally experienced -> http://www.lexmark.com/lexmark/product/home/272/0,6970,204816596_653399443_243436816_en,00.html?ta bId=7

[AustinSchuh]

Not just applications, but also drivers for hardware needed to be rewritten and were not available at the time of Vistas launch.

And the hardware drivers that were available, especially the graphics drivers, were quite buggy and would cause the OS to crash often.

[Daniel_LaFleur]

Or in some cases, still not available...
One example that I personally experienced -> http://www.lexmark.com/lexmark/product/home/272/0,6970,204816596_653399443_243436816_en,00.html?ta bId=7

I've been lucky, and all of my stuff was compatible, but I've heard the horror stories ...

All in all I've found Vista to be a decent, stable OS thats not (completely) deserving of its 'incompatibility' reputation.


Oh, and BTW Nate, I just noticed your signature ... look me up at BAE ;)

[samir13k]

I still don't understand what people's problems with vista are. it really got the short end of the stick. there's nothing broken about the operating system as people seem to think, and i have seen few people get any actual problems with it.
it sure did a whole lot better than leopard did, but no one called them out on that.

i don't get it. :confused:

I'm with you on this one... once you get vista fine tuned to where you like it (i.e. set up security and defaults) it is not as bad as the reviews have been saying it was. I personally refused to install XP on my Vista computer, but i see where it had its problems when it was a new release. At least it was a bigger hit than Windows ME...(I invested in that one too...didnt do anything spectacular though!)

Mainly i think people were not ready for such a dramatic change as Vista was.

[JohnBoucher]

I'm with you on this one... once you get vista fine tuned to where you like it (i.e. set up security and defaults) it is not as bad as the reviews have been saying it was. I personally refused to install XP on my Vista computer, but i see where it had its problems when it was a new release. At least it was a bigger hit than Windows ME...(I invested in that one too...didnt do anything spectacular though!)

Mainly i think people were not ready for such a dramatic change as Vista was.
So skipping every other Microsoft OS release is the way to go
98 OK , ME Bad , XP OK, Vista Bad :eek:

[Nate Smith]

Oh, and BTW Nate, I just noticed your signature ... look me up at BAE ;)
I'll be the one checking all the volunteers in...trainer for the system and running it at BAE...

[cdennisxlx2]

So skipping every other Microsoft OS release is the way to go
98 OK , ME Bad , XP OK, Vista Bad :eek:

well personally i was ecstatic when i switched from dos to 3.1 then to 95

so really it was

3.1: good [for the time]
95: good
98: good
me: extremely bad
NT: ok
2k: good
xp: good
vista: annoyingly bad [at least to me]
7: sounds great [especially since its going to be more enterprise geared]

just my 2 cents

[matt91]

I got vista for my home computer (the family computer), used it for a day, and never used it again. I RAN (really fast) to the Apple Store. Maybe Microsoft will redeem itself... or at least I hope so.

With the NXE for Xbox, the Zune 3.0 (i think), they seem to be on track for another fantastic release.

[cdennisxlx2]

Zune 3.1 was worse, i was part of the huge group of people who's first gen 30g zune froze today :(

for those of you who are oblivious to this, read this
http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/12/31/zune.player.failures/index.html

[matt91]

I was never a big fan of the Zune, one of my friends has one and lives by it. I am more of an iPod type person...

In that report it mentioned a possible Y2K like meltdown- If that does end up happing then were all screwed... But hey MS could just fix that "small bug" with a SP update hahaha

[cdennisxlx2]

lol, well i used to be an ipod person but ended up having 3 break on me [between 1 and 5 months if getting a new one] so i got the zune when it came out and it only stopped working now because of the software update. life time just seems a lot longer i got over 2 years out of it before any problems.

[MrForbes]

I'm still on Windows 5....and I have some music players that don't know (or care) what day it is....

So, I guess news of Windows 7 is kinda irrelevant.

[CraigHickman]

Windows 7 has potential, assuming M$ doesn't FUBAR this one like they did Vista. It's not the stability of Vista that got me, it was the ugly bloated theme that sucked down a HUGE portion of your power.

So assuming Windows 7 is decent, there's only ONE of my machine's that I'd run it on, that being my CAD machine. For portability I need 100% uptime, and I have had NO windows machine give me that. For my server, I'm still sticking to Linux.

Here's hoping M$ doesn't biff this one too.

[matt91]

lol, well i used to be an ipod person but ended up having 3 break on me [between 1 and 5 months if getting a new one] so i got the zune when it came out and it only stopped working now because of the software update. life time just seems a lot longer i got over 2 years out of it before any problems.


I guess im lucky then because my iPod Touch has lasted me almost a year with no problems, and my nano before that lasted about 2 years... maybe you just have bad Apple luck....

Back on topic here: I think that MS should try to get on the Unix train, i mean everything runs Unix except them. They should also try some Linux-Like graphic system, that seems not to take up much power..

[McGurky]

correct me if you think i am wrong here, but...

The problem with Microsoft, is that they make software, and nothing else.(with the exception of input devices and other devices) So when they make software, and it doesn't work with a lot of hardware, it is "there" fault.

where as apple Makes there Hardware and software, so they have most of the compatibility bugs worked out before the public uses it.

[CraigHickman]

correct me if you think i am wrong here, but...

The problem with Microsoft, is that they make software, and nothing else.(with the exception of input devices and other devices) So when they make software, and it doesn't work with a lot of hardware, it is "there" fault.

where as apple Makes there Hardware and software, so they have most of the compatibility bugs worked out before the public uses it.

You're dead on. Another issue is the size of M$. Once you hit that many employees, your company becomes bloated. Too many chefs in the kitchen will spoil the soup, ya'dig?

[McGurky]

Well it can work with good management,(Google can seem to do it)

Really i think after 34 years Microsoft needs an overhaul, or a new managing team, because right now, they are on a downward spiral.(in my mind)

[R.C.]

Well it can work with good management,(Google can seem to do it)

Really i think after 34 years Microsoft needs an overhaul, or a new managing team, because right now, they are on a downward spiral.(in my mind)

Kinda, some of their stuff (huge xbox fan and it didn't work properly till after 3 years?) is good. But if you think about they are such large company and how many different types of computers are there. Each one needs their own drivers and not everyone is patient. I am not backing up microsoft for their terrible new platform but I think they know how bad their operating system is. Plus the thing with macs is that they don't have all these companies manufacturing different computers. Mac has their own line of unix comps. I returned my xbox 10 times, but still love it because of all the dang support for it aka games (HALO 3 and GEARS OF WAR 2). I can't use CAD or my other special programs on mac or linux without running some kind of emulator. So i guess we have to put up with microsoft and the alpha released seemed decent for windows 7.

-RC

[RyanCahoon]

What do you hope come with the new download?

Personally, I'm more interested in what's *not* coming with it. I like the idea of the slimmed down application bundle, etc. I've always felt that the Windows product line should focus more on the core system. Especially with the level of internet connectivity that is the norm in recent years, it'd be extremely easy to make such add-ons install-on-demand. Such a system has been working for Linux for years and years. Apt-get is by far my favorite reason for using Linux.

[Nate Smith]

correct me if you think i am wrong here, but...

The problem with Microsoft, is that they make software, and nothing else.(with the exception of input devices and other devices) So when they make software, and it doesn't work with a lot of hardware, it is "there" fault.

where as apple Makes there Hardware and software, so they have most of the compatibility bugs worked out before the public uses it.

Let me throw this out there...currently on Newegg, they have a total of 496 AMD & Intel motherboards available(not counting anything only listed under combo or server motherboards.) With this large of a potential install base for Windows, can we reasonably expect Microsoft to be able to test on every potential hardware configuration to ensure compatability, or can we say that they are doing their part by releasing documentation that tells the various hardware manufacturers "this is how you make your hardware work with Windows"? If the hardware companies are given this info, and then choose not to do anything with it, where should the blame really fall?

As far as Apple is concerned, I think the argument can be made that they are more in the CE (consumer electronics) business than the computer business. Apple's focus is on a system where everything "just works," and they are able to accomplish this by having a very small "supported" hardware base, and simply not letting their software not work on anything else, just as, for example, you could not take your iPod OS and install it on your Zune(I realize the hardware isn't as similar in that example, but I think it makes the point). Not that there is necessarily anything wrong with this approach, I just believe that because of it, MS and Apple can be considered to be targeting different markets.

[jcatt]

I recently acquired a copy of Windows 7 Build 7000, and i must say i am extremely impressed. I installed it on my HP TX2000 tablet, which originally came pre-installed with Vista.

[Off Topic]
From the moment i first booted the laptop from the factory it ran slowly. Even after i uninstalled all the "junk-wear" that came pre-installed it still ran relatively slowly, and would often lock-up for minuets or just freeze completely. I had many BSOD's all with different causes, which made troubleshooting impossible. The boot up was slow, sometimes it would be 10 minutes before i could use it. I tried to improve performance by turning off most of the visual features and tweaked it as much as i could, but to little improvement.


So out of frustration I emailed HP and requested the XP drivers for the laptop, I explained that vista was not performing how i wanted it to and that I had purchased a copy of XP Tablet 2005 and wished to install it instead. And within 1/2 a day I received a reply with a link to the ftp site for the laptop which contained all the xp drivers. So i proceed to partition my hard drive to maintain the vista OS and installed XP on the new partition. After i had installed all the drivers and such it ran very well. Xp booted in seconds not minutes and i rarely had lookups. However as i used it more i kept having issues with the drivers from HP. Even though they were correct and up-to-date, i kept getting reoccurring BSOD's all driver related. But i took it with the territory and put up with them.
[/Off Topic]

So when i got the chance to install the alpha release of Windows 7, i installed it over my old vista partition. What amazed me the most during the install was how fast it was. From the start of the installer to to its finish took around 10 minuets, not accounting for time spent traversing through the dialog boxes. Further still was that during the installation the installer popped up asking which wireless network to connect to, so that it could retrieve the latest updates from Microsoft, without asking me for the wi-fi driver before hand. Something i had only seen in Linux installations. After the installation completed i only needed to install the video driver, the tablet driver, and the finger print reader software, to get full functionality, better still was that all the drivers were just the vista drivers already available from HP's site.

After i had everything set up my overall impression is that Windows 7 huge step up from vista and light years ahead of XP. Its amazing, i retained all of the vista features and visuals yet maintain better performance than XP. While the boot is still a little slower than XP, once its booted everything runs so well. Programs start much faster, with more reliability. Not to mention that i have been running it straight for 4 days now without a single hang-up, freeze, or error message, even after i installed Inventor 09 and Adobe CS4, ect. I really looking forward to the release of Windows 7, and without a doubt this will be the best Windows yet.

[JohnBoucher]

[Off Topic]
From the moment i first booted the laptop from the factory it ran slowly. Even after i uninstalled all the "junk-wear" that came pre-installed it still ran relatively slowly, and would often lock-up for minuets or just freeze completely. I had many BSOD's all with different causes, which made troubleshooting impossible. The boot up was slow, sometimes it would be 10 minutes before i could use it. I tried to improve performance by turning off most of the visual features and tweaked it as much as i could, but to little improvement.

The people that I know that have Vista running well have all reformatted and reinstalled Vista. Then Vista runs well.

[merybar]

Is windows 7 coming out for "public release" anytime soon?

[jcatt]

The people that I know that have Vista running well have all reformatted and reinstalled Vista. Then Vista runs well.

That could be the case but i didn't have a standalone copy of vista to install, only the recovery partition built into the laptop. But i did have XP Tablet so i defaulted to that. Given the option again, even with the quirky drivers, i would still go back to XP.

[chris31]

Is windows 7 coming out for "public release" anytime soon?

I think I read unofficially that it was later in 2009 but I cant seem to find the article to back that up.

[Mark Rozitis]

I still don't understand what people's problems with vista are. it really got the short end of the stick. there's nothing broken about the operating system as people seem to think, and i have seen few people get any actual problems with it.
it sure did a whole lot better than leopard did, but no one called them out on that.

i don't get it. :confused:

I think the biggest problem was hardware and resources and the masses were trying to run this vista on machines that could barely run XP and it didn't do so well, myself included, when I got my new Asus F3 series laptop all my Vista issues went away.

The other negative was the licence, for some who like to build an rebuild systems and change parts and re-install it was a problem.

So far I have heard nothing but good things about windows 7, I want to get a copy of it when it comes out in Beta, anyone know how to get on the list?

There is somone in my weather newsgroup on yahogroups, (wxscan), jason L who has the alpha release but he won't share nor tell how to get it but apparently it comes out in beta in January. I want one!

m

[Mark Rozitis]

Let me throw this out there...currently on Newegg, they have a total of 496 AMD & Intel motherboards available(not counting anything only listed under combo or server motherboards.) With this large of a potential install base for Windows, can we reasonably expect Microsoft to be able to test on every potential hardware configuration to ensure compatability, or can we say that they are doing their part by releasing documentation that tells the various hardware manufacturers "this is how you make your hardware work with Windows"? If the hardware companies are given this info, and then choose not to do anything with it, where should the blame really fall?

As far as Apple is concerned, I think the argument can be made that they are more in the CE (consumer electronics) business than the computer business. Apple's focus is on a system where everything "just works," and they are able to accomplish this by having a very small "supported" hardware base, and simply not letting their software not work on anything else, just as, for example, you could not take your iPod OS and install it on your Zune(I realize the hardware isn't as similar in that example, but I think it makes the point). Not that there is necessarily anything wrong with this approach, I just believe that because of it, MS and Apple can be considered to be targeting different markets.

You hit the nail on the head in that post, problem is alot of "consumers" don't understand why their computer won't work and can't think beyond pressing the on button, they just complain that MS put out a bad product. VISTA runs fine if you have the resources yet people with entry level machines are screaming that vista is no good.

I'm also thinking that MS should perhaps have different versions of their next OS and those being consumer, business, technical, the technical version would allow us to tweak and do what we want and the consumer version quite simpler to protect end users from themselves and be more for the people, the Mac type users who just want their system to work with as little tweaking and customizing as possible.

m

[Andrew Schreiber]

Let me throw this out there...currently on Newegg, they have a total of 496 AMD & Intel motherboards available(not counting anything only listed under combo or server motherboards.) With this large of a potential install base for Windows, can we reasonably expect Microsoft to be able to test on every potential hardware configuration to ensure compatability, or can we say that they are doing their part by releasing documentation that tells the various hardware manufacturers "this is how you make your hardware work with Windows"? If the hardware companies are given this info, and then choose not to do anything with it, where should the blame really fall?

As far as Apple is concerned, I think the argument can be made that they are more in the CE (consumer electronics) business than the computer business. Apple's focus is on a system where everything "just works," and they are able to accomplish this by having a very small "supported" hardware base, and simply not letting their software not work on anything else, just as, for example, you could not take your iPod OS and install it on your Zune(I realize the hardware isn't as similar in that example, but I think it makes the point). Not that there is necessarily anything wrong with this approach, I just believe that because of it, MS and Apple can be considered to be targeting different markets.

You have nailed why Apple is recognized as having a more reliable operating system. If OS X were required to run on even HALF of the hardware that Windows supports I think we would find that Windows is actually a better made operating system.

Vista is a nice operating system provided you have the drivers and the hardware to run it.

In my opinion, Windows 7 needs to be stable, needs to trim down on the hardware (hard drive space especially), and it needs to get rid of UAC. Meet those requirements and I think we might have a winner. I would personally like to see their new file system that was promised for Vista.

Just to keep things open, I am a Mac user who only uses XP for Cad.

And I have to agree with Craig, for rock solid uptime very few things can beat linux. My Ubuntu box has an uptime of nearly 60 days and that was only because of a power outage.

[Nate Smith]

In my opinion, Windows 7 needs to be stable, needs to trim down on the hardware (hard drive space especially), and it needs to get rid of UAC. Meet those requirements and I think we might have a winner. I would personally like to see their new file system that was promised for Vista.

Stability: Check - During my short time with the 6801 build, the only real problems I had were with applications flat out not liking the new OS - didn't really expect anything different there, since it was still in Alpha at the time.
Hardware: Don't remember for sure, but supposedly things have been trimmed at least so that Aero can run on machines that it was previously not able to. Also, the default "clean install" sets up a separate "System" partition, which (theoretically) makes sure you can at least still boot to a console if your Windows partition gets FUBAR'd.
UAC: I actually agree with what they are trying to do with UAC, and they made the settings much more flexible with Win7. Rather than the simple UAC On/Off option that you had with Vista, there's actually about 5 different levels of UAC that you can choose from - basically from Off to "Protect me from Myself" and everything in between.
New File System(WinFS): It's my understanding that WinFS has been all but abandoned by MS, but some of the work on it is being rolled into future versions of SQL Server(since WinFS was SQL based anyway)...so, it's my guess that you'll never see it as an actual part of the OS, but it may make an appearance as an add-on for those who might need it. I actually played around with the Beta they released a while back, and honestly was not that impressed...the idea is nice, but could be implemented just as easily by allowing tags on files to categorize them. You see a little bit of this in Vista, where your default "Documents", "Pictures", "Music", etc folders in the user directories are not folders at all, but rather what I would call "meta-folders" (I think Win7 calls them "collections"), where you can specify multiple locations, that get combined into one for easier access. The physical folders still exist, of course, but you don't see them unless you go looking when you go to open or save a file. I used this to my advantage while I was using Win7, linking my music(stored on an external HDD) to show up in the "Music" metafolder, without having to use up the extra HDD space on my internal drive.

[Andrew Schreiber]

Thanks Nate, maybe instead of WinFS they will focus on reading/writing to other file systems. I am also glad that they added levels of UAC, protecting people from themselves is nice in a world where grandma doesn't know that sudo rm -R / is a bad idea.

[Bsteckler]

How did those who have beta copies get them? I have an MS account (and in fact, a beta of Server 2008). But I cannot find a download page.

[MrForbes]

from Microsoft, in big red letters: "If you are inquiring about being a beta tester for Windows 7, be advised that they are not accepting new participants at this time. Please do not submit a Feedback item to request participation in any programs.

Please visit the Connection Directory for all programs that are available to participate in."

http://beta.microsoft.com/Connect

[DtD]

As long as I can get it with my MSDN Subscription, I'll definitly be trying it. However, I'm not too thrilled about the "Super Bar", it look like Microsoft's version of Apple's Dock, and I never liked it at all.

@Bsteckler
Microsoft was giving them out to some special people, or people that attened thier presentations and stuff. I think we'll be getting it once they announce it at CES in about a week, since that is when the official beta is supposed to begin.

~DtD

[Heretic121]

being a gamer i dispised vista with a passion when it first came out with all of its problems espically in the driver department... since SP1 they have fixed a lot and it has gotten progressivly better...

with windows 7 it is using the same kernel base as vista which means it should be a seemless transfer for developers creating software + drivers...

i still use XP to this day... its not broken so why change over??? if windows 7 isn't broken to the gaming community i will switch over...

[CraigHickman]

@Bsteckler: It is VERY possible to "beta test" Windows 7 without being on the official registry. Due to forum rules, I urge people to not discuss the method here. If there is true interest in learning this, PM me and I'll tell you a great method to get sued.

With early software, it's best to not play games with piracy.

That being said, I've got a friend on the beta list and I get to try Windows 7 next week! Woohoo!

[killerofkiller]

Windows 7 has potential, assuming M$ doesn't FUBAR this one like they did Vista. It's not the stability of Vista that got me, it was the ugly bloated theme that sucked down a HUGE portion of your power.



You do know that you can turn Aero off, and run the 'classic' theme just like xp.. invest in some ram, i'm running a 2.5 year old thinkpad with an old ati x1300 video card and it runs great with 2 gigs of ram...

[Andrew Schreiber]

You do know that you can turn Aero off, and run the 'classic' theme just like xp.. invest in some ram, i'm running a 2.5 year old thinkpad with an old ati x1300 video card and it runs great with 2 gigs of ram...

Agreed, our team laptop runs Vista but BARELY met the requirements so we just turned all the fluff off, went all the way back to windows 98 look and feel.

[killerofkiller]

also, i was using Win7 build 6956(the one that leaked from the Chinese Conference) for about a month. And i just installed the 7000 build (beta1)
Runs like a dream, all the drivers installed perfectly. CS4, matlab, office and a few others all installed just fine. (If interested in how to get it, just use the googles ;) )

[Mark Rozitis]

also, i was using Win7 build 6956(the one that leaked from the Chinese Conference) for about a month. And i just installed the 7000 build (beta1)
Runs like a dream, all the drivers installed perfectly. CS4, matlab, office and a few others all installed just fine. (If interested in how to get it, just use the googles ;) )

I am going to wait until I can get the beta legally from the MS site but it's amazing the good reviews of this OS so far and just how badly people want it, thats a good sign that MS might have come up with a winner after all the bad press they got on vista. I can't wait to get mine :)

[daltore]

Thanks Nate, maybe instead of WinFS they will focus on reading/writing to other file systems. I am also glad that they added levels of UAC, protecting people from themselves is nice in a world where grandma doesn't know that sudo rm -R / is a bad idea.

Grandma would have to hit "y" about 10,000 times for that to really work. I think she'd figure out something was up by then. You need an "f" flag for it to delete everything without asking. And that's for Posix systems anyway. :p

I'm an avid Linux user because Windows has always proved to crash for me. I know it's because my line of home computers running Windows have always "met" the hardware requirements, and not exceeded them substantially, but it kind of says something when you need a $400 computer in order to boot up. All the Windows machines I use are usually slow, also, because of all of the non-Microsoft hardware installed on them that's always running in the background and taking up resources. Personally, I just don't like the fact that it runs generally slowly unless you have a gaming-scale computer.

That being said, when Vista had just come out, I was working with a guy to set up one of the laptops his company had just bought (that day, right out of the package) that had been pre-configured for a wireless internet cafe. We're both computer nerds. It took 5 minutes for the computer to boot up, and another 20 for the two of us to figure out where Vista had hidden the WiFi card control to turn it on (the button on the computer didn't do it). I would just like the next version to organize things a little better (either pre-Vista style or just logically placed under the labels that happen to pertain to their contents). Then when we turned it off, it idled for 10 minutes (no hard drive activity, any "active" processes contained somewhere within RAM and the CPU) before the power actually shut off. So, better resource management might also help.

One of my friends has a fairly adequate laptop for running Vista, and it ran acceptably, but the only problem is it went through about a 4 amp-hour battery in about 45 minutes because everything was always running. He switched to Ubuntu and the battery started lasting him about 3 hours at a time. Power management could be better handled. Even if it's for a desktop, there's no reason to waste that much power.

Another thing that's peeved me in general about all the Windows OS's is that when you're logging in, you have to wait a bit before you can do anything. Now, this is a no brainer and to be expected on any operating system, but the system should not spend all of its resources loading MSN messenger when you've just clicked on Firefox. Some kind of real-time engine would be a very nice addition to the kernel. And if this would require new drivers for everything, that might be an issue they should work on too, standardization of the kernel protocols. You can use an Ubuntu realtime kernel in a Fedora Zen installation with no problems if you add the right files in. You don't have to reinstall anything. And then it'll update correctly the next time there's a new version. So it is possible, and it would make their fan base a lot wider because of the improved and consistent support.

One thing that amazed me when I got to Linux was the lack of a need for defragmenting the drive. The main Linux partition is setup to always rearrange the files when you're planting them so that the drive is not fragmented, therefore removing the need to do it manually and decreasing required access time. WinFS may not be such a bad idea, as it would remove this problem. Not to mention that their current default, NTFS, has enough complexities to it that there are MULTIPLE open-source tools installed by default on Ubuntu devoted ONLY to diagnosing and fixing NTFS drives. Maybe they could adopt the operating system that was being developed several years ago that would never need to expand its filetable because it would take the energy required to vaporize the earth's oceans to write a one to every bit the filesystem could hold. I believe it was called znfs, or something similar, but it might be could to move to a standardized multi-platform FS.

And if I understand correctly what you're talking about with the UAC levels, it sounds like they're finally doing something about the fact that there are very few manual controls for Windows, and most major problems are fixed by backing up and reinstalling. That's one of the reasons I use Linux, if there's a problem, it gives you a precise error about the issue, usually how to fix it, or a resource to find out how, and then you run a command and it's over with. The Windows commands are generally somewhere along the lines of, "There was an error. It was either because 'foo.dll' is not a Windows file or has been corrupted." They could put a little more trust in their users, or at least the computer repair people who need specific errors to fix the problem.

If what people on this thread are saying about Win7 is true, then MS has taken a huge jump forward from their several backward steps 2 years ago, and I applaud them. I will probably stick with Linux because it better supports the things I do and is quick on old hardware (typing this on a 2003 laptop with a 1.2 GHz processor and 256 MB RAM with 3 other windows and 6 tabs open), but it would be really nice for me to not have someone e-mailing me every couple of days going, "My computer broke, can you help me?"

[Jeff K.]

People bag on Vista because of a technical term called...the bandwagon effect. They hear it sucks from others or from reviews and then they blindly concur that it sucks, and in doing so, join the band wagon. I've been using Vista for almost a year now on my Vaio laptop, never had a problem with drivers or software. I will admit Vista does require a lot of processing power for all the fancy gadgets and effects, and so lower end computers that people get for cheap will probably leave them waiting on it. Changing the settings to just what you need and upgrading the ram are good ways to speed it up. On a 2.4ghz Intel dualcore with 4 gb of ram, startup time < 20 seconds and I can run all CAD programs I need to and other programs without a hitch. Connected to all my old devices that were pre Vista and even pre XP old. I do plan on getting a Mac laptop though just for the aesthetic qualities, I must admit they are quite sexy. But I do plan to continue running MS desktops because I can build them and I don't need to spend an arm and leg to upgrade the ram.

[Tom Line]

I'm with you on this one... once you get vista fine tuned to where you like it (i.e. set up security and defaults) it is not as bad as the reviews have been saying it was. I personally refused to install XP on my Vista computer, but i see where it had its problems when it was a new release. At least it was a bigger hit than Windows ME...(I invested in that one too...didnt do anything spectacular though!)

Mainly i think people were not ready for such a dramatic change as Vista was.

From my experience, the people who thought vista were ok were the ones who bought a whole new computer from a vendor.

The people who disliked vista were the enthusiasts and system builders that like choosing their own components, and the ones who upgraded their operating system without changing components.

Group one generally didn't have many problems since vendors like dell tested everything and made sure all the drivers worked. Group two had an absolute nightmare because so many components simply didn't work. That's what people liked about xp - it simply worked with nearly everything.

Most folks don't remember though that XP didn't work that way when it started out!

[Mark Rozitis]

I have another question and I have nearly crashed google a few times researching this one out but still don't have a 100% answer yet.

My current laptop is an Asus F3 series, Vista ultimate, 4G ram, Core@duo 2.20Ghz, runs vista fine, I work in news and severe weather so I don't run too many programs, we have radio scanner programming software like Arc996 by butel.nl, some other small programs like Grlevel3 Grlevelx.com and CrossFTP basic which is very important as that how I get video out to one of the TV stations, also run virtualdub for capture and probably sony vegas soon so nothing too major...yet.

I am holding off though on upgrading to 64 bit Vista because even though 32 bit older programs will work the drivers must be digitally signed and there appears to be no easy work around, guess the only way is to upgrade and find out but I don't have as much free time to play as I would like :(

I am also toying with the idea since I don't have a permanent desktop about retiring this latop to the desk as that way I would also have a permanent always on ftp machine here and getting the Asus G50Vt-A2 as my new mobile laptop, I am trying not to keep looking at the Canadacomputers.com website but it's on for a really good price right now.

This 32 bit vs 64 bit digitally signed driver issue has me still very unsure of what to do.

mark

[Nate Smith]

Not one to normally bump a thread like this, but aparrently Microsoft is releasing a free public Beta 1 of Windows 7 on Friday. Check out this site for more info...
http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=9125278

[spacegy4]

I used a nifty trick to force direct x10 on XP... and anyways if win7 has better 64 bit support (which vista was already quite impressive) I will definitely pay it a look.

[EncodersRUS]

Vista runs smoother if you make the windows perfectly clear and disable recent items. Also if you run a defrag every other day and don't use more than 11.6% of memory it works like a dream ;). :p SO HA! (psssss.... my vista is no longer vista. I personally upgraded my drivers and my source code and MS no longer recognizes most of my Vista.):D :confused: :eek:

[Mark Rozitis]

I am currently downloading windows7 64 bit from this link and it's working

http://download.microsoft.com/download/6/3/3/633118BD-6C3D-45A4-B985-F0FDFFE1B021/EN/7000.0.081212-1400_client_en-us_Ultimate-GB1CULXFRE_EN_DVD.ISO

The win 7 32 bit is a no go right now, too many people tried to download it an MS's servers exploded :)

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/evalcenter/dd353205.aspx

I placed a spare smoke alarm over my laptop and modem before I go to sleep tonight, downloading win7 64 x2 and uploading 5g's of news video at the same time, poor modem :)

m

[synth3tk]

I placed a spare smoke alarm over my laptop and modem before I go to sleep tonight, downloading win7 64 x2 and uploading 5g's of news video at the same time, poor modem :)

m
lol, I feel it, although I've never had to upload 5-gigs of anything! :yikes: My WRT54GL with DD-WRT has been serving me pretty darn well. It can take just about anything I can throw at it.

I'm downloading the win7 x64 right now, also. Capped at 2MB/s, averaging 800kb/s, with about 28% left to go. I still need a key, but at least we get 30-days to try it out. MS should've been prepared for this, but nooooo....

[Hanna2325]

...Its windows...and I'm a loyal follower of Macs, so nope:ahh:

[synth3tk]

Well, I'm a Linux-junkie, and not much of a Windoze fan myself, but this is what Vista was supposed to be like, so I'm interested. Especially since the requirements have been lowered, less annoying pop-up notifications, etc.

[Mark Rozitis]

lol, I feel it, although I've never had to upload 5-gigs of anything! :yikes: My WRT54GL with DD-WRT has been serving me pretty darn well. It can take just about anything I can throw at it.

I'm downloading the win7 x64 right now, also. Capped at 2MB/s, averaging 800kb/s, with about 28% left to go. I still need a key, but at least we get 30-days to try it out. MS should've been prepared for this, but nooooo....

Any idea where we get the keys? I downloaded and installed win7 64 as a second OS this morning, install was super fast, 45 min and done but it won't connect to the internet with my cable modem no matter what I try so I still have to figure that out and it asks for a key and I m not sure were we are supposed to get the keys but then again I haven't had much time to read and I have to go back out on the road now.

Still want to get the 32 bit version as well and try it.

mark

[Nate Smith]

Any idea where we get the keys? I downloaded and installed win7 64 as a second OS this morning, install was super fast, 45 min and done but it won't connect to the internet with my cable modem no matter what I try so I still have to figure that out and it asks for a key and I m not sure were we are supposed to get the keys but then again I haven't had much time to read and I have to go back out on the road now.

Still want to get the 32 bit version as well and try it.

mark

it's my understanding that MS temporarily stopped handing out product keys due to the overload on the 32 bit version on their servers. Once they bring that back online, you should be able to sign up for a key...

[techsupport07]

I too, have not had many if any problems with Vista. I am majoring in Network Administration, so I work with Vista on many levels including networking them. No real problems here...I sometimes find it easier to find something because of the nice litte "start search" on the start menu. I am waiting for Windows 7, but I hear it is not going to be much different than Vista. I have seen some screen shots and had some details thrown at me. Sounds like its is just basically a version of Vista with ALL of the bugs worked out.

[synth3tk]

You don't have to download the Beta if you have already, but go through the process here to grab your key(s):
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windows-7/beta-download.aspx

[T3H_K3YM45T3R]

a guy that used to be on my team downloaded the beta via torrent and he likes it, he said it had some cool stuff and he was going to use it instead of vista. he gave me a copy of the ISO but I haven't had a chance to get it working yet because vista won't allow me to adjust my partitions enough to get it installed

[mrbob1000]

a guy that used to be on my team downloaded the beta via torrent and he likes it, he said it had some cool stuff and he was going to use it instead of vista. he gave me a copy of the ISO but I haven't had a chance to get it working yet because vista won't allow me to adjust my partitions enough to get it installed

I didnt touch my partitions at all, i just made a virtual machine in virtualbox (its free) it runs pretty well but would probably be faster if it was installed on my computer as opposed to a virtual machine.

[Michael_MARS]

a guy that used to be on my team downloaded the beta via torrent and he likes it, he said it had some cool stuff and he was going to use it instead of vista. he gave me a copy of the ISO but I haven't had a chance to get it working yet because vista won't allow me to adjust my partitions enough to get it installed

Were you using the partition manager in a window or in cmd? Because some times i can get things done in cmd that the normal wizards or programs don't let me do.... just a suggestion.

[kirtar]

Ok, so I just installed the beta and right now most of it works. By most I mean that the Internet fails. It seems that with my MSI Neos Platinum, the networking goes through an Nvidia nForce 3 that it doesn't work. Anybody know how to fix this? As far as I know, Nvidia has dropped support for nForce 3 even for Vista, so I can't find drivers or whatever to let me connect to the internet.

[MrForbes]

It looks like I'll be trying out beta 7 after all...my son wants to play with it, so we're downloading it to insall on one of the spare P4s. We need to juggle memory to come up with 1GB for it, though.

27%....should be done downloading by morning....

[McGurky]

they where originaly going to cap the downloads at about 2.5 million, but they changed it and made it unlimited downloads for 2 full weeks!! woot this means i don't have to rush to get it downloaded

[rdlevy1215]

I am running Windows 7 Ultimate Beta and can say for sure that i will not be going back to Vista or XP. This will be here as my regular day-to-day OS since everything works with it and it runs like XP on the machine that i'm using it with (Pentium D 3.4Ghz, 2GB RAM, NVIDIA 7350LE). This machine came with XP (With Vista Express Upgrade) and then i put vista on it and now Seven ... I will be staying here as MSFT did an awesome job on it!

**Note: If you have installed the beta I highly recommending changing the taskbar to the setting that says "Combine When Taskbar is Full". That is when you right-click and go to properties ... it is the option for "Taskbar Buttons"**

[synth3tk]

Just setup today. Lemme say one thing here: I LOVE THE INSTALLATION!!!
It has a clean, easy-to-read progress bar, not as many pop-ups requesting info, and (my favorite part), you can START THE INSTALL from your current Microsoft OS. I realized that I didn't need a DVD to install it. You can choose a new partition, or upgrade. But you can only upgrade if you have Vista SP1+.

So now I'm triple-booting Win7-64, XP64, and Ubuntu64. I really, truly, honestly don't know where to start. Just if you read this, every positive thing that someone has said about this OS, is true. Even their claim of less UAC-related notifications.

Runs well on my laptop with an AMD64 1.6GHz dual core, 2gigs of RAM, and integrated mobile video card. In fact, if it wasn't for my crappy video, I'd have a 4.5 on the Windows Experience Index (currently it's 1.0).

I'm not gonna lie, I wasn't a big fan of MS, if at all, before tonight. Now, well, let's just say they have my vote. I've already vowed to legally purchase this OS, and have only pestered all of my friends about it.

And it's still in Beta....

[Joshamuffin]

I've skimmed through all 5 pages. I'm very suprised. Nobody mentioned http://windows7news.com/

[MrForbes]

A college student gets his first look at the new Windows. Hopefully I'll get a chance soon.


edit: it only took me about 15 minutes to crash it....I was doing a complicated task, trying to see what was on the C drive, using Windows Explorer. Used to be we could just type in "dir c:"

[Uberbots]

So i downloaded it, struggled to get one of the first 2.5 million keys (before they stopped download capping), and installed it. I got it up and running and installed over Vista in about a half an hour on my computer. I must say, i really, really like the installation process.

Now into the actual experience. The bootup screen was kinda weird... the little glowy balls forming a windows logo was kind of awkward. Performance wise, it is much faster than Vista. heck, it may even be faster than XP, ive yet to run any formal tests. The ability to dock unopen programs in the taskbar is extremely useful, and so is the live preview function (hovering over the mini preview and watching the other windows fade is pretty cool). I dont see much use for the desktop preview function, but whatever. Window "slamming" is also a really nice feature... i hated it when i used to close a window after exerting a reasonable effort to maximize it.

As for compatibility, the 64 bit beta version of windows 7 is FAR more compatible with my computer/hardware than Vista ever was. In vista my wireless network card experienced intermittent dropped data and lagging, but in 7 there is nothing of the sort.


windows 7 is windows vista with all the bugs worked out. like they said, they finally listened to the users. I think they are marketing it as windows 7 to avoid the stigma that Vista had placed on it. with that said, i am never going back to XP or (god forbid) Vista


edit
Oh! i forgot to mention the libraries feature! i run a configuration with XP on one hard disk and se7en (upgraded from vista) on the other. The libraries basically allow you to define the "My Documents" scheme however you want- for instance my ONE my documents library links together all of the data from my XP system and my current se7en system. You can also add custom libraries (for instance "My Webserver", "My C++ Projects" etc). It is such a handy feature and im glad they finally added it.

[synth3tk]

edit: it only took me about 15 minutes to crash it....I was doing a complicated task, trying to see what was on the C drive, using Windows Explorer. Used to be we could just type in "dir c:"
Remember, this is still an early Beta build, so the fact that it's nearly fully functional is amazing in-and-of itself. I'm pretty sure whatever made it crash will be worked out by "August".

So i downloaded it, struggled to get one of the first 2.5 million keys (before they stopped download capping), and installed it. I got it up and running and installed over Vista in about a half an hour on my computer. I must say, i really, really like the installation process.
You didn't hear? They raised the limit to "infinity". ;) There's an unlimited number of keys now, so tell anyone who's interested.

As for compatibility, the 64 bit beta version of windows 7 is FAR more compatible with my computer/hardware than Vista ever was. In vista my wireless network card experienced intermittent dropped data and lagging, but in 7 there is nothing of the sort.
I had no audio in XP64, and it was pretty irritating. I also couldn't use an ethernet wire or my quick launch touch buttons.

windows 7 is windows vista with all the bugs worked out. like they said, they finally listened to the users. I think they are marketing it as windows 7 to avoid the stigma that Vista had placed on it. with that said, i am never going back to XP or (god forbid) Vista
Yeah, it certainly would not build the hype that it has, had it been marketed as "Vista SP3". And I'm also going to leave XP and Vista behind me. Heck, I might try to see if I can stick with this Beta OS until it releases. :D

Only issue I have right now is video, and that seems to be a majority of the compatibility problems with Windows 7. So my games are sort of just wasting HDD space, but that's fine, because it's FRC season.

[Uberbots]

Only issue I have right now is video, and that seems to be a majority of the compatibility problems with Windows 7. So my games are sort of just wasting HDD space, but that's fine, because it's FRC season.

Are you really having trouble with video?

I can play all of my steam games (TF2 required a volume fix) flawlessly on se7en, but i am using a relatively new video card, so i guess se7en came with the drivers (radeon HD4850)

[MrForbes]

Win7 did not automatically install a driver for the onboard sound on my old off-brand P4 system. I haven't tried to fix it yet....since I don't have a pair of speakers handy to use on it...but I probably will some time.

Youtube video works fine (in blissful silence) after installing firefox, flash player, noscript, and flashblock :)

[synth3tk]

I'm using a built-in video card (laptop), Radeon X1250 I believe. Games worked in XP, but they go all screwy in Win7. TF2, L4D, some other RTS. I'm going to try a quick-fix later today to see if that does anything.

btw, my SteamID is 1up_dave ;)


EDIT: Yeah, the other thing I hate is IE8. Not really a fan of it. But then again, I never really liked IE, even on XP.

[kirtar]

Drivers maybe? For me, the problem in my ethernet connection is that Nvidia dropped support of it about 4 years ago. Maybe try downloading Vista drivers for it?

Oh by the way, it'll probably not run well because integrated takes your system RAM, and Windows 7 requires you to have 1 GB, so it might be a RAM problem, but then again, I don't know what your system specs are.

[synth3tk]

No, I can handle it. http://chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=799009&postcount=71

It's probably just a driver issue. It worked on Vista, and that takes heluva lot more system resources. Just like my fingerprint scanner just had a driver released today.

[GregW11]

Maybe we should show Microsoft the CCCP (Combined Community Codec Pack) and have them include that on Win7. That would solve all codec problems with video/audio.

As for drivers, that's a little harder since they're per device and not necessarily generic...

[synth3tk]

Maybe we should show Microsoft the CCCP (Combined Community Codec Pack) and have them include that on Win7. That would solve all codec problems with video/audio.
I'm hoping they do. That would be a great help. It perplexes me why they haven't included free (beer and liberty) open-source codecs such as Ogg Vorbis with their OS.

[whlspacedude]

I installed it on two computers
1)My 2 year-old abit kn8 AMD X2 4200+ with 2gb of ram and an (old IDE) 40GB hdd
ATI Radeon x1300 (dual monitors)
Install took 20min
2)A Several year (more than 5) old Inspiron 600m with and intel centrino at 1.2GHZ 512MB ram and 120gb hdd
install took 32min

computer 1 looks amazing and proforms better than XP SP2, Very impressed:)
computer 2 is snappy but slightly less appealing(no dedicated graphics):(
needless to say i will be keeping my XP and Ubuntu installs on both computers until the final release of Windows 7.

Has anyone got labview to work with Windows 7? i have been getting some errors.

[synth3tk]

Has anyone got labview to work with Windows 7? i have been getting some errors.
I will try it out next chance I get and report back here. What are the errors you're getting?

[GregW11]

Considering that Windows 7 is still in beta, I wouldn't run Labview on it, mainly because neither Microsoft nor NI can be held accountable for errors, due to the fact that Labview isn't guaranteed to work on Win7 and Win7 is still early beta.

[synth3tk]

True. They also state that this should not be used as a primary OS, and for good reason. But that's why there are adventurous geeks like us me. To be bold like that and try it out anyway.

[whlspacedude]

I will try it out next chance I get and report back here. What are the errors you're getting?

I get error #12 upon installer open (see win7.jpg)
I get error #12 upon the directory destination screen (see win7 2.jpg)

I dont know if i can install each product individually. I'll try that later.

Edit: the first installer is what seems to be causing the problems

[f4lsePositive]

True. They also state that this should not be used as a primary OS, and for good reason. But that's why there are adventurous geeks like us me. To be bold like that and try it out anyway.

Yeah, I'm switching from XP Pro 32-bit completely over to Windows 7 64-bit Build 7000. The beta is good until July anyways. I've heard nothing but good things about it so far and how it's really stable with huge performance upgrades, making up where Vista was lacking. I'm just waiting for everything to finish backing up onto my 1TB storage drive at the moment.
The only problem I've heard of is if WMP detects any MP3's, it will cut off the first 3 seconds of all of them. There's a hotfix but it can't be applied before the damage is done.

[MrForbes]

The only problem I've heard of is if WMP detects any MP3's, it will cut off the first 3 seconds of all of them.

Nice feature.

[f4lsePositive]

Nice feature.

That seems to be the only flaw so far. It is a beta after all, and they're working on a fix right now. It'll definitely be resolved by release.

[synth3tk]

The only problem I've heard of is if WMP detects any MP3's, it will cut off the first 3 seconds of all of them. There's a hotfix but it can't be applied before the damage is done.
Good job, now you tell me about this!!! :rolleyes:

At first I thought my MP3s were corrupt. Hopefully something can be done about it soon.

[jason701802]

even after i installed Inventor 09.

Did you have any problems while installing Inventor. When i do it off of a DVD with all the install files on it, the installation gets all the way up to where it actually starts installing the software, then prompts me to insert disk 1 of 4. If i click ok, it just prompts me again, and if i click cancel, it cancels the whole install. The same DVD has been used to install Inventor on both vista and xp machines.

if i try to use the FIRSTbase FRC download tool it says that i don't have enough space (the file is 3.06gb and i have 139gb free). if i use the file that i downloaded in the browser, during the setup initialization it stops and tells me that it can't move a file (i don't remember what the file is and now the setup freezes before it gets to that point).

[morganh2550]

Onething is really slow and it uses 1.25GB of my RAM and it takes 5 min to turn on. I just installed the beta i am actually using it right now it uses less then a gig of RAM and it takes about 2 min to start up. It also has windows powershell an advanced command line and scripting language. It is also much easier to navigate and use very user friend friendly.:) :D :cool:

[morganh2550]

If u dont now what windows powershell is follow this link, http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2003/technologies/management/powershell/default.mspx

[RyanN]

Has anyone been able to get LabView running on Windows 7? I received the same error as someone mentioned before. I might play with it a bit since I'm not on the school's crippled internet anymore.

[morganh2550]

i got that error in vista so is it 7?:eek:

[RyanN]

Hmm... not sure... I had LabView working on Vista, but my laptop didn't like Vista, and would randomly freeze up, so Vista didn't work for me. I'm back to using XP. No freezes, LabView runs, and all my games still work, so I'm sticking with it until I need to upgrade.

[jamie_1930]

The thing with vista is that it uses a lot of your cpu at one time. Ever want to scare yourself get the cpu gauge gadget and realize that 48% of your cpu is being used when nothing is open and your mouse isn't moving. So if you want to shell out a lot of money for a oct-proccesor vista's for you (there was a little bit of sarcasim with the oct-proccesor for those of you vista-simpathist).

[Honis]

I can't read through all 8 pages (sorry)

Has anyone tried running the labview installer in xp or vista compatibility mode?



Also, does anyone know whats happening for me? If I'm running a 3d application (game) in windowed mode then click so that its out of focus, the sound for that 3d app stops (more like mute, but the mixer shows no mute icons for the app).

[Tom Line]

Considering that Windows 7 is still in beta, I wouldn't run Labview on it, mainly because neither Microsoft nor NI can be held accountable for errors, due to the fact that Labview isn't guaranteed to work on Win7 and Win7 is still early beta.

Yeah, um, because we can hold them accountable for all the issues there are.... or not :).

Ever looked at the sheer number of services Labview runs upon installation, that are nearly always ON?

[XXShadowXX]

One of the mentors on my team(Chad) installed windows 7 (got it through his job) on his laptop, and it runs great. No annoying are you sure, thats your sure about running this program that i asked 4 times if you were sure about downloading, and then my fire wall wouldn't let you get. Windows 7 it looks solid, and runs solid.
After installing it Chad said he had to install labview 8.5.1 piece by piece but now that's on their it runs really good. We haven't exported any of his subVI's yet, but it accepted the upgrade with out a hitch, so it's got to have some good backwards compatibility.
Oh it comes with IE8 (internet explorer 8) which also looks great.

[synth3tk]

Oh it comes with IE8 (internet explorer 8) which also looks great.
IE8 is technically-challenged. Too unstable in terms of compatibility of sites.

Of course, being the good human being that I should be, I installed FireFox3 before any other piece of software.

[XXShadowXX]

I know he uses Firefox 3, me and Brandon are trying to convince him to use Google chrome, but i still harbor a good love for Firefox

[morganh2550]

i have tried and tried to get google chrome to work on 7 but it just will not work:confused:

[artdutra04]

I've downloaded and installed both the 32-bit version of Windows 7 onto my laptop and the 64-bit version onto the media center computer in our apartment. What's surprised me the most is not only the remarkable increase in performance over Vista, but that it hardly needs any additional drivers out of the box to actually work.

On my laptop, on Windows XP I had about a dozen drivers to install. After wiping the hard drive and installing Windows 7 fresh, I only had to install audio driver, touchpad driver (to get the ability to scroll webpages, as otherwise it worked), and a general Dell driver (to make all those Fn keys work). On the media center computer, which was also wiped clean before install, I only had to install an ethernet driver. Previously on Vista, it took hours to get all the drivers on this machine to play nice with each other.

Back when it was running Vista, our media center computer couldn't play Blu-Ray discs at all; they would play but the video was so choppy it was unwatchable. After upgrading to Windows 7, using the same software to play the disc, the performance gain was actually enough to make low-action scenes entirely watchable. It was only during high-action scenes where stuff was very fast moving where the computer bogged down and became choppy.

I'm really impressed with Windows 7 so far, as it's light-years better than Vista. So far,

7 is to Vista as XP was to ME.

[MrForbes]

7 is to Vista as XP was to ME.

That sounds about right. I skipped over ME, I never got to Vista, XP still does everything I need. Eventually I might upgrade to 7, but I think it'll be a while.

Thanks for the detailed report...

[synth3tk]

That sounds about right. I skipped over ME, I never got to Vista, XP still does everything I need. Eventually I might upgrade to 7, but I think it'll be a while.

Thanks for the detailed report...
Definitely wait either later (when there are more stable drivers/features) or until it's released, but you will certainly want to buy this OS. Artdutra got it right, it will be their next long-term release.

[MrForbes]

I'll wait until XP doesn't do what I need....which might be a while. I'm usually 3 to 7 years behind with my OS.

[ScottX]

Windows 7 v.7001 is okay i can rumor has it that its not as best as XP as for the multi running programs. Windows 7 is almost the same as Vista just faster. A new feature to it is that if u drag the windows to each side of the screen it automaticly maximize it to a certain size WHICH IS COOL! Well when it does come out I might buy it if i have the funds! =D

[M. Gildner]

A big problem with Vista was people didn't need it.
XP was a good OS that did everything people wanted.
I only know one person who upgraded to Vista and I tried it out, and it wasn't bad. However I am not going to shell out 200$ when the OS I have does everything I need. I probably won't upgrade to Win7 unless there are major upgrades.

[IceStorm]

I've been running windows 7 build 7000 on my HP tablet that is used for production work at my office with no problems. It has actually been faster and more stable than when I ran Vista or Xp on the same machine. The only two items I don't have working drivers for are a EDVO modem and the fingerprint sensor which were both items I never used anyways.

[jeremiah.pegues]

win 7 is good stuff.
it makes xp look like a snail.
and vista look like a slower snail.
major stability improvements.
and looks cool. but we know [vista] that it needs more than that.
doesn't hog memory. boots faster than my macbook pro.

good stuff. but its gonna have the same probs vista had and xp had and thats compatibility

[nathan.chupp]

windows 7 is Vista sp2


they need a new name..... I'm running win 7 beta right now.

[Jeff 801]

Has anyone installed Inventor 2008 in Windows 7 I am looking to upgrade my full hard drive but if inventor does not work I will not be upgrading. Currently, I have it on a 15gb partition and I know my system can handle it and everything I just don't want to upgrade and then have to downgrade because the main program I use does not work.

[synth3tk]

There's multiple issues (as pointed out in this thread) but I believe someone posted a workaround. Wait until one or two people respond before switching over. As always, this is beta software, so do not use on a primary machine without knowing that there is no support other than that of the community.

[Loubear]

Has anyone installed Inventor 2008 in Windows 7 I am looking to upgrade my full hard drive but if inventor does not work I will not be upgrading. Currently, I have it on a 15gb partition and I know my system can handle it and everything I just don't want to upgrade and then have to downgrade because the main program I use does not work.

Well, I don't know about Inventor '08, but Inventor '09 works fine on my laptop with the win7 beta installed. Content center and everything.

[Arcre]

I have installed Window 7 successful with latest updates, and successful. It works faster than Vista 64bit.

[Uberbots]

Well, I don't know about Inventor '08, but Inventor '09 works fine on my laptop with the win7 beta installed. Content center and everything.

inventor '09 has a couple compatibility issues on my machine with windows 7, specifically with the design accelerator stuff. i dont know why, but when i run the gear creator, it locks up the entire system (which im guessing is an MS issue because its system-wide, but it could be autodesk)

[XXShadowXX]

I've been running windows 7 build 7000 on my HP tablet that is used for production work at my office with no problems. It has actually been faster and more stable than when I ran Vista or Xp on the same machine. The only two items I don't have working drivers for are a EDVO modem and the fingerprint sensor which were both items I never used anyways.

To back up what Chad has said, we have used the tablet (with windows 7 on it) to load code into the cRIO no issue yet, and all codes developed in windows 7 in labview 8.5.1 are completely compatible.

[1337Nerd]

I have no problems with it on my desktop. It runs faster than XP when I had it installed and it runs faster than most Vista computers I've experienced.

The only issues I have are some compatibility ones with select programs, but that's to be expected.

[EncodersRUS]

I know someone who is running 7...........
He can't get anything to work on it older than Vista, but that's propably because he screwed with PowerShell and tried to but in XP's Luna theme.

[A Bear]

I got Windows 7 and it runs fine, but i can get it for free and get newer versions for free aswell because of my IT class :P

[alectronic]

I heard that all Vista users are gonna get a free upgrade to 7 once it has a stable full release. I apologize if someone else said this earlier, but I haven't read all 100+ posts yet!!
That would be nice though, at least to make it an option.

[Nate Smith]

I heard that all Vista users are gonna get a free upgrade to 7 once it has a stable full release. I apologize if someone else said this earlier, but I haven't read all 100+ posts yet!!
That would be nice though, at least to make it an option.

Not entirely accurate(unfortunately), from what I've heard...the posts I saw on this topic were somewhat misleading, but the actual release from Microsoft was discussing the upgrade assurance program that they have done in the past(for example, before Vista was released). Essentially, anyone who purchases a new computer with Vista pre-installed after a certain date(still TBD,) would get a free upgrade to Win7 once it is released.

[Jeff 801]

As an update to anyone that wants to use windows 7 and Inventor 2008 after seeing that no one has tried it I repartitioned my drive and installed Inventor 2008 with SP3 installed and it is running execlent (faster than in Vista I might add).

[tj1673]

Speaking of Windows 7, I know someone who beta tested it for Microsoft then got a keygen to unlock the full version of it. He described it as "Windows Vista, but everything you love about XP." So personally, I'm excited for it. I jst hope that all those who had to have Vista will get a free or discounted upgrade to Windows 7 and they will make everything from Vista compatible for Windows 7, especially because most people don't have the money to just go out and buy a new computer since many people went and bought new ones when Vista came out because of the non-compatibility issues with XP.

[Gamer930]

I really need to reformat my laptop. . . I have access to a Windows 7 Beta key through school MSDN Program.
Has anyone tried to install FIRST Robotics Labview Version on Windows 7 and download/upload code to the robot??

[typharn91]

i wish my IT class at school got a beta key of it but were lame

[IceStorm]

I really need to reformat my laptop. . . I have access to a Windows 7 Beta key through school MSDN Program.
Has anyone tried to install FIRST Robotics Labview Version on Windows 7 and download/upload code to the robot??



Yes. and Yes. It does install though its not just as easy as throwing in the CD and launching setup. I"m running windows 7 on my hp tablet and i had to install each of the Labview FRC components manually. I think there was easily 8 - 10 different setups if not more that needed to be ran to get it to work. The menu/scripted installer throws up an SDK error when launched.

Once it is installed you also have to manually activate each component If i remember right as well with the license manager.

After that you then can install the update 3 and activate that.


Once all that is done just set your ip address to match the scheme and your good to go. I haven't had any other issues as far as labview goes.

The only real problem i have going right now is where the laptop will just randomly shut down. you'd be working or playing a movie or something and bam its powered off. when you turn it back on its like you had a power outage. battery can be fully charged even. Thing is i don't know if its the laptop or windows 7 as the laptop has taken quite a beating as part of my job.

oh yes by the way this is my "production" system. I'm a network tech/admin for the RESA/ISD that oversees about 7 school districts in our county with about 200+ miles of fiber optics and 15k or more computers on the network.

[UnknownMember]

I have mixed feelings about Windows 7, to say the least. Performance wise, it seems like it is going to be a step up from Vista, which is a much-needed improvement. Compared to XP, Vista is slow as dirt. The problems I'm forseeing with Windows 7 are all UI related. Quite frankly, it seems like Microsoft is "dumbing down" Windows. They try to make everything easy to understand, easy to change, and appealing to the masses. This is understandable, and good marketing, but they lose the tech geeks like me when they do this :) Luckily, though, I've heard they have a tool where you can turn certain features on or off at will. This is an excellent idea, and, if implemented well, it could make enough difference so that Windows 7 is not merely a sell-out to make money at the expense of power and performance. Just my thoughts, though.

[MrForbes]

If they offered a "make it look like XP" button, I'd consider buying it.

[Trent B]

I am going to hope someone sees this

I tried installing windows 7 and everything worked I didnt try solidworks though but I noticed autodesk inventor outright said it couldnt install as I was incompatible.

3dsMax installed most of the way but there was a popup part way through whcih i didnt read and just clicked a button to make go away since i was busy at the time, so maybe it would have installed.

Anyways i reverted to XP and now I am wondering if anyone knows how to get the autodesk software to install in 7, i tried running them in compatibility mode and it didnt work :/ so now I am lost as to what to do since I really liked 7.

Also im on a Mac with Bootcamp and I think autodesk says that my platform isnt completely supported even under XP because of bootcamp I believe, so I am wondering if any other bootcampers have had success/lack therof. Since it may be possible it is doing two strikes, one for bootcamp 1 for seven and not letting me install. What about SolidWorks?

Thanks for your help,

TrentB
Captain 2502

Reading Jeffs Post it sounds like he had to have XP running separately to make it work, is this a method worthy of trying?

[R.C.]

I am going to hope someone sees this

I tried installing windows 7 and everything worked I didnt try solidworks though but I noticed autodesk inventor outright said it couldnt install as I was incompatible.

3dsMax installed most of the way but there was a popup part way through whcih i didnt read and just clicked a button to make go away since i was busy at the time, so maybe it would have installed.

Anyways i reverted to XP and now I am wondering if anyone knows how to get the autodesk software to install in 7, i tried running them in compatibility mode and it didnt work :/ so now I am lost as to what to do since I really liked 7.

Also im on a Mac with Bootcamp and I think autodesk says that my platform isnt completely supported even under XP because of bootcamp I believe, so I am wondering if any other bootcampers have had success/lack therof. Since it may be possible it is doing two strikes, one for bootcamp 1 for seven and not letting me install. What about SolidWorks?

Thanks for your help,

TrentB
Captain 2502

Reading Jeffs Post it sounds like he had to have XP running separately to make it work, is this a method worthy of trying?

Alrighty,

First of all, I've been using windows 7 since the release candidate. I would like to say that Windows 7 pwns Vista and is up to par with XP. As for CAD, are you sure inventor doesn't work with windows 7. Right now I have Inventor 2010 installed (2009 on my brothers comp) along with the Solidworks 2009 (and the beta). If you need some help, let me know. You can either IM or email and I can try to help you out.

-RC

[artdutra04]

Also im on a Mac with Bootcamp and I think autodesk says that my platform isnt completely supported even under XP because of bootcamp I believe, so I am wondering if any other bootcampers have had success/lack therof. Since it may be possible it is doing two strikes, one for bootcamp 1 for seven and not letting me install. What about SolidWorks?Comments like that from software companies are left over from the PowerPC days. Any Intel Mac running any version of Windows natively (aka Bootcamp) is absolutely no different than any other typical PC running Windows natively.

Now what they are probably referring to is that generally CAD programs are optimized around professional NVIDIA Quatro or ATI FireGL graphics cards, with very little or no optimization support for the consumer level cards found in nearly all personal computers. Most Macs, along with nearly all PCs sold to the general public, come with consumer-grade graphics cards. What this means is that while the program will still work, it won't work as efficiently as it would on a workstation computer.

[Bryan Herbst]

Definitely wait either later (when there are more stable drivers/features) or until it's released, but you will certainly want to buy this OS. Artdutra got it right, it will be their next long-term release.
Although I do tend to agree, the Win7 RC (and even the beta) was incredibly stable. I ran into zero problems with any of my drivers, hardware, or software. Everything runs really smoothly, and I have fallen in love with it.

That, combined with the insanely low (50% off) pre-order pricing convinced me to preorder.

[MrForbes]

I installed the RC on my main system (core 2 duo) on a second drive, it seems to work well. It has a problem with shutting down right after starting up, which should not be a bother in normal use, but sure is when trying to get things set up. No driver for the antique video card I had installed (radeon 9200) so I ended up buying a newer cheap card (nvidia 9400 gt) so I could get both screens working.

And I fixed the freecell problem by installing the program from XP, so I guess the new OS will be usefull after all. moviemaker needs work (7 does not come with WMM, and the Windows Live MM is still in beta and needs a lot more features)

still trying to get used to how much ram it uses...but I guess it's not a big deal since ddr2 is so cheap.

[Trent B]

Ok some clarification.

Double click the setup icon for inventor.

Install Products

Says something along the lines of this software is not compatible and doesn't install... (last thing I tried installing :/). It just cancels the installer.

Maybe something got screwed up as windows was installed (fresh reformat of that partition, and 64-bit for what it is worth)

Any thoughts?

For the Record
Solidworks - Didnt Try
3ds Max - Installed most of the way, some popup came up (I think about compatibility at the time) I was doing something else so I clicked it thinking it was for whatever app i was using at the time, 3dsmax started to uninstall. I never tried it after that.
Inventor - Install Product, your system is not compatible, exiting now.

2.4ghz core 2 duo
2GB ram
70GB win partition
8600m GT 256mb RAM
Bootcamp installed all drivers fine.

I realize I am theoretically natively running windows however technically I don't think I am because I have EFI and bootcamp emulates the bios I think.

Feel free to contact me over IM if you wish.

Edit: I may try VMing 7 later today (I have enough freepsace on my 200GB drive (like 120 for mac) to VM inventor and 7 so I will see if I can get it to install. Well VMing isnt working because I cant get the stupid files to transfer over. Gonna download in a VM now...

[Trent B]

This is the error I got in 7 as native and as VM

http://content.screencast.com/users/trentborman/folders/Jing/media/d73af260-80c2-4e46-be5f-00c383549637/00000012.png

Im wondering if anyone else got that and if they had to work around it. I tried compatibility mode when I had it natively installed (as opposed to VMed) and it didnt do anything.

Ahh crap http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=71241 it seems like I have to download a special 64 bit version despite the fact that windows 7 is supposed to run 32 fine... in addition 3dsmax was probably just telling me 32bit couldnt work... time to dl that and see if it works. if it does I am off to go get my backup drive from my dads desk (750GB =P)

Now im confused according to the site the download is 32/64 bit and if you want autocad 64 you need special download. Any other 64-biters chime in and say what they did? they say at the top 32 and 64 and imply dl tool and at bottom say 64 bit users. I thought 7 was supposed to get over the bit issue. Maybe not.. I should probably dl and test it out but I don't want to kill 8GB of bandwidth twice since I cant see to copy files from my vm.

[jason701802]

I had similar problems when I tried to install Inventor 32bit onto 32bit Windows 7. I had a DVD that I had burned the install files onto and i could not install from there. I then downloaded the install files straight onto my computer and still had the same problem. Then, just to see what would happen, I copied the install files onto a flash drive and IT WORKED. since the location that you install from seems to make a difference (If anyone thinks they have an idea why, i would like to hear it), I would try installing using all of these methods.

[Trent B]

Yea 64 bit install worked fine, compatibility mode got solidworks to install. It launched once in 7 mode then i had to put it to xp mode to get it to work and I get these annoying glitches all the time

http://screencast.com/t/5LCCFSvR

CAD software is the only troublesome thing I have had so far, I guess it could be said that I had trouble with webcam too as I cannot take pics with it (they removed it it seems.)

[oddjob]

I tried the W7 RC on a recent Toshiba laptop, previously running Vista Ultimate (32 bit). 2G ram.

The wireless connection now randomly dies, didn't before. The wireless signal strength icon says there is a connection when there isn't one. Booting is about as slow as Vista. Shutdown is about as slow as Vista. Firefox now leaks memory and eventually dies. Pdf files don't open in the browser. The printer (Xerox 6180 color) status panel says every job fails, but they do print. Some programs have compatibility issues e.g. Matlab. Here is the list of benefits over Vista and XP:

1.

End.

OK, so it's an RC, but it is quite close to the manufacturing release. This is the lowest quality RC I've ever used from Microsoft and I wonder what the production release will be like. Windows has gone to shark. Joe Average consumer can be happy with XP and skip Vista and it's SP3 fork, W7.

[kjohnson]

I have been running Windows 7 x86 since the end of February on an Acer laptop with 1 GB RAM and a 2.0 GHz Intel Celeron ($300 deal from Woot! and runs great).

I first had the Beta, and now the RC, and I love it. Win 7 is a large improvement over Vista in my opinion, and has not crashed in 5 months of use. Some programs, the start menu, and the program search lagged with the Beta, but that was easily fixed by upgrading to 2 GB of RAM. I have had some compatibility issues with some programs and trouble finding a driver for my printer, but seeing as Win 7 still isn't finalized yet, I will wait to see if that gets fixed.

I am very pleased with Win 7 so far, and I get a free copy through MSDNAA, so I will be sticking with Win 7.

[MrForbes]

I just got an Aspire One from walmart, under $300 incl tax....put the 320gb drive from my external unit on it...installed 7 RC and ubuntu on it. seems to work ok. Windows uses less than half of the 1gb ram when running a browser.

I got to learn how to install windows from a flash drive, that was fun.

I'm keeping XP on the original 160gb drive....