Hole in the rules regarding causing penalties?

[BethMo]

G24 states that a robot receives a penalty if it is in possession of or herding more than one empty cell at a time.

G21 states that payload specialists may throw empty cells over the wall into the crater.

G18: Causing PENALTIES – The actions of a ROBOT shall not cause an opposing ROBOT to break a rule and thus incur penalties. Any rule violations committed by the affected ROBOT shall be excused, and no penalties will be assigned.

G18 does NOT say that the actions of a PAYLOAD SPECIALIST shall not cause an opposing robot to incur penalties. As it reads, you can toss the empty cells onto your opponent's robot instead of into the trailer and cause a ten point penalty.

Is there another rule covering this somewhere that I missed? If not, I hope they fix it.

[Ian Curtis]

Is there another rule covering this somewhere that I missed? If not, I hope they fix it.

As it is currently written, it would appear that if a ball is thrown from the ALLIANCE STATION (note that <G21> states that it is illegal for the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST to throw balls over the OUTPOST STATION) and lands in hopper that already has an EMPY CELL in it, then that robot will incur a penalty. I'm willing to be that once the Q&A opens up (or maybe even prior) that this loophole will be fixed. Of course, this potential "correction" is pure speculation.

[EricH]

G24 states that a robot receives a penalty if it is in possession of or herding more than one empty cell at a time.

G21 states that payload specialists may throw empty cells over the wall into the crater.



G18 does NOT say that the actions of a PAYLOAD SPECIALIST shall not cause an opposing robot to incur penalties. As it reads, you can toss the empty cells onto your opponent's robot instead of into the trailer and cause a ten point penalty.

Is there another rule covering this somewhere that I missed? If not, I hope they fix it.They need to fix it. <G21> gives an action that <G22> prohibits--or does it?
<G21>Introducing EMPTY CELLS – EMPTY CELLS enter the CRATER when the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST passes the EMPTY CELL through the payload port in the OUTPOST shield, or over the Alliance Station Wall from the FUELING STATION. EMPTY CELLS shall not enter the CRATER through any other means (e.g. an EMPTY CELL can not be thrown over the OUTPOST shield and into the CRATER). A violation will cause a PENALTY to be assigned.
<G22> Exchanging EMPTY CELLS - When an EMTPY CELL exits the CRATER via a FUELING PORT, it is retrieved by the PAYLOAD SPECIALIST and stored on the CELL RACK. During the last 20 seconds of the MATCH, each EMPTY CELL in the FUELING STATION may be exchanged for a SUPER CELL. Once an EMPTY CELL has been exchanged for a SUPER CELL, it can not re-enter play. Violations will result in a PENALTY.The bolded sections are the contradiction.

However, from the OUTPOST, no worries due to <G21> prohibiting EMPTY CELLs from going over the OUTPOST wall.

[GaryVoshol]

I don't see a contradiction there, Eric. <G22> is about exchanging Cells and how to do it. If the team doesn't want to exchange the Cells, then they are free to do something else with the Empty Cell. JMOICBW

[Kevin Sevcik]

This seems entirely similar to the rule for herding/holding ringers in 2007. In that case, robots were only allowed to herd/possess one ringer at a time. If an additional ringer inadvertently fell on the robot, the were allowed to dispose of the original ringer, but had to remove the additional afterwards before possessing another. Also, it was not allowed to intentionally place an additional ringer on a robot to penalize or restrict them, and such ringers were ignored.

I imagine the GDC will go with a similar ruling here. At worst, an empty cell that accidentally bounces onto an inaccessible place on your robot will mean you can't pursue any more empty cells. So I don't think sandbagging opponents with empty cells is going to be viable once this is brought to the GDC's attention.

[Ben Bastedo]

They would almost have to fix that because they would receive a lot of heat for it! Good find! :ahh: