Before we start - PLEASE read the Manual! [Archive]

View Full Version : Before we start - PLEASE read the Manual!

dlavery

28-12-2009, 18:37

Before the season starts, we would like to take a moment and pass along a plea from practically all of the game designers, FRC leaders, lead mentors, lead team engineers, competition inspectors, referees, judges, and (most likely) your team mates.

Once it is released PLEASE, PLEASE, PLEASE read the FRC Manual!

The Manual is packed full of important information that pretty much everyone on the team will need to know. While not everyone will need to know every chapter intimately (e.g. not everyone on the team will be involved with shipping the robot, so not all of them will need to study the "Robot Transportation" chapter), there are a few sections that all will need to know and understand. Everyone should be sure to read – and probably re-read –the "Arena," "Game," "Robot," and "Tournament" chapters.

If you do not become reasonably familiar with this material, you will have endless problems during the season. These can range from wasting your and other people’s time repeatedly asking questions that are clearly addressed in the Manual, to showing up at a competition with an illegal robot and not being allowed to compete. I can pretty much guarantee that if you get caught up in a rules violation during the season, trying to use "but I didn't read the rules, so I didn't know that" as an excuse absolutely will not work with the referees or inspectors at the competition events.

As has been mentioned so many times, a big part of FIRST is about exposing students to the standards and practices of the professional world. To do this many teams structure their operations to mimic the organization and procedures of a professional engineering project. The Manual is the "requirements document" for your project. In a professional environment, EVERYONE on a project is required to know the requirements, be conversant with the documentation, and be able to extract information from them. Those skills are critical and expected. As a member of your team, practicing those skills will be fundamental to your ability to positively contribute to the success of your team. As an entire team, this practice will be critical to your – and your alliance partners - success at the competitions.

The Manual is your friend. Read it. Know it. Use it.

-dave

-.--

Tanner

28-12-2009, 19:43

*spys something at the end* omg - morse code

Anywho, good post. I shall share with the rest of my team.

-Tanner

ChrisH

28-12-2009, 20:08

Can we have Dave's post "stickied" at the very top of the forum until about Jan 17?

Please?

Billfred

28-12-2009, 20:19

Can we have Dave's post "stickied" at the very top of the forum until about Jan 17?

Please?
Done. And co-signed.

MrForbes

28-12-2009, 20:30

Can we have Dave's post "stickied" at the very top of the forum until about Jan 17?

Please?

or Feb 17th or so? maybe April 17th or so?

:)

Vikesrock

28-12-2009, 20:41

Thanks for posting this Dave and thanks for making it a Sticky Billfred.

As one of the frequent rules question responders I can definitely say that most rules questions I answer I pull right out of the manual. While I am more than happy to answer the questions, as it helps me drill the manual into my head, it would usually be easier and faster to look up the answer yourself.

scottydoh

28-12-2009, 22:25

*spys something at the end* omg - morse code

Anywho, good post. I shall share with the rest of my team.

-Tanner

I noticed the same thing, and it seems as though he's been including this little addition in a lot of his posts lately...but, Im probably thinking into it way too much...

And, this is indeed a very important post!

Justin Montois

28-12-2009, 22:59

I hope I'm wrong, but I have a feeling this thread might be the most linked to when build season comes along.

Instead of RTFM, we should just link this thread.

Rion Atkinson

29-12-2009, 13:52

I have this as sticky note on my desktop. I'm going to blow in up a tad bit and print it out; then hang it in the meeting room. :D

BrendanB

29-12-2009, 14:53

And in some cases rules are unclear and need resolving from the GDC. Those questions should be posted in the FIRST Forums- http://forums.usfirst.org/index.php?

DonRotolo

29-12-2009, 19:44

And in some cases rules are unclear and need resolving from the GDC. Those questions should be posted in the FIRST Forums- http://forums.usfirst.org/index.php?...and NOT HERE, since Chief Delphi is NOT the official forum of FIRST.

--

Al Skierkiewicz

31-12-2009, 10:41

...and NOT HERE, since Chief Delphi is NOT the official forum of FIRST.

--

However, if you do post a reply to a question here, please quote the manual section in your reply. It saves time for everyone and keeps Dave's request to "Read the manual" upfront in everyone's mind.

hipsterjr

05-01-2010, 13:30

IndySam

05-01-2010, 13:37

Speaking of manual, I thought the encrypted manual was available for download, but I can't find it.:confused: I just don't want to try and download it on Saturday when the entire FRC community will be to.

Any time now. They will put out an email blast and I'm sure the email will be posted here minutes after it happens.

Peter Matteson

05-01-2010, 14:24

Al Skierkiewicz

06-01-2010, 07:47

I have a couple of simple reccommendations to the team mentors reading this thread to help drive home why to read the manual to your teams:

3) Please check the First website several times a week and download the Team Updates and check for document revisions. Inspectors and refs are required to know the changes and perform using the latest Team Updates and doc revisions at each event. The last robot section revision occurred as Rev K and the Team Updates went to 19 in 2009.

4) Check the Q&A every week as well.

MrForbes

06-01-2010, 10:20

LINK TO MANUAL

Might help to provide a link to the manual for those who have trouble finding it.....????

http://usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/content.aspx?id=452

The encrypted manual is posted.

Cyberphil

06-01-2010, 14:24

The only thing I dislike more than piontless hints are people who don't understand or know the rules to the game each year! Thank you for making this thread. You can not stress enough how important it is to understand the game!

I love the quiz idea. We usually just talk about the game sooooooooooo much that it is burned in our minds.

vic burg

08-01-2010, 10:18

It also might be helpful to have certain sections (*Arena, Game, Robot*), printed out as a hard copy reference. That way you don't have to wait for the manual to load on the computer and then search for a certain rule. If you REALLY want to (though I do not recommend it) you can print the whole thing but I did that a few years ago for the team.... barely fit in a 3 inch binder.
I agree with Peter though; a quiz would be a very good idea.

MrForbes

08-01-2010, 10:22

I'm old, so I print out those sections of the manual, and keep them in my engineering notebook (a thick 3 ring binder). The fun begins when they start sending out the team updates, and the manual gets some changes....I print the updates and put them in the notebook. And occasionally print the revised manual pages.

Al Skierkiewicz

08-01-2010, 12:03

The fun begins when they start sending out the team updates, and the manual gets some changes....I print the updates and put them in the notebook. And occasionally print the revised manual pages.

Please be sure that if you use this method, each update gets into the book when it is released. A team who had only added Team updates through 16 was being called on an issue that was posted in update 17 at the Champs. Big OOPS.

DanDon

08-01-2010, 12:27

Please be sure that if you use this method, each update gets into the book when it is released. A team who had only added Team updates through 16 was being called on an issue that was posted in update 17 at the Champs. Big OOPS.

I also like running a diff on the two files and comparing any changes....seems to help the changes sink in more than just going through the update or the revised section.

terryo

08-01-2010, 12:50

Please be sure that if you use this method, each update gets into the book when it is released. A team who had only added Team updates through 16 was being called on an issue that was posted in update 17 at the Champs. Big OOPS.

For those, like me, who must have it on paper...:cool:

Practice good documentation control for the sections that you keep on paper. (the students will need to do this when they enter the working world anyway)

1. One member 'owns' the Master copy (if many own it, then no one owns it)
2. That owner checks for updates daily
3. When an update is released, highlight the changes and share them with the team
4. Remove and file the old section, replace it with the new section- this includes the updated index

Electronic Manual reference should be taken directly from the FIRST site.

vic burg

08-01-2010, 13:32

1. One member 'owns' the Master copy (if many own it, then no one owns it)
2. That owner checks for updates daily
3. When an update is released, highlight the changes and share them with the team
4. Remove and file the old section, replace it with the new section- this includes the updated index

That's what we did when I was in charge of it. Although, we rarely used the whole manual. Really only the updates once they started because at the time, that was all we were concerned about. Ended up breaking a rule that way *I think* or were close to it.

EricH

09-01-2010, 01:00

Folks, Dave has said this better than I can. He's said it more ways than I can come up with.

One thing I haven't seen yet in this thread: Most, if not all, PDF readers have a find function, often accessed by control-F. So if you want to know if CO2 can be used, or if you HAVE to have bumpers, or any one of a number of other answers to questions you have, you might try picking a key term or two (for the examples I gave, "CO2" and "bumper" would work), plugging it into the find function, and seeing what you find.

*gets ready to put the link to Dave's post in any thread that asks questions that are answered in the Manual*

lil'est lavery

12-01-2011, 14:38

I have a couple of simple reccommendations to the team mentors reading this thread to help drive home why to read the manual to your teams:

1.) Put together a 10-15 question basic quiz for your teams to take in the first week of build. take the questions from the robot, game and arena sections of the manual primarily and give your team a pop quiz. - It will make you think about the rules more and encourage your students to read them if they are ashamed of poor performance on the quiz.
...
Doing things like this will help you think through the rules before asking questions and will be invaluble when forming a strategy.

Everyone on team 116 (student or mentor) is required to take a rules test on the robot, game, arena, and tournament sections of the manual. You have three tries to pass the test and each time you take it, the test gets progressively harder. If you don't pass within 3 tries, you're off the team. The test starts out incredibly easy and it doesn't take a whole lot to pass, but failing multiple times picks out the students that are not serious and are showing no signs of commitment early on. Students who want to be on the team are ready when they take the test. This forces students to read the manual and it saves us a lot of time when designing and building.

mechE131

12-01-2011, 14:47

Everyone on team 116 (student or mentor) is required to take a rules test on the robot, game, arena, and tournament sections of the manual. You have three tries to pass the test and each time you take it, the test gets progressively harder. If you don't pass within 3 tries, you're off the team. The test starts out incredibly easy and it doesn't take a whole lot to pass, but failing multiple times picks out the students that are not serious and are showing no signs of commitment early on. Students who want to be on the team are ready when they take the test. This forces students to read the manual and it saves us a lot of time when designing and building.

Bravo

WillF

13-01-2011, 00:06

I completly agree. In fact our team made a test on the manual and made it mandatory to retake it until you pass. Only 4 (out of 20) passed. They now have to retake it until they do pass.

P. Fuller

13-01-2011, 10:44

I completely agree. In fact our team made a test on the manual and made it mandatory to retake it until you pass.

The same goes for our team; you have to take the test until you pass, making it obvious who hasn't read the rules. We actually have an assigned job on the team, the "Rules Guru." Their job is to know the rules by heart, and have the official, completely updated set of the rules that people can go to if they have a question.

nikole95

20-01-2011, 05:26

Any time now. They will put out an email blast and I'm sure the email will be posted here minutes after it happens.

Put together a 10-15 question basic quiz for your teams to take in the first week of build. take the questions from the robot, game and arena sections of the manual primarily and give your team a pop quiz. - It will make you think about the rules more and encourage your students to read them if they are ashamed of poor performance on the quiz.

Andrew Schreiber

06-01-2012, 10:28

Has anyone mirrored the manuals yet? The server will probably be hit hard tomorrow.

I have a mirror of the encrypted document on [LINK REMOVED]

Also what about a bittorrent download of the manuals?

No, just download the encrypted one now.

Karibou

06-01-2012, 12:23

No, just download the encrypted one now.

Do what Andrew said, and then you might want to take a look at Dave's post about mirroring (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1095784&postcount=54) (and the posts that follow).

EricH

06-01-2012, 13:36

And while this thread is here:

Please, please, please, please read the thread title and the first post.

I know it seems faster to create a CD account and ask the question here (and have it given to you in 15 minutes or so), but it's not! It's much faster to use a PDF reader's "Find" feature to do a little bit of research in the Manual. Besides the facts that a) anything said on CD is not official and b) just asking without indicating that you've looked is likely to get you hit with either a "Read the Manual" or a "Search before you post--there are 47 threads on this topic already and it's answered in the Manual" as the default responses.

And, as a more personal note: If I don't see any sign of some rules-knowledge seeker having looked in the Manual, I tend to only give the rule number and a very short summary. If someone has actually looked, or rather gives some indication thereof, I'm much more likely to quote the rule, along with the reference and my interpretation.

Jackladd

06-01-2012, 17:00

kickoffkickoffkickoffkickoffkickoffkickoffkickoffk ickoffkickoffkickoffkickoffkickoff

theNerd

07-01-2012, 22:37

is there a way we can grab the entire manual in a downloadable pdf format that is not broken into parts? If there is one I can't find the link any where.

EricH

08-01-2012, 00:29

1) Go to the entire manual web page (same path as before).
2) Select a section of the Game Manual (any section will do).
3) Click on the heading "Game" at the right side of the page.
4) Click the "Save as PDF" link at the top right.
5) Save the PDF that pops up.

Repeat as necessary for updates.

the man

08-01-2012, 00:33

I have read the game, the robot, and the tournament sections. I think thats a good start. :D

artdutra04

05-01-2013, 09:33

With the new season upon us yet again, I would like to take this opportunity to remind everyone of this thread.

Please, please, please, read the 2013 FRC Game Manual before you come on here and create new threads! No one likes having several pages of new threads all asking the same basic questions that can be answered by the simply reading the game manual.

I would also like to remind everyone of FIRST's stance on mirroring the game manual documents (http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/blog-one-day-to-go) - posts and threads that contain links to the mirrored manual will be deleted.

With that said, good luck in 2013!

slijin

06-01-2013, 17:39

Bump for truth.

nathan_hui

09-01-2013, 16:49

Bump for the CDers who still aren't reading the manual.

ptkunapuli478

21-04-2013, 13:56

After going through this year's build season and getting to competition, its actually astounding that there are teams that probably didn't read the manual at all. Hopefully everyone learns this lesson and does a little reading come next January.

Al Skierkiewicz

21-04-2013, 14:01

Pranav,
I can tell you that maybe one team at each regional came in with a robot sized for last year. Midwest had three, they were sure dimensions would never change so they just skipped over that part.

Wayne Doenges

16-01-2014, 10:41

Besides Reading The FIRST Manual (RTFM) please read the Updates BEFORE you ask any questions.
I've seen several Q&A questions that the GDC refers to an update that was posted before the question was asked.

Andrew Lawrence

10-02-2014, 21:11

^ Don't feed the troll. Just carry on and ignore it.