View Full Version : Carrying Other Robots
Spirator
12-01-2010, 23:45
3132 here,
Our team is wondering if we can carry other robots on top of ours. Anyone know whether it is legal.
Thanks.
If it is legal, you would have to come up with a way to lift the robot without moving the bumpers (mounted 10 inches above ground) or breaking the frame perimeter for more than two seconds. I suggest abandoning the idea. Sorry
Borisdamole
13-01-2010, 00:22
park next to the hump.... get a FAST other robot...
JUMP (http://image.motortrend.com/f/miscellaneous/red-bulls-travis-pastrana-flies-high-in-first-practice-for-new-years-stunt/31050861+w527+st0/red-bull-travis-pastrana-jump.jpg)
hotapay42
13-01-2010, 00:34
park next to the hump.... get a FAST other robot...
JUMP (http://image.motortrend.com/f/miscellaneous/red-bulls-travis-pastrana-flies-high-in-first-practice-for-new-years-stunt/31050861+w527+st0/red-bull-travis-pastrana-jump.jpg)
how did you know our secret sabotage strategy???
i mean...yeah...i dont know if that would work...i advise against it...
Phoenix Spud
13-01-2010, 00:43
Lucky Guess???
squeaker114
13-01-2010, 01:49
so at the end of a match if ur on top of another robot that is off the ground does that count or do you have to be hanging from
timytamy
13-01-2010, 04:46
One of our concepts had another robot on top of ours. We abandoned it because of stability issues.
Thanks,
timytamy
Vikesrock
13-01-2010, 05:23
so at the end of a match if ur on top of another robot that is off the ground does that count or do you have to be hanging from
The rules state that to be Suspended a robot must only be in contact with an Elevated and/or Suspended robot. The rules make no specification as to how that contact must occur.
GaryVoshol
13-01-2010, 06:44
If it is legal, you would have to come up with a way to lift the robot without moving the bumpers (mounted 10 inches above ground) or breaking the frame perimeter for more than two seconds. I suggest abandoning the idea. SorryYou are allowed to expand up to FINALE CONFIGURATION during the last 20 seconds, or at any time during the match if the expanding robot is in contact with the TOWER.
Watch out for the "Raul Rule" though. In Rack-n-Roll, you got bonus points at the end of the game for being lifted off the field on an alliance robot. Wildstang had a match with two non-functioning robots as their alliance partners. Their alliance strategy was to stack the two non-moving bots from the beginning of the match to the end, and 111 ran around the field alone. Despite a Q&A ruling earlier that this was a legal strategy, the GDC reversed their decision after this event, citing that the stacked robots were dangerous. If a stack of non-moving robots was dangerous, I'd guess they'd think it even more dangerous if you intended to move around with another robot on your back.
EricLeifermann
13-01-2010, 08:34
You are allowed to expand up to FINALE CONFIGURATION during the last 20 seconds, or at any time during the match if the expanding robot is in contact with the TOWER.
Watch out for the "Raul Rule" though. In Rack-n-Roll, you got bonus points at the end of the game for being lifted off the field on an alliance robot. Wildstang had a match with two non-functioning robots as their alliance partners. Their alliance strategy was to stack the two non-moving bots from the beginning of the match to the end, and 111 ran around the field alone. Despite a Q&A ruling earlier that this was a legal strategy, the GDC reversed their decision after this event, citing that the stacked robots were dangerous. If a stack of non-moving robots was dangerous, I'd guess they'd think it even more dangerous if you intended to move around with another robot on your back.
Only downside to this strategy this year is all three robots have to start in a different zone. Kind of hard to stack robots before the match starts when there not permitted to be close to each other.
What happens if a red bot is on top of a blue bot and the blue bot doesn't move for what ever reason? Is that pinning?
Al Skierkiewicz
13-01-2010, 08:43
I think you will find that the answer to your question is in the starting configuration rule. One robot in each section touching a specific boundary when the match starts.
I am guessing that when you ask this question of the GDC, the answer may come from an interpretation of robot. If you drive around with another robot on yours, it could be considered one robot and as such exceeds weight, and likely size. Even if that still doesn't throw a flag, any contact with the second robot and another robot can only be in the bumper zone (of the bottom robot) and would likely garner one of the myriad penalties.
<G08> ROBOT Starting Positions – Prior to the MATCH, each TEAM negotiates within their ALLIANCE to select one of the three starting areas for their ALLIANCE.
When the FIELD is viewed from the ALLIANCE STATION, the ROBOTS must be placed on the right side of the CENTER LINE in one of the following starting positions:
• In the far ZONE and in contact with the ALLIANCE STATION WALL and/or ramp.
• In the MIDFIELD and in contact with the farthest BUMP.
• In the near ZONE and in contact with the nearest BUMP.
Daniel_LaFleur
13-01-2010, 08:46
3132 here,
Our team is wondering if we can carry other robots on top of ours. Anyone know whether it is legal.
Thanks.
As long as it's your own alliance, then yes you can.
Figuring out how to get them up there is a challange unto itself though.
What happens if a red bot is on top of a blue bot and the blue bot doesn't move for what ever reason? Is that pinning?
No. Pinning requires being held against a field element, the floor is not considered a field element.
Daniel_LaFleur
13-01-2010, 08:49
<<snip>>
Even if that still doesn't throw a flag, any contact with the second robot and another robot can only be in the bumper zone (of the bottom robot) and would likely garner one of the myriad penalties.
Al,
If this is how it will be called, then how is it possible for 1 robot to hang from another (suspended) without incurring a penalty?
What happens if a red bot is on top of a blue bot and the blue bot doesn't move for what ever reason? Is that pinning?
The two questions that this idea begs are:
If you're blue, how do you get the red robot on top of you? (Burrowing would result in field damage)
If you're red, how did you get on top of blue? (Pounce-bot?)
Love the ideas that these games spawn :p
The rules particularly note that robots should be built robust enough to withstand other robots falling onto them from the bumps:
<G38> (NOTE) ROBOTS should be designed to withstand the expected contact outside the BUMPER ZONE. For example, ROBOT designs should anticipate the scenario of a ROBOT coming off a BUMP and landing on a ROBOT on the green carpet.
Thus someone at some point is expected to inadvertently and unexpectedly carry an opposing or alliance robot, should both robots actually survive that scenario.
Al Skierkiewicz
13-01-2010, 16:40
Al,
If this is how it will be called, then how is it possible for 1 robot to hang from another (suspended) without incurring a penalty?
Daniel,
I was referring to contact between the robot on top and another robot on the field. It is perfectly conceivable that the top robot will not fit perfectly on the robot underneath and any contact with another robot would be outside the bumper zone.
DBortnick
13-01-2010, 16:57
The rules state that to be Suspended a robot must only be in contact with an Elevated and/or Suspended robot. The rules make no specification as to how that contact must occur.
So interesting question... Do you think that if my teams robot was suspended robot was incidentally touching the tower, would our team lose its bonus points at the end of the match?
Daniel_LaFleur
13-01-2010, 17:01
Daniel,
I was referring to contact between the robot on top and another robot on the field. It is perfectly conceivable that the top robot will not fit perfectly on the robot underneath and any contact with another robot would be outside the bumper zone.
Al,
I believe you missed my point. If a robot is to be suspended, it must sit on or grapple onto another robot. This action will (in most cases) be outside the bumperzone.
If the rules are called, as you stated in post 12 (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=898042&postcount=12) then the suspended robot will recieve a penalty for purposeful interaction outside the bumperzone.
DarkAndroid
13-01-2010, 17:15
That will be illegal because your attempt can lead to damaging another robot, no matter if they are on your team or not.
So I'd advise you to abandon that design
Sorry
1101010010
Al Skierkiewicz
13-01-2010, 18:19
Daniel,
Perhaps I mislead you. The interaction I am speaking of is not with the carrying robot but with another robot on the field should that contact occur. i.e. three robots in this scenario, the carrier robot, the carried robot and the contacted robot.
GaryVoshol
13-01-2010, 22:03
Al,
I believe you missed my point. If a robot is to be suspended, it must sit on or grapple onto another robot. This action will (in most cases) be outside the bumperzone.
If the rules are called, as you stated in post 12 (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=898042&postcount=12) then the suspended robot will recieve a penalty for purposeful interaction outside the bumperzone.
You only get a PENALTY for an action taken against an opponent. <G38-b>
vBulletin® v3.6.4, Copyright ©2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.