Michigan State Championships

[littlek050844]

I just figured it was time to start a thread on this competition. What are your guys predictions for the final matches? Who will be at the top of the rankings at the end of qualifications? Is it even possible to make these predictions with the number of good teams attending states? Please post your opinion.

[ExTexan]

I'm thinking we may see a little more seeding point finesse than we have seen all year.

Scenario assumption: No one really develops a perfect defense against 469 (or 51 or other loopers), so the alliance that includes them has a high percentage chance if their cycle gets underway.

If that scenario happens then their is a clear advantage to being seeded 1st and picking 1st.

We have so many good players, 217, 67, 27, 33, 910 and many others that I believe they will all be watching the qualifying match scores during the games much more closely to affect seeding points.

I think game strategy will be in play and I would hesitate to predict any further.

[kwotremb]

It will be ifun to see all of the positioning for the number 1 seed during qualifications. Some of the top teams will be scoring for the other alliance to try to help boost their qualification scores. It will only take 1 match like the 16-13 score in Detroit to help really boost one of the robots to the top. With less matches for each team, every match will be vital to obtain as many points as possible. Once the eliminations start, we will see some interesting ways to defend 469. I have a feeling unless they seed #1, they will be chosen first.


Hoping that we make it to the event. Sitting on the bubble right now, but with teams still having to play we might be left out. If enough teams are not able to make it (money/time) we can sneak in, but we might be left out this year :(

[Ryan Caldwell]

It should be interesting with the # of good teams. The strategies of the top seeds will really show up. Teams will be better able to assemble a true team instead of what we saw at most districts which was High scorer picks high scorer picks team left that has most consistently been able to move and run defense or interference in the close zone.

What do we need from a far zone bot?
- long kicker-clear the zone then move up
- clearer-clear the zone & defend a little
- defender-pain in the bot
What do we need a mid zone bot?
- assistant-kicks balls to close zone score 50%
- feeder-kicks balls to close zone
- looper-tower directly into close zone
- 469er-looper that scores
- anti469er-self explained
What do we need a short zone bot?
- sweeper-push in balls
- distraction-occupies D-Bot

The eliminations at states should be a good indicator of what we will see in Atlanta, I can't wait!

[Craig Roys]

With all the good robots there, I would expect to see a lot more of the 8-7, 12-10, etc, with fewer of the 1-0, 3-1 type matches. At least on Thursday/Friday - on Saturday morning, the defense may start to clamp down. I expect to see seeding points going through the roof. The top 3 teams at W.MI were above 200 pts (210, 214, 273) - I wouldn't be surprised to see seeding scores top 300...

That being said...I wouldn't be terribly surprised to see the opposite happen; teams battling in close, low-scoring matches. I'm more inclined to believe the first scenario.

[kwotremb]

I expect to see seeding points going through the roof. The top 3 teams at W.MI were above 200 pts (210, 214, 273) - I wouldn't be surprised to see seeding scores top 300...


Remember though if it was like last year, teams will play only 8 matches rather than 12. With that seeding points will decrease. I agree points per match will go up, but overall points could go down.

[Craig Roys]

Remember though if it was like last year, teams will play only 8 matches rather than 12. With that seeding points will decrease. I agree points per match will go up, but overall points could go down.

They will be playing matches Thursday from 3-7, all day Friday, and Saturday morning - I believe that they are trying to get 12 matches in. But you're right, if it is less than 12, points will go down. We'll have to start calculating averages.

[littlek050844]

I thought the teams were playing twelve each. Thats why they are starting qualifying matches on thursday. But either way seeding scores and co-op points will be through the roof. I think that hanging bots are going to be very effective here. With alot of good high scoring bots, 2, 4, or even 6 extra points at the end of the match could be the game winner. Watch out for effective scorers that can hang at the end of the match.

[kwotremb]

You guys might be right, forgot about the Thursday thing. I hope it is 12 instead of 8. With only 8 matches it does make it harder to get a true seeding of teams going.

[Clinton Bolinger]

FiM is trying to give each team 12 matches, meaning before nationals teams that are at the Michigan State Championship have played in 36+ matches.

As for the eliminations expect to see the Alliance Captain and 1st round draft of the winning alliance of the District events in the eliminations: 1918, 2645, 67, 910, 217, 469, 573, 2337, 51, 1243, 3357

Also expect to see the following teams in the eliminations: 1, 27, 33, 70, 201, 245, 247, 397, 494, 503, 830, 1718, 2619

As for seeding points expect teams to be fighting tooth and nail for the number 1 seed.

You will also see a lot more elevated robots at the State Championship then at any other regional or district. (Hopefully even see a double suspension!)

Teams will have new features and modifications that they did not have at their district events, especially autonomous programs.

Needless to say the Michigan State Championship will be one best events people will see all season, especially during the eliminations.

-Clinton-

[ExTexan]

As for the eliminations expect to see the Alliance Captain and 1st round draft of the winning alliance of the District events in the eliminations: 1918, 2645, 67, 910, 217, 469, 573, 2337, 51, 1243, 3357

Also expect to see the following teams in the eliminations: 1, 27, 33, 70, 201, 245, 247, 397, 494, 503, 830, 1718, 2619

Wow, I hadn't really laid out all the team numbers but when I look at those team numbers that is a long list of great teams. And there are others very close. There will be some great matches!

(Hopefully even see a double suspension!)

If you have strong verticals I predict an 8 pointer, 2337 elevate with 2 suspenders!:yikes:

[Dragonhawk]

.As for the eliminations expect to see the Alliance Captain and 1st round draft of the winning alliance of the District events in the eliminations: 1918, 2645, 67, 910, 217, 469, 573, 2337, 51, 1243, 3357


Thank you very much. I just hope to have fun and hopefully get into eliminations. It was a total thrill to even be in thirteenth after day one where we ended in 38th.

I am thinking that 1918, 1718 and 2771 are deffinately going to be in the final s and I hopr to be there with them

[ALTrammell818]

You guys might be right, forgot about the Thursday thing. I hope it is 12 instead of 8. With only 8 matches it does make it harder to get a true seeding of teams going.

And more difficult to notice the "Diamond in the rough" robots that don't get top 8.

I just hope we make it to states. I'm not ready for this season to be over.

[JABot67]

I can't wait to see the good 'bots from the western part of the state. I would have watched the webcasts, but Traverse City and West Michigan fell on the same dates as competitions my team was in. I can't wait to see what 1918, 3357, 1243, 2645, 2771, 107, 85, and 141 have to show us easterners with our infinite loops and whatnot. My prediction is that one or more of those teams will be in the finals.

1718... Wow. 273 seeding points. I am in awe. Looks like 2010 is their breakout year.

Finally, when talking about loopers, 1528 would be a great second pick. Paired with a good offensive near-zone team, they are just as good as 51 for racking up the points, except they don't hang. I think they'll be selected in the eliminations just for their ball deflecting capability, but they can also score and go over the bumps. Cool robot!

[Tyler Hicks]

State is going to be a great competition. I'm very excited to see other robots from the east side of the state. It's going to be a nail-biter.

[scarletrain]

I am very excited to see what everyone has to bring to State. :D

[Craig Roys]

1718... Wow. 273 seeding points. I am in awe. Looks like 2010 is their breakout year.


Thanks, that means a lot coming from 67 - we've been in awe of the quality product/team that you've produced year after year. We are extremely excited for states after the success we experienced in W. MI.

[Chris Hibner]

I'm going to make a prediction:

469 will seed in the top 3, and maybe #1 overall.

People are saying that they can't seed well because they need a good scoring partner. Well, it's the Michigan State Championships - what are the odds that they'll play a match without a good scorer? One match without a good scorer, maybe - but that will be it.

Given good partners in all of their matches, they'll rack up the big scores and seed at or near the top.

[BJC]

States is one week away!

As for predicting anything, its very hard to do so because basically all the teams going are really good and are worthy of being in elims.

I really think Michigan State might be deeper then Atlanta this year because Michigan teams are so good this year and the talent gets so spread out in Atlanta. Honestly, what are the chances that 67, 217, 469, 1918, and 33 (the top five teams in the state) get in the same division at nationals. Zero!

To compaire to last year the Michigan Champions were 67, 217, and 65 where at Atlanta the winners were 67, 111, and 971. These Alliances are pretty evenly matched and watching them compete against each other would be something to watch.

Basically, what I'm saying is that the Michigan State Championships is going to be absolutly amazing this year! (I'm skiping a trip to Florida with my family to go, thats how amazing its going to be!:p )

[maverickfan138]

It's possible to stop 469. Team 573 did it at Troy Athens:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FA0FSXlvf_Q

All it takes is one robot to keep them out of the tunnel. After this match, many other teams started doing the same thing and even though it didn't always work, it kept their score low. Every team in the elimination rounds did this as well, but 217 was good enough to still win. I expect almost every team to do this next weekend. It's going to be very interesting.

[BHOP]

I agree with the original prediction of teams in the finals:1,27,33,51,67,70,201,217,245,469,494,503,57 3,830,910,1243,1918,2337,2619,2645,etc...

but we will also get randomly seeded rookie teams and weird picking teams that don't make sense due usual luck of the draw, but also the messed up seeding system this year.

I think we will also see heavy defense and fights for ball control in the scoring zones because robots in elims will be good enough to not only play defense, but clear and maybe score balls from their far zone.

469 will seed first, but who knows from there. It's gonna be AWESOME, much better than championship. The winning alliance at the michigan state championship could easily take any alliance from the championship in ATL.

Also as a side note: when we(830) play 469 we will play 6v0. I don't see any reason not to. I even propose that if there is match with some heavy weights in it we should go for a 12 ball loop with 469, get all the balls at that side and rack up the highest score for the season at the toughest regional there is.

Good luck to all, see you on Weds!

[Chris is me]

It's possible to stop 469. Team 573 did it at Troy Athens:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FA0FSXlvf_Q

All it takes is one robot to keep them out of the tunnel. After this match, many other teams started doing the same thing and even though it didn't always work, it kept their score low. Every team in the elimination rounds did this as well, but 217 was good enough to still win. I expect almost every team to do this next weekend. It's going to be very interesting.

The teams that did this made a mistake, unless they had the potential to jump 469 in the rankings like 33 did.

Help 469? You get 25 seeding points or so.

Stop them with, say, a 6-5 match? (Optimistic) You get 21. If everything goes your way and your plan does not fail, which is certainly possible.

Pretty simple, really. 469 will seed #1 because other teams want to seed high too.

[Jack Jones]

It's possible to stop 469. Team 573 did it at Troy Athens:

Either I was at the wrong location, or they gave the big trophy to the wrong alliance!?

[maverickfan138]

Chris is me: Who said somebody would receive 25 seeding points? Nobody knows if a team is going to score enough balls on themselves to give them 25 points. It's possible, but still difficult. 573 and the alliance that beat them thought about scoring for them, but we decided that we could beat them, and we gained 22 points out of it. Not only that, but we also gained the respect of all the other teams that were trying to do what we did(not to mention that we had one robot down for the entire match and another down for half the match).

Jack Jones: It was a qualifying match. 573 didn't face 469 in the bracket.

[Jack Jones]

Jack Jones: It was a qualifying match. 573 didn't face 469 in the bracket.

IOC - I was at the right location, but at the wrong time. :rolleyes:

But you said you "stopped" 469, when you actually stopped the alliance of them and the 99th and 77th FiM ranked teams. No disrespect intended; you handed them loss. But I'll be impressed when someone stops both them and any one of a number of good goal scorers.

On the other hand, to all those goal scorers soon to be at the STATES: Please ignore what I just pointed out and recall that we beat the Chickens on pre-penality points - and that it wasn't we who DOGMAed.;)

[johnr]

The only problem with states is to many good teams get left out. Maybe they should go to a 10 alliance final. Or maybe... You start qualifiers early thursday, it is states and you should be ready to go, and at the end of friday you take the top 20 and pick alliances. Now you go 2 out of three all day saturday. You just play till there is a winner. The four remaining bots are back-ups. If a bot breaks they can fix it and move to the bottom of back-up list.

[Basel A]

-- State Eliminations
The only problem with states is to many good teams get left out. Maybe they should go to a 10 alliance final.

Here's an idea. 12 alliances. Alliance selection proceeds normally, 1->12, then 12->1

In the "First Round," the top 4 alliances get a bye. matches are as follows:
5 v 12, 6 v 11, 7 v 10, 8 v 9
Winners proceed to the Quarterfinals

There are now 8 alliances left, and eliminations proceed normally.
1 v (8 or 9), 2 v (7 or 10), 3 v (6 or 11), 4 v (5 or 12)

I think you get the picture. It allows more alliances a chance to make it to the final, with each robot still probably deserving it's spot in the elimination rounds. And it only adds 4 more matches to the schedule.

--Stopping 469
So, it was shown it is possible. The 573 match, 217's first match and Finals Match 1 showed that it can be done. Can we just say that it's hard, and that we'll see who can do it at States?

--Here's a crazy prediction
Top four at states will be the following (in order of team # because I'm unsure of who will be where):
33
67
217
910

[FoleyEngineer]

I like your top 4 (in any order ;)) However, I think you forgot one... 469?

[Karthik]

Here's an idea. 12 alliances. Alliance selection proceeds normally, 1->12, then 12->1

In the "First Round," the top 4 alliances get a bye. matches are as follows:
5 v 12, 6 v 11, 7 v 10, 8 v 9
Winners proceed to the Quarterfinals

There are now 8 alliances left, and eliminations proceed normally.
1 v (8 or 9), 2 v (7 or 10), 3 v (6 or 11), 4 v (5 or 12)

I think you get the picture. It allows more alliances a chance to make it to the final, with each robot still probably deserving it's spot in the elimination rounds. And it only adds 4 more matches to the schedule.

This was done at the 2006 Greater Toronto Regional. That year the event had 75 teams. The field probably wasn't strong enough to support those extra 12 teams being in the elimination rounds, but that wouldn't be a problem in Michigan. (In 2004 in Toronto, the event had 16 alliances making the eliminations. That was way too many teams and resulted in some very weak alliances.)

[Basel A]

I like your top 4 (in any order ;)) However, I think you forgot one... 469?

I called it crazy, right? I personally think they'll be defended better at MSC than any district they've been to or at nationals. Though I could be wrong. Some will also note a lack of 1718 or 1918, but I haven't watch them play at all, unfortunately.

This was done at the 2006 Greater Toronto Regional. That year the event had 75 teams. The field probably wasn't strong enough to support those extra 12 teams being in the elimination rounds, but that wouldn't be a problem in Michigan. (In 2004 in Toronto, the event had 16 alliances making the eliminations. That was way too many teams and resulted in some very weak alliances.)

Oh? Did they have to get specific permission from FIRST HQ? I don't see why it couldn't be implemented at MSC. And it would certainly make sense, if not by # of teams, by the depth of the field.

[Zach O]

I called it crazy, right? I personally think they'll be defended better at MSC than any district they've been to or at nationals. Though I could be wrong. Some will also note a lack of 1718 or 1918, but I haven't watch them play at all, unfortunately.

I don't know wether to agree or disagree with you. The defense on 469 will step up at MSC, but I don't know if I'd agree that they will not make it to the top 4. It's been proven (during the finals match at Troy) that even if 469 doesn't get into the tunnel, they can still win.

469 doesn't just have a good design, they have good strategy. I'm sure that no matter what, they will go out every match fighting, and I'd say they'd be able to pull out a win for the majority of times.

I can not, however, even take a guess of the top 4 teams. I think we'll have teams all day pulling in and out of the top 10, until finally one match will set a team of the rest. I'm sure we'll see the best of matches here, dare I say, probably even better matches then Nationals!

Congratulations and best of luck to all teams attending the Michigan State Competition!

[Basel A]

I'm sure we'll see the best of matches here, dare I say, probably even better matches then Nationals!

Congratulations and best of luck to all teams attending the Michigan State Competition!

Yeah, I'd like to reïterate this. MSC is going to be a great competition, not because of the venue or the location (not that they aren't awesome but..), but because of the teams involved. It's going to be great because every match will be a hard-fought match for every team. This is not a regional where a perennially good team can merely subside and still win (not that they aren't good but..). This is Michigan, where we have the best of the best. Every team are a challenge to play against. Every team could seed in the top 8. Every team can say, "They might be good, but we can be better." This is a competition that could come down to the wire in every match.

On that note, I'd like to wish everyone the best of luck this weekend at the Michigan State Championship. I look forward to having a fabulous time competing with you all. :D

[littlek050844]

The problem with the top four alliances getting a bye would be in the rankings. Those extra alliances get extra points for winning that first elimination which could cause a lower ranked alliance to get more points than a higher ranked alliance. Giving an extra match to lower ranked teams mess up the standings for national qualifiers.

[Basel A]

The problem with the top four alliances getting a bye would be in the rankings. Those extra alliances get extra points for winning that first elimination which could cause a lower ranked alliance to get more points than a higher ranked alliance. Giving an extra match to lower ranked teams mess up the standings for national qualifiers.

By FiM Rules Supplement Update 3 page 7, you only get win points for *qualifying* matches. It would, however, bring up the points from alliance selections and elmination-result points.

I would suggest that Alliance Captains get 24 for 1st, 23 for 2nd, down to 13 for 12th for Alliance Captains, then 24 down to 1 for picks in their normal order. Also, making the playoffs but not being a quarterfinalist might or might not be given points.

[johnr]

With the depth of field, i hope there is a double suspension. Oh, and if the planets line up maybe all six hanging/ suspended. That would take something like 2337 and 51 going against each other to start it off. Maybe a scout can post a match number were all six bots are able to hang for the people watching on the web and don't know every team. I wish there was some way to highlite the teams that can hang when the match schedule comes out. Something like just turn their numbers red.

[ExTexan]

I am also interested in seeing if any alliance pulls off the elevation and 2 suspensions. Both alliances? A lot of stars need to be aligned very closely. :yikes:

I am most interested to see the emphasis on Seeding points. Only one team gets to pick first and I believe that may be considered very important.

I hope to see you all tomorrow evening. If you get there early there is a high school invitational track meet at the Stadium next to the Convocation Center. I'll be watching my son run in a circle!

[Hatchinatore]

I don't know wether to agree or disagree with you. The defense on 469 will step up at MSC, but I don't know if I'd agree that they will not make it to the top 4. It's been proven (during the finals match at Troy) that even if 469 doesn't get into the tunnel, they can still win.

469 doesn't just have a good design, they have good strategy. I'm sure that no matter what, they will go out every match fighting, and I'd say they'd be able to pull out a win for the majority of times.

in the finals at troy we found it to be better to let 469 get into position. 33 cleared balls like crazy, we (910) were being passed balls by both 33 and 288 from the mid-zone and scored as well. our alliance did outscore them, however penalties resulted the match as a tie. as far as the last two matches, bees popped a chain, we had a control issue, then practically exploded in the last match, i'd like to say those two went better, but they didn't :) regardless, one of the funnest finals i've driven in.

what it comes down to is that there are multiple strategies to defend against 469, as well as there are for any other team. this year is great because of the strategies, there are just so many for every possible alliance. whatever happens in the qualifying and in the finals brackets, this competition will be one of the funnest all year, and i think the ranking scores will bobble between the highest seeds match after match until the end. a slight malfunction in our bots will send anyone flying down to the bottom of the list, so hopefully everyone can keep their robot in tip top shape. things will be interesting, and im confident that one of the teams that win this weekend may be seen winning at nationals in 2.5 weeks.

good luck to you all! i cant wait to compete!!!

[kwotremb]

in the finals at troy we found it to be better to let 469 get into position. 33 cleared balls like crazy, we (910) were being passed balls by both 33 and 288 from the mid-zone and scored as well. our alliance did outscore them, however penalties resulted the match as a tie. as far as the last two matches, bees popped a chain, we had a control issue, then practically exploded in the last match, i'd like to say those two went better, but they didn't :) regardless, one of the funnest finals i've driven in.

what it comes down to is that there are multiple strategies to defend against 469, as well as there are for any other team. this year is great because of the strategies, there are just so many for every possible alliance. whatever happens in the qualifying and in the finals brackets, this competition will be one of the funnest all year, and i think the ranking scores will bobble between the highest seeds match after match until the end. a slight malfunction in our bots will send anyone flying down to the bottom of the list, so hopefully everyone can keep their robot in tip top shape. things will be interesting, and im confident that one of the teams that win this weekend may be seen winning at nationals in 2.5 weeks.

good luck to you all! i cant wait to compete!!!

I thought you guys did a good job of stepping up and preventing them from getting in location right after auton. Then voiding that spot and letting them have it after the balls that made in auton were back on the field. That way the 2+ that went in during auton were not able to get into a loop right away. If they are in that spot and there are no balls in the loop its like a 2v3 match in your favor. If you have a guy sit there the entire match then its a 2v3 against you. Plus with someone like 217 voiding the far zone it gives the offensive bot free range in that zone for any ball that gets in there.

I think something similar to what you guys did is the best way to slow down (your not going to fully stop 469) enough were there is a chance to beat them. If 67, 33 or 27 are teamed up in the finals with a good close bot to push in the balls I think 217 and 469 can be beat, especially if 67 gets their hanger working well. There are probably some western/northern teams that I do not remember well that would make good partners like the NC Gears (cant remember their number right now) as well as 2771 for the close zone.

Wish we made it there so I can watch there awesome matches in person, but we were just outside. Oh well we learned what not to do for next year so we will come back even stronger.

[nikeairmancurry]

Is anyone aware of a match schedule yet??? I'd like too look up some key match-ups for today.

[kwotremb]

Is anyone aware of a match schedule yet??? I'd like too look up some key match-ups for today.

Just looked it up, matches are set to start at 3:30 so I would anticipate a list showing up closer to that time. Maybe 1 or 2 at the earliest, they do have to inspect all of the robots before they can release a list.

[IKE]

Q25 was a huge score.

26:12 means the winners got 55 seeding points!

[David Dawson]

Does anyone know if today was the first triple hang on one alliance?

[Tyler Hicks]

Q25 was a huge score.

26:12 means the winners got 55 seeding points!

That was an Awesome match :D

[nikeairmancurry]

Does anyone know if today was the first triple hang on one alliance?

From what I know it was.. I'm still looking for a triple hang of another robot!! We need 2337, 27 and 33 on the same side!!!

[Chris is me]

From what I know it was.. I'm still looking for a triple hang of another robot!! We need 2337, 27 and 33 on the same side!!!

2337 can't hold side hangers, last time I heard.

[nikeairmancurry]

Double Hang!!! 2959 hung on 2337!!! Finally!!!!

[EricH]

Close call.

From the video it wasn't obvious that 2959 was completely above the platform.


~
Being above the platform doesn't matter if you're suspended. All they needed was for 2337 to be above the platform.

[Ether]

Being above the platform doesn't matter if you're suspended. All they needed was for 2337 to be above the platform.

You are correct. My bad.

Nice job 2959.


~

[nikeairmancurry]

Close call.

From the video it wasn't obvious that 2959 was completely above the platform.


~

I dont believe the second robot has to be above the platform

[Joe Ross]

Was 67 DQed in a match, or is there another ranking problem? They show 11 matches played in the seedings, even though they've played 12 in the match results.

[JackG]

Finals match #1 just finished. It was the first time I've giggled from watching an FRC match. It was quite amusing watching 217 defending against 469. May I suggest that all drivers who will be defending against 469 have mandatory Pong practice?

[Ty Tremblay]

That first match was epic. 18-18. I think it really shows how important hanging can be. Michigan seems to have run away with the game this year.

[Mike Soukup]

Was 67 DQed in a match, or is there another ranking problem? They show 11 matches played in the seedings, even though they've played 12 in the match results.

They were DQ'd in match 108 for having multiple robots in the defensive zone. It was a blow-out and they wanted to score for the other alliance. Same thing happened to 1114 in Waterloo last weekend, twice.

[Ether]

Finals match #1 just finished. It was the first time I've giggled from watching an FRC match. It was quite amusing watching 217 defending against 469. May I suggest that all drivers who will be defending against 469 have mandatory Pong practice?


In the second match, 217 defended so well that 469 had to leave its post in order to get some balls into their alliance's goal zone. 67 got caught off-guard and missed the chance to block 469 from re-establishing itself at the ball-return. 469 alliance eventually won 15/13. Could have been a win for the other alliance.


~

[Ty Tremblay]

469, 1918, and 2834 win! What an epic final.

[Jared Russell]

I firmly believe that if red and blue were to play 100 more times, the record would be 50-50. What a great set of matches.

[Rick TYler]

Red: Ain't gonna be no rematch.
Blue: Don't want one.

[The Lucas]

Here are the 9 qualifiers for Atlanta based on rankings that they read off at the end of the webcast:
1718
573
2612
2337
226
201
308
1023
830

Great event with a memorable finals! Hope Atlanta is as high scoring and exciting.

[Karibou]

All I can say is WOW. I was on the edge of or completely out of my seat for the matches from the semifinals on. Amazing. Amazing strategies, amazing bots, amazing defense. 217 played some excellent Pong. And those matches were close. Breakaway at it's best, guys. Seeing the best teams in the state compete on one field as a spectator was one of the best things I've seen and done in a long time.

Congratulations to all of the competitors for their performances at both this event an others. Congrats to 1918, 469, and 2834 for their victory. Congrats to 67, 217, and 2612 for OUTSTANDING performances. Congratulations to 27, 33, and 503 for their Chairman's wins - such deserving teams! At this point, I don't remember all of the names or teams, so congratulations to: Rookie All-Star, Rookie Inspiration, Woodie Flowers, Engineering Inspiration, and Dean's List recipients. What a state championship.

And finally, thanks to the wonderful volunteers, who we can't live without [:

[Squeakypig]

:O <--Best way to explain the Michigan Championship Finals.

I don't mean to put any team down, but I honestly think this Michigan Championship just shows that we will be seeing 4 of them on Einstein. I can see teams like 148 and 1114 getting to Einstein...but no way without one of the Michigan teams there. Last year we saw a 3 Michigan alliance go up against an Indiana, Cali, and...Michigan. This year, I honestly wouldn't be surprised to see 5 or even all 6 teams be Michigan teams for the World Championship. I'm not sure what it is exactly but...jaw-dropping really. This is only our second year as a team and frankly we thought we made a bot that was outstanding, at least one that could be a 2nd round pick at states. For those of you who know who 2612 is (WMDestroyers) they were picked 2nd to last (2nd seeded team). If that doesn't put things into perspective as how good Michigan is this year I don't know what will.

For all of you non-Michiganiers, all i have to say is...watch out!

[Adam Freeman]

In the second match, 217 defended so well that 469 had to leave its post in order to get some balls into their alliance's goal zone. 67 got caught off-guard and missed the chance to block 469 from re-establishing itself at the ball-return. 469 alliance eventually won 15/13. Could have been a win for the other alliance.
~

Our strategy was to break the cycle and outscore them. We wanted 469 in the tunnel. If we would have stopped scoring, to block them from the tunnel, they would have outscored us outside the tunnel anyway.

[GaryVoshol]

As the alliances were being introduced for the QF's, I made this observation: The alliance of 2337, 226 and 2619 would be a good #1 alliance in any other regional in the country. They were the #8 alliance at MSC. That shows the depth of the MI teams.

[Adam Freeman]

They were DQ'd in match 108 for having multiple robots in the defensive zone. It was a blow-out and they wanted to score for the other alliance. Same thing happened to 1114 in Waterloo last weekend, twice.

That's exactly what happened. We were worried 1918 would score more seeding point in their matches than we would, so we were trying to get any many as possible in each match.

The alliance we were playing, switched from playing against us to playing with us during the match. The score was 10-0, when we decided to send 1188 over to score for the other alliance. We then started playing for additional seeding points also. I got too focused on scoring one ball, and told the drivers to chase after it (completely forgetting that 1188 was in there)...

I keep saying we will not focus on seeding points during a match, but it never seems to work. We will no longer worry about scoring for the other alliance, because it usually leads to bad things.

[kwotremb]

Anyone happen to know if any videos have been posted of the finals, or the eliminations in general? I was not able to watch them live, either in person or online and really want to see the awesome action. It sounds like 67 and 217 found some good ways to play against 469.

Congrats to all teams there and I hope some Michigan teams can bring a part of the World Championship back this great state!

[musicspeaks]

http://www.youtube.com/theglitr

Finals-Match 4 can be found here

[Btower]

Wow, what a year for FIRST in Michigan. Personally I saw another awesome years demonstrating what FIRST is all about. Ann Arbor District, Detroit District, Troy District and Michigan Championships. Awesome events, awesome volunteers, awesome teams, great people young and young at heart. But the attached pic tops it.

http://i834.photobucket.com/albums/zz267/Bentower/ed9e2a93.jpg

Four hours after squeaking out a win at the MI Championships and proving yet again they are a serious contender for Einstein, here's 469 team members showing true dedication to FIRST during the field teardown, literally climbing into an overloaded dumpster to properly dispose of the practice field carpet.

Huge thanks to all the teams that helped with the field set up, reset and teardown this year. I met a ton of fantastic and fun people we couldn't have FIRST in Michigan without you.

Thanks,

Ben

[waialua359]

469 is the best team this year. Not one-on-one, not by themselves, but as an alliance, the best.
They just proved that with any great team as their striker, they are the alliance to beat.

I cant believe how many great teams all at once are from Michigan this year.

Coopertition will definitely be the key in being the #1 seeded team in Atlanta, vying for the 469 sweepstakes.

Congrats to all.

[Gerdee]

Thank you to teams 469 and 2834 to help us win the gold medal

[Tyler Hicks]

Michigan State Championships were amazing. The finals matches were very intense, we had a great alliance. Thank you 469, for recycling all the balls we scored, that was a great system we had there ;) thanks to 2834 for being our near zone striker, you did great. We have the potential to make it to Einstein for sure :D

We were the Finalists last year, and now came out on top! Good Job to ALL Michigan teams, it was great playing with you. See you in Atlanta!

[Andrew Schreiber]

Ben, that isn't them helping tear down the field. That is Dan punishing them for every ball they missed in the loop. /sarcasm

No seriously, I cannot adequately express how nice it was to be able to share 469's practice space this year and how amazingly cool it was to be next to them in the pits. You guys have a target the size of a small country on you right now. Look out in Atlanta.

To all the teams going to Atlanta, represent us well. Last year the All Michigan alliance lost. Let's have them win this time okay?

Special thank you to team 2771 for picking us (oh, and that little thing about web casting the event). It was nice working with you guys. 1711, it was fun to play with you guys again here.

To the volunteers, thanks. Special thanks to Mr. Mike Martus for taking the time to give me a glimpse inside how 51 is organized. I really do appreciate it.

MSC was a ton of fun, I met a ton of people and learned a ton more.

[Ed Law]

Thank you to teams 469 and 2834 to help us win the gold medal

The elimination matches were some amazing matches. I hope we convinced visitors who came to watch that robotics competition can be truly exicting and fun.

Thank you 1918 and 469 for picking us. This whole weekend, our robot has been trouble free unlike Kettering and Detroit. We understand what the Maytag repairman feels like now. We had nothing to do between matches. We scored 6-8 balls on average each match but lost most of our matches due to a series of unfortunate events. We ended up ranking very low. Probably for that reason, all other alliance captains did not want to pick us. You guys saw what we can do and we really appreciate your faith in us.

I think we did okay in the finals sweeping up most of the missed balls that 217blocked. We did slow down 217 to allow 469 to cycle some balls in. One thing I have to say is that I am truly humbled by 217's robot. Do not try to get into a pushing match with them head on. Our center of gravity is very low and below the bumper. We weigh 119.5 lb with traction wheels in the front. 217 completely flipped us upside down with one push.

[J-Brock]

I think we did okay in the finals sweeping up most of the missed balls that 217blocked. We did slow down 217 to allow 469 to cycle some balls in. One thing I have to say is that I am truly humbled by 217's robot. Do not try to get into a pushing match with them head on. Our center of gravity is very low and below the bumper. We weigh 119.5 lb with traction wheels in the front. 217 completely flipped us upside down with one push.
You guys did a great job. yea, 217 is pretty tough but you guys kept them working at it! Great team work!

[Mike Soukup]

I don't mean to put any team down, but I honestly think this Michigan Championship just shows that we will be seeing 4 of them on Einstein. I can see teams like 148 and 1114 getting to Einstein...but no way without one of the Michigan teams there. Last year we saw a 3 Michigan alliance go up against an Indiana, Cali, and...Michigan.

I guess some Indiana team misplaced last year's Einstein trophy since it's sitting on a shelf in our shop in Illinois :rolleyes:

It was fun to watch the MI webcast this weekend. It's amazing how much more exciting the matches are as the quality of play increases. Unfortunately most of the country will never get to see Breakaway played at such a high level.

[ExTexan]

Four hours after squeaking out a win at the MI Championships and proving yet again they are a serious contender for Einstein, here's 469 team members showing true dedication to FIRST during the field teardown, literally climbing into an overloaded dumpster to properly dispose of the practice field carpet

Thanks for the picture Ben. It says more than a thousand words. It also captures Dan's and team's commitment to FIRST and the program far and above the robot competition. Every time I have helped setup a field, I believe Dan has been there. (Along with his claim to fame of helping Mike Martus show us how to bag a robot in the MI rules! :D )

My hat is tipped to Las Guerrillas!

[Tyler Hicks]

OVERALL MICHIGAN RANKS! GO 1918!!! :D

http://www.firstinmichigan.org/staticpages/index.php?page=2010_Results_Overall

[Wayne TenBrink]

First and foremost, it is a great honor and joy to be involved in FIRST. Whatever happens on the field

is secondary to the positive impact that participation has on everyone - students, leaders, &

organizers alike. Where else can you have this much fun learning about complicated stuff, doing hard

work, solving difficult problems, and trying your best to do the right thing?

This was a great event. The game has really developed as all the teams have gained experience and

gotten their machines in top form. The scores look more like something from the first week of Lunacy

than they did from the first week of Breakaway.

We played against some great teams in the quarters and semi's. All of them (2337/2619/226 &

70/910/2137) will do our state proud in Atlanta.

These finals were brutal - in a good, FIRST sort of way. They were four of the toughest matches we have

ever played in. Who ever expected to see an 18-18 tie? The strategy for 67, 217 & 2612 obviously

involved trying to keep us from feeding the loop, and they did a good job of it. Near the end of the

first match we lost comms after a collision and blocked our own goal. Near the end of the second match,

We tripped the 120amp breaker - the first time we ever did that. By then our drive motors were so hot

you could literally burn your hand on them. We called a time out, and in our haste to swap out the main

breaker and cool the motors before time expired, we forgot to change the battery. In the third match we

didn't have enough power to cross the bump. We thought we had fried a motor and were ready to call in a

backup robot until we realized that we hadn't changed the battery. In the fourth match, I just prayed

that we could still move. Thankfully, it did and we engaged in combat with 2612 while trying to move

balls forward and slow down 67. When it was over, our top shroud was mangled, and our bumper frame (1-

1/2 x 1-1/2 x 1/8 Aluminum channel) was bent in more than an inch, and you could fry eggs on the drive

motors.

Thanks to 469 and 2834. You are both great teams and we hope to have the honor of playing with you

again. 469 puts innovative machines on the field every year and it was a treat to play the game with

them. They deserve all the attention they have gotten this year (and the picture with the dumpster says a lot about their character and service). 2834 is a young team that will be

heard from again and again.

Thanks also to 67, 217, and 2612. You always set the bar high for the rest of us and make FIRST a

better, tougher place to be. I know that playing with you has made us a better team.

See you in Atlanta!

[LWakefield]

Thanks to Las Guerillas and the Bionic Barons. You guys were great.

[GaryVoshol]

I'd like to thank all the teams at the MSC this weekend. While it was a fast and hard game, it was the easiest event to ref this year. The ref crew having done over 2600 games collectively helps, but the most credit has to go to the teams. The experience gained by the teams over 4 weeks really shows in Week 5. Even though this event had nearly twice as many matches as a district, I think there were less penalties - and there certainly were far fewer yellow and red cards.

This event rivals IRI. (And that's not a put-down of IRI; I've really enjoyed working there too. It's another kind of equal good.) I haven't reffed FRC in Atlanta, but I can't imagine that it gets any better than being here in Michigan.

I hope to see everyone in some off-season events, and can't wait to see what you do to improve next year. Because each year gets better.

[mark johnson]

THE MICHIGAN STATE CHAMPIONSHIPS ROCK !!!!!!!!!!! Thats all you can say. The matches were great in quals, and even better in elims. But the four matches that both teams displayed for the final was nothing short of INCREDIBLE!!!!!!!!! All six teams should be proud of the fine preformances they exhibited. Congrats to 1918 ,469 ,2834 for the win ,and to 67 ,217 ,2612 for a hard fought runner up. Atlanta is in for a big awakening from the Michigan teams. Thank you to team 70 for picking us ,we would be more than glad to play on an alliance with you anytime. Your defensive play aginst 469 was awsome to watch, not only were you keeping them out of the tunnel but you were coming out to block there shots and at the same time clear the balls to us in our zone, AMAZING THING TO WATCH!!!!! To 2137 I cant believe we picked you up in the second, round because you were for sure a first round pick!!!! Our scouting team had you ranked number one for clearing balls , and you did a great job of that for us . It was a pleasure competing on an alliance with you and hope we can do it again sometime . To Dave awsome job as always at the MC. Were sooo spoiled in Michigan to have you do our regionals SALUTE!!!!!! Also to the refs ,judges ,and all the people that make this quality event happen THANK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Basel A]

The Michigan State Championship was amazing!! There were a lot of truly great moments.

To 469: I predicted you wouldn't be seeded highly and that you'd be defended too well. Boy was I wrong! I now absolutely believe there's no one that can stop you if you have a decent striker. Also, our auton that flipped you over was unintentional. Our programmer later said it was meant to have you wedge us into tunnel, but it didn't work properly, and you won anyway! It'll be fun trying to match you in Atlanta!
To 1918: I knew you might kill my previous prediction, but you absolutely surpassed all expectations. Kudos to a great robot from a great team!
To 2834: I've always admired your team, and your performance in the eliminations shows the true depth of the field in Michigan. I wish you the best of luck in Atlanta!

To 67, 217, and 2612: A great game played by a great alliance. Those finals will be hard to match, even on Einstein. There was everything from amazing defense on 469, and very, very good offensive play to keep up with the #1 alliance in a loaded competition. I won't be surprised to see any of you on Einstein!

To 2959: You made our dreams come true! I personally machined (with supervision, right?) most of our hanging mechanism, and you finally used it. Highlight of my day!
To 2619: Have we put our (gp) rivalry behind us? I didn't think so either! However, it was a nice break to be cheering with you, and our matches together were a thing to watch. Too bad the suspensions didn't work out, but we can hope for Atlanta!
To 226: You made a great alliance partner! Playing defense on 469 is never easy, especially with a robot specifically delegated to blocking you, but you did your job very well. We wish you the best of luck in Atlanta!

To 27, 33, and 503: I can't think of 3 teams more deserving of the Chairman's Award. You are exemplary teams that will continue to lead FIRST for the years to come. We can only hope to match your spirit and dedication. Congratulations and best of luck!!

To the volunteers that made it happen: I don't really know any of you, but you did a great job! From what I could tell, the event ran very smoothly, and there certainly weren't any major delays. I thought the reffing team did a great job. One can only hope that the national championship will be run as well.

Overall, it was a great competition, and I was absolutely delighted throughout. Oh, and did I mention? We're going to Atlanta!!!!

[Karibou]

To Dave awsome job as always at the MC. Were sooo spoiled in Michigan to have you do our regionals SALUTE!!!!!!
As one of my mentors commented, he's easily one of the best MCs in FIRST. I don't know how he has that much energy at the end of the event. Also, I enjoy the handstands [: Turning the filed UPSIDE DOWNNNNNNNN!

[Ed Law]

Thank you for all the kind words from 1918, 67 and 2337. I watched the videos of all the finals matches over and over again today. There was so much happening at the same time. I can only watch one or two robots at a time. Hence I have to watch each match more than once. All I can say was it was incredibly exciting no matter what the outcome was.

Thanks again to 1918 and 469. You had made our day. It was depressing during the qualifying rounds for us because we did everything right, scoring 6-8 balls per match and lost quite a few because of a non-working partner robot or unnecessary penalties. One of those matches was our own fault. We tied 217's alliance in that match but our driver accidentally touched the tower during finale even though none of our opponents were trying to hang.

Being a relatively new team, another thing I need to learn to deal with is partners grossly exaggerating what they can do, wanting us to follow their strategy and then not delivering what they promised.

I know this has been discussed many times before in other posts. We use student drive coach on our team. Our drive coach discusses strategies and negotiate starting positions with other teams. He is very capable in working things out with other teams and I almost never have to step in even when I was there. Last year in our rookie year, nobody believed he was a freshman in high school. I am very proud of him as his coach and as his dad.

[MishraArtificer]

To teams going to Atlanta who HAVEN'T seen any of the match videos from GLR/Michigan State Championships...

Michigan teams will
eat your souls.

You have been warned.

[johnr]

Thanks FIM for this incredible tournament. I hope some day the rest of the country will get to this point. Codered, once again a life saver for those that could not attend. Please, please get to IRI.
I wanted to compare other 5th week qual match scores to Michigan,but that just wouldn't be fair with so many great bots in one place.(i'm to lazy to average out all those matches) So i thought maybe the elims would be closer being you have the best bots playing and doing a quick glance it looked like Conneticut had the highest spread of scores across elims.
red - blue
michigan 10 - 7.2
conneticut 7.2 - 5.4
Michigan's low average score is conneticut's high and and our low would probably have beat their high except for that dq in semi1-2. I guess that isn't fair either,what's the chance of all these teams playing together again? Oh, that's called IRI.

[Mike Copioli]

Congratulations to teams 1918, 469, 2834. You worked hard and deserved to win.

1918: Your performance on the field was stellar. Even under the heavy defense of 2612 you never backed down. It is no surprise that you were the number one seed.

469: What can be said that has not been said already? How about this. While playing WITH you guys is much more relaxing, playing AGAINST you guys is definitely more fun. This is a compliment to your incredible performance and challenges you bring to the game. You guys raise the bar year after year making FIRST events much more exciting and successful. I am just glad you guys took it easy on us by not playing the midfield.

2834: A first round robot that was picked second round by the number one seed?...........Only in Michigan. Stopping the balls in the loop is no easy task. To stop the balls only to watch you guys shoveling them into the goal was PAINFUL. It was a privilege to play against such an effective defender/scorer. The lines between defense and offense have officially been blurred.

67: Thank you for picking us. We had what I consider the dream alliance. Three offensive robots. Your robot is as amazing as I have heard. Some day I would like to see it perform during elims. It was as if two different games were being played at the same time. Breaking the loop requires so much attention It felt as if we were all alone, that is until the end of the match when I looked up and noticed this "thing" hanging from the tower and a ton of points on the scoreboard. Adam, it was a pleasure finally getting the chance to work with you. You are all that Paul made you out to be and then some. I hope we get the chance to work together again in Atlanta.

2612: If I could only use one word to describe your performance that word would be dangerous. And I mean that in a good way. An 18-18 tie while we played "Pong" could only mean one thing, you guys scored, scored, scored!!! I wish I could explain how you guys made it back to the number 2 seed in the second round when you were in the top 5 on our list. If there was one thing that Michigan teams could improve it would be scouting. It was great to finally be playing together in the elims.

33, 1718, 308: You guys scared us more than anyone. I wish I could get video of that last match between us. I would like to actually count the balls that you guys scored in Auton to see if it was truly 0. I know there are bugs in the ball counting software I hope that these issues are solved before Atlanta.

Congrats to Alvin Carrols on WFA. I cannot think of a more deserving candidate. You are an inspiration to us all.

[Craig Roys]

33, 1718, 308: You guys scared us more than anyone. I wish I could get video of that last match between us. I would like to actually count the balls that you guys scored in Auton to see if it was truly 0. I know there are bugs in the ball counting software I hope that these issues are solved before Atlanta.

Mike,
After I talked with you I heard conflicting accounts of whether we scored in auton or not - I too would like to see the video. I don't want to take anything away from your alliance - you definitely deserved the win. We were very happy to have kept it close. Your defense on us was frustrating to say the least. Of course playing a 3rd match would have been even more fun! See you in Atlanta!

[flippy147852]

First of all, thanks to 469 and 2834 for joining us in our alliance. You both really shone in the elims and our win wouldn't have been possible without you guys.

Also, thank you to 67, 217, and 2612. You guys really made for the most competitive and entertaining finals ever and you have probably convinced my parents to come to every FIRST event as long as i am on the team.

With that said, I really would have liked it if the eliminations were expanded to 10 alliances. There were so many good teams that didn't even make it to the playoffs (830, 1528, and 247 are some that came to mind). To see these teams not in the playoffs really showed the depth of the field, but i would have liked to see these teams compete in the elims.

Just my $0.02