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vamfun
27-03-2010, 02:04
Ok... I give up. What is the secret of opening up a 2007 Victor 884 that has no screws on the bottom or top?

Seems like Innovation First doesn't want to make it easy to get to the circuitry like we could with the 2004 884.
sanddrag
27-03-2010, 02:08
Push and pry. It breaks the case when you do it, so you'd have to reassemble with glue. Also, the transistors used in it are not a real easy to find item if I recall.
Al Skierkiewicz
29-03-2010, 11:09
Chris,
A putty knife or some other long object inserted around the base will open the case. It is just friction fit. Be patient and don't try to pry open one side too far before moving on.
vamfun
29-03-2010, 19:34
Al,
Friction is a kind word... more like #%^$*& stuck for good. So I had to push and pry and of course several of the little black pins snapped off like sanddrag said but its open. I think Innovation First was out of their minds to save a little on screws. Now I begin the search for some 3103 Fets.
DonRotolo
30-03-2010, 18:58
Digi-Key sells them. There is an alternative number IIRC, try this post (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=379839&postcount=28)
Gdeaver
30-03-2010, 20:36
I have a 2007 victor 884 and it used Infineon IPP042N03L FETS available from digikey.
Al Skierkiewicz
30-03-2010, 23:33
Chris,
Maybe the FETs over temped and melted some of the case together. I have opened several over the years and didn't have that much trouble. Sometimes it is helpful to show a team just how much crud can build up inside on the robot.
vamfun
31-03-2010, 02:34
I have a 2007 victor 884 and it used Infineon IPP042N03L FETS available from digikey.

I finally got around to looking at these and they indeed are Marked 2n03L13 which translates to a Infineon SPI42N03S2L-13 based upon this spec:
http://www.infineon.com/dgdl/SPP_B_42N03S2L-13_040604.pdf?folderId=db3a304412b407950112b4271a7 43b94&fileId=db3a304412b407950112b4271adf3b95

So we only have 42 amps instead of the 60+ from the IRL 3103.

This shows up as an obsolete item on DigiKey:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?vendor=0&keywords=SPI42N03S2L-13

Also noticed the board is marked 883 Rev F.
Anyone come across a ckt for an 883/884 yet or are we stuck with generic ckts?
Al Skierkiewicz
31-03-2010, 06:38
They are wired in parallel for 126 amps each leg. Slightly higher series resistance.
Gdeaver
31-03-2010, 07:57
I don't have time to do it this morning but I believe the IPP042N03L G matches ok with the others. You can check the data sheet for the match ups. I believe I used these and they seem to work fine.
vamfun
31-03-2010, 13:10
I don't have time to do it this morning but I believe the IPP042N03L G matches ok with the others. You can check the data sheet for the match ups. I believe I used these and they seem to work fine.

Ok..lets compare (Vdss,Rds_on,Id)
IRL3103 30v,12mho,64 amp 2004 Victor
2n03L13 30v,12.9 mho,42 amp 2007 Victor
042N03L 30v,4.2 mho,70 amp Gdeaver replacement

So the 042N03L looks more capable and would make a nice substitute. But this raises a question: What constitutes a First legal 884?

AllElectronics is a few blocks from me and has a stock MTP75N03HDL
http://www.datasheetcatalog.org/datasheet/on_semiconductor/MTP75N03HDL-D.PDF

MTP75N03HDL 25v,9 mho, 75 amp AllElectronic sub

This might work too, but probably shouldn't be legal for competition right?
Joe Ross
31-03-2010, 14:40
So the 042N03L looks more capable and would make a nice substitute. But this raises a question: What constitutes a First legal 884?

I think per <R60> it wasn't legal as soon as the case was opened.
vamfun
31-03-2010, 15:09
I think per <R60> it wasn't legal as soon as the case was opened.

I'm with you there Joe. "shall not be tampered with, modified, or adjusted in any way (tampering includes drilling, cutting, machining, gluing, rewiring, disassembling, etc.) " Seems clear that disassembling for home repair makes your 884 a practice controller even if replacing with OEM parts. So we really might be better off getting a certified repair and saving a few bucks there if the competition supply is getting low.
vamfun
27-04-2010, 16:34
I'm with you there Joe. "shall not be tampered with, modified, or adjusted in any way (tampering includes drilling, cutting, machining, gluing, rewiring, disassembling, etc.) " Seems clear that disassembling for home repair makes your 884 a practice controller even if replacing with OEM parts. So we really might be better off getting a certified repair and saving a few bucks there if the competition supply is getting low.

Email response from IFI. So much for a certified repair:)

Chris,

If you have blown FET’s on your Victors, we generally don’t attempt to repair them. There are parts that have been compromised beyond just the FET’s and the cost becomes more to repair than to replace.

Regards,

Tom Watson

VEX Robotics

(903) 453-0820
sanddrag
03-06-2010, 00:37
Has anyone actually successfully repaired one? It seems there are large copper busses in the middle of the board, which sink all the heat away when trying to clear the through-holes. After giving this a try, I now know why IFI doesn't bother repairing any.
vamfun
03-06-2010, 01:45
Has anyone actually successfully repaired one? It seems there are large copper busses in the middle of the board, which sink all the heat away when trying to clear the through-holes. After giving this a try, I now know why IFI doesn't bother repairing any.

Take a look at this http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=380114&postcount=31

What replacement FETs did you decide on?
Al Skierkiewicz
03-06-2010, 08:18
Has anyone actually successfully repaired one? It seems there are large copper busses in the middle of the board, which sink all the heat away when trying to clear the through-holes. After giving this a try, I now know why IFI doesn't bother repairing any.

Sandy,
It depends on the damage. If just one FET or two are bad, the cost to replace probably justifies the repair. Common thinking is that anything beyond a simple FET failure has likely stressed other components to the point of being unreliable in the future.
I have had success with larger Weller tips using Mike Betts' method. However, I heat only the pin and remove it when the solder melts. Then I clean the hole using solder sucker rather than the wick. If one of the holes is still clogged, then I simply heat the new transistor pin as I insert it.