FRC Game Name Shorthand

[Greg Marra]

Hi everyone,

As part of the TBA v4 redesign, we're going to be storing which year's game a match was. For example, "Raising the Bar", "Breakaway", or "Aim High". This lets us handle games with different formats (4v0, 2v2, 3v3) correctly.

I'd rather not store a full English punctuated, capitalized, and with-spaces name. Having something that is all lowercase, with no spaces, and short would allow us to use the codes in URLs, file names, and other places where full English doesn't make sense. However, there is no standardized name for each game. FIRST has short codes for Events ("ct", "ma", "mn2"), but not for Games.

Let's come up with a standard shorthand to refer to FRC games.

2010 Breakaway
2009 Lunacy
2008 FIRST Overdrive
2007 Rack 'n' Roll
2006 Aim High
2005 Triple Play
2004 FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar
2003 Stack Attack
2002 Zone Zeal
2001 Diabolical Dynamics
2000 Co-Opertition FIRST
1999 Double Trouble
1998 Ladder Logic
1997 Toroid Terror
1996 Hexagon Havoc
1995 Ramp n' Roll
1994 Tower Power
1993 Rug Rage
1992 Maize Craze

-Greg

[Rick TYler]

No need to over-think this, just use the first three or four consonants in each game's name.

Examples:

OVRD
TRPL
LNC
BRKW

Consonants carry a LOT of information.

- RCK

[ATannahill]

Overdrive can be O/D or OD like what is written on gearshifts.

I would be happy just storing the game by year. 2010 instead of BRKW.

[Greg Marra]

I agree Rick, I just wanted to make sure that we settle on a set that makes sense. How do these look? Any suggestions for clarity tweaks? Consistently sticking to four letters seems like a good idea.

BRKW - 2010 Breakaway
LNCY - 2009 Lunacy
OVDR - 2008 FIRST Overdrive
RCKL - 2007 Rack 'n' Roll
AMHI - 2006 Aim High
TRPL - 2005 Triple Play
FRZY - 2004 FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar
STCK - 2003 Stack Attack
ZNZL - 2002 Zone Zeal
DBDN - 2001 Diabolical Dynamics
COOP - 2000 Co-Opertition FIRST
DBLT - 1999 Double Trouble
LDDR - 1998 Ladder Logic
TRDT - 1997 Toroid Terror
HXGN - 1996 Hexagon Havoc
RMPR - 1995 Ramp n' Roll
TWRP -1994 Tower Power
RGRG - 1993 Rug Rage
MZCZ - 1992 Maize Craze

[Greg Marra]

I would be happy just storing the game by year. 2010 instead of BRKW.

I think using codes is better in case there are ever two games in the same year, or we expand to having FRC and FTC and FLL games. Most of the time these won't be directly people-facing anyway.

[Tetraman]

If you want to add FTC and FLL, it might be best to have a system where your code first distinguishes between them and the game as itself.

As an example:
(Competition Type)(Game Number)

FRC01 would be the first competition game of FRC.
FRC14 would be Aim High, the 14th FRC game.
FLL07 would be Ocean Odyssey. It's the 7th FLL game.

[ATannahill]

I would think for simplicity all 2010 games would end with the same two numbers. Either with 1992 as 01 or with 1992 as 92.

[GaryVoshol]

I would think for simplicity all 2010 games would end with the same two numbers. Either with 1992 as 01 or with 1992 as 92.

But then you have to define the FLL year. For example, FLL Body Forward (this year's game that will be revealed in about a month) - is that 2010 or 2011? The majority of the games will be played in 2010, but some competitions are in Jan or Feb 2011, and the World Festival will be April 2011 in St. Louis. FRC on the other hand goes from Kickoff to Championship all in 4 months of one calendar year.

Greg, some of the suggestions you made are perfectly clear. Others have some unfortunate suggestions. For example, TWRP - my first thought is twerp, not Tower Power. Try pronouncing the word to see if you get some other unwanted words. I believe that Lunacy should have a U in it, perhaps LUNC, I guess just because we seldom put in a U when a vowel is missing.

[hg273]

I agree Rick, I just wanted to make sure that we settle on a set that makes sense. How do these look? Any suggestions for clarity tweaks? Consistently sticking to four letters seems like a good idea.

RCKL - 2007 Rack 'n' Roll


Those look great, save maybe for 2007. I'd go with RKRL instead.

Just my $.02

[Knufire]

=
TWRP -1994 Tower Power


TWPR seems more intuitive.

[J93Wagner]

Maybe 5 letters would be better since it leads to less confusion and is still much shorter than the normal, fully-spelled, name.

And in that case:

BRKWY - 2010 Breakaway
LUNCY - 2009 Lunacy
OVRDR - 2008 FIRST Overdrive
RCKRL - 2007 Rack 'n' Roll
AIMHI - 2006 Aim High
TRPPL - 2005 Triple Play
FRNZY - 2004 FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar
STKAT - 2003 Stack Attack
ZNZL - 2002 Zone Zeal (Didn't see a better way :p)
DBDYN - 2001 Diabolical Dynamics
COOP - 2000 Co-Opertition FIRST (Also didn't see a good way)
DBLTB - 1999 Double Trouble
LDRLG - 1998 Ladder Logic
TRDTR - 1997 Toroid Terror
HXNHV - 1996 Hexagon Havoc
RMPRL - 1995 Ramp n' Roll
TWRPR -1994 Tower Power
RGRG - 1993 Rug Rage (Also didn't see a good way)
MZCZ - 1992 Maize Craze (Also didn't see a good way)

Granted, some 4 letter acronyms are perfect and they can't really be improved just by adding an extra letter.

[ATannahill]

If we go to five letter I think LDLGC would be better for Ladder Logic. Otherwise it looks fine.

[Justin Montois]

For some reason, to me, the 5 letters look a little more confusing. I like the 4 letters better.

[EHaskins]

I think the year alone is the simplist to understand. If you're concerned about adding FLL/FTC/JFLL then you could prefix the year with the competition (i.e. FRC2010, FLL2007, etc.). As for FTC and FLL which span the new year, use the date of kickoff.

You could also make the competiton and year/game different fields. That would allow you to easily query for the FLL/FTC/FRC competitions/matches which happened the same year, assuming you had that data in the system.

Another thought, if you intend to add FLL data you may want to reconsider using competiton short codes internally, since the FLL events are both more numerous and also change from year to year meaning that there isn't a universal shorthand like in FRC.

[EricH]

FLL team numbers also don't stay constant. Trying to track FLL data by team would be like herding cats, 2004 game balls, and orbit balls combined, and then trying to sort them by color and type (and without damaging anything in the process). Can it be done? Probably. Is it going to be easy? Nope, no, and no way. Team name/school would be the best bet for that.

Just use something like FRC2010 for the game/year--and have a separate page with a list of the games, codes, and type (1v1v1, 4v0, 2v2, 3v3, etc.).

[Siri]

By Name:
If you go by game name, I agree with Justin that the 4 letter abbreviations seem neater/easier to look at. I'd also recommend standardizing 2 letters for the first main word in the name and 2 for the last. (Granted, there aren't always two words, but usually.) You do this for some, but others are a 3-1 split. Personally I find 2-2 easier to decode. For instance, to me:
BKWY is simpler than BRKW
RKRL simpler than RCKL
DBTB than DBLT
LDLG than LDDR
TRTR than TRDT
HXHV than HXGN
RMRL than RMPR
etc

It also seems that the first letter in each set is the first letter of the word, while the second tends to be the first letter of the last syllable (when applicable). For instance, Dou-ble Trou-ble. Just a semi-constant observation; don't know whether you'd want to actually use it.

I wasn't around in 2004, did people refer to it as "FIRST Frenzy" or "Raising the Bar" more often? I've heard both, just curious.


By Year:
If you do want to sort by (Competition)(Year), I suggest defining "year" as when the worldwide championship/event takes place. This makes the system universal, since they're--conveniently (or not)--all on the same weekend.

Of course, this doesn't fix the FLL team number issue. I'd recommend staying away from team nickname on that, if our FLL & VEX programs are any indication. By schools could work. Granted, our FLL teams shift schools, but then you're left with the (more philosophical) question "what actually defines a team?". Best stay away from that in this instance. ;)


just my $0.02 (nominal)

[Pjohn1959]

Either the set of 4 letters or 5 will work. I think that we can interpret both.

Greg, thanks for doing this. When can we expect version 4 to appear?

[Chris is me]

I like pretty much all of the four letter combinations, but I would rather use years. For example, a lot of people know of the 2001 game, but not its name. If expansion to other areas of FIRST was desired, /tbatv/frc/team/2791/2009/ would be easier in my opinion.

[StevenB]

I realize I'm a week late and something may have already been decided. But if not, here's my two cents:
I prefer using the competition/year format because it is simple and understandable to everyone. For someone who is new to FIRST and never saw or heard about Hexagon Havoc, "FRC96" makes immediate sense, but HXGN is undecipherable gibberish. I assume you're going to document it either way, so it will ultimately make little difference. Nonetheless, codes I can read and write off the top of my head are better than codes I have to look up. It also saves you the trouble of making up a new code each year. ;)

For what it's worth, I would year-stamp games based on when they're released. The FLL website refers to Body Forward as the 2010 game (http://firstlegoleague.org/what-is-fll/twocol.aspx?id=247), as do most teams.

[Greg Marra]

I suppose if a competition ever released two games in one year we could have XYZ2012 and XYZ2012B. One key thing that I want to distinguish is teams from games. FRC177 is a team, clearly, but is FRC2010 a game or a team?

[Chris is me]

FRC177: Team
2010FRC: Game

:D

[Joe Ross]

Or FRCG(ame)XXXX

[JesseK]

What about allowing numbers into the codes? FIRST has a habit of naming their games with some sort of numerical denoation (e.g. the FRC's below and then Quad Quandery in '07). Suggested changes in bold.

BKWY - 2010 Breakaway
LNCY - 2009 Lunacy
ODRV - 2008 FIRST Overdrive
RKRL - 2007 Rack 'n' Roll
AMHI - 2006 Aim High
3PLA- 2005 Triple Play
1FRZ- 2004 FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar
STCK - 2003 Stack Attack
ZNZL - 2002 Zone Zeal
DBDY - 2001 Diabolical Dynamics
COOP - 2000 Co-Opertition FIRST
2TRB - 1999 Double Trouble
LDDR - 1998 Ladder Logic
TRDT - 1997 Toroid Terror
HXGN - 1996 Hexagon Havoc
RMPR - 1995 Ramp n' Roll
TPWR-1994 Tower Power
RGRG - 1993 Rug Rage
MAIZ - 1992 Maize Craze

[JamesCH95]

Codes are good for people, years are less ambiguous though, so I might include both. I would list them in a more top-down fashion like this:

fll_2010_xxxx
fll_2009_xxxx
fll_2008_xxxx
...

frc_2010_bkwy
frc_2009_lncy
frc_2008_ovrd
...

ftc_2010_xxxx
ftc_2009_xxxx
ftc_2008_xxxx
...

This way if lists are compiled alphabetically they will be sorted out by competition (FTC, FLL, FRC), then by year, then a short code to remind the user what they're actually looking at.

Team numbers would be zero-filled with a "t" proceeding the team number, i.e. _t00095 or _t03333, to enhance sorting and to make it human-readable and intuitive. Underscores are great for human readability of these designations and would be clear characters to use for to facilitate parsing out names in code, skip all-caps for readability reasons, and zero-fill any numbers.

I could imagine typing in something like: frc_2010_bkwy_cxxx(competition code)_m078 to get information about match 78 in a particular competition. Alternatively: frc_2010_bkwy_t00095_cxxx(competition code) to get information about team 95 in 2010 at a particular competition.

Check out how US Digital does their part numbers, the part number contains all of the important information of a particular encoder and options very precisely. When I order a part from them with a very specific combination of options I need only give them a part number.

Just my $0.02

[Starke]

FRC177: Team
2010FRC: Game

:D

Using numbers to distinguish the year instead of abreveations is best for people that are not inside FIRST to recognize. For new people to the "sport" of FIRST, it is easier to distinguish by year.

[Greg Marra]

Here's what I'm going with:

FRC_GAMES_BY_YEAR = {
2010: "frc_2010_bkwy",
2009: "frc_2009_lncy",
2008: "frc_2008_ovdr",
2007: "frc_2007_rkrl",
2006: "frc_2006_amhi",
2005: "frc_2005_trpl",
2004: "frc_2004_frnz",
2003: "frc_2003_stck",
2002: "frc_2002_znzl",
2001: "frc_2001_dbdy",
2000: "frc_2000_coop",
1999: "frc_1999_trbl",
1998: "frc_1998_lddr",
1997: "frc_1997_trdt",
1996: "frc_1996_hxgn",
1995: "frc_1995_rmpr",
1994: "frc_1994_tpwr",
1993: "frc_1993_rgrg",
1992: "frc_1992_maiz"
}

Thanks everyone for their input! :)

[Chris is me]

Not to burst anyone's bubble too hard but isn't that the worst of both worlds? You now have to remember BOTH the year AND the shorthand for the game in order to make URLs manually.

[Joe Ross]

Not to burst anyone's bubble too hard but isn't that the worst of both worlds? You now have to remember BOTH the year AND the shorthand for the game in order to make URLs manually.

I agree with this. If it's desirable to support both, they should be separate and aliases for each other.

[Greg Marra]

Not to burst anyone's bubble too hard but isn't that the worst of both worlds? You now have to remember BOTH the year AND the shorthand for the game in order to make URLs manually.

I'm not anticipating these being used in URLs. These are basically only going to be used to know how to format the page for any given Match.

What situations do you think we might end up using these in URLs? This is definitely not set in stone.

[Chris is me]

I'm not anticipating these being used in URLs. These are basically only going to be used to know how to format the page for any given Match.

What situations do you think we might end up using these in URLs? This is definitely not set in stone.

I thought this was a replacement for the current year in a team or match URL. i.e. /177/2009/ changes to /177/frc_2009_lncy . My mistake.

[Greg Marra]

I thought this was a replacement for the current year in a team or match URL. i.e. /177/2009/ changes to /177/frc_2009_lncy . My mistake.

Nope, the URLs like that will stay the same. :) This is just so that the page template can know that Lunacy is a 3v3 game with a Red Alliance and a Blue Alliance.