2011 Game Hint #1 [Archive] - Page 2

BEEKMAN

21-12-2010, 16:57

I saw many of you have reminded the "train issue"
how about teams will have to work to work together in the "train method" just like in relay races, having to move a game piece from a robot to a robot?
maybe each robot in the alliance will stand on a different stair i.e on different heights?::rtm::

I like this!

How about different levels, with a pole (or tracks?) to climb to get to them. Bots are on different levels, and have to rely a game piece to them. Auto is at then end, and bots each start on a different level. You can move between them, or rely on your alliance?

Something like that maybe?

Robert Cawthon

21-12-2010, 16:58

Two points that may interest me:
1. Locomotion, by Little Eva, came out in 1960
2. Haagen Daaz, opened in 1960 - with Vanilla, Chocolate and Coffee ice cream.

Steve

I thought that Loco Motion was released in 1962. But whose counting?

Team#2057-Vegas

21-12-2010, 17:01

I saw many of you have reminded the "train issue"
how about teams will have to work to work together in the "train method" just like in relay races, having to move a game piece from a robot to a robot?
maybe each robot in the alliance will stand on a different stair i.e on different heights?::rtm::

this takes a lot of that and makes a lot of sense.. moving it from level to level.. knowing the need to get your robot up.. maybe there would be a ramp option too :D

dag0620

21-12-2010, 17:02

Two points that may interest me:
1. Locomotion, by Little Eva, came out in 1960
2. Haagen Daaz, opened in 1960 - with Vanilla, Chocolate and Coffee ice cream.

Steve

It would only be a matter of time before the GDC got Haagen Daaz invovled in a game:rolleyes:

jerry w

21-12-2010, 17:09

googling from another direction, another song of hers called the turkey trot brings up Little Eva right away.

People may say your some kind of a nut
When you're lifting your knees and you start to strut
But if your really want to get out of a rut
Do some turkey trotton' and all your cares will be forgotten

Come on let's Turkey Trot
Let's give it all we got

perhaps there are ruts on the field... or maybe knees are needed....

musicgurl1329

21-12-2010, 17:12

Extra points if you get in/out of the ruts on the field in autonomous mode?

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 17:13

c'mon guys...remember that the game has be accessible to rookies (which there are a record number of) and cannot cost FIRST a fortune (like leasing and hauling train cars into sports arena)

vic burg

21-12-2010, 17:13

I highly doubt that the type of colun is important. If it was, then we would have gotten a top or bottom. I think it might be that it is the fact that it is a column like it was mentioned before, from a dance studio. Also, a lot of photography studios have them, so it may have to do with the camera, also with it being balck and white. i think it plays to the camera thing. And since we have been using cameras the last couple of years a lot, I'm thinking maybe something like FLL has been doing with the cameras following a black line. So maybe something along those lines?

whcirobotics

21-12-2010, 17:15

What if its like this:

Usual autonomus and teleop, but the surface is made out of, rough material(terrain part), and there are bumps and right in the middle there is a stair-case like thing that on all the to its top holds tennis balls in a attached bucket, and we have to drive up to that center, with a arm of some sort, reach all the way up, and get the tennis ball and drive back to the alliance we are in and drop the balls in a bucket. And it has many different sizes or kinds of balls and different points for them. The team with most points win.

Just a thought :)

fr05ty27355

21-12-2010, 17:17

Has anyone check out the lyrics to Little Eva's song "The Locomotion"?
Some of the lyrics seem like instructions on how the game is played.

Little Eva The Loco-Motion Lyrics:
Everybody's doing a brand-new dance, now.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
I know you'll get to like it,
If you give it a chance, now.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
My little baby sister can do it with ease.
It's easier than learnin' your A-B-C's.
So, come on, come on, do The Loco-motion with me.

[Clapping.]

You gotta swing your hips, now.
Come on, baby, jump up, jump back.
Well, now, I think you've got the knack.

Wo, wo.
Now that you can do it, let's make a chain, now.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
A chug-a, chug-a motion like a railroad train, now.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
Do it nice and easy, now, don't lose control.
A little bit of rhythm and a lot of soul.
Come on, come on, do The Loco-motion with me.

[Instrumental break with clapping.]

(Yay, yay, yay, yeah.)
Move around the floor in a Loco-motion.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
Do it holding hands if you get the notion.
(Come on baby, do The Loco-motion.)
There's never been a dance that's so easy to do.
It even makes you happy when you're feeling blue.
So come on, come on, do The Loco-motion with me.
[ Find more Lyrics on http://mp3lyrics.org/pwfv ]

You gotta swing your hips, now.
That's right.
You're doin' fine.
Come on baby.
Mmm-mmm-mmm.
[Fade.]
[B]Jump up, Jump back.
You're lookin' good.
Mmm-mmm-mmm.
Jump up, Jump back.
Mmmmm, yay, yay, yay, yeah...

ke7qcl

21-12-2010, 17:18

Ok, also what about the triple conjunction between Uranus and Jupiter in January, also at times a train stop is called a railroad conjunction. We see a connection between the two planet names (they're roman) and the pillar, along with the locomotion. :yikes:

Peter Matteson

21-12-2010, 17:24

You have all missed the something I certainly thought the older mentors would have gotten by now.

Locomotion was covered by "Grand Funk Railroad" in 1974

GFR Bassist Mel Schacher was originally in "Question Mark and the Mysterians" proving that the GDC likes to mess with us.

Question Mark and the Mysterians biggest hit was "96 Tears"

Therefore the game is an updated version of "Hexagon Havoc" from 1996.

It's a logical progression I can't believe no one else came up with already.

dag0620

21-12-2010, 17:25

Jump up, Jump back.
.

If that was the case (which would be pretty cool if it was). That could easily tie into the titles of several of Bill's Blog Posts.

artdutra04

21-12-2010, 17:27

Potential clues from BB reference different levels and views from high altitudes.

Official game hint shows Little Eva next to a column. Biggest hit was Locomotion, released in 1962.

Combining these together, we need something that is related to trains, involves pylons, different levels, a view from a high(er) altitude, and incorporates the year 1962. This all points towards...

http://i.imgur.com/S5mSZ.jpg (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seattle_Center_Monorail)

Monorail! Monorail! Mono- doh't! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jF_yLodI1CQ)

Carolyn_Grace

21-12-2010, 17:31

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 17:31

This all points towards...

dont see how that would be much of a game...unless robots had to climb scaffolding on a single rail...that would be sick!

bhaidet

21-12-2010, 17:32

I like the idea of optional legs somebody mentioned earlier - it would go along with the "locomotion" theme but would not be restrictive to new teams.

This is also not a huge stretch from the clue (if we assume that "locomotion" is the intended clue).

I also read something here about a bonus pack to the KOP - could this contain a platform or the "muscles" or something to make a walking robot? I don't know if the lists are published or if they occasionally contain bonus items...

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 17:33

I solved it...it's a picture of a dead person...clearly FIRST has learned how to bring back the dead....heeelllooo....Zombie game. Arm yourselves appropriately. And don't forget to double tap and wear seatbelts.
FIRST Left 4 Dead...it turns out the GDC got lazy, and it was just gonna be a deathmatch tourney :P

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 17:35

I like the idea of optional legs somebody mentioned earlier - it would go along with the "locomotion" theme but would not be restrictive to new teams.

then presumably veteran teams would have a huge advantage? if i were a rookie team and i saw 50 teams with legs rampaging around and outscoring my alliance 500 to 1, i would be pretty discouraged lol

Peter Matteson

21-12-2010, 17:37

bhaidet

21-12-2010, 17:38

then presumably veteran teams would have a huge advantage? if i were a rookie team and i saw 50 teams with legs rampaging around and outscoring my alliance 500 to 1, i would be pretty discouraged lol

well, the legs may open up a new aspect to the game, like being able to grab the pole and flip up onto it in breakaway... that was an advantage to veterans but not too much of one - and it came with risks and complications. the legs would be a tradeoff.

I could almost imagine a game where each team consisted of legged and non-legged robots each with specific tasks, but that is COMPLETE speculation.

jmanela

21-12-2010, 17:40

Maybe locomotion in terms of other modes of transportation, besides legs. For example, maybe something like treads will be encouraged for the next game.

ghostmachine360

21-12-2010, 17:41

Just going to reference something Dave said before.....

"I certainly know my ears may never recover..."

Ears get stocked up when in the water. Another indication of water game.

AcesJames

21-12-2010, 17:46

So I was thinking about those pillars and mirrors....

Where are pillars prominent in Greek architecture, to go along with the Narcissus motif? Well, perhaps...The Acropolis of Athens?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Acropolis_of_Athens

The Acropolis was typically the central, highest point in a Greek city state.

Also, I thought, where in the modern world have we seen such architecture? Well, the picture of the Acropolis reminded me of a monument. Specifically, the Lincoln Memorial in Washington D.C... Conveniently located right across from the... REFLECTING POOL.

I see more of the Greek influence, and more of the mirror/reflection influence.

PingPongPerson

21-12-2010, 17:52

Well it won't be a water game

Mike o.

21-12-2010, 17:53

To add yet more confusion to the crazed discussion. The picture of Little Eva is used as the album cover of a compilation that was released in 2001. 2001's game included tall column like goals. Maybe yet another clue that this year's game could be a compilation of previous year's elements?

Just my 0.02

PAR_WIG1350

21-12-2010, 17:56

Well, the Loco-motion was released in 1962. Other notable happenings in 1962:
- An extremely rare grand conjunction occurred during the new moon and solar eclipse, including the sun, moon, Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, and the Earth.
- John Glenn became the first American to orbit the Earth
- the debut of the Hulk and of Spider-man
- The AT&T Telstar, the first commercial communications satellite, was launched
- JFK's speech at Rice (oddly, this is the 4th time that speech has come up for me in the past few months...)
- the first James Bond film
- Cuban Missile Crisis

Telstar was spherical-ish, but we've had a lot of spheres in recent years

PingPongPerson

21-12-2010, 18:07

I agree with Mike O. I think that the game may have something to do with previous games, because it is FIRST's 20th anniversary this season.

JasonTKahn21

21-12-2010, 18:13

so my thought is based off her studio albums along with the picture being reversed.... the game will take place in some sort of reversed position due to the clues "Back on Track" and the flipped pic. Also these reference trains... "do the locomotion" and "back on track" are both prominent train references so it may involve pulling something or a new style of drive etc. I don't know what i'm necessarily saying but this is just an idea. Also i can see the records being the shape of the game pieces used for scoring and the pillar either a game piece to hang off of in the end or to climb up. Almost like a competitive game where the first on to the top wins.

Anyone see any of this from the clue?

ivers123

21-12-2010, 18:13

I think it is highly likely the column refers to the game pieces. And maybe the lady grasping the pillar is signifying how the robots will interact with the game pieces?

Radical Pi

21-12-2010, 18:15

kinda something I'm surprised nobody has commented on yet. There's all this talk about trains/railroads, but nothing about a train itself. Trains have cars connected to eachother. Could this mean that we see the return of the 2009-style trailer?

maltz1881

21-12-2010, 18:16

The Locomotion is a song that usually when played starts a conga line...hence train. Maybe we have to latch on to our alliance partner in some way. I actually have no idea but I bet we will find out in 18 days well 17 days and 17 hours...but hey who is counting!!!

bhaidet

21-12-2010, 18:18

I don't think any game would be a race or other zero-interaction game because any good game they make, if it is to be competitive and repeatable, should have an aspect of impeding your opponent.
It would be pretty boring to watch a bunch of robot races, see teams getting consistent numbers (times), and be able to predict the outcome of the regional before the alliances have been chosen.

JohnFogarty

21-12-2010, 18:23

I means we'll have trailers again...like in Lunacy. NOOOOOOOOOO. okay that was a informed guess. Locomotion kindof gave me that idea. It's Little Eva...i can't believe i'm saying this but 4chan agrees.

bearjcc

21-12-2010, 18:30

From my experience with game hints, everybody looked way in to the picture more than could ever be expected, but yet that IS what is expected from the game committee :). My guess is that the two important things are the date of the picture and the pole. What kind of pole does not matter, just, a pole. The date, why the date you ask? Well it could be referring to something in our past, or that the game will involve elements from FIRST's past.

JaneYoung

21-12-2010, 18:30

It's a logical progression I can't believe no one else came up with already.

Wait, we have to be logical?

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 18:31

it's a clue to a multi dimensional game. put on your 3D glasses...you'l be blown away

jk

SealedSeven

21-12-2010, 18:35

Did anyone post yet that the picture is Flipped?

whcirobotics

21-12-2010, 18:37

Did anyone post yet that the picture is Flipped?

Yes

Tyler Hicks

21-12-2010, 18:37

Did anyone post yet that the picture is Flipped?

Yes, it's been mentioned. But good observation.

SealedSeven

21-12-2010, 18:38

Yes, it's been mentioned. But good observation.

Alrighty then,

Yea, i dont have time to go through this whole topic XD

Tyler Hicks

21-12-2010, 18:40

Alrighty then,

Yea, i dont have time to go through this whole topic XD

I don't think any of us do...but I can't wait for the next clue :D

r2davis2

21-12-2010, 18:42

I think its gonna be the gamepiece on a rail, something like a mine cart that acts similar to tug of war, the "jump up jump back" part of the song, just my wild idea, though it makes a little sense

Edit- ooh 294th post teehee

Tyler Hicks

21-12-2010, 18:45

The game piece is still a mystery....I'm going to assume it's not a ball.

SealedSeven

21-12-2010, 18:45

kgzak

21-12-2010, 18:49

I didn't see anyone mention this:
The goals are on wheels and we can attach to them (like a train)? People have wanted movable goals :rolleyes:

r2davis2

21-12-2010, 18:51

Did you get that Idea while playing Team Fortress 2? XD

no sir never played it

JaneYoung

21-12-2010, 18:52

I didn't find an Acropolis but I found an Astropolis earlier. A book written in 2009 about The Grand Conjunction. (I think). Anyway when searching for it again, I came across this (http://muppet.wikia.com/wiki/The_Great_Conjunction).

acrease77

21-12-2010, 18:52

idk if anyone said this but the locomotion is a line dance, and they say "lets form a chain now"
,ay have to form a line to pass something from one bot to another?

GGCO

21-12-2010, 18:53

The game piece is still a mystery....I'm going to assume it's not a ball.

Yeah, I really liked the idea of disks or "albums" being stacked on a pole which was mentioned on page 2 or 3. Then someone went ahead and posted the lyrics.... and now we're talking about planets and craziness!

Anyways, do you know if FIRST will acknowledge/explain the clue post-kickoff?

Tom Ore

21-12-2010, 19:02

"Little Eva" is also an area in Western Australia with gold and copper deposits. A Penn tennis ball may be the "gold". Some sort of mining game maybe...

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 19:02

we're getting tired arent we?/ it's been nine minutes!

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 19:03

"Little Eva" is also an area in Western Australia with gold and copper deposits. A Penn tennis ball may be the "gold". Some sort of mining game maybe...

what are the chances?...

GGCO

21-12-2010, 19:13

"Little Eva" is also an area in Western Australia with gold and copper deposits. A Penn tennis ball may be the "gold". Some sort of mining game maybe...

Really far fetched, but any thing is possible at this point.

hihi11111

21-12-2010, 19:15

so i have been reading this thread all day haha and what i think the game might be your bot is a train and you go around picking up things (tennis ball sized) and put it into your cart , but you have more then one cart attached to you. the one thats closer to you you get points but the one farther away oponents can put items into to take points away.

though this is an odd idea this game i know will be definely fun!

18 days!!

flippy147852

21-12-2010, 19:23

OK, from spending the last hour reading this entire thread front to back, this is what I think:

1. Locomotion will be the name of the game
2. Robots will attempt to move game pieces (tennis balls?) along a series of predetermined paths to goals that turn on/off. Robots will have to choose the right path to reach the right goal before the goal changes status.
3. The only water in this game will be in bottles. :(
4. The endgame will involve changing levels (hanging?)

Just my $0.02

r2davis2

21-12-2010, 19:28

Basel A

21-12-2010, 19:29

Guys, you're missing something here..
The picture has a person in it; doesn't matter who it is
because all people have some things in common.
For example, all people are roughly 70% water..
So I propose the field will be covered by water 70%. Final 30% will probably be some sort of carpet..
But regardless, water game!

r2davis2

21-12-2010, 19:34

davidthefat

21-12-2010, 19:43

Is it Diana Ross? My team captain thinks so

D.Allred

21-12-2010, 19:45

Wow. More than 300 posts already. I guess everyone was desperate for a hint.

I think the Loco-Motion theme is still the front runner so far, although the game could still be anything. The theme does seem to fit the "Penn" Station theory from the Red Herring thread.

The Loco-Motion is a great song. How about dancing robots! (Come on hipsterjr ... "Your bot can score, but can it dance!")

You know, choreographed back up singers were a big deal in the 60's. Hmm... Co-opertition anyone?

jblay

21-12-2010, 19:48

The song locomotion was featured in the 1993 film Matinee staring John Goodman. John Goodman was in the 2009 film Beyond All Boundaries starring Kevin Bacon.

This years game piece is Kevin Bacon. Only one will be put in each team's kop.

Basel A

21-12-2010, 19:48

It's absolutely Little Eva. De-flipped, uncropped picture here (http://www.spectropop.com/gallery/v/Girls/Various/Little+Eva.jpg.html)

davidthefat

21-12-2010, 19:49

It's absolutely Little Eva. De-flipped, uncropped picture here (http://www.spectropop.com/gallery/v/Girls/Various/Little+Eva.jpg.html)

Oh Ok Then, not Diana Ross

andreboos

21-12-2010, 20:09

This years game piece is Kevin Bacon. Only one will be put in each team's kop.

Does using Kevin Bacon in a robot increase one's Bacon Number?

Clourchn07

21-12-2010, 20:11

After reading the enitre thread, all 21 pages!
First off: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Little_Eva
Then http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncle_Tom%27s_Cabin#Eva

The Eva in uncle tom's cabin talks about drowning, So Water Game!

But all jokes aside:
The picture is reversed, today is the winter solstice the clock gets reversed, today is 12/21 which is reversed, and this is '11 which is reversed!
The autonomous is at the end or the game switches or reverses some how, maybe like the offense defense in Aim High

I like the idea of the bonus for the robot locomotion limbs, just note the pnuematic muscle only contracts about two inches at 60 psi

I also like the idea of a second elevated field, maybe something to pull back and forth for a multiplier or release, mini robots on top, or an overhead railway system

Whatever the game is and whatever this hint means, I am now very excited for the new season!

Only 18 more days and a few really long speeches until we know if we were right!

Edit: I just missed number 316 my team's number!

DonRotolo

21-12-2010, 20:16

After reading the enitre thread, all 21 pages!
You are a better person than I. I'm simply unwilling to read all that.

From past years' experience: The "best" hit on what the hint means has always come in the first three pages pf CD posts. Everything after that does not get any better. Therefore, I'm sticking to the first 3 5 pages of posts; i.e., Locomotion.

By the way, what is the etymology of Locomotion? Anything to do with the Spanish word "loco"? :p

spartan058

21-12-2010, 20:17

Maybe it has something to do with the UN declaring that 2011 will be International year of Forests, and International year of Chemistry?

Or maybe it's related to Uncle Tom's Cabin somehow? Little Eva is the name of a character from Uncle Tom's Cabin, and the performer who's in the pic had the stage name of Little Eva...

JaneYoung

21-12-2010, 20:21

From past years' experience: The "best" hit on what the hint means has always come in the first three pages pf CD posts. Everything after that does not get any better. Therefore, I'm sticking to the first 3 pages of posts; i.e., Locomotion.

We weren't even warmed up at page 3. You're missing all the good stuff.

Jane

PAR_WIG1350

21-12-2010, 20:33

no no no the other 30% of the game is flying

Are you implying that we are all full of hot air, because you might be on to something there.:]

Karibou

21-12-2010, 20:33

The picture is reversed, today is the winter solstice the clock gets reversed, today is 12/21 which is reversed, and this is '11 which is reversed!
I don't know if I can believe that to be a coincidence.

synth3tk

21-12-2010, 20:35

We weren't even warmed up at page 3. You're missing all the good stuff.

Jane
In fact, that's when we found the initial info.

EricH

21-12-2010, 20:38

I don't know if I can believe that to be a coincidence.
Reverse Robotics. Fastest team to unscore the entire 2004 game, starting on the bar, wins. And by unscore, I mean put the field back to the way it looked at the start of the game.

Then the field crew gets to "reset" the entire game.

torihoelscher

21-12-2010, 20:40

http://www.usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/content.aspx?id=18713

Go crazy.

You know we already are! :) Talk to you soon! :P

jyh947

21-12-2010, 20:41

Haagen Dazs-Began in 1961
Little Eva's Locomotive- Released in 1962
1961-Fifty years before 2011.

Anyone wanna do more research about 1961?

synth3tk

21-12-2010, 20:42

Reverse Robotics. Fastest team to unscore the entire 2004 game, starting on the bar, wins. And by unscore, I mean put the field back to the way it looked at the start of the game.

Then the field crew gets to "reset" the entire game.
Consider my mind blown. ::rtm::

davidthefat

21-12-2010, 20:51

Little Eva -> Uncle Tom's Cabin -> Civil War + Water -> Uss Monitor v Css Virginia -> Iron clad Game

DonRotolo

21-12-2010, 20:55

We weren't even warmed up at page 3. You're missing all the good stuff.I won't do it, I won't. I have more important things to .... (ooh! Squirrel!) :ahh:

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 20:59

Little Eva -> Uncle Tom's Cabin -> Civil War + Water -> Uss Monitor v Css Virginia -> Iron clad Game
WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THIS THREAD!!!! :D

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 21:01

Anyone wanna do more research about 1961?
well yuri gagarin is the obvious thing that pops into my mind

Grim Tuesday

21-12-2010, 21:12

My theory revolves around the concept of the picture being reversed, or mirrored. I may or may not have gone a bit overboard on it, but whatever.

OK, so there are two types of symmetry: Rotational and Reflective. While working with videogames, I have discovered a fine example of the two: The game Team Fortress 2, which I map for.

Anyways, every FRC game so far has had both types of symmetry, which while fair, is a bit boring. Enter stage left my hand dandy drawing. I didnt feel like making all other games, but trust me, they are all rotated, and have both types of symmetry.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6865197/Code%20Red/FRCGames.jpg

In my time working with TF2, I discovered a different type of symmetry: The reflection, which reflects the base over a line of symmetry.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6865197/Code%20Red/Rotational.jpg
This is an example of rotational (only) symmetry. It allows someone on the red team to turn left at the exact same place that a member of the blue team turns left on their side. This allows people to only have to memorize half the field, or map in this case. Note the crossing arrows. If someone wants to go to the opposite identical portion of the field, then they must cross fully through the middle.

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6865197/Code%20Red/ReflectionalS.jpg
This on the other hand, is reflectional symmetry. Both sides are reflected over the axis. If one team's player turns left, then the other right, and vise versa. It allows for a slightly more dynamic gameplay, possibly for the sole reason that it is not the norm. It is just different, and although one may not realize it, it will create a very different game.

Now, you may say, how may this apply to FIRST, how could they make a reflectively symmetrical field? It would also allow them to use angled elements, something that is not possible in a rotationally symmetrical game. It should also be notes that it is quite hard to make a game piece through the LOS in a reflectively symmetrical field.
My example of a field in this type:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6865197/Code%20Red/Possibility.jpg

Anyways, Food for Thought.

Other possibilities of the reflection:

-Light based game

-Red herring

-It was simply there to stop people from reverse searching it

-"Competitive co-op" There is a mirror across the field, and your team races vs the other team to complete an objective that doesn't require contact.

r2davis2

21-12-2010, 21:13

WHAT HAS HAPPENED TO THIS THREAD!!!! :D
about 8 straight hours of posting every few seconds

JaneYoung

21-12-2010, 21:18

I won't do it, I won't. I have more important things to .... (ooh! Squirrel!) :ahh:

Don,
Just get a nice big box of chocolate-covered maraschino cherries and a cup of coffee and settle yourself down for a fun read. You'll be amazed at the ideas that you are going to have pop into your head.

Jane

lmgarg5

21-12-2010, 21:18

HER MIDDLE NAME IS NARSSASIS THAT IS ALSO THE NAME OF A GREEK LEGEND IN WHICH A MAN IS SO PREOCUPIED WITH HIMSELF HE ALWAYS CARRIES A MIRROR...ALSO THE IMAGE IS FLIPPED (LIKE A MIRROR IMAGE) LASTLY SHE IS LEANING ON A COLUMN COLUMNS=GREEK :D

dag0620

21-12-2010, 21:23

The thing I think I'm going to say is everyone should probably sleep on this! (If your not going to sleep soon you should, the time for little sleep will come in 18 days).

Closing thoughts for the day until I resume alot of thinking and discussion tommrow.

- Locomotion, must be involved with the name, or uses some sort of train.

- The Pillar, I know alot of people are putting it aside, but I don't know guys, I feel like it has some importance.

- Wackiest clue yet - Probably, my intial reactions was pretty off.

We have alot to consider, but hopefully the next hint will clarify things. As I said before, I look forward to going back after the 8th and seeing how right or wrong we all were.

oh and I wish I had a round table going tonight ... darn :P

PAR_WIG1350

21-12-2010, 21:23

Nobody has mentioned beehives. We must be out of practice with our over-analysis.

Yes, I searched the thread

Grim Tuesday

21-12-2010, 21:30

Nobody has mentioned beehives. We must be out of practice with our over-analysis.

Yes, I searched the thread

What about them?

I think we should list everything we haven't mentioned. Just in case we miss something.

davidthefat

21-12-2010, 21:36

Im still going with the Iron Clad idea... Mirror = Split right in the middle. So the Union and the Confederacy was split in the middle. Some one mentioned Eva being a character in Uncle Tom's Cabin that thought of drowning. Water + Civil war = Iron clad. Loco motion is railroads, that is how the Union won, with rail roads. 1962 = 100 + 1862, the second year of the civil war. Pillar = holding the house up. Without unity, the Union will ultimately fail.

JaneYoung

21-12-2010, 21:39

Nobody has mentioned beehives. We must be out of practice with our over-analysis.

Yes, I searched the thread

That's not a beehive, it is more along the lines of a poof.

IndySam

21-12-2010, 21:41

maltz1881

21-12-2010, 21:42

Haagen Dazs-Began in 1961
Little Eva's Locomotive- Released in 1962
1961-Fifty years before 2011.

Anyone wanna do more research about 1961?

I was born!! OOPS.. Did I say that?? I will deny that..My 26 year old son still believes that I am 29!!!:eek:

Grim Tuesday

21-12-2010, 21:46

This is when these threads become useless.

People start posting things that have already been posted because they don't have the common courtesy to read first, or even try a simple search.

Oh well, see you after the next hint.

Hey I read it all. I hope noone mentioned my mirror idea that I missed.

Someone should really do a compilation thread (note, seperate thread where the top post is updated with the latest info) Maybe il do it tomorow.

Dragon Princess

21-12-2010, 21:58

c'mon guys...remember that the game has be accessible to rookies (which there are a record number of) and cannot cost FIRST a fortune (like leasing and hauling train cars into sports arena)

they don't need to rent real train carts, they could just have boxes that they put onto prefabricated 'train cart' chassis

Karibou

21-12-2010, 21:59

Hey I read it all. I hope noone mentioned my mirror idea that I missed.

Someone should really do a compilation thread (note, seperate thread where the top post is updated with the latest info) Maybe il do it tomorow.
I doubt that there will be much of an update to be posted after today. Really, all of the points mentioned in this thread were mentioned at least twice. Most things were mentioned 3 or more times.

(however, I did type up a brief summary that I posted on Facebook for a few friends that hit the main points. If anyone wants it, let me know)

Bochek

21-12-2010, 22:05

Just to stir up the thoughts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQYD5TVCGlY

Luke3161

21-12-2010, 22:06

Hi,
Here are my thoughts about the game in descending order of likelihood.

A water game is completely unreasonable because these robots cost several thousand dollars. Frying a CRIO is not something FIRST wants to be responsible for. Also, with robots getting wet, water would get all over the pits, field and competition area in general. Again, there are things like cameras, computers and other expensive electronics FIRST will not want to replace.

Irregular terrain on the field. This was already seen last year, and played a big role in the success of teams who were able to work together and maneuver easily. This kind on small irregularity on the field is likely to appear again to "appease the crowd" (think of robots flipping). Also, it ties into to new drive trains and helping rookie teams have just as fresh a start as the other teams. I do not think there will be multiple floors, but maybe a small raised area maybe a foot or so off the general playing field level. Perhaps partly with a cliff type area and a ramp for entrance.

Tennis balls being used as game pieces. They are cheap and available everywhere. This would be especially good for rookie teams who have not done a lot of fundraising or have few sponsors. It ties in with FIRST's drive for more teams with the paying for registration and such.

Moving game pieces. There have not been independently moving pieces ever from what I can see, and I do not think that those will be introduced because they would be prone to breaking, especially with the forces made by the 120 pound robots, so I would rule out trains or moving carts. However, I think it is within reason to have buckets or trolleys which could be moved or pushed by the robots, potentially with tennis contained to score points.

Chris Fultz

21-12-2010, 22:21

It was an image reversed... So basically what we saw was not reality.

But how do you know the GDC reversed the image. Maybe the original was reversed, and the GDC put it back the way it was supposed to be?

gorillamonky

21-12-2010, 22:29

the tennis ball was not a real game hint right?

Karibou

21-12-2010, 22:35

But how do you know the GDC reversed the image. Maybe the original was reversed, and the GDC put it back the way it was supposed to be?

I think that we have to assume that the picture on the album cover is in the correct orientation. One of the first things that we learned in journalism regarding photos is that you NEVER flip photos, ever. When you flip photos, all of the sudden person X writes with their right hand instead of their left. I think the same is probably true for this situation.

Edit: This (http://www.spectropop.com/gallery/d/1303-2/Little+Eva.jpg) seems to be the image that was flipped, in higher quality. The top cuts off at approximately the same spot on both pictures.

Whateveryousay

21-12-2010, 22:52

Just to stir up the thoughts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQYD5TVCGlY

This is something that I am interested in, FIRST has been trying to tie it with sports, and this is definitly something that we want to look at.

Gir_450

21-12-2010, 23:04

I think that we have to assume that the picture on the album cover is in the correct orientation. One of the first things that we learned in journalism regarding photos is that you NEVER flip photos, ever. When you flip photos, all of the sudden person X writes with their right hand instead of their left. I think the same is probably true for this situation.

Edit: This (http://www.spectropop.com/gallery/d/1303-2/Little+Eva.jpg) seems to be the image that was flipped, in higher quality. The top cuts off at approximately the same spot on both pictures.

Our programers found this picture and IT IS indeed reversed, the GDC is messing with us again this year on this one. :ahh:

BACONDUDE1902

21-12-2010, 23:12

i think the name of the game well be "The Loco-Motion":yikes:

http://www.history-of-rock.com/little_eva.htm

Chris Fultz

21-12-2010, 23:14

I have read all 350+ posts, this is pretty interesting stuff.

The locomotion seems too easy. What about some of the other songs or other links to EVA?

I like the thoughts on the mirrors and reverses, the date 12-21, etc.

Lots of cool thought and well worth the time to read!

Gir_450

21-12-2010, 23:17

What our team has found that is a huge event in history is the triple conjunction between Uranus and Jupiter (This happens in January). These planets, as we all know, were named after roman gods. The pillar in the hint appears to be of roman architect. Now here's where conjunction comes in, the woman is Little Eva, whose biggest hit was in 1962 and it was titled "Loco-Motion". Locomotion can refer to trains, and trains can refer to conjunctions. Therefore, we are possibly dealing with some sort of train game =P

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 23:22

the tennis ball was not a real game hint right?

it was a red herring, meaning that it was kinda distractor...prolly only a less noticed part (or "aspect) of the image was a "clue"

unionylibertad

21-12-2010, 23:24

The locomotion seems too easy. What about some of the other songs or other links to EVA?

the hints FIRST gives out are never too complex...someone has always guessed them correctly in some way or form...chances are that the real nature of the clue has already been touched on in this thread ;)

hihi11111

21-12-2010, 23:34

the hints FIRST gives out are never too complex...someone has always guessed them correctly in some way or form...chances are that the real nature of the clue has already been touched on in this thread ;)

thats the GDC for ya :P

DiscoKittyPrime

21-12-2010, 23:34

Ok, I have made it through a little over half of the pages and one thing that keeps popping up to me is that they might be reusing parts from previous years. If they want to do that and stick to the locomotion hints of making it harder to move around, then the inaugural challenge of FIRST (Maize Craze) comes to mind. For those who don't know the first year's challenge, go to this link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maize_craze.

The basic summary of this challenge was picking up TENNIS BALLS and scoring them in either the corner or into a central column that was in the center of the field if i understand it correctly. Also, the field was not carpeted, it was covered in 1-2 inches of corn (thus the MAIZE spelling).

I highly doubt that they would do this challenge exactly but if they are really wanting to do a throwback to a historical game, what better than the first year's challenge of moving on corn? And now with that, my mind is spinning with ideas of making robots navigate through a child's ball pin.

Any ideas off of this or am i just repeating something posted in the second half of this thread?

also, a link to the only video I could find of that first year: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-m1QBOxsfg

216Robochick288

21-12-2010, 23:35

These are my random thoughts before my parents FORCE me off the computer.... There will be more tommorow.

Since the RoboDawG logo was drawn, I have never changed my computer background.
Now its a picture of a lady [little Eve] by a pole. XP
Google is probably puzzled why the hits on "Little Eve" are off the charts this very second.....

I dont think the game will go smaller or being hanging from something simply because FIRST is trying to be more non-FIRST people friendly, and sitting in the back of the stands looking at tiny robots does not sound people friendly.

I dont think they will be doing another Space style game... unless its a "Grand Review" of all games..
All FRC games are lining up?
FRC mash? Bash? Party? Loco-motion?
Are we bringing our robots to Robo-prom????
...sorry... I got carried away.....

Sweater and pole have bumpy surfaces, and tennis ball covering? Oppisite of 2009?
E.V.A.... maybe a planet with huge amounts of gravity that uses this stuff to provide more resistance/harder to move?

mirror Image... Reverse Engineering? taking stuff apart?

I dont think it will be walking robots either. No offense to Rookie teams out there, but that is a tad ridiculous to expect to be able to do, let alone get money for materials and stable designs... ect..

Some happenings in 1962:
The president then set a goal of landing a man on the moon before the end of the decade-- game review? word-I-must-not-say-includes-slippery-fields-and-white-wheels again?::rtm::
12 European countries form European Space Agency----larger alliances YET?!?!?! O_O smaller bots so we can fit every bot on feild? ehh doubt it
US Airforce investigates using lasers to intercept missiles----- laser guided goals??

hihi11111

21-12-2010, 23:43

this is a good full picture of her that was said eairler http://www.spectropop.com/gallery/v/Girls/Various/Little+Eva.jpg.html

mattiej

21-12-2010, 23:46

Just for fun:

Column=tall
tall=height
height=altitude
altitude=sky
sky=rain
rain=water

Therefore, this year's game will be a water game.

BIGWILLI2081

21-12-2010, 23:58

masoug

22-12-2010, 00:41

Wow! Everyone is like trying to do "CSI" work and concocting theories of what this means, when it might as well have almost nothing to do with the game...

Team#2057-Vegas

22-12-2010, 00:48

Just to stir up the thoughts:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQYD5TVCGlY

bochek.. you just sent my insanity level skyrocketing.. football game is brought up again o___O

hmm

Chickenonastick

22-12-2010, 01:04

The name Little Eva was derived from a character in Uncle Tom's Cabin.

Harriet Beecher Stowe wrote Uncle Tom's Cabin to promote the abolition of slavery in the United States.

The abolition of slavery was one of the many goals of the Civil War.

During the Civil War, the most popular sport soldiers played was horse racing.

Thus by deductive reasoning, the game will involve horses and racing. :ahh:

ENIAC

22-12-2010, 01:09

I saw something earlier about black and white? And Line following? And Trains? What about line following trains during autonomous? Have a marker on a robot, IR beacon, what have you, follow line, link, have it be half the match to allow for time.

IanW

22-12-2010, 01:09

As Luke3161 said in post #347, everyone is postulating games that are too complex. You have to consider that every piece needs to be constructed for the regionals, so expense really is an issue. In addition, the GDC will be thinking about teams that do not have a ton of money to blow on replicating a super complex field. And has been said several times, I think many teams, rookie and veteran, would have a difficult time producing an entirely new form of drive train. Most teams just do not have access to the resources necessary to build walking robots, especially as many have invested so much in making ones based on wheels.
However, I do think the Locomotion (as a name) and mirroring are probably some of the best ideas so far.

masoug

22-12-2010, 01:21

Pole dancing robots...

GDC is reading this thread and laughing at us now...

Are you SURE that its a column? NOT something else?

dlavery

22-12-2010, 01:34

GDC is reading this thread and laughing at us now...

Naaaah, I doubt it. I am pretty sure they are all fast asleep right now. They are not even thinking about this stuff any more, right up until kick-off.

OK, whew, I'm back now. Just needed that one little moment of fantasy to get through the next two weeks... :)

.

Mike AA

22-12-2010, 01:45

Naaaah, I doubt it. I am pretty sure they are all fast asleep right now. They are not even thinking about this stuff any more, right up until kick-off.

.

So whats your excuse?

synth3tk

22-12-2010, 02:07

Wow! Everyone is like trying to do "CSI" work and concocting theories of what this means, when it might as well have almost nothing to do with the game...
Welcome to ChiefDelphi a month before Kick-Off. This is an annual traditional experience for quite a few regulars.

rahilm

22-12-2010, 02:21

I'm in the Extra-Vehicular Activity camp. Too much points to that:
-Little EVA
-Group 1 for FIRST Choice is an FTC kit and nothing else. You have to get it.
-FIRST was providing incentive earlier for FRC teams to get involved in FTC

My guess is we have to build an second smaller bot (Tetrix required maybe?) that gets deployed by the main FRC bot. The second bot would be what the human player controls.

Now as to what this second bot does (or the first for that matter) I'm just as clueless as the GDC wants us all to be.

EricH

22-12-2010, 02:29

-Group 1 for FIRST Choice is an FTC kit and nothing else. You have to get it.
-FIRST was providing incentive earlier for FRC teams to get involved in FTC

Actually, you don't have to get anything in Group 1. (Or Groups 2-4). FIRST Choice is optional, and you can pick 3 items, as long as each is from a different group.

I'm thinking that the FTC kit is just to help FRC teams get people involved in FTC.

Could it be that there's a mini-robot, required or as a bonus? Possible. But if it has to remain tethered to the main robot... welcome to the biggest violations of the entanglement rule since 2002 (and then some). A number of tethers were run over that year. Some had mini-bots on the end.

JB987

22-12-2010, 02:39

Seems everyone is fixated on locomotion/train based thoughts or thinking there is some relevance to the column,etc...Maybe the person in the picture isn't significant but the letters in the name are? How about looking at the name Little Eva as an anagram? ... elevate L, levitate Lt...??? Let's start looking beyond the assumed obvious and branch out with some new lines of thinking.

1086VEX

22-12-2010, 02:41

after reading most of this thread i like the idea of a compilation game. so what were some of the most notable game features from FIRST's history?

1990's games- many involved tall cylindrical goals
2001- 4v0 and see-saw
2002- mini tether bots
2004- stairs
2006- game periods
2007- ramp bots and weight classes
2000, 2004, 2010- hanging (doubt theyd bring it back after one year unless they made us hang on a column:rolleyes:)

just a few to think about... but personally i think that we were supposed to get locomotion from this hint as the game name.

GaryVoshol

22-12-2010, 07:29

Suppose the picture of Little Eva is only the starting point. It's not about Little Eva herself, or her songs. Maybe it's about some other Eva.

Eva Braun - Nah, let's not go there lest someone invokes Godwin's Law.

Eva Peron - No, not an Argentinian-themed game - although using bolas as a game piece would be fun! I followed some word-association paths, but got lost once I got to Team 245 AdamBots.

Eva Gabor - Here's where it starts to make sense:

Eva Gabor starred in Green Acres
Arnold the pig was a character in Green Acres
The most famous pig in FIRST is Suzy Q, kissed by Paul C at IRI
One of the sponsors of IRI is Team 45, one of the original and sustaining teams; Andy Baker supplied the pig
This points to a 20th anniversary game - Maize Craze
And pigs eat corn!

JaneYoung

22-12-2010, 07:57

Al Skierkiewicz

22-12-2010, 07:59

Does anybody think this is going to be a Dancin' with the Robots year?

My favorite Little Eva song is "Some Kind of Wonderful" but the version by Grand Funk Railroad is better!

Mike o.

22-12-2010, 08:00

..........
Eva Gabor - Here's where it starts to make sense:

Eva Gabor starred in Green Acres
Arnold the pig was a character in Green Acres
The most famous pig in FIRST is Suzy Q, kissed by Paul C at IRI
One of the sponsors of IRI is Team 45, one of the original and sustaining teams; Andy Baker supplied the pig
This points to a 20th anniversary game - Maize Craze
And pigs eat corn!

And what was the game element for Maize Craze you say? Why it was tennis balls. Hmmmmm.....yet another supporting factor that we may just see those jumbo PENN balls this year.

lim shi hao

22-12-2010, 08:35

my guess is :
1. robot have to pick up cylinder like object and play a game of 'chess'
2.maybe try fighthing to bring 'pillars' to the alliance side of the field.

This is what I could think of for nowhttp://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/images/smilies/biggrin.gifhttp://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/images/smilies/read-the-manual.gif

TD912

22-12-2010, 08:55

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xufxKCC1NJ8

thefro526

22-12-2010, 09:02

And what was the game element for Maize Craze you say? Why it was tennis balls. Hmmmmm.....yet another supporting factor that we may just see those jumbo PENN balls this year.

I think drawing comparison to Maize Craze might just be one of the most logical ideas I've read in this thread.

Though, I'd hate to play another Ball game... it's been 3 years since we've had a game piece that wasn't a Ball.

Corn scattered across the field could make for and interesting game though.

GaryVoshol

22-12-2010, 09:09

It is way too early in the morning...

But I'm a time zone ahead of you ...

Anyone care to venture how I got from Eva Peron to AdamBots? Only 2 degrees of separation.

KHall

22-12-2010, 09:58

I’ve got it!

The game will be to reach up to a series of branches supported by a central column. The robot will have to locate and retrieve small red balls that are hanging from these branches. The balls will be about the size of an apple. In the last 20 seconds of the game, the robot will have to deliver as many of the red balls as possible to the “Adam” containers at the corners of the field. The name of this year’s game will be “Genesis”!

HA!
Enjoy and Happy Holidays Everyone!

K Hall
Mentor FRC 2171, FLL 1528

Bill_B

22-12-2010, 10:04

All very entertaining folks. At 2 cents for each opinion, it still adds up to only about a buck two ninety-eight? So I'll add mine to round out the mix.

Not enough emphasis on the "loco" part of the motion. Let's try off-center special wheels that will truly supply loco-motion and the chugga-chugga motion like a railroad train as in the song lyric. It won't matter if the playing field is level. All the robots will be bopping around.

I hope you all bought a good supply of pool noodles as Bill advised way long ago.

Peter Matteson

22-12-2010, 10:09

My favorite Little Eva song is "Some Kind of Wonderful" but the version by Grand Funk Railroad is better!

Agreed, and their version of Loco-motion is also better in my opinion.

216Robochick288

22-12-2010, 10:33

Is anyone else REALLY tempted to look at Wiki Leaks...?

I want to say that this is a giant composition of the FIRST communities favourite games of the past, but then wouldnt the poll have come earlier so they could put it all together... or maybe they REALLY dont make the game til December. They post the hint then look at responses and make the game and...

I dont know anymore. I had an idea last night but I forget what it was. I wrote it down but cant read the handwriting. I can, however, read my half-poem that reads:
"4 days before Christmas the game Hint's released
I wont have a life 'til April I think!"

johnr

22-12-2010, 10:36

Looks like she is protecting/ holding onto a giant pool noodle. One of those 4 sided ones.

rsisk

22-12-2010, 10:58

Interesting anagrams from Little Eva and Locomotion

Leave Tilt
Latte Live
Latte Evil
Latte Vile
Valet Tile

Cool Motion
Coin Lot Moo
Icon Lot Moo

I see several references to Latte and Moo. Maybe we get an espresso machine in the KOP this year

Or, the more relevant anagrams LEAVE TILT, COOL MOTION. Maybe you have to go across a tilting mechanism to leave an area of the field. Scorekeepers award extra points for cool dance moves during the bonus period at the end of the match.

Mike Rizzo

22-12-2010, 11:02

So I was actually able to catch up to the posts, turn your head to do some work and your 30 posts behind…

Anyway I wanted to explore the avenue (you’ll see the pun in a second) of the reverse, since the picture was reversed I decided lets reverse her name as well, so EVA becomes AVE (see)

Ave, some of the top hits got a Google search are in regards to high speed trains and rail systems

Another options it could stand for is Advanced Vehicle Engineers

ALSO Ave is a Roman salutation

Now I also had other ideas like FIRST Ave and such like that but I just wanted to post this to see if I could stir up any new Ideas

As for the game piece – Ave Little - Ave L.- ‘D’ave L.

...This year’s game piece is Dave Lavery :)

IKE

22-12-2010, 11:26

So...This year’s game piece is Dave Lavery :)

I checked and Walmart is currently out of stock of Dave Lavery. Maybe its a summer item.:mad:

AlftanSr

22-12-2010, 11:30

All these analyses...your english teachers must be proud of your essays!

Chris Fultz

22-12-2010, 11:30

...This year’s game piece is Dave Lavery :)

There will be cutouts of Dave scattered around the field, each in a different color hawaiian shirt. Before eachmatch, the color randomizer identifies which color dave is the goal. Your robot has to hear* this color, then adapt the logic to go only to that color Dave.

* Since we are all so good at using the cameras, the GDC is incorporating sound identification into the mix.... :ahh:

mattiej

22-12-2010, 11:32

ALSO Ave is a Roman salutation

2 thing about this:

1. By Roman you mean latin and
2. Salutem would be a better greeting. Ave isn't used often.

Dustin Shadbolt

22-12-2010, 11:37

Is anyone else REALLY tempted to look at Wiki Leaks...?

Win :D

JewishDan18

22-12-2010, 11:38

2 thing about this:
2. There is no V in the latin alphabet. The word you are meaning to say is Age! But that means come. If you want to say a greeting, saw Salve to a single person or Salvete to multiple people.
Source: I take latin in school.

Isn't there a v in salve :P ? I think you mean there is no v sound in latin. Ave certainly is a latin greeting.

Bill_B

22-12-2010, 11:50

2 thing about this:

1. By Roman you mean latin and
2. Salutem would be a better greeting. Ave isn't used often.

There clearly IS a "v" in the Latin alphabet, e.g. veni, vidi, vici.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veni,_vidi,_vici There, is however, no "v" sound in Latin. You have to use "u" instead when you see the letter "v". Remember the double-u "W"!

Also remember the schoolboy lament:
Latin is a language, as dead as it can be.
First, it killed the Romans. Now it's killing me!

Team#2057-Vegas

22-12-2010, 12:05

I hope you all bought a good supply of pool noodles as Bill advised way long ago.

We just stocked up ;) Wally World had a sale in August

There clearly IS a "v" in the Latin alphabet, e.g. veni, vidi, vici.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veni,_vidi,_vici There, is however, no "v" sound in Latin. You have to use "u" instead when you see the letter "v". Remember the double-u "W"!

Also remember the schoolboy lament:
Latin is a language, as dead as it can be.
First, it killed the Romans. Now it's killing me!

So is trying to guess this years game latin? It's killing me :eek: just kidding

But really..

We all really are thinking too deep.. there was a great post put like 15 pages back that made a lot of sense.. there were 3 levels.. (ill post a picture) with a robot on each level and the top one had a pillar.. there were plenty of balls on the top middle and bottom all worth different ammounts with lower ones being worth more.. they could be shot up too (like aim high) any thoughts?

http://i53.tinypic.com/2zfr6rm.png

remember to keep this simple but yet complex everyone

unionylibertad

22-12-2010, 13:01

^ok that would be a pretty sick game, for all its simplicity

Mr_I

22-12-2010, 13:04

EVA = Wallie

(It's spelled "WALL*E")

EVA == Extra Vehicular Activity

We need a "mini-me" robot to do some "outside of the box" activity (like so many did in 2002).

JaneYoung

22-12-2010, 13:09

http://i53.tinypic.com/2zfr6rm.png

That looks like a Festivus pole to me.

Jane

WhiteShadow1474

22-12-2010, 13:12

We need a "mini-me" robot to do some "outside of the box" activity (like so many did in 2002).

Does that mean 2 control systems? That could get expensive ::rtm::

EricH

22-12-2010, 13:18

Or, the more relevant anagrams LEAVE TILT, COOL MOTION. Maybe you have to go across a tilting mechanism to leave an area of the field. Scorekeepers award extra points for cool dance moves during the bonus period at the end of the match.
Nah, the bonus points are for keeping the tilting mechanism with neither end on the floor. Whoever or whatever is on top of it is worth double points as well (and trapping Chuck Norris is worth infinity, Dave, Dean, and Woodie are 500 apiece, and trapping Andy Baker is worth double infinity).

Mr_I

22-12-2010, 13:36

Does that mean 2 control systems? That could get expensive ::rtm::

Not necessarily ... the mini-me could be tethered.

jmanela

22-12-2010, 13:41

Not necessarily ... the mini-me could be tethered.

Doesn't OCCRA have mini-robots that play along side the big robots in their games?

Joey P

22-12-2010, 13:59

The woman in the picture is American Pop Singer "Little Eva." Her number one song was in the year 1962. The song is "Loco-Motion." Now if you look up the definition of Locomotion, it means movement or the ability to move from one place to another. This relates to the column that she is holding onto in the picture. It seems that this years game is going to have to do with crane work. I think we are going to have to move objects to different places on the field.

MarkoRamius1086

22-12-2010, 14:01

I have read the majority of the thread (I have perhaps missed a few hundred posts since the last time I was on yesterday...) and have come to a few conclusions, some more relevant than others.

We know who is in the picture, and we know what she is with. Little Eva with an unknown, generic, column.

We know that she sang the big shot song "Locomotion." If I was going to put money on anything, there would be some kind of theme this year involving "Locomotion"... no whether that is the name of the game or a game element, I do not know.

The column is unspecific, not having a top of bottom. This depicts a tall cylinder. Something to climb vertically?

We know the image is reversed from its original version. The relevancy of this is... questionable.

We know after many long years (20 years infact) the GDC will most likely make the game pieces something easy to acquire, as last year they got soccer balls. Some theories say tennis balls, I do not know the accuracy of this "Red Herring."

Many people are emphasizing on the simplicity of the game. Complex games are not something a new spectating crowd can keep up with.

I dont think that they will have a tethered robot... thats a whole nother system teams and programmers have to deal with. (This is more of an opinion now that I think about it...)

At this point I have a few questions. Did anyone find the original version of this picture, and if so what is different? I am wondering if there is anything different in the column or other primary pieces of the picture.

I think they picked this picture for a reason, for the two things in said picture. Eva, and the column. They could have picked any picture with her, but the picked the one with the column.

My opinion: This picture has two big points, Locomotion and Column.

My guess: A game themed around railway systems with some kind of end game column climb.

My $0.02
Happy Holidays!

~Cory~

22-12-2010, 14:14

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTjJJgzYqAJxi9OX9RAxpY8XLu81B_qb CGC5iwXhclJlkFUpzIw

~Cory~

22-12-2010, 14:16

AllenGregoryIV

22-12-2010, 14:19

OK here is my idea after reading all of this thread. A lot of this is completely conjecture but it would be a fun game anyway.

The 2011 FIRST game will be called Locomotion. It is the 20th anniversary so I expect some recycled game dynamics.

- Played on the standard sized field. (too expensive to change that now, too many regionals, and too many teams have practice fields setup)

- Scoring objects are big and little balls. (i.e. 1996, 2001, 2004 and etc). The large balls can be used to cap the goals, to gain more points or as a multiplier and defensively to stop the other team from scoring in a goal.

- There will be 5-8 movable towers similar in dimension to the 2001 game (10 year anniversary). The towers may have some sort of device that allows for them to be linked together, possibly magnets, so you are able to build a train of the goals. Either way you will be able to hold multiple towers and drive around like a train. possibly using your alliance partners to assist in making it longer. The number of goals that are in the train will be a multiplier for the points in the goals at the end of the match.

- There will be 2 stationary scoring goals (made of steal pipe) that robots can score balls into and also can climb at the end of the match. These goals will be shorter and wider than the mobile goals so robots can shoot into them. The goals will be located on raised platforms that robots must climb to reach the goal. Points will be awarded for being on the platform and not touching the ground and more points will be awarded for being in the air hanging on to the scoring goal. Potentially even more points for a certain height above the platform.

- Vision targets of some kind will be on each goal

- Human players will be able shoot the balls into the goals.

- This makes the field easy and cheap to build. A couple of the mobile goals and one of the stationary goal platforms is all a team would need to practice.

- Line tracking is going to be useful in autonomous (just throwing that out there on a complete guess but it is an easier challenge for teams that don't want to try vision)

The biggest problem with this is that it is the old style game where there is a limited number of scoring objects and balls must be counted at the end of the match. I am trying to figure out a way to eliminate the problem but so far not much luck. Perhaps the stationary gaols will be built with a funnel and hose that feeds the balls out after they are digitally counted.

~Cory~

22-12-2010, 14:28

Sorry if this has been posted already...
Here is some analysis:

First look at the two zoomed in. You can see photoshoping lines in the hint version around the pole. Also the pole is only a portion. The original is a marble poll.

http://gifup.com/data/gifs/8/2/c/82c5209227.gif
GIF animations generator gifup.com (http://gifup.com)

However, there is this image to contend with from last.fm It is the same, but reversed.

http://userserve-ak.last.fm/serve/_/6550963/Little+Eva.jpg

The image is also used as an album cover:

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B000024VI6.01._SCMZZZZZZZ_.jpg

~Cory~

22-12-2010, 14:36

Analysis: There are two different pictures This set
http://gifup.com/data/gifs/8/2/c/82c5209227.gif
and this set:
http://gifup.com/data/gifs/a/d/d/addeaa5d0f.gif

chemipanda

22-12-2010, 14:37

CrazyCarl461

22-12-2010, 14:55

It is about time for another compilation game. The last one was in 2004. FIRST Frenzy had elements from the previous four years: The hanging bar from 2000, the large multiplier balls from 2001, the mobile goals from 2002 and the slick HDPE surface from 2003.

There have now been six games since that game, all with unique scoring objects: tetras, poof balls, inflated tubes, trackballs, orbit balls, and soccer balls. Some aspects of previous games, such as orbit balls, they know to stay away from now, but several of those elements could make a return.

It has been a while since they have had a game that requires a big pick-and-place arm so I think we might see that coming up. That may just be wishful thinking more than anything else, though.

Grim Tuesday

22-12-2010, 15:55

Picture is reversed. Collum is reversed. Whats the opposite of climbing?

Getting lower. Never been done in FIRST. Maybe the end game is a "get lower than 12 inches" competition.

pandamonium

22-12-2010, 15:56

except it isn't Wilma Rudolph...

karomata

22-12-2010, 15:58

i'm pretty sure that's little eva, the singer. reseach i've done leads me to many paths that are resonable for FRC to do. also, the research i did on john penn, from the tenis ball, also led me to locomotives and trains. getting more specific, i researched oscillating engines which are the bar things on the sides of train wheels that are usually found on older trains. and the column, i researched the column and it is a replica of columns found in ancient egypt, later copied by the romans. i'm not sure yet how that relates to trains yet, but think about it, the egyptians brought marble from luxor all the way to memphis, then to cairo. then they pulled giant rock slabs up the sides of the pyramids. there may be some theories out there.

more to come

tcahoon

22-12-2010, 16:13

Little Eva
Singer famous for the song LOCO-MOTION (not locomotion) with associated dance (doing the loco-motion)

Loco means crazy in spanish. Crazy motion?

song lyrics has possible suggestions of trains, connecting together.

Found image on Google images. one used is a horizontal flipped image of one on google.

Alan Anderson

22-12-2010, 16:28

I'm no longer going to follow this thread. There are now too many people posting already-noted information here as their first Chief Delphi message. Someone wake me when another hint comes out, okay?

Happy New Year, everyone.

Captain Slacker

22-12-2010, 16:30

EVA can also stand for Electronic Video Assistant. Couldn't it be possible that it has something to do with robot vision? they've been trying to get teams to do more with vision for awhile now, maybe we're required to do it in endgame or something. Or better yet, earlier people were mentioning a major game change before end game but after auto, maybe the screen darkens in front of the drivers and they have to use their vision code to see what's going on.

Alright forgive me if this is wrong or has already been said, but I vaguely remember someone talking about stepping it up and making the game more interactive. I may be messing things up in my mind, but I thought Dean has mentioned it somewhere. If teams had to use more interactive robots that would definitely add some intensity to the game, but I feel like it would still be pretty user-friendly. I definitely like this observation.

CrazyCarl461

22-12-2010, 16:45

There are now too many people posting already-noted information here as their first Chief Delphi message.
I know 28 pages seems like a lot to those who are just now joining the discussion, but try to get through as much of it as you can before posting. The only thing more tedious than following a super-long thread is following a super-long thread with the same observations on every page.

This hint may be completely exhausted of pertinent information until we get something more.

whosdadog

22-12-2010, 16:54

Found the album on Amazon (http://www.amazon.com/Llll-Little-Eva-Complete-Dimension-Recordings/dp/B000024VI6) not much on there other than glowing customer reviews.

psyco_klown

22-12-2010, 17:26

anyone notice dave's avatar of a train? from the looks of it same time period and it looks like it from Creedence Clearwater Revival - Midnight Special hmmm

rabridges

22-12-2010, 17:59

Hello Every

After reading the majority of this thread, there are a lot of interesting ideas being throw out. I don't have any to add at the moment, But I did find a video
of the first FIRST competition in 1992, the game was called Maize Craze: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0-m1QBOxsfg

It was interesting to watch and the robots collecting tennis ball to score, another video I find was of the second year game 1993 Rug Rage had me
thinking could some elements of this game be in next seasons game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rZyU9Xu8GE&feature=related

This is all I have for now, also for loco-motion idea. Maybe are controlling the robots differently, maybe using the Xbox Kinect.

-Antron-

Erik_2505

22-12-2010, 18:14

Ok, finally finished reading 28 pages, and yes, most of it past the first 5 or 6 pages starts being repeats, or IMHO twisting the possible meaning of the the picture way too far...

So far, I think the only accurate bit of info we can count on is the "locomotion" bit.

Anyway, forgive me if this has already been mentioned, but has anybody suggested that the game pieces may be on tracks of some sort instead of the robot?

EricH

22-12-2010, 18:47

anyone notice dave's avatar of a train? from the looks of it same time period and it looks like it from Creedence Clearwater Revival - Midnight Special hmmm
You might be on to something. That was changed within the last day or so.

Game Name: Locomotion.
Game field: Standard size and shape.
Game itself: ?????????? (Hint 2 might have this "info")

Karibou

22-12-2010, 19:07

First Hint
http://www.usfirst.org/uploadedImages/Robotics_Programs/FRC/Game_and_Season__Info/2011_Assets/FRC%202011%20Game%20Hint%201.jpg

Real image:
http://s.dsimg.com/image/A-150-271626-1128158605.jpeg
(I deleted the IMG tags for the sanity of my computer screen)

The image that FIRST gave us was a flipped version of what appears to be the pre-cropped image of one of Little Eva's CD covers. I don't know what the second picture was used for, but that it exists doesn't mean that FIRST made up a similar image :/

Nah, the bonus points are for keeping the tilting mechanism with neither end on the floor. Whoever or whatever is on top of it is worth double points as well (and trapping Chuck Norris is worth infinity, Dave, Dean, and Woodie are 500 apiece, and trapping Andy Baker is worth double infinity).
Trapping Billfred is worth negative infinity, right?

IndySam

22-12-2010, 19:08

The image that FIRST gave us was a flipped version of what appears to be the pre-cropped image of one of Little Eva's CD covers.

CD cover lol, so young :)

EricH

22-12-2010, 19:12

Trapping Billfred is worth negative infinity, right?
Nah, it's worth a caption contest. Trapping JVN (or any other IFI employee) is negative infinity and a caption contest. Trapping 1114 is a measly 50 points, unless you trap Karthik, which multiplies your entire score by -1.

porterma64

22-12-2010, 19:14

Could the reversed image refer to the B side of the Album?:rolleyes:

Karibou

22-12-2010, 19:19

CD cover lol, so young :)

FINE. Record cover. Note that I did say "record cover" in an earlier post (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showpost.php?p=987189&postcount=125)...

:)

BJC

22-12-2010, 19:20

I have a feeling trapping Andy Baker would be harder than a double suspention. No teams would be able to pull it off, Mike Copioli would make a bunch of money in bets with the GDC, and in the end we'd have to fake it during an offseason compitition.

Edit: So by trapping Billfred and Karthik you could get infinity points? I call dibs on that stratigy!

rutzman

22-12-2010, 19:23

Could the reversed image refer to the B side of the Album?:rolleyes:

The song on the B side was titled "He is the Boy".

WhiteShadow1474

22-12-2010, 20:44

Trapping 1114 is a measly 50 points, unless you trap Karthik, which multiplies your entire score by -1.

how about just for non-simplicity, we go by multiplying it by i

EricH

22-12-2010, 20:50

how about just for non-simplicity, we go by multiplying it by i
Not a big enough number, though I could go for pi*i*e^1.

synth3tk

22-12-2010, 21:00

I'm with Alan. We've finally reached the "repeat point" (though later than usual, if I recall correctly).

Peace out until #2 (if any).

Mahekp15

22-12-2010, 21:04

Oh man i cant wait for this years game, IM EXCITED!!!! and i have a wierd feeling its going to include everything from the past 20 seasons. CANT WAIT!!!!

JaneYoung

22-12-2010, 21:07

anyone notice dave's avatar of a train? from the looks of it same time period and it looks like it from Creedence Clearwater Revival - Midnight Special hmmm

Really?

Cyberphil

22-12-2010, 21:25

anyone notice dave's avatar of a train? from the looks of it same time period and it looks like it from Creedence Clearwater Revival - Midnight Special hmmm

Very interesting find! Well, I think we have the locomotion thing down. We just have to find out how it connects to the 2011 game. . .

I also found this by a quick Google Definition lookup of Midnight special. It was the name of one of the trains in the The Gulf, Mobile and Ohio railroad carrier, and guess where it's main voyages were? St Louis to Chicago.

http://www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Gulf,_Mobile_and_Ohio_Railroad

Connection!!!!

Other Definitions found on Google:
Definitions of The Midnight Special on the Web:

The Midnight Special was the name of a passenger train formerly operated by the Chicago and Alton Railroad and its successor, the Gulf, Mobile and Ohio Railroad. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Midnight_Special
The Midnight Special is an American musical variety series that aired during the 1970s and early 1980s, created and produced by Burt Sugarman and airing on NBC. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Midnight_Special_(TV_series)
"Midnight Special" is a traditional folk song thought to have originated among prisoners in the American South. The title comes from the refrain which refers to the Midnight Special and its "ever-loving light" (sometimes "ever-living light").
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Special_(song)
The Midnight Special is a syndicated radio show broadcast on Chicago, Illinois radio station, WFMT-FM (98.7 MHz) since 1953. It is a showcases of folk and roots music from historical and contemporary artists. The show also features comedy sketches and show tunes. ...
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Midnight_Special_(radio)
Midnight Special is a 1962 album by Jamaican-American singer, Harry Belafonte. The album notably contains the very first official recording of Bob Dylan, who plays harmonica on the title track.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Midnight_Special_(album)
(Chicago - St. Louis)
www.absoluteastronomy.com/topics/Gulf,_Mobile_and_Ohio_Railroad

JaneYoung

22-12-2010, 21:33

And... anything about Creedence Clearwater Revival ...? John Fogerty, maybe? Lead Belly maybe?

rabridges

22-12-2010, 21:37

Yeah I did, could a micro hint he is give. Or messing with us. But keep that in mind, yesterday it was a man climbing.

Cyberphil

22-12-2010, 21:42

Yeah I did, could a micro hint he is give. Or messing with us. But keep that in mind, yesterday it was a man climbing.

But it has been that man (Which I believe is Dave himself) climbing for as long as I can remember (I think) :rolleyes: . I think this has some significance.

By Jane:
What was that man wearing?

Was it a paisley shirt?!

JaneYoung

22-12-2010, 21:45

No, I honestly can't remember that avatar...

andgordo558

22-12-2010, 21:46

OMG! An locomotive track over a huge pool, but that wouldn't allow teams to move as freely... hoever "Locomotion" seems like a great name for the game. Teams being forced to make chains seems great, but different teams might have different ideas on how to hook up to other robots. Unless FIRST regulates the ways you can hook up, it won't be very creative. I looked up the invention of the locomotive (1781) so IDK if 229 or 230 means anything. I LOVE this time of year! :P

Chris is me

22-12-2010, 21:48

I'm going to bet that the game involves two zones or two zones per alliance. One is elevated. You need to be able to either climb some stairs or drive on a thin mono-rail track between the two. Your starting position lets you start low or high, so there will be mono-rail teams or stair teams.

jmanela

22-12-2010, 23:12

Grim Tuesday

22-12-2010, 23:20

Cyberphil

22-12-2010, 23:22

the only thing about he two-floor system is safety. How would you safely get robots off if they are on the top of the field? Everyone remembers the rule last year where you had to roll the robot over the bump and couldn't step over it. If GDC is that picky about safety, then I don't think they could really do a multi-level field unless it is just a single platform or something.

If they let us roll the bots over the humps, I am pretty sure they would be ok with us bringing the robots to the edge of the step and then removing them from the field. If safety is a large concern, the GDC would probably make a ramp or 2 so teams could safely take their robots off the field. Or maybe a ramp is included on the field to the ramps. :rolleyes:

EricH

22-12-2010, 23:24

Simple, the robot start position must be touching an edge of the second level, making it so peopl never have to step onto the level.
OK, what about the end of the match? Somebody ends up on top. Now what?

Karibou

22-12-2010, 23:24

the only thing about he two-floor system is safety. How would you safely get robots off if they are on the top of the field? Everyone remembers the rule last year where you had to roll the robot over the bump and couldn't step over it. If GDC is that picky about safety, then I don't think they could really do a multi-level field unless it is just a single platform or something.
What if the second level was only a foot and a half higher than the first? If kids can take down robots that were hanging from the very top of the tower this year, I don't see why they couldn't take a robot off of a platform that's not too high off of the ground. I think that the issue with the bumps this year was that they were very wide and hard to step over easily while carrying something.

jmanela

22-12-2010, 23:34

What if the second level was only a foot and a half higher than the first? If kids can take down robots that were hanging from the very top of the tower this year, I don't see why they couldn't take a robot off of a platform that's not too high off of the ground. I think that the issue with the bumps this year was that they were very wide and hard to step over easily while carrying something.

I guess it depends on how the second level is built. If the 2nd level is shaped like a model runway or something where two people can safely roll the robot to the end and take it off, that would be fine. However if it is a big open space there really isn't anywhere safe for two people to lift a robot.

*EDIT
Unless of course, the GDC provides a ramp in each field - Cyberphil's idea

Bobert

22-12-2010, 23:45

davidthefat

22-12-2010, 23:47

I've cracked it! Little Eva's second album was released in 1989, the same year that FIRST was founded. The album was called "Back on Track." Another album with the same name was released that year. The first track in that album is called "Big River to Cross." :D

Welllllll, obviously.......

We either have to get on a track or cross a river.

Now Back On track sounds like a game name...

edit: Track + Locomotion = trains... Something about trains...

rcmolloy

22-12-2010, 23:49

dodar

22-12-2010, 23:49

I've cracked it! Little Eva's second album was released in 1989, the same year that FIRST was founded. The album was called "Back on Track." Another album with the same name was released that year. The first track in that album is called "Big River to Cross." :D

Welllllll, obviously.......

We either have to get on a track or cross a river.

That does sound like a good name, and that is a nice find! Of course again that could just be a stand in for the actual idea. Like they could mean something related to what it says.

davidthefat

22-12-2010, 23:50

OK I think those two clues are pretty plausible. The track reference has been going back and forth on here for quite sometime. Along with crossing the river assumption, maybe there could be a bridge into play. Who knows?

Off Topic: Is anyone actually more scared than excited for this game? :eek:

I'm more than ready, I took the last year's robot into my house and I am currently working on the vision system. Im ready for anything.

Chris is me

22-12-2010, 23:54

I'm more than ready, I took the last year's robot into my house and I am currently working on the vision system. Im ready for anything.

Be sure to release all of that pre-season developed code online if you intend to use any of it!

rcmolloy

22-12-2010, 23:55

I'm more than ready, I took the last year's robot into my house and I am currently working on the vision system. Im ready for anything.

Haha I'm really just nervous about the game and how it's going to turn out. The GDC is so unpredictable! :confused:

davidthefat

22-12-2010, 23:56

Be sure to release all of that pre-season developed code online if you intend to use any of it!

Sure thing, it turns out WPI students already coded 90% of the code I needed... I just need to put it all together in a nice package and make them work... I mean they make it so easy that they already have code for blob tracking

WhiteShadow1474

22-12-2010, 23:58

Off Topic: Is anyone actually more scared than excited for this game? :eek:

I'm so excited. It's my senior year and i'm ready to build the most amazing thing in the club's history!

We had huge potential last year in theory... but not so in practice :rolleyes:
However, that's in the past! new game new start. only a few more weeks. hopefully Christmas can distract me...

Chris is me

23-12-2010, 00:06

Sure thing, it turns out WPI students already coded 90% of the code I needed... I just need to put it all together in a nice package and make them work... I mean they make it so easy that they already have code for blob tracking

It won't be so easy soon ;) Multiple blobs in one picture, blobs in different light / reflecting light... It's just the beginning.

METaylor

23-12-2010, 00:42

The pole is a pole, like a football pole. Soccer last year, football this year. In OCCRA we sent footballs through a field goal to score points.

BIGWILLI2081

23-12-2010, 01:27

Im ready for anything.

famous last words..

steelerborn

23-12-2010, 01:33

Basel A

23-12-2010, 01:56

It won't be so easy soon ;) Multiple blobs in one picture, blobs in different light / reflecting light... It's just the beginning.

So all we have to do to beat 589 is make a shiny robot? Or be two different blobs?

Chris is me

23-12-2010, 01:59

So all we have to do to beat 589 is make a shiny robot? Or be two different blobs?

Or have an alliance partner...

thefro526

23-12-2010, 08:40

Off Topic: Is anyone actually more scared than excited for this game? :eek:

I'm always afraid of what the GDC will come up with... Their sanity is often questioned... :D

Wayne C.

23-12-2010, 08:59

seems to me that Little EVA would be a space guy term for Extra Vehicular Activity- maybe a short trip outside the field

maybe on a track like a train between the two field gates

of course I could be wrong....

:cool: WC

pandamonium

23-12-2010, 09:44

I've cracked it! Little Eva's second album was released in 1989, the same year that FIRST was founded. The album was called "Back on Track."

maybe we missed the boat with locomotion I think back on track would be a good game name

WhiteShadow1474

23-12-2010, 09:51

Just to mix things up...

http://www.acronymfinder.com/EVA.html

my favorite one might be the english volleyball association ;)
but that would be similar to overdrive...

joeweber

23-12-2010, 10:17

From Wikipeadia

"St. Louis Union Station, a National Historic Landmark, is a passenger train terminal in St. Louis, Missouri. Once the world's largest and busiest train station, "

We assume that when you hear locomaotion you think of trains but some times it is just movement.

If the game is about trains it sure worked out that St. Louis is well known for trains.

Maybe we are pushing goals on tracks that we have to fill and move to different locations, or we have to hook on to objects and connect them into train type segments and than move the train to the finish line.

rsisk

23-12-2010, 10:40

Did you know they sell HAAGEN DAZ at PENN station where LOCOMOTION also occurs and according to Twitter, Chris HERRING has also been at PENN station. There is too much convergence for it to be just coincidence....

Twitter / Chris Herring: I'm at New York Penn Stati ...
I'm at New York Penn Station (2 Penn Plz, btw 31st St & 33rd St, New York) w ..

Bill_B

23-12-2010, 11:42

If the Lord High Vacuum of Time and Common Sense ever changes his picture, then it might be a red herring. Otherwise, that picture is as old as the hills!
...
The picture may be old, but perhaps the conception of the game is equally old. Nothing says that the upcoming game was originated in the preceding year. Perhaps the boxcar/locomotion idea has been percolating for some time, waiting for a finishing touch or refinement.

yarden.saa

23-12-2010, 11:49

my guess:
The picture is a hint to the game nature but not the game it self.
my guess to the game:
there will be poles as bumpers and: big boxes and big cookies
the purpose is to put the cookie in the box; every cookie in the box reward us with a song of Eva, but there will be mirrors around the field

karomata

23-12-2010, 12:55

i also think that our bots and drivers may have to deal with mirrors. it seems realistic.

JaneYoung

23-12-2010, 13:04

Reverse image...

Push me-pull me engines. Forward and reverse in order to get the cars (or themselves) where they want them to be for whatever purpose they are working towards.

Midnight Special - the beam of light. Communicating through light/beams/signals?

Edit: Here's something interesting that keeps coming up when I do searches: Australia.

Lead Belly had a sister named, Australia.
Sean Williams is an Australian writer who wrote The Grand Conjunction in 2009, a book in the Astropolis series.
That's right, mate - Australia.

And here's something really fun - Dave Lavery spent part of his life growing up in Australia. To hear him talk about it, he has very fond memories of Australia. He was in Alice Springs, Northern Territory. And in remembering about some of Dave's adventures, I remembered this (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=69351&highlight=Australia) thread that was posted by Beth Sweet. It was so cool. It's about a book.

jerry w

23-12-2010, 13:19

I can remember my favorite movie when I was a kid was "Honey I Blew up the Kid". But the loco-motion song is performed in that movie (kind of had a weird flashback to sitting and eating mac and cheese, watching that movie when I heard the song). And it is about one crazy engineer that makes a big mistake. So perhaps it is where the song has been used. So going along the lines of that perhaps something has changed in size from the game field, or perhaps the objects make the robots appear either larger or smaller. Maybe a nano-tech game where the bots work with microscopic game pieces like moving one molecule to another.
Just a thought :)

I think you have something here. The hint would be too easy with just locomotion. But if the song was played in a movie, then we have a second degree of seperation. The thought process for creating a clue about making things larger during the game. Thus the movie about "Honey I Blew up the Kid". Movie reference is too simple. Thus a connection to a song in that movie would make it difficult to interpret right away. So clue makers have to ask who sang that song. Then find a photo of the singer.

The conclusion to reach here is that we will be inflating some object. We will be "Blowing-up the game piece".

EricH

23-12-2010, 14:20

I'm always afraid of what the GDC will come up with... Their sanity is often questioned... :D
Nope, it never is. We all know they don't have much left; it's just a question of how much.

EagleEngineer

23-12-2010, 15:03

This hint explains a lot, but it can be interpreted many different ways. Some might say that the robots are going to hang off of this "column", i don't think the design committing is going to have the robots hang again this year. All of the game hints mean a lot, but you can really start designing, and think strategy wise, unless you see the actually game is. We'll all see what this hint means, on Jan. 8. :D

JaneYoung

23-12-2010, 15:04

The conclusion to reach here is that we will be inflating some object. We will be "Blowing-up the game piece".

That would mean clowns.

Travis Hoffman

23-12-2010, 15:09

That would mean clowns.

I was thinking unwanted Lebron James merchandise myself. Oh, wrong connotation of "blowing up". My bad!

I really enjoyed "blowing up" the wall of bins in 2003. We haven't really had a game since then where robots get to contribute to the entropy of the game pieces in such a dramatic fashion. 2004 had a bit of it with the ability to release the balls in the overhead bins early, but it wasn't THE centerpiece of the game. That kind of dynamic is always a crowd-pleaser, too.

Blowing up a wall of inflatable clowns - with trains - I could deal with that. Bring it on.

alectronic

23-12-2010, 15:26

We also know that bumpers are involved, and if Bill annouced them that "early", we can assume there is a good deal of contact or at least multiple elements on the field they are trying to protect.

Chris is me

23-12-2010, 16:16

Hmm... What about instead of locomotives we think of locomotion... like climbing up the stairs / steps that have been hinted about in every other hint ever?!?!?!

davidthefat

23-12-2010, 16:46

Hmm... What about instead of locomotives we think of locomotion... like climbing up the stairs / steps that have been hinted about in every other hint ever?!?!?!

So legged robots? Elaborate on the stairs more please.

Wayne C.

23-12-2010, 16:51

That would mean clowns.

good to have you on board the Circus Train Jane

:cool: WC

JaneYoung

23-12-2010, 16:56

good to have you on board the Circus Train Jane

:cool: WC
Wayne,
I'm still recovering from 'loco-motive' - this one is going to require CPR.

Good luck to 25 this upcoming season. :)
Jane

AcesJames

23-12-2010, 16:58

So legged robots? Elaborate on the stairs more please.

Chris and I talked about this a little while ago.

What he means is locomotion, as in the type of motion used to climb stairs. The up and forward motion that your legs make as you climb stairs, or the "chug" that a train makes to move the wheels.

RoboDesigners

23-12-2010, 17:01

Elaborate on the stairs more please.

Some elaboration on different "stair" ideas can be found many pages back... :)

(I've read every single post in this thread... :cool:)

Erik_2505

23-12-2010, 17:04

Trapping Billfred is worth negative infinity, right?

But, if Chuck Norris is infinity, what happends if you trap Chuck Norris AND Billfred? Undefined score?:confused:

Wildcat

23-12-2010, 17:39

So legged robots?

could be a long shot here, but with all the "EVA" discussion earlier i thought "What about the Eva's from the anime Neon Genesis Evangelion"? they are "robots" (mechas, http://evangelion.wikia.com/wiki/Evangelion_%28mecha%29) with legs. maybe robots will need to have legs. aslo since the Eva's from noen genesis are also part biological creature that could point towards something like the hybrid mode in '08
--->maybe a 2 min 15 sec tele-op to start, with 15 sec hybrid @ end to climb object for bonus points

Grim Tuesday

23-12-2010, 18:14

So legged robots? Elaborate on the stairs more please.

It would be interesting to see the stairs as a strategic decision that teams could make, as in thats where the bonus points are.

Bill_B

23-12-2010, 19:17

We also know that bumpers are involved, and if Bill annouced them that "early", we can assume there is a good deal of contact or at least multiple elements on the field they are trying to protect.
So here goes my one, deeply researched, wild shot at the ecology of 2011's game. Never mind how old the Lavery reference is to Boxcar Willie in his picture post. The boxcar reference merely pulls us further away from the "truth" to Little Eva's Locomotion song. (I also like the "Back on Track" album title as the name of the game this year.)

Instead, delve backwards from the location of Willie's overpass memorial in Red Oak, Texas, part of Ellis county. It's a bridge over Interstate 35E for non-rail vehicles. Prominent in Ellis county history is a relatively recent underground, technological phenomenon. Construction work on it was begun about the time of FIRST's startup in 1991, only to be starved of funding by Congress in 1993. If I mentioned Waxahatchie, would your atoms begin to quiver? Only about a third of the 54-mile circumference was tunneled even though there were 17 access shafts excavated.

Yes, that's right. I'm talking about the Superconducting Super Collider project. My guess is that the six, on-field robots will be engaging in a series of super collisions.

Scoring? Maybe we'll be carrying accelerometers?

Crowd-pleasing? You BETCHA!

Loco-motion? Crazy, man, crazy! Ever hear of demolition derby? on a figure-8 track? We are going to have a pool-noodle flattening, aluminum bending, tire-spinning, full-bore crunch-fest that will be the absolute talk of FIRST's NEXT twenty years!

DarrinMunter

23-12-2010, 21:22

Since "Little Eva" picture is backwards...
"Little Eva" backwards - "ave elttil"

AVE is a high-speed train connecting cities in Spain

Cyberphil

23-12-2010, 21:30

Since "Little Eva" picture is backwards...
"Little Eva" backwards - "ave elttil"

AVE is a high-speed train connecting cities in Spain

Now thats interesting! Great connection! Hmm, high-speed tracks on the field? :rolleyes:

Grim Tuesday

23-12-2010, 21:30

The train references just keep on popping up. However, it may just be because we are looking for them.

VPN.vIPer

23-12-2010, 22:08

I did some research on all the past years' game hints starting from 2003 (when they began giving hints)... they are really quite arbitrary ...
Here is a baseless brain dump...

2001 is the 10th anniversary of frc ... 1991 is when the best of little eva album was released, 20 years ago when frc began
if 2001 was as diabolical as it seems to be to me ... the 20th anniversary is gonna be worse. coming from the chairman's point of view ... somehow it might incorporate some unusual degree of cooperation as i guess they would want to celebrate their message too ... 2001 was kind of like that

one of my first thoughts was ...
since the image has to be reversed and it marks the 10th anniversary of little eva's work ... maybe it's a "reflection of the past" ... strictly from the a standpoint about the nature of the game ... well suited for the 20th anniversary...

Some keywords from getty images, which holds the image from the gems/redferns collection ... according to them the image was created 01 Jan 1960 ...Referring to style ... vertical | Referring to subject matter ... small, music, arts culture and entertainment, eva
...interpreting the pillar, something with height...they seem to like racks or tower-like goals for game pieces ... as in 1996, 2001, 2007 etc...
the height reference might also mean game pieces on rails or ladders like 1998
...could also just mean robots attaching vertically for bonus...

her hit is locomotion which implies crazy motion I guess ... maybe something weird with the robots' motions like 2009 ... that was real fun to watch ... or reflecting a new type of robot motion ... or movable goals like 2004 ...
it was released in 1962 ... 8 planets were in conjunction, some really rare thing or whatever....might relate to the lunar eclipse that happened the morning the clue was posted...about the reversal and all...
compact cars developed, united stated rocket ranger IV landed on the moon, marilyn monroe was found dead, the first american orbited the earth on the friendship 7 mission/exploration, brazil won the world cup in chile, release of the beatles first hit, first trans-atlantic tv signal was relayed ....
don't think this is getting anywhere ...
or it could be tied to something coming up this year ... maybe the cricket world cup .... just throwing that out there. XD

and just a personal sidetrack comment since they started giving out hints in 2003 ... they have alternated between balls as game pieces (though I think they should stay away from storage bins for a while...) and other things as game pieces ... if they keep that going ... guess there's a possibility of a weird piece this year since they did soccer balls last year.

mkay. i'm done.
thanks for reading...

can't wait till kickoff. :)

P.S. and yes ... i have read all 33 pages of this forum ...