FRC Altium design libraries

[andreboos]

The design packages for the solenoid and analog breakouts and the digital sidecar on this page (http://usfirst.org/roboticsprograms/frc/content.aspx?id=16337) depend on a number of external libraries that I haven't been able to find. The parts are linked to valid Digi-Key supplier information but there are no corresponding footprints. For example, the rectifier on the solenoid breakout depends on a library named FETs.IntLib, which contains the schematic, footprint, and 3D model for that part. Other parts depend on Connectors.IntLib and LEDs.IntLib. Are these FIRST-specific, and if so, where can I find them?

[EricVanWyk]

Those are referencing my own personal libraries.

I was under the impression that the full part info for each of the parts used is contained within the layout and schematic: You should have everything you need to view and modify the designs.

What are you doing, specifically, that requires those libraries? I want to be sure that those packages are fully self sufficient, but I don't want to release my libraries publicly without fully scrubbing them, especially considering that Altium's recent releases essentially make them outmoded.

[andreboos]

Yes, the data seems to be contained within the files and the PCB renders correctly. However, when I try to import changes from the schematic, even when I change nothing, it gives me the error "Footprint Not Found" for each of the components. Validating components gives an error about the nonexistent libraries.

We're designing a "cRIO breakout board" that interfaces directly with the cRIO modules, combining the circuitry of two digital sidecars, two solenoid breakouts, two analog breakouts, and maybe a few sensors on a single PCB. The circuits will be powered independently and be electrically equivalent to the standard hardware, which is why exact component matching is important for us.

[Joe Ross]

We're designing a "cRIO breakout board" that interfaces directly with the cRIO modules, combining the circuitry of two digital sidecars, two solenoid breakouts, two analog breakouts, and maybe a few sensors on a single PCB. The circuits will be powered independently and be electrically equivalent to the standard hardware, which is why exact component matching is important for us.

We had a similar idea, making it so that a single PCB could fit across the top of the cRIO. This would take up less vertical space then the breakout modules sticking out the top and would also free up the space that the digital sidecar uses. It would be great if something like this could be made to be FIRST legal.

[EricVanWyk]

Please PM me with an email address where you want the libraries sent.

[andreboos]

We had a similar idea, making it so that a single PCB could fit across the top of the cRIO. This would take up less vertical space then the breakout modules sticking out the top and would also free up the space that the digital sidecar uses. It would be great if something like this could be made to be FIRST legal.

Our thoughts exactly. The digital sidecar and breakouts are not subject to <R55> and we will be able to provide documentation showing that our board is electrically equivalent to the discrete components, so I believe it is competition-legal.

[Matt Krass]

Our thoughts exactly. The digital sidecar and breakouts are not subject to <R55> and we will be able to provide documentation showing that our board is electrically equivalent to the discrete components, so I believe it is competition-legal.

Rule <R54> requires the breakout to power and control the robot signal light, also required in the same rule:


<R54> ROBOTS shall use the diagnostic Robot Signal Light (RSL) provided in the KOP. It must be mounted on the ROBOT such that it is easily visible while standing three feet in front of the ROBOT in the NORMAL CONFIGURATION. The team has no direct control over the RSL and no programming is required.

A. The RSL must be connected to the “RSL” supply terminals on a Digital Sidecar

B. The Digitial Sidecar must be connected to a NI 9403 module in Slot 4 of the cRIO-FRC.

C. The RSL must be wired for “solid light” operation, by placing a jumper between the La and Lb terminals on the light per Figure 3-5.


Matt

[andreboos]

Rule <R54> requires the breakout to power and control the robot signal light, also required in the same rule

As I see it, the breakout is merely a modification of the sidecar and breakouts, as if I had disassembled two sidecars and glued their respective PCBs together, which would not violate <R55>. <R54> is satisfied because the breakout board is a digital sidecar in all important respects (electrically equivalent).

[Matt Krass]

As I see it, the breakout is merely a modification of the sidecar and breakouts, as if I had disassembled two sidecars and glued their respective PCBs together, which would not violate <R55>. <R54> is satisfied because the breakout board is a digital sidecar in all important respects (electrically equivalent).

Since the refs and inspectors and FTAs rely on the expected behavior of the robot signal light, I suspect they'll be rather stubborn on this particular requirement. While your system may not affect that performance at all, it's additional burden on the inspectors and other crew members to ensure your custom approach is as valid as the standard approach every other team uses. It simply isn't feasible, especially since it falls in the realm of "allow one, allow all". I can't even imagine the havoc of having to inspect so many different versions of the standard unit and making sure they're compatible.

Honestly, it's more than just a breakout board, it handles a lot of the stickier electrical and signal conditioning aspects for you as well, as well as physical compatibility. I think if you tried to replace it you'd find your replacement very similar to the original sidecar, or not very effective.

Matt

[Joe Ross]

When I was talking to NI about the cRIO FRC2, they mentioned that there would be a new layout of the modules for the original cRIO also. Analog in slot 1, digital in slot 2, solenoid in slot 3, and TBD in slot 4.