Performance wheels vs. Plaction wheels

[Andrew Lawrence]

Which do you prefer: Performance wheels or Plaction wheels? Why do you like one over the other?

Thanks!

[IndySam]

Better how?

Plaction price is right and they perform well but performance wheels are cooler.

[Andrew Lawrence]

Better how?

Plaction price is right and they perform well but performance wheels are cooler.

Better overall, in your opinion. And I agree, performance wheels have that coolness factor about them. :cool:

[Ankit S.]

Edit 2: Disregard what follows, I thought performance wheels were something else.



For some reason, I just like the plaction wheels. For that same reason, i just don't like performance wheels. I can't explain it, but i think i like plaction wheels because they are great in traction, size, and weight. I think i dont like performance wheels because I prefer mechanums over them to do fancy tricks...

Now don't get me wrong, they both(performance vs plaction) have their advantages and disadvantages, but imo, plaction all the way <3.

EDIT: Ill think about why its like this, and if you want a better answer, hit me up at CalGames :D .

[Akash Rastogi]

For some reason, I just like the plaction wheels. For that same reason, i just don't like performance wheels. I can't explain it, but i think i like plaction wheels because they are great in traction, size, and weight. I think i dont like performance wheels because I prefer mechanums over them to do fancy tricks...

Now don't get me wrong, they both(performance vs plaction) have their advantages and disadvantages, but imo, plaction all the way <3.

Plaction vs Performance has nothing to do with what you mean by fancy tricks.

Your tread it what gives you traction, not the wheel the tread goes on.

[msimon785]

Exactly. There is absolutely no difference in terms of traction. The CoF will remain subject to the tread riveted TO the wheel. The way I see it, this is an aesthetics vs cost question. While the Performance wheels have an obvious aesthetic advantage - this is undeniable, - they cost $36 / piece (with bearings). This is compared to $26 for the Plaction wheels.

In my personal opinion (and I should say that I will almost always be biased towards aesthetics), they $10 per wheel extra to get the aluminum Performance wheels is definitely worth it. Compared to the overall cost of your robot, $10*[# of wheels] is probably a minute amount of money.

That said, there are definitely situations, ie. a practice bot, in which case there would be no reason for the additional expenditure, given that the robot will likely never be in the public eye.

Just my 2 cents.

[Akash Rastogi]

It is not all aesthetics.

The plaction wheels are easier to use in a drive setup in which sprockets are mounted to either side of the drive wheel whereas performance wheels with hex or key in them are easier to use for let's say a WCD system. Performance wheels have a bolt pattern on only 1 face, so you would have to double mount sprockets in order to run the most common 6wd setup. Each wheel has its benefits. The plaction wheels require a hub if you wish to direct drive, where the performance wheels are broached if desired.

It depends on what you are designing, there's no real "which is better?" in most cases of wheel selection. Tread selection is another issue though.

[Andrew Lawrence]

Thanks for all of the answers so far! We were thinking of performance wheels because of two reasons: They look nice, and one of our placation wheels cracked last year (resulting in little to no control one match at SVR and then running over our own minibot someone knocked off. :( )

[AcesJames]

176 used plaction wheels for the first time in 2011, and we noticed that the little edging that runs along the outside of the wheel that holds the tread in place started to snap off after our first regional. This, of course, eventually led to tread just moving sideways and falling off the wheels. We saw instances of this on all 6 wheels on our drivetrain. So, we ended up replacing all 6 wheels.

In 2012, if our drivetrain is conducive to the use of wheels which use tread, we will most likely use performance wheels. 6 x $36 is much cheaper than 12 x $26. Just something to think about. Of course, if you want to get into which wheel is easier to mount on a certain kind of drivetrain, see Akash's post above.

[Chris is me]

Your tread it what gives you traction, not the wheel the tread goes on.

This isn't entirely true. We had measurably more traction from our Performance 4 inch wheels than our Plaction 6 inch wheels. I suspect it has something to do with the Plaction's deep tread groove.

[Nemo]

For a directly driven wheel, a performance wheel is cheaper and lighter than a plaction wheel + AndyMark hub.

[Mr. B]

We had the same problem as team 176 listed above. Wire ties and rivits helped us get through the competition

[jwfoss]

Both wheels fall into the same category: COTS wheels with replaceable tread. This category also contains the IFI/VEXPro wheels. They all provide the ability to mount up treads of your choice.

For prototyping purposes a set of Plaction wheels will allow you to try different axle sizes (1/2" or 3/8") by switching just the bearings and testing live vs. dead axles (hex or keyway) with the addition of hubs.

I like the flexibility in testing that Plaction wheels offer, but for a competition robot with a defined drivetrain the Performance wheels would be my choice (that is, if i wanted treaded wheels and was happy with only a 1" tread width)

[Chris is me]

For prototyping purposes a set of Plaction wheels will allow you to try different axle sizes (1/2" or 3/8") by switching just the bearings and testing live vs. dead axles (hex or keyway) with the addition of hubs.


FWIW, IFI wheels are pretty much the same in this regard.

[Colin P]

This isn't entirely true. We had measurably more traction from our Performance 4 inch wheels than our Plaction 6 inch wheels. I suspect it has something to do with the Plaction's deep tread groove.

You would've been getting more torque from a 4 inch wheel than a 6 inch wheel, but I'm going to assume you knew that and agree with you that performance wheels edge out the plaction wheels due to that groove design.

[Akash Rastogi]

This isn't entirely true. We had measurably more traction from our Performance 4 inch wheels than our Plaction 6 inch wheels. I suspect it has something to do with the Plaction's deep tread groove.

I've definitely heard this issue before, quite a few times now.

Maybe someone should shoot Andy an email about it.

[Dave McLaughlin]

This isn't entirely true. We had measurably more traction from our Performance 4 inch wheels than our Plaction 6 inch wheels. I suspect it has something to do with the Plaction's deep tread groove.

If it is the same type tread with the same CoF then why would the style of wheel, aside from round, make any difference?

[AdamHeard]

This isn't entirely true. We had measurably more traction from our Performance 4 inch wheels than our Plaction 6 inch wheels. I suspect it has something to do with the Plaction's deep tread groove.

This had more to do with the diameter change I'd wager (as is true of our wheels).

[Brandon Holley]

If it is the same type tread with the same CoF then why would the style of wheel, aside from round, make any difference?

There should be no difference if the treads are interacting with the carpet surface in the same manner (obviously).

There are two issues I can think of that may potentially cause a difference in traction (if one exists):
1. The retaining 'rim' on the plaction wheel has the ability to make contact with the carpet and therefore absorbs some of the normal force versus the smaller 'rim' on the performance wheel. I don't think this is the case though. If I were to guess it would be due to...
2. The draft on the injection molded plaction wheel creates a minor 'V' shape in the tread groove. This may result in only the edges of each piece of tread absorbing normal force and therefor results in a virtual thinner strip of tread versus a flat tread groove in the performance wheel.

That would be my hypothesis to test if I were to do so...

-Brando

[Dave McLaughlin]

Thanks for affirming that my physics teachers have not filled my head with nonsense guys. :)

[thefro526]

This had more to do with the diameter change I'd wager (as is true of our wheels).

I believe Adam is correct.

234 Published Data a long time ago comparing various wheel diameters with the same tread and similar gearing and for some reason 4" wheels came out on top in terms of traction.

[AdamHeard]

I believe Adam is correct.

234 Published Data a long time ago comparing various wheel diameters with the same tread and similar gearing and for some reason 4" wheels came out on top in terms of traction.

If you look at and handle 4" and 6" wheels side by side with roughtop tread, the trend makes sense. As the diameter decreases, the cleat formed by the rows in the tread becomes more and more pronounced. The more pronounced it is, the more it digs into the carpet (I believe).

We haven't proven this theory, but it has been shown that smaller wheels will get more traction (for roughtop).

[Ankit S.]

Plaction vs Performance has nothing to do with what you mean by fancy tricks.

Your tread it what gives you traction, not the wheel the tread goes on.

I realized that performance wheel are NOT the AM trick wheels. Fail on my part. I guess I should research before I post even if I think I know it...

My bad.

[BJT]

That tread holding edge broke on all of our plaction wheels this year too. None of them on our 2010 bot broke through a regional and atlanta, not sure what was different. I think we will be using 4 inch performance wheels this year if they are right for the game.

[Andrew Lawrence]

176 used plaction wheels for the first time in 2011, and we noticed that the little edging that runs along the outside of the wheel that holds the tread in place started to snap off after our first regional. This, of course, eventually led to tread just moving sideways and falling off the wheels. We saw instances of this on all 6 wheels on our drivetrain. So, we ended up replacing all 6 wheels.

In 2012, if our drivetrain is conducive to the use of wheels which use tread, we will most likely use performance wheels. 6 x $36 is much cheaper than 12 x $26. Just something to think about. Of course, if you want to get into which wheel is easier to mount on a certain kind of drivetrain, see Akash's post above.

The exact same thing happened to us! :eek:

[Andrew Lawrence]

If you look at and handle 4" and 6" wheels side by side with roughtop tread, the trend makes sense. As the diameter decreases, the cleat formed by the rows in the tread becomes more and more pronounced. The more pronounced it is, the more it digs into the carpet (I believe).

We haven't proven this theory, but it has been shown that smaller wheels will get more traction (for roughtop).

Why rough top only? That's what we use, but we're just curious.

[AdamHeard]

Why rough top only? That's what we use, but we're just curious.

I imagine there are other treads out there with similar effects, but we only looked at roughtop as it's what we use. The Rows of roughtop tread form cleats that interact with the carpet.

[Tom I]

In my view, weight will determine 90% of all debates with all other things equal.

My team normally pairs up some sort of high-traction wheel with omni-wheels (we call them the "your momni-wheels"). We've never had a problem with the plaction wheels from AndyMark, so while the performance wheels are nice and pretty, we normally cover them with bumpers anyways, so we go with the lighter choice (rated 0.8 lb performance vs 0.66 lb plaction). It's not an outstanding difference, but sometimes every little thing counts.

[Andrew Lawrence]

Are both the performance wheels and the placation wheels the same size? I mean if you had the same size of each and put them right next to each other, will they be the exact same? If not, is it because the wheel frame itself is bigger, or because the tread protrudes out farther?