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-   -   Team Update 2012-02-07 (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=102193)

Joe Ross 07-02-2012 17:01
Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Quote:
Robot Actions
[G21]

Robots may extend one appendage up to 14 in. beyond a single edge of their frame perimeter at any time.
Violation: Foul for exceeding size allotments; Technical-Foul for continuous or repeated violations.

These appendages are intended for use in manipulating Basketballs and/or Bridges. A Robot may have multiple extension devices onboard, but only one may be deployed at a given time.

All portions of an appendage that are outside the Frame Perimeter must be contiguous with each other. Very brief violations of the contiguity requirement as a single appendage is being extended or retracted will not be penalized.


GAME
The Game

The Answer affected by the change to Rule [G21] has been updated in the Q&A.

Eligibility and Inspection
[T09]

The Bill of Materials Template is now available under Section 5 - The Tournament on the Competition Manual section of the FIRST Website.
I think everyone should like the new addition to the blue box for [G21].

Steven Donow 07-02-2012 17:04
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Yay! And the BOM template!




But now hopefully there won't be controversy over the definition of, "very brief". I assume this also allows wheels.

Madison 07-02-2012 17:32
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Given how consistent the Q&A responses were regarding contiguity outside the frame perimeter, it isn't unreasonable to expect that a number of teams -- mine included -- revised or redesigned mechanisms to accommodate the narrow definition of appendage.

The contents of the team update make sense, but it's frustrating that it's an about-face after weeks of getting a consistently different answer.

ChrisH 07-02-2012 19:23
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Welcome to the wonderful world of engineering requirements. At least on this occasion the change makes sense.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Madison (Post 1121854)
Given how consistent the Q&A responses were regarding contiguity outside the frame perimeter, it isn't unreasonable to expect that a number of teams -- mine included -- revised or redesigned mechanisms to accommodate the narrow definition of appendage.

The contents of the team update make sense, but it's frustrating that it's an about-face after weeks of getting a consistently different answer.

wilsonmw04 07-02-2012 21:30
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madison (Post 1121854)
Given how consistent the Q&A responses were regarding contiguity outside the frame perimeter, it isn't unreasonable to expect that a number of teams -- mine included -- revised or redesigned mechanisms to accommodate the narrow definition of appendage.

The contents of the team update make sense, but it's frustrating that it's an about-face after weeks of getting a consistently different answer.

I was bitten by that bug a few years ago. From then on, we have determined what we think is a common sense approach to the rule and go with it. Glad we did. We will make some minor adjustments to the design to increase it's contenuity. I was willing to stick with our design until after what we saw at the week 1 events.

Advise after the fact: Don't get caught up in the CD echo chamber. Make a common sense call and stick with it until the updates prove you right or wrong.

PayneTrain 07-02-2012 22:09
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Madison (Post 1121854)
Given how consistent the Q&A responses were regarding contiguity outside the frame perimeter, it isn't unreasonable to expect that a number of teams -- mine included -- revised or redesigned mechanisms to accommodate the narrow definition of appendage.

The contents of the team update make sense, but it's frustrating that it's an about-face after weeks of getting a consistently different answer.
"Hey guys, what if we just latched onto the tower at our end and fed soccer balls back into our own goals?"

"No way the GDC is going to let that loophole lie open."

The best thing you can do, I think, is design to what the vaguest of definitions make the most sense. This year, a light manual has meant few definite answers and an unfortunately high dependence on the Q&A.

Tristan Lall 07-02-2012 22:51
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by wilsonmw04 (Post 1122031)
Advise after the fact: Don't get caught up in the CD echo chamber. Make a common sense call and stick with it until the updates prove you right or wrong.
That sometimes works. And sometimes the update never comes. And sometimes, when the update comes, it doesn't work the way you'd hoped. FIRST has made many good amendments over the years, but there have been a few awful ones.

wilsonmw04 07-02-2012 23:00
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tristan Lall (Post 1122114)
That sometimes works. And sometimes the update never comes. And sometimes, when the update comes, it doesn't work the way you'd hoped. FIRST has made many good amendments over the years, but there have been a few awful ones.
yeah, that's why i always have a contingency, but it's small changes. It's the benefit of not being a week 1 regional anymore.

dellagd 07-02-2012 23:36
Re: Team Update 2012-02-07
 
Well, then this solves the "H" appendage problem. Wunderbar!


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