a question for Shooters
 

Hey teams,

I'm seeing many shooters that look amazing, but i cant help but ask, how good are you? Has anyone tested their shooters with low light, obstructions, slightly worn foam balls etc.
I often test mechanisms to death in order to find out if our team is "cheating" by assisting or adjusting to our specific shop conditions. I cant wait to see all these great shooters @NYC, but im curious to know how do you deal with some defense and varying conditions?

I by no means want to see code, as i don't deal with that, i am just a curious mechanical person.

Good luck to all.

We don't have any vision targeting for an assist, we shoot by driver skill. Our robot is mainly designed to shoot for the middle hoop but can shoot to the top hoop if the ball is dense enough. We practiced with damaged and new balls and outside on concrete so we didnt have any advantages.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

Everything works great in the shop. In competition it's a different matter altogether.
When in competition there a many variables that teams never think to consider such as having a teenager at the controls who has never had to deal with a high pressure situation before and is wilting under the lights ,dealing with poor alliance partners who wouldn't be able to buy a clue if they paid for it with an inheritance and elite robot teams in the opposite alliance station destroying all who lay in their path. Even practice can't simulate that.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

Going off the last post, I always think our team is hot stuff until someone pulls back the curtain on some devastator at the competition.

Also, in the magical world of Chief Delphi, every member of the forum likely has a robot that can operate or play some aspect of the game. Problem is, Chief Delphi only counts for 30-40% in the real world; the sad truth is some teams derp around in the dark all year because they can't/won't be helped at any time, even at competition when they are a BLT that can't even move.

I'd say that most shooters you see on CD can put up a few baskets, but that's really not saying much. :/

Re: a question for Shooters
 

I actually think CD represents on 5% of the general FIRST community, if not less.
Most people just read and don't participate for various reasons.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

Yup, our robots always work so much better at home than they do on the field....but I think we'll do ok with our shooter. I'm guessing that being able to shoot 50% from the key in matches will mean you have a pretty good robot.

I know we don't have nearly enough driver practice, especially with other robots on the field. But that's normal for us. And one reason we like to go to two regionals.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

This.
Teams that have gone to two regionals have been shown over the years to be more competitive at the championships than team that have went to only one. That's why I think the district system will be so much more helpful to so many teams in the future.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

Our shooter has worked well in a variety of situations (although the teenager under stress aspect can't be minimized). We have an interesting control board: the shooter portion of the board has about a dozen push buttons laid out on a drawing of the field. When our robot is in one of these 12 positions, the human shooter only has to push the correct button and the programming will set velocity/angle and shoot. We didn't have time to test this method of shooting, but we're hopeful. If it works, it could be considered for a control award.

Re: a question for Shooters
 

Well, as far as my teams shooter goes we generally used an angle that best suits situations that we know we can be sucessfull with. There was a couple of things that we learned during the development of our shooter.

1) It needs to be able to change trajectory (however you do it)

2) you may need to change speeds

3) you need to be able to shoot over 60" before the ball leaves the frame

4) Taking a little experience from rack and roll, Set positions are key to being able to reproduce a shot

Those are just some things we learned, aside from shooting is going to be only at most, half the game anyway. :]

Re: a question for Shooters
 

That's why we have competitions and don't just vote in the winners based on videos. The fact is, nobody knows how good they are until they get to the competition.

Unveil videos give you a decent idea about what a machine is capable of, but they are usually edited to show only what the team wants you to see. In competition we don't get multiple takes, we can't stop and start the clock to make sure that the robot is lined up and positioned perfectly to shoot, and there aren't other robots on the field trying their best to make us look bad. Not to mention the pressure of working to the clock and the stress of being under the spotlight.

We have learned over the years that a good drive team with a lot of practice time and a simple, driver-friendly machine is a good way to go. A human-in-the-loop control system is usually faster and less prone to issues than the "technological" solution. How many teams were successful with the line sensors or reflectors in 2011, targets in 2010, trailer-top targets in 2009, green lights in 2007 (maybe so in 2006), vision tetras in 2005, etc. Perhaps this year will be different, but I expect that the straight-on shot from the key or up against the fender, with or without auto targeting, will be the workhorse this year. Balancing with strangers and no time on the clock is going to be all about the drivers, too.

We'll find out soon enough!

Re: a question for Shooters
 

My team personally has a mostly defensive strategy using our shooter. However, we can switch to offensive if need be. We are far shooters, and can only reach the top and possibly the middle if we miss the top shot. We only rely on our shooter and driver, one of which is me to make the shots by eye. From our testing, once we set up in the right position our shots are pretty consistent with one another.

Hope to see you all @NYC Regional! :D