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Chief Delphi (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/index.php)
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-   -   Archimedes 2012! (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105773)

Adam Freeman 20-04-2012 20:52
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
WOW a Dave Verbrugge Chief Delphi sighting....awesome! :yikes:

We can't wait to get this party started.

qzrrbz 20-04-2012 21:12
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Verbrugge (Post 1160691)
See you in St Louis. Best Regards, Dave.
Wow! Now *doubly* sad not to be in Archimedes! :)

Billfred 20-04-2012 21:33
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Freeman (Post 1160706)
WOW a Dave Verbrugge Chief Delphi sighting....awesome! :yikes:

We can't wait to get this party started.
This. Dave's one of the all-time greats, and we on Los Pollos Locos look forward to doing business with him early and often. If that happens to be about ten times after lunch on Saturday, all the better :)

Joe Ross 20-04-2012 21:38
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Similar to what I did in previous years, I ran through 200 simulated qualification match schedules (with 9 matches per team, using the FIRST match generator).

I used each team's highest adjusted opr at any event to choose that team's "best event". Then, for that event, I used their unadjusted OPR for their contribution to a match. I also used the hybrid OPR, bridge OPR, teleop OPR to help calculate the standings. For the co-op bridge, I summed the co-op OPR for all 6 robots in the match and compared that to a threshold. When back-testing against regionals, if the threshold was chosen to be close to the number of actual co-ops at the regional, it had a relatively high correlation to the actual results on the co-op bridge. Almost all regionals had a correlation co-efficient of between 0.6 and 0.85. However, at the Michigan State Championship, the correlation coefficient was only 0.3. I believe this is because almost all of the robots there were able to balance so the balances that didn't happen weren't be cause of the robots, but because of luck. I used this method for calculating the co-ops, trying to get a co-op percent of around 60% (higher then most regionals, but lower then MSC). Overall, this isn't a very good way to do it, as it punishes teams at early regionals and regionals where teams did not co-op that much. However, it's included to help simulate the randomness of the rankings this year. All OPR data is from Ed Law's spreadsheet.

I calculated the results for each of the 200 simulated qualification schedules, and then looked at some statistics from the aggregate results.

Since the standings are much more complicated this year, and the co-op bridge is so important, and there isn't a very good way to simulate it, I looked at both the ranks, the number of qualification points, and the number of wins.

Everyone should attend Karthik's presentation at the championships where he covers "Why 'OPR' is a flawed indicator in Rebound Rumble".

The following were the values that were used in the simulation
Code:
Team        OPR        Teleop        Hybrid        Bridge        Coop
67        36.70        19.41        11.17        6.12        1.06
2056        36.61        23.24        11.81        1.63        0.30
1114        35.10        18.64        15.19        0.91        0.78
359        30.79        19.15        9.14        2.79        1.27
1218        30.55        21.75        7.82        1.88        1.13
973        28.16        13.06        4.97        3.05        0.23
2590        26.84        13.99        6.09        6.76        0.16
1676        25.02        14.09        8.96        1.86        0.89
2826        24.35        12.57        8.34        3.44        0.92
1796        23.67        11.61        9.58        2.57        0.50
2415        23.42        14.01        4.60        5.53        0.27
1311        23.15        11.10        10.38        1.48        0.18
716        22.90        10.60        5.06        7.19        0.03
2996        22.70        9.88        7.82        5.09        0.56
245        22.58        8.63        7.30        6.65        0.44
195        21.68        12.79        4.65        4.05        1.06
2614        21.39        8.63        6.61        6.16        0.28
2046        21.27        12.87        5.02        3.49        0.42
75        20.94        8.12        9.43        3.40        0.53
3968        20.92        10.65        6.60        3.54        0.69
1592        20.85        13.16        6.06        1.52        0.02
1816        19.58        4.76        10.48        4.26        -0.35
2557        19.35        5.98        3.75        9.63        0.87
272        18.51        7.25        7.45        3.81        0.46
126        17.73        9.56        5.47        3.31        0.78
3015        17.69        4.48        7.57        5.53        0.08
1868        17.64        9.20        5.40        3.90        0.47
1403        17.09        7.24        8.30        1.73        0.96
2603        16.54        4.59        7.68        4.27        -0.16
3476        16.42        8.29        5.68        2.44        -0.06
1902        15.93        3.58        4.77        7.38        0.60
1756        15.50        7.75        3.88        3.87        0.49
234        15.05        7.80        3.29        4.12        -0.08
2898        14.36        4.61        7.87        2.18        0.51
1987        14.35        4.26        8.05        1.99        0.07
2512        14.33        9.60        1.28        3.67        -0.14
781        14.13        6.09        0.13        7.71        0.19
247        13.80        2.77        6.85        3.74        0.26
3008        13.67        6.53        5.90        1.33        -0.16
4334        13.50        4.46        4.99        4.05        0.78
369        13.23        2.75        7.60        2.84        0.69
3997        13.20        6.02        4.42        2.58        0.28
1261        12.81        5.75        3.77        3.06        0.23
4256        12.77        3.54        5.38        3.92        0.25
1736        12.50        4.00        3.60        4.90        0.17
1647        12.45        4.72        4.60        3.12        -0.14
839        12.25        5.67        0.99        5.30        0.30
3747        11.50        3.70        3.31        4.49        0.26
2949        10.85        1.00        6.97        3.15        0.93
1504        10.78        6.32        5.75        -1.28        0.45
3947        10.64        5.63        2.94        2.07        0.66
587        10.52        2.11        3.88        4.84        0.45
100        10.00        2.69        4.46        0.73        0.01
2851        9.99        4.22        1.28        4.49        0.88
2974        8.57        3.22        4.93        0.15        0.11
1458        8.56        1.41        4.64        2.99        -0.03
2022        8.48        4.07        1.39        2.93        0.61
3481        8.48        5.29        0.86        2.44        0.05
4143        8.04        0.63        4.91        2.50        0.06
20        7.93        3.95        0.79        2.96        0.01
3335        7.91        0.60        4.87        2.64        -0.10
128        7.85        1.78        3.97        2.11        0.46
4356        7.55        0.05        0.40        6.88        -0.09
2395        7.50        6.48        1.23        -0.21        -0.32
2638        7.37        5.69        1.95        -1.30        0.50
1        7.36        2.70        1.45        3.20        -0.04
4001        7.12        1.95        0.73        4.66        0.51
1306        7.02        2.23        6.18        -1.39        0.25
3456        6.85        1.98        0.39        4.63        0.20
190        6.62        1.99        5.48        -1.09        -0.04
1875        6.40        4.25        1.20        1.16        -0.16
1014        6.22        0.28        5.60        0.68        0.27
1642        6.15        0.39        0.15        5.30        0.48
144        5.98        3.99        3.94        -2.06        -0.26
1710        5.60        1.20        4.92        -0.56        -0.17
2403        5.59        2.84        0.98        2.57        0.14
236        4.94        3.61        4.49        -2.85        0.25
2410        4.84        0.70        3.26        0.89        -0.09
2815        4.54        4.93        1.65        -2.03        0.21
3410        4.49        0.63        1.00        2.42        -0.07
246        4.47        1.12        0.12        3.24        0.37
4300        4.15        3.80        1.51        -0.84        0.02
2648        4.07        4.21        -2.41        2.27        0.50
1058        3.91        -0.23        0.46        0.86        0.05
3081        3.91        -0.93        2.48        2.18        -0.22
3158        3.88        0.91        1.58        1.85        0.05
1018        3.79        1.09        4.06        -1.36        -0.08
2809        3.68        4.38        -0.21        -1.53        0.13
692        2.70        2.60        -0.82        0.62        0.43
2085        2.70        1.82        0.23        0.41        0.37
4403        1.92        1.16        0.52        0.39        0.50
956        1.76        2.06        1.81        -2.10        0.05
3999        1.44        -0.82        2.77        -2.06        0.16
4218        1.35        -0.11        0.24        1.30        0.31
4206        0.44        1.16        -1.98        1.56        0.21
4082        0.22        0.61        0.46        -0.26        0.03
3585        0.07        -0.25        -0.65        1.04        -0.12
3128        -0.78        -1.40        0.03        0.17        -0.13
3927        -1.75        -0.85        0.11        -1.16        0.19
3634        -5.53        0.03        -3.29        -2.67        0.31
Seeds:
Code:
        avg        med        mode        min        max        stdev        top8        #1
67        3.25        3        1        1        15        2.61        191        64
2056        12.67        11        8        1        60        8.81        73        5
1114        5.65        4        1        1        38        5.57        159        39
359        4.35        3        2        1        32        4.04        179        36
1218        5.11        4        3        1        45        4.86        173        28
973        25.77        22.5        19        4        69        14.09        9        0
2590        26.79        24        17        5        87        13.85        7        0
1676        10.63        9        6        1        43        7.86        94        2
2826        10.01        8        4        1        41        7.83        111        7
1796        18.33        16        9        1        84        13.37        48        2
2415        29.29        27.5        25        5        77        15.24        7        0
1311        31.77        29        21        3        80        15.84        6        0
716        39.48        36        35        7        89        17.80        2        0
2996        19.09        17        13        1        66        12.57        40        3
245        23.45        21        11        1        70        14.37        26        1
195        12.09        10        7        1        40        8.21        87        5
2614        31.06        28        25        3        88        17.06        13        0
2046        27.68        25        16        4        78        15.83        16        0
75        22.23        19.5        15        2        79        13.28        28        0
3968        17.81        14.5        8        1        70        12.74        53        1
1592        43.59        40        40        8        99        20.17        1        0
1816        57.86        59        52        16        99        18.62        0        0
2557        19.00        15.5        11        1        68        12.74        37        1
272        26.66        24        18        2        74        14.76        15        0
126        19.67        17        17        1        56        12.21        40        2
3015        42.26        39        23        7        92        19.11        1        0
1868        30.48        28        17        1        81        16.74        16        1
1403        16.92        14        8        1        54        11.78        58        2
2603        54.75        53        53        12        97        20.00        0        0
3476        55.01        52.5        40        8        100        20.64        1        0
1902        29.31        27        32        1        83        15.67        8        1
1756        32.89        29        26        2        93        18.67        7        0
234        58.91        57.5        45        15        99        20.01        0        0
2898        30.49        29        32        2        99        17.53        12        0
1987        49.67        47        43        13        99        21.47        0        0
2512        66.46        67        78        16        100        18.89        0        0
781        53.27        52        60        8        100        21.76        1        0
247        46.12        45        42        4        90        20.38        3        0
3008        61.56        62        67        16        99        20.62        0        0
4334        26.15        25        21        2        92        13.55        11        0
369        27.55        24        12        2        75        15.92        12        0
3997        45.82        45        34        7        92        19.16        2        0
1261        49.97        49        49        11        98        18.81        0        0
4256        45.73        44        43        8        96        18.44        1        0
1736        53.71        54.5        47        5        98        20.70        1        0
1647        69.82        75        75        15        100        19.45        0        0
839        51.87        51        49        12        99        19.69        0        0
3747        51.74        52        52        13        93        19.77        0        0
2949        24.19        20        19        2        80        15.23        23        0
1504        43.87        41        47        10        93        19.67        0        0
3947        38.57        36        26        2        88        18.14        6        0
587        43.49        43        58        6        90        18.80        3        0
100        61.46        64        73        23        99        20.39        0        0
2851        30.72        28        23        4        90        17.51        12        0
2974        57.21        56        56        12        100        21.18        0        0
1458        70.04        72        87        21        100        18.86        0        0
2022        45.32        44        51        6        95        20.44        4        0
3481        69.72        72.5        88        10        100        19.31        0        0
4143        68.10        69.5        96        17        100        19.44        0        0
20        70.76        71.5        65        25        100        18.84        0        0
3335        68.97        68        68        20        100        19.37        0        0
128        50.23        50        60        8        95        20.32        1        0
4356        77.40        79        91        22        100        16.35        0        0
2395        84.44        89        96        32        100        14.46        0        0
2638        49.05        50        54        9        94        19.54        0        0
1        72.86        77        91        20        100        18.66        0        0
4001        49.13        46        36        12        94        19.64        0        0
1306        58.21        60        69        11        95        19.78        0        0
3456        61.68        61        48        11        99        20.42        0        0
190        70.82        74.5        90        18        100        20.86        0        0
1875        80.12        85        92        14        100        16.58        0        0
1014        58.26        57        54        12        98        20.60        0        0
1642        57.33        59        73        13        96        19.62        0        0
144        80.70        85        95        18        100        17.48        0        0
1710        77.36        81.5        94        30        100        17.43        0        0
2403        68.09        70        60        9        100        18.46        0        0
236        63.07        64        88        14        100        20.12        0        0
2410        77.15        80.5        90        7        100        17.83        1        0
2815        65.93        67        85        9        100        19.91        0        0
3410        80.54        83        99        31        100        15.26        0        0
246        62.25        62        62        15        98        19.33        0        0
4300        75.45        79        91        9        100        18.51        0        0
2648        59.16        60        53        16        99        21.54        0        0
1058        79.60        84        83        28        100        16.46        0        0
3081        82.69        86        100        23        100        15.06        0        0
3158        74.78        78.5        84        21        100        18.77        0        0
1018        77.94        79.5        78        25        100        15.24        0        0
2809        71.96        74        98        13        100        19.62        0        0
692        60.30        62.5        49        6        100        21.63        1        0
2085        62.93        63        63        17        98        20.44        0        0
4403        61.50        62        82        13        99        19.08        0        0
956        75.00        80        81        15        100        17.89        0        0
3999        74.19        77        88        17        100        17.67        0        0
4218        68.16        70        76        9        98        18.69        0        0
4206        75.18        77        69        38        100        16.48        0        0
4082        84.92        90        99        37        100        14.01        0        0
3585        87.01        92        100        26        100        14.52        0        0
3128        87.76        93        100        42        100        12.39        0        0
3927        80.52        84        97        20        100        16.19        0        0
3634        80.42        83.5        94        23        100        15.48        0        0
QPs:
Code:
        avg        med        mode        min        max        stdev        Perfect
67        32.28        32        34        26        36        2.26        21
2056        27.14        28        28        18        36        3.02        1
1114        30.37        30        30        20        36        2.98        9
359        32.00        32        34        23        36        2.48        15
1218        31.61        32        32        20        36        2.61        11
973        24.26        24        26        16        32        3.25        0
2590        23.76        24        24        12        32        3.29        0
1676        28.35        28        28        20        34        3.03        0
2826        28.84        29.5        30        20        36        3.20        3
1796        25.73        26        28        13        36        3.69        1
2415        23.40        24        22        14        32        3.34        0
1311        22.18        22        22        14        32        3.24        0
716        21.28        22        22        12        30        3.47        0
2996        25.67        26        24        16        36        3.75        1
245        24.58        24        24        14        33        3.57        0
195        28.61        28        30        22        36        3.19        3
2614        22.74        23        24        12        31        3.68        0
2046        23.92        24        26        14        32        3.70        0
75        24.59        24        26        14        34        3.33        0
3968        26.19        26        28        16        34        3.53        0
1592        20.15        20        20        7        30        3.94        0
1816        17.29        18        18        8        26        3.31        0
2557        26.38        26        26        16        36        3.39        1
272        23.77        24        26        14        32        3.36        0
126        26.02        26        26        18        34        3.50        0
3015        20.20        20        22        10        28        3.53        0
1868        23.42        24        24        14        34        3.84        0
1403        26.42        26        26        18        34        3.58        0
2603        17.87        18        18        8        26        3.51        0
3476        17.99        18        20        6        30        3.97        0
1902        23.53        24        24        14        34        3.57        0
1756        22.93        24        24        10        34        4.07        0
234        17.77        18        20        6        27        3.74        0
2898        22.68        22        22        6        33        3.94        0
1987        18.84        19.5        20        8        27        3.95        0
2512        16.61        16        16        7        25        3.68        0
781        19.29        19        18        7        30        4.05        0
247        19.63        20        22        11        30        3.90        0
3008        16.71        17        16        6        26        3.92        0
4334        24.15        24        22        12        33        3.15        0
369        23.45        24        24        14        32        3.64        0
3997        20.14        20        18        12        30        3.64        0
1261        19.34        20        18        8        28        3.63        0
4256        19.96        20        18        10        30        3.47        0
1736        18.64        18        18        8        31        4.00        0
1647        15.33        15        14        6        26        3.78        0
839        19.48        20        20        10        28        3.58        0
3747        19.15        20        20        10        28        3.71        0
2949        24.49        24        24        14        34        3.67        0
1504        20.18        20        20        10        28        3.67        0
3947        21.84        22        20        12        34        3.76        0
587        20.65        20        20        11        30        3.66        0
100        17.02        16        16        8        24        3.77        0
2851        23.77        24        24        12        32        3.68        0
2974        17.66        18        18        6        26        4.04        0
1458        15.18        15        14        6        24        3.72        0
2022        20.71        20        22        12        32        3.84        0
3481        16.02        16        16        6        27        3.81        0
4143        15.58        16        16        4        26        3.94        0
20        15.78        16        16        6        24        3.73        0
3335        15.37        16        18        6        24        3.92        0
128        19.37        20        20        10        29        3.84        0
4356        14.48        14        16        4        24        3.68        0
2395        12.57        12        12        2        23        3.64        0
2638        19.85        20        18        10        29        3.64        0
1        15.25        15        14        4        26        3.97        0
4001        19.90        20        22        10        28        3.60        0
1306        17.54        17        16        9        28        3.71        0
3456        17.71        18        18        9        28        3.82        0
190        15.05        14        14        6        26        4.15        0
1875        13.72        14        14        6        25        3.66        0
1014        17.45        18        18        8        28        3.80        0
1642        18.60        18        18        11        28        3.44        0
144        12.87        12.5        14        1        26        4.05        0
1710        13.58        14        12        2        22        3.76        0
2403        16.36        16        16        8        30        3.55        0
236        16.77        16        16        6        26        3.76        0
2410        14.01        14        14        4        30        3.92        0
2815        16.59        16        18        8        27        3.89        0
3410        13.61        14        14        4        24        3.57        0
246        17.64        18        18        10        26        3.62        0
4300        14.50        14        12        5        32        4.04        0
2648        18.43        18        18        8        28        3.84        0
1058        14.11        14        14        6        24        3.50        0
3081        12.79        13        14        1        24        3.76        0
3158        14.64        14        14        6        24        3.93        0
1018        13.78        14        14        5        24        3.40        0
2809        15.53        16        16        6        26        4.10        0
692        18.19        18        16        8        32        4.09        0
2085        17.46        17        16        8        26        3.73        0
4403        17.68        18        18        8        28        3.53        0
956        14.75        14        14        6        26        3.64        0
3999        14.65        14        14        6        26        3.73        0
4218        16.53        16        18        10        29        3.43        0
4206        15.28        16        16        8        22        3.37        0
4082        12.65        12        12        2        23        3.61        0
3585        12.10        12        12        2        24        3.82        0
3128        11.71        12        12        4        22        3.48        0
3927        13.81        14        14        4        26        3.60        0
3634        14.14        14        14        6        24        3.51        0
Wins:
Code:
        avg        med        mode        min        max        stdev        Perfect
67        8.03        8        8        5        9        0.89        68
2056        8.09        8        8        5        9        0.94        78
1114        7.85        8        8        4        9        1.04        63
359        7.41        8        8        4        9        1.13        32
1218        7.51        8        8        4        9        1.12        36
973        7.02        7        7        3        9        1.19        20
2590        6.91        7        7        2        9        1.29        21
1676        6.54        6.5        6        3        9        1.29        13
2826        6.48        6.5        6        3        9        1.30        10
1796        6.46        7        7        3        9        1.31        10
2415        6.29        6        6        2        9        1.39        5
1311        6.26        6        6        3        9        1.30        4
716        6.27        6        7        2        9        1.35        6
2996        6.38        6        6        3        9        1.31        7
245        6.33        6        6        3        9        1.35        4
195        6.10        6        7        3        9        1.37        6
2614        5.89        6        6        2        9        1.33        2
2046        5.92        6        6        1        9        1.57        7
75        5.86        6        6        3        9        1.29        2
3968        6.03        6        6        2        9        1.39        4
1592        5.96        6        7        1        9        1.53        4
1816        5.87        6        6        2        9        1.30        4
2557        5.58        6        5        2        9        1.40        3
272        5.68        6        6        2        9        1.41        1
126        5.60        6        6        2        9        1.48        2
3015        5.69        6        6        2        9        1.42        1
1868        5.63        6        6        2        9        1.41        4
1403        5.29        5        6        1        9        1.58        1
2603        5.38        5        5        2        9        1.40        3
3476        5.08        5        5        1        8        1.52        0
1902        5.04        5        5        1        9        1.43        2
1756        5.27        5        6        2        9        1.51        4
234        4.93        5        4        1        8        1.48        0
2898        4.99        5        5        1        9        1.50        2
1987        4.77        5        4        1        9        1.53        1
2512        4.79        5        4        2        8        1.45        0
781        4.69        5        4        1        9        1.49        1
247        4.69        5        5        1        9        1.54        1
3008        4.84        5        5        1        8        1.49        0
4334        4.68        5        5        0        8        1.43        0
369        4.64        5        5        1        8        1.55        0
3997        4.67        5        5        1        8        1.40        0
1261        4.50        4        4        1        9        1.48        1
4256        4.63        5        4        0        8        1.46        0
1736        4.42        4        5        1        9        1.55        1
1647        4.23        4        4        0        9        1.44        2
839        4.40        5        5        1        8        1.43        0
3747        4.19        4        4        0        8        1.50        0
2949        4.34        4        5        0        9        1.56        1
1504        3.98        4        4        1        7        1.45        0
3947        4.10        4        4        1        8        1.51        0
587        4.16        4        4        0        8        1.56        0
100        4.26        4        5        0        8        1.45        0
2851        4.14        4        5        1        8        1.59        0
2974        4.09        4        4        1        8        1.54        0
1458        3.73        4        4        0        7        1.31        0
2022        3.55        3        3        0        8        1.50        0
3481        3.68        4        4        1        8        1.38        0
4143        3.53        4        4        0        8        1.59        0
20        3.76        4        4        0        8        1.63        0
3335        3.81        4        4        0        8        1.54        0
128        3.63        4        4        0        8        1.44        0
4356        3.36        3        3        0        8        1.47        0
2395        3.51        3        3        0        8        1.40        0
2638        3.64        4        4        0        7        1.53        0
1        3.48        4        4        0        7        1.49        0
4001        3.56        4        3        1        7        1.46        0
1306        3.47        3        3        0        8        1.46        0
3456        3.69        4        4        0        7        1.49        0
190        3.35        3        3        0        8        1.48        0
1875        3.39        3        3        0        8        1.49        0
1014        3.29        3        3        0        7        1.44        0
1642        3.18        3        3        0        7        1.37        0
144        3.25        3        3        0        8        1.56        0
1710        3.34        3        3        0        7        1.40        0
2403        3.30        3        3        0        8        1.31        0
236        3.13        3        4        0        8        1.43        0
2410        3.20        3        3        0        8        1.34        0
2815        3.11        3        2        0        7        1.44        0
3410        2.95        3        3        0        7        1.44        0
246        3.07        3        3        0        7        1.34        0
4300        2.95        3        3        0        8        1.38        0
2648        3.02        3        3        0        8        1.50        0
1058        2.73        3        3        0        6        1.38        0
3081        3.13        3        4        0        7        1.39        0
3158        2.97        3        3        0        7        1.51        0
1018        3.05        3        3        0        7        1.33        0
2809        3.06        3        3        0        7        1.35        0
692        3.00        3        2        0        8        1.58        0
2085        2.89        3        2        0        7        1.28        0
4403        2.53        2        2        0        6        1.31        0
956        2.75        3        3        0        7        1.30        0
3999        2.55        2        2        0        6        1.33        0
4218        2.67        3        2        0        6        1.38        0
4206        2.50        2        2        0        6        1.31        0
4082        2.22        2        2        0        6        1.22        0
3585        2.35        2        2        0        6        1.29        0
3128        2.16        2        2        0        5        1.32        0
3927        1.98        2        2        0        5        1.21        0
3634        1.62        2        1        0        4        1.14        0

RoboTigers1796 20-04-2012 23:01
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Team 1796 is excited to be in this sure to be exciting division. I realized our robot picture isn't anywhere easily accessible so I attached one. Any questions feel free to ask. We look forward to meeting everyone in St. Louis!

DonRotolo 21-04-2012 10:55
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Verbrugge (Post 1160691)
I know who you snagged and I couldn't be more pleased. Me.
Awesome doesn't even scratch the surface here folks.

CalTran 21-04-2012 11:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Verbrugge (Post 1160691)
I know who you snagged and I couldn't be more pleased. Me.
^That's one signature spot down, only like a dozen more to go.

Well then, I'm super excited to go. Monday and Tuesday aren't going to fly by fast enough at all. We're super excited to come out, and with some new revelations and secret weapons we're just itching to deploy, look out world, Team 2410 is going to take y'all for a wild Mustang ride.

Banderoonies 21-04-2012 12:48
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banderoonies (Post 1160682)
here is the link to all the archimedes robots and their pics. This one shouldn't get locked out for "excessive traffic" the way the drop box did. Sorry about that everyone.

Enjoy!

liam.larkin 21-04-2012 13:04
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
1 Attachment(s)
Sorry we are so late to the party. Attached you will find an image of Team 272 The Cyber Crusaders.

Good luck everyone

Carolyn_Grace 21-04-2012 18:04
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Dave as Emcee.
Rob as FTA.
Walker as VC.
...could this field crew get any better?!
So pumped for Archimedes!

dodar 21-04-2012 18:07
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Carolyn_Grace (Post 1161013)
Dave as Emcee.
Rob as FTA.
Walker as VC.
...could this field crew get any better?!
So pumped for Archimedes!
VC?

Richard Wallace 21-04-2012 18:18
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1161014)
VC?
Volunteer coordinator.

A key volunteer role, and a critical one for the smooth operation of any FRC event.

Doug G 21-04-2012 22:53
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Banderoonies (Post 1160463)
Hi,

Does anyone have pictures of these robots?

1058
1311
1875
2085
2395
2410
3158
3634

They are the only ones missing from my file
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/74551503/Arc...es%20copy.pptx
Here's a photo we have of 2085's robot. It is a small footprint robot about 28x28, 8 wheel drive, WITH BRAKES and turreted shooter.

noyest 22-04-2012 15:14
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
1 Attachment(s)
Here's a more current picture of Team 236's robot. We've got more pictures and video at http://www.technoticks236.com/

MatthewT 22-04-2012 20:08
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Here is a video of 1311's robot. In the video we had one of our drivers driving the two man setup ( We will be faster and have both drivers in St. Louis). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JmCKK8W_bEM

Dan Richardson 22-04-2012 21:09
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
We have an unfinished picture of 1875 and their turreted shooter here: http://www.modulox.com/?attachment_id=987

/edit I just realized that they don't have their boom on in the picture. They have a boom the extends down and helps them lower the ramp and heard balls on the field.

I've been told they've made a lot improvements to shooter code since the Orlando Regional and are ready to turn some heads at their first FIRST championship.:yikes:

On a more serious note, when reading Dave's post I distinctly heard his voice saying it. It was a strange ethereal and movie-esque experience, but I swear to you, the voice in my head was distinctly Dave's. Did this happen to anyone else?

deshnik 24-04-2012 08:02
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Anyone know where to find the link to the webcast?

CalTran 24-04-2012 08:13
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
TheRedAlliance or Madstream will have it, but the direct link to the NASA page can be found here.

Hotontherim 24-04-2012 09:01
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I am really excited to go to St. Louis this year! The division has some really good teams, and being on a rookie team, I think there's a lot to learn there from the more experienced competitors. (:

CalTran 24-04-2012 09:06
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hotontherim (Post 1162292)
being on a rookie team, I think there's a lot to learn there from the more experienced competitors. (:
You don't have to be just a rookie to learn from competitors. But that is still most definitely a correct statement. Be sure to stop by our pit if you ever need help! We're on the corner of 2415 and across from 1987, straight into Archi from the center court of the practice field.

Teamcodeorange 26-04-2012 06:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Picture of Code Orange 3476's robot! http://i1009.photobucket.com/albums/...e/77a46738.jpg

Schnabel 26-04-2012 10:27
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Is anyone able to get this webcast working? At the moment they have the Einstein webcast for both Archimedes and Einstein.

mathking 26-04-2012 10:33
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I think they just have both links directed at Einstein. They both show up with the same address. Very frustrating. The first time in 10 years not going to a competition. Hopefully they will get it corrected soon.

Schnabel 26-04-2012 10:44
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
It's fixed now! http://mfile.akamai.com/18569/live/r...asx?bkup=40837

Schnabel 26-04-2012 15:19
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Ok I'm confused, what happened to the rule where there can't be a tie during qualifications? I thought the tie breaker worked like elims with an electronic coin flip deciding the fate all else being equal. Am I missing something here?

EricH 26-04-2012 15:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schnabel (Post 1162966)
Ok I'm confused, what happened to the rule where there can't be a tie during qualifications? I thought the tie breaker worked like elims with an electronic coin flip deciding the fate all else being equal. Am I missing something here?
Rule that there can't be a tie during qualifications? What rulebook are you reading?

During eliminations and ranking are the only places there can't be a tie. Ties in qualifications are 1 ranking point plus whatever coop points you get. Ties in eliminations are settled by a defined set of tiebreakers--no coin flip, though.
Ties in ranking are settled by a different defined set of tiebreakers--that's where the coin flip comes in.

Schnabel 26-04-2012 15:24
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by EricH (Post 1162967)
Ties in ranking are settled by a different defined set of tiebreakers--that's where the coin flip comes in.
Ok that's probably what I was thinking. For some reason I thought there was something against having a tie in qualifications too. Thanks.

KrazyCarl92 26-04-2012 16:13
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Has anyone noticed the improper assignment of coop points?

Quote:
[G41]
If a Robot from each Alliance is Balanced on the Coopertition Bridge when the final score for a Qualification Match is assessed per Rule [G37], each Alliance earns 2 Coopertition Points. If the Coopertition Bridge is not Balanced, but a Robot from each Alliance is fully supported by the Coopertition Bridge, each Alliance will earn 1 Coopertition Point.
emphasis mine

In matches 6, 12, and 17 so far on Archimedes, 1 CP has been awarded for instances where robots are touching the unbalanced Coop Bridge, but not fully supported by it. What is the ruling on this? It seems black and white to me that these should be 0 CP...

wdell 26-04-2012 16:21
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Um, was looking at the bot pictures... the picture you have for 3999 is wrong. That pic is of 399. 3999 is green... really, really green.

mathking 26-04-2012 21:15
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
So any big surprises in Archimedes so far? I am stuck not attending for the first time in 10 years, and only watching the webcast.

FlyingHedgeHog 26-04-2012 22:44
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathking (Post 1163006)
So any big surprises in Archimedes so far? I am stuck not attending for the first time in 10 years, and only watching the webcast.
1st time at championships and 2898 Is at the top of the pack :) (For now...)

Austin2046 27-04-2012 01:37
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by FlyingHedgeHog (Post 1163027)
1st time at championships and 2898 Is at the top of the pack :) (For now...)
Great work you guys! keep it up. We unfortunately had a less than stellar day... we missed our first match entirely as someone misplaced our front bumper... we found it and ran out to the field but the crew wouldn't let us on and our alliance lost the match. After that it wasn't much better. We had an air leak in our second match so we lost pressure and couldn't use our multi-tool... we lost by 1 point. Then we just made some bad decisions and wasted time in our 3rd match... we lost by 2 points. Things luckily started to click by our fourth match today, and we squeaked out a win by 2 points, with a co-op balance. It's amazing to me to see how many close matches there've been on our field! Personally, I'd rather get creamed than lose by just a point or 2 :P anyway, best of luck to everyone tomorrow! we'll try our hardest to show what we've got.

Sean Raia 27-04-2012 19:05
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Never mind, wasn't aware 2056 was seeded 2nd

KrazyCarl92 27-04-2012 19:12
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I'm not sure if people understand the gravity of the current situation. In matches 6, 12, and 17 all teams were awarded 1 CP when they should've been awarded 0. The bridge was unbalanced and one robot was touching the carpet in each case. Currently 3481 is ahead of the rest of the field by 1 qualifying point, which should not be the case because they were awarded 1 extra CP in match 17. If it isn't taken care of, this will have massive implications on the rankings and selections.

This is akin to the score to a match being 100-0 and then the match being recorded as a tie.

For those interested, a precedent would be GSR in 2009 when they actually changed the rankings AFTER alliance selections and then completely redid alliance selections after reranking the teams. This is the latest rankings have been changed in a tournament, I believe.

NickTosta 27-04-2012 19:39
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by KrazyCarl92 (Post 1163117)
I'm not sure if people understand the gravity of the current situation. In matches 6, 12, and 17 all teams were awarded 1 CP when they should've been awarded 0. The bridge was unbalanced and one robot was touching the carpet in each case. Currently 3481 is ahead of the rest of the field by 1 qualifying point, which should not be the case because they were awarded 1 extra CP in match 17. If it isn't taken care of, this will have massive implications on the rankings and selections.

This is akin to the score to a match being 100-0 and then the match being recorded as a tie.

For those interested, a precedent would be GSR in 2009 when they actually changed the rankings AFTER alliance selections and then completely redid alliance selections after reranking the teams. This is the latest rankings have been changed in a tournament, I believe.
Hmmmm. While it does sound like something should be done about that, there are two issues I see:

1. We need to bring this to someone's attention, someone with the power to correct it
2. We need to prove that it happened

I think the problem is that nobody knows who to talk to, and nobody knows if any concrete evidence (pictures, videos, etc.) exist at the moment. I'm not sure how anyone would go about either of those. Any thoughts?

EricH 27-04-2012 19:46
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickTosta (Post 1163123)
Hmmmm. While it does sound like something should be done about that, there are two issues I see:

1. We need to bring this to someone's attention, someone with the power to correct it
2. We need to prove that it happened

I think the problem is that nobody knows who to talk to, and nobody knows if any concrete evidence (pictures, videos, etc.) exist at the moment. I'm not sure how anyone would go about either of those. Any thoughts?
First, I know who you'd talk to. The head ref and/or the scorers. The problem is, you need the drive team to talk to the head ref. The pre-college members of the drive team. And you'd most likely need it to happen in the match.

You could try finding a GDC member, but that's going to be difficult to find them, difficult to convince them that it happened, and then they get to convince the head ref/scorer to fix the scores.

Second, especially regarding evidence: The head ref will not review evidence per [T13]. You need to raise doubt in his mind that he's been calling this correctly, and possibly get him to contact GDC members present for clarification.

stundt1 27-04-2012 20:19
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Guys are the rankings weird for you too? http://www2.usfirst.org/2012comp/eve.../rankings.html

Tristan Lall 27-04-2012 20:33
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stundt1 (Post 1163129)
Guys are the rankings weird for you too? http://www2.usfirst.org/2012comp/eve.../rankings.html
Yes, all entries are duplicated. It wasn't like that earlier in the afternoon.

Awards are still empty.

stundt1 27-04-2012 20:37
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I wish they posted the score for the last 1114 match does anyone know who won that match? It was the last match of the day.

speedbuggy76 27-04-2012 20:41
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
1114 lost that match after not moving for much of the match. I forget if there was a coop or not

GaryVoshol 27-04-2012 20:41
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
[G41]
If a Robot from each Alliance is Balanced on the Coopertition Bridge when the final score for a Qualification Match is assessed per Rule [G37], each Alliance earns 2 Coopertition Points. If the Coopertition Bridge is not Balanced, but a Robot from each Alliance is fully supported by the Coopertition Bridge, each Alliance will earn 1 Coopertition Point.
(emphasis mine)

By definition the bridge is not balanced because another robot is touching it. Yet there are two robots, one from each alliance, that are fully supported by the bridge.

I'm wondering if it was being called wrong all season long, and it's correct now.

speedbuggy76 27-04-2012 20:51
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryVoshol (Post 1163134)
(emphasis mine)

By definition the bridge is not balanced because another robot is touching it. Yet there are two robots, one from each alliance, that are fully supported by the bridge.

I'm wondering if it was being called wrong all season long, and it's correct now.
I didn't see these matches this morning, so I'm not quite sure what happened. I'm assuming there were two robots trying to get on the bridge, and they slid down and one of their bumpers stopped them both from rolling further. It sounds to me like you're saying there were three robots involved?

Chris 27-04-2012 20:52
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
This occurred at CT also and involved Team 118 (and whom ever else was in the match i don't remember the teams).

Team 118 went up to the ref's immediately after the match and pointed out the error. That they had received a co-op point when they shouldn't have. Later in the day the referees stopped by the pit and 118 was told "merry Christmas" its too hard to go back and fix.

This is the only reason 118 was 2nd and 177 was third. (didn't end up mattering at all since we were pretty sure 2168 was going to pick 118 and we'd end up picking second no matter what).

I never went back and figured out if it affected anyone else in the top eight (i wouldn't be surprised if it did).

Hopefully if the points were incorrectly awarded you have better luck.

GaryVoshol 27-04-2012 21:03
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedbuggy76 (Post 1163138)
I didn't see these matches this morning, so I'm not quite sure what happened. I'm assuming there were two robots trying to get on the bridge, and they slid down and one of their bumpers stopped them both from rolling further. It sounds to me like you're saying there were three robots involved?
I have no idea - I was only commenting on what I read here. If it was just 2 robots, one touching the carpet, then coop points should not be awarded.

I note that only on Archimedes are there odd coop points - and there's quite a few of them. It appears that the fields are not doing things in the same way.

Holtzman 27-04-2012 21:36
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
We witnessed a similar situation after Match 129. Immediately after the match, we noticed that both alliances received a single coopetition point despite that one of the robots attempting to balance was obviously touching the ground. We approached the head ref following the match, and the response our student representative was given was that he was going to converse with the Chief Referee about it.

After getting back to the hotel, we noticed that the score for match 129 was no longer posted, the standings seem to be duplicated, and the single coopetition point was removed from all teams in match 129.

We plan to bring the remaining matches in question to the head ref's attention tomorrow morning, as this currently affects whether 2826 or 3481 is the number 1 seed on Archimedes.

I’m sure the referees will do their best to sort out this confusion and get the bridge points awarded properly.

rocknthehawk 27-04-2012 23:08
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
We've been having some coms issues plaguing us. After our last match today, we found our gyro was shorting out. This was causing multiple issues with the digital sidecar.

Hoping for the best tomorrow. Our accuracy and speed has been consistent with our past performances, unfortunately the controls issues slowed us down a bit.

JB 27-04-2012 23:56
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Holtzman (Post 1163148)
We witnessed a similar situation after Match 129. Immediately after the match, we noticed that both alliances received a single coopetition point despite that one of the robots attempting to balance was obviously touching the ground. We approached the head ref following the match, and the response our student representative was given was that he was going to converse with the Chief Referee about it.

After getting back to the hotel, we noticed that the score for match 129 was no longer posted, the standings seem to be duplicated, and the single coopetition point was removed from all teams in match 129.

We plan to bring the remaining matches in question to the head ref's attention tomorrow morning, as this currently affects whether 2826 or 3481 is the number 1 seed on Archimedes.

I’m sure the referees will do their best to sort out this confusion and get the bridge points awarded properly.
Interesting, a team who was not involved in the match went to the head referee to dispute the call. Judging from the rules all rulings are final once the head referree gives the okay to clear robots and nothing can be changed. Even with video and photographic proof. It should be interesting to see how this plays out tomorrow.

bduddy 28-04-2012 00:12
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jb1403 (Post 1163177)
Interesting, a team who was not involved in the match went to the head referee to dispute the call. Judging from the rules all rulings are final once the head referree gives the okay to clear robots and nothing can be changed.
I don't think this is true - considering how fast field resets are this year, it would essentially prevent any changes from being made. The rules even call for questions to be asked after said "okay"...
Quote:
[T14]

If a team needs clarification on a ruling or score, a pre-college student from that team should address the Head Referee after a field reset has been signaled. An team signals their desire to speak with the Head Referee by standing in the red or blue Question Box which will be placed on the floor at each end of the scoring table. Depending on timing, the Head Referee may postpone any requested discussion until the end of the subsequent Match.
Quote:
Even with video and photographic proof.
[T13] indeed bans viewing of "recorded replays", but actually says nothing about photos. Do you know if either was presented?

EricH 28-04-2012 00:18
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jb1403 (Post 1163177)
Judging from the rules all rulings are final once the head referree gives the okay to clear robots and nothing can be changed. Even with video and photographic proof. It should be interesting to see how this plays out tomorrow.
[T13] states that all head referee rulings are final. However, it gives no timeline. If all rulings were absolutely final, carved in stone, no review, as soon as the all-clear sounded, then there would be no real point to [T14].

So: [T13] says, all head referee rulings are final, no recorded replays will be reviewed.
[T14], however, gives teams the right to a clarification of calls made on the field and a procedure to get the clarification. Much of the time, this clarification results from a team's misinterpretation of the rule in question. Some of the time, however, the referee is actually mistaken or wrong. He can get input from outside sources, including the GDC (which includes the Chief Referee and Volunteer of the Year, Dr. Aidan Browne) per [G13]. When the input comes in on a call that is asked about, the head referee has to make a call--either he was right, or he was wrong and what he will do about it. Note that in this case, the Head Ref indicated that he would in fact consult with the Chief Referee.

If the head referee rules that he is right, see [T13]. If the head referee rules that a mistake was made, then he will say, "I made a mistake. We will do X to fix it." Now see [T13] again. That will be the final ruling.


In the case of a team not involved in the match asking for clarification, [T14] does not specify that the team has to be involved in the match. It just says, "If a team needs clarification,". Obviously, the team in question needed clarification, and [T14] not restricting this to teams involved in the match, they addressed the Head Referee as per protocol.


I think everything in this one was within the rules and the Head Referee's authority, and we'll see what happens with the other matches tomorrow morning.

JB 28-04-2012 01:08
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bduddy (Post 1163181)
I don't think this is true - considering how fast field resets are this year, it would essentially prevent any changes from being made. The rules even call for questions to be asked after said "okay"...
[T13] indeed bans viewing of "recorded replays", but actually says nothing about photos. Do you know if either was presented?
I know for a fact the will not take photo evidence. At one of our events we had a balanced bridge not counted as balanced and the refs refused to review photo's.

qzrrbz 28-04-2012 07:41
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
A little late to consider process improvement, but a possible root cause to this is the typical lack of timely feedback as to the award of coop points.

Team has to wander back to the pits and look at the live score to see if something looks "odd". By then it's a little late to protest.

Chris is me 28-04-2012 09:01
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
From what I understand (I was field side at the time), the referees were awarding 1 CP to a pair of robots that were on a tilted bridge even if one of the robots was touching the ground. The "mentor from another team" went to clarify what was going on and what counted as 1 CP and what didn't. I don't know if they're going back and fixing old matches.

The rules do not say that you can not ask the refs any questions after the matches are over, and if it's an issue of rule interpretation and the refs agree, the results can be changed. Co-op points have been revised at multiple regionals this year and there is no reason they couldn't be revised at the Championship

A_Reed 28-04-2012 11:28
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Congrats to our Wisconsin Regional champion alliance partners FRC Team 2826 Wave Robotics for capturing first place in one of the most loaded of divisions. Good luck to all teams and keep it going Wave.

stundt1 28-04-2012 15:36
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I cannot believe that happened when I saw Simbotics not moving I thought they were done for. wow. Then at the last second wave fell off the bridge.

Ankit S. 28-04-2012 15:38
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
That finals match was so awesome!

dtengineering 28-04-2012 15:41
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
They don't come much closer than that...

Looking forward to Einstein.

Jason

Austin2046 28-04-2012 16:00
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Wow, Archimedes was intense! Congratulations to teams 2056, 1114 and 4334. Good luck on Einstein!

I'd like to thank our alliance partners 195 and 2415. We had a real chance at knocking out the Canadian powerhouses! It was a pleasure to play with you, as well as everyone on Archimedes. We had a great time, and we plan to kick it up another notch next year. :D

DampRobot 28-04-2012 16:45
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I was blown away by the play in the finals. Although in the end, they did not suceed, Wave robotics played extremely well. They clearly earned their number one seed. Good luck to the Canadian alliance at Einstein!

Anupam Goli 29-04-2012 13:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
The Blue Alliance has the Top 15 OPR statistics on their site, here they are:
2056 45.32
2826 37.75
2415 34.29
973 31.01
67 30.10
1114 29.65
1676 27.76
1504 26.29
1218 26.06
2996 26.01
359 24.71
2949 23.11
2046 22.87
2590 22.48

With 2415 being in the top 3, I was surprised they weren't chosen until the last round. I would've thought they would be chosen quickly.

Austin2046 29-04-2012 14:11
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wing (Post 1163906)
The Blue Alliance has the Top 15 OPR statistics on their site, here they are:
2056 45.32
2826 37.75
2415 34.29
973 31.01
67 30.10
1114 29.65
1676 27.76
1504 26.29
1218 26.06
2996 26.01
359 24.71
2949 23.11
2046 22.87
2590 22.48

With 2415 being in the top 3, I was surprised they weren't chosen until the last round. I would've thought they would be chosen quickly.
It seemed like most teams wanted a wide bot as their first picks with a few exceptions. 2415 was quickly snatched up in the second round by the number 7 alliance, as they already had 2 widebots, 195 and 2046, assuring their ability to triple. And as has been said before, OPR isn't all that reliable a statistic this year for rebound rumble. Our scouting data showed we (2046) were consistently putting more points on the board than 973 yet their OPR is more than 8 points higher.

AcesJames 29-04-2012 20:21
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
I'd like to take a minute to thank all the teams and volunteers in Archimedes for making my first even as a volunteer field reset-er a memorable one. Having been able to watch every single match on Archimedes this year from the dome floor, 3 feet from the field was incredible. We knew Archi was going to be stacked, but I was absolutely amazed by the match play in quals and in eliminations. However, I was also amazed by the people playing in those matches.

Every so often, it seems that people have negative things to say about the "elite" teams that occupied so much of our division this year. Things like "that's a mentor built robot" or "that team only cares about winning", or even "that team is trying to sabotage us". I didn't see any of that on Archimedes. What DID I see?

I saw some of those slandered "elite" teams (67, 1114, 2826, 2056, and others) playing their hearts out all weekend. I saw the student drivers, graciously accepting wins AND defeats, congratulating their opponents when they lost, and being proud of themselves either way. I saw their teams in the stands, cheering them on regardless of their performance. I saw all three nail-biting Finals matches with last second balances involving the 4 teams above. I saw those 4 teams who have been slandered time and again this season for their "mentor built" robots walk out onto the field at the end of their 3 matches, shake each others' hands, smile, and compliment each other on a job well done. It was evident seeing their faces that the students and coaches representing their teams on the field were grateful just to be competing against each other.

Forget the FMS issues on Einstein. I saw the magic on Archimedes. I'm inspired.

Richard Wallace 29-04-2012 21:12
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcesJames (Post 1164121)
... Forget the FMS issues on Einstein. I saw the magic on Archimedes. I'm inspired.
This. Thank you. :D

It's why we do the math. It's why I cannot stay away.

tap13 30-04-2012 10:32
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcesJames (Post 1164121)
I saw the magic on Archimedes. I'm inspired.
Thank You, I really feel the same way. Whatever happened in the Einstein field couldn't take away the magic I saw in Archimedes. I would proudly admit that after our last game in the semi-finals, we were happy, we did our best and so did everyone else. It was an intense and memorable competition. I'm proud to be at FIRST. I'm inspired.

Carolyn_Grace 30-04-2012 11:01
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AcesJames (Post 1164121)
I'd like to take a minute to thank all the teams and volunteers in Archimedes for making my first even as a volunteer field reset-er a memorable one.
....
Forget the FMS issues on Einstein. I saw the magic on Archimedes. I'm inspired.
Ditto!
I had a blast working field reset with you and the others! Such a great weekend. The finals on Archimedes were insanity, and I was so honored to be court-side watching it all play out. Great job by all of the teams.

I was also really excited to see an Archimedes team win Chairman's Award! Congrats again to 1114! The members of your team who were around the field throughout the weekend truly embraced the spirit of FIRST.

Adam Freeman 30-04-2012 11:47
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
What an exciting and interesting weekend. Thursday started out pretty rough for us, with some missed coop balances and had a communication/controls system problem. Friday we were awesome in our 3 matches, finishing perfect 4pts for each one. Saturday we climbed back into the top 3, then ended up finishing in the top 8 overall. We were selected by an awesome team, 2826 and then selected 4143.

Our alliance struggled with the triple balance throughout the eliminations. I am not really sure why...Wave and HOT easily tripled with Adambots Friday evening. We also hit a couple of triples on the practice field with 4143 Saturday morning, although they were not quite as smooth. I wish we would have had more time to get everything correct before we got kicked off the practice field.

After failing to triple in either of our first 4 elimination matches, our alliance opted for ditching the triple and just trying to out score our opponents by 20pts and double balancing. This was effective in F1. It was also pretty effective in F2, until we hopped over the barrier and got stuck on a ball. We were not able to free ourselves and only managed a single balance. We also effectively denied 2826 any balls in the last 30s of the match. Our alliance was up about 12-15 when we got stuck. We knew that the Canadian alliance was slowly closing in the gap on our scoring, so we decided that we would attempt a triple balance if we were up by less than 15 in the last 45s of the match. During the match the scores were extremely close, I believe we were up by 2-3 when we called for the triple. Everyone was in position and balanced....then disaster struck! This is what I believe happened, since I haven't seen the video...both 67 and 2826 robots started to tip. We saved ours with the arm, 2826 tipped, then some how got back on the bridge and it balanced for a couple of seconds...then they tipped off again. This was incredibly heartbreaking for all of our alliance.

To 2826 - You guys are incredible. Just a scoring machine. It was great to get a chance to finally play with you guys. After getting knocked out by you last year, we definitely had all our scouts eyes on you. You did not dissappoint. You guys are a Powerhouse team!

Jake, thanks for letting me lead the alliance. You are a great coach. I wish I would have come up/stuck with a winning strategy. Eric and Tyler..it was awesome talking with you all weekend.

To 4143 - Thank you guys for being an awesome third partner. You did everything we asked you to do. Even had to put up with me yelling, probably incoherantly, back there. Your robot was capable and durable. You were a definite advantage to our alliance.

To Alliance #2 (1114, 2056, and 4334), what an incedible alliance. Congratulations! We knew we would have to go through you to get to Einstein...and we knew you would be triple balancing in every match. Just the threat of the potential you guys had in any of our matches, forced our hand away from our initial strategy and into the triple balance. For an alliance that was putting up an average of 88 ball points (us) after ditching the triple balance, your strategy and execution intimidated us into going back to trying it. Which looking at the data in hindsight was a terrible decision.

There are so many tiny little details that if changed could have effected the outcome. I am trying not to look back, but it keeps happening. The scores don't look that close or high but the matches were epic. We could not have lost to a better alliance, and IMO would not have lost to any other alliance in St. Louis.

It's not fair to anyone what happened on Einstein, but the class and professionalism you guys displayed was amazing. I don't think I would have been able to stay so calm and so composed during those events. Thank you for being model teams in the face of adversity.

To 1114 and 2056 - It is always fun/challenging/exciting to be in a division with you guys. Our teams have so much respect and admiration for each other it's incredible. Karthik and Tyler you guys are such good friends...just hanging out and talking with you made for a great weekend.

Now on to acceptance and recovery....

Holtzman 30-04-2012 13:34
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Playing on Archimedes was an absolute pleasure. I've never been through such an exciting elimination tournament. The semi's between the 1 and the 5 alliance were exceptional to watch, and it was a privilege to play those finals with and against so many friends. To walk on the field afterwards, in victory and defeat, and shake hands was a great feeling. They were the most exciting and memorable matches in my FIRST career.

To our new friends on 2826, it was almost depressing how many balls you could score in the last 30 seconds. When I first saw your robot this season, I was shocked and amazed by the similarities. I'm glad we could inspire each other and learn each others success's and failures.

To 67, we had high hopes to play with you this weekend. Your machine was phenomenal. It is a unique and highly effective design, and I'm shocked you didn't get a Championship Technical award.

To 4334, you have taken the first steps towards becoming a hugely successful team. You were calm and collected through out the tournament, and your performance under pressure should be commended. I'm sorry we couldn't have finished off under better circumstances, but that's a story for a different post. We will be nominating you in our application for IRI. You deserve to be there as much as anyone.

To the Canadian teams that joined us on Archimedes in the elimination rounds to cheer on "The Eh Team", Thank You. Seeing those hundreds, if not thousands of fans cheering and waving Canadian flags was hugely inspiring. You gave us confidence, even when facing elimination from the phenomenal #1 alliance.

To our family on 1114, this one was a long time coming. Seeing you win the Chairman's award brought me to tears. Winning the division together was like a dream. I can only imagine what would have been had things played out differently on Einstein.

I encourage everyone to think of the great times had on Archimedes and not to dwell too much on the events that occurred on Einstein. We can only hope that some good will come of those events, and improvements will be made to benefit all teams going forward.

RyanShoff 30-04-2012 16:00
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
4143 posted a few of our last matches to youtube.
Here is our last non-balance....
http://www.youtu.be/ABTTuwNsu6A

Our team greatly appreciates Wave and Hot for almost leading us to Einstein as a rookie team. I plan on posting about the experience from a rookie team's perspective soon.

Chris Fultz 30-04-2012 16:42
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
After a rough start we we excited to get back into the groove with shooting and balancing and then to be selected to be a part of the number 5 alliance.

It was great to play alongside 3481 and 359 in some very close matches. Some went our way, some did not! :D

Congrats to the runner up alliance of 2826 and 67 and 4143 and to the division champs 2056 1114 and 4334.

AdamHeard 30-04-2012 17:25
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
We recorded every match in very high quality with a midfield camera, we'll spend all day uploading to youtube and share links when they're up.

Adam Freeman 30-04-2012 17:42
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanShoff (Post 1164657)
4143 posted a few of our last matches to youtube.
Here is our last non-balance....
http://www.youtu.be/ABTTuwNsu6A

Our team greatly appreciates Wave and Hot for almost leading us to Einstein as a rookie team. I plan on posting about the experience from a rookie team's perspective soon.
Ouch...I thought it hurt before. Being able to see it over and over is even worse.

Atleast I can see that we were clearly beat in F2, and would not have won even if we didn't land on that ball. So that's comforting to know that triple balancing was basically the only option in F3.

Those three robots were just not compatible with triple balancing.

Thanks for posting the videos.

rocknthehawk 30-04-2012 17:43
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Watching the finals matches was one of the most exciting moments I've had in my years with FIRST. The 103-106 back and forth battle, to the ups and downs (literally) of the last attempted triple. We couldn't stay in our seats each match as time wound down. Congrat's to a great season to all the finalists.


I think 67's machine tops my list for all time favorite robots. An ingenious idea, multiple functions of one mechanism. Absolutely amazing to watch.

RyanShoff 30-04-2012 18:10
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
The Archimedes Final might be 3 of the best matches of the finals. That is how Einstein should have ended.

J2R5M3 30-04-2012 22:01
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Being part of an alliance with you guys as well as 1114 was Utterly amazing and i will remember it for the rest of my life.

Both of you inspired our team to push and reach for heights we initially believed unattainable

a salute and toast to our brief stint together as the Eh Team i am deeply honoured to have met all of you and of course to have played with you through both the good and the bad.

2056's nomination of us for IRI means a lot and is greatly appreciated hopefully we will get the chance to attend and see you all there. :) (Eh Team Unite ;)

I send the same message to the Archimedes alliance #1 seriously what a match proud to have played with you all :)

Karthik 01-05-2012 00:45
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
What an intense division. The finals matches between our alliance and the "Lake Michigan" alliance were of the charts when it comes to the intensity level. The drama of F-3 is completely unparalleled.

It was an honour to play against our dear friends from Team 67 once again. This marks the 4th time in 6 years that 1114 and 67 have battled at the Championship event. Fitting that the series is now tied up at two a piece. Hopefully one of these years we'll finally get to play together at the big show.

As for Team 2826, they are the next emerging powerhouse team in FIRST. Expect to see them on Einstein in the near future, it's just a matter of time. It was great getting to know you guys, I definitely see a lot of similarities in our teams.

To Team 4334, congratulations on having the smartest simple design of the season. It's mind boggling to me that more teams didn't realize the value of a super small robot that could fetch balls. Our alliance had some of the fastest and smoothest triple balances of the season, and this simply would not have been possible without your robot. I look forward to seeing even more impressive things out of your team next year in Calgary!

To our friends on Team 2056, what's left to say. I thought that this was finally going to be our elusive chance to win Champs together. Alas, maybe it wasn't meant to be. Regardless, there's no one else we would have rather been paired with. Thank you for picking us and getting the band back together; we always put on a good show together. Can't wait until the next tour.

It was such a thrill being on this division. The crowd at our field for the finals was so huge, it seemed like everyone appeared out of nowhere. Thanks to all the volunteers who kept things running smoothly, it was an amazing crew.

kgargiulo 01-05-2012 00:49
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Freeman (Post 1164729)
Ouch...I thought it hurt before. Being able to see it over and over is even worse.
You've got that right.

My daughter, who is 7, literally cried watching the web feed of the live event. She still doesn't understand how it can happen. It's interesting trying to convince her that "it's not fair" doesn't really apply. Robots are easier than 7 year olds.

Even more cruel, the stream my parents were watching froze when we were still up (the second time) and they assumed we had won. It was minutes later before it started playing again and they had to piece together what had happened.

Wave and HOT, sincere appreciation from the entire 4143 MARS/WARS team for the trust to select us in your alliance. It certainly was an amazing cap to what was already an extremely memorable rookie year for the students us mentors too. We look forward to many more years of coopertition.

While I'm at it, more sincere thanks to 1736 Robot Casserole and all the other Peoria area FIRST teams that helped us out as rookies this year. Your support made a huge difference.

Now I need to go burn the video tape....

Thad House 01-05-2012 01:05
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karthik (Post 1165049)
To Team 4334, congratulations on having the smartest simple design of the season. It's mind boggling to me that more teams didn't realize the value of a super small robot that could fetch balls. Our alliance had some of the fastest and smoothest triple balances of the season, and this simply would not have been possible without your robot. I look forward to seeing even more impressive things out of your team next year in Calgary!
On Friday night we realized if we won our Saturday match we would be picking 7th. Because of this we started looking for robots that could help us triple. The first team we thought of was 4334. We had 1 match with them, and by the end of the match we had every ball on our side of the field. Plus because of their size, they were put at the top of our pick list because they would have been a perfect compliment to us. We completely realized the value of a robot like that.

Sitting next to all of you guys down on the field during the finals was very inspiring, and it was awesome seeing an all Canadian alliance making it the Einstein. I just loved all of the energy of everyone who was rooting for Canada.

bduddy 01-05-2012 02:33
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by RyanShoff (Post 1164657)
4143 posted a few of our last matches to youtube.
Here is our last non-balance....
http://www.youtu.be/ABTTuwNsu6A

Our team greatly appreciates Wave and Hot for almost leading us to Einstein as a rookie team. I plan on posting about the experience from a rookie team's perspective soon.
I'm copying my post from Youtube here...

At 3:48 what clearly should have been a 6-point shot is only credited with 3... does anyone know if that was corrected at any point in the match? That could have made the difference, as red wouldn't have had to triple...

Adam Freeman 01-05-2012 08:14
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by bduddy (Post 1165079)
I'm copying my post from Youtube here...

At 3:48 what clearly should have been a 6-point shot is only credited with 3... does anyone know if that was corrected at any point in the match? That could have made the difference, as red wouldn't have had to triple...
It really doesn't matter. I can tell you that the Red Alliance was going to attempt a triple balance no matter how that ball was scored. The discussion before the match was, if we were ahead by 15pts @ 45sec, then double balance otherwise we would need to triple for the win.

At 50sec, we were tied, at some point after than we scored a few more balls, then called for the triple balance. We had no idea 1114 had died in the corner. It appears that 2056 knew 1114 was dead, assumed we would double as we had been, scored enough to take the lead, then went to double balance. Lots of very strategic play in these matches.

It was extremely close and very emotional for those involved, but in the end we battled two of the best teams and friends in FIRST, as closely as we possibly could. This time the cards fell for them. As Karthik said the series is tied 2-2 with 1114, and now 1-1 with 2056. I look forward to getting a chance to play with and against them more in the future.

trilogy2826 01-05-2012 12:03
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
As the "New Kid on the Block", it's still difficult for me to comprehend how we can not only be playing on the same field as 1114, 2056 and 67, but to actually receive accolades such as you have bestowed is an incredible honor. I wonder if you can imagine the countless hours we spent studying your teams play, skill, demeanor and overall "awesomeness". We learned a lot from you over the years and now to have directly worked with you and got to know you as friends is an irreplaceable experience. For me, working with role models such as all of you is truly what FIRST is all about.

To 2056: You are truly the most intense team I have ever worked with. From the beginning, you could see that everyone on the team had a common goal and that nothing was going to deter them from it. After getting to know Tyler over the weekend for the first time, you could almost physically sense this intensity. There was no anger (though at times I would not have blamed him for showing it), no remorse, just a single minded goal. The amazing thing was that the whole team showed this intensity without an air of "Elitism". Not a single member acted like they were better than anyone else. After letting it sink in that 2056 has never lost a regional, it is easy to see why.

To 4334: I can only echo Karthik's words. You picked one thing and you did it amazingly well. When you were snatched up by the rest of your fellow Canadians, we were a little struck and we immediately knew that we were going to have a tough time indeed. Please keep in contact with you new robotics family, as I know they can guide you onto great things.

To 1114: After watching the chairman's video and seeing the members with tears in their eyes, it almost made me want to cry (almost). All I can say is "Unbelievable". I know we are a few years behind you guys, but I am still trying to imagine the army of students and volunteers we would have to put together to come close to what you have done in a few short years. Not to slight previous HoF teams, but I think you easily epitomize all that FIRST is about. Getting to finally meet Karthik in person was great. Tyler Olds has always had the greatest respect for you and now I share that respect.

To 4143: You put up with a lot of stuff from Adam and I in a very short period of time. Most teams would have told us off or at least have grumbled behind our backs. Instead, you elevated your value immensely by making quick and concise changes to your auto mode and proving on the field that you were a durable and extremely worthy partner. Thanks for your patience and skill.

To 67: I am actually sitting here wondering how to start this and I am actually at a loss for words. Not because there are too few words, but far, far too many.
I guess first, a little history: Our teams first met on Curie during Logomotion. Adam has already admitted that Wave was underestimated and we bit him for for this in Semis last year, effectively ending the run for a three-peat Worlds title. I had a feeling he wouldn't ever let me live this down. Thankfully he is a very forgiving person...
After obtaining #1 seed, 67 was an immediate first choice.
1. The machine: Well crafted and well designed. Its hard to imagine a more recognizable icon of Rebound Rumble. The things this machine was capable of was astonishing. Crossing the bump was child's play, Auto with Coop was easy and bridge balancing was unparalleled.
2. The Pit crew: In QF1-2, 67 was hit pretty hard in their arm by another bot and cracked a critical weld. Within 8 minutes, they had the arm repaired and it was probably better than before.
3. The drive team: To be cliche - These guys had fire in their eyes and ice in their veins. But seriously, they were focused, passionate about driving and had an understanding of what to do and how to do it at all times. They easily earned their MSC title.
4. The coach: A lot of people have given Adam a hard time for his coaching style. In some cases they stated he was elitist and unwilling to cooperate. I can now definitively state after working with him that they were all right. Sorry, just kidding. Adam will go down in my book as the perfect combination of experience, dedication, knowledge, drive and humility a coach can have. I seriously think he and Tyler Holtzman should write a whitepaper on coaching. The best part of working with Adam is that when he was not sure of something, he said "I don't know, what do you think". Not many people in his position and of his reputation would say these words let alone mean them. I now consider Adam a good friend-in-fire and I hope I get to work with him in the future.

Finally, my team, 2826: After our Duluth regional in Week 2, I was ready to swear off ball-shooting games forever. In 2010, we had an admittedly dismal year and so far, was the only year we did not go to champs. Instead of taking an obviously poor attitude, we iterated, tested, researched and spent countless hours developing and practicing. To be cliche again, we didn't give up and let what we had be the best we could do. What came out of this was a new tower insert, a single axle hooded flywheel shooter (original was a double axle), and a dead-accurate vision targeting system. Our Wisconsin regional performance of 15 balls in F-1 validated our hard work. Lastly, I want to thank our departing seniors, especially, Zac, Tyler and Alan. You will be missed...


Ok, so I know I rambled and sounded incredibly sappy, but I meant every word. I hope everyone can get on CD and give a shout to what they are thankful for. Going to Champs was a great experience and ended better than I could have possibly expected. Though I am still sore to lose, We could not have lost to a better alliance in what was arguably the best match of the season.

Thanks for reading and see you next season...

J2R5M3 01-05-2012 20:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
That's great advice :)

we will definitely make sure do our best to maintain contact with our new "family" as you put it

In fact i would love to build rapport with all the great teams we played with/against during championships.

being one of the two programmers on the team i would be interested in hearing about your tracking system if you feel that is alright it would be amazing to learn such things from one of the best scorers in the championships. (our scouting had you guys getting approx 30 teleop pts per game)

DonRotolo 01-05-2012 21:12
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Best...Finals...Ever....

AdamHeard 02-05-2012 21:47
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Videos are on this youtube page;

http://www.youtube.com/user/tecumsehman14grr/videos

Tyler Olds 02-05-2012 22:22
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamHeard (Post 1166197)
Adam, thank you for posting these!

It was an honor to play on the Archimedes field and to me what happened in the finals regardless of the outcome was nothing short of magical in my 12 seasons of FRC.

I want to thank our alliance partners 67 and 4143 for banding together with us to put up a fantastic fight. It as amazing what two seconds and gravity can do.......... (and a deceiving practice field ;) )

I huge shout out to 2056 and 1114 for their incredible play. You guys were amazing and I was sad to see what happened on Einstein. These two teams are nothing short of a class act. 1114 you guys definitely deserved Chairman's. Your dedication to FIRST and STEM is unparalleled IMHO and I could not think of a better team to win.

(No discredit to 1114, 2056, or 4143 in the below paragraph)
Out of all the teams on the Archimedes field, my spiny geek hat goes off to 4334. IMHO this is the team that made the #2 alliance. We had these guys pinged to be an immediate second pick for us and were heartbroken (but not surprised) that they were picked by 2056. I was absolutely flabbergasted that this team was not picked earlier. Even if they were a rookie, this team consistently shuttled balls back and forth, was able to score in auto (though feeding in auto was used for elims), and was around 22" long without bumpers. This is the only team to me that was capable of putting 2056 and 1114 over the top with the capability of a triple balance (there was some other 4*** team that was about this length but did not have the capabilities of 4334) and allowed the #2 alliance to beat us.. When they were picked, my first words to my coach (Jake), was that I was legitimately scared of the #2 alliance because of 4334. It is not often that I say that of an alliance or team especially a rookie team.

I see only great things ahead in 4334's future. With 2056 and 1114 mentoring them; I am spotlighting this team to become a top tier team in the next two years.

I also want to give a huge thank you to all the volunteers who dedicated their time to make this event successful. Many do not get the limelight that the Emcees and Game Announcers do that make this event and division run as well as it did. Without great volunteers, the event & FIRST staff, and the GDC making such a fantastic game (tied for me for best game with 2004) tens of thousands of individuals would have not gotten to experience what FIRST offers.

I look forward to seeing many of you at IRI (pending)!

dodar 02-05-2012 22:30
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamHeard (Post 1166197)
This is awesome. Thanks. Seeing our matches from this perspective, I think we did better than I had originally thought. It does suck, though, that we never get to play with the really good teams at championships; atleast we got to play one of them, even if it was just once.(and our first match lol)

Karthik 03-05-2012 09:58
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tyler Olds (Post 1166213)
This is the only team to me that was capable of putting 2056 and 1114 over the top with the capability of a triple balance
4334 was the key to making our triple balance as fast and smooth as it was. However, 1114 and 2056 had the ability to triple balance with any standard wide robot. We actually had practiced it over 50 times back at home. So, 4334 wasn't the only team we could triple with, they were just the best at it. :)

Adam Freeman 03-05-2012 10:15
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Archimedes was so close that any tiny change in a number of things and I believe we may have sent any combination of 1114, 2056, 67, and 2826 to Einstein. No offense to any other team, I just feel these teams were a cut above the rest.

It's interesting...one of my biggest fears heading into Archimedes was that 1114 or 2056 would seed #1 and select the other. If the seeds were reversed (2056 was #1 and 2826 was #2), but the selections were the same....we would have selected 4334 as our third partner and definitely triple balanced.

Not saying this would have been the difference or that we would of beaten the combination of 1114 and 2056, but I am 100% confident we only needed about 0.5" (or less) more room on the bridge to achieve a triple balance. A 22" long bot would have helped for sure.

Such an intelligent design and very effective.

It's crazy for me to think about 1114 and 2056 triple balancing with any standard wide bot, yet 67 and 2826 could not.

Congrats to all for an incredible division and an great year overall.

OZ_341 03-05-2012 10:26
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
One of my biggest regrets at the Championship was that I did not get to watch the elimination rounds on Archimedes. I could see some of it from my viewing area on Curie, but wished I could see more. What a tremendous collection of robots and teams there were, playing on that field. I was absolutely jealous of the scouts that we sent to your division.
Hopefully, if we get into IRI, we will be able to watch your teams up close this summer.

AdamHeard 06-05-2012 12:21
Re: Archimedes 2012!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamHeard (Post 1166197)
It looks like we goofed, and only have 2 of the 3 finals matches. Also, the one marked as f2 is actually f3.

We'll get them renamed nice at our meeting Thursday.


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