Tap Magic?
 

I just came across this cutting fluid which I have never seen or heard of before. Its called Tap Magic and I was wondering what are the benefits and how many teams use it?

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Tap Magic is used to aid in the process of cutting metals. I have only ever seen it used in tapping applications though. They advertise that it can be used for other machining processes as well.

So some personal experience:
Tap Magic is very good when used correctly. I have used it extensively with different types of steels while working with Baja cars, and ocassionaly some Formula cars. It does make the process 'easier' but you still have to be careful. As far as maintaining tools and creating longer lives from them, I have no clue. My Formula counterparts did find that it is very important to make sure ALL of the fluid is removed prior to welding. They were tapped a member in a closed loop and drained MOST of the fluid. Then through a testing that should not have broken (or even come close to breaking) the member did break. As they looked into the cause, the fluid during the welding process heated up and changed the strength of the metal.

They do have a specific type fo aluminum (which I assume most teams use on robots except special conditions), but I have no experience with that. I have alsways used some other type/generic cutting fluid when tapping aluminum, sometimes even just a cutting wax.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We use aluminum tap magic when hand tapping all our aluminum tapping needs on the team. It is convenient and most of all smells good. A lot of cutting fluids just plain stink to me. I actually like the smell of aluminum Tap Magic. Smells like cinnamon to me!

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Highly reccomend using tap magic or another lubricant when tapping metals.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Nice to know that I'm not going insane by saying it smells like cinnamon to my team. :D

We use Tap Magic on aluminum, it makes tapping long holes a lot nicer to deal with and I think that it really does a good job lubricating the cutting area of the tap. Only concern for me is that for me, after using it and getting it on my hands and not washing it off, it burns. (not sure if that happens to a lot of people or what)

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I'm not sure about the burning, I don't think I have ever experienced that.

I've used tap magic for the past 8 or 9 years in FRC and it's great especially for newbies. When we used to use 80/20 we would need it for tapping the ends of the extrusion. We try to use it any time we are tapping anything. I've also used it as cutting fluid for our bandsaw before it seems to work alright.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Tap Magic is not a question. Tap Magic is the answer.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

My skin is probably over sensitive to chemicals. But I do remember a warning on the container to try and not get it on your skin.

From their website "SKIN CONTACT – Prolonged or repeated exposure may cause irritation." This is a warning for their ProTap series which is what I think we use along side of the aluminum series

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Tap Magic is a very good product for most machining. Look at the container and see if it contains 1,1,1-Trichloroethane. If it does it is old stock and 1,1,1-Trichloroethane is considered a hazard waste. A Material Data Safety Sheet can be downloaded from http://www.tapmagic.com . Please follow the instructions on use and disposal.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We use it when drilling. It helps lubricate the metal so that it cuts cleaner and doesn't heat up so much.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We use it for tapping too. Makes it easier and seems to help with chip buildup. At work we use flood coolant when power tapping and we never break taps either.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I use it frequently. It does work as advertised for tapping. In particular I find it's the most successful fluid I've found for tapping various plastics. Acrylic is very difficult to tap successfully, but Tap Magic does make it much easier and does not appear to interact with the material otherwise (I do make an effort to dry the part quickly, though). You can very easily tell the difference between plastic threads cut with and without tap magic. You get the same results in polycarb.

I've never used it as a general cutting fluid, but I suppose it would work there as well. It's a little expensive for that kind of work, but if it's all you got...

I also have a can of Alumtap, which seems to be essentially the same thing, or at least so close to it I couldn't tell the difference.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I always liked the regular stuff but we bought some aluminum tap magic a few years ago and I hate it.

There's something about the cinnamon smell that gives me a massive headache every time I'm exposed to it. It's also near impossible to wash off your hands completely.

Works well though.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We bought 4 bottles last year. We use it when tapping, drilling (sometimes) and CNC milling metal. It works well, nothing special.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Thanks for your input guys. Ill prolly be bringing some other questions up on various other tools and techniques. I'm not new to tools. Ive worked in my dads auto shop since an early age. I just like having input on whats the best tool or technique. (Yes I know the one your most comfortable with is)

Re: Tap Magic?
 

For manual machinery tasks you might also want to look into Relton A9 or Anchor cutting fluid (water soluble). I've had good results with both. Anchor has especially nice cutting, but it feels gross on my hands compared to A9. For the CNC, after extensive reading I decided on Trim, but I haven't run it yet. For some operations in aluminum, I've found regular ol WD40 to work rather well, but I'd recommend something a little thicker for tapping.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I know this thread is about one brand of tapping fluid, but allow me to offer a heretical solution that works much better for aluminum than this fluid or wax, and does not contain hazardous chemicals. Better yet, it is available in most schools right now!

Believe it or not, the best aluminum tapping fluid out there is the lustrous pink hand soap that comes from the dispenser in most institutional rest rooms. The next best option is viscous dish soaps like Palmolive or Dawn (do not try this with thin dollar store knock-offs).

Unlike the oil-based fluids, these soaps wash out cleanly with plain water. They leave no contamination if you need to weld (or anodize) the tapped piece later. They provide very good lubrication through the cut, and do not make as much of a mess, when compared to other tapping fluids. These soaps won't stain your clothing.

-- Len

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I much prefer the sweet & satisfying taste and smell of A9.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I used Trim (C275) extensively and really liked it for cutting just about everything, but I can't say that I liked tapping anything using CNC machines. Rigid or soft, explicit tap cycle or directly coded; tapping is a very special challenge for NC. You really need a properly set automatic tapping head. Otherwise, you will collect a lot of broken taps, and more damaged workpieces.

For prototype work, it is much better to NC the pilot holes, and tap the threads by hand. Production is different, it takes a much larger investment of time and capital.

Back to the coolant, Trim makes the air taste sweet when it is atomized. I put this in the pile of information, I wish I didn't know, because I'm pretty sure that it isn't a good thing to ingest. I know that the anaerobic bacteria problem we had when using conventional naphthalated corn oil based coolants, went away when we made the switch to Trim.

-- Len

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Probably because it's made out of animal fat :D

Re: Tap Magic?
 

The heavy weight of 3 in 1 oil tends to work well for tapping and most cutting situations, it is also really easy to get and a good general lubricant. It is also easy to clean using a rag.

I can also vouch for A9, amazing stuff.

Since it seems to matter on this thread, both have a sweet smell when burned. :D

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I don't have any problems (on a Haas with rigid tapping) with cycles or directly written programs, cut taps or roll taps. As long as its properly cooled, programmed, and you're not trying to go too deep at once, it comes out fine.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I use coconut oil as my cutting and tapping fluid/wax. It's a solid at room temperature, melts at skin temperature, has a high smoke point (450 deg F, if Wikipedia's to be believed), smells great, and is relatively cheap. And I don't know if it's the smell, but I never have to remind students to use it--they're all over it.

I picked up this tip from the shop manager at CU-Boulder and have never looked back.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

That's funny. I got the soap trick from an old tool and die maker, when I ran Cornell's student shop. I had been a wax or A9 user, but the Hand soap worked better than both.

I could see coconut oil working well.

-- Len

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Perhaps your Haas is tighter than the Fadal and Okuma machines my bad experiences came from. I should revise that I never had a problem with 1/4-20 or larger, but smaller than that with either blind or deep through holes is problematic for most machines. Insufficient chip evacuation was the typical cause of seized and then broken taps. Lots of small holes are tapped by NC machines in production, every day. Those parts, programs and fixtures have been optimized for production.

I still maintain that for prototypes and student projects, it is far better to tap by hand. It builds character and an appreciation for the material and tools. It also keeps you from finding out how deep is too deep, especially when you may be working with an unknown alloy. A bit of a tangent, but not all aluminum cuts the same. Once had a college robotics team grab some 3003 (essentially pure Al) when they ran out of 6061, for an intricately cut CNC'd part. Had to slow the spindle to half, and feed to a third of the rate for 6061 to get passable parts. Machine tapping was not an option because of the "grabby" nature of 3003.

-- Len

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I've been wanting to try Anchorlube G-771 for tapping. It supposedly works well and is not as nasty as some other types.

http://www.anchorlube.com/anchorlube.html

You can request a free sample on their main page.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We use tap magic when tapping and hacksawing- but just a word of warning... wash your hands before you eat.
Almost all the older members on my team are like "tap magic is good with pizza," and that's probably not such a good thing... :P safety first!

Re: Tap Magic?
 

Looks promising. Two things that caught my eye on the MSDS are the extreme non-specificity of hazardous ingredients, and the almond odor. On the first, I doubt that this product contains anything that is very bad, but there is no indication of any ingredients, other than being "soap" based.

On the second, it makes this product a non-starter for our team, as it indicates that it may contain esters of almonds. We have a student on our team, who is highly allergic to tree nuts, like almonds.

-- Len

Re: Tap Magic?
 

We used it for tapping some 303 stainless parts to M4x.7. It seemed like good stuff, but on one part I put too little on the tap and it broke (and then so did the boring bar that follows).

I can't vouch for it for hand tapping, but apparently our programmers decided it is better than just coolant for small taps in stainless. Never used it for aluminum though, or larger taps in stainless.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

When I was on 11, we used to swear by the stuff for machining of all kinds. The nice thing about it is it's water-based and can be diluted to your desired viscosity. It also doesn't have the unpleasant fumes of a lot of oil-based lubricants/coolants.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

It's never lunch time until someone breaks open the flammable liquids cabinet and drops a box of tap magic on the shop tables at our shop....delicious.

Re: Tap Magic?
 

I've always used 3 in 1 oil when tapping.