Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

This was my rookie year in FIRST, so Rebound Rumble was the only game I have intimately known. I have spent too long reading and watching threads, rulebooks (yes really) and videos on older games, but I still have only limited knowledge on them. From that limited knowledge, it seems that people liked this year's game better than most. I also concluded that the complaining this year about Co-Op points or the disagreements over the value of Widebot/Longbot means that there weren't any big problems anyone had with the game.

So, the questions: Where does Rebound Rumble stand among the best FRC games so far (in the poll)? Also, what was the best game the GDC has devised?

P.S. Feel free to move this thread if it should be elsewhere.

EDIT: My Top 5 (for what it's worth)-

1. FIRST Overdrive
2. Rebound Rumble
3. Aim High
4. Breakaway
5. Triple Play

Way back in 5th grade (I know, I'm young :ahh: ), my teacher would reward us with videos of either How It's Made or Overdrive, once we had finished other things. I had no idea what it was at the time, and it was quite a moment of epiphany when I figured out I was on one of the teams I had seen four years before. That's part of why I love Overdrive, its personal connection to me.

This year brought together a lot of different elements very well with good balance (no pun intended), and created the most well-rounded game we have seen.

Aim High, while confusing to some, was great because of the physicality, something that I would like to see return. A big open field, and 3-on-2 action with solid defense was fun to see.

Breakaway is conflicting for me, because our robot barely worked, but I liked how the elements of the game related to strategy and design. The simplest box with some kicker could do something, and a team could also expand on their design and take over the game (like 469), but the "Godbot" wasn't as constricting as in older games like Zone Zeal.

Triple Play makes the list because it was so strategically intense, which appeals to me. The tic-tac-toe setup added a layer of complexity to the game, which is something not seen often enough since.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I watched the last few seasons before this (back to lunacy) and, like you, have spent lots of time going over the past games. The ones that I know well are 2003-present. I think most people would say Aim High was their favorite game, although I was too young at the time to know about it. Breakaway is definitely a good game, as it allowed all sorts of robots to be useful. I like watching old matches of both 2004 and 2008, and 2007 was ok. I didn't really like 2011 or 2009, but then again most FRC games have set a high standard. Rebound Rumble was a very fun game, as all 3 parts were fun to play/watch. I could go into every little detail about what I liked and disliked, but you would all get bored at my soliloquy. The reason it is not a top game is that I didn't like the defensive penalties, and the co-op bridge was worth a bit too much. Still, it was ROBOTS PLAYING BASKETBALL, and me being a basketball player, I loved this game from the beginning as my first game as a member of FRC. Here are the last 10 games in order, IMO.

1.Aim High
2.Breakaway
3.Rebound Rumble
4.Overdrive
5.First FRENZY
6.Rack n' Roll
7.Stack Attack
8.2005 (can't remember the name but I remember it)
9.Logomothion
10.Lunacy

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I've only been involved since 2003 as well but I think that's where we have to start anyway since that was the introduction of autonomous. Maybe even 2005 when we went 3 v 3, as before that the games were very different.

I loved Aim High but the offense/defense rounds were very confusing for casual fans and it made autonomous worth too much. My problem with Breakaway wasn't really with the game design as much as I felt that robots looked to similar to the casual fan. If you got up close to the robots with their bumpers off you could see all the differences but if you just watched a web cast it was a lot of similar looking boxes kicking balls.

I think Rebound Rumble as it was played at IRI was the best and most dramatic FRC matches in history. The defense was challenging to perform but some teams played it very well throughout the year (ex. 16, 4334, and down here in Texas, 457). I loved watching teams fight for the middle bridge (ex. 341 vs. 233 so many times this season). Last second balances and human player shots decided matches at the buzzer. I think it’s one of the first times that the human player involvement made sense and was balanced.

Once I saw 148, 2936, and 922 pull of the first triple balance at Alamo I know it was going to be a very good year to be an FRC fan.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Nope! 2000.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

So I'll do mine based from my start year only. (2006)

1. Logomotion
2. Overdrive
3. Lunacy
4. Aim High
5. Rebound rumble
6. Rack N' Roll
7. Breakaway

My thought process goes by what i felt was exciting. (for the top 5)

Logomotion- The minibot was the make or break part of the game and to see the evolution of the minibot from week one to champs was just something real cool.

Overdrive- The fact of tossing such a huge game piece so high was just cool the entire time. and the fact i was a driver for this year made it all the better.

Lunacy- Most people might not like this game, but it was a chest match. Try to out think and drive your opponents made it all the fun. The chance to see a team score huge points on one ball dump so exciting.

Aim high- What made this game different and placed so high was how the game was broken into small periods. It seemed more like basketball, where for period you had to play offense and a period where you had to play defense. All picking up unlimited game pieces was cool.

Rebound rumble- Probably the best end game FIRST has had but the lack of having a few more balls killed it to me.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

This being my first year as a mentor and for my team, I think it was the best game for rookies. The game was really simple, easy to understand and explain and it was easy to watch and learn from. My team was able to understand the concepts quickly and only had to read the Game Manual for fouls and rules. My first year in FRC was 2009 and I personally loved Lunacy, but after looking back at the games through the years, Rebound Rumble is definitely one of the best games ever created. Breakaway was the first game in my opinion that people outside of FIRST could watch and get some understanding of. Rebound Rumble built off of that idea and made it better. When I was at Lone Star and one of the sponsors for our team came and asked us what this years game was all about, all I had to say was, "We have to play 3-on-3 basketball and try to balance on the bridge at the end for bonus points," and they instantly could catch on to the game. It did have it's downsides though. Like Allen said above, I do think the fouls and penalties could have lessened a bit but they didn't alter the game drastically.

The best part about this game was you never knew what the next week was going to be like. Every week was better and better and Championships (aside from Einstein) was like the icing on the cake as far as quality of matches go.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I joined in 2007 so I only have 6 games:

1. 2007 - Rack'N'Roll
2. 2012 - Rebound Rumble
3. 2010 - Breakaway
4. 2011 - Logomotion
5a. 2009 - Lunacy
5b. 2008 - Overdrive

Now before anyone jumps at me for not having Lunacy at the bottom of my list, Lunacy is not my least favorite only because I was the HP that year and if anyone else on here was you know it was cooler than being a driver that year.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

This.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I started in 2008, so here is my list, only considering games I have played in:

1: Logomotion: This was a simple, competitive and very fast-paced game. I really liked that any low-resource team could build an arm and compete, but teams with real skill built with efficiency as their main design tenet.
2: Rebound Rumble: In my opinion the best end-game and most fluid integration of coopertition yet. I also tend to enjoy games in which robots control multiple game-pieces.
3: Lunacy: A lot of people discredit Lunacy for its slow gameplay and open field. The reason I liked Lunacy is because despite the underdeveloped game, teams were able to produce some of the best robots in FIRST (many of which are among my favorites).
4: Overdrive: A lot of people liked Overdrive, but I found there to be a general lack of strategy (148 was an exception). Defense was fun, but robot-robot interaction within an alliance was relatively sparse.
5: Breakaway: I found breakaway to be fairly slow-paced and limiting in design. I don't really like games in which every team's robot resembles the others. Only a rare few broke loose of what became a cliché robot.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Having only been in FRC since 2010, my personal experience puts Breakaway at the top of my list, simply because it is what kicked off my career and was incredibly simple to grasp, yet also offered many strategic options (469, 51, 2337, 125 [cookie to anyone who can point out the similarity between these :D ])

After that, I would say that Rebound Rumble is a close second because of the action that the matches provided, especially the balancing. I can still hear the Archimedes side of the field exploding once Wave's alliance fell off the bridge and shot the Eh Team on to Einstein.

Of years that I didn't compete in, Overdrive and Aim High had always stood out to me, though I sorta got my Aim High fix through this year (Though it wasn't quite the same)

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Answering your questions, in order:
1. Number One.
2. Rebound Rumble.

Supporting evidence:
RR supplied the (almost) unaninimously considered best match in the history of FRC.
RR supplied the unanimously best IRI to date.

I rest my case.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

My top games for my years in FIRST:
2012 (The only game that features an exciting similar but different endgame during the qualification matches and the elims. I honestly can't find much fault with this game)
2004 (the robots were so athletic and amazing. Most Ohhhh/ahhh moments a FIRST game had.The game was so diverse)
2006(best game to watch. Exciting and easy to follow)
2010 (Would have ranking second if it wasn't for the nutty seeding system)
2008(I thought it was a rather fun game to watch really. Especially during the elims)
2003(this game was better than it got credit for it's only sin was giving way to many points for the top platform)
2007(not a bad game really but brutality at the championship showed it's flaws and the endgame was frustrating and trumped all the hard work good teams did and they could do nothing to stop it)
2011(Similar to 2007 but the endgame was over so fast you it was hard to get excited about it)
2009( great at strategy but boring to watch)
2005(very vanilla to be honest)
2002(bleh. The game changed completely in the eliminations and became a boring pointless tug of war)

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

"You must spread some reputation around before giving it to Jessica Boucher again."

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

This game was one of the better ones. My top five in the order they occurred:

Toroid Terror (1997)
Double Trouble (1999)
Zone Zeal (2002)
FIRST Frenzy: Raising the Bar (2004)
Rebound Rumble (2012)

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

My all time list looks like...

1. 2006 Aim High
2. 2012 Rebound Rumble
3. 2010 Breakaway
4. 2008 Overdrive
5. 2004 FIRST Frenzy

I think those who played in 2006 will choose 2006 over 2012 more often than those who didn't play 2006 will pick something over 2012.

2006 was probably the first of the "modern era" of FIRST robotics.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

"A vote says more about the voter than the thing they're voting on."
Your ranking of 2003 above 2007, 2011, and 2005 is a... striking statement.


QFT.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Since my Freshman year:

1) Rebound Rumble
2) Logomotion
3) Overdrive
4) Rack & Roll
5) Lunacy
6) Breakaway

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I love game ranking! I'll play...

1 - 2000 "Coopertition FIRST" - Still holds strong to the top spot at the greatest game ever in my opinion. To this day, I have never seen an elimination tourney at championships with more excitement. The ability to descore a major game piece and put it in your own goal, despite the difficulty of the action...unparalleled. It is going to take one heck of a game to top that one in my eyes.

2 - 1999 "Double Trouble" - While the portion of the games where teams picked up and scored "Floppies" was not as exciting, the rest of the game made up for it. Battles for the top of the puck, a team suddenly yanking the puck across the field to double their score. The puck, by far in my opinion, was the greatest game element ever created by a FIRST GDC. I would love more than anything to see it return.

3 - 2012 "Rebound Rumble" - It took some thought to put this game here over Aim High, but in the end I had to. I personally judge how good a game is by how bored I get announcing by the end of championships. This year, to this day, I am still not bored of this game. The strategy involved in this game in incredibly dynamic. The risk/reward element is such a heavy part of this game, that it keeps you on your toes at every moment. Any game in which you have the opportunity for a last second game swing is huge...when that last second game swing involves a possibility of your robot ending up in a heap of scrap at the bottom of a teeter-totter bridge as a result of a missed balance, well, then you have a winner in my book!

4 - 2006 "Aim High" - This one is here for many of the same reasons as Rebound Rumble. Fast paced, complex strategy, never boring. The reason it did not end up as number 3? Simple...no crashing robots from a failed balance. Other than that, one of the best ever.

5 - 2004 "First Frenzy" - OK...so this was a tough one because I also loved the 2007 game. The edge that this game gets? Simple. One of the best single plays in FIRST history took place that year... River Rage 2004: The Pole Vault This game had it all...hanging, scoring, defense, falling robots, tumbling balls from a container, creativity in designs...it was pretty awesome.

Rounding out what would be my top 10 in order would be

6 - 2007 "Rack n Roll"
7 - 2005 "Triple Play"
8 - 1996 "Hexagon Havoc
9 - 2011 "Logo Motion"
10 - 1997 - "Torroid Terror"

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I was/am/and will continue to be a big Fan of 2005 Triple Play. I love the tic-tac toe scoring bonus. Auton was OK. I think with the improvements to the vision system, it would better. I feel this game is way underrated, and if brought back (in some form) would be a real pleaser. The OCCRA 2011 game is a variant I really think could have some legs in FRC.

Rebound rumble was much better than I expected when the game got anounced. I initially thought the scoring in a flat hoop would be too difficult for teams to do effectively. I am glad I was wrong. In general, the game suffered a bit from too much scoring in auton and endgame, and not enough scoring in the middle. I am not sure how I would adjust the values though.

As far as the bridge, this was probably the most exciting endgame element from a spectators perspective. Usually I am very frustrated watching teams struggle to drive up a ramp, or having difficulty docking to a pole or ... Charlie Browing on the bridges was exciting. All of the triple doubles and double triples at MSC was also a big thrill. Muc more exciting than the minibot race.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Based on Games I have seen live (prefaced with my status on the team to show a frame of mind):

2007 Rack N' Roll: My rookie year and I absolutely loved the game coming in the moving rack, the inflatable tubes, and balancing on a robot at the end were all great. The exponential scoring was also a nice touch though I will admit not the most spectator friendly.

2012 Rebound Rumble: My first game as the full time coach and I had a blast. The main complaints of the co-op bridge never effected us to badly and only one match we had an issue of no one wanting to co-op. The scoring was simple and balanced, the end game was exciting without being overly complicated and upsets were a lot more common then previous games

2006 Aim High: Attending Mission Mayhem inside on the tiny field made this game a lot more fun to me ironically but more importantly the obvious Big Brother to rebound rumble had several things I would love to see return, the offensive and defensive times, more game pieces then could almost ever be used, and ramps (if not obvious for some reason I am very much a fan of ramp games :D )

2011 Logomotion: My first game as part time coach and I feel Rack N' Roll's descendant was a great game but not as good as the first for a few reasons. First the positives the multiple shape inflates was great to see and did make almost all teams not just repeat their 2007 designs, the field being mostly open made for great games to watch, and the game pieces making the logo worth more was the best aspect. The bad: scoring blocking your view of the field for the end game made it more challenging but not in a fun way, and the mini-bot race was not spectator or sometimes field friendly, it was sometimes hard to watch from the stands and the field to determine the winner and while the engineering impressed me it was over so fast sometimes you didn't get to see it.

2005 Triple Play: The first FIRST game I saw and I was hooked the tetras were awesome and the scoring was simple though I will admit from the stands a little challenging to figure out if you didn't pay attention the whole time, I feel this game would have ranked higher had I participated in the build season but I was 13 at the time so that couldn't happen.

2009 Lunacy: The game I became Team Captain (the last one on my team) and the game I became a full time field member, I loved the open field and regolith, the fact that the scoring locations were attached to robots, and the super cells were great. This would rank a lot higher if several games didn't devolve into pile ups in the middle of the field which slowed down the pace for me

2008 Overdrive: My second active year and I became the lead scout. This game was slowed down do to a lack of defensive play and there was a lot of field pieces blocking the view from the stands.

2010 Breakaway: My senior and last year as a student and this is my least favorite game how ever I will freely admit that I feel this game would have ranked higher without some of the team dynamics that occurred. The scoring was to low for my taste, with matches easily ending in ties of 0-0 and robot to robot interactions were sometimes limited to 1 on 1 but event though it was my least favorite it was still an exciting game and I wouldn't call it "bad"

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I'm going to have to go with 1996, Hexagon Havoc, as the best game ever.

Rebound Rumble was pretty good, top half..

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Food for thought: Would Lunacy have been significantly better on carpet? That would, in theory, increase robots' ability to get out of the "pile ups" that slowed down the game.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

No, it would have been worse. Lunacy was a very weird game but it was built for the flooring.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I liked Rebound Rumble, but it wasn't my all time favourite. I'm only going to comment on games I've competed in.

1. Breakaway:

This tops my list. While it was tough to be good at the top tier, this incredibly difficult yet simple game was balanced enough that anyone who could push a ball around with a kitbot theoretically could have been competitive. I thoroughly enjoyed this game; but only after it was fixed after week 1.

2. Rebound Rumble:

Rebound rumble was another fast paced, fun game. While it combined a few "mixed-bag" ideas from games of the past, it provided much entertainment, and was again a tough and super competitive game.

3. FIRST Overdrive:

FIRST Overdrive will always have a special place in my heart, as it was my rookie year, and my first year at the field. While I personally think it was far too penalty-ridden, it still made for a fun and interesting challenge.

4. Logomotion:

This resides at the bottom of my list for one very simple reason. Minibots. All it turned into was a freaking spending war. The rules were so loose that the more resources you had, the faster the minibot was. While my teammates and I enjoyed much success with Logomotion, I have enjoyed other games more.

I won't talk about Lunacy. That year still stings.

-Nick

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I think that when you talk about the "best game" for FRC, you may want to divide the field of games up into two, if not three, sections.

There are the "every bot for himself" games of the 1990s (1992-1998). Those, I can't comment on, as I only have a vague idea of most of them.

There are the Alliance games (1999-present). That group can be further divided into 2v2 and 3v3. 2001's 4v0 is in a class by itself, but it's still an alliance game--and, IMO, at the bottom of the list.

Of the 2v2 (1999-2004, 2001 excepted), I'd have to go with:
2004--the strategic cycle of small, doubler, bar is tough to beat.
2000--Simple, but tough.
1999--Multipliers are key, but getting them is tough.
2002--Good balance between goals and balls in terms of points, but don't get old-timers started on the tape measures.
2003--That ramp was worth way too much.

Of the 3v3 (2005 and onwards)... Well, in no particular order, but generally high to low: Breakaway, Rebound Rumble, Rack 'n' Roll, Triple Play, Aim High, LogoMotion, Overdrive, Lunacy.

Best overall: Undecided. Each game has its good points and bad. I'd probably take the top 2 of the 3v3s and the top 3 of the 2v2s (in my list) and call those top 5, no order.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

2004 still my favorite one! :D

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

My listing of the games I've personally been part of (08-12)

1. 2008 - FIRST Overdrive: I think Overdrive was the most entertaining game I've ever seen played. First off, it was an intuitive game for the public to watch. Balls go up, score goes up. The autonomous was one of my favorites, as you'd either see a robot expertly maneuver the track, or you'd see a collision. No lose in my book! Game play was fun to watch. It may have been a little linear with the flow of the game, but seeing how teams devised to hurdle balls always fascinated me. The end game may have been a bit dry, but it certainly had it's moments.

2. 2012 - Rebound Rumble: The 2012 game ran a close second to Overdrive and was almost third. I found the game exciting at all levels, qualification and eliminations, regionals and champs. An autonomous and teleoperated period that were similar, yet exciting, earning cheers from the crowd if a team was able to sink a full stream of balls. The simple scoring rules made it a great audience game. The frosting on the cake was the endgame. An extremely exciting end game that would either end in triumph or crushing defeat. Amazing game all around.

3. 2011 - Logomotion: The only thing that draws Logomotion down from the #1 or #2 spot is the often "dead-matches", where robots would perform at a heart breakingly low level. Missed ubertubes, numbers of logo pieces I could count on the number of suns in the sky, no or slow minibot races. Especially at the earlier regionals, these happened more often than I liked. But overall, I enjoyed the robot, elevation and acquisition system designs, as well as the entirety of teleoperated. I just loved seeing those tubes go up. It was also nice to have (close to) real-time scoring, and a visual of how well an alliance it doing (wall of tubes). Many people criticized the end game for being too over weighted, but I don't really see it.

4. 2010 - Breakaway: I found the action of Breakaway to be much less exciting than many others, almost costing it the #4 spot. While many teams designed and planned for a cross court shootout, many teams didn't consistently shoot/kick from further than the middle field, and most points came from herding balls into goals. The autonomous period was dry to me as well, as it was basically just a headstart on teleoperated (as balls were worth the same points). Breakaway had two saving graces: End game, and strategy. I found the strategy involved in Breakaway fascinating, as you could coordinate how you set up auton, how you played the fields in teleoperated, and how you synced up your end game. I also found the end game of Breakaway exciting, as the robots hoisted themselves up. While some robots snapped themselves up in a blink of excitement, robots than winched up had the crowd on the edge of their seats, seeing if they would make it.

5. 2009 - Lunacy: I have gripes with Lunacy that have yet to be resolved (for example, two friends I know from 1126 were married yesterday. They decided it would be a good idea to have the walkway leading to the ceremony covered with Regolith. I love them dearly, and it was a wonderful wedding, but I'll be darned if carrying that stuff into the trailer after the ceremony didn't bring back painful memories). Lunacy was a unique game, and it was close in many aspects to being great. It just... wasn't. First off, the autonomous mode. It was a trainwreck, which often just ended with 5 robots in a pile up center field, and one who maybe was smart enough to run along the side. Teleoperated was a cat and mouse cluster... never mind... that rarely, but occasionally, had the roles switch. Too often you'd see one robot pin another, just to have a third jump in out of the blue and join the action. I thought the super cells were an interesting addition to the game, probably the only aspect I really enjoyed. Just seeing what teams would do with them. Too bad they often just ended up on the floor. I don't think Regolith was the problem with 09. It was a joint effort by several aspect of the game.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

My top two aren't references to the game itself, but to the impact of the game. By impact, I mean what each did for FIRST culturally and the impact it had on the casual observer. I also know I'm echoing others here with my choices.

2000 - This was the game changer. Coopertition was the game that introduced Coopertition. If you ask me, FRC had the danger of descending into a bitter culture of competition we see all too often in sports had it not been for this game. Also, for everyone who is used to the 3v3 games, the original incrnation of cooperition had the added twist that you didn't know who your partners were when you went to the field during qualifications. The match schedule listed 4 teams, and at the end of the match preceeding yours, you found out who your partner was. A challenge to be sure, but a good one that I feel changed a lot of attitudes in FRC.

2008 - Overdrive was the most intiutively approachable game that I've been involved in. Robots make laps, robots toss balls over the overpass. That's simple, effective, and provided for a variety of designs that solved the game challenge. Also, this was the first year for mandatory bumpers. While the bumpers make the collisions gentler, they also make the field look like a sport. You can see the reds, you can see the blues, and the bumpers are a heck of a lot better than the flags and leds used previously. While 2008 didn't have red and blue bumpers in the rules, more than a few teams decided to make two sets just to look good on their alliances. I'm glad FIRST adopted that convention as it makes for a really sharp scene.

One man's opinion.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I've witnessed '08 on.
That being said:
1. Logomotion
2. Rebound Rumble.
4. Lunacy/Breakaway
5. Overdrive

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I'm going to go with 2004. So many games thrive at certain levels, but are intolerably boring at others. Breakaway was tremendous on Einstein, but absolutely terrible when low end teams were on the field (remember the countless 0-0 ties?). Lunacy was okay in regionals, but good opponents just led to humans players doing most of the scoring and maybe one good score per robot.

2004, despite it's silly name, was competitive and entertaining at virtually every level. Just about every team could do something, and there were so many different activities and varieties of robots. High end games were exciting and competitive, but low end games would still have points on the board and battles over key resources.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I have only watched FRC since 2008, so I will only list the 2008-2012 competitions:

1. Breakaway: It may not have had the best seeding system, but it was by far the easiest to understand, and the most fun for both competitors and spectators. Even bad robots could perform, but the best clearly played at a much higher level.

2. Rebound Rumble: At the highest level, this was the most competitive FRC game. This is ranked #2 for one reason alone: The division elimination rounds. Spectacular and completely unexpected.

3. Overdrive: Simple, fun for audiences and players, this was probably one of the more competitive and balanced games. Although there weren't many tasks a robot could accomplish, there was a lot of different and interesting robots.

4. Logomotion: Sometimes not very competitive, and a little boring. It was a bit hard to watch, although I thought it was creative, especially the end game. It was definitely more fun at a higher level.

5. Lunacy: Boring and hard to understand. It did not draw in audiences, and it was probably the least fun game to play.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Rating FIRST games gets a bit difficult because as the years roll by, some elements from an earlier game got included in the newer games. That isn't a bad thing either. Rebound Rumble looked to be a very fun and exciting game, but my favorite will always be Ladder Logic (1998?). If I recall correctly, it was a 1v1v1 game, before alliances came on the scene.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Your memory is excellent. Either that or both of our memories are faulty--it was the last game to be 1v1v1, and the reason for the alliances starting the next year was a de facto 2v1 tended to result if there was a highly-ranked team in the arena. At least, if my memory is also correct.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

My list so far...

1. 2008 - Overdrive
2. 2011 - Logomotion
3. 2007 - Rack'N'Roll
4. 2010 - Breakaway
5. 2012 - Rebound Rumble
6. 2009 - Lunacy

My thoughts in making the list...
1. Overdrive was by far my favorite, and it also was a game that was extremely easy to explain to others.
2/3. Logomotion and Rack'N'Roll were both awesome, incorporating much the same elements. A period of hanging tubes, followed by an end game that could be extremely exciting. I give the node to Logomotion, however, since we managed to make it to champs that year.
4. Breakaway was a great game all around. However, the separation of the field into 3 zones tended to result in less robot-robot interaction, which makes things a little less fun.
5. This year was great, however I really didn't like the way the field was split. Basic kit bots had a hard time being useful to their team. They relied on someone else lowering the bridge in order to help earn points, and if they couldn't get to the other side, they also couldn't play defense. Further, I personally didn't like the way coopertition points affected rankings.
6. I can't count the number of matches I saw where the human players outscored the robots. Add to that the complications with getting game pieces to practice with, and this one rates as my all-time low.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I've only played the past three games, but I did study Lunacy a bit. I'm not a huge fan of the games based on other sports, partially because it's hard to explain something like "It's like basketball, but with more balls and eight goals.", and partially because I think FIRST goes beyond that. Robotics is just way cooler than basketball or soccer or other "athletics". I'm not sure it sends the message of wanting to change culture when we have ended up conforming to it.

This is probably a bit more blunt than I intended it, all those athletics do have value, but it's independent of robotics and vice-versa. Once more people come to our regional competition with 55 teams than go to a football game with only two, I'll stand down. But dealing with challenges that we hadn't even thought of dealing with is (I think) more impressive than these imitation athletics. I would be willing to bet there are several FIRSTers who have looked at a basketball game and thought about how to build a robot to do it, but I get more of a kick thinking of ways to drive on a low friction surface or suspend an inner tube than something people watch other people do as a mater of course.

*I liked the co-op thing though. That was cool, and totally what FIRST is about. You don't see much of that on a basketball court.

**I am going to keep referring to Curiosity's landing as an interplanetary field goal, however.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I have personally experienced the 2006 game and after, so I can't say much about before that other than what recorded matches I've seen on the internets.

2007 - My absolute favorite all-time has always been Rack'n'Roll, not just because of how simple the game seemed (score tubes), but how the game allowed different skill-level teams to have different but equally important impact on the game. And the post-game mandated teamwork to work. Plus, I still feel like that was the last true year of defense.

2009 - I love Lunacy because your robot WAS the scoring device. You had to protect yourself, as well as you teammates. Also, the Regolith made driving particularly fun that year.

Honorable Mentions
2005 - Love watching youtube videos of this game. Am completely disappointed I missed this entire season. Robots playing contact Tic-Tac-Toe is awesome!

2003 - Something about knocking down a giant wall never gets old. This was still in the more "rockem sockem robots"-esk era of FIRST, in my opinion.

2001 - Get the highest score possible and stop the time. I also kind of like how there was no opponent except the clock.


The Bad
2011 - still dislike the minibots. Also hated how almost half the field was restricted to one alliance or the other. WAAAY too many driving rules.
2010 - didn't like the zone restrictions. And even what rules didn't restrict, gameplay still seemed very isolated. An open field would have made the game MUCH better.
2008 - Defense (for all intensive purposes) was illegal this year. I was excited when it sounded like it was going to be like NASCAR, but my excitement didn't last long.
2002 - Became a giant pushing match of who had the best tred. Not much fun to watch.

Really hate to complain on fav boards, but FIRST's recent games just don't live up to their predecessors. If you go back and watch '99, '02, '03, '04, '07, so much was left to grit and determination. Now it's all about skill and team talent. Not saying that's bad at all, just different. '12 was no different than '11 or '10; the teams that could score the most (with a few exceptions) were going to win.
Since the beginning of autonomous ('03), I'd rank Rebound Rumble 6th; '07, '05, '03, '09, '06, '12, '04, '11, '10, '08.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I'm not quite sure I understand why that's a bad thing.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I think it may be the best so far because the game is just, FULL of excitement. Especially when it comes to the bridges. That last minute balance is sure to make the adrenalin kick in! I've been competing since Aim High and I certainly think this is the best one. Maybe fighting with Lunacy for its spot at #1.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Rebound Rumble is top 5 for me after experiencing 12 different games in 13 years.
Personal opinions are often times based on your experience/successes during that season, and this is definitely one of them for me personally.

The only thing I would like to see changed in the future is a bonus/end game that is more closely related to the game itself. However, having different tasks are good engineering/design exercises that forces teams to integrate multiple functions on the same robot.

Ex. Logomotion was about putting up tubes, but end game had minibots racing up a pole. No relation.
Rebound Rumble had ramps but nothing to do with scoring baskets.
What if instead there was an endgame at the free throw line where each consecutive basket made scored exponentially like Rack N Roll? Teams would be forced to minimize missed shots.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Somewhere in Goleta CA there is a robot that just shed a tear because it's incredible accuracy could have scored even more points then it already did...:rolleyes:

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Of my 3 years I would have to say

1) Rebound Rumble
2) Logomotion
3) Breakaway

But going back a few more years, I like watching '04 and '06 matches better.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

In the past eight years that I have done FIRST, I would rank this years game fourth. My personal favorite is Aim High, I think it is a more well done version of this game. The scoring and pace at which the game was played was much higher than any other game I have seen, with full court plays being made at all times. The two greatest plays I have ever seen in FIRST history occurred in 2006, one featuring Team 25 and the other featuring Team 71.

I have never been a fan of games that are defined by the end game. Games like 2007, 2011 and 2012 were so heavily influenced by the final 15-20 seconds that they rendered the other 100 seconds mostly useless. Ranking the eight games I have seen I would say it is 06>10>08>12>05>07>11>09

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

2007 was not highly influenced by the end game like 2011 or 2012. In 2007 if you were good at placing tubes, the end game was absurdly meaningless. If you were able to get 5 tubes in a row you were already +2 on the maximum your opponent could get in the endgame. I would classify 2007's endgame as a cherry on the top of an amazing game. The chess battle that would take place between alliances of where they were placing tubes was exhilarating and then to see the teams rush last second to place that last tube or place that spoiler and then dart for their alliance's ramps and lift 12 inches all within the last 10-15 seconds was unbelievable.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

I actually thought 2007's end game was a game breaker in many elimination matches over various regionals. 60 points vs none was huge.
Wasnt that the year that a lot of lower seeds won regionals?
I also cant recall any other year that an 8th seed won CMP.:)
**High Rollers fan**

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Oh ya thats right it was 30 points each. IM sorry, IDK why I thought it was 30 total for 2 bots. And championship that year stung a little bit or a very sketchy red card call that ended our run in the Newton finals.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

If you were dramatically bettter at placing tubes than your opponent, the end game was meaningless. All that meant was that the top few teams at shallow regionals didn't have to worry about balancing during qualification matches where they weren't heavily defended.

Ramps and defense dictated that game. 6+ tube rows were rare. Not getting your 60 points in end game bonuses was usually a death sentence in elimination matches, similar to a failed ramp balance this year. When it was played in the way you describe, it was awesome, but that was rare outside of IRI and Galileo.

2007 was a game that had the potential to be excellent, but an average match was brutally boring and having an effective end game would win (or at least tie) almost every qualification match. It was much easier to reduce your opponents' score through defense and tactical tube placement than to drive up your own.

Re: Was Rebound Rumble the Best Game Yet?
 

Every division in Atlanta was like that though. The Newton elimination rounds were some of the best matches I had seen all year.