[FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

The first game hint has finally arrived. The game hint was posted on the FTC blog at http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.c...game-time.html.

The first game hint is supposedly a bus...
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/at...5&d=1345230458

What do you guys think? What kind of make/model is the bus and what can it mean?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

"lift across"...? Hmm.

And whenever I see a bus, I think "under the bus". So... Maybe robots have to go underneath something?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I've said this for years. Hanging.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

"catching a lift"
"ring"ing phones

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

The car is also known as a Volkswagen Transporter.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

AhHa...

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

From what I see on other posts, lifting, ring'ing, and transporting. Doesn't this sound like Logo Motion?

You have to catch something perhaps?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I personally like the "under the bus" idea as I see where it comes from. And I also like the transporting idea as well. Both are great!... well, all ideas are great but I like those two the best. But again... who knows!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Notice that there is a poster of a robot R2D2? hanging on the light post and a repair man up there too.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Here I go:
Back from "summer vacation". They were in a Volkswagen.
Volkswagen are German.
German summer holidays include "assumption day" in which Mary ascended into heaven. You could say she "climbed there"
They "caught a lift" in the VW.

Something to do with lifting and/or climbing.

That's what I think.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

so the bus is a vw transporter and they said they caught a lift on the robobus,
so if you type in "Volkswagen Transporter robot bus" on google, http://www.collectablescorner1.com/s...-Robots/Detail comes up, maybe it has something to do with the movie robots

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

It is going to be all about parallel parking. Robobus got lucky! But that car in front of it... Well good luck to them on getting out without hitting anything!!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

There is a new hint:
http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.c...ost-there.html

I am thinking a Logomotion (FRC 2011) Overdrive (FRC 2010) hybrid.

Kyle

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I see poles that have potential to be used for climbing!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Ringing phones, now telephone wires...

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

If a hint says "reach across" and another "end of the long road" I would think the picture of telephone poles would represent poles on the outside of a field. Maybe you have to transport across the field rings to score them to an off-field goal that may be poles or similar to telephone poles (Each level of the spoke is a higher point level?).

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

overdrive was 2008, breakaway was 2010

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Thr prevalance of poles seems to suggest having the robot climb up a pole like they did for FRCs logomotion.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I think they're going to change the field size from a square to a rectangle. "Long Trips", "Long Road", etc.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Taking two field paremeters and combining them to make a single rectangular field with two basic sets of the field elements and playing a 3-on-3 tweaked version of the game has been an off-season idea of mine for a few years now. ;)

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Anyone remember this picture from last year on ftc's facebook page? http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater
one of the hints is back after catching a lift "across the country" (thats a long trip, so is that race) on the RoboBus for "summer vacation" (beach has to do with summer) and the latest hint said nearing the end of the "long road"(this race was 200 miles!) and Timm (the person posting all the hints) ran it.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Do we have another hint today?? See http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.com/ for details.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Seems we have a second reference to “Rings” now. The question becomes are we transporting them or hanging from them?

The Medal clue is interesting because it looks silver. Are they implementing Gold, Silver and Bronze medals like the Olympics?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I wonder if the things in their hands are supposed to represent another "mountain" to vary the terrain, like in "Get Over it!".

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

The new hint also says "all I can think is Olympics (in more ways than one)."

I looked up different meanings on Olympic, and this wikipedia page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_(disambiguation)
All of the other uses for olympic are to name airline companies or large ships. This further shows that the FTC game will involve traveling large distances.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

They're both star tennis players, they're "passing" the torch, there's a fence in the background (could be related to a tennis net), and they're showing the similarities between the FIRST logo and Olympic rings? Note: rings was a hint before.
Sounds like it has the elements of Vex Clean Sweep to me. Except with rings. .............And hopefully, torches.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

So with passing the torch and long distances, could it involve a field setup in a rectangular fashion, versus square, with quadrants such that one robot passes a scoring object from one quadrant to another? Could the scoring element be a ring? Will the robot have to climb a pole in the endgame?

Because FIRST wants to push Matrix, which is less sturdy than Tetrix, the GDC may have designed a limited contact game so the Matrix teams are not disadvantaged when a tetrix robot squashes them. Climbing would also benefit the lighter Matrix parts. If the field is divided into quadrants, that would provide limited contact.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

"Shall we play a game? "

A new hint:
http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.c...play-game.html

X's and O's it is - with a twist, I'm sure!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

[quote=jcarr;1183620
Because FIRST wants to push Matrix, which is less sturdy than Tetrix, [/quote]

Not too certian where you've read this intent or have seen any testing to document your second claim? I beleive both to be incorrect. To my knowledge there is no preference by FIRST over one vender or the other as both are allowed kit of parts. Tetrix and Matrix are similar gauge aluminum with different profiles and connector pieces but both appear to be sturdy and capable of building robots.* Not yet seen in competition, so it remains to be determined if one building system offers an advantage over the other. I think it may be a bit of a wash when compared to design ingenuity...imho

*Based upon running summer robotics camps with VEX, TETRIX, and now Matrix

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

During the opening ceremony in St. Louis, FIRST mentioned Matrix and that the GDC would design a game that featured the new parts. I thought it odd, but they said it. It is possible I misunderstood. We will find out soon enough.

Because they mentioned it, I spent some time at the Matrix booth. The materials are not similar gauge, at least not the ones that were at St. Louis. If you have actual parts for comparison, that is great and I would love to see some specs. I remember what I saw at the booth, but it has been a long summer.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

From what I heard they're more like VEX gauge parts. It would be interesting to see multiple robot types on the field and possibly use of both materials. The lesson of "the best strategy is not to play" could mean a separate field area. But I would think this is too complicated to add to the manual. Pairing Tetrix and Matrix teams every round and maybe having an equal amount?

Maybe an alternative scoring object? It seems like there are two sides to a telephone pole. Adding to the interest would be a sort of adding and subtracting scoring. One side gains a point, but the opponent scores the same level and side. Removing a point at the same time. Resulting in a number of stalemates and possibly defensive/offensive measures.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

They have been showing rings. Now they are talking about strategy. The clip from War Games shows the WOPR playing tic-tac-toe. The lines of telephone poles may indicate winning by getting three rings of your color in a row on a matrix of poles. That would be similar to the logomotion game.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

What if is like a combo of Rack 'n Roll and Triple Play?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I'd like to see more precision scoring, instead of mass scoring. Rings seem like it would be a happy medium. :)

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I think another major hint is, "How will your robot compliment your alliance mate's robot?" This goes along with the passing references.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

New Hint:
http://firsttechchallenge.blogspot.c...e-stretch.html

The first hint that can be seen is the title "Home Stretch". This refers to a term in racing for a last turn or straight portion of the track.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Once again the word ring appears in a clue! hmmmmmm

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Once a lap you get to place a ring on a grid. I think Tic-Tac-Toe is a little too simplistic, but maybe something where the more rings in a row you score the more points it’s worth. Part Roller Derby, part Connect 5. Lot’s of potential for strategy on both the race portion and the ring placement.

Fast bots, agile bots and accurate bots will all have an advantage. Big 50lb bots, may actually be at a disadvantage. This plays well for combining bots from Tetrix, Matrix, & custom parts.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Another hint I saw which I didn't have time to post was "we'll step you through any issues.". Which makes me think there's an obstacle course of sorts involving team work.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Another clue. Seems to support putting rings on poles in some sequence. May have divided game area.

"you have all your ducks in a row".
"critical administrative actions each team needs to complete"
"you can ring us"
"we'll step you through"

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

The photo is a deeper hint, it's from a sketch on an old tv show. Nothing too crucial, except that the character uses the phrase "one ringydingy, two ringydingy" etc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9e3dTOJi0o
"down to the wire" - hearkening to telephone wire reference?
"clock ticking" - well, that happens in every game.
"ducks in a row" - someone commented on the blog that this works with the tictactoe reference
"ring us" - ring reference
"step you through" - has to do with jumping through hoops, maybe, or just another ring reference?
Also, in the title, I think that the home "stretch" could indicate a rectangular field shape. But that's probably just wishful thinking.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

A Tentative list. Feel free to add stuff.

"catching a lift"
"ring"ing phones
Volkswagen Transporter.
“end of the long road”
“almost there”
telephone wires
Olympic rings
Passing the torch
Star tennis players
Fence
Medal/FIRST logo
Complimenting teammate
Predict/forethought
“The only way to win is not to play”
“the home stretch”
“one ringydingy, two ringydingy"
"down to the wire"
"clock ticking"
"ducks in a row"
"ring us"
"step you through"

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I’ve hoped for a 12 x 16 field too, but I don’t think it’s in the cards just yet. If it were in play, I’d assume that AndyMark would be suspiciously out of stock on the official Field perimeter. Maybe next year.

http://www.andymark.com/product-p/am-0481.htm

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I’ve hoped for a 12 x 16 field too, but I don’t think it’s in the cards just yet. If it were in play, I’d assume that AndyMark would be suspiciously out of stock on the official Field perimeter. Maybe next year.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

It's possible they could change the field this year by either two options:
- Taking the tiles and sidewalls from other parts of the field.
- New playing surface (carpet, wood, etc) if they create

With all the changes in materials it might be a field change too. They state no field shape or the word field for that matter in the rulebook they had released early.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

What about 8x16? still the same number of walls.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Not wanting to highjack this thread any further, I posted metal thickness data on an older thread about the matrix kit of parts. Upon a casual look one might agree that a majority of the parts are of similar yet not identical gauge with most being 1/16 verses 5/64 (4/64 v 5/64). Major difference that I did not spot immediately was in the angle beam 1/8 vs 1/16.

See data in post.

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Down to the "wire"
"precious" game hint
Lord of the "Rings"
Sauron's tower - the all-seeing eye
One does not simply walk into Mordor

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

This is what I have found in past years, the game hints don't really matter. They can tell you that we are scoring rings in a tic tac toe arrangement. If you don't have the game manual, that info is close to useless. We need rules on scoring points, penaltys ect. It is a lot of fun to try and guess the game though, and I like how FTC gives hints. It kind of sounds like " hanging around" (the FVC game in 2006).

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

Is there "One Ring" that's special?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

After reading all these ideas and some of my own speculation, I think we can be fairly certain about a few things:

The new game will involve placing/hanging rings on poles/posts. Robots will need to pass these rings between each other. Scoring in one way will be to the exclusion of others. The game will likely involve obstacles or terrain.

I think there will be a shared element between both teams this year, similar to the middle balance bridge in Rebound Rumble.

Just one more day until we know for sure!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

My guesses would be:
Rings (duh), one bonus ring
travelling long distances, long field
working with your partner, passing
heavy defensive strategy, descoring
ring stacking/lining up in rows
some sort of gate/fence obstacle, maybe with narrow entrance
...Wire?
...tower/pole?

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

We are a rookie team (graduates of three years of FLL), and we are absolutely pumped for the kick-off! Guessing the game has been very exciting. We're going to all write down our guesses tonight and see who is closest tomorrow. I agree that guessing is somewhat futile, but fun nonetheless. Thanks for playing along with us, everyone!

I like the idea of one ring as "precious". I hadn't thought of that one. Also, I can see passing the ring to an alliance partner as probable as well as some sort of obstacle on the path. It certainly looks like hanging rings, maybe in a row, is important in scoring as well.

We shall soon see......

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

I may be drawing too many conclusions here, but in 2011, the FTC game (Get Over It!) had bridges, which involved balancing. The 2012 FRC game (Rebound Rumble) had bridges, which involved balancing. The next FLL game (Senior Solutions) also has a 'bridge' which involves balancing. So from past experience, we can definitely see that the FTC GDC is quite capable of borrowing from other programs and their past games. It sounds like there will be 'rings' or 'doughnuts' of some kind, so I guess we will have to see!

Re: [FTC]: FTC 2012-2013 Game Hints
 

If this is a special ring, it would be interesting for it to be a different size/shape than the others.

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The license plate says robobus, a lot of you have noticed this. I decided to put it in google, and a lot of these photos came up. http://www.timeslive.co.za/scitech/2...o-bus-pictures Notice the arms, I think transportation, is a big deal in this competition. And maybe they are trying to refer to something more human than we imagine. :confused: