Student Expectations for Travel
 

So we (the adults) are putting together a handbook for our team and in it we want to include some expectations/rules that our students need to follow for traveling for regionals/staying in hotels.

We already have in there that they do need to travel in no less then groups of 3, letting a chaperone know if they're going to lunch, having a curfew for the night and no closed doors if there are members of both sexes in a room.

What kinds of things do your teams expect from the students during travel? Any insight will be helpful.


Thanks!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

I think it might be regulations with our school district, but our students have to have an adult aged 21+ accompany them anywhere that isn't like the hotel or the venue.

This leads to interesting bargaining when certain groups of students want to go somewhere unique for lunch/dinner :rolleyes:

The best one I've heard from a team is once their kids weren't going to bed at proper times, so they implemented a curfew instituted with duct tape on the outside of the door. Can't put it back on from inside!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Depending on where we are, we don't enforce this rule. Like, when we went to Boston, the kids could go to lunch or breakfast by themselves because there were literally a bunch of places across the street from the venue or within a block or 2. They were not however, allowed to get on the T without an adult, for example to go to Fanueil Hall. However, if we went to say, DC or Baltimore or somewhere not 'local' to us, then we'd enforce it.

LOVE THIS. Heh. :D

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Check with your school. A lot of schools have a set of rules or guidelines for student travel that can give you a big starting point.

Personally, I think having a reasonable curfew is a must for trips like this. This helps ensure your students aren't disturbing other guests, and helps get them down to the lobby for breakfast on time. Besides, if they aren't exhausted after a full day at a robotics competition, they're doing something wrong!

We always eat as a team during competition. When we travel, this includes breakfast, lunch, and dinner. When we're going to a competition in town, it's generally only lunch, as students will do breakfast/dinner with their family, and we aren't responsible for them during those hours. This gives us a chance to hold team meetings while we eat, promote team bonding, and ensure no one is getting in trouble.

When we're at the competition venue, the general rule is no student leaves. Obviously, this doesn't apply if a parent picks up their kid.

All of this is designed for the student's safety AND the mentor/chaperone's peace of mind. After all, the last thing you want is for student to get hit by a car when you let them leave the venue to get food unsupervised!

In addition to all of this, there is a general "behave well" rule - We don't want hotel guests, other teams at competition, or patrons at restaurants complaining about us!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

You've pretty much nailed all the things we do. At the actual regional, we use the buddy system- never go anywhere alone. We also expect students to be one of four places: In the pit for judges or drive team, out to lunch, scouting in the pits, or scouting in the stands. Students are also required to travel to and from the regional with the team on the buses, unless they use a travel form from the school's administration to leave early or arrive late. We also have them sign a form that says they will follow typical school expectations and will be punished as if they were at school.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Jon, question on this - (it may be a dumb question but whatever) - are the kids responsible for paying their own way even when you have team dinners or does the team pay?

We tend to run into a problem that the kids don't budget appropriate for trips and their money is gone the first day - and they don't listen to us when we tell them that $20 isn't going to get them through 3 days in Boston or Manchester. Any suggestions for pounding this home?

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Also, one more question - do any of you all enforce cell phone use in the stands during competition? During our matches, we do want our kids in the stands cheering, but when we're not competing, we want them either mingling in the pits with other teams or talking to the college reps that are there.

Unfortunately, we have a hard time with most of them just sitting in the stands who aren't scouting and being on their phones. We don't want to have to take the phones away and give them back at lunchtime, but we're at a loss as to how to handle this.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

It depends on the meal. Some meals (like lunch during competition) are ordered and delivered as a team, and the team pays. Others might be on a per-student basis.

Before the trip, we make sure everyone knows which meals the team is covering, and which ones they will need to pay for, as well as how much money they should bring for meals (based on average prices at the places we'll be eating).

Occasionally we'll have a student who forgot to bring money, or didn't bring enough. It's usually not a problem for one of the mentors or teachers to cover that student and get paid back by the parents later - it's never been that common for it to be a big problem for the team.

If it's a chronic problem, though, I would recommend having a travel fee every student pays before they get on the bus that covers all meals. Plan the meals appropriately - for example, stay at a hotel with an included buffet breakfast of some kind, pre-order lunch through the venue if possible (at our regionals, they provide an option to get boxed lunches for your team ordered ahead of time - just pick them up, find a cozy spot in the hallway or in the stands, and chow down), and go to a pizza place for dinner, where you can order a number of pizzas for everyone to share. It helps a LOT if you can find a local (someone who used to live in the area, or someone who has friends or relatives in the area) to give you restaurant suggestions. They'll be able to clue you in on great places that don't cost too much, can fit your team AND take reservations!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

This is a great point! One year, cell phone use got so bad we placed a basket next to the door at our build space - every student had to drop off their phone before entering, and any phones we saw out would immediately be confiscated and placed in the basket. Fortunately, we haven't had to do that since - the threat of the basket at the beginning of the season is usually enough.

As for at competition, cell phones are great to have from a safety perspective, especially if the students have phone numbers of adult chaperones. The best way to keep them off the phones during the competition is to keep the busy with other stuff. If you have enough students to fill a drive team, fill your pit, and fill your scouting team with some left over, find something great for those leftovers to do. Form a "help squad" of some sort to go around the pits and help teams (especially rookies!). Have a couple of experts on Chairman's or community outreach go around to the younger teams to talk about those aspects of your program, and help them improve their programs. Talk with the individuals coordinating your regionals, and see if they need extra volunteers to help run the safety glasses station, or to guide VIP's around the regional - these are perfect roles for students to help out with!

There is so much you can do at a regional, no one should be sitting around playing on their phones!

When in doubt, send your technical students to the inspection station to ask which teams need the most help - you'll quickly become your LRI's favorite team!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Thank you Jon! That is all great information! :)

I'll have to look into the venues possibly providing boxed lunches for the teams - I didn't recall this happening last year (Boston & Manchester, respectively). I'll definitely ask around, because that would be a great help for a) corralling our kids to the arena during lunch, b) not making them pay arena prices for food and c) Not having them have to leave and cross the street to get outside food.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

More great ideas - I apologize for all of the questions, but myself and 2 other adults (alum of our school and our FIRST team) just took over the team this year so we're trying to make some positive changes for our team and for our students.

We don't necessarily have a problem with cell phone use in our build room - that tends to be more of a sneaking off into other rooms under the guise of scouting or homework to play minecraft on the computer for 3 hours. :rolleyes:

I love the basket idea though.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Just make sure you don't have any devious mentors who would do such a thing as remove/reapply the tape for students who offer bribes. :cool:

Also, know that some teams might enjoy removing the tape to get your students in trouble.

Regarding students having enough money for food throughout the weekend, one method we find works very well is giving students $1.00 in profit for every pepperoni roll they sell. The team gets the remaining profit per roll. These are very popular - we sell them throughout the school year.

This money they earn from this specific sale is first used to pay off a student's activity fee, required prior to traveling. Any excess proceeds are then distributed by the parent booster leader to the students while on the bus heading to the competitions for use as extra food money. So the kids have an opportunity to earn additional spending money for trips. This is especially beneficial to students who come from poorer or struggling families. And it isn't a freebie handout - double bonus.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Or students from the team who break the rule remove duct tape from everybody's door (I didn't do that in high school :rolleyes: )

Our team is actually very liberal with rules because we're smaller and our students are all pretty good about being where they're supposed to be and telling us their plans. We enforce going to lunch in groups and we do allow them to take the light rail in Dallas if they choose. Us engineering mentors are closer in age to the students than the other adults we'll tag along with the students. After dark they weren't allowed to leave the hotel without adult mentors being with them.

One issue our team had dealt with religion. Some of the boys wanted to go swimming but a few girls couldn't be around them shirtless and also couldn't use the pool so that was something we had to deal with. We still allowed the team to use the pool but the mentors reserved judgement that if the particular students who couldn't use the pool were being left out (perceived or real) we would have said no swimming period. Again, our students are pretty good and genuinely like each other so we didn't have an issue but with larger teams it's something you might want to think about BEFORE angry parents call you.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Use of cell phones on our team has gotten so bad that at most events we have a jar that all phones have to go in. The exception is each buddy group may have a cell phone so we can reach them.

As for hotel rules, from my experiences as a student as we have never travel with the current team. A Curfew which is enforced by room checks and 'lock-out' tape tags to seal checked rooms and see if someone left. We didn't allow members of the opposite sex in a hotel room unless there was an adult present also.

One thing that we learned from our trip to Atlanta in 2008 is have an id or reference card for each student that includes hotel information and adult contact numbers. We had a student get separated from us, due to a misunderstanding between the mentors and his parents, at the finale and he had to walk back by himself without knowing what hotel we were at or know any phone numbers to each us.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

What are pepperoni rolls? And I'm not sure that we could sell food as a fundraiser only because MA has become really stringent with the healthy eating intuitive (all the lunch rules and stuff changed this year too) and we're not allowed to sell candy bars or anything like that in the building due to the rules.

I do love the idea of the kids earning extra spending money for trips though - thats kind of a cool incentive for fundraising.

This is a good point - thank you!

How does this go over amongst your kids? As I said, its not that we WANT to take our kids' phones away but I'm not sure how else to motivate them to get out of the stands if they're not scouting and go talk to other teams, check out the pit, etc.

Also a really good idea -- and actually really important! Thank you!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

A great system that worked for us for meals at competition:

Breakfast: If the hotel offers breakfast, eat there. Otherwise it's a good idea to go to Costco and buy a whole lot of muffins, croissants, fruit, and Sunny D bottles and just have a quick but good breakfast in a hotel room (just keep it clean) before heading to the competition.

Lunch: For lunch, an adult chaperone would collect $3 from everybody and go and get lunch from a fast food place nearby and bring it back so we could eat it outside the competition venue (because they often don't let you eat inside). This makes it quick and easy and maximizes the amount of time that students can be working and preparing at the competition because they don't have to go out and get lunch and come back.

Dinner: We would all go to a local shopping center. From there, everyone is free to go to any place in the shopping center to have dinner. This works very well because it allows everyone to eat whatever they want and with their group of friends and it's easy to keep track of students.


As far as hotel etiquette goes....we aren't really the ones to give advice.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

You wound me. :) Pepperoni rolls are essentially pizza toppings (in this case, pepperoni and cheese, a bit of sauce - depends on the local pizza place that makes them) put on bread dough, rolled into a sub-sized roll, and baked. Sometimes the pizza shop offers different fillings - sausage, hot pepper, etc. Quite tasty.

Did the government ban pizza in Massachusetts?

If so, you could always fill the innards with healthy flavor-infused tofu and bean sprouts!

I bet some places would sell veggie/white pizza style rolls.

Indeed. Everyone seems to really appreciate the program, including the students' parents.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Oh, I see! Those sound kind of amazing. Do you get a local place to donate them? How do you do profit-wise on them?

LOL, no, but I'm not sure our administration would let us do it in building, that's all. Then again, you never know until you ask.

It definitely sounds like it goes over well! We might have to investigate to see if we can do something like this with our kids as we've been talking about possibly giving the students an incentive to fundraise other then seeing our lead mentor in a skirt at competition. (Its happened)

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Yes, a local place makes them for us (it's a very common fundraiser in these here parts) and sells them cheap enough that we can make a profit of about $1.25 or so per roll for the price we charge. This fundraiser is not meant to make mad money for the team - mainly fund student spending money.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

I remember a quote out late team founder Gene Wicks made to our kids before going to champs years ago regarding taping kids in their room and such.
"If we have to do such things to keep you in line, we're not taking you."

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

^This!

Regarding taping doors if you want it to be effective put the tape on after student curfew, don't put it on obviously, and take it off/check before morning curfew. Also when dividing up the rooms, don't put all of your problem children/most likely to cause issues in one room.

With regard to cell phones, I would advise not taking them away from students. If a parent were to find out that on a school trip students weren't allowed to have cell phones on them I don't see that going over well. What if there is an emergency, a parent wants to have contact with their student, or contact among members regarding important team function at the event. It is hard to keep everyone busy and entertained 100% of the time but you need to set a standard that playing games is not acceptable during competition.

Money for trips is hard especially when students don't have a job. During a trip meeting with both students and their parents we said to plan for $10 per meal and a few extra dollars for snacks. We have had some problems with students running low after a long weekend so I and a few other parents and mentors have loaned students money on trips. Part of your problem could be making sure the parents are aware of how much their child needs in advance. For all they know, breakfast, lunch and dinner are covered by the team/event so they only give money for snacks. Parent education is key for trips!

A tip for dealing with meals. We had an issue this year where after collecting the tab for our meal ended in a huge difference between what people gave for their meal+tip and the total. In the future we plan to keep one of the menus along with a notebook and go around writing down what each student ordered and calculate the tip so every person knows exactly what they owe. Splitting up $600 tabs is not easy! :rolleyes:

For down time in the hotel we encourage students to hang out in common areas and not in their rooms (no girls in guys rooms and vice versa).

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

This is an EXCELLENT idea. Thank you! :D

Our kids are generally really good about curfew and staying in their rooms at night because they're exhausted from competition (we're doing something right!) so taping doors isn't an issue.

We do plan on having a parent/student meeting perhaps in December or RIGHT at the beginning of build season to lay down expectations for the build season, travel, etc. Will probably have another one before we go to our first competition. I feel like some of that will help with the students having enough money for meals issue.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Why bother? There's no better way to demonstrate that you don't trust your students' judgment than to make them feel like you're always watching.¹

Even if the rule works as intended, it's still of limited value. Firstly, it doesn't take much imagination to realize that there's all kinds of trouble they could get into with members of the same sex. Secondly, they could just close the door, and do whatever you don't want them doing—after all, once they're committed to breaking the rules, why would they let a little thing like a door get in their way?

¹ If you really need to check on them, do it with panache, and burst in on them inquisition-style.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

The open door policy for members of both sexes in the same room isn't a FIRST team rule, its a school rule.

Also, that video is fantastic. That may have to be uh, tried at curfew check in at some point. :D

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Here is a snapshot from our team handbook and our travel policies. Most are ours, but there are a couple that are stright from the School Handbook.

1. All students are to adhere to the Lakota Schools Student Conduct Handbook.
2. Curfew Hours and quiet hours for hotel will be 11:00 pm unless specifically noted at the nightly team meeting.
3. Keep in mind that we are not the only guests at the hotel. When in common areas, keep the noise to a minimum. Reports of complaints will result in the curfew being pushed up.
4. Promptness and attendance is required to ensure that the team is on time and on schedule.
5. BOARD POLICY ON POSSESSION AND OR USE OF ILLEGAL SUBSTANCES: Any student not following board policy on possession or use of illegal substances will have parents contacted and will be sent home immediately at the parents expense.
6. BOARD POLICY ON POSSESSION AND OR USE OF WEAPONS OR WEAPON-LIKE OBJECTS. Any student not following board policy on possession and or use of weapons or weapon-like objects will have parents contacted and will be sent home immediately at parent’s expense.
7. BOARD POLICY ON DESTRUCTION, THEFT, OR ABUSE OF PROPERTY. Please see attached board policy documents. Any student not following board policy will be held accountable for the cost or repair of any member’s personal property. The students and parents will be held accountable for any legal charges incurred because of destruction, theft or abuse of property. Student’s parents will be contacted and that contact information will be given to any authorities involved in the incident. Theft within a public area (amusement park, hotel, restaurant, etc.) will be turned over to the authorities.
8. LANGUAGE AND ATTITUDE: All students will present themselves as an ambassador of Lakota School District and Lakota Robotics Team Sponsors. Students will refrain from lewd or offensive language and remember to treat all participants, drivers, chaperones, directors, and tour adults with full respect. Students not following this policy will contact parents (with a mentor) and explain their actions. Students continuing inappropriate language or attitude unbecoming of a Lakota Robotics Team Member may be sent home at the parents expense and/or removed from the team.
9. DRESS POLICY: At all times at the competition the team uniform for the current year must be worn. This is not only for Team Spirit, but safety as well. Jackets, coats, hoodies are not to be worn over the team uniform. Should these be necessary, it is preferred that a white long sleeve shirt be worn under the team uniform.
10. Male/Female: At no time shall a member be present or enter the room of the opposite sex.
11. At no time shall a member be present or enter the room of another team.
12. Food and drinks are permitted on the bus, but our team policy of leaving a place better than we left it is in full affect. At no time should any trash be left on the bus. There will be trash bags and paper towels available for clean up. Should an accident occur, notify a mentor or chaperone so that appropriate action can be taken.
13. You will not permitted to go home with parents after riding the bus to an event, unless they give specific written permission, before the trip, to the team.
14. At no times should a team member leave the competition venue or hotel without a mentor or chaperone. When walking around the venue or hotel, please practice the buddy system and never go anywhere alone!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

SPAM had a rule (I don't remember if it was official or unofficial) that if you were late for one of the team meetings or if the bus had to wait for you, you became a member of the laundry crew. The team would collect and wash team t-shirts Friday night (Thursday they wear a different shirt) and the students had to collect, wash, dry, fold, and distribute them. It gave enough incentive to make everyone on time.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Our former team leader it also a triathelete/iron manner. So if you were late for the bus, you had to walk to the venue with him and keep up with his pace. We usually stayed further out for cost reason.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Might be some hints in the papers under "travel". These were compiled some years ago now, but much of the info is still relevant. http://www.firstnemo.org/resources.htm

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Thank you! I will definitely take a look!

Jimmy, thank you for your list as well! :)

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

As a mentor for a rookie team last year, the mentors (including alumni from 4 FRC teams) implemented travel rules that expanded on the sponsoring organization's rules (4H). As we have no direct school association, we do not have to include school travel rules. The rules ended up being a bit too extensive but could have been enforced a bit better.

Students were assigned rooms and rides during the trip and had to follow these rules:

1. All students must remain in locations and areas designated for the trip.
2. Students must attend all scheduled events (unless specified by the mentors or chaperones).
3. All students must travel by designated transportation (unless otherwise specified). Appropriate behavior on all modes of transportation is essential.
4. Students must obey all curfews and remain in their rooms after curfew.
5. Students must report to their designated chaperone when requested.
6. Luggage, rooms and personal possessions will be subject to search by chaperones.
7. If any student is in a room that is not his/hers, there has to be an adult (25+) supervisor.
8. Students can only be in areas authorized by their chaperone at any time.

Basically, we gave the chaperones (parents, not including the head mentor) the flexibility to determine how strict or loose to manage the students, as this was the first year the team traveled. Each chaperone was assigned 4-5 students to keep track of at competition. Fortunately, many of the students were totally exhausted by the end of each day of competition, so we had few behavior/curfew issues.


Additionally, I found it necessary produce a list of rules for the head mentor to follow while at competition. Some of the gems that earned exasperated sighs and eye rolls as he read the list include:

1. Have your cell phone turned ON, charged, and on YOU at all times.
2. Answer your phone when someone calls you.
3. Eat food during each meal and get at least 3 hours of sleep a night.
4. Try to be somewhat responsible and a role model.
5. Do NOT use duct tape at any time in any manner.
6. Do NOT obtain, fabricate, carry, or use any zombie defense weapons of any sort including projectile launchers/shooters, blunt objects, sharp objects, etc.
7. Do NOT get upset with your offspring.

He later tried to collaborate with other mentors to find loopholes to a number of the rules, particularly the one regarding zombie defense weapons.

-Kat

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

When we were a rookie team, I know none of our mentors got more than 3 hours of sleep at competition, and I know I got less! There's just too much to figure out if you've never done it before, and too many plans to make just to get you through the next day. Fortunately, once you've done it once or twice, you can "wing it" and get plenty of sleep!

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

LOL, those are fantastic, especially 2 of the last 3.

I was a first year mentor last year and by the end of Boston I was so tired I was crying when I got home. We actually don't get too many behavior issues either because the kids are so exhausted after the days of competition. But yes, sleep is a must for mentors too! As well as eating.

Re: Student Expectations for Travel
 

Rereading what I wrote I feel that I made it sound like we were super strict with it. We do allow the kids to have their phones on less "important" days during competition. Generally they have their phones on Thursday but Friday we generally have them and Saturday when they get them back depends on how we did.

The kids grumble because they don't want to be disconnected from "life" but overall it has worked pretty well. Our team inteacts with other teams so much more now and they make friends out of it.

After reading the comment that parents wouldn't want students going on a trip and not having their phone I felt I should add this disclaimer. Since enforcing that rule we have never traveled and only done local events. If we did travel we would have to reconsider that rule and make sure the parents have mentors phone numbers to reach us if their kid does not answer.