Bumper Numbers?
 

For whatever reason I can't find last years game manual, so I come to seek out an answer.

As far as bumper numbers go, if we satisfy the size requirements, can we make the design/color whatever we want?

We wanted to make our numbers in our team font and color this year.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Changes sometimes. Checklist says in white, or outlined in white. So don't get too crazy or you'll be repainting at competition.

Checklist

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

I found a PDF of the manual here.

According to R35
Any color you want, as long as you have a white outline and meet the size and placement requirements.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Neat.

It doesn't really specify how thick of an outline, though.. Which is troubling because we could technically make either a 1mm outline or a 1 cm outline with a huge difference.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

EDIT: Saberbot beat me to it.

I've attached the manual. Last year, we used GIMP to create numerals that satisfied the number dimensions.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Make em whatever color you want as long as it's red and blue. The numbers will probably still be 4" .25" stroke. The odd colors make good demo bumpers though

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Yes, they make VERY good demos.

See:
http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/38135

So...Beautiful...

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Don't forget that the bumper rules are supposed to undergo significant revision for 2013. Anything stated here is obviously according to previous years' rules.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Before you get too far into this, keep in mind that the rule may not be the same this year. (The GDC has made changes on the color/outline part in each of the last three years, although I'd bet the size and stroke width is going to be the same).

As a scout, I've always been fond of very white or bright yellow on the blue or red background. Dark numbers outlined thinly in white, while less challenging than unoutlined numbers, are usually still quite difficult to read from the back half of the stands. This is particularly painful when the team numbers are all pretty similar and the fonts and colors chosen make it hard to tell (as a random example) 2345 from 2346, when they're both in the same alliance and one robot is partially obstructed by the other in starting position.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

I'll echo the sentiments about not reading too much onto this year's requirements from last years rules.

Bumper numbers were enough of an issue to inspections last year, that I'd be surprised if they weren't more specifically defined this year.

With more and more people watching online with fuzzy at best video feeds and with events taking place in bigger venues where people are sitting further away, the readability of the numbers is more important than ever. It's hard enough for the public to follow our game as it is. The ability to identify their favorite team on the field is necessary.

There are plenty of places on the robot to get creative and artsy. The team numbers on the bumpers is not one of them.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Can you back this statement with a credible source?

- Sunny G.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Everyone,
The rules for bumper color and team numbers are intended to satisfy a few simple requirements. Those are to identify the alliance (color), and to identify the robot team to both spectators and refs (team numbers). The color requirements are pretty specific to insure you and your alliance partners can identify each other and so that spectators can tell alliances from afar. The team numbers and their visibility should be a prime concern for all teams to insure that penalties and points get assigned to the right team and that judges observing from the field or stands can correctly identify the team they are judging. Your failure to make your team numbers readable from afar compromises your ability to advance and receive recognition. The rules involving split numbers last year had as much to do with game as with bumper design. It is not hard to find white fabric paint pens or vinyl numbers that can be used for both alliance colors. You know you will have to do it later so buy your supplies now when you have no pressure.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

We have our numbers embroidered on the bumpers. With the computerized embroidery machines, you just have to make sure the width & height is correct. Clearly readable for afar.

The Game manual is on the First web und game and season info\archived game....

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

What if our numbers are fully white, but in a more stylized font (our official team font).

Our official team font is http://www.dafont.com/alien-encounters.font

I think it'd be very readable from afar if put in white, but that'll be up for determination during build season.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

I would have them in the solid versions of the font. Be sure they meet the stroke requirements as well.

Our team's main font, DINPro, has several weights and we used the thickest possible and it just barely fit the criteria.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Last year we asked our sponsor that does vinyl cut letters to switch to a different font to make ensure that our 4 digit number fit on the minimum bumper segment without looking "squished."
Uniform font use is something we strive for across our documentation but when it would have impaired the ability of spectators to read our bumpers we made an exception.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Last year, because we needed our number on a minimal bumper length, I went to www.fontstruct.com and built a simple font that when scaled to the right point size will be exactly 4" high and .75 stroke width, but with narrow enough digits to fit nicely on a 2012 minimal bumper length (assuming the short bumper extends to the outside edge of the bumper corner)

See http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/papers/2630?

We printed this and handed it to a screen printer business that did all the bumpers (8 x 4digits) for about $50 I think. Best bumper numbers we've ever produced.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

I have officially hated bumpers since our first season (we are a fifth year team). :) And it really isn't the bumpers per se but the mounting of the bumpers that I hate.

Anyway, bumper materials, colors and the numbers are something that should be inconsequential and rote purchases for the robot. We have always used Duck Canvas (Royal Blue and Red) purchased from pretty much any local fabric store. Duck Canvas is tough yet workable. Both colors closely match FIRST's colors and are nice vivid colors. We take them to the school's screen printer (any screen printer can do it) and have them put bright white letters that conform to the rules centered on each piece of the bumper. This has worked well for us for four years.

Our best bumpers were last year when we use the reversible bumpers. They are so wonderful and so quick to change that it just reduces the stress of quick changes for everyone.

Mounting the bumpers in a secure manner is always our challenge.

My recommendation is to not make the bumper colors, material and numbers something you are going to be stressing out about at the competitions. Keep them simple. Promote your team image on the robot itself, not the bumpers.

how did you do the reversible? with Velcro?

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Think of the bumper material as a capital T so (T). Now, image that the top of the T is attached to your robot. The bottom of the T can either velcro up or down, and that's how you swap colors.

In my experience, teams thats opt to use one set of bumbers but then change the materials often end up with a set of bumpers that aesthetically sub-par.

- Sunny G.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

For some odd reason, team 11 did not have that problem last year.
Oooh! A problem in need of a solution! Maybe some robot kids can figure out something better???

Bottom line is: don't get fancy with the numbers. Stick to plain and simple for best results.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Neither did Juggernauts.

When deciding fonts, use the easiest to read. Wouldn't you hate it if I gave someone credit for you work. It could make your team look bad.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Correct our team has used reversible bumpers for two seasons. You can check out a picture of them here. http://www.chiefdelphi.com/media/photos/38203

Like sunny said that seam going down the middle is where the bumper flips and the two pieces are one. We have velcro on the top and bottom to keep our bumpers up. Don't try to save money by buying cheap velcro go the extra mile and use the industrial strength so it can hold up to competition!

It takes some extra work to make them look good. Our team has had a seamstress sew the fabric and velcro the past two seasons and they have turned out great! As long as you keep the fabric night and tight the numbers look clean.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

May sound dumb, but what do you actually call that white cable-carrying "tubing"?

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

The link to Team 2809's tutorial on reversible bumpers.
http://kbots.files.wordpress.com/201...ble-bumper.pdf

We could literally change colors in 10 seconds. The reduction in stress among the students and mentors in changing colors between matches was dramatic compared to previous years. Also, you don't have the second set of bumpers taking up space. We have left the bumpers on the robot all year and never worry about them getting lost or pins lost.

Re: Bumper Numbers?
 

Braided Expandable Sleeving, Expandable Sleeving, Braided Sleeve, or Expandable Sleeve are common terms that googling will lead to what you want. You'll more commonly find it in black.

Here is one choice. http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/NNSRIT...eywordless+Ads