Creating the perfect robot
 

Hey CD,
So a project that I've been working on for the past few weeks is coming up with the "Perfect Robot" now that we are in the offseason. My idea of the perfect robot is: A 7-disc Autonomous, a 50-Point Climb, and having the ability to FCS. So now that we have finished the 2013 season, what combination of certain robot's parts/robots with certain additions could create this "Perfect robot"?

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Being under 30" tall and being able to use their pick-up during the match as well as autonomous are two great attributes. An extendable blocker would also be cool but this is already getting pretty crazy :yikes:.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

469 with their fabled 30-point climber. Done.

EDIT: Or, if you want to improve even further (not by much), you could have a wildly modified 1538.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

What about just 67 with a floor pickup? They have a 30 pt climb, FCS ability, and extra 20 pt pyramid goal dump ability. Add a floor pickup with 7 disc auton, and they would probably win everything.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I'm surprised that I've never seen anybody mention this, but how about a robot that does full court shots from a high starting point, but can also lower to go under the pyramid?

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

The perfect robot would also be able to adjust the height of their shooter, much like 1718 did. When the robot is shooting full couurt, the shooter would be as close as possible to 60", thus making defense difficult. When the shooter is down, the entire robot height, including the shooter, should be <30" for driving under the pyramid.

Adjustable height was a pretty rare feature this year, but the perfect robot would definitely have it.

EDIT: lost the race

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

233.
But with a 50-pt climb somehow. I'm not exactly sure.
But if you took 233, removed their consistency issues, you'd have a 7-disc auto robot with a tall full-court shot. I'm not sure how to put a climb on it, though.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

If I was building the "perfect" robot I still would want it to be boiled down to simplicity for reliability. In my opinion a FCS is too easily blocked. Cyclers are harder to block and much more accurate(efficiency/reliability is king). Climb and dump is required because of the reliability of the 50 pts. Front vs back intake is a question of points vs versatility. The front intake allows you to dominate by yourself while the back intake gives you a faster back auton(more likely to pull it off) and a bit of a better position for picking up stray frisbees on the way back to the feeder station. Either way this boils down to 610's shooter, 1114's climber, and 1986's intake(forward or back facing with a respectively faced hopper).

In a more realistic case, my favorite robot this year was 1114's. With the large amount of multi-disk autos this year, 1114 proved to be an ultimate 1st pick. They were extremely reliable at scoring enormous amounts of points and are by far my favorite robot of the year.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

The robot I wanted to see this year would've been similar to team 1501 from 2007 (which was basically a platform on wheels).

The robot would be optimized for climbing the pyramid, but what would make this robot special is that it could carry two robots with it, and do it very quickly (under 10 seconds). That way, it could pair with a couple robots similar to Robot In 3 Days, and give the entire alliance a 90 point bonus instead of 50.

As an afterthought, the robot could also have an auton (say it dumps 3 discs into the 1pt goal) or be a dumper, and if it wasn't too difficult could be designed to make more than 1 trip.

This type of robot would fit into most alliances better than a "perfect" robot, since it improves their scoring capabilities rather than completes every aspect of the game all alone.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

That would be one of if not the most impressive feats FRC has ever seen or will see.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I like the idea of a more consistent 233. The elevator design that they had on their bot was really brilliant if they had been able to utilize its full capabilities. I'm wondering if you really need the 50 pt. climb though if you had the elevator system.

Theoretically with the elevator you should be able to get close enough to the pyramid goal that you could probably score pretty consistently in the top of the pyramid anyways. With a good FCS you could drain the feeder station quickly enough that you could still get 1 (maybe 2) trips of alliance discs in.

With the elevator, you could also make it robust enough to be some sort of pyramid climber. Especially if you could somehow pull off a design similar to 340's where the robot adjusts its CoG to swing to the next bar.

(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-vikQ5-DoE if you do not know that design)

It's also possible to just perform a 50 pt climb if with the elevator you could extend your shooter upward directly adjacent to the pyramid goal and put 4 alliance discs in.

This design is probably fanciful for a 6 week build but it would be a killer offseason bot if a team had started son enough that they could finish it. I could see it being possible since most of the concepts are already designed and tested, it is just the integration and implementation that would take time.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

If you had a 1538-style robot (chassis, arm, etc.) with 67's shooter on top, rather than 1538's shooter (which is on the bottom), you should be able to use a 118/2056 style design to move a hopper of discs from the pickup to the shooter pneumatically. You'd essentially have one of the best floor pickups and FCS capability in FRC, with minimal integration effort.

But, we haven't touched the drivetrain. :D There's no reason you couldn't put a 67/1114 climber on there. And with the 1538 arm that pivots, you'd be just as accurate as the 67 dump.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

If 118 could make the robot in their reveal video lighter and possibly add a dumper it would be able to do everything pretty well.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I wonder if it would have been possible to make an accurate full court shooter that shot frisbees upside down so you could fire them at a higher, unblockable angle.

From videos I've seen upside down frisbees don't get the lift that right side up frisbees get.

Or even throw them "hammer" style at a higher angle.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

The idea is the ideal robot, so in theory, the ideal robot would have the ability to shoot full court from an elevated position.
This isn't a discussion on whether or not a robotics team should ever try any of these things (as I don't see any team pulling it off), it's a discussion of what that robot would be.

So a more reliable 233 with a 50-point climb would satisfy that requirement, I think. But I don't know how that would work. Possibly a 1334-style climber on the back of 233's elevator? I don't know. Their design doesn't really work for a 67/1114 style climber.
They could have a 4451-style climb/dump. Or a 2170-style climb/dump. But regardless, it would be extremely difficult to integrate with the 233 design.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I really wanted someone to do that and succeed, but alas, no team I know of did it.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I think it's interesting that everyone seems to be assuming the ideal robot must have every single capability in this game.

Curious to hear what people's definitions of ideal are.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

We prototyped a hammer throwing FCS, but couldn't get the right combination of forward speed and spin with our prototype. It's probably possible, but would have taken more resources then we had during the build season.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Then what would your definition of the "Perfect Robot" be?
My definition would be a robot that excels at every aspect of the game.
Do I think that a robot without all these functionalities can excel at UA?
Obviously.


In order for this theoretical robot to excel at every aspect of Ultimate Ascent, it should have:

7-Disc Auto

Ability to cycle very effectively- meaning fast drivetrain/strong drivetrain and ability to drive under the pyramid and avoid defense, fast shooting

Ability to play a floor game very effectively- Roller-floor pickup, front/back of the pyramid shooting positions, ability to pick up discs and shoot discs in both orientations

Ability to full-court shoot very accurately and limit the level of defense to be played on them- High release point, accuracy, fast lineup (either by code or a hard stop)

Have a consistent and fast 50-point climb (including line-up time)- meaning all 4 colored discs need to consistently go into the pyramid goal

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Honestly I don't see why a perfect robot needs to have an FCS. At the top levels of play the field is going to be deep enough to run a 3 cycler alliance(which as we well know, can pretty reliably clear out the feeder station). In a shallow field you can beat strong alliances regardless of FCS. If you still decide to run an FCS, there should be no reason why it has to be tall. If you are only FCSing you will promote defense. A much better style is a run and gun style similar to that of 469.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

What if you get picked by a good floor-pickup like 33 whose cycling isn't all that great?
What if you're completely outgunned in a cycling battle in a qualification match?
Full-court shooting is a game-changer. It forces your opponents to alter their game strategy to deal with your full-court shot, and if they can't block you, they likely lose, especially if you can then pick up your own misses and shoot those. Even 2-point full-court shooting is deadly provided those discs aren't going to be scored otherwise.

Ex1: If you DON'T block 67, you lose. They can score over 200 points on their own.

Ex2: 2169 in Galileo is arguably the best dedicated full-court shooter in the world. Their FCS game is so #solid that they were the only teleop threat (that was leveraged) on their divisional finalist alliance. Their FCS shot was also difficult to block because of it's high release point.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I think the current set of ideas gravitate towards the best robot -- and not the best alliance. This is a complete hypothetical that won't ever be considered, because it can't be, because one must pause and consider the other 66% of your alliance.

I think the question of the perfect alliance is a completely different question, and deserves a completely different answer.

And while a robot can't do everything, I think there were lots of robots (469, 987, 118 etc.) that were diversified enough that they opened up lots of strategic options for their alliances. And they could almost do everything -- and do it well. But the fact remains: no one robot was capable of performing every single role in Ultimate Ascent well (of which FCS was one); that robot is what I'm trying to theorize about, and mentally construct.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

We are talking about an all-around, god-tier robot. That robot would be the one picking, if anything.

Anyway, I would like to inform all of you that I am now CADing the ultimate ultimate ascent robot. Might post pics if I can finish it.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I'd like to point out that the three best robots in Archimedes got picked, they didn't captain their own alliances (i.e. 254, 469, 987).

If this robot couldn't stand up to a match against three good cyclers with limited to zero help (i.e. being able to FCS, as that's they only way they would stand a chance), then they wouldn't sit at the top of the rankings, as they would lose that match.

And I totally want to see this CAD. It'd be epic.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

A fcs with no help vs 3 cyclers would get pounded, too. Also, the base is almost done. Making a request for 67, 987, 254, 1114, 2056, 610, 1310, and 3476 to post their CAD. ;)

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I think an undefended 67 would crush most 3-cycler alliances.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I've done a lot of thinking about this on my own, especially after IRI. I define the "Perfect Robot" as the bot that would most likely go undefeated through official match play, all the way to Einstein. In my mind, this would require the ability to reliably come somewhat close to producing the absolute maximum theoretical score for one robot. There will always be matches where the odds are against you, which means you'd need to have the greatest odds of winning any match, requiring a lot of versatility.

So let's start with the autonomous. The most we've seen from one bot is 7 discs (8 from 254 picking up misses), but I believe it might be faintly possible for a team with a good enough floor collector and strong programming to score 8-9 discs in auto.

Then there's Tele-Op, where I believe it should have the capability to full court shoot when undefended, and empty the alliance station. It would then go across the field and clean up any of its own misses. Essentially, it would have the capability of scoring every one of the alliance's discs, and possibly then some off of the ground.

Finally, it would load up the colored discs (either from the alliance station or the ground) and climb to 30, scoring the discs in the pyramid goal. Depending on the speed of the full court shooter, and the ground load time of the bot, the time it takes to climb may not be a crucial detail.

Now the fun part: What IS this perfect bot? Maybe a climb like 25's or 842's could be implemented on a 469 type bot. From the way I've seen their collector work, it looks like the >7 disc auto could maybe be possible. However, the bot that I believe is closest to this ideal "Perfect Bot" is 67. Now if a bot like that could implement a ground collector, possibly even for autonomous only, their max score would be 7 discs in auto, 47 in the high goal during tele (45+2 alliance colored discs), 4 in the pyramid, and the 30 point climb. That adds up to 233 points. If a 9 disc auto were possible, then that figure would increase to 245.

Of course, is any of this useful as hindsight? Will it help us in the future? Absolutely not! But it certainly helps hold us over until next build season :D

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Possibly with a 2474 style collector. It collects both forward and backward.
Maybe the shooter can be elevated to 60" to shoot full court, and lowered below 30" to shoot auto. I kinda like that idea. A shorter 67 with a 2474 collector. And MAYBE the ability to change their shooter height.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Just a thought, but I know our robot (a more-or-less FCS) and a few others that I saw had to let their shooter wheels speed back up after each shot. What if it had a system of 2 shooters, so it could go through all the alliance's white Frisbees much more quickly? Then you have more time to do each of the other things on the list.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

This is exactly what I was thinking!

It sounds crazy but what if you had an elevating top shooter similar to 1477, and a semi-stationary bottom shooter (it would only adjust its shooting angle)?
That way's it would be possible to fire all of your alliance discs very quickly, then if you had a 30 point climb or a floor intake, you would have enough time to make good use of those design aspects.

You could elevate your top shooter to score the alliance discs into the pyramid goal for the full 30 points if you had enough time for 2 trips.

Now, lets say that you're a wizard of compacting your designs.
When your top shooter is in its stored position, you can fit under the pyramid, and your bottom shooter can receive discs from your intake system (again similar to 1477).

So now all we are missing is the 30 point climb.
Suppose you made the elevator system strong enough and tall enough to act as a lifting arm for a 30 point climber similar to the 1986 or 254 style of climbing.
You now have every aspect of of the game covered with one robot AND enough time created by the double shooter to do those aspects.

Obviously this is a ridiculous idea, but it is certainly fun to think about!

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Just stick the top half of 148 or 1806 onto the bottom half of 1310!! :D
That should work great right?

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

But if you have 67's shooter, 195's shooter, or 2169's shooter, you have awesome accuracy AND zero-spin-up time.
I don't know if 67 and 2169 used code to keep the speed of their shooter or some other method. I DO know that 195 used an exorbitantly large wheel so that after every shot, the weight of the wheel would keep it spinning quickly.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

9 disc auton + the worlds best drivers + incredible amounts of traction + retractable blocker


:cool:

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

195 actually explored the idea of an elevating shooter during brainstorming at the beginning of the season and again before IRI. There were possible designs made, but we decided that we wanted to keep our robot the way it was, simple.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Our shooter was a 180 degree circular shooter with an 8" pneumatic wheel direct mounted to a CIM. It takes at least .5-1 seconds to speed back up after pushing a Frisbee through it. I think one way to avoid that might be to decrease the contact time of the Frisbee with the wheel.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I don't think that how much energy you need to push the frisbee through really matters. You can almost always just add more power to get a faster recovery time. We had a similar setup to yours: an 8" Colson on a ~120 degree path. We started out with a CIM but then went to dual fisher prices to get it back up to speed faster.

I think it would be possible to get the throughput of this sort of shooter up above what a single human player can load without too much extra trouble. I think the ultimate FCS would need to take disks from multiple human-loading slots more than it would need a second shooter.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

2169 had a hall effect sensor to keep track of their RPM and how quickly they could feed, in addition to having plenty of power and I believe a heavy wheel (the only thing that is definitely correct about that is the hall effect sensor).

The other thing about 2169's shooter is that it's angled so they could sit directly against the feeder station and still shoot "straight." If I remember correctly this affected where they could sit in autonomous and they had to be angled (which may or may not be an issue if you're repurposing it for pickup).

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

??
FP motors were not legal in 2013. Perhaps you meant Banebots 550s or AndyMark 9015s?

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

To my opinion, the perfect robot would be the one that has a low center of gravity and still having all the features. Our robot, for example (team 1165) has a very low center of gravity. Yet, we were able to shoot into the highest goal and we were able to do a 30 point climb. The height of the robot doesn't matter. It should be anything that isn't too outrageous (e.g. 6 inches or 6 ft). Also, for the 'impossible': full autonomous throughout the game, automatically picking all the frisbees on the way and shooting them. The robot should align to the pyramid goal during autonomous and always shoot at it. Also, it should pick up and do a couple rounds automatically. After that, the robot should got the feeding station and wait for autonomous to end. The robot should be able to climb like team 254 (cheesypoofs). Whole court shooting would also be quite nice, and s good human player who always hits the pyramid goal would be a plus! Quite Impractical!?

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I'm pretty sure a 9 disc auto is physically possible, if you have a robot with enough ground clearance to straddle the discs under and in front of the pyramid, and your pickup drops off the back of your bot (1241-style)

Looks like this:

Fire your starting 3, possibly while dropping your pick up (which faces center field), and backing up toward the centerline discs.

Grab the centerline discs, and fire them as you drive all the way to the alliance wall with your pickup up.

Grab the forward and under-pyramid discs as you return to your starting position and fire them.

It'll be tight, but I'm pretty sure its possible with a robot that's designed for it.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

An auto like this is possible if you have a fast firing speed like 610, 1114, etc. 2056 is the closest team to hit this level. IIRC they have had several matches where they shoot 6-7 in auto before returning to the centerline and suck up 1-2 discs. A robot like you mention with a reverse pickup would do the trick.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

2056's 7 is not particularly tight on time at all. They had 7, + time to back up onto the centerline ready to collect those, all the way back in week 2 at ONTO.

1241's firing rate is ridiculously fast. I'm confident 1241 could have pulled off 9 if their chassis wasn't too low to clear a disc on the floor.

Your firing rate doesnt have to be THAT crazy fast to achieve a 9 disc auto. The problem is that most floor pickup designs required at least two 180 degree turns in order to pick up all 6 and shoot them.

1241 is one of the only ones I can think of that have their floor pickup oriented in the opposite direction to their shooter (which allows for a turn-less 9disc auto), but their chassis prevented them from driving over discs on the floor.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

If anyone could do a 9 disk, it would be 469 or 2590. Both have ground clearance, retractable floor pickups, and pickups on the back. For both of their 7 disks they drive over the disks and then collect them backwards. 987 may be able to do it too, but their intake is much smaller.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I was thinking of 2590 as well. The only problem with that machine is that it takes some time to get their shots off after getting back. I don't know if that bot is capable of accurately firing the centerline discs en route to the wall. While 987's camera targeting takes a second or two, I think they've got the programming power to possibly hit 8-9. I saw them attempt a centerline/middle of pyramid 7 disc on Archimedes. Maybe they could hit the front 2 as well...

But 469 is certainly in the conversation. Their collector seems to pick up pretty well from the front or back.

So what about an 8 disc auto? I haven't heard much about that. Say you start at the wall side of the pyramid with 2 discs, drive forward, collect the two in front, fire those 4, drive back collecting the discs under the pyramid and on the centerline, return and fire. Less changes in direction might make it somewhat more possible.

Although by not starting with 3, you leave one extra on the centerline. Maybe fire one on the way back then get the 3 on the centerline? Could be another way to do a 9 disc.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

11 disk auto.
Have both partners not preload any discs, then just drive down the center line picking up discs while shooting. The robot could be like 987, except with their shooter positioned so that it shoots perpendicular to pick up.

It sounds pretty pointless right? But remember that in quals you can get allied with robots who don't shoot very well (or at all).

EDIT: The robot would also need an uber-powerful drive train so that opponents who try to get in the way just get plowed through.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Has anyone seen 2474's pickup? It collects both forward and backward. The only issue is that it's a spatula/roller-style pickup, so a nine-disc would be extremely tight for time if you consider that it has to lift the discs up to it's shooter.
But I think with some programming magic and a rapid fire rate, it could be done.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Good catch - I think it was 550s. In my head I tend to sort motors into CIM/window/globe/other.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Everyone's talking about the highest scoring robot being the "perfect" robot, except the only score that matters for winning is the alliance score. So by that the perfect robot is one that increases their alliance score the most, both for normal qualification and high scoring elimination matches. Then we get back to the robot that can carry 2 other robots to the top of the pyramid. It would have a flat top with a pull up ramp. It would have a fold out 2 stage corner climber (like 1334) with a shooter that folds up and down (like 3940). It could shoot 3 disks in autonomous, make 3 cycles and finally triple climb and dump.

At a regional it could score 164 points with 2 plowies(box bots). It shoots 3 off in auto (18), 3 cycles in teleop (36) and finally triple climb and dumps (30 x 3 + 20 = 110).

At iri we get paired with a robot that has a center line auto and one that has a seven disk auto. Now we have a 90 point auto mode. In teleop all 3 cycle and because two robots have ground intake they pick up the misses for 135 points. At last the carrier robot climbs with the colored disks and 2 other robots for 110 points. In total the alliance makes 335 points.

Now your saying 335 points is great but it is close to impossible. Lets say the alliance misses 3 disks in auto and makes 40 instead of 45 disks in teleop. That's more reasonable. The alliance still scores 168 and the world high score without penalties was 167.

Also you have one of the most memorable robots in the history of first and can claim the title of the Ultimate Ascent.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I have significant doubts any robot built to the specifications of Ultimate Ascent could achieve this task.

And especially not one built(mostly) in a 6-week build season.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

We designed our offseason bot pretty much exactly along those lines. Stay tuned to hear it will end up working out.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Actually, all it needs are bars at the same height as the first rung of the pyramid so robots can latch on as they normally would. A fold out ramp would be very heavy, and probably less safe.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I wanna see someone pull this off. You would have to have a gearbox using 90% of the motors in the KOP for your lifter. Then you could maybe shift that gearbox to control the drivetrain, and then shift it to control the shooter.

That'd be awesome. Every mechanism on the robot runs off the same gearbox.
Lol.
But seriously I'd love to see a robot pull that off.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Ok, I understand the design, but how in the world does it fit in the 54" cylinder? I know it's in any orientation, but its still the 54" diameter x 84" length cylinder, and I just don't know how you could build a platform that would hold 2 other bots. The idea would also make me nervous, as if you fall, you're taking down 2 other bots that may have never even thought to design for taking a fall like that. An alliance would be destroyed. Not to mention packaging all the other mechanisms would likely be a nightmare.

Nonetheless, it would be awesome if someone were to pull it off. Totally would be THE bot of the year. It'd be sick.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

shifting swerve drive
under 30 in tall
extremely fast drive train that can push too
7-9 disc auto
469's collector
turret shooter with adjustable angle, has lift to raise to any height under max
shooter must be lowered to get discs off ground can raise, can get fed from feeder slot when raised
shooter faster than 67's and more accurate
ability to score from anywhere on the field at any time
collects any discs missed by opponents and scores them
arm attached to shooter lift, can climb corner or sides, inside or outside of pyramid
can climb and dump in under 6 seconds and then climb down to get rest of colored discs
can play defense with any time it has left

9*6=54
(45+15)*3=180
6*5=30
30

54+180+30+30=294
new world record by one robot

ps. it can also swim under water

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Or, just put your shooter's RPM at peak efficiency for whatever motor you are using. My team was shooting twice as fast at IRI because we switched from a CIM on our shooter to a pair of BB550s in a Cimulator box. It just so happens that the banebots+gearbox were near peak efficiency at the RPM we ran the CIM at, so we went from shooting about 1 disc/sec to 2.5 disc/sec.

Whoa, there, let's keep it within the realm of possibility! Update on the CAD: drive base is done, drive gearboxes stolen from 1477's CAD are in place. I will make custom ones once I finish the rest of the CAD.

They had by far the best spatula collector. It was the only one I saw that could collect from both directions, and one of the few that could be effectively used in teleop. What really bothered me, though, was that they didn't have a climb.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

The platform idea is near impossible, but if you instead had two bars that stuck outside your bumper perimeter 30in off the ground for the other two robots to hang on (would require your partners to adjust their hangers) its feasible and I'm sure you could throw a very simple shooter that you could use in auto as well as make a few cycles before climbing for 30 with your partners.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Can I ask- do you think YOUR climber could lift three 120+ lb robots? It would have to be some massively powerful climber to achieve that.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Not as is. Only one CIM and the system was designed for lifting one 160lb robot not three. A 254 style that utilizes 6 cims could work.

Our style of climb also wouldn't work unless we figured out a way to shrink our partner's robots on the way up! :p

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

So a 6 CIM PTO 2170-style climb with two bars made for hanging somehow. That better be a stable climb. And then you're gonna put a shooter on it too?
Jeez.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Kevin, I think it would be a corner climber if it was possible at all. Think about it, as BrendanB said, 2 bars that the other bots use their 10pt climbs on, then it climbs smoothly to the top with 6 CIMs.
It could probably be done, although I'm still fairly skeptical. Also, maybe it's a good thing there weren't any teams that lifted other bots this year, or else GEICO would probably start offering robot insurance. :p

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Do keep in mind that for the other robots' climbs to count, those robots have to contact the pyramid at each level in sequential order.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

So basically this design would have to be engineered to an extremely precise degree with a ton of power and a ton of foresight. I also don't see the team that accomplishes this putting a shooter on the robot- but if they did, I don't see them making any cycles, just three shots in auto.

It would still be an amazing bot to have on an alliance even without that, it would just have to rely on it's partners for it's disc score. And it's climb would have to be quite fast, otherwise you'd be losing out on a lot of disc points (i.e. if the climb takes 40 seconds, then all three bots are out of commission for 40 seconds- if you were against HOT, they could score all the discs in the feeder station during that time).

What if instead of carrying all three other bots up, it lowered down a bar to the 10 pt level from the 20 or 30 point level that it could retract to carry bots up the tower? That could work. It still faces the power issues, but it allows for more time to be spent on disc scoring.

In reality I think any of these designs are implausible, and we should just settle for a combo of 469 and 67 being the best robot this year is capable of.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Just gently bump them along each rung during the lift. ::safety::

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

A large zip tie will soon become your best friend.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

I'm not sure why we haven't said this yet, but why not just use 118's original release robot? That could climb for 30, I believe it could score once at the top, FCS, cycle like crazy, had a quick ground pickup. Aside from being a tall FCS that was about as complete of a robot as you could get.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

118's climb was to slow, unreliable, and hard to line up from what I heard. I am pretty sure they decided to focus on trips because of how easy it was for them to speed from end to end. They can make way more points with trips than with the FCS and climb. I also do not recall them being able to dump for 20 on top. Recently they have also been jamming and playing defense which was extremely odd. Any how, I do not see them the as the "perfect robot" but more as one of the most important parts to an alliance because of the ground feed and multiple trips.

Re: Creating the perfect robot
 

Their shooter with the climber wasn't great. They took off the climber in order to put on a better shooter. They were shooting 2 or 3 out of 4 with the old shooter, and, well, you know how they were with the new shooter.