Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Having to "send" the game pieces to other robots due to a location limit. Then the last robot will score.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Maybe it will be one large central game piece the two alliances will have to pass to each other before scoring, as in no "un-assisted" goals?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Oh look we have 2 box bots on our alliance, we get to score 0 points

;)

I doubt the GDC will ever allow for a game in which scoring cannot be accomplished by 1 robot...

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

There have been many instances of robots helping each other in the past, within alliances as well. Remember Rack 'n' Roll? Teams had to lift their alliance partner up in endgame.
2012 we had to share a bridge (A very exciting and competition-changing thing, remember, FIRST likes the excitement)
There have been other instances of Coopertition in the past. I am sure that is what the assisting refers to, either Coopertition between alliances or within an alliance.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

This is what I was thinking would be an issue. Maybe they would bring back trailers? That way you could somewhat avoid that scenario.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Since the GDC is a year ahead of the game, This game would be the first developed with information from the surveys after rebound rumble. Coopertition being back is definitely a strong and almost likely possibility.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I think you're absolutely right. We can continue to speculate for fun but I think the game hint points to coopertition coming back. And that's it.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That's a great point. That would make sense too because this year in Ultimate Ascent we didn't see Coopertition.
2012 was the debut, the test of Coopertition again.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

So coopertition comes back what ways could they make it happen?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

If it is a hockey game i think that they will have it more closely resemble field hockey. Regolith was a nightmare that i don't think anybody wants again. Also field hockey uses small ball fitting with the ball-not ball pattern

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That would depend completely on what the rest of the game is like.
We won't do bridges, that's for sure.
Maybe an FTC-like thing? In FTC this year we have a pendulum that we score in and if it is balanced we get extra points, a 50% bonus to be precise.
Uhmm...
Both sides lifting an assumed heavy object?
A tug-of-war scenario? Where the center needs to be parallel to the ground?
(I am literally just coming up with random ideas here, I'm not considering the plausibility of them)
A high place they need to work together to get to?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I must have missed something somewhere. Which hint suggested Coopertition coming back, and what exactly is Coopertition?
Ultimate Ascent was my rookie year, so I'm a bit behind on some stuff.

Edit: I know what Coopertition is, but what is it in relation to the game? A bonus of some kind?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Everyone keeps throwing out hockey with the idea that it HAS to be ice hockey or air hockey. this is FRC, the game is never the exact same thing as the sport it may be based off. There is a chance it could use a small rubber ball instead of a puck, or, only use small elements of hockey, like small netted goals on either end. it could easily be played on carpet, it doesnt have to be a slick surface.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

So would the Coopetition come at the "end game"?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

This is what I was going for. Just getting ideas flowing and connecting them to other hints.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Assist is the hint which lead to coopertition. That is working together for a benefit usually. in 2012 both alliances had to balance on a bridge for coopertition points, which give you a better seat for qualification.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That's what I thought, but I wasn't entirely sure. Thank you for clarifying.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Coopertition was an aspect of the game where you had to work with your opponent in order to gain an advantage.

In 2012, There was a bridge used in the qualification rounds that if you balanced on it with a member of the opposing alliance it was worth the same amount of ranking points as winning the match. So a team that went 10-0 but never balanced could theoretically be ranked the same as a team that went 5-5 but balanced with an opponent in every match.

For reference, the 2012 game animation: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOXsdhZZSdM

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

no problem :)

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

If you refer back to the first page in the thread, they found out that the hint most likely refers to assisting.
You will soon learn all about the ethos of FIRST, Sam.
Coopertition is up there with Gracious Professionalism as important in FIRST. Coopertitin means "Cooperative Competition". Or, in other words, it means to be competitive and cooperative at the same time. In 2012, Rebound Rumble, the game contained a series of bridges down the center of the field (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOXsdhZZSdM) each with different colors. As the animation will explain, the middle, white bridge was the "Coopertition Bridge" that the two alliances would work together on. You did not get any extra match points for going on the Coopertition Bridge, but rather qualification points, which in most cases decided the outcome of regionals.
Coopertition is the idea that working together will benefit both sides of the competition. This is an idea that FIRST seemed to like since it made a big difference in the competitions.
Are you all caught up now?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I may be totally wrong, but I'm pretty sure nobody has gotten it yet. I think the three things are three ratios. Maybe they're unit conversions or game piece dimensions, but I don't think assists are the hint.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

so i agree with hockey, or field hockey. Now for the endgame.... I do think the water bottles/staircase/ramp thing from the original thread is important. And the word 'point' in the poem. Also the assisting hint. If I put them together a cool thing would be a capture the flag sort of end game. One robot would have to lift a bridge by wedging itself under the ramp (ramp, staircase clues) in order for another one (assisting) to get up to the flag (point). Perhaps the flag would be on a 2nd layer, or tier of the field.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I would presume that it would come at the end of the game, but that is just looking at the dynamics of Rebound Rumble. The endgame was a chance for an alliance to either benefit just themselves or help themselves and the other alliance. I came up with ideas that could occur at the endgame, there are other ways we could assist during a game however

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I agree but we can only get so close and the assist idea is the closest we have gotten because it matches both hints.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

They said it would be so obvious when we see it. it would be extremely easy to see. and thats what we have now

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Note what Frank said, "
61474:135, 12661:1963, 32662:15806

From what I've seen on CD, folks are trying far too hard on this. Once you get the answer, it will be so obvious I expect some reactions like this*:"

(I included the hint just for a refresher for those at this end of the thread)

Maybe the assisting was what they were going for, and we have just been over-complicating it, second-guessing ourselves.
Or maybe we are all completely wrong :P
I have to agree with atucker though.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

A few minutes after this thread started we came up with a new idea and have been rolling with it and we have actually gotten a little ways...

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

But we still have not linked the game hint with the poem yet, which will give us a much better idea.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The blog says we should be able to find it just just using the numbers. So that said let's focus on that.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The principal value of the game hints for the GDC appears to be to generate a flurry of FRC -based discussion about what could be possible in a future game. I'm only sure you are wrong if you think that any idea(s) posted here will be completely ignored in the creation of some future game. Relation or validity with respect to the upcoming game need only be tangential with some nebulous tie-in to be useful as idea bait for us. So look at all the neat stuff people have proposed. What you might do is look at game hint discussions that preceded games by two or three years to see if any ideas from them were incorporated in some way.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

"First game hint we thought was so tame
It surely will point to the game
But so far no luck
CD's run amok
Much clearer is this one we claim"
Just to give you some information on Limericks.
The 1st, 2nd, and 5th lines rhyme.
The 3rd and 4th lines rhyme.
The 1st, 2nd, and 5th lines have 3 stressed syllables.
The 3rd and 4th lines have 2.

Have a party with it!

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Let's keep this focused and not jump all over the place...

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I think it would be pretty cool if they did it during the autonomous mode. Maybe if a robot for each alliance drives to a circle in the middle of the field, both alliances receive an autonomous bonus (maybe 18 points if last year). It was still be extremely benifical for both alliances to attempt it (as autonomous could be the first tie-breaker) and easy enough that any robot that can drive can do it (maybe veteran teams would work with their rookie partners to program their autonomous modes so the veterans could do more elaborate auto modes like the 7 disc autonomous). Plus, it wouldn't be quite as important as it was in 2012, which many complained about.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I know what Coopertition and Gracious Professionalism are - I just wasn't sure how they applied to competition games. In terms of scoring, and stuff.
Thank you all for clarifying. :)

-

The format of the numbers seems to be an analogy. I know that someone converted them to dates, and got the assist theory that way, but has anyone tried converting them into words?
I know it's a long shot, but anything is possible, right?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I feel like this would be doable but it would not be that great of an idea because of having contact with other robots with no human interaction.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I went to google and googled "tame game claim hockey" and came up with this site from 2010. http://www.iihf.com/fi/channels10/ii...h=7a5936 1586

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The first hint is
"8234/57, 61126/1963, 62326/15806"
3/4/82 is Landon Donovan's birthday and he had 57 assists in MLS.
1/26/61 is Wayne Gretzky's birthday and had 1963 assists in NHL.
3/26/62 is John Stockton's birthday and had 15806 assists in NBA

The second hint
Steve Ralston, born 6-14-74, holds the MLS record for assists: 135.

Wayne Gretzky, born 1-26-61, holds NHL record for career assists: 1963.

John Stockton, born 3-26-62, holds the NBA assists record: 15806.

The only difference is that FIRST GDC realized that Ralston had more assists than Donovan, so had to change the clue.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Boom. That's probably it.

2010 - MLS inspired.
2012 - NBA inspired.
2014 - NHL inspired?

Water game - well, a frozen water game! :)

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I honestly can't see anything else that the hints would lead to.
And since we've connected assists to coopertition, I don't really see anything else to do - unless we focus on the FakeGDC's 'Game Name' hint.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Do you seriously think FakeGDC released anything useful?

EDIT: and there goes my promise to myself to not post in this thread.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I think it is funny how people started talking about a twitter parody. It was like really they are FAKE GDC.

Edit: If you don't believe they even said that they were oj the West Coast

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Anyone else notice the Lunacy wheels and floor on the Fake GDC twitter account...? That seems to correspond with hockey pretty well... I may be completely wrong though and it could be sheer coincidence.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

FAKEGDC ISN'T REAL.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The confusion on the first set of numbers comes from the following link:

http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/us-men...e-leaders.aspx


Goal Scorers

Name Goals Caps Era
1. Donovan, Landon 57 154 2000-2013


Assists

Name Assists Caps Era
1. Donovan, Landon 57 154 2000-2013

Since they are both 57, one of them may be wrong. That is why they the DGC said they can't confirm.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Thank you!!!!

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Donovan had 57 assists with US Soccer, which is the most. However that's not a league, it's an international team, so using the MLS record makes much more sense!

Source: http://www.ussoccer.com/teams/us-men...e-leaders.aspx (Scroll down to where it lists assists)

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Has anybody figured out the significance of the poem?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Also, I don't think the poem that they tweeted actually means anything. I think it's just referring to the blog post that came after, and saying "Okay, the first hint was hard. We'll clarify it with the next one."

The assist idea really is the way to go, I think. Some sort of Coopertition. Hmmmm

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

My apologies. They seem to have some insight at times. As I said, I could be completely wrong and it could be complete coincidence. It would appear that I am.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

So it is baseball because that is the only sport that has assists that they did not list (well that and water polo but I think baseball makes more sense)

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I agree. A hockey game would be too close to Lunacy.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The Limerick seems to refer to the clarifications in the number clue.

The data format change from Year-Month-Day to Month-Year-Day. They put it in a format more commonly used in the United States.

Changing from "/" to ":" also helps to show a relationship vs. an operand.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Coopertition is one of the core tenets of FIRST, not (necessarily) a game element.

http://www.usfirst.org/aboutus/gracious-professionalism

Also, **Woodie.

----

Editing, because I had something to add as I continued reading the thread.

Anything that isn't released AS A HINT isn't worth analyzing. As Frank said in his post, you're all trying to hard. "There are no game clues in this photo" means THERE ARE NO GAME CLUES IN THIS PHOTO. Focus on the actual hints released and not on the peripheral social media posts. (Especially those not posted by actual FIRST accounts...Lookin' at you, @FakeGDC!)

For the most part, FIRST's social media accounts are run by separate staff from FRC/Game Design - the posts like the kickoff-filming photo and the limerick are for fun, not to throw people off or add more things to analyze to the already-ridiculous frenzy on CD.

Exhibit A:

It's a twitter post. It's not a hint.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

3 Separate zones on the field. Robots may not cross zones. Dividers separate the zones to prevent robot passage, but allow the game pieces to move between zones, very similar to breakaway.

And these:

http://www.fatbraintoys.com/toy_comp...FYg-MgodYiQA_Q

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I also think it is funny that people are still thinking there is something to do with Dr . Who. The blog post clearly said there is nothing involving Dr . Who.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Wasn't very clear. His message keeps repeating, so don't know if Dr Who is a hint or not until you find the limit of the function at the end of the repeating series.

Looks like the clue takes some calculus to solve.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

For those of you who think this might be hockey based....there are pucks made for playing on carpet....

http://www.thesimtecstore.com/thecar...oublepack.aspx

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Can you not see 3 posts ahead of yours, or am I just imagining it?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

We still need to focus on the assist part because it is the closest thing we have. What sports are there assists in? Who is the all time assist leader out of any sport?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

My method was to "simply" google the rhyming words +hockey to connect with my guess of hockey,mentioned in an earlier post in the thread, but I think Libby is right on this one.

I would guess that the game is divided into three hockey zones, by some obstacle, that each member of the individual alliance has to stay in for the main portion of the match or occur an "off-sides" technical foul. I'm guessing it will be a lot like breakway as far as the auto and main game go. Teams will probably not be able to "collect and shoot" the game pieces like the last two years. I think that the end game will be a lot like Rack n roll such that each zone having a lifted robot will receive bonus points and the middle being "somewhat" like 2012, no sure what but something will change a bit. For eliminations having two lifted robots will be even more bonus points.
I'm going to laugh at how wrong I am after kickoff, but it is fun to speculate. :D

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

FakeGDC has released some legitimate hints in the past.
And would you really put it past FIRST to NOT do something like FakeGDC?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Like?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I would be somewhat disappointed to have a Breakaway-like field. I like the open spaces with fast moving robots (2011, 2013 come to mind) much better. It just feels very limiting with these kind of barriers and obstructive to a game.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Nope. Nope nope nope nope nope nope. Not even a little bit.

FakeGDC is not a FIRST account. FIRST only puts official releases through @FIRSTweets, @FRCteams (and other program accounts) and the FRC blog.

Seriously, stop.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

oops...i went right to the last page in the thread (i had read the others earlier) Tom Line has a
link for a carpet puck, but not the link i posted and thats three ahead of mine.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

If you just look at their past tweets, even if they seem like general comments, they have a correlation to the game. Like 'thanks for the assist.'
I don't know. I'm probably just grasping for straws at this point - and probably succumbing to the pre-insanity of the season.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

@FakeGDC is run by a FIRST student simply being amused by the pre-kickoff insanity and making fun of it. He knows as much about this years game as anyone else. The only things you can think of as game hints come from official FIRST sources (as Libby stated).

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Let's get back on track yeah?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

You have no idea if their comments have a correlation to THE GAME. It hasn't been released yet.

They connect to the current theories on the GAME HINT, because it's a parody account based on the ludicrous theories on Chief. As in, it's a joke.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That's the only correct thing you've said so far.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Agreed

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Like I said, I'm probably just grasping at straws - I blame a lack of sleep and an obsessive curiosity.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

So we have a solid idea that the hint is pointing at assists. How can we connect this to better make out the game? Maybe names of people that are assist leaders? Then connecting there name with the game?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Perhaps the "assists" are not pointing to another coopertition element (in which the two opposing alliances need to work together), but a true assist element.

Maybe we will need to pass a game element between two robots to score.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Possibly but this leaves one robot out of the picture.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

What if their is a game element so big, that it takes two robots to push it (and only one robot from each alliance can enter the zone to push it during endgame).

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The only assist leaders we have right now are the three record holders in soccer, baseball, and hockey - and I'm not really aware of an assist 'leader'.

There is always the Joe Montana theory that someone came up with.

And a teammate of mine just mentioned this - what if 'watergame' is just figurative? Like we're using the water, we're not IN the water?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Not that I don't want a water game and I hope that there is sometime but at the moment using water with the current control system is not that great of an idea. Just one slip up and a teams season is ruined.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Not necessarily. To me, that is like saying that scoring a goal in soccer or basketball leaves the rest of the team out.

I'm imagining passing a ball, or two robots pushing one object together. The third robot could be defending, getting another piece, or performing another challenge (since FRC games always have multiple ways to score).

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

And that was my teammate's concern. He's the electrical engineer in the group, and when I told him the theory, he freaked out. But he also said that if there was a minor element of water - like if only a portion of the field is water or there is a slight water element.

Like if you have to fish balls out of a small pool in the center of the field or something. It's purely speculation, but it's what he thinks.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

This seams reasonable. Just trying to get better information and making stuff more viable!

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

The problem I see with the idea if having assisting or passing of some sort between teammates means that you have to rely on getting good teammates in qualifications. As any FIRSTer knows, there's always that match where you are the only robot who is able to do anything, and this that could screw over a really good team simply because of luck of the draw.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I still don't think that at the current time there could be even that. Just too much risk. I could see them in the future making upgrades and special products to use small amounts of water.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

For those looking for a possible connection between the poem/rhyme the GDC recently released and this updated game hint for verification if you are still weary of the hint relating to "Assisting," here is one possible solution. In the poem it states, "Much clearer is this one we claim." If you look at the overall meaning of it and what the GDC was trying to do rather then trying to decipher or analyze it for some deeply hidden clue which is what the GDC said to avoid by stating that people are trying to hard, you see that the GDC is trying to help us, in other words they're trying to "Assist" us. It is only a possible connection, not certain.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

And this is why we should be focusing on the assist part now...

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I don't think that we'll see to much coopertition or working together too much. Balancing on the bridge in 2012 wasn't that difficult, you just needed a driving robot and somebody to tip the bridge toward you, yet it was painful to watch crazy good teams like 254 waste a minute of their match in order to attempt (then fail) their coopertition balance. It really can bring down the game.

FIRST received negative feedback on cooperating with a simple game element, I doubt the whole game will be about assisting and working together. Think about 2010, with robots hanging from robots. We only saw that a few times the whole season!

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

In all three sports the hint deals with, an "assist" is only recorded by the actual passing of a game piece from one player to another. As difficult as it may have been in the past, I really do think that is probably what the GDC is going for this year.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

It still would be nice to see it brought back in my opinion. It brings a whole new element to the match and can be very exciting. Just because 254 couldn't do it that well doesn't mean much. Teams should have realized that it ment something and should have designed robots to easily accomplish the relatively easy task. That is the reason lots of teams struggled at regionals, they didn't know how to coopertate.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I don't think any game would rely purely on having a teammate assist you. As others have said, you might not have another functioning robot on your alliance!

However, assisting might help you in the game. So it's something that one team could do alone in a pinch, but is much easier for multiple teams to do together.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I can see coopertition, but nothing too big. If you can't win a match with just one robot, then it's not a good game.

What I mean is if there is some sort of restriction (i.e. the game piece must be passed to each team on the alliance) and one team is incapable of performing the task, that means the alliance loses at no fault of the teams who were capable.

I don't think I'm explaining myself clearly.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

254 could do it quite well, and realized the value of co-oping early on. However, as Cory is spotlighted as saying, "it sucked because you not only had to depend on your partners being good, but your opponents too."

Your opponents not only had to have a working drivetrain, but a coach that recognized when it was time to balance, decently competent drivers, the foresight to coordinate with the opposing alliance, and the maturity to not decide to botch a balance in order to tank a teams rankings.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I get it and it makes sense. I would think coopertition in this case would be similar 2012 were the alliances could work together and not hurt their alliance.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I agree that the 2012 win-is-as-valuable-as-coopertition-balance system was flawed, and that it has the ability to turn into people saying "I only lost because my opponents were worse than yours", but I do think some sort of cooperating would be nice, especially in the elimination rounds. It shouldn't be the only way of scoring, but I think it could work out nicely, if done right.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

I think it does.

254 did it to the best ability possible of any team, as did all the other competitive teams, and still failed to be effective.

If teams like 254, 1114, etc... don't do it right, then something is not right with the game. Somewhere there's a match where 254 is making basket after basket, crossing the field, avoiding defense, and having one of the most entertaining matches of Rebound rumble I've ever seen, then with 1:15 left, drives up to the coopertition bridge, attempts balancing with a team completely unable to balance, and at the end of the match, doesn't have a balance, and looses, because they didn't score for more than half of the match. They get 0 qualifying points for the match.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Yeah and this brings up a good point. Is it possible to have a good coopertition system so some teams don't end up loosing either way?

There is also the point that maybe teams should have spent too much time trying to coopertate. If they realized it wasn't going to happen they should have gone back to scoring for their own alliance.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Coopertition has actually been a huge part of all the FRC competitions, even if it isn't on field. Last season, my team had a big issue with our programming, and our pit neighbors were more than happy to help us. Though we didn't make it past qualification, we were (and still are) extremely grateful for their help.

The way coopertition ties into the game would be a big part of it, as well. I think the easiest way to tie it in would be in a hockey-esque game. Someone did mention earlier that they make carpet pucks.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That was the problem with 2012. Teams didn't go back to scoring, because winning would give them 2 qualifying points, balancing would give them 2 qualifying points, but they really needed 4 qualifying points (balance and win) in order to play in elims.

With some tweaking, a coopertition system would work. It's not a flawed concept, in fact, it's a great idea, but 2012 was a flawed implementation.

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

Well back to this year any other things that have to do with assist and any other connections from other small hints?

Re: [FRC Blog] Kickoff Broadcast and Game Hint Redux
 

That's not true at all...

If you went to the bridge with 1:15 left and then ended up losing the match, you didn't have a good enough lead at that point in the match to allow you to attempt the bridge. Winning should've been priority, then the coop bridge.

While the bridge was flawed, I don't think you can go far enough to say "if blank team couldn't do it then there's something wrong." Many teams were able to complete the bridge and win the match.

Plus you have a match schedule with who you're playing against. Why not talk to the opposing teams in advance for true coopertition?