Re: Human Player
 

True. G32 only covers deflection.

Devil's advocate on myself: An HP holding their opponents' ball is simply an extremely delayed deflection...

Re: Human Player
 

<G40> TEAMS may not extend any body part into the FIELD during the MATCH.
Violation: TECHNICAL FOUL.

You'd have to grab one that has left the field. That's not worth basing a strategy around, and I don't even think it's worth having a contingency plan for.

Re: Human Player
 

If G32 doesn't prevent it, could it be argued that the ball is "stuck" and can be declared dead? You lose Assist points, but you can still play the match.

Even then, I expect someone to Q&A this, and the GDC will make the obvious ruling. Holding the opposing alliance's ball should be a penalty.

What if you have the 6 inch diameter arm pointed to the HP so the deflection angle is generally towards him/her. Then HP is the all star b-baller at your school. You'd be set?

Re: Human Player
 

Absent any ruling of the GDC, Any touching of the other alliance's ball is going to be considered a deflection. Holding the ball & refusing to turn it over to the field people is going to be failure to follow instructions & probably a red card.

It is interesting to go down this road. But don't ever think it is anything but a dead end.

Re: Human Player
 

Just to satisfy my curiosity, where did you learn this? Remember, words not specifically defined in the Manual are to be defined with the English dictionary. A touch is not a deflection; grabbing and holding is not a deflection. Knocking the ball back onto the field or changing its course to miss all field reset if it was on the way out would be a deflection.

That said, I would tend to agree that not turning it over to the field crew on request would probably end up as egregious behavior, and thus be eligible for a card.


Also, to this time REALLY play Devil's Advocate on myself, and on my own Devil's Advocate, and hopefully put this to rest, or not...
G12 calls out that an Alliance may not Possess their opponents' Ball. The definition of Alliance calls out that it's up to 4 Teams. A Team is the Coach, Human Player, and Drivers, also from the Glossary. Thus, no possession by Human Player.

The only problem with this reasoning is that the definition of Possess specifies that it's for a Robot (only!). Thus, G12 is a moot point, as an Alliance does NOT include the Robot, thus a Robot may Possess the Ball of the opposing Alliance indefinitely...

Re: Human Player
 

My superior powers of deduction :)
The general intent on G 32 is the human players are not to interfere with the other alliance's ball. You don't really think the GDC is going to rule any other way?

Re: Human Player
 

Because I believe there to be a high likelihood of balls bouncing wildly out of play rather often (possibly overwhelming the officials ability to quickly return them every time - and thus slowing game play to an un-exciting tempo) I believe it possible that the GDC will permit an opposing human player to catch and return to the field a ball leaving the field in their HP zone. If that's the case, it would be in that HP's best interest to field it in a direction away from the opposing alliance's robots and goal. I kind of hope this is the outcome, because it will make the game more exciting to watch, and will reward alliances for better control of the ball.

I agree with you that they will rule that any prolonged holding of the ball to prevent play by the opposing alliance will be prohibited.

That being said...I won't be surprised if they rule that any deliberate contact by an opposing HP is prohibited (deflection, catch, etc.). But again, I hope not.

Re: Human Player
 

Q&A has already ruled you can't deflect the opposing alliances ball back unto the field. While catching the ball & quickly handing it to an official or other alliance's HP would be in the spirit of GP, I don't see the GDC allowing it. If you where to attempt to catch it & didn't it would a deflection & a penalty under any reading of the current rule..

Re: Human Player
 

I actually wouldn't be surprised if a human player could be an assist in and of itself, let's say robot 1 is dead, so it never moves past the white zone, robot 2 starts with the ball and assists to robot 3 in the white zone, what if robot 3 gave the ball to the human player in the blue zone, is that three assists, I would highly doubt it, but just something to think about because FIRST does all sorts of crazy things with hidden rules trying to make us think.

Re: Human Player
 

You should probably reread the Manual. ::rtm::

Re: Human Player
 

If the human player is on the field during a match, the alliance will be assessed a Technical Foul for violating <G40>, and the team is likely to be assigned a red card for egregious behavior.

Re: Human Player
 

Adding one simple suggestion for human players on the sidelines....I attempted to catch a full power shot ball on the down stroke (falling from about 10' high as our bot was on a concrete platform about 3' higher than I was standing), and they can rotate quite well in the air, the cover is both very slick and quite rough, and creates a lot of fingertip friction w/ that nylon cover & those seams (especially the zipper area)...Gloves will/may just save those unique fingerprints you like so much HP's...Just my 0.02 cents on the subject. (Just think rug burned hot fingertips and palms.....I cannot even imagine the tender nose or forehead areas w/ those bright red spots that may be very evident at Regionals and Champs this year!)

I expect to also see over time more than a few quite fast moving inbounders, due to the large size of the gamepiece possibly carried too high, trip and do a faceplant into the ball...The real question is...Will you personally laugh or wince w/ the HP? (Think "Gracious Professionalism" please!) Straps holding the safety glasses to the head may just help there.

Re: Human Player
 

Actually, after doing extensive research across the game manual, truss points can only be scored through being caught by a robot. As quoted from the game manual:
A CATCH occurs when a BALL SCORED over the TRUSS by a ROBOT’S ALLIANCE partner is POSSESSED by that ROBOT before contacting the carpet, the ROBOT which SCORED the TRUSS, or HUMAN PLAYER.

In explanation, only the robot(s) that didn't possess the ball before the truss throw are the only ones who can catch it; not the human player or the robot that threw it

Re: Human Player
 

You're entirely incorrect as to when Truss points can be scored, AND the rule you brought in refers to Catch points instead of Truss points.