Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

At the events I've been to, I've seen separate bumper sets, slip-over skirts, and velcro/snap-on reversibles on robots and in pits. I was wondering, what is the most popular option that teams choose for changing colors, and if you have a major reason why, post it!

If you have a different way of changing bumper colors and chose "Other", let us know what it is!

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We have two different sets of bumpers we use. We mount them using drop in pins (bolts) for each individual 'side' bumper. We've found that this system works very well. We can change them out in under two minutes!

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Team 701 prefers reversible Velcro bumpers. We do this so we do not use any space in the pit for another set, and so we do not have to use skirts which can look messy, or can come loose during a match. The nice thing about reversibles, is that we never have to think about which color our bumpers have to be. We usually change colors in queuing, but if we forget, we change them on the field when setting up the robot. We like not having to worry about bumpers that involve extra pieces, like skirts and sets. The only time we ever remove our bumpers is during inspection.

It's so convenient! We can change our colors in less than 5 seconds if we have four people, with one on each side. Probably less than 15-30 seconds for one person. We run our pit crew like NASCAR does in terms of bumpers. Wheel changing? Not so much.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Drop the bumpers into t-slots in the side of the frame, lock nut in place once per competition. Then, reversible bumpers means we never have to run back to the pit to grab a forgotten color. Long velcro strips among the top and bottom to attach to - though I'd like to experiment and see if several short strips would hold better.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

That's pretty much what we use as well. As he mentioned, change time is pretty fast. Under two minutes every time, if not less.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Reversibles are the fastest method I know of. Change colors in a matter of seconds, not minutes!

But I do admit, when teams have two sets that are made really nice, and the fabric is mounted nice and tight, the look is really clean. Reversibles can look clean, too, but you gotta have a person on the team who knows their way around a sewing machine. I remember making these as a student, and they can be a pain in the butt to make correctly, but the pain is worth the worry free color changing.

Velcro reversible is what we did for our summer build. It was my wife and my first time helping mentor a team, and she is almost what you could call a seamstress. She taught the kids how to make the bumpers, and make them look good.

Bolt them on and forget them. Switching from Blue to red can be done in a matter of seconds.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

I don't know if you can add another poll, but an interesting thing to see would be what teams use vs. what they would like to use.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

That's an interesting thought. Does your team have a desire to use a type of bumper, but can't or not know how to do it?

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Personally, I'm a fan of how 2056 does their bumpers. They start out white and then print on the colors for a crisp number. I simply have no idea where you would get that service done.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Whatever you do, make sure it's secure. There's a subtle but important change to the rules this year:

I really, really don't want to have to disable a robot because of a bumper malfunction.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

As for my team, we have simply used the same way of mounting bumpers. Haven't really considered other options. Velcro reverses do sound very convenient. I'll have to talk to my team about it when we need to make a new set. This year, we may just be using last year's again, depending on chassis dimensions.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Another way to get crisp numbers is to get them silkscreen printed or ironed on. As for how 2056 does it, they may have some connections to people who dye fabric. You should ask one of their members for more information. They have a convenient "contact us" page on their website where you can ask them directly.

http://www.2056.ca/contact

As for my team, we use a stencil and fabric paint like many teams do.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We took the Velcro method and changed out the Velcro to use a bungee. No more attaching Velcro or having Velcro wear out. Just add a loop to the end and fish a bungee through, hog ring the ends together and be done for the season. Video of a one person change here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XYTiRxLw7oA

I have already had a request for a how to, and I will post a white paper when we build our bumpers next week.

We also use t-shirt vinyl and a vinyl cutter to create our numbers and then heat press them on.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

That's pretty neat! It's like a hybrid between a skirt and a reversible! How well does it stand up to the rigors of gameplay? I can't see much of a reason for regular bumping or sliding to cause the bungee cord to slip, so this looks pretty reliable. The only problem I could see is the fabric getting caught in the wheels from being pushed around. We like velcro because it anchors the fabric in a specific place, making sure it stays away from moving parts. I might get my team to try this for the season. I want to make sure I get the instructions for this, so along with posting a white paper, could you also send me a personal message?

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We have always done 2 sets but are tackling the reversibles this year. We have one of the schools classes (graphics) either silk screen or vinyl cut the numbers and put them on for us. Check with your school to see if there is a class that makes T-shirts and they should be able to help.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Our team used reversible bumpers last year that used elastic bands that would wrap either over the top of the bumper or underneath the bumper depending on what color we needed and looped into small hooks attached to the back.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

The bungee on our 2013 bot was entirely inside the frame perimeter so it never came in contact with anything. We just put a couple of small bolts around the outside at the corners of the frame to hold the bungee from getting tangled with the wheels. We actually forgot to change colors until we were lined up to get on the field at MSC, but with two people it is about two seconds to swap colors.

PM sent...

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

I remember in 2010 when bumpers first became red/blue I independently came up with a reversible design as a rookie, but the way I made them wouldn't work because I didn't put a 45 degree "miter joint" on the fabric so we had to stuff extra fabric in to the space between bumpers. We gave up on the reversibles that year and just kept em on the blue side and used a red skirt.

Then in 2011, I re-designed the fabric to have the miter, and at the moment, nobody else, (or at least one or two teams, if my memory is off) at our main regional had reversibles yet, so we would purposely neglect to change colors when lining up at the start of a match, so we could show off our new bumpers on the field. It was fun seeing other teams who never saw reversibles gasp at the speed of our color changing! We also did it to implicitly spread the idea that color changing can be easy, and that you don't need to have skirts or two sets of bumpers.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We tried reversible bumpers last year and really liked them.

For bumper numbers we got 4" white numbers from https://www.numbers4sports.com/ and ironed them on the Cordura. They looked really sharp. We were concerned that the Cordura would melt, but we didn't need super high heat to get really good adhesion.

Numbers4Sports gives you a price break when you order 10 of each number so it was also affordable. We needed 8 sets of numbers for the bumpers anyway and then screwed up ironing one set on (upside down, oops) so it worked out well that we ordered 10 sets.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We had a really bad experince with reversibles last year. So we will be using drop pins this year. But I really want to go back to reversible bumpers so if you finish that white page I'd be eager to read and try at my home before showing the team.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

The basics of how to do reversible bumpers is shown in this thread. While not quite as in depth as a white paper would be, it's actually simpler than one would think. Changing to bungie rather than velcro would require MrBasse to elaborate though.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

You can purchase iron-on transfers that are laser-jet compatible. 2996 has done this for at least the last four years.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

I've been doing FIRST for 7 years now. I've used all of the above. Different sets in 2012, skirts in 2011 and 2013 and reversible in 2010 (for the record, I honestly forgot how we did it in 08 and in 09 we had a single white bumper. This was before the advent of the colored bumpers with team number on it requirement). Heck, in 2011, we had a rigid frame that dropped into place on the frame, and used the skirt (which ended up being too small!!!).

Not sure what we're going with this year, but I can tell you we will have distinct segments, whether we go full length or only worry about complying with the rules (> 8" from each corner).

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Our team (2177) has used reversible Velcro bumpers for the past few years and they work really well. I did make a white paper recently explaining how we make them. We have the numbers screen-printed on.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We've used all of them, but in 2013 we used the reversibles with velcro. Worked great, changing colors only took seconds.

The "skirts" are annoying because you have to worry about not getting them tangled within itself and making it look good and flat without a ton of wrinkles, but a good option to save space nonetheless.

I wouldn't recommend 2 sets of bumpers, but sometimes if you're looking for really tight and clean looking bumpers, you might need two sets, but you can probably achieve a neat finish with the other two methods as well.

Reversible bumper white paper
 

We have a white paper on our reversible (velcro) bumpers at http://kbots.files.wordpress.com/201...ble-bumper.pdf

They are incredibly easy to change. We've had people in queue tell us "Hey, you guys need to change your bumpers!" "OK ... done."

Plus, they never come off, never get tangled, and always look good.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Separate sets. Everything else looks bad.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

This is the same process that Team 3200 has been using for the last 2 years. We found it a large hassle to change out bumpers completly.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Reversables FTW

We would also purposely come with the wrong colors to show off one of the only things that worked really well on our robot...

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We use reversible bumpers for the instant changing time (you take 2 minutes, we literally take 2 seconds [120x faster :P]) Also we are planning to make a large portion of the structural part of our base frame integral to the bumpers (20 free pounds is a lot of steel!) so removing them is not preferable in that situation. Covers do not work well when your robot has very low bumpers (in 2011 we had <1.5" ground clearance) the cover drags the ground or worse

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Separate bumpers no questions asked for us. Just the professional look of it is what it boils down too. Nothing really wrong with skirts other than looks in my opinion.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

There will always be teams that end up making robots that are short of their expectations, but when your bumpers are the only thing worth showing, the struggle is real!

I can imagine the scenario in the pits:

Judge: So, what part of your robot is your team most proud of, and why?

Student: The fabric. It's nice and soft. Wanna feel?

Judge: *touches bumper* Wow, it is. What's it made of?

Student: Dolphin fur. Imported from North Antarctica. Don't worry, it's tuna safe.

{{{{INSTANT IMAGERY AWARD}}}}

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We're using these reversible bumpers. http://www.robopromo.net/product_p/rp_fb.htm

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

We use reversible bumpers, mostly for the speed at which we can change them.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Give me reversible bumpers or give me death!

Seriously, it's a no-brainer. A little more work up front, but cheaper (less wood, fewer pool noodles, etc), easier to transport (one set vs 2), doesn't get pulled off like a cover could, and is super easy to change colors. The most important feature is the look it puts on a queuer's face when they freak out because you're the wrong color, and then you change color in a few moments without any tools.

We've been using reversible bumpers for 2 years now and will never ever go back.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

[quote=bEdhEd;1324085]Another way to get crisp numbers is to get them silkscreen printed or ironed on. As for how 2056 does it, they may have some connections to people who dye fabric. You should ask one of their members for more information. They have a convenient "contact us" page on their website where you can ask them directly.

http://www.2056.ca/contact

Save you the time

We have a printing sponsor (SpeedPro) print the fabric. It is canvas with a transparent laminate.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

Ah, OK thanks a lot!

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

I just noticed that the irony of this thread is that the poll says that the majority of the teams have bumper sets, but the majority of posts here are people talking about their preference, and even love, for reversibles.

Maybe reversibles make for happy teams!

Have you ever seen someone frown when reversing bumpers? You haven't, because they're too dang cool.

There's something about that velcro ripping, and the flipping from blue to red in an instant that just puts a smile on the face of even the saddest of FIRST-ers.

Re: Bumper sets, skirts, or reversibles?
 

There are trufax.