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-   -   610 Electronics Board Teaser (http://www.chiefdelphi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125576)

Matthew Lang 31-01-2014 22:57

610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Hi CD,

We've been working hard over the past few days to get this ready for public consumption, so here it is! It's not entirely done yet, but we wanted to get a picture out before anything goes on top :) Feel free to comment and ask questions, I'm not sure how much I will respond though :rolleyes:


Gregor 31-01-2014 22:59

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
So where do the Jaguars go? :rolleyes:

I think you might need a few more compressors.

s_forbes 31-01-2014 23:04

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
I'd post R79, but I think you know that already.

Something I find interesting: you probably inspired a lot of teams to use 6 CIM drivetrains with your robot from last year, and with all of the new ones popping up in 2014 you only have 4.

Adamz_ 31-01-2014 23:12

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Needs more compressors.

donkehote 31-01-2014 23:16

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by s_forbes (Post 1335621)
I'd post R79, but I think you know that already.

Something I find interesting: you probably inspired a lot of teams to use 6 CIM drivetrains with your robot from last year, and with all of the new ones popping up in 2014 you only have 4.

I see 4 cims 2 minis, they are hiding :D
Looking really good though. Cant wait to see it in action

s_forbes 31-01-2014 23:20

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by donkehote (Post 1335628)
I see 4 cims 2 minis, they are hiding :D
Looking really good though. Cant wait to see it in action

oooh, I missed that... you win!


dodar 31-01-2014 23:24

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Adamz_ (Post 1335627)
Needs more compressors.

No, 4 is enough. Now they just need a WINpump.

Mr. Lim 31-01-2014 23:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor (Post 1335616)
So where do the Jaguars go? :rolleyes:

I think you might need a few more compressors.

I keep forgetting just how easy it is to mix up jaguars and compressors. Happens all the time.

Just like that time we miscounted how many motors were on our drivetrain? Remember that?

dtengineering 31-01-2014 23:24

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Adamz_ (Post 1335627)
Needs more compressors.

Actually, it needs more pressure relief valves.

(Says the tech inspector in me...)

Jason

Jonathan Norris 31-01-2014 23:38

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
610 building a West-Coast drive! Blasphemy!

It must be because Mikey and I are in San Francisco for build this year :ahh:

Gregor 31-01-2014 23:39

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Lim (Post 1335634)
I keep forgetting just how easy it is to mix up jaguars and compressors. Happens all the time.

I hate it when that happens!

Answer42 01-02-2014 02:32

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
I like the rectangular tube gearboxes. God only knows what the crazy mechanism is going to go where those compressors are.

Caleb Sykes 01-02-2014 18:53

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
First off, this is an absolutely spectacular electronics board. If my team makes one that is 1/3 as good, I will be proud of them. I do have a few questions though:
1. I have always been concerned about having anything in contact the drive motors since they can get very hot. Obviously, since you have wires attached to the top of the CIMs, this is not a concern for you. Do your CIMs not get very hot because of the gearing and/or the load sharing over 3 motors? Or have you tested these motors under high loads for extended periods without seeing any problems with the contacting material.

2. What are those red connectors between the motors and their respective speed controllers? Also, why do you use them instead of cutting the motor wire to length and connecting it right onto the speed controller?

3. Where do you intend to place the remaining pneumatic components? Will there be space directly above the compressor for them?

4. Why did you opt to use the old digital module to sidecar cable instead of the ribbon cable? Is it because of the placement of the sidecar and cRIO right next to each other?

5. Did you cut to length and crimp all of the PWM cables yourself?

6. What is that thing at the top of the PD Board? And why does it have a PWM cable coming out of it?

7. Why are your two non-drive speed controllers attached to 30 amp breakers instead of 40 amp breakers? Are you concerned about the total current draw of 8 40 amp motors?

7. Will there eventually be a mechanism in the space of the 4 compressors? If so, did you design the board specifically to save this space? Or are you just so efficient in your wiring that you have 4 compressors worth of excess space just to show off? :p

Matthew Lang 01-02-2014 19:45

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1335955)
First off, this is an absolutely spectacular electronics board. If my team makes one that is 1/3 as good, I will be proud of them.

Thanks for the kind words :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1335955)
1. Do your CIMs not get very hot because of the gearing and/or the load sharing over 3 motors? Or have you tested these motors under high loads for extended periods without seeing any problems with the contacting material.

We ran a similar system with our drivetrain last year (pig-tailing the motor leads on to the motors) and although the motors do get warm, we never ran into issues with melting the insulation or anything like that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1335955)
2. What are those red connectors between the motors and their respective speed controllers? Also, why do you use them instead of cutting the motor wire to length and connecting it right onto the speed controller?

The red (and black) connectors are Anderson Power Poles. We find them to be better versions of quick disconnect crimps. In terms of swapping out a broken component, it means all we will ever have to do is change the motor or speed controller without re-doing any wires. It also means that we can cut all of our motor leads to the same length (off of the robot), and then make the appropriate length run (also off of the robot) with ordinary spool wire instead of worrying about affecting the CIMs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inklinhg16 (Post 1335955)
3. Where do you intend to place the remaining pneumatic components? Will there be space directly above the compressor for them?

They will go where the sideways large compressor appears in the picture, and where the furthest right vertical compressor appears.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inklinhg16 (Post 1335955)
4. Why did you opt to use the old digital module to sidecar cable instead of the ribbon cable? Is it because of the placement of the sidecar and cRIO right next to each other?

It has a lot to do with the placement of the cRIO, and ribbon cables are a pain to make. Unless vertical space above the cRIO becomes an issue, we figured why not use something that was already assembled for us.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inklinhg16 (Post 1335955)
5. Did you cut to length and crimp all of the PWM cables yourself?

Yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inklinhg16 (Post 1335955)
6. What is that thing at the top of the PD Board? And why does it have a PWM cable coming out of it?

It's a gyro sitting on top of a custom 3-D printed mount attached with double-sided tape.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1335955)
7. Why are your two non-drive speed controllers attached to 30 amp breakers instead of 40 amp breakers? Are you concerned about the total current draw of 8 40 amp motors?

We just figured that the application of those motors shouldn't draw more than 30 amps and that we could preserve the other 40 amp slots for spares/other applications.

Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1335955)
7. Will there eventually be a mechanism in the space of the 4 compressors? If so, did you design the board specifically to save this space? Or are you just so efficient in your wiring that you have 4 compressors worth of excess space just to show off? :p

As I mentioned we will be putting the rest of the pneumatic components there, and likely a few more Talons. We also knew that there would be a bit of a mechanism dropping down into the electronic board space so we tried to preserve as much as possible. As it turns out the mechanism will be centered against the frame opposite the battery.

Mike Starke 01-02-2014 19:48

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1335633)
No, 4 is enough. Now they just need a WINpump.

4?? I see 5! Haha.

Lightfoot26 01-02-2014 19:53

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1335633)
No, 4 is enough. Now they just need a WINpump.

That sir..... is patented technology!

dodar 01-02-2014 20:15

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Lightfoot26 (Post 1335990)
That sir..... is patented technology!

You guys have given the technology to other teams in the past...lol.

And Mike, I noticed the real one a little bit after I did that post.

kk052 01-02-2014 20:56

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
may want to look into the rules, i'm pretty sure teams are allowed ONE 1.05 CFM compressor, but i could be wrong. just wanted to let you know so you don,t get disqualified.

dodar 01-02-2014 21:38

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kk052 (Post 1336049)
may want to look into the rules, i'm pretty sure teams are allowed ONE 1.05 CFM compressor, but i could be wrong. just wanted to let you know so you don,t get disqualified.

.....

Tem1514 Mentor 01-02-2014 21:43

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
No no they need all those compressors to blow their own horn:rolleyes:

Okay enough kidding, but I really like where you put the drive train encoders. It gives me an idea, thanks.

philso 01-02-2014 22:00

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Maple syrup is much more viscous than air so more compressors are required to get the job done.

Tem1514 Mentor 01-02-2014 22:11

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by philso (Post 1336095)
Maple syrup is much more viscous than air so more compressors are required to get the job done.

And, ah so sweet it is. I feel for you guys so far south not knowing what really good maple syrup tastes like. :D

Gregor 01-02-2014 22:11

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kk052 (Post 1336049)
may want to look into the rules, i'm pretty sure teams are allowed ONE 1.05 CFM compressor, but i could be wrong. just wanted to let you know so you don,t get disqualified.

I'm not 100% sure so don't quote me on this but I thought I heard from someone that more than one compressor is ok.

philso 01-02-2014 22:35

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Tem1514 Mentor (Post 1336103)
And, ah so sweet it is. I feel for you guys so far south not knowing what really good maple syrup tastes like. :D

I only moved to the US 11 years ago. I worked for 5 years in Ottawa and 12 years in TO. Last December, my wife went to visit her relatives in TO and brought back several gallons of "the good stuff". She also brought back a box of Timbits because she loves me :D

DampRobot 01-02-2014 22:36

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Gregor (Post 1336104)
I'm not 100% sure so don't quote me on this but I thought I heard from someone that more than one compressor is ok.

Dude plz res the Manuel it's ok only if they're all wired off the same jaguar or digital side car I can't remember

Andrew Lawrence 01-02-2014 22:43

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DampRobot (Post 1336120)
Dude plz res the Manuel it's ok only if they're all wired off the same jaguar or digital side car I can't remember

Wait there's a manual? :eek: :eek: :ahh: :ahh: :D

Mr. Lim 02-02-2014 01:44

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by dodar (Post 1335633)
No, 4 is enough. Now they just need a WINpump.

Would you settle for a WINtake?

:D

ice.berg 02-02-2014 02:01

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DampRobot (Post 1336120)
Dude plz res the Manuel it's ok only if they're all wired off the same jaguar or digital side car I can't remember

If you hear it on CD then I guess it must be true! Official ruling right there..... :p

Steve W 02-02-2014 17:50

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
The rules state one and only one compressor. The other bigger grey mechanisms are sometimes miss labeled as compressors but are actually self restoring air tanks and as the rule states there is no limit on air tanks. As an LRI I make sure that our team does not break the rules. :rolleyes:

jtrv 04-02-2014 19:24

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Wait, is 5 compressors legal...? Oh.

philso 05-02-2014 22:16

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
And now for a serious question.

What did you use to label all your wiring? Are the labels from a label maker, are they heat-shrink tubing or are they self adhesive labels?

Once again, you have done wiring that is nicer than what the "professionals" at work do.

Matthew Lang 05-02-2014 23:04

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by philso (Post 1338297)
And now for a serious question.

What did you use to label all your wiring? Are the labels from a label maker, are they heat-shrink tubing or are they self adhesive labels?

Once again, you have done wiring that is nicer than what the "professionals" at work do.

Thanks for the compliment, it's great hearing that our extra effort gets noticed; and what do you know, the labels have proven their worth a few times already!

We use self-adhesive labels. Products 4 & 5 are very similar to what we use, and that is all we use.

philso 05-02-2014 23:37

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew Lang (Post 1338328)
Thanks for the compliment, it's great hearing that our extra effort gets noticed; and what do you know, the labels have proven their worth a few times already!

We use self-adhesive labels. Products 4 & 5 are very similar to what we use, and that is all we use.

Thanks for the tip, Matthew. I was able to find something similar at the local Home Depot so I will pick some up in the morning.

At work, we are required to label both ends of all wires. The Field Service people would kill us if we didn't do it. The labels are printed on pieces of heat shrink tubing using special printers so it is hard to use the same method for our robot.

fsgond 06-02-2014 13:31

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Forget tanks with that much compressing power! Oh yeah, and the wiring job looks pretty nice also. The only thing I don't like is it looks like there is limited service loops on some of the connections to the PD board, may make a fix a little difficult. :rolleyes:

cmrnpizzo14 06-02-2014 13:38

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew Lang (Post 1335986)
As I mentioned we will be putting the rest of the pneumatic components there, and likely a few more Talons. We also knew that there would be a bit of a mechanism dropping down into the electronic board space so we tried to preserve as much as possible. As it turns out the mechanism will be centered against the frame opposite the battery.

How many talons do you expect to need? I counted 8 on there already. That is enough for your drive train and then 4 motors for shooter, intake, something else. Are you just moving some of the ones that are already there or are you actually adding more?

Caleb Sykes 06-02-2014 15:09

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cmrnpizzo14 (Post 1338567)
How many talons do you expect to need? I counted 8 on there already. That is enough for your drive train and then 4 motors for shooter, intake, something else. Are you just moving some of the ones that are already there or are you actually adding more?

I believe that they have 6 drive train motors. 1 on each side is hiding.

cmrnpizzo14 06-02-2014 16:48

Re: 610 Electronics Board Teaser
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by inkling16 (Post 1338619)
I believe that they have 6 drive train motors. 1 on each side is hiding.

Aaah, sneaky Canadians ;) I see now, that seems more reasonable, I couldn't really picture a team this year needing 6 non-drive train motors (although I'm sure someone will have it)


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